From David Bowie to Madonna — Publishing Pioneer Annette Barrett

 What if some of the biggest moments in music history were shaped by someone most listeners have never heard of?

In this episode of She Creates Noise, Sarah sits down with Annette Barrett, whose 40-year career in music publishing reveals the invisible architecture behind some of the industry’s most important creative successes. From an early opportunity at Carlin Music to global leadership roles, Annette’s story is rooted in instinct, intelligence, and a lifelong belief that everything begins with a great song.

From working with legends like David Bowie, Madonna, Prince, and Elton John, to becoming the first woman appointed to the board of Warner Chappell Music, Annette shares the philosophy that guided her through decades of change: it all starts with a song.

She also reflects on her lifelong friendship with David Bowie, which began during art studies at the Sorbonne University in Paris, where Bowie was also a student. That connection offers rare insight into one of music’s greatest innovators and the creative fearlessness that changes culture.

Annette explains how her grounding in copyright law, combined with an artist’s sensibility, became the “magical combo” that shaped her success—helping writers protect their work while building meaningful careers.

Long before globalization became standard practice, she was connecting songwriters across borders and cultures. She shares the story of introducing Danish producer Cutfather to Nashville writers—an unlikely pairing that later led to a number one hit with P!nk and Keith Urban.

As co-founder and president of the Independent Music Publishers Forum, Annette continues championing independent voices, songwriter rights, and the next generation of creators.

A rich conversation about songs, strategy, originality, and the unseen people who help shape music history.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

• How music publishing quietly shapes major artists, hit songs, and long-term careers
• What Annette Barrett learned from working with icons like David Bowie, Madonna, Prince, and Elton John
• Why combining creative instinct with business and copyright knowledge can become a career superpower
• How global songwriting collaborations can lead to unexpected hit records
• Why mentorship, advocacy, and protecting songwriter rights still matter today

https://www.instagram.com/annettebarrett4022/

https://www.reservoir-media.com/

Transcript

Speaker 2 0:24

Hi, you're listening to Sarah Nagourney and welcome to. She Creates Noise, a new podcast spotlighting women who power the music industry, coming to you from New York City. Now, if you don't know me yet, here's a little background. I'm a songwriter, producer, manager, educator and mentor. I've written platinum selling songs, had tracks on Grammy nominated educator and mentor. I've written platinum-selling songs, had tracks on Grammy-nominated records and released music on both major and independent labels. I've been a jazz singer, a jingle singer, toured with big bands and became a pop artist, and I've performed at festivals across the US, europe and Asia.

Speaker 2 1:00

These days, I focus on writing with and developing young talent. In the coming weeks, I'll be pulling back the curtain on the music industry's female changemakers. Some are close friends, others I'm just getting to know, but all have reshaped the business in profound ways. My goal here is to help listeners better understand how the music business really works and just how instrumental women behind the scenes have been. You'll hear from both sides of the desk artists, producers, managers, label executives, lawyers. Women making things happen, often without the spotlight on them. Thank you for joining me on this journey. Now let's dive in. Thank you for joining me on this journey.

Meet Annette Barrett: Publishing Pioneer

Speaker 2 1:47

Now let's dive in. Today, I'd like to welcome Annette Barrett. Annette Barrett is a veteran music publishing executive with over 40 years of experience. She began her career at UK-based Carlin Music and rose through the ranks to hold senior positions at Virgin Music and Warner Chapel, where she became the first woman appointed to the board of directors. Since 2001, annette has served as managing director of Reservoir Reverb Music, working with top-tier songwriters like Jamie Hartman, ina Rolson and Nittan Soni. Under her leadership, the company has been behind major hits including Human and Giant by Rag and Bone man and how Deep Is your Love by Calvin Harris and the Disciples. Annette has also worked with legendary artists such as David Bowie, george Michael, elton John, eric Clapton, madonna and Prince. A passionate supporter of emerging talent, she continues to mentor the next generation of songwriters. In 2014, she co-founded the Independent Music Publishers Forum, the IMPF, and was re-elected to president in 2021, advocating for independent publishers and songwriters on a global scale. Please welcome, annette Barrett. I was thinking about how long I've known you. I'm thinking, am I allowed to say Well?

Speaker 4 3:02

yeah, absolutely yeah, yeah, well, I'm very honored. Thank you, um, uh, yes, of course you are. Yeah, how long is it?

Speaker 2 3:11

well, you were at mortars. It's probably pushing 30 years. It's before my daughter was born, so 27 or something like that wow time flies. Yeah, I want to sort of mention you know. One of the things I want to bring up here is what an interesting journey you've had and how much you and people like you have trailblazed for the women in the business that have come after you. And if you could tell us a little bit of how you fell into this crazy business, that would be fantastic.

