Insight from Veteran Patroller going from previous PNW Division Director to newly elected NSP BOD member.

We talk with newly elected National Board member Shelly Urban about the long campaign, how conventions differ across divisions, and why defining our lane as an educational organization safeguards standards nationwide. She shares priorities around OEC consistency, tech modernization, mountain hosts, and wellness.

The PNWD History Project:  Shirley Cummings, the official history project coordinator, (& all around fabulous lady), has been on a mission: Collect and assemble an archive of stories and pictures from the different ski patrols within the Pacific Northwest Division. Hence, Patroller Chats was born! 

Chapters

• 2:58 Campaign Trail And Why She Ran
• 4:57 Conventions, Forums, And Meeting The Divisions
• 7:51 How Boards Operate Across Regions
• 9:39 Stepping Onto The National Board
• 13:01 Travel, Snow, And Upcoming Japan Trip
• 17:29 Snow Conditions Across The Northwest
• 19:07 Career Path From Patrol To Board
• 22:39 Awards, Senior, And Service Milestones
• 26:05 Defining The Mission And Staying In Our Lane
• 28:35 National Standards Vs State EMS Rules
• 33:19 EMT Equivalency, Challenges, And On‑Hill Skills
• 35:50 OEC Consistency And Local Protocols
• 37:35 Toboggan Techniques And Terrain Differences
• 39:12 Building The Bike Patrol Curriculum
• 40:36 Fixing The Tech Platform And Records
• 42:44 Welcoming Mountain Hosts As Full Members
• 45:49 How Hosts Support Patrol Operations
• 47:56 Contact Shelly And Representation Goals
• 49:38 Wellness, Safety, And Culture Change

Transcript

Murphy 1:59

Welcome back to another episode of Patroller Chats. Today we're here with Shelly Urban, the newly elected National Board member. Shelly, how are you?

Shelley 2:10

I'm doing well. Thank you. How are you guys?

Murphy 2:13

Fantastic.

Shelley 2:15

Good.

Murphy 2:16

So, you know, we're all super excited that you were elected to the National Board. You know, before we get started on some of our other questions, tell us how was that long and grueling campaign? And what did you learn going into becoming a newly elected board member? And, you know, we'll talk about some of the things that people chatted with you about and you know what they want to see brought to the uh national board, how your life is going to change over the next couple of years. I know as division director, you were really busy, but now we're gonna put that into overdrive. So let's start out with on the campaign trail. How was it, you know, getting to getting to people all around the country? What did you do? Where did you go? How were those uh meetings?

Conventions, Forums, And Meeting The Divisions

Shelley 3:04

Sure. Um, well, I started out southeast and flew to gosh, that was I think in May to Albany, New York, and was able to go to their they don't call it a convention. I can't remember what they call it now. Spring meeting, I think. And got to kind of it was good because it made me, you know, you're when you're standing up in front of some people and trying to give a five-minute spiel of why they should elect you to something, you have to really hone in on why and why. It's a really good question. So, you know, trying to come up with the the why and really I had it in my brain, but trying to articulate that and put that into words was a good challenge. And I think it was it was great to go back and meet people, meet their their group of patrollers, their leadership, talk with them, see some, see some friends that I hadn't seen in a while, based on my division director experience. From there, you know, got my application in, did our convention for Pacific Northwest, then flew to Milwaukee to Central, kind of did a similar type thing at their, this was their convention. So got to again spend time with their patrollers, talk to people, do a little presentation about why elect me, and you know, kind of honing down out down on that. Yeah, it's a long process. Boy, I mean, May to where you start thinking about it, and you know, should I run, should I not run? March, April, and then you don't find out anything until December 1st. You know, what is that? Like nine months or something? It's a long, long process to to do that.

Murphy 4:37

Full term, as they say, in the OBG LAN world.

Speaker 1 4:41

There you go. Yep.

Murphy 4:44

Wow. So what was what was unusual that you ran into, you know, campaigning and going through this whole process? Was you know, was it what you thought? Was it kind of different? I mean, how how is it? I've never ran for national office.

Shelley 5:00

So I don't know. You know, I think uh just because I was division director for six years and you know, I knew what other, you know, like Liz Dodge and Lance Vaughn and John Kane and you know some of the other folks who were division directors, the campaigns and the process that they went through. You know, in the fall, there's the the uh forums that that get held that the division directors run. And I, you know, as a division director was involved in those. So I was pretty familiar with the process. I didn't really expect to go back east and to central for flights that you know were like go spend one day, come home, you know, all those that way on an airplane. But it was worthwhile, you know. I mean, I I enjoyed, like I said, I really enjoy getting to meet the people. You know, patrollers are patrollers are patrollers, you know, and and it's pretty cool to see how similar we all are and how we're also driven and passionate about the organization.

Murphy 5:58

Also, though, that you got to see with being division director for PW with 11 divisions and the NSP, you got to see some variations probably with like their meetings or or were there not any variations that you noticed?

