The Hearing God Podcast
Anthony Moore and Dan Lamos have met for coffee every week for over a decade. You're invited to listen in on their conversation on The Hearing God Podcast. Explore the prophetic, mystical, and heart-centered aspects of a life filled with the Holy Spirit. Each episode offers insights, inspiration, and practical wisdom to deepen your spiritual journey. Tune in for authentic and encouraging conversations that will enrich and empower your walk with God.
The Hearing God Podcast
His Presence Changes Everything
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Questions? Fun God stories? Let us know!
God with (and in) us is what sets us apart. This reality simply changes everything. We start with Moses' bold request in Exodus 33 and move to the rhythms that keep us grounded today. The heartbeat is simple: we will not move without God. That posture isn’t about drama or performance; it’s about a daily, ordinary awareness that the best part of any moment is the One who is with us.
From there we push into what presence produces: power that makes a real difference. We talk about the church as more than mere talk, and share stories of healing, freedom, and provision that have shaped our expectations. Deaf ears opening, chronic pain lifting, shame losing its grip—none of this works on theory alone. We also get practical about why some prayers seem to stall. Sometimes the body hurts because the heart is holding a wound. Learning to ask simple, honest questions helps us partner with what God is actually doing rather than what we assume He should do.
You’ll hear how we practice attention in the mundane—car rides, desk work, hallway chats—and why that quiet habit prepares us for moments that need courage. We draw a straight line between “Your kingdom come, Your will be done” and a life that expects God to move. Not as control, but as persuasion. Not as formula, but as friendship. Connection comes first; commission flows from there. Our hope is that you’ll walk away with a deeper hunger to notice what God is noticing and the courage to step toward the impossible with a simple yes.
If this conversation stirred something in you, subscribe, share it with a friend, and leave a review so more listeners can find the show. What’s one place you want to invite God’s presence today?
Welcome to the Hearing God Podcast. I'm Anthony Moore. And I'm Dan Lamus. For over a decade, Anthony and I have been diving deep into weekly conversations about the prophetic, the mystical, and the matters of the heart.
SPEAKER_03:And we invite you into these weekly conversations. We hope you feel like an honored guest at our table. So pull up a chair, settle in, and let's get started.
SPEAKER_02:Well, here we are. Here we are. Here we are. How's it going, Dan? Good, good. We've got our coffee and we've uh we're here. It's a early morning. Always always a time. I mean, for me, I love the early morning.
SPEAKER_01:You are definitely of the two of us, the early morning.
SPEAKER_02:Early morning person, yeah. Well, I just know I've learned about myself a long time ago that uh that I just have a bent to uh be have my feelers out soon into the day as to what everybody else needs. And I tend to get I tend to get wrapped up in that, which hey, which makes you a decent pastor. So decent pastor. Yeah, that's uh that helps. But um it's also like kind of how you're wired too. Yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah, so I really enjoy the time of the day where it's just pretty much just me and God, and and I can just I have my mind isn't getting cluttered with other things. And so I really enjoy the morning a lot. So so but I'm I'm doing well and yeah, uh I I'm I'm kind of intrigued lately of might have something something to do with my age. Well, maybe, but it's a joyful thing too. Uh I I I'm aware of how God God has the the right and the permission with anybody who has said, hey, I surrender my whole life to you, God. Right. He has the permission to, you know, uh put you into the game whenever he decides to do that. Yep. And I'm just learn I'm learning more and more how I need to stay prepared, have an attitude of it's fair game for God to call upon me in any moment. Right. And it's just important for me to remember who he has said I am. I think that's that's the thing that's been on my mind a little bit is hey, no matter what else might be coming on the airwaves to you that you're swatting away or receiving, don't forget who God has said you are, because it'll there'll be a conversation or an invitation that'll come seemingly out of the blue and ask you to do a thing, yeah, and you're like, oh yeah, that is who I am. And you've you can forget it.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Doing other good things. It's not a it's not a one and done thing, right? Right. You you seem to be uh put through these situations where you're where that is challenged and you have to be frequently reminded what God has said about you.
