The Full Circle Rewind: Frank Turner Creates His Full Circle!

One year ago, I had Frank Turner on The Full Circle. He was the first musician to come on the show and if it wasn't for him, I would not have been able to speak to so many more incredible musicians since. I wanted to celebrate this by re-releasing the episode with a new spoken intro by myself before the conversation with Frank! 

 We spoke about:

- How touring went in 2025 and speaking about the returning Million Dead prior to completing their now confirmed final UK tour in December 2025! 

- He answered some tough Would You Rather questions, including if he'd played the same venue forever with a different setlist every time, or different venues forever with the same setlist every time!

- He also played Which Frank said this? A game where he had to figure out if he, Frank Turner, said a particular quote in a previous interview or if it was his friend, fellow musician, and current touring singer for Sex Pistols (and also someone others have confused him with), Frank Carter!

- And of course, Frank makes his Full Circle, ranging from Million Dead to Descendents! 

Link to the songs are here: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/2iYkuvFNfqc9yKg647ysv7

All this and so much more on this week's episode!

Follow Frank Turner on Instagram: https://instagram.com/frankturner

Thank you to Frank Turner for his time on the show, and thank you to each and every one of you for the ongoing support! 

Follow the Full Circle on social media!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hello, this is DC. I am the host of The Full Circle, a show where we link songs together with the last song linking back to the first song, hence completing the Full Circle. Now, one year ago, I had my first musician on the show, the incredible Frank Turner. Now, some of you may have heard that show before, but I wanted to share it again because hey, it's been a year and I wanted to celebrate that. Now, if you have heard the show, now I'm not gonna lie, it's pretty much the same show, so I do apologize. However, this bit's new, this little bit is new, so hello, thank you so much. And I just want to say thank you to everyone who continues to support the show. If you haven't heard the show of Frank Turner, it's super fun. He shares an incredible fun fact. We play some fun, would you rather questions, and he plays a quiz called Rich Frank said this, where he had to guess if it was himself, Frank Turner, who said the quote, or if it was his mate, Frank Carter, who you may know from Frank Carter and the Rattlesnakes, but also as the frontman of the Sex Pistols at this time. Now I won't say a final goodbye because of just just just because why not why not why not just hear Frank Turner's Dorset tones to finish the show, but as you know, I always end the show in one way. I'm gonna end it here because for some of you you might just stop here and not listen to Frank Turner. It's always tradition to say this, as I'm sure you know. Just remember this stay safe, don't eat beef. Now, here's the interview with Frank Turner.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

The Full Circle.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

With D S D.

SPEAKER_01 1:46

I have a very special guest on the Full Circle today, an absolutely amazing and talented musician. He has released 10 albums under his own name. He has done over 3,000 solo shows and counting, including a world record, 15 shows in 15 cities in 24 hours. He has performed in over 50 countries. He is a chart topper and also an ambassador for the charity Calm, the campaign against living miserably. He is the incredible Frank Turner. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. Hello, Frank. Hi, what a lovely introduction. Thank you. It's an absolute honour to have you on here, and I cannot thank you enough for your time. So Frank has made his own full circle. So he has linked songs together, and we're gonna hear his choices. We're also gonna do some features, such as would you rather? And I've also thought of a quiz that only you and another Frank can do. I don't know if that's a bit of a clue. I don't know if you have any ideas about who the other Frank might be. Uh we'll see how we go. Okay. And and just and just some general chat in between as well. So, Frank, I know you do a lot of interviews, and you probably get asked the same questions very often. So, what I thought I'd ask is can you give a fact about yourself, whether it's a fun fact, whether it's not, but something you've never shared in another interview?

SPEAKER_02 2:59

I can't a hundred percent guarantee that I've never shared this in another interview, but it's not something I talk about very often for reasons that will become apparent quite quickly. Uh, when I was a kid, I had piano lessons when I was about sort of eight, nine, ten years old because I'm middle class. And uh, but the other thing that I did when I was a kid was I had harp lessons, and I have grade two harp. Um, I haven't touched a harp since I was 12 years old, and I'm not sure I could do anything with one at this point. But there was a I I had harp lessons for a few years, and um there is a photo of me playing the harp somewhere. But the problem with it was was that I was at one school and they had a school harp and nobody else was playing it, so I could do that. And then I went to another school and they didn't have a harp. And if I wanted to keep playing the harp, I'd have to buy a harp, which cost considerably more than the family car. And my parents were just like, absolutely not. Um, so that was the end of my harp playing. But yeah, I do have grade two harp.

SPEAKER_01 3:53

Wow, that it that is a very fun fact. And if you can get that photo, that'd be incredible. We'd love to see that.

SPEAKER_02 3:59

Yeah, it's I I would have to do some digging, but I'll see what I can do.

SPEAKER_01 4:03

And if anyone will donate Frank uh a harp, maybe maybe we can uh get some harps.

SPEAKER_02 4:08

I live I live in I live in a two-bedroom flat in London. I'm not sure how much space for a harp I've got these days. They're very large.