Shelley 6:16

Yeah, you know, with Central, and actually I did get on the phone with Far West too, but that was just a phone call. With Central, there it was really fun because their convention is run very similar to ours. But I kind of wondered if maybe it was because we had, you know, when we were division directors, we exchanged, you know, because it's like, how do you guys run your convention? Let's kind of compare because I mean you guys know how every year with PW convention, it's like, what can we change? How can we improve? You know, but like well, everybody kind of runs theirs the same.

Speaker 1 6:47

Um yeah, yeah.

How Boards Operate Across Regions

Shelley 6:49

So it's very similar format. The uh Eastern board meeting, well, it was a spring board meeting, so it was all meeting, you know, all together in one room, people giving their like take our two-hour Sunday board meeting and expand it over you know two and a half days.

Murphy 7:10

Wow.

Shelley 7:11

Yeah, they did do a banquet.

Murphy 7:12

Did you say two and a half days?

Shelley 7:14

Yeah, because I think they started on Friday. I mean, I got there, they might have started Friday night. So maybe one two days, Friday night, Saturday, all board meeting. Saturday night they had a a banquet, dinner, and then Sunday. I think they met, yeah. I know they met again on Sunday, but I left.

Murphy 7:33

Well, they're like five times as large as Pacific Northwest.

Shelley 7:37

So exactly, yeah, like with 13 regions or something. Oh wow, yeah, they're yeah, they're big.

Murphy 7:44

Interesting. Okay, so you wound up doing that, and that was that was beneficially like that. You know, you came here to your home crowd, hometown, you know, pitch in the Pacific Northwest Division. How did that go? What was your uh reception? Did you feel all warm and loved by the time you finished that?

Shelley 8:03

Yeah, yeah. Joseph Roar, I think, kind of kicked that one off on Saturday morning.

Murphy 8:10

The mantra for Shelley, oh yeah, the mantra kind of carried throughout the weekend.

Shelley 8:15

Yes. I mean, we have such a great, warm, warm, welcoming group of people here. I just would not want to be in that love all the other divisions, there are people I've met, but gosh, you know, pretty connected here.

Stepping Onto The National Board

Murphy 8:28

Well, that's good to hear. I'm glad. So, how do you think your life's gonna change, you know, over the course of the next uh couple of years with doing this national work? I mean, because you were really busy doing division stuff. I remember, you know, you were always really good about getting back to me, and yeah, there was lots of stuff that happened, but now you're on a national level. So you represent that retired from the school? You're not doing that.

Shelley 8:53

Yes, yeah. No, I retired from that about four years ago, five years ago.

Murphy 8:57

Right.

Shelley 8:58

Yeah, no, so you know, as because my husband was asking me the same type of question just a few days ago. Like, well, you know, I mean, as division director, you know, I had you know all the national, you know, I attended all the national board meetings, I was on committees, um, I attended other meetings at the national level, and I had all of our division meetings, you know, the the wellness meeting, the meeting with a division group, just conversations, phone calls with so you know I don't think it's I think it might be even a little bit less, other than you know, other phone calls and and definitely, you know, as a division director and especially as division director chair of the team, I you know, we didn't get a vote a vote for a voice, but I still had the opportunity to share what our team thought about certain issues as they came up at board meetings, but now I get the vote. And so now I get to to you know do my research, find out where people stand on on various topics as they come up for vote, um, or or not for vote, and wonder maybe should they be up for vote?

Speaker 1 10:05

Right.

Shelley 10:06

You know, I get I get more of a say on that. So that's that's kind of cool.

Murphy 10:11

So what do you want to work on in regards to you know the national charter and things that happen at that office? I mean, what do you see as uh I guess a mantle, something that you are gonna bring to the national level and want to see some change, or at least you're gonna you know move in that direction? I know that's tough because there's you know different things that go on, but yeah, there's yeah, it just kind of depends on what pops up.

Shelley 10:39

But I I mean I guess my biggest my biggest focus is, and I you know, I I mean I hope I stay true to this, but you know, I've tried, I've really worked on it in my professional career too, is just to to really be able to listen to what people are saying and you know, have those conversations beforehand and be thoughtful about decisions, like I said, as as because you never know what's gonna pop up. You know, I mean, like, you know. I'm trying to come up with a topic that's not too controversial to bring up in a podcast.

Murphy 11:15

Um, come on, we want we want controversy here and there. Good for ratings.

Shelley 11:21

Yeah, let me think. Um I don't I don't know. I got you can come back to it. Let's come back to that because right now the ones that are popping up are pretty controversial and I don't want to get in trouble. I guess I'm already elected, so you know what could they do? Fire me?

Murphy 11:40

Can you get fired as a uh board director? You can.

Shelley 11:44

Sure.

Murphy 11:44

Oh, they can?

Shelley 11:46

Yeah, if you got a code of conduct against you.

Murphy 11:48

Oh, code of conduct, right?

Shelley 11:50

Yeah.

