Why The Muppet Show Still Works | Original Geek | S1E23

For Original Geeks, The Muppet Show wasn’t just a kids’ program—it was controlled chaos, smart failure, and comedy that trusted the audience.

In this episode, we dig into why the Muppets still matter 50+ years later, how Jim Henson deliberately built characters who failed on purpose, and why the show worked for adults and kids at the same time.

We talk Sesame Street roots, the original UK production, the Steve Martin guest spot that lives rent-free in our heads, and the ongoing debate:
Did Disney save the Muppets—or sand their edges off?

Along the way we hit Geek Flashback, Geek Court, Basement Treasures, and some hard truths about nostalgia, longevity, and why you shouldn’t ignore something just because it’s “old.”

If you ever watched The Muppet Show with your family—or still hum Mahna Mahna for no reason—this one’s for you.

Welcome to Original Geek—the podcast for anyone who rolled their first d20 on shag carpet, waited hours for a comic book JPEG to load on dial-up, and wore the label “geek” back when it got you mocked, not monetized.

Hosted by stand-up comic Steve Scarfo and Forever DM Jeff Shaw, we dive deep into what it meant to be a geek in the '70s and '80s—and how that underground culture became the mainstream multiverse we live in today.

🎙️ Subscribe for weekly episodes on Dungeons & Dragons, Star Wars, comic book chaos, geek court debates, and critical hits from your childhood basement.

👾 Follow us @OriginalGeekPodcast on socials and visit OriginalGeekPodcast.com for merch, extras, and to send us your own geeky tales.

 If you ever hid a Monster Manual like it was porn, you’re not alone. You’re an Original Geek. Welcome home.

Transcript

Steve Scarfo (00:00)
Don't go at the Muppets. Right? I don't need to watch that. know the Muppets.

Don't assume it's done just because it's 56 years old, right? Please don't assume that because I'm 56, I don't wanna be done. The true test of any property, of any character is how long will people stay interested?

I want an episode. Don't yuck it. Rats, bastards.

Jeff (00:15)
Don't yuck our yum, how dare you.

Steve Scarfo (00:40)
Welcome to Original Geek. This is the All-Fandom Podcast where we dig into sci-fi, fantasy, comics, and every pop culture obsession that built the multiverse we live in today. So whether you're Gen X millennial or just geek curious, welcome to the basement. Hi, I'm Steve Scarfo.

Jeff (00:54)
and I'm Jeff Shaw and we'll be your rainbow connection for today's lovers, dreamers, and you. What's our topic today, Steve?

Steve Scarfo (01:02)
love it. Well,

you know what they say, Jeff, it ain't easy being green. This is about the Muppets. ⁓ If you haven't caught on from the comment in the quotes, ⁓ then buckle up, because we're going. ⁓ So this is the classic, right? ⁓ I have all these prepared things that GPT held me right, and I don't even think I want to say them. I just want to say we grew up with the Muppets, the Muppets as they are. ⁓

Jeff (01:07)
This is true. Yes.

Yeah.

Steve Scarfo (01:31)
were around before us and we grew up with them in our lives between the, you know, Sesame Street characters and all this. So these were characters that were archetypes, ⁓ but they were ⁓ close to our hearts. Like they were fun to watch. You never knew what you were gonna get, but you always knew it was gonna be crazy and chaotic. So we wanna talk to you guys about the Muppets. And there's a very specific reason because on

February 4th. Yes. Yeah, there's no spoilers. It's February 1st right now. So if somehow we got it right, it was complete luck. we'll talk about that in a little more depth later on. But we wanted to kind of bring them up at the top and talk about them. And yeah.

Jeff (02:01)
After we record this, so we're not commenting on the February 4th episode.

Yes.

Yeah, so absolutely. We you know, we would have started with Sesame Street. So Sesame Street, you know, premiered when we were, you know, well, before I was born, I think the year you were born. Yeah. So we grew up alongside Sesame Street. was, you know, you know, Steve 69, me 70. So early days of Sesame Street, early our days.

Steve Scarfo (02:34)
The year I was born, it came out in 1969.

Jeff (02:49)
We grew up with Sesame Street and, you know.

Steve Scarfo (02:52)
You could say we

were teenagers when Kermit was a teenager.

Jeff (02:54)
Yeah, exactly. Well, no, that's that actually is not true. So Kermit came about in nineteen fifty five. ⁓ But then he was a lizard, not a frog. So the Kermit wasn't a frog until the 60s. So kind of kind of. Yeah. So ⁓ but hey, that's that's in our evolution. But but yeah. And then when The Muppet Show came out.

Steve Scarfo (02:58)
⁓ was waiting.

Okay.

Yeah, I tend to blow stuff.

Jeff (03:24)
And ⁓ man, was fantastic because I just remember watching it with the whole family because it was Sesame Street was obviously for kids, but the Muppet Show was for the whole family. had adult humor in it along with the kids and people got it. And I wondered if it was still relevant, would still work today for a kid. And my nephew, Hunter, who's six years old.

And if he's not six years old, sorry, Jess and Mike, we're getting your son's age wrong. ⁓ Who I believe is six years old. ⁓ We were watching it, was, in preparation, I'm like, you know what, I'm gonna play the first season while he's here. And he loved it, loved The Swedish Chef, he was entranced by The Muppet Show. And ⁓ then I also asked my mom, who was here at that same time, because there were some of those

Steve Scarfo (03:56)
Ha ha ha ha!

Jeff (04:22)
Guest hosts from that first season, had no idea who they were. Like, who is Joel Grey and Connie Stevens and Juliette Brous? I'm certain I did not know who they were when I was a kid.

Steve Scarfo (04:34)
Wait,

you know who they are now? ⁓ okay.

Jeff (04:38)
I know who they are now, like when I was

like, that's what I think, that's what I think like they didn't get, like their guest hosts were like making sure adults were watching this. Like, cause they weren't like children's celebrities. You know, this wasn't like Lee Majors. I'm not saying that Lee Majors didn't do one. by the way, for those who don't know who Lee Majors is, six million dollar man.

Steve Scarfo (04:54)
Right.

that first season. Yes, the six million dollar man. And if you don't know what the six million dollar man was, because that was this

late 70s early 80s show, we're just pulling back the gray on our geek Gen X geekness. so would you got to remember that? Sabrina Carpenter? They couldn't get Ronald Mc... No, let's hope not. He was always on that bench outside the restaurant. ⁓

Jeff (05:08)
Okay, okay.