SPEAKER_02:Don't make yeah, don't make assumptions by don't okay. Maybe this is the principle. Don't let circumstances fool you into making assumptions about what's going on. Yeah. Because we don't, we're not great judges of that. Right. And all of a sudden, God will bring along, oh hey, can you do this for me on Wednesday? Yeah. And you're like, yes. And maybe you thought maybe that season of of your life was not really important right now. And God goes, Oh, well, no one really told you that. You just assumed. Yes. Anyway, I'm just I'm oh yeah. It's just another side to God's sovereignty, you know, as we talked about last week. Oh, yes. Like God being in charge. Like he like when he when he says, Here's a thing, and he assigns it one of his angels, hey, go get Anthony Moore to do this. Yes, he's our guy. When that angel shows up to whether you see the angel or not, if you do, that's awesome. If you don't, it's still awesome. Yeah, uh, but it says, Hey, no, Anthony's our guy. You you need to be ready to say, Oh, yeah, that's right. Uh, I am, and I'm ready to go.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So, yeah. Yeah, that's that's interesting. You know, uh, I think for me personally, uh there's some times in life where you feel this is gonna be it's a little bit vague, but yet at the same time, feels very solid. I feel like in the last gosh, the last three or four weeks or so, I feel like you know, me personally and also us as a house, like us as King's Church, we are moving forward. And yet I don't have any specifics about why I feel that way. Gotcha. Right. Yeah, like yeah, there are just some moments, you know. I think it's really it comes down to just moments with the Lord and seeing our people respond in you know, specific ways. Yeah, I go, maybe it's like they're just moving forward. Maybe it's we're changing a little bit as a people. Maybe it's I don't know, there's just some signs that sometimes you run into that like and they are kind of just signs, right? Like hints uh and whispers, sort of that you're picking up on. And yeah, I just have had that sense a little bit about that it feels like we're moving forward. It feels like things are shifting a little bit as a people, but it's in a good way, it's like towards to in response to and towards the Lord, and so I I felt I felt that um a month a bunch of times in the last few weeks, and so I just I kind of just for me, it's like it's a little vague, but it's it feels very uh very solid in in a lot of ways. Yeah, but yeah, anyway, um I just I think today what I'd like to do, Dan, uh is uh I'd like to just there's a there's a as I was sort of like chewing on what we would talk about this morning, I was thinking about sort of just laying there really one night thinking with the Lord and just just the the the phrase or just the concept or the reality, let's whatever you want to the label of the presence of God, uh just kind of just started to you know float through my mind. And I thought I thought, you know, one of my absolute favorite portions of scripture in the Old Testament is Exodus 33. And I and I'm just gonna just read it or start reading it and see where we go from here. But sounds great. This is uh this is probably it is I don't know, it's like it is up there, it's like in my top, probably top five scripture verses in the old testament. That that might seem a little uh presumptuous. I'm just saying that, but it's for sure top ten. Let's call it that. It might be top five, probably top ten. Um yeah, so I just um this this I'm just from Exodus 33, um, chapter uh sorry, chapter 33, verse 12, where Moses and the Lord are having this conversation. As they do, as they do, and as they have as one does as one does face in the face with God. Yeah, I'm just gonna read it and then go from there. Uh so Moses said to the Lord, see, you say to me, Bring up this people, but you have not let me know whom you will send with me. Yet you have said, I have I know you by name, and I have found favor, you have found favor in my sight. Now therefore, if I have favor found favor in your sight, show me your ways that I might know you in order to find favor in your sight. Consider too that this nation is your people. And the Lord says, My presence will go with you, and I will give you rest. And he says, and he said to him, This is Moses saying, If your presence will not go with me, do not bring us up from here. For how shall it be known if I have found favor in your sight and I, your people? I and your people, is it not your going with us, so that we are distinct, I and your people, from every other people on the face of the earth? And the Lord said to Moses, This very thing that I have uh This very thing that you have spoken, I will do. For you have found favor in my sight, and I know you by name. And then Moses said, Please show me your glory. And then he said, I will make my goodness pass before you, and will proclaim before you my name, the Lord, and I will be gracious to whom I am gracious, and I will show mercy on whom I will show mercy. Um and then it goes on from there. This is a wild encounter, and my I think the first thing I just want to say is like, I think that's so moving to me because it's just a you know, it's an honest conversation about something that Moses recognizes is the desire of Moses to like not go anywhere without the Lord. Right. Right. And then it's the Lord's response. I'm gonna honor like this is what I this is the thing I wanted to like of all the things that I could have answered for you. This it seems as though to me, yeah, that the Lord is saying, This is the one thing that I wanted to answer, like of my top few things I wanted to answer for.
SPEAKER_02:The flow of that conversation, yeah. Very intriguing.