Travel, Snow, And Upcoming Japan Trip

Murphy 11:50

But yeah, that's gotta be fairly egregious. I would think you're too charming for that, so I don't think that's it. So you know, uh when do you actually when does your tenure start? Isn't it January?

Shelley 12:04

January 1st, yeah.

Murphy 12:06

Okay. So when's your first meeting?

Shelley 12:10

January 22nd in Denver.

Murphy 12:13

Oh, you guys are meeting face to face.

Shelley 12:16

Yeah. Yep, that's what I understand now.

Murphy 12:22

So do you get to bring your skis when you go so you can like do a little side trip and then well, some people are skiing on that Sunday, but I think that's a long ways for one day of skiing to drag my skis and my boots and all my gear.

Shelley 12:40

So I think I think I'll just go and come home and then we're flying, we're taking ski flight to Japan in February.

Murphy 12:47

So oh, where are you going there? A couple weeks after that.

Shelley 12:50

Oh my gosh, where are we going? All kinds of, I don't know. Ask Sally. Sally's in charge. I just I just jump on the airplane and I follow Sally.

Murphy 12:58

Yeah. Well, I saw a I'll say TikTok on some resort in Japan where the snow level is actually almost to the top of the derailer or the top of the tower. You know, yeah. It was amazing. It's I wonder if you guys are going to the same area because at Snowana they had some crews crews, they had some resort showcasing at the Portland Expo Center, and got to meet one of the you know, a couple of the higher ups up there, and uh it was great to talk to them and and you know, comparing a little bit of different things, but you know, about their powder and and not all of a sudden I just lost their name. I'll have to look it up while you guys are talking.

Shelley 13:42

I I can tell you, we're going to Tokyo and then we're going to. I know I'm not gonna pronounce these right, Akuba to ski. I think well, Tokyo, I don't think we're skiing in Tokyo. No, um, yeah, and then a place called Naseko. That's who was there.

Murphy 13:58

I think that's the big one that yes, yes that's who is at uh Snowana at the Portland Expo Center, and and it looks it looks like a lot of fun, amazing.

Shelley 14:08

It does look fun, yeah. I was pleasantly surprised. I mean, I hope they're getting snow. I hope they're not like us, right?

Murphy 14:13

Oh no, like I said, I saw the video and it was just chalked full of uh chalked full of snow.

Shelley 14:18

Yeah, good, yeah.

Murphy 14:20

But uh so are you guys getting any uh snow at your mountain right now? Because I know Crystal, it's uh barren and down low with all that rain. It's interesting because I saw Schweitzer and Lookout seem to have some snow.

Speaker 1 15:05

Really?

Murphy 15:08

And they they've had they're open, but I mean Bachelor's Closed, Hoodoo's Mount Spokane's open, yeah, because my brother-in-law was open so yeah, so that little section is getting small, but everybody gotta be way up north. Yeah, everybody else is just bring your umbrella.

Shelley 15:26

Yeah, I didn't even think, at least less I looked, Timberline wasn't open. No, that was what one or two weeks ago, so I don't think they're open either.

Murphy 15:34

Yeah, my brother tells me at Hood there's nothing. So unfortunately, yeah. Oh my god, lots and lots of rain.

Shelley 15:42

Oh my gosh.

Snow Conditions Across The Northwest

Murphy 15:43

Yeah, well, I had my my power is flickering this morning because of uh all the rain. And I was warning my wife that she's going down because she's in between the Cedar River and the Green River as they go through where her school is. Both of these things are saying that you know the river is gonna be eight, ten feet above flood stage. I'm like, holy. Yeah, really?

Shelley 16:08

Yeah, it's crazy.

Murphy 16:10

Well, this morning I heard the Scantit River, the prior record for overflow of the banks was 37 feet. It's gonna be 41 feet tomorrow morning. Oh it's like I'm trying to fathom how much water that is, you know, how many millions of cubic gallons that are going through there. Well, so here's something we talk about how you know the internet and how we get news so fast now compared to just 20 odd years ago. Someone was talking about a trillion, was it a trillion gallons of water that is being dumped in the PNW on social media? They were saying they just came on to announce they just learned about, but it was something like, yeah, 10 trillion or something. I'll I'll look it up while you guys are talking. Okay, so back to the back to your new board member job here. So you know you've been patrol. How long have you been patrolling? Should I ask? Well, you started when you were 16.

Shelley 17:17

I'm looking at much each year. 26 years.

Murphy 17:20

26 years. All at the same place?

Shelley 17:24

Yes, all at Sandy and Pass.

Murphy 17:26

All at Sandy and Pass.

Shelley 17:27

With Sandy and Pass, yes.

Career Path From Patrol To Board

Murphy 17:30

Yeah. How much patrolling are you are you gonna get in this year?

Shelley 17:34

I don't know. Depends on the snow. If we get some, you average is, I think for most of us, other than this the real snow hogs is probably 12 to 14 days a year, don't you think, Jody? I mean, and then then there's those who come up every weekend and they're like 25, 30 days.