All right, yeah, try to think of a kid star. could think of a kid star. Ronald McDonald, they couldn't get Ronald McDonald.

Steve Scarfo (05:28)
But you gotta remember the first season of this show, It was all, ⁓ and I'm sure you've looked this up because I have failed too, but I remembered always being on PBS, right? So not a lot of budget. Nope. See?

Jeff (05:40)
Nope. PBS

was Sesame Street.

Steve Scarfo (05:44)
sorry, yes. ⁓ Muppet Show was network, but it was still a first season. So I'm sure their budget for bringing people in was small. So they were going with those A minus B plus folks, I'm sure, or older. Because, I mean, let's face it, Joel Grey was great, but he was, I think, in 69 or whatever the actual, ⁓ that was Sesame Street when the Muppet Show started. ⁓

It would be like saying we got, ⁓ I can't even think of a good example. I was gonna say Harrison Ford, because he's old, but he's still too relevant. ⁓ But somebody who was like, was a star, ⁓ John Cusack is a good name, right? He was a guy big in the 80s and 90s who may not have a lot of heat on him. He might be cheaper to pick up for show today. You know what mean? So that could be why they had those stars that were like, adult, no.

Jeff (06:34)
Yeah. Well, and they did get ⁓

Florence Henderson. She was the mom from the Brady Bunch. that's kind of a, that one hits. But then Charles Asnavour. I'm like, mom, who's Charles Asnavour? And she didn't know.

Steve Scarfo (06:42)
That's right.

Isn't he

the guy that played the computer and chess? No, that's a different guy. That's what it sounds like.

Jeff (06:57)
He was a composer. ⁓ and so. But to that point, they recorded in ⁓ England because no studios just didn't get it, which I know we were touching a little bit about on the evolution, but we can just skip this part of the evolution. ⁓ It was Jim Henson had a hard time.

Steve Scarfo (07:17)
Hehehehe

Jeff (07:22)
And what's ironic about it is Jim Henson, these characters, he didn't want them in Sesame Street, because he didn't want Muppets being a just for kids. And Sesame Street was just for kids. But because the philosophy of that show, wanting to reach out, having, you know, showing diversity, you encouraging kids to read and learn, like the mission of Sesame Street was so strong.

that he wanted, he like, yeah, okay, we'll be a part of Sesame Street. But he didn't want his puppets, his muppets to be just for kids. So, and he hit that wall hard trying to get the Muppet Show sold. So it took Lord, ⁓ my God, I always, I always want to call him Lord Grey. I know. So it's Lord, it's Lord Lou Grade.

Steve Scarfo (08:10)
Yeah, that's a clue video game character that we play for the.

Jeff (08:19)
⁓ Yeah, so every time I heard it like Lord Grey, he believed in it and put millions of dollars, but he did say the Muppets had to be filmed in England. so that was part of the challenge too, is trying to get US stars, which blows my mind. they said, like they couldn't get people there for, because they couldn't afford to pay them at hardly anything to host.

Steve Scarfo (08:19)
I can see why you would say Lord Grey.

Jeff (08:48)
They'd be there for a week recording the Muppet Show and not making much money. But I'm like, but I got a trip to England? You're paying for me? Like, if I had been an actor in the 70s, like, yes, I'll take a free trip to England and act with puppets, Muppets.

Steve Scarfo (08:56)
Well, but this-

Right, but you gotta

remember in the 70s, because it was, ⁓ I'm looking at it now, in 76, the Muppet Show started. But in 76, the split between TV actors and movie actors was huge. We talked about it in previous podcasts, right? There were times when movie actors wouldn't touch TV because it would ruin their career, right? So it could have been that there was a sort of a stigma. A, it's a TV show. B, it's a kids show, because even though it wasn't, right?

Jeff (09:22)
yeah, that's true. That's true.

Yeah, yeah, 100%. Yep.

Steve Scarfo (09:31)
I'm sure there are people who are like, nah, it sounds fun, but I can't afford to downgrade myself to kids TV, to...

Jeff (09:38)
Yeah, it's hard

to put ourselves back in those shoes, even though we talked about it like last episode. It's true. It's true.

Steve Scarfo (09:41)
Yeah. But but like every

other TV show, because the Muppets went what's five years, six years to 81 for the original run. ⁓ And so I'm sure that's why in the later seasons, you start seeing bigger stars, because just like anything else, it's like, wait, that worked. People are getting people are getting heat off the off this. Holy crap. Now I want to do it. And that's why they. Yeah.

Jeff (09:55)
Yeah, yeah, 81.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, they went from struggling to having a

wait list. And people must have just not gone on because Jim Henson stopped it at five seasons. Not because it wasn't successful, but he wanted to end on a high note. And which I think was amazing for him being from the US, because I know in England they do that. And I know you talked about that on a previous episode. Like the original Office was, what, three seasons? Then we're done.

Steve Scarfo (10:12)
And that's

Three seasons,

Jeff (10:37)
And it wasn't because it wasn't successful. They just like, we did it, we're gonna hang on a high note. And so for Jim Henson, like, okay, I'm done. Five seasons of this incredibly successful show. So,

Steve Scarfo (10:49)
Right.

Jeff (10:59)
So as we were talking about, ⁓ like, just putting ourselves, you know, watching the Sesame Street, watching the Muppet Show with family, my flashback, a memory I have to this day, and I made sure to rewatch it, was when Steve Martin was in the second season, because my family, were huge Steve Martin fans, had the actual vinyl, played those vinyl records of his...

that he made ⁓ Wild and Crazy Guy and had the balloon with the arrow through his head and all that. I love that in the trailer for the new episode that's premiering on February 4th, the Kermit is walking down the hall with all the pictures of guest hosts and he stops and it's the Steve Martin guest host from The Muppet Show is the one you can see most clearly.

And it's I think it's you know that for me was you know for my flashback when I think of them up at show I always think of the Steve Martin episode and specifically and I rewatched this to see just why I remembered it so strongly was he was juggling oranges and he throws one to Fozzie and Fozzie throws it back and misses and Steve Martin goes to to get the orange and actually steps on it and freaks out that he's killed the orange and

Steve Scarfo (12:23)
Mm-hmm.

Jeff (12:23)
It's so ridiculous and I don't know why I still remember it because like, was like, that bit's gotta be just pure gold. I'm not saying it wasn't funny, it was funny, but like, I don't know why it stuck with me so much. Why that, I like, my God, that's so good. But yeah.