SPEAKER_01 4:14

Yes, no, that's fair. That's completely fair. And just in some downtime in between uh touring, how's the touring been this year for you?

SPEAKER_02 4:21

Uh it's been great, thank you. Yeah, um uh we what have I done this year? We I did a tour in Mexico at the start of the year that was great. I've I've been some visiting some places that are for me lesser visited, shall we say? So I was in Mexico. Um I did a tour of uh Southeastern Europe, the Balkan states, which was amazing. I went to Turkey for the first time, went to Romania for the first time. Uh I also did my 3000 show, done a UK tour, an American tour. We're in festival season now. Um, I've got my own little festival Lost Evenings in September in Edinburgh, which I'm excited about. Then I'll be around Europe again with my old friends, the Dropkick Murphy's before the year is out.

SPEAKER_01 4:55

So busy times. Yeah, and it all sounds amazing. And if you get a chance to check Frank out, please do because his shows are absolutely incredible. I saw you last year at Glastonbury on the Avalon stage. Uh that was that was really fun. We were right at the front for it, and yeah, I just really enjoyed it. We wanted to get to Strummerville, but unfortunately that just went instantly.

SPEAKER_02 5:15

Yeah, I mean, I love Stromerville to bits. The guys who run Stromerville are old, old friends of mine, and the sort of the whole philosophical universe around that place is very much in line with my take on the world. Um, but it is not the biggest space at Glastonbury. So I've done it, I think, three times now, and every time they've had to close down the area, which makes me feel it, you know, that's my Beatles moment. Do you know what I mean? It makes me feel very popular. Amazing.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

And your 3000 show was at Ali Pali this year, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_02 5:40

Yeah. Uh which was amazing. It was incredible. I mean, it's a funny thing because, like, on paper, there's no special reason why show 3000 should be better than show two nine nine or three thousand one or whatever. But it's a number ticking over, which is an excuse for a party, and other people seemed excited about it. So we had a big show. I love Ali Pali, it's the only non-royal palace in England, which I enjoy. And uh I used to live at the bottom of the hill, so it's very much my neighbourhood, if you like. And yeah, we had an amazing show. We had some great friends played as well, the lottery runners and the MFs. I'm wearing a MEFs t-shirt today. It was it was awesome. Yeah, yeah, incredible.

SPEAKER_01 6:12

And you mentioned the Lost Evenings 8, which is which is in Edinburgh. I think all four dates have now sold out, haven't they?

SPEAKER_02 6:17

Yes, they have, yeah. And um, we have one hell of a bill. The thing I'm most excited about, and I suspect I'm more excited about it than anybody else, but it's my festival, so who cares? Uh, there's a band called Arab Strap, who are one of my all-time favorite bands. They're not quite broken up, but they don't play very often. And when we were booking the supports for the festival, I put some political and financial resources towards trying to convince them to play, and they said yes. Uh, and I'm very, very excited about that.

SPEAKER_01 6:44

No, that sounds amazing. All four shows are different shows, because that's what I was going to actually ask you. Is any are any of them like make you feel a bit nervous? So actually, you're like, no, all the shows are gonna go.

SPEAKER_02 6:53

Oh, yeah. Well, so the guys in my band, the sleeping souls, refer to Lost Evenings as the annual exam, uh, because we play a different set every night, which means that generally speaking, we play just shy of a hundred songs over four nights, uh, which is a lot. Um, and uh, I mean, I have to do a bit of thinking about remembering second verses to songs and chord changes and stuff, but um, those guys really have to work quite hard. Uh, and you know, I spend I I am already writing the set list for that right now, in fact, um, because it's such a you know, there's a lot of work that goes into it. So, I mean, uh, there's it's it's always fun. It's very much a home crowd, as you might imagine. Um, but and it's the one sort of time of year where I can play the really deep cuts and people still get excited about them rather than going to the bar for a drink. Um you know what I mean. So um, but uh yeah, I'm excited about it. But there's there is a lot of uh graft that goes into making the fast forward with this.

SPEAKER_01 7:42

No, it sounds no, it sounds amazing. And of course, if you are around the Scotland area, you weren't able to get tickets. You've got a few shows before then, haven't you? One in Aberdeen, Sterling, and Glasgow, I believe.

SPEAKER_02 7:51

Yes, that's correct.

SPEAKER_01 7:52

So yeah, check if you're if you're able to check them out, please do because Frank shows are amazing. And you've also brought about Million Dead.

SPEAKER_02 8:00

Yes, which uh which is a turn-up for the books. It was the band I was in in my in my early 20s and late teens. Um, we were about four years, 2001 to 2005. We have not played together publicly since 2005. Um, and on Thursday coming, we are playing our first show in 20 years at the venue where we played our last show, which is some full circle for you right there. And uh, I'm pretty excited about it. I'm a little nervous. There's a physicality to those shows which I haven't done in quite a long time, and I'm a little kind of apprehensive about my general level of fitness, shall we say? Um, and the songs are the the pitch of the songs is super high because when I was in my early 20s, I used to yelk quite a lot. So um I've got to navigate that as well. But it I think it's gonna be a lot of fun. That's the idea. Yeah, and you're doing some more shows in December as well. Yes, yeah, we got a tour in December as well. And and incidentally, for anybody who's curious, that is it. We're not doing more after that, we're not doing any record, we're not doing another tour. If people want to see Million Dead, this will be your last chance.