Murphy 17:54

Yeah, and midweek, yes.

Shelley 17:56

And midweek, yeah.

Murphy 17:58

Are you still doing Alpine Patrol?

Shelley 18:00

Alpine, yep. Yeah, I got new skis.

Murphy 18:04

Oh, you got the new skis?

Shelley 18:06

I did. Nordica. I'm so excited to try them.

Murphy 18:10

And where did you find this great deal?

Shelley 18:13

I actually found it on the NSP website. No, I've looked, I have looked for like five years for a new pair, and they finally uh came across just an ad, you know, how they had the sweep or whatever since those ads, and like, all right, let me take a look at these. And it's like I did a bunch of research, they looked good.

Murphy 18:30

So yeah, I am getting more emails from the Pro Deal Store, which is kind of nice. Yeah, keep working on those things, those are always really super nice.

Shelley 18:41

That's true, that's a good point. Yes.

Murphy 18:43

You know, because we we can't reward people with money, but we can with awards and great deals.

Shelley 18:49

Yeah, exactly.

Murphy 18:50

So that's gonna be fun. Yeah, so uh back at Santi and Past. Give me your career there. Where what have you done at Santi and Past, you know, in your your role that you started out as an Alpine patroller, and then were you the PD, APD? How do you give me your progression of where you started in case somebody wants to be, you know, on the national board one day? This is Shelly's track.

Shelley 19:16

Yeah. Well, let's see. I guess I started by actually running the Norwester or the not wasn't the Norwegian back then, or what was it called? For our patrol, whatever it was called, the Black Forest, I think. So we used to have a newsletter just for our patrol. Oh yeah. And I put that together and then that kind of morphed and kind of went to somebody else took that on. And then I did awards. And then what did I do after awards? Oh, banquet, thank banquet and awards, I guess, kind of together. And then I yeah, became P assistant PD and then PD for nine years before I came division director. So it's kind of a lot of different Yeah, Hill Chief, yeah. Yeah, excuse me. Still do that.

Murphy 20:00

So you you weren't the region director, you skipped you went from PD to division director?

Shelley 20:05

Yep, yep. I was never the region director. Yeah, I did some, I did awards at the region level, I think one or two years, and then I was you were nor'wester. Nor'wester for the division.

Murphy 20:17

Yes.

Shelley 20:18

Yeah. And then as as the assistant PD, I think I went to a few region meetings that uh and then of course as PD, I went to our region meetings.

Murphy 20:29

So when'd you get your national number? No cheating. I see you looking.

Shelley 20:36

I didn't I didn't print that one out. I just printed down my number.

Murphy 20:42

Oh, 11452 is the number. Okay, now you can go look and see what it was. I was going in the opposite direction to try and confuse her a little bit. So she had a little liquor.

Shelley 20:56

I think I got that 2013, 2014, probably something.

Awards, Senior, And Service Milestones

Murphy 21:02

You can look at your list there, but so those that don't know, I'd be curious to know if other divisions do this. Do what? Do what about can you name your number and the consequences of if you don't name your national appointment number?

Shelley 21:20

Yeah, you got you all around. Yeah, I don't know. That's a good question.

Murphy 21:24

Yeah, see if others. So your NSP number is 198.

Shelley 21:31

See, I know I memorized the one, 11452, 198319.

Murphy 21:35

And your national appointment number is 11452. A lot of ones.

Shelley 21:43

Yes.

Murphy 21:45

So you got that one, was it 2013?

Shelley 21:48

Something like that, yeah.

Murphy 21:50

What is so what did they cite in your national number? All the uh stuff that you had done to get that for your oh gosh, I think for that one I mean, I'd had a handful of awards.

Shelley 22:04

I think where's my awards list? That probably doesn't give me my years. Oh, it does. Oh, national appointment, 2013. There you go.

Murphy 22:14

Your memory is still strong.

Speaker 1 22:16

Yeah.

Murphy 22:17

You'll you'll be able to continue as board of directors with that memory.

Shelley 22:20

There you go. Yeah. I think I just actually hadn't had that many awards, but I did a meritorious service award and then I'd been OECA, you know, an OEC instructor control director for nine years, all those things.

Murphy 22:33

When did you start doing the Nor'Wester?

Shelley 22:38

That was under Dave Ulrich. So that would have been 2010. Around that, probably 2010, 2011, yeah.

Murphy 22:49

And you got your senior win.

Shelley 22:52

And I got my senior in probably was 2010 or 2011.

Speaker 1 23:01

Okay.

Shelley 23:02

I had a couple years when I wasn't working and my kids were in high school, and so I kind of like I gotta get senior done, and I I had time to do the nor'wester, so I kind of jumped on those. That's awesome.

Murphy 23:14

Yeah, getting your senior takes a long time. I mean, yeah, that's an arduous effort. Uh being that you were ahead of the nor'wester, I don't know if you can see this if it gets cut out.

Shelley 23:24

Yep. Oh no, I guess it.