Steve Scarfo (12:42)
Yeah, that's

a, I mean, it's a time and place thing, right? Cause you were younger and at the time Steve Martin's wacky antics were at the height of his career then, right? ⁓ You didn't know him for what he can do today. I remember that same bit. ⁓ I don't remember the stepping on the orange. I remember him coming out with the arrow through the head. ⁓ So for me, the biggest flashback was always

⁓ I guess there's two, was gonna talk about it later, but Fozzie, ⁓ of course, as a standup, ⁓ resonates with me. ⁓ And his, I didn't get it at the time, but he was never supposed to be good. And you always rooted for him. But one of the things Henson wanted is he wanted characters who failed and never got better. Miss Piggy was never supposed to be a star. She always wanted to be a star, but the humor was in the attempt.

Right? Fozzy was never gonna be ⁓ an amazing standup comic, but he wanted to be a standup comic. And you know, even as a kid, cause as a kid, I loved watching ⁓ probably not PC to stay now, but like Bill Cosby was one of my favorites growing up. I think we've talked about it. I loved like the whole Noah bit for Bill Cosby, but like I watched and listened to standup from a very young age, long before I even thought about being a standup. ⁓

So watching Fawzi always hit me and I always felt so bad every time he would have a waka waka waka moment, I'd like, holy crap. But... ⁓

Jeff (14:21)
Yeah, but as

a kid, like I know what you mean, like, cause we're rewatching this and it's not like his jokes are so amazing, but as a kid, didn't you actually like his jokes? I did. Like I thought they were good.

Steve Scarfo (14:31)
I did, because they

were goofy silly kid jokes, but he would never get a good response. People were never laughing at him, but that was on purpose. And I didn't know that at the time. So you feel bad for him, because we're laughing, and it's by design, right? Jim Henson was a very smart guy. He knew what he was doing.

Jeff (14:36)
Yeah.

Well, yeah, because in and

actually the Steve Martin episode plays on that. So the Steve Martin episode, they their Kermit comes out and he's like, all right, we're not going to have the show today. Sorry, it was a mistake. We're doing auditions today. And so Steve Martin ends up auditioning and Fozzie Bear is wracked with anxiety that he's going to lose his being the stand up comic for the Muppet show with Steve Martin there. So, yeah.

Steve Scarfo (15:11)
Yeah.

That's awesome

Jeff (15:17)
So yeah, that's good. ⁓ and your point about Miss Piggy, that's one thing that struck me rewatching season one is that Miss Piggy didn't look the same and didn't sound the same because she wasn't meant to be a primary character. Initially, she was just kind of in the background as one of the dancers. ⁓ But there was a scene early on with one of the dancing.

scenes and her interactions with Kermit and they decided to keep going from there. And Frank Oz was only one of the voices for Miss Piggy and he hadn't landed on his real Miss Piggy voice that we know but there was a second puppeteer who was playing Miss Piggy because they didn't think it mattered. Because she was not supposed to be a primary character.

Steve Scarfo (16:04)
Right. Such a side character. Well, you know, one of the things I

did find in the limited amount of research I was able to do. they had many puppeteers who played multiple parts. And so I can see like a Frank Oz is doing a scene between Kermit and Miss Piggy, how that would be really rough for one puppeteer to do both voices in this scene. Right.

Jeff (16:18)
Yeah.

Wait, what did you say? that again.

Steve Scarfo (16:35)
Kermit the Frog and Miss Piggy.

Jeff (16:37)
Well, it's Jim Henson's Kermit, But if.

Steve Scarfo (16:40)
Yes, but

Jim Henson, you're saying he was not doing Miss Piggy. He hadn't landed on the voice, but... Oh, Frank, oh, sorry. I totally zipped right over my head. I was thinking you said Jim Henson. So for the wrong reasons, but the right point.

Jeff (16:45)
Frank Oz was Miss Piggy.

Steve Scarfo (16:56)
multiple people did the same, sorry, single people had to do multiple characters. So they had to split it out. ⁓ And so obviously then it wouldn't have been Jim Henson and Frank Oz because, ⁓ you know, my brain's not working.

Jeff (16:56)
Yeah.

Right, yeah.

You know, it's interesting that

you mentioned that too, because it seemed, know, Frank Oz eventually became well known as a director. And he kept providing the voices for like Miss Piggy, but he couldn't do the puppetry anymore, just at the time. And someone, ⁓ one of our Gen X friends was hanging out yesterday. We're all excited about the Muppet Show, but she was bemoaning the fact that they didn't sound the same.

and couldn't they have found someone who could imitate the voices better? And I realized like, but they want the puppeteers to do the voices. Like they had Frank Oz continue doing it until he retired from doing it entirely. But ⁓ you gotta get someone who sounds like Kermit, who also is a good puppeteer, that's probably not gonna be easy to do. So they probably, guess, you know.

So the voices are going to be different, I anticipate, on February 4th. I mean, you can see in the trailer, or hear in the trailer, but I think they're pretty good, pretty close.

Steve Scarfo (18:15)
was just

gonna say, I did watch the trailer for the new show. ⁓ I didn't realize they're doing a single show and that they're not sure if it's gonna be, I thought when I heard about it initially, I thought, they're bringing back the Muppet Show on Disney, great, because Disney has the power and the money to bring good stars and they actually have, Sabrina Carpenter's gonna be on this one and they're gonna have Maya Rudolph, it's gonna have a lot of great, Seth Rogen for Christ's sake. ⁓ So I thought, awesome, but it's one episode, so watch it.

Jeff (18:24)
Yeah.

Steve Scarfo (18:45)
Watch the one episode so Disney goes, holy crap, we should do more of these. ⁓

But now I forgot where I was heading. What was?

Jeff (18:51)
Well, the

voices and you thought that sounded pretty good with the trailer. Yeah

Steve Scarfo (18:54)
Oh, so sorry, I did

watch the trailer and I thought the voices were pretty good too. You know, admittedly it's been a while since I've watched the episode. I know you watched some in prep for this. I hadn't gotten that opportunity to, but the voices I heard in that trailer sounded at least enough like the characters I remember. But let's remember this too. The kids who are watching and not just the kids, I say kids, anybody under 40 at this point will qualify, but the people who are gonna sit and watch the Muppet Show.

Most of them don't have a lot of experience with the 70s and 80s TV shows and movies. Like they've seen them, but I think they sound enough like no one's gonna go, you know, it's not like Kermit goes, hey ho, Kermit the Frog. You know, it's a pretty good Kermit that they'd got. That wasn't my impression of Kermit for the record, but.

Jeff (19:40)
Right, exactly. We got that. But hey,

Disney's gonna crush it, it's gonna be great. Or will it? Maybe you should take me to court.