SPEAKER_01 8:59

Oh wow, so definitely check them out if you're a Million Dead fan, because this is your last chance. Okay, shall we begin with your first song, Frank, and uh why you've chosen it?

SPEAKER_02 9:08

I'm I'm I'm slightly shooting from the hip here, which I'm enjoying, but I think we should play a Million Dead song given the conversation we've just been having. Uh, and if I was to pick one Million Dead song, I would pick the song Living the Dream, which was from our second record, uh, which is probably my favourite song that we ever did. So Million Dead and Living the Dream.

SPEAKER_01 9:24

Enjoy that one. And how would that link to the second song?

SPEAKER_02 9:28

Uh well, I think it slightly depends on what we talk about next. I've got a few ideas about where we're going, and I know how we're gonna finish this, by the way. I've got the ending wrapped up. Let's let's let's chat and I'll I'll I'll work it out.

SPEAKER_01 9:38

Okay, let's play some Would You Rather? So we'll do some Would You Rather questions. So they could be two very straightforward questions or two difficult choices. I hope one of them isn't easy than the other, otherwise that sort of uh, you know, makes it makes it pointless. So, would you rather perform an intimate acoustic show or a full band spectacle at a massive stadium?

SPEAKER_02 10:02

I mean, the first thing I would say is that I'm lucky that I don't generally have to choose between those in any permanent kind of way. Uh, I think that the honest answer is I'd rather play the full band thing. Um, I love the guys in my band, I love the noise that we make together, and I usually play a couple of solo songs in the middle of a full band show anyway. So um I do love the small instrument shows, but if you're gonna make me choose, uh, which seems to be the vibe of the game, uh, then I'm gonna go with uh the full band uh spectacular, please.

SPEAKER_01 10:28

No, that sounds yeah, I think that's I think that's completely fair. Um divided opinion, because I asked this on uh on social media, and a lot of people would rather see an intimate acoustic show than the full band spectacle, but I thought it was interesting to get your perspective.

SPEAKER_02 10:40

Yeah, which I understand, of course. I mean, the issue with it is I do quite regularly get people saying to me, Oh, I just wanted to do a tour of smaller venues, and on the rare occasions when I do that, they all sell out and that person doesn't get a ticket. Uh I try and pitch where I play to the number of people who want to come and see me play.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

Okay, this is a less of a music one because I didn't want to always just focus on music. I also uh it's just a general like politeness question. Would you rather never be able to say please or never be able to say thank you?

SPEAKER_02 11:07

Oh, that's a good question. Instinctively, I'm gonna say never be able to say please. It would still suck because I do try to be considerate in my journey through this world. But I do I think that thank you is more important than please in a funny way. They're both important, but I think I'm going I'm going with thank you.

SPEAKER_01 11:24

I think you're right. I think grateful and being thankful is more important than being pleased. Even you know, as much as that is polite, I think it I think it'd be harder to say to not say thank you. I agree.

SPEAKER_02 11:33

Right. I I think the the act the the fact of being, you know, anyone doing anything for you or giving you anything or whatever and never being able to say thank you for it would be torturous. Completely agree.

SPEAKER_01 11:44

Okay, this is actually quite uh an interesting one because we've spoken about your, you know, you lost uh, you know, your the the same venues and different set lists, and actually did think of this before we spoke about it. But would you rather perform at the same venue, like so this is like forever, at the same venue but have different set lists every time? Or would you rather perform at different venues but it always has to be the same set list?

SPEAKER_02 12:06

That is a really tough question. In my experience, I sort of do a bit of both, and the last evenings you mentioned, but I've done residencies in various venues around the world at different times. I recently did a residency in Colorado for a few days, same venue, different set list. But then, of course, on a regular tour, we don't play exactly the same thing every night, but we have kind of a reasonably established set list as we go. I think that ultimately when you're doing a residency, the fact of being in the same place every day gets a bit weird. Going back into a venue the day after you've played it to sit up and play again always feels a bit like revisiting the scene of a crime to me somehow. It's just a bit like, why are we still here? We should be somewhere else by now. And ultimately, on a lot of levels, when I'm on tour, the important thing is the focus is the music, of course, is the performance, it's the show. But the fact of that I get to travel around the world as a musician is a huge privilege and one that I love and enjoy. And you know, I'm I feel very lucky that I can say that I've got friends in cities all over the world. So I think that I would hate to have to make this choice, but I would probably choose the same set list different places. Simply because I get to travel and see the world and see people. I don't know, it would get old though. That is a tough one.

SPEAKER_01 13:20

I think more and more bands, I've noticed this more and more bands and artists are doing the same set list these days.

