Life in Progress

Welcome back to Table for Two for the Season 2 premiere!

In this episode, Jason and Nicole Barnett share a deeply personal update about parenting, ministry life, ADHD, family stress, and learning to give themselves grace while raising kids in real time.

The conversation includes:

• Ben’s ADHD journey
• parenting struggles and emotional meltdowns
• balancing church ministry and family life
• fear-based Christianity and parenting
• Pokémon, Harry Potter, and K-Pop Demon Hunters 😂
• how kids process religious fear
• parenting neurodivergent children
• school struggles, bullying, and emotional growth
• learning that progress matters more than perfection

This episode also introduces a brand-new storytelling segment for Season 2 featuring fictional text-message conversations inspired by real-life family tensions and parenting challenges.

If you’ve ever felt overwhelmed as a parent, struggled with fear-based faith, questioned whether you’re doing enough, or simply wondered if anyone else is figuring this out as they go… this episode is for you.

Table for Two is a Christian podcast about faith, family, parenting, church culture, marriage, ministry, and navigating real life with honesty, humor, and grace.

Thanks for pulling up a chair at Table for Two. If you enjoyed today's conversation, we'd love for you to join us on Facebook! It is where we share behind-the-scenes updates, chat with listeners, and keep the conversation going throughout the week. We'd love to see you there.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome back to Table for Two, the podcast where faith, family, and real life meet around the table.

SPEAKER_01 0:06

And we're Jason and Nicole Barnett. He's Jason, I'm Nicole. We're a married couple in ministry trying to follow Jesus, you know, raise a family, survive group text on my word, and occasionally remember that we left our coffee. Or the bulletins. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 0:29

And we we're at a point in life where we might need to start wearing name tags to help each other out and our children. But uh welcome to season two. Uh last season we shared stories, laughed a lot, tackled some difficult conversations, and honestly, realized we're not the only people trying to figure life out in real time.

SPEAKER_01 0:48

Now, this season is gonna be going a little deeper, a little bit more personal. Although I feel like we weren't really pretty personal last last season, too, but but you know, it's definitely gonna be a lot more chaotic this time around, and we're gonna be discussing some of the some of the drama that we dealt with this last year.

SPEAKER_02 1:09

Absolutely. And drama just seems to be the definition of our lives these days. Yes, it is. Um anyway.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

So today's episode is going to be called Life in Progress. We're talking about parenting, family life, ADHD, grace, frustration, and you know, just learning that sometimes growth doesn't happen and neat little steps.

SPEAKER_02 1:35

Yeah, sometimes it looks like stepping on Legos while trying to keep everyone emotionally stable.

SPEAKER_01 1:40

Yeah, and if you're a parent listening right now, you probably felt that on a spiritual level.

SPEAKER_02 1:46

Alright, so pull up a chair and let's get started. This is table for two.

SPEAKER_00 2:02

It's not about ladders, it's me and you. Serving the chain dumb and eight ones and jeans, last lines and calistans and holy routines. Pull up for chair will tell the truth. Love and faith with the side of previous real talk.

SPEAKER_01 2:22

So before we jump into the today's conversation to the today, JJ, um, let's lighten things up a bit first.

SPEAKER_02 2:31

Yeah. Um What is something you are absolutely convinced you would never do as a parent that you now do all the time?

SPEAKER_01 2:40

I think you know my answer.

SPEAKER_02 2:42

Yes, but I don't think those listeners know our answer to this story.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

Okay, so back when our oldest was born, we were very, or I was very adamant that we weren't going to let her have soda until like I think I I think our agreement was like when she started school, we'd let her have it occasionally. And by nine months, that went out the window because I was carrying her in from the car, and I had a McDonald's Coke in one hand, and she was on my hip, and I was holding the diaper bag in the other, and she was she leaned over and started chewing on my straw. Well, I got her inside, set her, set her down on the floor to play, and and I realized my my McDonald's cup is only half full, and I hadn't taken any drinks yet. Um, yeah, that little little nine-month-old girl drank half of my large McDonald's coke. And so the idea of no soda until they started school kind of went out the window at that point. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:57

But in all fairness, let's just let's just be honest with ourselves. My grandma was gonna ruin that long before we got to that point in the day.

SPEAKER_01 4:04

So because we we went and visited her shortly after that. And what did she do immediately?

SPEAKER_02 4:08

She filled Jaden's bottle full of Pepsi and then handed her a pop-tart.