Steve Scarfo (19:50)
I don't know.

I'm taking you. Let's go.

All right, well, let's set the stage. So the Muppets, starting with ⁓ the other show that we'll talk about during evolution and then the Sesame Street characters all the way through to today had a pre and a post. And that pre and post is two of them. One was ⁓ Jim Henson passed away in 1990. And then in 2004, Disney acquired the Muppets property. So they collaborated with a lot of stuff, but

The question and the court for today is, is Disney's involvement a good thing? Has it made it better? ⁓ Did it help them survive or did it really cut the edge off? Did it make it safer and bubble wrapped?

So Jeff's gonna take the position that this was a good thing that Disney got involved. So why don't you start?

Jeff (20:51)
Yes.

All right, so, yeah, so Disney ⁓ getting the property of the Muppets was something that Jim Henson wanted. And he felt like if he wants his Muppets to continue and ⁓ past him, that who better to do that than Disney? They've got a proven track record of taking characters and making them last for all time.

So first bit of evidence is Jim Henson wanted Disney to own the Muppets. he also, ⁓ when it came to Disney, did not, because the premise here is that they made it too corporate, they made it too safe. And my counterpoint to that is when the very first movie,

that Disney released was the Muppets Wizard of Oz, which most people have never watched, including myself. ⁓ So you might think, did they make it too squeaky clean? No, there was a girls gone wild reference in that Wizard of Oz. it was, ⁓ and actually the issue was more that they were trying to push some boundaries. And like, when you're going to see

Steve Scarfo (22:02)
I didn't even know it existed.

Jeff (22:21)
we're gonna go see the Muppets family. Girls Gone Wild. Dad, what's Girls Gone Wild? So they didn't make it. Now, I think maybe that helps when later on they were trying to make some decisions as to just how grown up the joke should be. But fast forward to the trailer that we saw for the show coming out from Disney with Sabrina Carpenter.

Steve Scarfo (22:27)
You

Jeff (22:49)
And Kermit says, we've got to work out some kinks. And Sabrina Garber says, I like a good kink. So they did not make it so squeaky clean that it doesn't keep to what Jim Henson wanted to do. ⁓ So I think that it's not that Disney is perfectly handling the Muppets. But I would say that the idea that

they're making them too safe and not working for adults as well as kids, I say that is wrong. Go ahead.

Steve Scarfo (23:30)
Well, thanks for making my point before I made my point. But ⁓ so I can't deny that Disney's involvement with most stuff is positive, right? ⁓ For all the stuff we've been talking about, they have big budgets, they have a full studio, they have control. The problem, I think, is ⁓ in that transition time when they were not figuring out what the Muppets were.

Jeff (23:34)
Ha

Steve Scarfo (23:58)
Right? I did not know Henson wanted them to go to Disney and it sounds actually odd to me because the things I have read about it is he liked the Muppets as the, ⁓ basically they were a cast of fools and they were fools on display for a purpose, right? The humor was in their failings. The humor was in their shortcomings, in their ignorance and sometimes just in ineptitude, you know.

if Gonzo got a stunt right, we would be surprised because he never got a stunt right. And I don't think they've ruined that part of it, but I think what Disney does is they create, ⁓ to your point, these legendary characters that last forever. But that's a narrow window to live in. To live in a character that people wanna keep watching, but make it so that they keep failing, so that they keep being interesting enough to watch. And so I think when they first started,

I think you made part of my point, a Girls Gone Wild reference was probably them trying to figure out where is the line. The kink reference, a little more subtle because yes, it's still got a sexual bend to it, of course, especially with Sabrina Carpenter and her persona is very much the kinky girl. ⁓ She sexualizes herself a lot in her music and her advertisements. So for her to say it, it's obviously what they were.

pointing at and by the way, the part you didn't say was that, and I assume it's the right cut, but at least in the ad they do a cut to like one of the little rats going, hey. Like she goes, I like a little kinky and he goes, hello or whatever. It's like, it's hysterical. Cause this little tiny puppet pops up to say hi to her, which just kind of exacerbates the whole sexual overtone to it. But again, the muppets was never meant for just kids. It was meant to be like, I think of it like Shrek, the original Shrek.

I went to, we brought my nephew to go see Shrek when he was, I don't know, God, whenever Shrek came out 30 years ago, right? Yeah, six works. He was young and it was funny because I think it was one, was Thatcher and it was a bunch of guys. It was like my brother, my ⁓ brother-in-law, Jeff, I think Ryan Gartley came with us. Like we all went to go see Shrek and I laughed so hard because most of those jokes weren't for the kids, but they were.

Jeff (26:00)
Just say six.

Steve Scarfo (26:23)
They were subtler, like the whole thing with him questioning ⁓ Gingy, do you know the Muffin Man? The Muffin Man, like the whole them saying the lyrics to the song, ⁓ kids didn't understand that. I was crying. And I think that's where the Muppet Show used to be, right? It used to be, it's still, but I think they're, I think they screwed it up a little bit. Now are they redeeming themselves? We'll see. Hopefully this February 4th show is great. I'm gonna watch it anyway, cause I love the Muppets and I love Disney, but I'm afraid.

Jeff (26:39)
and still is.

Steve Scarfo (26:52)
that they are not going to hit this nail on the head. They have, ⁓ yeah, they've done some bad, maybe they'll do some good. So hopefully it's not too safe. I think the Sabrina Carpenter clip gives me hope, but I'm afraid.

Jeff (27:11)
Well, it's funny because I feel like things like the Muppets mockumentary series that in 2015, where it's supposed to be like the office in Modern Family, I watched the first episode, I did not like it. It had a huge following and that was geared towards adults. So I feel like, I'm not saying that Disney doesn't take missteps, but I think attributing it to the fact that they want it clean and polished and for kids.

is not the misstep they're making. They've made mistakes. I just take umbrage to the fact that they're trying to make it too safe, because that was a garbage.

Steve Scarfo (27:49)
So that's not what I said though.

That's not my argument. You're arguing someone else's point. I didn't say they were making it too safe.

Jeff (27:55)
Let's see, ⁓ geek court.

Did, did he save the Muppets or sand the edges off?

Steve Scarfo (28:01)
⁓ But what I just said wasn't the sanding the edges off. I said that they have made mistakes. I have said that they try to make it ⁓ more Disney and they're trying to get longevity out of these characters, but I said it's difficult space for them to live in.