SPEAKER_02 13:28

Maybe because it's easier to sort of rehearse and it is, and like but then there's a famous thing that Tom Petty ended up, he went through about a 20-year period of playing the same set list every night because he basically just played the track listing of his greatest tits record. And he did actually start putting his fan base off going to see him live because at a certain point, you just if you know exactly what you get and you saw the last tour, it's just a bit like the same thing again. So I do in between tours, I change up my set list a lot. Um, and as I say, on a given tour, we do change it up every night. I try and play some requests, I try and play some rarities, I try and sort of move things around a little bit. But we generally have the same opening and closing to a show and stuff like that. And there's sort of, you know, there are certain sort of set pieces that work in the middle of the show. So I can sort of see both sides of it, really. Yeah, it must be tough.

SPEAKER_01 14:10

I would I would personally rather someone was at the same venue and different set lists as a fan. But yeah, I can see I can't.

SPEAKER_02 14:17

Yeah, I mean, well, that's the thing, there's a different experience there though. Do you know what I mean? And like if I was in the same place every day but playing different set lists, that would perhaps be creatively more interesting. But I just think I'd start feeling a bit trapped somewhere after a while.

SPEAKER_01 14:28

I've only chosen these two festivals because they're the two biggest festivals in the UK. But would you rather only perform at Glastonbury or at Reading and Leeds?

SPEAKER_02 14:36

Again, that's a tough question. And I'll tell you what, 10 years ago, my answer would have been quite different to what it is today. Because, in a way that I'm not casting shades of saying this, but Reading has changed a lot in recent years. I I hold the record for most number of consecutive years at Reading. Uh, I did 10 years in a row without a break. Um, and that finished in 2015, and then I played there again either last year or the year before, I can't quite remember, and was quite shocked at how different it is. It's a much more well, this is the thing. I think it is, I think its demographic target is still the same. It's kind of it's a it's a post-A-levels festival or however you want to describe it. But it was much more sort of TikTok focused, should we say? It was much more kind of pop and less rock and all that kind of thing. And I don't want to be an old man's check in a walking stick and say it was better in my day. It was different in my day. Um, and if that's I'm sure that Melvin and the people who book Reading know what they're doing. If that's what the the kids want to hear, then happy days. So I think that 10 years ago I would have said Reading without hesitation. But I have to say that now I would probably say Glastonbury. I feel that feels more homely to me as a musician, as a performer these days. Um, there's also, you know, I mean, Glastonbury has the cultural heft, it has it, it has the international reputation, all that kind of thing. So yeah, I'm gonna choose Glastonbury, but that that is a recent development.

SPEAKER_01 15:49

Interesting. Yeah, I I I've all I've been to Glastonbury quite often. I've only been to Reading and Leeds once, and I and I I definitely prefer the vibe to Glastonbury more than Reading and Leeds. I think this year, I think there's one particular day where there is quite a bit more of a rockier lineup. I think they've got one day they've got Bring Media Horizon, Enter Shakari, Limp Biscuit. But you're right, it in general, most they have changed their line-ups a bit more.

SPEAKER_02 16:16

It has. And then and then by contrast, I mean, looking at the lineup this year for for Glastonbury, you know, seeing Biffy Claro and Idols and people like that playing, there's definitely a lot more kind of quote unquote heavy music at Glastonbury than there was. When I was a kid, there was a pretty strict divide. There were indie kids who went to Glastonbury and rock and metal kids went to Reading. And it and again, I think that's changed.

SPEAKER_01 16:37

Um, this is one my partner wanted to ask, my partner Abby, if that's okay. Um, would you rather only have a cat or a dog?

SPEAKER_02 16:45

Uh I would say cat. Um I mean, I I love dogs. My goodness, I love dogs. I grew up with lots of dogs in my house, but as an adult, I've had cats um and I love cats. And I I lost a cat last year, so um I and I miss her very much. So I think I'd say cats. They're they're lower maintenance and they're easier if you're a touring person because you can um get people in to look after them in a way that is a bit easier than looking after dogs.

SPEAKER_01 17:10

Okay, how do we get from uh million dead to yourself?

SPEAKER_02 17:15

Well, so um there is a band um that I'm gonna phrase this carefully because I'm not trying to give anything away. But there is a band who were an enormous influence on Million Dead, and they were an they remain an enormous influence on me now called Descendants. They're an American punk band from uh starting the 1980s, but still going. One of my all-time favourite bands, um, and a band that I am possibly gonna do some stuff with in the future. That's all I'm gonna say about that. But the specific reason why I particularly want to choose the song I'm gonna choose, there is a descendant song called Thank You, and we had a brief chat about Grassites earlier, and it seems appropriate to me. It's a song that's uh that is a thank you to uh I believe I'm right saying there's lots of different sort of internet rumors about who it might be, but I believe it's a thank you to the band Black Flag, uh, who are a foundational punk rock band of the early 1980s. Um, and it the song is a thank you to them for existing. And I thought of it while you were we were talking about wanting to say thank you in life, and it's one of my favourite songs, it's such a huge influence on, as I say, on everything Million Dead did, but also everything I do as a solo artist. So the song Thank You by Descendants would be my second pick.