SPEAKER_01 4:12

No, it was an Oreo. Or an Oreo. Yeah. And then Jaden followed her around like a lost puppy the rest of the time through there.

SPEAKER_02 4:18

Yeah. I think for me it was too. I always told myself I wasn't gonna be that sports dad. You know? I was gonna sit down and just let the coaches coach and do their thing. And now my kids aren't really that active in sports right now, but when they played baseball, softball, or even my Ben played flag football for a lot, I just couldn't sit down. Like I was more nervous watching them play than when I played. And in fairness too, like Ben's baseball coach, he was like, he's like them he was their school's PE teacher. Like I had full confidence in him as a coach. It was just okay, how can I help Ben be successful?

SPEAKER_01 4:59

But to be fair, you were invited onto the fields in those in those moments.

SPEAKER_02 5:04

Oh, that's true.

SPEAKER_01 5:05

Like you were asked to kind of be a backup assistant coach in in a few of those situations, and then invited to give input later on. So I don't know. I don't I don't think that was really you being the typical sports dad. It was you you were invited to be a voice.

SPEAKER_02 5:23

True. Nicole, I think you just got a text message. All right, now before we continue, just want you to know this. This is a new segment we're introducing for season two.

SPEAKER_01 5:37

So the messages you're about to hear are fictional. These are not real people, they're not based on any real family or any one real situation. Um, they're just inspired by struggles and conversations. Many families quietly navigate every day.

SPEAKER_02 5:53

And we're doing this, so maybe this conversation, conversation and quotation marks. Yes. I'm doing quotation marks and you can't see me doing it. But maybe these conversations can help you or help somebody you know, and they feel a little less alone in the situation.

SPEAKER_01 6:08

So So, okay, here is today's text message. And it's from Amber C. And she said, Hey Nicole, it's Amber from the park a few weeks ago. I need advice before my mother-in-law accidentally starts a spiritual war in my house. Oh snap. So apparently Sadie told her grandma that I let her watch K-pop Demon Hunters last weekend. Uh-oh.

SPEAKER_02 6:34

That's that's that could be bad.

SPEAKER_01 6:37

Now Linda is convinced I'm letting demons into the house through Netflix. She sent me three Facebook videos, told Sadie she needs to pray after watching these cartoons, and asked if I prayed over the television lately.

SPEAKER_02 6:49

As long as you anointed it too. I don't do that during Notre Dame season, though.

SPEAKER_01 6:54

Yeah, keep your sports out of this. Sadie cried before bed because now she thinks she accidentally invited evil spirits into the living room. I honestly don't even know what to say anymore. I know Linda means well, but I also don't want my kid terrified of everything all the time. What do I do? Okay, before we dive into this, I do want to reassure you that this is fictional.

SPEAKER_02 7:26

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

We would not be sharing private text messages or conversations with a pot with our podcast.

SPEAKER_02 7:32

Yes, but this this gives you an insight into how we operate when we receive your text messages a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 7:38

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 7:38

Um now we might be a little funnier because this is the podcast. Yes, these are fictional situations, so um, but but you so if there if you share a name with one of the characters, it's by pure coincidence.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

It's yeah. I can't even think of anybody off the top of my head named Amber.

SPEAKER_02 7:54

So Yes.

SPEAKER_01 7:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:55

Anyway, all right. So Wow, K-pop Demon Hunters. Maybe you should tell those who are listening what K-pop Demon Hunters is, because I could try and tell you, I've seen the movie three or four times, but but I'll be honest, when it comes to this K-pop stuff, I'm like a caveman.

SPEAKER_01 8:13

Okay. So K-pop Demon Hunters is a is a movie that came out on Netflix, I think it was earlier this year, right? Or like maybe late last year. I don't remember. But it it quickly gained traction with you know children and teens alike. Um basically the premise is there's these three young women who are who are k-pop stars, Korean pop stars, if you don't know what K-pop means.

SPEAKER_02 8:45

Yeah, I was gonna ask you if you can find that for people.

SPEAKER_01 8:47

Yeah, it's it's Korean pop stars, and they also hunt demons. Now, another thing I want to preface is the fact that demons in K Korean culture and demons in our Western Christianized culture are very different. I would say demons are more closely related to vampires in the Korean culture than they are like spiritual um creatures like they are in our culture. So it's not as big of a red flag as you would think. But um, but anyway, so they come in contact with like the this group of demons who are infiltrating the K-pop world and and are playing their songs to put like the world under a spell. And I'm not gonna get into any more details there, but basically it's the classic good versus evil story story line. And there's a really, really sweet and neat redemption arc in there as well.