SPEAKER_03:But it's just that simply, simply is like, please do not send me up out of here unless you go with me. Right. And I know that we've I think we had that like again back to where we are as a house, and just um we prayed into that at the beginning of the season, the fall season, with the launch of ministries, and say, we don't want to, we don't want to go anywhere without you. So don't send us up here without you. And I know the reality is a little different with the with the new covenant, the advent of like the sending of the Holy Spirit, where the Holy Spirit resides, you know. Yeah, you know, Father, Son, Holy Spirit live within us, right? And um it's a little different, but I think the heart is the same, right? Right. And so just this notion of like being with the Lord and the presence of the Lord and hunger for the presence of God, I just thought, would it be great to just again because I don't know if we necessarily talk about maybe some times with the Lord, times in the presence of the Lord. This is the thing um that I feel like it it is at its core the thing that differentiates us from as believers from anybody else. It isn't a right, it isn't uh an ideology that we subscribe to. It isn't as ultimately it isn't a set of beliefs, it's actually the indwelling presence of someone that makes us different. Right. And so I just thought, oh, let's just crack that, crack that open and see how that let me know how that how's that hit you, Dan? Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Oh man, there's so many layers to this. And and I I think where I would where I would jump in is that um that God does the the way I like to think of it is this way, it's a subtle difference, but a person can say, God convinced my heart of this. Yeah, or a person could say, God persuaded my heart of this. I like the word personally, it's just a small difference. I like the word persuade. Right. God is very persuasive. Yeah. And when I read that account with Moses, I believe God is honoring the way he has created all humanity. Yes. And in this case, specifically Moses. And he's interacting with his creation, right? And he's not domineering and controlling Moses. Yes. Um, he's not saying to Moses, I know you'd be satisfied if I sent my angel ahead of you, but I am gonna go with you whether you like it or not, Moses. Like he it's not a controlling, domineering way, it's a persuasive way. And I think it's good for us to recognize in that conversation with Moses, God is persuasive with us. He's not the enemy is tends to be more domineering and manipulative of us. God is persuasive with us, so he moves oftentimes in at the pace of our willingness and our initiative. Yes, not because he couldn't just do it, but he's honoring the relationship. Like, yeah, he he wanted he wanted to have this intimate partnership with Moses, but that wasn't gonna happen if he just if he just domineered it into being.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, and I think that that's a that's at least a at least a great word for the moment, but I've I found the I find that sometimes I put that on God, the domineering part. Yeah, right. And it's sort of this, and I have in the past, but in experience, like in a lived experience, and again, you can sort of read that sometimes into some of that, you know, some of the the prophets, right? Isaiah, Jeremiah, God's sort of grief and his anger about the the way that the people of Israel are acting, right? Like our behavior, yeah, or whatever, yeah. And again, like we I have to remind myself, look, okay, so number one, I have to remind myself that God is love and he's always only ever going to operate out of love. Right. And also in my experience, when God has shown up, again, basically, I we say that he's literally always but but when he has revealed himself and he has spoken to me, spoken to my heart, it's always loving. Right. Right. And so I think that's a really interesting, just wanted to throw that out there because I can put that domineering uh belief on God. God's going to God, God's going to force his way into, you know, force his way. And so here we go. You know, God speaks and then I, you know, we don't get a choice in the matter, kind of deal. Right. But it's not, it's almost like we almost put that bully sort of, you know, caricature on God when that's in when frankly, he's operating quite in the opposite, right?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Right. So in this conversation with Moses, you get this feeling as you read it that there was genuine negotiation going on. Right. There's genuine, like we don't know because Moses chose what he did, which is beautiful. Yeah, we don't know what might have been prolonged or held up or whatever. If Moses would have said, Thank you for sending your angel ahead of us. Yeah, that's wonderful. Right. And just left it at this whatever, if I'm imagining a distance between him and God. Right. If he left it at that handshake distance, but Moses didn't. He pushed in and he kind of brought into the embrace. Like, no, you need to, we you need to come with us, or I'm we're literally not going. Yes. Like, like it's wonderful. God goes, well, in that case, yeah, I'm going with you. Like it's uh this is this beautiful. Um, and I yet uh you originally asked what sets us apart. Yeah, yeah. Like like people who you know are followers of Jesus do recognize uh that we've made this journey from this isn't about just embracing Jesus ideas or even saying, Yes, Jesus is the Messiah, he is, you know, he is Son of God, he is the savior of the world. If there's no following and actually, you know, inviting him to come with us in the everyday and every moment, surrendering to him in that way, we never really discover the heart of what this is about. Like it isn't enough to believe. We have to follow. Um, and I guess it just it just kind of unfolds there that if I'm following, that means he's with me. Like, yeah, there has to be a relationship.
SPEAKER_03:100%, you know. Then I think the the Lord's invitation, I think that's the thing is like what you can read into that conversation that Moses had. There's like there's a few things that you know uh that sort of pop up there, but one is just you know, Moses it says of Moses that he talked with the Lord face to face as a friend, right? So basically, like I can it's important that I read through that. Like Moses is like, I don't want to, what do you mean? Like, I don't send me anywhere without you, right? Like, what do you like with us together? Yeah, we're we're like, I there's no one, you know, there was no one, there's no one I'd rather be with. Right. And I and I that thought uh is I think so pleasing to the heart of God. Like if you and I can go I don't want I can go through this day, but I don't want to go through this day with you or without you. Like I don't want to don't I don't want to be separated from you in this day. And the reality of that is here's here's a couple things, right? So the in Christ, the reality is is we're not actually going to go through this day without the Lord, right? Right. But at the same time, we can go through this day and not pay attention to him. Absolutely, right?
SPEAKER_02:And so I think this is so it's just so important, right?