SPEAKER_01 18:19

Amazing. Descendants thank you the second song on the full circle. Okay, next feature which Frank said this. Um so the format is I've got some quotes, and they were either said by yourself, Frank Turner, or by Frank Carter.

SPEAKER_02 18:39

I figured that's where we were going with this, and uh and and it's all good. Um it's worth saying before we dive into this. So um I was a big fan of gallows when they first showed up. I've met Frank a bunch of times over the years, he's an absolute darling, and I was hanging out with him last weekend, in fact, because he's currently singing for the Sex Pistols, which incidentally I think is a tough gig because of the kind of layers of expectation that go with that. And I watched them play and I thought he absolutely smashed out the park. I think he did an amazing job. He's a lovely guy, he's a great front man, and um the only thing is that we regularly get confused for one another by in social media tags and by journalists. Indeed, the first I heard of the Sex Pistols reunion with Frank on vocals was getting inundated with people asking me for guest list for a Sex Pistols show, which was completely confusing to me because I hadn't read the news that morning and I was like, what on earth are you talking about? Uh so we took a photo together and put up a thing saying, you know, this one's Frank Turner and this one's Frank Carter. Lovely guy though.

SPEAKER_01 19:37

Yes, I actually did see that photo and I actually thought of this feature before that photo, and I was like, oh, that works absolutely perfectly.

SPEAKER_02 19:46

I'm not sure how many interviews is in my red, so I'll be very interested to see how this goes.

SPEAKER_01 19:49

I know you've done a lot of interviews, so I'd be interested to know if you know you remember words you've said or quotes you've said, or if you thought, oh, do you know what? Actually, that might have I don't think I said that, and turned out it was you, but yeah, we're gonna find out. Okay, this is the first one. As I get older, I find there's more dignity in accepting that there's a time and place for everything.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

This is tough. I that sounds like the kind of thing I might have said at a certain point in time. So I'm gonna guess me. Correct. Oh, look at that. What a wise statement.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

Yeah, it was an in it was an interview you did in 2022 of the independence. Right. I that that sounds likely. That sounds like a thing that would have happened. Are you are you feeling that way? Are you still finding that there's more dignity in it?

SPEAKER_02 20:33

Yeah, definitely. I mean, I I d I definitely think that I, you know, I think that probably what I was talking about back then is just I'm I'm in my forties now, and um there are certain I'm not trying to cast shade on anybody by saying this, but there are certain bands that sort of consistently attempt to inhabit the the time and space and musicality and charisma of who they were when they first broke through in their 20s. And you can sort of see why, but it just becomes a charade at a certain point, you know what I mean? And and indeed undignified. Um, you know, you've got bands in their bands in their 40s writing songs about high school, and it's just like, come on, mate. Um, you know, you haven't been anywhere near a high school in a long time. Um, so you know, yeah, I do try and I'm interested in songwriting that's honest and that's in reportage and and and channeling my experiences into songs, and um, high school is not a big part of that anymore, thankfully.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

Okay, next one. I find it quite depressing the way on which I think it's necessary to be quite good at social media on some level to succeed as a band these days.

SPEAKER_02 21:37

I mean, the first thing I say is that that's a sentiment that I wouldn't fully endorse. So it could well be something I said. But I'm gonna guess that it was Frank Carr who said that.

SPEAKER_01 21:47

It was you.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

Oh, damn it.

SPEAKER_01 21:51

Do you know what? You actually said that. Well, the the the interview was released this year, March 2025.

SPEAKER_02 21:57

Right, okay. I mean, I do a lot of interviews. Um You know, and I do find it depressing. You know, I spent many years learning how to play guitar and sing and write songs all the rest of it, and then I spend about 60% of my day um thinking about posting schedules for Instagram or whatever, and it's it's not quite what I signed up for in a way. But so um I'm well, and I like to think that Frank would probably agree with that too.

SPEAKER_01 22:19

Do you think that there's some bands that maybe if it wasn't for them being good on social media, they actually wouldn't be that popular or oh there's a question.

SPEAKER_02 22:30

I mean, yeah, I mean, I again I'm sort of I'm I'm keen not to be insulting anybody else. I think that probably is true. I mean, well, let's put it this way, without mentioning names, I've done some festivals this summer and crossed paths with a bunch of kind of bands I would describe as TikTok acts. Um, and I'm too old for TikTok, and that's fine, and I don't want to be an old man shaking his walking stick at clouds. But definitely it was a triumph of style over substance, would be a polite way of putting it. Fair enough. Okay. Next one, very vague. He's pretty special. The problem I'm having here is I'm trying to guess um whether what how you would lay out the A and B me versus Frank thing. I'm gonna say Frank just because you've done two by me. But I mean that could be a thing I said, and it depends who we're we're talking about.

SPEAKER_01 23:19

Exactly. It it no, but you're right, it's Frank Carter. He spoke about his band member, the original drummer for the Rattlesnakes, um, in 2015. But I also just wondered if would there be anyone you'd say that about?