Jeff (28:18)
Yeah, they've made mistakes. Jim Henson's also made mistakes because he had the ⁓ he's had some some fails. The Jim Henson hour was not a success, had a Muppet segment. So that was pre Disney. It's not like they were all.

Steve Scarfo (28:31)
He was just pre podcast that's all he was if that was a Jim Henson

hour was a podcast it would have been freaking amazing ⁓

Jeff (28:41)
That's, there you go.

Steve Scarfo (28:43)
Alright, well, unfortunately I think I have to give this one to you. Because I do, I am afraid, and I do think they've done some things wrong, but I do think ultimately Disney's probably a good thing. ⁓ Just because it's their best chance of staying on the air. ⁓ And we're gonna talk more about ⁓ some of the stuff they've done in their interactive realm, but we'll do that in another segment right now.

Jeff (28:48)
Ooh.

Yeah.

Steve Scarfo (29:12)
It's time to go digging.

Look at that.

Jeff (29:21)
Something that my business treasure another thing that disney got right releasing, ⁓ the full seasons of the muppet show on dvd back when we had DVDs I don't have any place to play this but man, I still got it. It has a felt Like I like I've got kermit in my hands so, I know so Yes, i've got kermit right there

Steve Scarfo (29:31)
DVD plays.

You

That's a little creepy.

Jeff (29:51)
So this season one, The Muppet Show on DVDs the full season before we could widely get things on streaming legally. I understand like things have been available on the internet illegally for a long time, but ⁓ it wasn't easy to get and view. this was fantastic. So my basement treasure was, ⁓ you know, and what I do like about these box sets, which I do miss that we don't have

as much in when it comes to streaming is all like the bonus features where you get the original pilot is in here and lots of different like nuggets that you don't always get ⁓ or can see in streaming. So I love that.

Steve Scarfo (30:37)
Those were the original blooper

reels too. The original blooper reels were lived on a DVD or a CD, yeah, a DVD or a Blu-ray extras segment. Those were always my favorites. So I did just look it up. All five seasons are available on Disney+. So you still have to pay for it, but if you have Disney +, you can watch all five seasons. So for me,

Jeff (30:44)
Yeah.

Yeah, so I love that.

Steve Scarfo (31:03)
I don't, I was, I said it before, I don't actually have my treasure, I think I just got rid of it. So for like a decade, I had this t-shirt that was animal. It was a black t-shirt with a very ⁓ distressed gray print. It was a single flat color, but it was animal just going to town on a drum set. It was one of my favorite shirts. It's the reason it's destroyed. It was a primary, I have, if you guys might not have figured it out by now.

I love my t-shirts, right? So it was a t-shirt I wore all the time out and did stuff with. And then it transitioned to an around the house t-shirt. And then at the end, it became just a, sleep in this t-shirt ⁓ to the point where there were holes and rips and it was like Swiss cheese because I loved it that much. ⁓ Animal was always, I talked about Fozzie, but Animal was always one of my favorite characters just because of the wild chaos that he was ⁓ or is, I keep saying was. I like I talk about it in nostalgic past tense, but the fact is they all still are here.

⁓ So that's my treasure, was this t-shirt and this memory of, I think a testament to how much I loved the show growing up, that I had this shirt that I could not get rid of. ⁓ I'm telling you at the end, it was ripped down the sides like it was just, it should have been a rag a decade, maybe five years before, but I couldn't get rid of it. ⁓

Yeah, that's my treasure. So now, that's a quick treasure. It's one of our faster treasures because we have a lot to talk about because there's a lot of evolution here.

Jeff (32:40)
All right, yes. So I did a lot of research and discovered so much coming into this episode ⁓ that I did not know. I, like I said, like we first knew about these Muppets in Sesame Street. So I had no idea until through research for this how long these Muppets had been around and that in 1955,

That's when Kermit made his appearance on a five minute local TV spot that they did only in Washington, DC called Sam and Friends. And Sam was a human puppet. It's actually wooden and traditional puppet. And ⁓ Jim Henson had created Kermit from cutting because he didn't have any budget. So he cut his mother's felt coat. ⁓

and cut a ping pong ball in half and created this muppet. And ⁓ before that, puppets were very wooden or they were marionettes. And so having the felt and having the flexibility, that was his invention. And having the little sticks that move the arms from below instead of marionette from above. So there were puppets that were just the mouth.

Steve Scarfo (33:51)
Mm-hmm.

Jeff (34:08)
or you had marionettes. so, and I thought about like back when we did the Rankin and Bass episode in the Animagic and how using those felt figurines, puppets, really made things come alive. And Jim Henson did the same thing even before that. So, yeah, I do wonder like Rankin and Bass, like, wait a second, like if they knew about, you ⁓ know, about what Jim Henson was doing, because.

Steve Scarfo (34:17)
Mm-hmm.

Right.

Jeff (34:37)
He was the first to create a muppet. Jim Henson has said it's a non, like, he didn't intend this, but people thought it was marionette and puppet combined, because it had elements of both a marionette and a puppet. So.

Steve Scarfo (34:52)
Well, is it

technically a marionette? Isn't it still, isn't it marionette, idea that it's being controlled from above? so wouldn't the control from below still be considered a marionette now? Is it only from above? Apparently, p-

Jeff (35:00)
Yeah.

Apparently, apparently not. Like apparently this,

like this is so innovative. And the other thing that is apparently innovative, because Jim Henson loved TV, was puppets were still being portrayed as if they were on a stage show. And having a TV, like a camera right there, and was not, was not normal. And the other innovation he did was having a closed circuit TV below him that he could watch.

Steve Scarfo (35:10)
That's cool.

Jeff (35:35)
while he was doing the manipulations. Apparently all the other puppets before that were being operated blindly. And this he felt gave them the most realistic way of creating their emotions and being able to monitor what they were doing. So yeah.

Steve Scarfo (35:52)
That's crazy. I did not

know that that was his invention. I obviously knew he created Kermit, but I didn't realize that the whole structure of that kind of puppet, because I was thinking about, what's her name? God, she's an older comedian. She did Lamb Chop, and it was literally just a sock. Sherry Lewis, right? And she would just do the sock.

Jeff (36:08)
Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

which did exist before and that's what, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Steve Scarfo (36:17)
Right, but to your point, it was just the head. was literally just, and it was

just her. I don't know that there were a lot of them. So him adding the ability to whatever you want to call it, if it's not Marionette, from below is pretty cool that he created that. then I knew he did the TV underneath. I didn't realize that was his thing too. ⁓

Jeff (36:35)
Yeah,

it's pretty wild how much he innovated that space. I think about some of the things that I've seen in Jason Segel in Forgetting Sarah Marshall. I don't know if anyone, it's a great comedic movie, but he wants to create Dracula Puppet Show musical. And we don't get that comedic bit without the Muppets.