SPEAKER_03:And so this is the this is what I want to just get to here. Uh is really the thing I think that brings pleasure to the Lord, and just that he loves to hear is his his kids saying, I want to, I want to go, I want to walk with you through this day. I want to walk through these seasons, these situations. I'm with you out. And again, I'm going to like, okay, so I'm like, all right, Lord, what what do you, you know, here we go through this day, here we go through this situation, here we go through this season. It's like I'm I'm going to be paying attention to you and where you are and what you're doing in this situation because I want to go through this day, you know, good, bad, or indifferent. Like, like if it's a neutral day, great. Yeah, it's going to be really good because I'm I'm I'm paying attention. I've postured my heart to to acknowledge you throughout this day. And so, and I think that's the again, that's like the to me, that's the sort of the new covenant sort of way to again, and it's really like not to say that I'm like far from perfect on this, because I do find myself, you know, uh not doing that the very thing.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, like this, yeah, the the reality of this uh, you know, in our lives is growth. It's it's it's yes, you know, uh, you can't learn unless you make mistakes, you know, like good and bad days. This lesson becomes more and more real to you. Like I'm keeping my eyes on you, God. Yeah. And then we realize in a moment we blunder and uh make a mess of things, and we realize on the other side of it, I wasn't really paying attention to God there. Like I and there's no condemning in that, but but it is learned over, so yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_03:And I think I I I love the I love the core of where you're going with it. And really, and really I think I say that, and here's how this has sort of manifest itself in my life is that I will find myself in random situations, and for whatever reason, I think it's just a rhythm, is like I will just like take a few minutes and go, God, I just thank you that you're with me right now. And I'm and I just whether or not if I'm able to just close my eyes or just shift my heart posture and just like God, the best part of right now is that you're with me. Oh man. And to me, I just I think the more and more that I can do that, the more and more it just goes, it settles my heart, you know, it settles, it settles me down. Yeah, I love this. It uh, you know, it just brings a level of peace. Yeah, and it and I think what it does is that it also it brings uh so quote unquote, I think it brings God into the mundane, it brings God into the like I'm sitting at my desk, I'm trying to get some work done, right? Or I'm driving in the car on my way from you know this place to that place. It brings God into those mundane spaces, and it isn't always this is what I love about it, because we can always turn to God when things go bad, you know, it's often like the knee jerk, and that's not wrong, but if I only if I go through life, how sad would it be if I if I go through life and I only bring God into the bad places of my life, like when things aren't going right when everything's going well, I've got it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, right, I'm and I'm I'm good.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, yeah, and so I think for me it's like it's it's that connection of like, yeah, don't don't send me, don't send me into this day. Like I have I have no desire to go through this day and not do this day with you without you. Yeah, like I I just wanna I want to live every moment and grow in living every moment with you, with me. And just man, not necessarily for what you we'll get to what God can do through you in a second, but at the very core, I really believe this is what God is about. He's about the connection, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Right, you know, it's it's it's really intriguing to me how Moses probably thought in that moment he was influencing God when he said, Don't send us out without as if God, what you're not you can't do it that way, yeah. And given comparing it to my experience and my friends' experiences, it was changing Moses, not God. Right. Like Moses was changed by the very words coming out of his own mouth. Yes, like hold it, yeah, don't send us out unless you come with us. Well, God didn't change God's mind or God's heart. No, no, but Moses was changed by his own words coming out of his own mouth, his heart was changed by that. Um, I wanted to just jump back because I loved what you highlighted, and I guess the phrase that comes to mind is I need the my best days, my most productive days are days when I'm mindful of the God who's always with me. Like his presence is available. My the best days for me are days when I remain mindful of his presence with me. I pay attention to that and I'm welcoming to it. Um and I thought it would be just helpful maybe to be just a little bit vulnerable about that. That can tend to look a couple different ways to me. Right. Um it it can tend to look like I'll be in the middle of a day and I'm in a situation that's troubling or challenging. And here's the way the awareness can happen for me. I can become aware in that moment that I really need to be connected with God. I need to be aware of God. And what's standing in the way is unconfessed sin. I've been careless in the last 48 hours, perhaps. Right. I've been nonchalant, I've maybe ventured into some thought life that is inappropriate. I've you know, who knows? Like there's in some ways I've just been careless and kind of foolish with my freedom. Right. And I'm aware, uh-oh. Like I need to be have a clear channel with God, but I'm getting tripped up by the fact that I'm I feel guilty and there's some condemnation here. Right. And I I haven't so I haven't surrendered this to God. Yes. And I'm like, oh, you know, it might include texting Anthony, it might, you know, because that's a habit of my life. Hey, tell a brother. And then it's me talking to God and saying, Thank you for your forgiveness. I washed my, I put released that to at your blood, Jesus, at the cross. I let it go, I receive from you freedom. And that's my track back on track with God. Yes. Or it couldn't go the other way. It can be, wow, am I ever grateful that the last 48 hours I've actually been cultivating a relationship with God when it didn't seem important. Right. And then the situation comes up. This is the other scenario. Situation comes up, I'm saying, I am so grateful I stayed mindful of God when it didn't seem important. Yes. Because I really need right here to know. Because I'm very similar to you. When a challenging situation comes, God is our shepherd has trained me, trained us that when challenging situations come up, we don't assume hopelessness, we assume God's got something going on here I don't see yet. Yes. And if I stay present to him, a solution's gonna open up.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:That is that that's the beauty of a Moses-like journey with God. Because that's kind of the way I see Moses. He because he wanted to know God's ways, because he found favor, God liked him. He liked God, they were friends, you know, like they've talked face to face. Because of that, Moses had this unique style of life where impossible was never the end of like anything seeming impossible was not the end of something. It was well, God, what are we doing here? Like, what are you up to? Like, how are what's your what's your so you he runs this crazy scenario down the road where his assistant Joshua is down in the valley fighting the enemy, right? And the promise is as long as the sun is yeah, you know, uh as long as as long as you hold the rod of the Lord up in the air, Moses, the sun is gonna stand still so Joshua can finish the battle. Yeah, and Moses is like, Cool, okay, I'm gonna sit here on this rock, yeah, I'm gonna hold this up in the air, absolutely. Even have his other buddies hold his arms up so they can well who would okay, yes, like why Moses, other than God saying, do this, Moses. Yeah, yeah, whatever you do, keep holding the rod of the Lord up in the air, whatever that takes.