Murphy 23:27

See that I was going through my office. That was from 2015. I have a stack of all the old ski patrol magazines. I'm trying to clean my office, but so I had the stack, and in there were a couple of very old, yeah, in fact, almost yeah, 10-year-old, because we are 2025. Yes, yeah, nor'westers. Oh, that's awesome. We're definitely have to give those on to Shirley. Oh, yeah.

Shelley 23:56

Yeah, well, and I know I've got all of the ones I put together.

Defining The Mission And Staying In Our Lane

Murphy 23:59

Yep. Because we want to get those updated onto the website. At least we can preserve our own website. I find it very interesting trying to go back in time and the internet people go, oh, it's all out on the internet. No, no, it just ups and disappears. Nice to have the actual copies. But yeah. Yeah, speaking of copies, the other thing that we were working on the other day was our, you know, the book that we have, our directory, trying to figure out how we maintain that thing. Because still to this very day, if you want to know if somebody's been doing something in the past years, yeah, we can't really go online. We have to go to the book. You know, old thing, oh, here's uh, you know, they did it this year and that year, as Blaine points those things out. Yeah, those are good.

Shelley 24:52

Yeah.

Murphy 24:53

So, you know, another question that I have is that you know, you've been patrolling for quite a long time. What's what's the biggest challenge that you've seen that uh that ski patrol faces you know, giving your history, where we've gone, or excuse me, where we've come from and where we're going, what do you see in the next, let's say, five years is our biggest struggle or things that we can change we have to work on?

Shelley 25:24

Good question. Um, I think a lot of it has to do with what is our job as an organization? I mean, we're a member-driven organization, we've got a mission and a vision statement out there. And I think we need to be really thoughtful to stay this term seems to bounce around a lot. Stay in our lane, you know, define our lane and know what that is. And then when when and and I think that that trickles down. That's what members on the both volunteers and paid who are on the ground trolling every day, day in, day out, or on the weekends, or whenever they're patrolling, they need to be assured that the organization that certifies them in their educational career, you know, because that's what we are, we're an educational organization, that that organization is solid and is giving them information and educational material curriculum that is not just accurate and up-to-date, current, whatever you want to call it, but also that's engaging and and you know, is being delivered in a way that that people are actually absorbing that material and want to absorb it. I think that's you know, I think we need to be really careful because that's who we are. And if we start reaching outside that lane, that puts us on a little bit of a rocky ledge, I think.

National Standards Vs State EMS Rules

Murphy 26:58

So that kind of makes me raise the question of we're talking about bringing, you know, standardization into our organization when it comes to outside control, state controlled, you know, emergency responders. Do you think that's gonna have any impact on us here in the near future? I mean, are we going to be held to some of the you know, same standards as I don't want to say like, you know, we're an AMR or somebody else, but you know, like an emergency responder, and that state regulators come in and say, look, if you're gonna do that on the mountain, you gotta be held to the same standard as anybody else, you know, like an ambulance organization.

Shelley 27:46

Yeah, well, I hope not. Yeah, I know that's a big that's a big topic because at least you know, in my opinion, your OEC, you are on the same level as you know, what a basic EMT, essentially. Right, you know, but we don't want to be regulated by the state because we've got a national charter, and you know, we don't, and every state's gonna be different.

Murphy 28:11

I mean, you guys that's what people don't realize. They don't realize that. Yeah, every state, I mean, there may be similarities, but the uniqueness of the OEC Outdoor Emergency Care is that it in the past, it has always been standardized throughout the nation and international so that you basically can drop anywhere and you can say this is documented. We've all had the exact same curriculum. And sure, there may be some other things that one area sees more prevalent than maybe a different division, but we've all had the same standard of training where EMS it is totally state driven. And there are, you know, I remember when I first started learning that some states, as an EMT, you could not administer oxygen in that state. But in XYZ states and the majority, yes, that was part of your training. So everything was sort of now. If you go to a different state, then you have to go, okay, well, what's the same research, yada, yada? And that's my biggest concern of how what happens, you know. I give the case in point of that accident that we had up at Mount Hood in government camp. Was it I think 2011, where the Subaru went end over end. And so right at government camp, we had people from Michigan, Washington, Utah, I Idaho, uh, Oregon, everybody there, and everyone just was helping out and knew what we were doing, and it didn't matter what state you came from, right? And now it's if they're I it's gonna be interesting to see what happens with the latest changes.

Shelley 29:57

Yeah, that that was one of the ones that came to my mind when you were asking me. Yeah, so it and it is. I I think that we need to be really again stay know who we are and stay in our lane and be careful about you know, unless unless there's some big group of people, you know, it wouldn't be me on the board who says we're gonna we're gonna change direction and completely redo National Ski Patrol. You know, that's a whole different ballgame, but that would not be my stance at all.