Steve Scarfo (36:57)
Mm-hmm.

Jeff (37:03)
And then I think it's funny, Jason Segel clearly loved The Muppets because The Muppets, the movie that they made with Disney, which was fantastic, go and see it if you haven't seen that one, ⁓ was also Jason Segel. And his brother was a Muppet. I know. Well, we've got my...

Steve Scarfo (37:14)
Yeah.

We should be sponsored by Disney at this point. I'm going to reach out to Disney Plus. ⁓

So let them know that you watched our episode. And by the way, Jeff was actually showing a package of DVDs earlier. So you guys got to watch if you want to see it. That's all I'm ⁓ Yeah, that's OK. I usually will pick up and I forgot about it. ⁓

Jeff (37:34)
That's right. That's right. yeah, I guess I should have said that.

So

but what I think is also interesting to the point you were making earlier about this was not like He was he did not want his ⁓ Creation his Muppets to be seen as for kids he so that five-minute local show was Created because they they needed to fill five minutes between the news program in the tonight show

And so that was initially why Sam and friends was created in Kermit was just a lizard at that point. He wasn't a frog because he didn't have his little collar and all that. then he was so successful that he started to appear on the Ed Sullivan show in the sixties and they did a lot of advertising. He created commercials for this coffee brand called Wilkins Coffee. And to show you just how kind of more adult it was, there was two ⁓

two Muppets on there, one continuously who didn't like Wilkins coffee was getting essentially murdered by the other one. Like, you don't like Wilkins coffee and like shot a cannon at him and blew him up or.

Steve Scarfo (38:47)
It was that

slapstick though of the Wile E. Coyote of the time, right? The Bugs Bunny Road Runner cartoons. And I'm sure it felt safe because it was puppets and not real people. ⁓ That's cool. I didn't know that about the Wilkins Coffee.

Jeff (38:51)
Yeah.

Yeah, so, and then the reason we got Kermit the Frog is because ⁓ one thing that Jim Benson liked to do was make his characters dress up as other characters to do something. And so he made a special called the Frog Prince where he had his lizard Kermit become a frog. And then that just stuck and Kermit was Kermit the Frog after they created the Frog Prince. So, yeah. And then we got Sesame Street, the Muppet Show and, and, and, and, you know.

Steve Scarfo (39:26)
The V.

Jeff (39:31)
the success that we've had since then with the use of these Muppets. And that cast of characters has kept growing. Another thing I noticed in the first season of the Muppets is that, for those of you who know the Family Guy intro, where at the end of it, it's just a tiered dais of maybe four levels with the characters. Well, the Muppets in the season one, that's all it was. And then now we've got all those arches of Muppet after Muppet after Muppet.

Steve Scarfo (39:51)
Yeah.

Jeff (40:01)
and it just kept growing all the the Muppets that they were creating.

Steve Scarfo (40:05)
Yeah, they've done an, I mean, let's face it, I'm 57, which makes, or if you're about to be 57, I'm 56 at the moment, I suppose. But that makes these 56 year old and more characters, Kermit's older, but the Muppet Show itself, to have only been on TV for five years and had movies and had this kind of longevity. And let's be honest, it was off the air before I probably remembered it.

you know, 69, ⁓ hold on, had it, sorry, 76 to 81. So I would have been, what, 12 when the Muppet Show went off the air. And I kind of remember it as a kid, but I remember the movies and stuff. And then obviously it's lived in reruns forever. But I think to me, part of the evolution of these characters is what I was talking about before, is actually...

that makes them endearing is that they have a lack of evolution. Those characters themselves don't evolve. Yes, they have, the show's gotten better. It's gotten more technical, better stars, bigger stars, more stuff going on. ⁓ Pigs in Space, still one of my favorite ⁓ subplots that they did, which was just ludicrous and hysterical. ⁓ I will say Sam the Eagle always freaked me out. There's something about his heavy brow that always, but.

But these characters, they don't evolve. They are who they are and they always will be. Kermit is always a stressed out stage manager, even in everything they do. They give him moments. Every character has a moment of redemption. You have to have something, right? Miss Piggy gets a moment in the spotlight where she does it right and Fozzy lands a joke occasionally and so does Gonzo not blow himself up. To go back, sorry, just to go back with the,

Jeff (41:55)
Yeah. Yeah, the. sorry, good.

Steve Scarfo (42:00)
The puppeteering thing, I think it's even funnier because I noticed this as a kid, ⁓ but the Swedish chef, he didn't actually have felt hands. They were real hands. When the Swedish chef was doing his stuff, it was just someone's actual hands, ⁓ which I thought was hysterical. Like everything else was felt or on wires, but his were hands, were real hands.

Jeff (42:11)
Yeah.

Cheers.

Yeah. Yes. Yeah.

Apparently the whole the cast loved that Swedish chef segment partially because of that, because it's like there's a for those who have done improv theater, there's a bit of improv where one actor is has his hands behind his back. Another actor is behind him and shoving his hands through in the

and the actor can't see what their hands are doing, and the other actor has to play along with whatever the hands do. And essentially that's what they did with The Swedish Chef. A lot of actually, ⁓ of The Muppets were ⁓ improv. ⁓ Frank Oz and Jim Henson were always playing off each other. And I think that's why sometimes some things didn't work when... ⁓

you know, when it was maybe scripted by someone else, or it didn't feel like the Muppets, you know, so those who might be saying, you know, Disney doesn't quite feel right. It doesn't have Frank Oz and Jim Henson, so it feels different, but I do agree with you that these characters mostly are the same, or if anything, if they gain a little popularity, ⁓ they get another chance ⁓ at something. But you made me think about...

And I shouldn't have skipped this in the evolution because before we had the Muppets, we had Saturday Night Live, Tales of Gorge, I think it was. I have to look it up, SNL. That's true. But I was like, oh, the land of Gorge. So the land of Gorge.

Steve Scarfo (43:56)
Technically, we're still in evolution.

Yeah

Jeff (44:05)
The Muppets, so Jim Henson, like we've been saying, wanted his Muppets to be for adults as well and not just for kids. So the land of Gorge was purely, it's Saturday Live. They are aiming entirely at adults and it did not work. It did not work on Saturday Live because I think largely because Jim Henson did not get to do any of the writing because of the Writers Guild contract. The writers of SNL had to do the writing and they hated writing for the land of Gorge. And.