SPEAKER_03:Even if you have to bring Aaron and Aaron and her along to hold your arms up there, just God's gotta love that.
SPEAKER_02:Like, look at my dude. Yeah, like seriously, look at him. He's he's so in he's so committed to this that he's got his buddies holding his bracing his arms up in the air.
SPEAKER_03:And when you think of this, the funny thing is that like that that you can sort of brush over that fact, but you think of the cosmic sort of implications of that, like the rotation, the rotation of the earth pauses or slows down or something like that. Yeah, it's a good thing God's in charge, hey Anthony. Good thing God's in charge. Yeah, and I think one of the things that's uh that's it's good that you mentioned that because there's actually another thing that I want to read um from a because it talks about like you what did you say about the the impossible? Like the the impossible, the impossible doesn't seem to it's not the end of the conversation for uh and so like that right there, and in light of uh In light of the presence of God, like the indwelling presence of God within each believer. There's this quote that's that gripped me a number of years ago. I thought I would just, I ran and got the book this morning. And it's by uh it's by a book. Um, it's a supernatural ways of royalty. It's by Chris Fallaton and Bill Johnson and just says this. If we can't do any more than mere men, then let us not tell others that we are part of the church of the living God. We have to accomplish more than the Elks Club or the Lions Club or whatever club you want, whatever social club. If we are going to call our dad, it's simply that. Like we got to accomplish more than the elk club if we are going to call God our dad. This requires us to live by faith in God's provision. And I just I thought like I thought it's like that. That is the the challenge and the invitation and the reality of what I believe is uh a significant fight, at least in our day, and maybe this is the fight of the church for like what it is to mean uh that what it what it what are the implications of the indwelling presence of God? And you know, I think that's to me, it's like there is a there is something about the indwelling presence of God and what he wants to do while he's in there, right? Yeah, what he wants to do through you where where the impossible isn't the end of the conversation. Yeah. So the opening one liner there was about if we are if we're not willing to be more than mere men, how if we can't do any more than mere men, then let us not tell others we're part of the church of the living God. Just that's so good. Boom. That's so good.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, because Moses would have been a guy who accepted the invitation. Hey, 80-year-old Moses, yeah. I got something for you. I got something for you. Would you how would you like to go back to Egypt and make an appointment with Pharaoh and be and show up as more than a mere man? Yeah. If you're up for that, yeah, I'm inviting you into that.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like wild. Imagine that as an 80-year-old dude, right? Like, but that's beautiful. Like, mere the because that that that's probably taken from a New Testament verse there where it says, you're acting like mere men. Right. Like it's like Paul, I think Paul wrote that. Like something like, you know, if you do this, then you're acting like mere men, almost as if he was incredulous about it. Like, yeah, what? You're you're a follower of Jesus. Why are you acting like a mere human?
SPEAKER_03:Right. Like you Right. And I think I think it's like if I go, oh, just taking that, taking that statement as a just like this, this sort of like this punch in the you know, punch to the gut or whatever, it's like it's convicting, it's challenging, but also I I believe it's true. Yeah, and I can say that because I've I've I've tasted of that, right? Right. And I think, you know, the way that you and I, the the you and I, the things that we're passionate about, right? Like the I was I was recounting, you know, with my friend Kirk, um was on our team, and just simply we're talking about healing, you know, and a little bit about why you know God heals and sometimes and doesn't seem to, a little bit in this equation. Yeah. And I say and I I won't again, I won't slide off into a little bit of that conversation where you could go. Yeah, I will say this, and I was recounting to him that you know, over the last, let's say, over the last 12 years or so, as as I've really given myself to believing that God heals and that God intervenes in situations, we have seen over and over, I have seen personally a couple, a couple of deaf ears open. Yeah. And I have seen countless times where pain uh has gone. Right. Uh I have seen uh headaches lift, we have seen babies conceived, right? And in very joint frequent joint pain, mobility issues. We have seen these kinds, we've seen miraculous provision. We have seen, like over and over and over, though it has not been 100% of the time, right? Over and over and over over the last decade or so, God move it. And we you've seen again, you've seen it specifically, like you see the power of what happens when lies get exposed, you know. Yeah, like inner healing freedom, pain, the transformation that comes from lies getting exposed. Like again, it's not just about the physical, it is about the emotional and the spiritual as well.