Speaker 4 3:40

Yeah, well, it has been a long journey actually, but I guess I love it. I think it's certainly who I am. It's part of you know, it's in my DNA. So, yeah, well, I came into it actually by way of art, which was it was always art music in school anyway. I mean that's what I loved. But I managed to get a scholarship We'll go back to that maybe later at the Sorbonne actually in Paris. So I was very lucky and I spent a year studying fine art in Paris and, anyway, came back, did my A-levels, then went to St Martin School of Art, which was fantastic, but I just like came out there going, well, you know now what do I do, but I mean I was doing a lot of private work, so that was quite nice.

Speaker 4 4:23

So, a friend, through a friend of a friend or whatever, and I've always loved music and I was always at shows and gigs and I did know a lot of people in the music business actually, and somebody said, oh, there's a job at Carlin Music actually it was which was a very established old well now, I mean old catalogue, I mean Elvis Presley, I mean catalogue, I mean Elvis Presley, and I mean there was, it was you know me, it was there, it was just fantastic and it was, it was a great um learning curve. And so someone said to me well, why don't you go in and see, and see what you, you know, I loved creating.

Speaker 4 5:03

I was very much into the whole sort of interacting, networking and social thing. I felt, and I think that's why I really is very aligned with songwriters. I understand when you're in a studio and you're creating something, it's like is this any good, where am I going to go with this? What am I going to do with it? You know, and so you know, it's very much, I think, helping navigate, helping navigate creativity. I think that was very much my calling.

Speaker 2 5:32

Because you understood it so much from being in a studio and being an artist.

International Music Publishing Journey

Speaker 4 5:35

Yeah, from being, you know, being there on my own and doing something I think it was, you know, I had a great affiliation with, always have done with some writers still do. So I think from that angle it was very, very much a very natural process. But I actually started off in the copyright department, so I got to know the real you know how publishing worked, and I think that's a great way to start, because publishing is very, you know, I mean multifaceted. There's so much going on and then every territory is different as well. So so I had a really good grounding and background and I never really looked back from there. I mean, I mean, obviously I've always dabbled with my art, I've had exhibitions and I've sold stuff. It sort of just went from there and I'm still doing it today.

Speaker 2 6:35

And it's lucky that you started sort of on the copyright side, because you started to see the business side of things, even though you were a creative. It was a great mix for you.

Speaker 4 6:43

It is it has been a great mix. For you it is, it has been a great mix and you know, I I do feel that not a lot of people have that. You know, both sides, both elements of of it, you're either, you know, I mean I very much felt that in um when, when I was in Warner Chapel, which I was for like 12, 11, 12 years, I very much felt that way. You know, people were very much either creative or they were. You know, for me that was it was great, it was really helpful.

Speaker 2 7:12

Magical combo.

Speaker 4 7:14

Yeah.

Speaker 2 7:15

That's great. Now you've led Reverb Music for over two decades and it's part of Reservoir, which is a US company. How has your role evolved since the acquisition, particularly in bridging the UK and US publishing operations?

Speaker 4 7:30

Well, I think. I mean, I've always been a great advocate of international anyway, so I've always worked the international side. In fact, in Warner Chapel I set up the whole international department, which when I went there in, I think 1990, I joined in 1980 or 1990. They did have an international department, but it was actually just really to sort of set up meet-em for people to go to meet-em.

Speaker 2 7:54

I think I remember that, I remember that you were there.

Speaker 4 7:56

Yeah, yeah, I reinvented the whole thing where I'd already put people from different territories together and stuff and really you know sort of cross pollinated lots of different writers from different countries and different things. I mean I wasn't reinventing the wheel, but it was certainly in the 90s. That was quite new. Actually, people weren't doing that so much. But now I mean, anything can come from anywhere and I've always felt that actually I've always thought it was. You know, it was a great thing to sort of have different influences from different cultures.

Speaker 2 8:30

Looking at K-pop, for example.

Speaker 4 8:32

yeah, I mean, some writers actually blossom in other territories and you know they haven't had much success in their own territory, but yet they go to another territory, maybe in Germany or something, and something just clicks. It's quite interesting how it works, for, you know, go to Southeast Asia and they work, they seem to find their spark there. So it's really interesting how creativity can work in different regions, different cultures, different territories. And now I mean, as I say, anything can come from anywhere.

Speaker 2 9:02

And some major artists I think Dua Lipa included was actually signed out of Germany originally.