EMT Equivalency, Challenges, And On‑Hill Skills

Murphy 30:31

So how are they bringing in people that get you know EMS certified? And I'm not talking about paramedics because they wind up being on a different level for EMS, but just your you know, your basic EMS responding professional. If they want to come into our organization, I know that we have that challenge option that they can you know pass. Is that gonna be something that we look at and say, okay, if you're you know EMT, you can come in and just challenge and you're in, you don't have to do the OECD care. Or are we gonna you know still require people to do OECD and then on hill version, you know, of the OECD? Because one of the things that I'm gonna tell you from my experience, we have to do with the backpack what they get a whole truck to do, right? When it comes to EMT. So there are some differences that you need to have, you know, in your toolkit, you know, some skills that you're not gonna be able to transfer right out of an ambulance. So how does National look at that? I mean, are they because I know that's kind of a push that they want to do is just come up with that OEC. If you're an OEC or not, excuse me, if you're an EMT, you're automatically in.

Shelley 31:52

Right. Yeah, that and that hasn't, I haven't seen anything come forward like with an a request for action for that particular piece. I mean, as it stands now, like you said, there's a challenge and then there's a modified challenge, depending on, and I'd have to look up exactly who can take what. Um, I don't have to remember off the top of my head. But that's merely for OEC. Now, when they come on your mountain, you know, every mountain's got different standards of training for their mountain, right? So, you know, like mine, you become an OEC, you get on the mountain, you still have to do your 10 days of training. You still have to, you know, go out, run a run up a problem on the mountain, get that, you know, take care of an injured person simulated, get them down to the first aid room, get them out the door, all those things, they still have to pass that in order to become a patroller on that hoodoo. You know, so that piece, as far as how they apply those skills and carry around that pack and call for auctions, and that's still you know, mountain driven. And and it should be patrol driven and should be, I mean, should be specific to each mountain because we're all different in that regard.

Murphy 33:05

And so how's you know, training-wise, are we as a an organization pretty similar with East Coast, and you've got, you know, the Central and let's just go, you know, Pacific Northwest Division. I mean, I know the OEC winds up being similar, but are they granted license to have some flexibility within that training for you know what they may have locally?

Shelley 33:33

No, I don't think so. No, everybody's supposed to be adhering to the same standards of training. Now, you know, when you go to your own mountain, you have a medical, hopefully, you've got a physician, you know, medical advisor who might then give you some certain protocols that you can use at your mountain based on their you know their oversight. And I know we at Santa Pass have some.

Speaker 1 33:54

Right.

Shelley 33:55

Um, you know, but as far as just the standard of training, it's supposed to be the same. You know, we should be able to, you know, you and I and Jody should be able to walk into an OEC class, you know, and that's what I'm saying.

Murphy 34:11

Right.

Shelley 34:12

That's waiting for and it should be the same.

Murphy 34:16

Yeah, because I know we get stuff, we will have trainings, and King County winds up being different, and they have different protocols. And I know that they do have disclaimers. So they'll say this is what OEC is, this is what King County is requesting for some of their EMT services so that we can, you know, they're doing testings. So there winds up being a little change, but yeah. That's good. Okay. So we're we are all on the same sheet of music, as it were.

Speaker 1 34:46

Yes.

Shelley 34:47

And that's not change. Yeah, the only nope, it shouldn't it hope not. Yeah.

Murphy 34:51

Okay. What about transportation? EMT tobogganing, or excuse me, uh EMT, OET.

Shelley 34:59

Yeah, should be. I mean, yeah, that should be the same. I mean, there are there definitely are differences in techniques. You know, you go to to Ness and Boltz up Mount Hood, and people come from all over the nation. And you know, which is is great because you learn different techniques for bringing a toboggan down, different, different, which is I think is important. Oh, you could do it that way, and that oh, that's it, that's interesting. That's a actually an easier way for me as a five foot, you know, short, older woman to be able to get a toboggan down the hill.

Murphy 35:31

Well, and and each place has different, I mean, the different terrains, whether it's the concrete ice, uh it's the you know, limited width, and there and there are some areas that rarely use a sled and mainly only use a snowmow.

Shelley 35:48

Yeah, that's true.

Toboggan Techniques And Terrain Differences

Murphy 35:50

Yeah, it does vary. So it's sort of related in the bike patrol world, how are we growing that side of the business? Because you know, more mountains are getting you know bike activities during the summer.

Speaker 1 36:04

Yeah.

Murphy 36:04

Are we really expanding that program and growing that thing to increase our membership?

Shelley 36:11

Yeah, it's a good question. I I mean, I have been super impressed by Jeremy, torture his last name, Bravetsky, who's the National Bike Program Advisor. He is just really on top of developing an appropriate curriculum for the bike patrol. They've already got what is it? I mean, intro to bike patrolling and then a bike patrolling, I think, one, and then they're working I think now this year, I think they're working on the bike senior. So he's really moving things along, and he's you know, he's very thoughtful about making sure that all of their I's are dotted and their T's are crossed before coming forth with no, here's our course, you know, can it can can it be approved so we can put it on the platform? You know, he's he's a pretty impressive guy, so I think they're moving along very, very well. At least, you know, I haven't I haven't been to any of their meetings recently, but from what I've seen.