SPEAKER_02 23:31

I'd say it about Frank Carter. I'd say it about lots of people. Funnily enough, actually, the original drummer from the Rattlesnakes, I believe, uh, was taught drums by my old drummer Nigel. So we ran into the festival about 12 years ago, and it was very odd because their drummer came over and said, Hello, Mr. Powell, and it was just like, what is going on here? Um, no, I think Frank's a special guy. I mean, I'm fortunate enough to know plenty of people who I would describe as special. Um, you know, often that's why I have them in my life, should we say?

SPEAKER_01 24:00

Of course. Okay. I'm an incredibly lucky individual, but I'm equally as appreciative of my position.

SPEAKER_02 24:08

That sounds like something I would have said. And certainly how I feel very fortunate in the way that my life has panned out, and there are obvious things about the privilege of my upbringing and all the rest of it. So I'm gonna guess me.

SPEAKER_01 24:19

And I would have, and I'm sure you probably have said it on a on an interview, but this was uh actually Frank Carter.

SPEAKER_02 24:24

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_01 24:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:25

Okay, cool. But I mean, I think, you know, good for him. I think it's important in life to be recon to recognize one's fortune as it comes along. And I mean, broadly speaking, the music industry, you know, I'm not saying that everything that I've achieved in my life has come down to luck because I've worked very hard at what I do. Um, but it would be insane not to recognise that luck plays a huge role in the music industry. I'm surrounded by friends of mine who I think are just as good musicians and songwriters as me who've not had the success that I've had. So uh I endorse the sentiment heartily.

SPEAKER_01 24:55

Okay, this is the last one. There have been times when I have felt that people were picking up on an ill-phrased thing that I said.

SPEAKER_02 25:05

I mean, again, that's definitely a sentiment I can endorse because lord above, that's happened to me. I'm gonna guess me. You're correct.

SPEAKER_01 25:13

Okay, there we go. There we go. That was from last February. Um, it was based on your song Do One when you were talking about your song Do One.

SPEAKER_02 25:20

Yeah, I think that you know, it's it's unquestionable that anybody who's been in the public eye for any amount of time, unless you're extremely well trained or whatever, there's gonna be moments in time when you've said stuff that could have been phrased better, could have been more considerate, could have been kinder, could have been um more self-aware and all that kind of thing. And I'm sure that Frank Caro has that in his life as well. Um, you know, I try not to say those kinds of things, but it happens. Do you know what I mean? And um, I think one of the major issues we have in our society now is that we live in a very judgmental culture that's not very good at the concept of forgiveness, um, which I which strikes me as if is nothing so much as impractical. Do you know what I mean? If somebody messes up, which everybody does, news flash, um, I think the most kind of useful response to that is to try and sort of help people correct themselves, do you know what I mean? And not to just be like, well, now you're the devil kind of thing. Do you know what I mean? I think that um there's nothing wrong with calling people on things that they say that are unkind and consider it inappropriate, whatever it might be. But I think that, and this isn't just self-interested, you know. I try and do this with other people who I know as well. You know, trying to kind of gently, kindly guide people to to smarter engagement with the world choices is a better approach than just kind of writing those people out of existence.

SPEAKER_01 26:35

I guess, you know, obviously if I completely understand if it's not not the specific thought, but was but was there when you said that, when you said this line, was there any was there something you were like, I wish I didn't say that?

SPEAKER_02 26:45

Or oh, I mean, there are there are bits and bobs, um plenty, shall we say. Um, you know, I mean that one of the things I would say is that I've reached a point in my life now where I'm kind of old enough now to just I'm really, really over the idea of hating on other music. To pick a specific example, I really don't like the Red Hot Chili Peppers music at all. It's not for me. Um, but you know what the Red Hot Chili Peppers do? They wake up every day and they make Red Hot Chili Peppers fans happy by making more music. And I think that's admirable. And I wish them to continue doing that because they're adding to the subtitle of human happiness, and that's a good thing. And I don't nobody's making me listen to Red Hot Chili Peppers, I don't have to listen to them, so I don't. Um, but the people who like them do. And do you see what I mean? And there were definitely points in my life, often in interview format, where I would say, Oh, that band's awful, or I hate that band, or whatever. Who cares? Like, I mean, who cares what I think first and foremost, but also like Kasabian, I don't particularly care for the music of Casabian, but they make Casabian fans happy, and that's great. And I want them to do more of it. Do you know what I mean? Um, like life is short and hard and full of the you know, it's a veil of tears and all that some cliche. And and if there are people bringing joy to other people through their art, then I wish them to do more of it.

SPEAKER_01 28:05

Yeah, and you know, like it, you know, hearing that, I mean, red-up chili peppers are one of my favourite bands, but that doesn't mean that, you know, just because you don't like them, you know what I mean.

SPEAKER_02 28:14

Yeah, one of my very best friends has a red-up chili peppers tattoo on his arm, and he's absolutely a diehard, diehard fan. And we don't agree about that, but it doesn't matter. Um, you know, I just asked him not to put them on in the car when we're driving together.