SPEAKER_02:Like in the Yeah, and specifically, just for everybody's benefit, the the joy of seeing the facts of people's memories not change, right? But the pain is gone. Right. Like the beauty of seeing somebody who is in pain over a memory in the middle of a prayer session, and 10 minutes later, yeah, they can remember those facts and the pain is gone. The pain is gone.
SPEAKER_03:And it's and it's healing to me, right? So, okay, so that all those things, right? Impossible. Right. Yeah. I couldn't talk to them to that. You can't pay them enough money. You can't pay them enough money. Again, like we just we would like to assume that hey, just write me a check for a million dollars and I'll be pain-free. No, that's not how it works, right? Yeah, right. So you can't, or uh, or uh have somebody who's caught in just explain it. Or caught in a lifestyle of addiction. Here's here's another million dollars to change your life. You want to believe in Addict's not he's not gonna change his life. Yeah, it's actually going to make his life worse if you give him a million dollars.
SPEAKER_02:In one of Satan's or his demon's favorite line, Anthony, all you gotta do is and give you the you know, give you the three easy steps. All you gotta do is it's like, no, that's not gonna fix impossible.
SPEAKER_03:So so that's the thing, right? That's the thing. And I think I lose sight of this and I undersell 100% in my own mind like what it is that actually happens. I think in the macro, there is some enjoyment in them in the in the moment, right? Again, like we've left, I've left ministry moments being blown completely blown away at how good God is and what how he speaks to people. Right. But uh in the macro, I can just sort of just leave that in the rear view mirror without fully grasping the gravity of what it is that we're doing here. Right. Right. If God hadn't been there, like yeah, exactly. Like those things, those things right there, like body, soul, and spirit, all those things, all those transformations that we've seen. Yeah, complete let's just acknowledge the fact that they're completely impossible. Right. Yeah, right, yeah. And and there's and there's no there's no like there's no good reason why they would have changed in the moment other than God stepped in and did something, right? He spoke, he touched a person, he he ministered to them, he breathed his breath, the the breath of life over them, whatever, however you want to put it, God intervened in that moment. And and this is the thing, right? Like this is the thing I think that I what I there's a I just want to get to something here. If if I as a person see someone else doing that, or at least I'm I'm I'm watching YouTube and these people are are doing this, doing the stuff, right? Let's call let's call it the stuff, the supernatural stuff, the impossible stuff. If I leave it at that and I can go, oh, that's this is where some of this unbelief can creep in. It's like that's for those guys. Right. That's amazing. What's happening over there? Or yeah, or even some suspicious stuff. They're just faking that or fabricating that. Right. And if I never let my own heart engage in what's possible, right, um, then I can just leave we can leave that at there. And I will never step into the impossible that God wants to do through me. Oh man. Right. And so really it's like, it's like, you know, uh, especially in the area of like healing and physical healing, it's easy for someone to go, well, that's just for them. Are they even is it even real? Are they just like they're just faking it or whatever? It's just this, I can just leave it between an us and them. It's like I can create that separation. But I but I'm here to personally testify that God heals, right? That he God moves, that he touches people, he really ministers to people in the moment, right? Right, plenty of times. And that it's enough to keep me, you know, it keep me going. Like I've seen enough to keep me going after inviting, like at least stepping into situations that are that are legit impossible. Like if I, you know, if someone comes to me in pain and you know, I have to at least, you know, uh the worst that can happen, I guess, is that they they leave in pain. They come in pain. The worst that can happen is that they leave in pain. But the best thing that can happen is that God intervenes in that moment through me, through the prayer that we agree together over, right? Then that's like utterly amazing. Yes, it's utterly amazing. Yeah, and also just to you know circle back to the the conversation, it is like that thing is impossible, right? Like I can't, you know, in in human sort of you know, fleshly Anthony, can't fix a thing, right? I might be able to give someone a hug, give them an encouraging word, pat them on the back, send them on their way, right? But it is God through me, which is how he designed it. Yeah, God threw me that suddenly he breaks in, he breaks through into a specific situation and then turns the impossible into the possible. Yeah. Right. And I just think that that's like and you feel free to interrupt. Feel free to interrupt me.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I just wish everybody could be sitting around this table with us because there is a atmosphere to this conversation that may not, or may, I don't know, may not come through the air, you know, through listening to the podcast. But the reality of God's presence with us always, regardless of our track record, regardless of does every person that I pray for for healing get healed miraculously in the moment? Yeah. Not so far.
SPEAKER_03:Nope.