Murphy 37:11

That's good. And since you brought up our wonderful computer system that we have. Oh, I'm sorry. You know, what's what's national's goal with that? If you have any insight into how they're gonna fix that, how they're gonna make it better and easier to use and changes that are coming.

Building The Bike Patrol Curriculum

Shelley 37:30

You know, I don't I don't know for sure. I know that there has been a group in, I believe it's in the planning committee. I was looking through the board minutes for the tonight's board meeting. And if I understand it right, there is a subgroup in the planning committee that's working, taking a look at the system, kind of like we did several years ago. You know, the question is you know, do we put continue to put band-aids on it or do we wipe the slate clean and buy something that's actually you know more 2025, 2026, right? You know, and beyond and would actually do what we needed to do.

Murphy 38:10

Yeah, like if you want to become an instructor in the ski patrol, it is you know something that's archaic and sort of antiquated. And you know, as a potential candidate to be an instructor, you have to carry around that piece of paper and guard it with uh everything because if you lose it, you have to start all over again. There's you know, no national record, or you can just go in and start checking boxes on that. I mean, that would be a nice addition that they can work on and add. Because as a teaching organization, there are some things where we're fundamentally behind.

Fixing The Tech Platform And Records

Shelley 38:44

Way way behind. Agreed. Yeah, yeah. We've yeah, that's a whole that's a big topic. That that whole system is just a you know, like you said, you mentioned about the records that we have to actually go back in our books to look things up. That should not happen. I mean, we've lost so much data when they switch systems.

Murphy 39:04

Uh I'm I'm being told by others that have been a long, long time patrollers that say it's there. It's just you got to know how to go behind the scenes and dig for it, which brings up the whole point. We need to be able to access and ensure that it's there. Yeah, definitely. But but of course, you know, we we at the Pacific Northwest, our website is, you know, golden.

Shelley 39:31

Yes, it is. Very good.

Murphy 39:33

Not biased, are you, Jody? No, no, there's no bias in that statement whatsoever. Not, none, not a peep. Oh, that's good. Hey, well, let's get chompic here for a second. Mountain hosts. Now the mountain hosts are you know full-fledged members. How's that impacting things at the national level? What are they, you know, thinking about and changing? And did that impact the last election at all that you know? Do they have stats on that kind of stuff?

Shelley 39:59

I mean, they they are going. My understanding is that they will have stats on that. I'm really curious to know that too. How many of our hosts voted, you know, not just nationwide, but you know, in the Northwest and you know, where we are and all the other divisions, you know, because I think we've got a fairly decent compare comparatively to other divisions, um, number of hosts. So I'm curious I am curious to know that. I know there's some they the board just passed that hosts are required now to take ICS 100. You know, they do have to take OFC, they have to have current CPR.

Murphy 40:35

And OF And so I think there's some cleanup. Yeah, OFC for those that are not in the know, that's outdoor first care.

Welcoming Mountain Hosts As Full Members

Shelley 40:42

Yeah, there you go. Yeah, and and there's there's definitely some cleanup on that, where there's some hosts that you know maybe don't have all those things. Of course, many don't have ICS 100 because that was just recently passed. But trying to get the word out, get them caught up, get their records right in the system, and you know, it's bringing them fully on board. I think that's it's probably gonna take another year, I would guess, for that to happen. Or more. I don't know. Hopefully, hopefully not more than a year.

Murphy 41:11

Have you got any feedback from any mountain hosts? Are they uh happy, excited that they're now full-fledged uh patrol members?

Shelley 41:19

I haven't really heard much, to be honest with you, but you know, our I mean, our patrol is, and our patrol is just now getting a host unit. Kind of started forming last year, but nobody was actually doing host stuff yet. So we've got I think we've got four or five hosts, yeah. Yeah, yeah, and they're super excited. Yes, they are so excited, yeah. And they're excited to be voting, and yeah, they were at I went to at our refresher at our on the hill, they were all a buzz and it was great. It was kind of fun.

Murphy 41:52

Well, we and Crystal, we've had hosts for years, and they are really part of our program. I mean, they come in so handy. We've got them, you know, down lower mountain, upper mountain. You have questions, it kind of allows us to be ski patrollers because we've got mountain hosts there that can do a lot of a lot of those guest related things. So yeah, I'm very appreciative of them in our system.

Shelley 42:17

And I guess, yeah, your yeah, your mountain was the first mountain I went to that that had hosts. And yeah, I agree, Marf. I was so impressed by. Your folks up there, Crystal. They they were the ones who sold me that hosts need to be traditional members, and and they do and and are both do so much and are so beneficial.

Murphy 42:38

Yeah, why east or Mount Hood at Timberline and then expanded down to Ski Bowl. I'm not sure if it's still at Ski Bowl, but for the mountain hosts. And that's that's where some of that uniqueness goes into when I say uniqueness, it varies by area because some areas don't have them, some areas do, some are with NSP, some are not, and they're different. I mean, I've heard from different regions, some are called rangers, some are called different things. So it's interesting. I I think there's a lot of varied there's similarities, but then there's um a lot of area specific variations to that. Mount Spokane has them has a host program.