SPEAKER_01 28:28

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Okay, thank you so much for uh for going through that. We now move on to the to the to the next song. So what's uh the next song after descendancy? Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 28:39

Given what we've been chatting about, and I have had this one on deck for a minute here, um, I would very much like to pick a Sex Pistols song. Um, we were just chatting about them. Also, the Descendants, American Punk Man, there's a long and boring debate about whether or not punk rock started in the States or in the UK. Um I am something of a diehard Sex Pistols defender, and I think that if you listen to the Ramones and then listen to never mind, I don't know if I can say the title on this without cussing, but the the Sex Pistols album. Um, you know, it's very clear to me that the charisma and spirit and all that kind of thing of punk rock very much comes from the Sex Pistols and from John Lyden specifically. John Lydon's said some problematic things in recent years. There is a big part of me that's just kind of like, what's that you're saying? A Sex Pistol said something offensive. That's literally his job description. That's what he's supposed to do. You know, um, they're not supposed to have glowing write-ups in the newspapers every week. Do you know what I mean? They're supposed to aggravate people, and he does a very good job of that. But all of that aside, uh, that first Sex Pistols record remains, I think, easily the best punk album ever made. Um, and uh I loved watching them with Frank Carter the other week. Um, and uh I could pick almost any song off that record, but um, given it's what they're open with and it is the first record in the record, I'm gonna pick Holidays in the Sun by the Sex Pistols.

SPEAKER_01 30:01

Nice. Sex Pistols, Holidays in the Sun. Um, because that's also something to I wanted to bring about. A lot of the a lot of fans are very unhappy that Frank that that you know Frank Hart is now the singer.

SPEAKER_02 30:14

Well, I mean, it's not really for me to say. I know Paul Cook pretty well, the drummer, and I think the relations between Paul and Stephen Glenn and John Leiden, as I understand it, have broken down pretty completely. But in the meantime, you know, I'm I think it's great that what they're doing right now. They're not set they're not selling it as something that it's not, you know. I mean, all the all of the publicity says the sex was with Frank Carter, and that's what it is. And I think Frank does a great job.

SPEAKER_01 30:38

So and there's so many bands over the years that have changed their you know, their singers. Like the big big example is Lincoln Park. They've got a you know a new singer, and um, again, divided. I think something about change just causes issues with some people, I think.

SPEAKER_02 30:51

It does. I mean, there is there is a weird conservatism to a lot of music fans, and I can sort of understand that, you know, people have enormously strong emotional connections with certain music that is very time and a place for them and all the rest, and and I have that too with all the music that I love. Um, but you know, life goes on, things change, the world keeps turning, and ultimately, nobody anywhere is making anybody go and see the Sex Plus of the Crankaio. Um, so if it's not for you, don't go. Completely agree.

SPEAKER_01 31:19

Okay, so I just want to ask three uh questions, just your just three favourite things of yours. And and it's about you, your your about about you and your music. What's your favourite song that you've ever done?

SPEAKER_02 31:32

That is a really tough one. Um and the thing is like there is a part of me that sort of slightly looks asking the question, just in the sense that like I don't think there's really any such thing as just one type of song. Do you mean different songs are aiming at different things and they're therefore quite hard to compare with each other? You know, how do you compare Enter Sandman with Don't Think Twice It's Alright? I mean, it's like that they're not trying to do the same thing, they're both very successful at what they're trying to do, but is one better than the other? It's well, I mean, is is a tube train better than a basketball? Do you know what I mean? It's just sort of there there are different um targets in mind, should we say? This is me to a degree faffing around to try and avoid answering the question. Uh um, I mean, one of my favourite songs I've written is a song called Somewhere in Between, which was on Undefeated, the most recent record, partly because I think that it's a good song, obviously. Um, I think that it achieves what it sets out to do to go to what I'm just talking about now. You know, it's a song about a really kind of difficult emotional topic, and um it was a difficult thing to tackle as a writer. I was nervous about writing that song, and I redrafted it many, many times. You know, I I specifically remember actually I was driving back from a festival and the album was in the mixing stages, at which point it's rare to re-record anything. And I suddenly realized there was a word that I could change for a different word that would ever so slightly improve what it was I was trying to say. The the art of writing poet poetry and lyrics, I can't quite remember who said this, but it's it's the art of trying to say exactly what you mean, which is both the simplest and the hardest thing. So I checked I went well, I went back in the studio and retracked that lyric and changed it, and it, in my opinion, improved the song. Um, so you know, there's a lot of a lot went into that song, and I'm very pleased with it. But um obviously what it's trying to do is quite different from what a song like Photosynthesis is Snow, the song of mine is trying to do, which is different again from what Four Simple Words is trying to do. So, you know, it it's difficult to pick just one, but you're making me choose, so I'm gonna pick someone in between.

SPEAKER_01 33:35

Nice, yeah. That's a really good song. Undefeated. Check that album out. It's a really good album. My personal favourite on that is Ceasefire. I really like that one.

SPEAKER_02 33:41

Oh, thank you very much. That's a very important song for me as well. So I appreciate it, Sena.

SPEAKER_01 33:45

What's your what's been your favourite? I know I know it's hard to just pick one, but what was your favourite gig that you've done? That I've played myself.