Steve Scarfo (44:34)
So they made

it bad.

Jeff (44:35)
The

actors hated giving any screen because those actors, there's a show called Saturday Night, I think, that kind of recreates that first season, that first episode, the pilot episode. It's great. ⁓ Go and watch it. And The Land of Gorge is featured in there and Jim Henson as well. They hated giving any time because people were, these actors are constantly losing out on their skit. They've worked all week on it and it gets cut.

Steve Scarfo (45:03)
yeah.

Jeff (45:05)
And they're like, I'm getting caught for a for a puppet because they were like the F.E. puppets. These puppets. I've got to get out of here. So. OK.

Steve Scarfo (45:16)
I'd love that you won't swear. We can swear here, it's okay.

I always mark us as explicit because I can't hold them back. Usually it's me.

Jeff (45:24)
Yeah,

Belushi was like, these fucking muppets, get them out of here. And so they hated them and the writers hated them. And so I think it was a self-destructive relationship or like they were on self-destruct. And you know.

Steve Scarfo (45:29)
Yeah.

Well, but when you have

a cast that's that talented, that doesn't put anything into it, it's destined to be a failure. ⁓ Yeah, that's too bad. I didn't realize that they hated it.

Jeff (45:50)
So, so

the land of Gorge. Yeah. So, ⁓ yeah, so it was. I can't remember where we're going with this. yeah, because I was going to talk about characters that get another shot. The that that that shrimp, the prawn. ⁓ That is Pepe, think Pepe. ⁓ I like where did that character come from?

Steve Scarfo (46:05)
Yeah.

⁓ yeah.

Jeff (46:19)
It came from the Wizard of Oz movie that they made with the Muppets. And Gonzo was always hanging out with Rizzo the Rat. And then flash forward to one of the newer Muppet events, was Muppet Haunted Mansion, which is fantastic. Highly recommend it. Go and see Muppet's Haunted Mansion. And instead of Rizzo, it's Pepe. And Pepe's a great character. So I think sometimes they have these little...

characters that end up being big and Miss Piggy was the same way. like they so no they don't evolve unless like they might increase in popularity but they they are they're true to whoever they were because the Miss Piggy became popular but she became popular because of that's that kind of egotistical self-centered. Miss Piggy was there even when she was a minor character.

Steve Scarfo (47:00)
Yeah, I'm ending.

But yeah, and that's a perfect lampoon of a takedown of a haughty character, right? That's one of the favorite things people have in most movies, when someone who thinks they're above it all and better than everyone else fails miserably and gets put in their place. And that's Miss Piggy from day one. ⁓ Yeah, I was talking specifically about the characters of each, the arc of each character. There's no arc, it's flat, right?

Miss Piggy is who she was in 1970, 69 and 70.

But I do, know, there's so, God, there's so much. There's all the movies that they did. so, ⁓ the one with Jason Segel, ⁓ one of my favorites because I think they, because he's one of my favorite actors too. I think he's great. So I think he elevated it too. ⁓ There was, ⁓ I'm a big fan of Ricky Gervais. I know he plays a part in a couple of them up at movies too, so.

Jeff (48:03)
Yeah.

Yeah,

Muppets most wanted.

Steve Scarfo (48:15)
And they, yes, he's like the inside guy too. They don't catch on that he's the bad guy.

Jeff (48:19)
In both

of those movies, like if you've seen a Muppet meme, the Kermit drinking tea, Kermit staring into evil, the evil Kermit, like the hooded Kermit. And then Walter, which is Jason Segel's human character's Muppet brother, which they don't explain why his brother's a Muppet, I don't think, has this panicked moment where he's running and there's the streaming like panic.

Steve Scarfo (48:30)
Yes.

Jeff (48:47)
You know, and that's like, like, wow, like it gave us some good memes.

Steve Scarfo (48:53)
Those are from there, yeah.

No, there's so much good Muppet content. I think it's clearer than when we talk about this stuff, ⁓ how much we enjoy these topics, right? I hope you guys are hearing it while we're talking about it because I, you know, we talk a lot about it and I should have said this roughly 50 minutes ago, but like, subscribe, tell your friends.

Jeff (49:10)
Yeah.

Steve Scarfo (49:23)
We'll tack this on to the beginning of the episode too. But this editing is a wonderful thing. So ⁓ listen, join us for these conversations. We have a couple more segments, but I want to say jump in, listen, have fun with us, comment, send us emails. Tell us who your favorite Muppet is. Tell us who your least favorite Muppet is, but ⁓ jump on and join the conversation with us. Because right now, look at that. I dropped right into our message.

Jeff (49:57)
Watch the Muppets. That's the message for all generations. Like I said, my six year old ⁓ nephew was watching that season one of the Muppets and was really enjoying it, really getting into it. It's they still work. And there's probably if you're like me, Gen X, maybe you stopped watching at some point thinking, you know, I'm past the Muppets.

Steve Scarfo (49:59)
Hey

Jeff (50:24)
Maybe you still love them for nostalgia's sake, but you never watched A Christmas Carol, or Treasure Island, or Haunted Mansion, or The Muppets with Jason Segel, or The One with Ricky Gervais, Muppets Most Wanted. All of those, watch them and The One on February 4th, because as Steve said, it's one episode. It's how many views that episode gets that determines whether we get a second one, or third or fourth, or so on.

Give it a watch. And if you don't like it, you can always post a review and maybe that'll impact whether we get a second one. But don't just hate it because it's new. Don't just hate it because it's different. And it's not exactly what you saw in 1976. Watch it with kind of open eyes, an open heart, and an open mind. And let's get more of this Muppet content. Steve.

Steve Scarfo (51:21)
Yeah, I'm just gonna kind of jump to the side of that and not even don't hate on it, but don't ignore it. Right? Don't go at the Muppets. Right? I don't need to watch that. know the Muppets. Like give them the opportunity to show you something new. Like, or in fact, not new, but tried and true, but still good. ⁓ There was a reason why there's a reason why 56, seven years later, we're here talking about the Muppets. They have longevity. People like them.

Don't assume it's done just because it's 56 years old, right? Please don't assume that because I'm 56, I don't wanna be done. But also, don't ignore it, right? This is good stuff, ups and downs, ins and outs. The true test of any property, of any character is how long will people stay interested? I want, like Jeff, to see more. I have the Disney...