Speaker 4 9:07

Yeah absolutely.

Speaker 2 9:08

Are there many examples of that too?

Speaker 4 9:10

Oh, many, lots of boy groups, I think early on and lots of people do get their own territory. I think you know there's always that sort of initial thing of like I really want to make it in my own, I want to be, you know, I want to be huge in America or I want to be huge in the UK, but you know it's a big, wide world out there and actually you can do very well in other territories as well and, you know, hopefully come back to your own territory.

Championing Artists and Collaborations

Speaker 2 9:42

I love going to the UK as a songwriter Great, great history for songwriting in the UK but there are a lot of, I guess, major writers already signed to Reservoir and so it's kind of I guess it's a balancing act for you and for Reservoir to find the catalogues you're working with and also to work with bringing in new talent. How do you kind of work on that on a global scale?

Speaker 4 10:06

That is quite interesting. But you know, I think it's down to instinct. Really, I think you know who you can work with, and one hopefully knows who one can work with, and you just you get, you have a connection and you know that you can work with lots of people.

Speaker 2 10:23

Now, who are some of the main talents? Now I read is Ali Tamposi still signed to Reservoir Joni Mitchell?

Speaker 4 10:31

Yeah, joni, yeah, yeah, joni Mitchell, yeah, absolutely, yeah, yeah, we have many great songwriters. My roster is probably, I mean and I've worked with mine, probably I mean from the Reverb days, because Respoir acquired Reverb in 2012.

Speaker 2 10:50

And just reminding anyone. Of course Annette is in the UK. She's got a British accent but she's actually in the UK.

Speaker 4 10:56

I'm actually in the UK. Yeah, I do travel a lot, but yes, I'm actually based in the UK and I have on my roster a Baha which actually I worked with at Warner Chapel originally.

Speaker 2 11:09

In the beginning. They came here, so that was the song that keeps on giving, I've got.

Speaker 4 11:14

Pete Gordino, who's now Depeche Mode, and I mean I've worked with Pete since 2003. Mode and I mean I've worked with Pete since 2003 who's Rag and Bone man, human Giant and many, many, many more. We've worked together since about 2003.

Speaker 2 11:30

But you are still looking to sign new talent, as I seem to remember. Yeah, always yeah always.

Speaker 4 11:35

And yeah, I mean obviously we have a creative team here as well, which is's always looking. We have some really good and we're constantly signing new up and coming writers as well, which is really important, I think you know.

Speaker 2 11:48

Keep it alive. I know you had mentioned you worked with global hit makers like Jamie Hartman, who did Human and Giant, and Iona Roltson how Deep Is your Love? And you also brought in advised talents like Cutfather. I remember you told me a fun story about that. I suppose you kind of mentioned this. Who else have you actually championed yourself personally?

Speaker 4 12:07

I've got phil manzanera, who's proxy music right well, and we're doing lots of new, new projects as well, which is, uh, always interesting. Nittan sawney, who's really amazing, probably busiest man in the music business as well. I mean, he's always doing it. He does a lot of film stuff and a lot of TV stuff as well. Great scorer, great musician, great producer and also a great artist too. He does every year when he sells out the Royal Albert Ball, such a great show. Very varied. But I think publishing is just the nature of it is very varied. Obviously one leans into what one really loves, which for me is a great song. So that can go across so many borders, so many genres. So for me it's been very varied over the years and I've been lucky enough to work with some great people, so Elton John, madonna, prince Sting, the Police in my time.

Speaker 2 13:03

That's the crazy part. All these people that you worked with. How did you know what would stand out, what stands out to you? How do you pick? Do you? Is it your gut or you?

Speaker 4 13:11

just it's a song well, it's all about the song. For me, it all starts with a song, obviously, and it is all about the song. So, you know, if I hear a great song on, you know, but it's instinct and it's a connection. That is just a natural instinct for me. So if I hear something, I want to hear more.

Speaker 2 13:29

And nowadays I guess you're conferring with your A&R department to talk about new artists and such.

Speaker 4 13:36

Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, very much. So I mean, I'm always interested in new things that happen and also, you know, cross-pollinating with you know, new writers and and maybe more established writers. As you know, you can get in the studio and you know you have an idea, but you can take it in a totally different direction when someone else comes in and goes yeah, but let's look at this, let's see how this works. So I think co-writing is a great creative form and can bring out. I know a lot of new writers sometimes are a little cautious about going in and saying, oh, you know, I like to write my own stuff and the whole thing. Also, you run out of ideas and it's great to find somebody else's ideas. I think it's that fear involved and many, many, many times have I had to coax people in and then, oh, that was fantastic.