SPEAKER_02 33:53

Yeah. Um, again, hard to say. Different gigs do different things. Um, a gig ultimately is an agreement between a performer and an audience, which means that it's not necessarily the case that your biggest show is your favourite show. We played at Wembley Stadium with Green Day in 2010, and it was an amazing thing to have done, but it's not my favourite show I've ever played by any stretch of the imagination. I mean, I will say that in February this year we played Show 3000 at Alexandre Palace. There's a live album coming out later this year of that show. That was a very, very special evening. It felt as I say, if if if art broadly and live music specifically is about connection, that show was remarkable for me because it was probably the most connected I've ever felt to that number of people. We had 11,000 people in the room, and um, feeling a connection with 11,000 people at the same time is a is a very odd and very impactful thing. So I'm tempted to say that I'm also tempted to go, oh yeah, it's when we played you know some random dive bar in the States last week or whatever to because that makes me sound cool. But um I think I'm gonna pick Show 3000. That was a really, really, really special evening.

SPEAKER_01 35:05

Yeah, no, no doubt. Okay, and again, so this this can be absolutely anything. Um and sorry to put you on the spot for this. What has been your favorite just moment? Oh wow, with in my life or as a musician, or just in your life, just this one moment or this one achievement, or just anything that you're like, wow, that was truly epic, or that's such a hard question to answer, you know.

SPEAKER_02 35:28

And I'm fortunate in life that I have many to choose from. Um I uh good lord, what to choose? And some of it's personal, do you know what I mean? Like I feel a great sense of achievement in my personal life right now. I've I've I've reached a moment of sublime contentment in my relationship, which is something I'm proud of because it wasn't easy to achieve. Um, so that's a that's a a possible choice for me. But at the same time, I mean I got an email yesterday from a guy called Craig Finn, who is in a band called Hold Steady, who are one of my all-time favourite bands. Uh, and he said that he was asking me to come and join them on stage at the 20th anniversary of uh what is one of my all-time favourite records, Boys and Girls in America. And he said that I was the their first choice for somebody to come and celebrate that anniversary with them. And when that record was released, I was in the crowd for their show at the borderline. Do you know what I mean? And this is going to be an arena show. And I'm not necessarily putting my money down saying that's my my favorite moment of my life, but there was a huge sense of value being valued and achievement in that, do you know what I mean? And being recognized by my peers, and that is something that matters to me an awful lot. So one of those two that I can't put my finger down.

SPEAKER_01 36:42

Incredible. No, absolutely incredible. Thank you for sharing your you know the favorite experiences. So, how do we link Sex Pistols to their next song?

SPEAKER_02 36:53

So, well, the one thing I will say, there is a clean version of this around somewhere which you might need to look up. Um, there is a song on Undefeated called Nevermind the Back Problems. Uh, so it's a song of mine. The title is obviously a reference to the Sex Pistols, but it's a song about getting older and trying to stay punk, as it were. And it's a playful song. Um, there are there are lyrics that are kind of joking around with various old punk bands and stuff like that. But it also, you know, in the midst of that, it does say something kind of that I consider to be meaningful. I'm not sure I'd say profound necessarily, but something meaningful. Just that idea of like, you know, as I as I was referring to earlier, I'm no longer in my 20s and and I do have back problems as it goes. Um, chronic back problems, which is no fun. But uh, but at the same time, I still go to gigs. Do you know what I mean? I still love punk rock as much as I ever did when I was a kid. It still gives my life direction and meaning. The and everything from the pistols and descendants through to the Meffs, whose t-shirt I'm wearing today, who are a newer punk man who I love. So, you know, um, it feels like a full circle thing to to bring that song up. So never mind the back problems by me. Amazing.

SPEAKER_01 37:57

And wow, how does that link to the first song then?

SPEAKER_02 38:00

Uh well, it's on the same album.

SPEAKER_01 38:02

No, the the Million Dead. Because the first song was Million Dead, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_02 38:06

Oh, The Million. Sorry, of course, Million Dead, sorry. It's by me. It's the it's another song by me. But I mean Living the Dream, the first song as well, is also a tune that's about um it's good. Living the Dream is a love letter to music um and to what it means to me to be able to be creative in my life, um, and to have a form of self-expression in my life that is meaningful not only to me, but that apparently some other people take meaning in as well, as evinced by my career. Um, and that is something that again I feel very privileged by. And I wrote that song, Living the Dream, 21 years ago. And it's a wonderful thing to me that I can be sitting here talking to you uh about a song that I wrote last year that also has meaning for me and for other people as well. And I think that's a good thing.

SPEAKER_01 38:52

Incredible. Hence completing the full circle. Yes, Frank, thank you so, so much for your time. Was there anything else that you wanted to sort of just add or say before we end this?

SPEAKER_02 39:01

Um, I'll be on tour, and people are welcome to come to shows.

SPEAKER_01 39:04

Yes, please do. He took on a phenomenal show. Enjoy it. Thank you so much, Frank, for your time. I really, really appreciate it and uh I wish you all the best. Thank you. Thank you so, so much.

SPEAKER_02 39:15

Thank you so much. It's been fun.