Shelley 43:22

If I'm correct, yeah, I think you I think you're right.

Speaker 1 43:24

I think they do.

Murphy 43:26

So yeah. But yeah, like I say, I'm glad that they're there. They're a wonderful help to us and yeah, glad that they finally get uh full membership and they can wind up doing some votes. And I hope a lot of them voted for you.

Speaker 1 43:43

Yep, yep, agreed.

Murphy 43:45

So you're gonna start here in January on your new your new journey. Is there anything that you want to add, you know, into you know what you're gonna do, where you're gonna go? If people want to get a hold of you, how do they get a hold of you?

How Hosts Support Patrol Operations

Shelley 43:59

Yeah, I think that was gonna be my only thing is you know, I I want to hear from people. And you know, some some of you folks attend national meetings, others, you know, are national or division advisors and go to so you know, people hear what's going on. And as as they hear, I want to hear from from our folks. I want to, you know, and like I think Jody mentioned, I'm not representing just our division anymore, I'm representing the whole nation, but you know, our division is still our division, and I know the folks here and I want to hear from them, and they can reach me at my same old, same old email address that Jody has up with the Nsp-PnWD address that's up on the website and my phone and text, whatever. You can write me a letter and put it in the mail.

Murphy 44:48

But oh a snail mail. Wow, wow. That that's that wouldn't that be weird? Good going back in history time, yeah. Oh, fantastic. Well, thanks for coming on the show today. We uh really appreciate you uh taking some time out of your schedule because I know you're very busy.

Shelley 45:10

Thank you for having me. You guys too.

Murphy 45:14

Going back, speaking of history-ish a little bit, can you share some insight over your years of some significant or impactful things that you've seen change over the last 26 years? Including safety. You knew I'd throw that in there someplace.

Contact Shelly And Representation Goals

Shelley 45:38

I was yes, I did think you would throw that in there. Yeah, I mean, definitely obviously wellness. I mean, we got that kicked off, Jody in particular in our division, and it's you know, Eastern and a lot of the divisions, it's it's a slow process. Oh, yes, like dragging teeth pulling teeth sometimes. But being just and I and and it's not quite sure how I want to say it. I think just awareness that as patrollers we can be vulnerable and that incidents and life affects us just like everybody else, and to be aware of that and you know how we bring that into our patrols, it's it's a difficult process. I mean, I think about my own patrol. There are those who are just so against anything to do with it, and then there are the others who are embracing it, and so it's just it, and that kind of goes again with you know, in a lot of the different things that happen within the national organization. I think it's probably within a lot of organizations, is you've got you always have two different sides, you know, just like or more, yeah, or more. And how do you resolve those? And and and that's where you comes back to what are the goals of the organization, what's the mission of the organization, where is our lane, and and staying there, and you have to do that also within your patrol.

Murphy 47:07

So that's trying to think outside the box, but also making sure we're not taking the U-turn or whatever. But um, have you seen anything else as far as I mean, think of mine when you first joined compared to now of people joining or or along that lines? As is there anything that comes to your mind? Obviously, I'm hitting you with this at the very last minute, but that's okay.

Wellness, Safety, And Culture Change

Shelley 47:33

You know what? Probably not so much. I mean, when I first joined, I was, you know, I was a mom with two little kids. I was trying to run a startup private school, you know, with had nothing knowing, not knowing anything about what I was doing. And to be honest, patrolling was for me was kind of my escape, my getaway. And I was, you know, I would go up, I would do my patrolling, I would you know, take care of people, but you know, I wasn't really involved in any of the community of our patrol until you know a few years, probably five years. So my initial was just kind of this is just I really want to do this just kind of for me.

Speaker 1 48:19

Right.

Shelley 48:19

Try a little more selfish. Well, I so I'd have a hard time, yeah. I'd have a hard time saying initially because I really wasn't aware of, really involved in region, division, national. I had enough going on my plate to even I didn't think about those things.

Murphy 48:41

Of course not.

Shelley 48:42

Same answer. Sorry.

Murphy 48:43

Uh it's all right. NSP's freed since 1938.

Shelley 48:49

Safety and service, service and safety.

Murphy 48:51

Service and safety. So I hope your next venture as a board member will help to showcase safety, bringing it back to the forefront. I know you talk about wellness being a long journey. Hopefully, we'll see that coming back as well.

Shelley 49:10

But yeah, I hope so. Yep.

Murphy 49:13

So anything else, Mark? No. All right. It's good. I like it. Thanks, Shelley. It was really good.

Shelley 49:22

Thank you. Thank you. And it was good to have you back.

Murphy 49:24

Congratulations once again on your uh successful victory. You can take your victory lap now. All right, that's awesome. Thank you very much.