But know, as most people have the bundle, I have the Disney bundle, so I get all the content. They have a lot of good content. ⁓ But in this case, ⁓ don't ignore the Muppets. It's three days from now, and hopefully we'll get something out before then, even if it's just a, go watch the Muppets clip. ⁓ But yeah, that's it. Watch them, don't ignore them, don't hate on them. Here's the deal, even if you do hate it, just don't say anything.

Let the people who like a talk so we can get another one. And then just don't watch episode two. I want an episode. Don't yuck it. Rats, bastards. All right. ⁓ But we're going to drop into our hits and fail.

Jeff (52:50)
Yeah. Don't yuck our yum, how dare you.

Steve Scarfo (53:06)
All right, this ⁓ is gonna be an interesting one, folks. So my critical hit is the Muppet Vision 3D ride at Disney. ⁓ It is without a doubt, and geez, don't go as often, Jeff and his wife go a lot, Jeff and Kristen go a lot more than we do, but I've been enough in the last couple decades that, or whenever it first started.

Jeff (53:06)
Give us a hit.

Steve Scarfo (53:35)
It's been the first time since I remember being there. So it's going to be more than 20 years that this ride has been at Disney. ⁓ And it was one of my favorite experiences as an adult. And I could only imagine as a kid that 4D thing they do so well, they have theaters across their parks. They do want it. ⁓ Animal Kingdom with the ants ⁓ with the bugs life. is it off to go see it next time we go, because I did not know they changed that.

Jeff (53:57)
Well, now it's it's Zootopia.

Steve Scarfo (54:03)
But it's one of those experiences, it's immersive. So there's real puppets in this thing. There's things that happen behind you. There's things that, know, appear, like characters walk out on to the, in front of you. ⁓ So it's not just a movie and there wasn't just, you know, it had that 4D, they did the Smell-O-Vision and you get spritz with water and it was amazing. ⁓ So. ⁓

I don't even know if I have much more than that to say, but that's my hit. Of all the Muppet experiences, it felt the most nostalgic to me. I felt like a kid walking in this theater. It came out in 74, I was six years old, up to 11, and I felt like I was that kid walking into this theater going, crap, I'm going to see the Muppets. That's my hit.

Jeff (54:49)
Absolutely, Muppet Vision was amazing. And that's why it leads into my epic fail. Because that whole land, that Muppet land that Jim Henson, when he was first negotiating with Disney in the late 80s, he ⁓ envisioned a Muppet land at what is now Hollywood Studios, was at that time, MGM Studios. And... ⁓

in that vision was the Muppet vision, ⁓ 4D, which Steve just described, it was amazing, but was also supposed to have the great Muppet movie ride.

which if you've ever done the great movie ride that used to be at Hollywood Studios, ⁓ like was a ride that took you through the movies, through history. And this would be the Muppet version and things would go wrong though as you went through it. So Alien and Indiana Jones and all that would, things would, they'd get it wrong. And it was a comedic Muppets ride. They never did it. ⁓ Jim Henson passed away in 1990.

before he saw his vision of the Muppet, you know, vision get realized, fully realized, and the whole Muppet land really ⁓ never grew to what it could have been. And that's the epic fail. Because now that the Muppet vision is gone, they've taken it away, they still have the Muppets at Hollywood Studios, but it's replacing Aerosmith's Rock and Roller Coaster, which is fine. I do like updating things.

Right next to ⁓ the Rock and Roller Coaster is a theater with a villain show in, which is amazing. It's a great show. But the fail here is the Muppets deserve a land. And that villain show, move it someplace else, put where you've got the Muppets Rock and Roller Coaster now, put ⁓ the Muppet vision there, and then add...

Steve Scarfo (56:39)
Hmm.

Jeff (56:52)
because now the great movie rides gone, add in the great Muppet movie ride. And now you have a nice Muppet themed land ⁓ that is deserved because you bought, you spent 75 million on this property to get these characters. And now you're all you got is a roller coaster that ⁓ if you don't keep your head back, you're going to walk out with a broken neck and whiplash. So like little kids can't go on it. They can't experience the Muppets.

Steve Scarfo (57:01)
Yeah.

What's...

Jeff (57:21)
Disney this way. So my epic fail is not fully utilizing ⁓ the Muppet property for a Muppet land at Disney. Huge, huge fail. ⁓ yeah, so as much as I'm looking forward to the new land that they're building for Monsters Inc. I'm sure it'll be fantastic. Come on, come on Disney. I've given you love all this episode. Make this Muppet land a reality. You can do it.

Steve Scarfo (57:48)
Hehehe

I do think it's funny that they're removing the Muppets from Monsters Inc. It's not like that's a new property either. Monsters Inc. has been around for a long time, so I am bummed to hear that there's no more Muppet Vision 3D.

Jeff (58:06)
Yeah, yeah, it's gone. And what's what's bananas to me is like, is like there's a theater right beside that they put a villain show, which is an amazing show. But I mean, right there, you could have just rehabbed the like, because the Muppet Vision was 1990. So it came out like or 1991, wherever it came out. But it was a long time ago.

It's awesome and I love nostalgia and I keep watching it even if it was the same thing all the time ⁓ Because it's a great show, but they could have even just changed it I don't I don't and they're miss. This is it. This is the epic fail of epic fails This could be an amazing land and legacy ⁓ And I don't understand why they're not doing

Steve Scarfo (58:59)
Alright Disney, smarten up. But listen, ⁓ we got through another one. Thanks for coming with us. ⁓

Originalgeekpodcast.com, if you found us, have heard us on one of your podcast episodes. If you're watching us or listening to us on YouTube, like, share, subscribe, tell your friends, let folks know, check us out on social media and do all this stuff, like and heart our videos and follow us along. We're gonna keep bringing you all the content we're bringing you. If you have ideas for content, let us know. If you have a conversation starter you want us to talk about, we can do that too. We love doing it and make sure you keep joining us.

Jeff (59:38)
Yeah, and geez, in the words of the very first skit ever in The Muppet Show,

Steve Scarfo (59:48)
do

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

Jeff (59:57)
Na

Ma-na-na, na-na-na, ma-na-na-na-na-na-na.

Steve Scarfo (1:00:06)
Love and love.

My name a geek. Do do do do do. My name a geek. Do do do do do. Do do do do. Do do do do Do do do do My name a geek.

Jeff (1:00:13)
Manamagi.

Manama Geek.

Buh-bye geek!


00:00 Introduction: the Muppets and Their Impact
10:51 Geek Flashback
19:54 Geek Court
29:13 Basement Treasures
32:33 Geek Evolution
49:51 Geek Rant
53:01 Critical Hits & Epic Fails