SPEAKER_02:Not so far. I'm not there. No. Um that would be awesome. I would love that. Me too. It's not disqualifying either, right? Exactly. And that's that's the um that's the amazing joy of this thing, is that the joy of God's living presence is with us, and that I can I can grow in my ability to be aware of that. Yes. Like I it's it's not um that I ever really arrive. I I hope that I keep developing forever my in my ability to be aware of this great God that is with us, yeah, and all the things he could do, far more than you and I could ever even come up with. Here's a new thing, God. Yeah, could would you be interested in doing this thing? Like, there's far more that he can do. There is far more, yeah. And he's but he loves me and I can love him through that whole process in my immaturity, like in those places where which you can't miss that in the story in the story of Moses either. Like Moses continued to mature in the Lord. Yes, and anyway, that's a whole other subject. But yeah, but the beauty of God's involvement, even when things go a little rough, even when I get it wrong, yeah, I don't I I can't really say, okay, where was God? Yeah, like it has a lot more to do with I'm growing in my sensitivity to how did he want to do it. Right. Um, and and there's other people involved. Like if I've if I'm dealing with one or five other people in a situation, yeah, they're the way they're responding and all of that has an effect too. Yeah. Like because God's, as a friend of ours likes to say, God enters through the door of our yes.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Like they may really have a heart that's stubborn against God. Well, probably that if they're involved in helping me do a thing, they could really limit the effectiveness of the situation. And I have to be gracious toward that. Yep. Like, I don't hate them because of that, but I recognize they weren't ready to sort of embrace the impossibility the way I am. Speaking of like a freedom press session, if someone comes and they're at a place where they're not ready to listen to God, yeah, well, and in it, I'll do it in a nice way, but we're gonna end the session because if if God is saying a thing to them and they're like, I'm not ready to do that, or I'm not hearing God anymore. Yeah, and I know that it's because they've said no to the thing he was leading them into, and they're like, No, I'm not gonna do that today. I will graciously say, No problem, we could get back together again next week.
SPEAKER_03:And there's no sh there's no shame, there's no shame in that.
SPEAKER_02:Right. That's right. Yeah, and and so God could have done a thing in their life, but today wasn't the day. Not because it's October or whatever, but it's because in the moment they're not ready.
SPEAKER_03:And the next moment, and the moment they are ready, God will do it. That's the right thing. Because He isn't He isn't playing games like we do. Right.
SPEAKER_02:That's the Kairos moment again. Like Absolutely, like what when when He knows His will and my readiness come together in a moment, that's a good moment for Him. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And for me. That's it, that's so good. And I I one of the things I wanted to mention was like, it's like we we we brush over or lose sight of. Uh, you know, we we say this and we don't grasp the full expression of its meaning. It's like the Lord's Prayer, you know, Luke 11, it's like, our Father who art in heaven, hallowed be your name, thy kingdom come. We're praying this. God, let your God, kingdom of kingdom of God come, like will of God be done on earth as it is in heaven. Yeah, and and um and and I immediately correlate that to, you know, First Corinthians 4 20, the kingdom of God is not a matter of talk, it's a matter of power. Meaning, right? So there's so how does how does God want to break into a situation? He isn't like there are lots of things that we can do, and they're not evil, there's like we we exist in this world, you know, we're gonna build stuff, right? We're gonna make things, we're gonna, you know, try our best. But the reality of is that the how is the kingdom of God going to come and advance and move on the earth? Well, let's let's think about what the kingdom of God is. The kingdom of God is a matter of power, it isn't a matter of I like talk. And I think I go, well, what's talk? I mean it's ideas, uh, you know, it's like philosophy or whatever, or just or things to subscription, uh, you know, subscribe beliefs, like a list of things, a list of does it. Winning or losing an argument, right? It's yeah to think to think it about it in that term is incorrect. Yeah, right. We have to think like again, you can't in a lot of and again, this is a true statement, like you can't separate the king from the kingdom, right? Right, because he is moving, he is advancing, right? In that, in that way, his dominion is advancing. And so that's going to happen as a matter of power. Like that's he's like there is the the power of God. When God advances, it's by his power, it's by grace, the operational power of God. Yeah, it's going to come by his power. And so, so how is that gonna happen? Well, it's going to happen by his people going, Your kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Yes. And it's they're not necessarily going, they're gonna, they're going to, let's call it in essence, pray that prayer. Right. Again, yeah. So when I, so when you, you know, or you're dealing a with a you know, in a in a situation with freedom prayer or in a ministry situation, or there's a sick person, or there's a um, you know, there's a uh uh other some some other type of need. And I'm addressing that need, and I'm saying, God, come and have your way. What I am praying is thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Yes, yeah. Right. So that in in in essence and in in principle, that's that's probably the better way to say that. I love it. In principle, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, as I'm praying for this person. If we have a person with a you know, a need, some any kind of need that is unmet, is powerful. And we we know this objectively because we know, okay, so in heaven, there is no lack. In heaven, there is no illness, no disease, there's no death, there's no whatever. It's it's perfection. And we as God's people, because he lives within within us, have this massive invitation over us to live in this world and operate in every situation with the heart of that the kingdom of God wants to advance. Yeah, yeah. He wants to, he wants to move, he wants to increase his kingdom on the earth. And I'm sorry if I bumped the mic because I'm waving my arms around like a madman. But he wants to, he wants to advance. Yes, and so it is in this, in this vein, it is in this vein of like, he wants to do that through us, yeah. And he's going to do it through us, yeah. Right. And so that's the part, that's the part that we lose sight of. The presence of God. And I and oh, this is a good, this is very important to to uh bring up. It's not that, you know, again, talk just to kind of like put a like maybe start to land the plane a little bit on this conversation and just highlight the presence of God for connection, and then the presence of God for uh for the advancement of the kingdom, right? The the the impossible stuff. Yeah. It's not that, and I guess I want to just maybe just circle back a little bit, like what God will or won't do through you isn't even the main focus necessarily, right? It's not, but it's not evil either, right? It is like when we say uh we love God and that we want connection with Him, to me, that's the first, that's the greatest. It's it's right in the vein of love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind. Exactly what I was thinking. And so, and so it's that word all is amazing. Yes, all like all of it. Like this is the first, and then there's the there's the commission that comes after that. Like raise the dead, heal the sick, cast out demons, cleanse the lepers. It's really like go and make disciples, yeah. Teach them about me, not just do's and don'ts, but to live and act like me. Uh so so really it's not that they're actually like two legs, right? With with the it's rightly ordered as well, because it begins with the connection. Because you can't you can't do without being first, right? You can't so anyway, I'm just like but I think I think it's I think it's important that it's like let's not get the stuff out of order. Yeah. Right?