Speaker 2 14:34

Just so it's clear. We're talking about collaboration. So publishers do a lot to put writers together different writers and sometimes you know often they don't know each other and they sometimes are nervous about getting in the room with someone they don't know. But I think a lot of publishers and including I spoke to Sam Cox at BMI really encourage it because it really does help, give you new opportunities and you learn so much from other writers.

Speaker 4 14:57

And areas that you perhaps you know might not have thought of going in directions. You might not have thought of going in directions, you might not thought of going in and something yeah, something sparks. It's can be magic. Yeah, it can be tough as well, you know not. Sometimes you just get great collaborations together.

Speaker 2 15:17

I know you told me about Cutfather you he was kind of not comfortable with the idea of doing a Nashville co-write. You can fill us in a little on that.

Speaker 4 15:27

Yeah, well, we were in LA actually and we just opened a reservoir I don't know if it's Nashville office and the Nashville staff were there as well. So I introduced him and I said you know, it might be really interesting for you to go to Nashville, and her father is from Copenhagen, so I'm very much in the pop world and dance world. And and he looked at me and he went what would I do there? So I said you might be surprised and he said, yeah, okay. So anyway, you know, weatted, we talked about it. Anyway, he did go and, yeah, he ended up with the number one, actually with Pink and Keith Urban.

Speaker 2 16:11

Keith Urban and Pink, not so very shabby.

Speaker 4 16:14

Not very shabby, and now it's a trip once a year. They do co -writes and they go to him as well, to his studio in Copenhagen. So it is that thing of like throwing it out there. Sometimes it's left to centre, but it can really work.

Speaker 2 16:29

It's cross-pollinating. Now I know you have a very interesting story to tell and something that a lot of people don't know about you. Do you want to tell us a little about your experience at the Sorbonne?

The David Bowie Connection

Speaker 4 16:39

Ah yeah, luckily I had a great art teacher actually, so she very much encouraged me and whatever, and as a young student I got into the Sorbonne. It was such a great moment. I think in time my mother was a careers officer too, so she was very aware of it.

Speaker 2 16:56

What a great thing that would be. And also you made a very good friend there, I think you told me Kind of a famous friend in fact.

Speaker 4 17:01

Yeah, I did actually. I got to the Sorbonne. I did my A-levels art very early, so I went there when I was about 17. Well, more than 17. And I was very young. Yeah, I met David Bowie there, actually, because my tutor.

Speaker 2 17:18

David Bowie.

Speaker 4 17:23

I'm not sure if everyone heard that, but yeah, that was cool. Yeah, my tutor was also working with David. I mean, david was getting himself ready for his tour. He was doing the Serious Moonlight. No, no, no, it was the Ziggy Stardust. Ziggy Stardust, oh, wow, yeah, I mean I was pretty young, oh sorry, early days.

Speaker 4 17:42

Sorry, early days, sorry, early days. He's always a great artist, david, and always great mentor, always a great fit. Any new artist. He used to really help. I mean throughout his career. Art was a big thing for him and he had such a great collection as well. So, yes, we met there and we were friends then for life, basically until he passed. I mean I did work with him on some projects. I did do the Cirrus.

Speaker 2 18:03

Moonlight Tour with him.

Speaker 4 18:04

I remember that it was stuck in my memory there, and then I did do some other projects with him as well, but basically our connection was through art and he was always, very always, sending me books, telling me what to go to see, what exhibitions were on around the world. You've got to see this, you've got to see this. You've got to see this, you'll love it. Yeah, he had quite a bit of my art and over the years, sold some of my art because he had a couple of galleries. We were very good friends that I go, shouldn't? He was a very special person, actually Such an icon so interesting.

IMPF: Supporting Independent Music Publishers

Speaker 2 18:36

Just changing the subject, that's, you know, also cool that you had that relationship, I believe. In 2014, you co-founded the Independent Music Publishers Forum, known as the IMPF, and in 2021, you were re-elected president of the organization. In this role, you continue to champion the interests of independent publishers and songwriters around the world. Can you tell us a little about that organization and how it advocates for independent artists?

Speaker 4 19:04

That's my other job.

Speaker 2 19:06

Yeah, your other full-time job.