SPEAKER_02:Right. So as I'm listening to you, there's this prayer that that I find myself just saying within me, God, help me to pay attention to what you're paying attention to. Yes, like it's the assumption that whoever I'm interacting with, whatever situation I'm interacting with, God is aware and he's paying attention. Yeah. And there's a special dynamic to that situation he's paying attention to. Here's the need. It's the assumption that I carry that God actually is paying attention to what needs to happen to make this better. Yeah. Like what are you paying attention to, God, that will release healing or provision or whatever it is. Yes. God help me to pay attention to what you're paying attention to. Yeah, absolutely. Because my best idea of what God should do in a situation may not be what he's paying attention to. Totally. I could be paying attention to something that he's not. Yeah. Like I'm rushing to want to see this person be physically healed today. What he's paying attention to is there's pain in their heart and mind that's actually causing their physical illness.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And he wants to heal that pain in their heart and mind. And suddenly they don't, they're not physically ill anymore. Yeah. I could spend all day praying for physical healing, right? And they could walk away bitter and angry.
SPEAKER_03:I have seen that, like, I think we're starting to see more and more of that. I think our friend Amy Howard has helped us see that a little bit, is that there's there's often correlations to, and I find myself uh asking uh a lot of questions of like, oh, hey, I've been dealing with this thing in my body. It just happened this past weekend where it was like I'm dealing with this thing, it's been a while around for a while, and then all of a sudden, instead of like immediately just starting to pray for that thing, I'm asking questions. Okay, so what was happening in your life? Right, when that thing, yeah, and then it became, oh, hey, there was this traumatic event that happened in my life. My soul. Yeah, right. And so yeah, so I think even if nothing happened, I'm not nothing happens, but even if that person isn't completely delivered and healed in that moment, at least they've they've begun to so change the conversation so that they can go after the root of the issue, right? Which I thought I think is super fascinating. Yeah, it it is. Yeah, and so we've seen God like just in a moment do it and then you know, start the person on the journey of healing, even based on simply asking that question of like, okay, so maybe there's something else at the root here, yeah, rather than of this physical issue, rather than just the issue itself. Right, right. Yeah, and I think this is the this is the journey that the Lord has us on, and I think it's the journey for every believer. And so maybe um man, that's good. Yeah, maybe just as we sort of land the plane here, would you would you pray? I feel like we should pray in this way, that pray for for people to come awake for an awakening in people's hearts of how present God is. That He's and just grace to do every day with the Lord. Yeah, like just to begin there, just to begin there, yeah, like no pressure to you know, to do anything else, but just to like in the in the quiet moments, in the random moments, in the good moments, not just the bad ones, be awake to the indwelling presence of God.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love it. Yeah, definitely we'll be glad to do that. Oh God, so we do come today and we say, Let your kingdom come, let your will be done on earth as it is in heaven, uh, in our lives, but also in the lives of everyone listening. God, we pray uh we agree together. I love that invitation, Lord. Would you awaken all of us, God? Yes, um, to the closeness of your presence, the reality of your presence in every in every situation throughout our day. Um God, would you bring awakening to all of our lives uh and just as we become aware of what you're paying attention to, would you train our hearts to pay attention to that? Like that we would look for what you are paying attention to today and partner with you in that way. Um and God, we we do pray along with Moses, like don't send us into this day without your presence going with us. And um give us the wisdom and the and the uh the grace to uh to trust you in those moments.
SPEAKER_03:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:And uh we look forward to to seeing you move because uh because uh because we're learning to pay attention to you. So God, thank you for the story that you're writing in your church. God, we just say more of it. Uh, we pray that more and more your kingdom would be known on earth as it is in heaven. Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Well, that's a wrap on this episode. It's been a privilege to have you as an honored guest as we all learn to hear God better.
SPEAKER_03:If your time with us has been encouraging and you think this conversation will be helpful to others, we would love it if you could share this podcast with the people around you. Until next time.