Speaker 4 19:08

So the IMPF is the International Independent Music Publishers Forum, which in 2013, there was about 10 of us in Paris, globally from around the world, and we sat down and talked about do we need a trade body to represent the independent music publishers? And we were humming and harring do we need another trade body? And just anyway, it was agreed that we did particularly for the independents, because I think, you know, sometimes the independence issues problems get lost, you know, with the majors, and because we do have different issues, not always, but there are certain issues that do come up and do affect us differently. Yeah, so we created this global trade body and it's run out of Brussels now and we are funded by the EU now as well, and this is the second round of funding that we've managed to get because we've done very well. Basically, we deal with any issues globally. We have probably about 150 members around the world. We have set up a summit in parma in october. We do it every year now, which phil board last year said it was basically a very cool medium replaced.

Speaker 2 20:37

What time of year is that? October?

Speaker 4 20:39

Oh, okay, october 7th to the 10th, around that time, and so we do, and we do a lot of panels. There's a lot of meetings that people do, obviously, and we have fun, it's sort of like a global AIMP type thing, like the conference they do.

Speaker 4 20:56

Yeah, we also. Not only do we run the business side of it, but I thought it was very important now as an independent music publisher that we also put together a songwriting camp, which we have about 21 writers. We have a great studio there with seven rooms where we put a whole cast of global writers together which members send in and I oversee the selection committee as well for that and look to sort of put together different songwriters and you know artists, but basically it's and we we have five days of songwriting and then on the last evening of the summit we do a playback of the songs that's been done while we're there and have a bit of mentoring going on. While they're there I often bring out other songwriters or established songwriters and stuff as well. But also I mean the big thing there is obviously culturally everyone's very different because they're all from all over the world, because we have members from over five continents. That sounds like a cool.

Speaker 2 21:55

Thing.

Speaker 4 21:55

It's grown immensely.

Speaker 2 21:57

I want a link for that from you. I'll put a link in the notes.

Speaker 4 22:01

It grows day by day. We get new members every day, so it's been really successful and I mean, obviously, having EU funding has helped us a lot, but the EU have really, they've really embraced it and said that it's one of the most creative things that they've actually been involved with. So we are joining the dots between Europe and the rest of the world as well. So we we organize songwriting camps all year round as well, so we do webinars on issues that around the world it's all different governments have different ideas on this as well, and though quite a black hole there with ai.

Speaker 2 22:37

Ai is a whole nother, thing, I guess, right but other issues obviously as well.

Speaker 4 22:41

If we deal with any of the PROs, with problems and stuff like that Anything, that is an issue. We try and share these problems so that we can try and come up with solutions and obviously help wherever we can as well, and also share them with globally too, because people need to understand how differently things do work. Around the world. From America to the UK is very different from Europe. We have very different ways of working, but obviously transparency is all very important as well, and you know, representing the songwriters too, that's a big part of what we do, and I do get songwriters involved with a lot of it as well. So it is very much. Although it's a trade body, we do have very much a creative edge to it as well, and the song camp sounds great.

Speaker 2 23:29

I'd definitely love to know more about that Very exciting work all around. Is there anything that I didn't ask you that you want to talk about or mention? I think we've covered quite a lot really. So much to cover, but I'm glad we talked about David Bowie. That'll be something everyone will. I never knew about. It was really interesting when you told me he did used to have some of my art as well.

Speaker 4 23:49

So because I used to use him as a model when I was in Paris and when he was there he wasn't there all the time, obviously, but when he was there, so yeah. He was a supporter oh no, but I mean, I used him as to draw. Yeah, I'm gonna have that, and I'd be like, yeah, well, you know, but he was close to them, so uh, so yeah, that's great love to see some of that.

Speaker 2 24:12

Well, annette, it's been really fantastic to talk to you and so interesting. I feel like I'm going to do episode two about you. We certainly covered some great stuff and we'll put some links in about the Song Camp and the IMPF and everyone should just know that there's so much going on out there and you're behind so much of it.

Speaker 4 24:29

And it's always very important now, I feel, to give something back as well and try and sort of help where we can, and through experience as well, obviously.

Speaker 2 24:39

Hopefully we can do more, quicker and better out well, thank you for all you do and it was so much fun chatting and I appreciate you being here thank you.

Speaker 4 24:48

Thank you, very honored, thank you. She creates noise.

Speaker 2 25:28

I'd like to thank today's sponsor, herd City, the premier audio post-production company servicing the advertising, motion picture and television industries right here in NYC. I'd also like to thank Antello aka XON for singing the she Creates Noise theme that I wrote. Thanks for listening to she Creates Noise. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to subscribe, rate and share. I want to thank the team here Blair Reinly, jelena Stavanovich, emily Wilson and the Master of Engineering and Grammy-winning Cooper Anderson. We'll see you next time.