SPEAKER_02 9:52

That's pretty good without giving away the story. Yeah, I'm not going to spoilers. Spoilers. Um, well, I think most of us as parents have kind of been in this situation before, or maybe as a kid with your own parents, you're in this. Like I remember I wasn't allowed to play with Pokemon cards or I wasn't allowed to watch Harry Potter. Yeah, so um what do we do with it? You know, what do we do with this? Like, you know, um one in this scenario, Amber doesn't go to our church. She's somebody new. And in the text message, she just met Nicole at the park.

SPEAKER_01 10:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:24

And um again, fictional.

SPEAKER_01 10:26

But it's not completely beyond the realm of possibilities. I have had people reach out to me that I've only met a time or two at the park.

SPEAKER_02 10:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:33

We've not about this.

SPEAKER_02 10:35

Yes. But so one, we can't assume that that Amber is a believer at this point. No. Nor is her daughter. It's possible. But maybe not. But even then. Um I think one of the issues we have is in the church culture right now is we are afraid of everything. Everything. Like the boogeyman is hiding behind every rock, behind every tree.

SPEAKER_01 11:01

And it's not the boogeyman, it's the devil.

SPEAKER_02 11:03

Yeah, yeah. Well. But we've we've we've reduced the devil to the boogeyman. Yeah. Right. Um so much so that we think he operates in pure black and white spheres. But he's way too clever for that. He's way too smart for that. So do you really think an I'm assuming 11-year-old kid, or whatever Sadie's age is? I was I forgot that part.

SPEAKER_01 11:30

Yeah, I don't think it mentions it. But she's old enough to really to like pop demon hunter. So my guess would be between eight and thirteen.

SPEAKER_02 11:37

Yeah. So she's she's watching this movie. Mom lets her watch it, not thinking it's a movie, right? Like, well, not thinking it's a bad movie. Yeah, she not think it's a bad movie. Uh be honest, my kids have watched it. Um their Aunt Ivy introduced them to it, which No. No.

SPEAKER_01 11:51

Aunt Ivy came to visit after they had already watched it. But she had already watched it like 15 times, too.

SPEAKER_02 11:57

So she was prepared. But if Aunt Ivy's listening to this, just knowing Aunt Ivy, this is a movie I would fully expect you to introduce my kids to, because that's what Aunt Ivy does.

SPEAKER_01 12:06

Um not that's not a bad thing. No.

SPEAKER_02 12:09

I was gonna make I kind of made it sound like a bad thing on purpose because I'd like to pick on people, but I don't really don't care.

SPEAKER_01 12:14

Aunt Ivy's a very good influence. She likes to challenge my children.

SPEAKER_02 12:17

Oh, but yeah, we've we've re reduced the the boogie the devil to this boogeyman that's based, you know, and we are afraid of these black and white imaginary things. Again, Pokemon cards are the same thing. It's imaginary, it's not real. It's a card game that kids play. Cards that they collect.

SPEAKER_03 12:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:37

Um there's no real harm in it. It's no different than reading Lord of the Rings or Um C. S. Lewis.

SPEAKER_01 12:44

And I would argue Lord of the Rings is probably worse because there's so much violence in it. But even then, like, it's not a bad like it there's there's age appropriate elements that like you have to you have to consider the age appropriateness, not not necessarily the spiritual side of things like this.

SPEAKER_02 13:04

Yes. So the the other side of this too is this is Amber's daughter. Not ours. And not Linda's. Not Linda's daughter, right? Like I get Linda might be upset by this and it might bother her. And I get I think Amber could have a conversation with Sadie's like, hey, let's not you know like there are some things that we don't necessarily talk about. Yeah, because you don't want to be a stumbling block to somebody else either. Um so you can have a conversation that way, but at the same time too, like one here's the hard part of parenting and really dealing with people in general, is everybody has free will.

SPEAKER_01 13:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:44

God gave us free will and he lets us make choices with our free will.

SPEAKER_01 13:51

Yeah. Now I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of pull from my history here. Okay. So if Amber were to go full scorched earth on K-pop Demon Hunters and do what Linda wants her to do, Sadie's gonna rebel. Now, she might not do it right away. She might think, okay, mom's got the best out, got the best in mind for me, but overall, she's gonna be like, what's the real big deal about this? And that happened with me with Harry Potter. Okay. I I sat and listened to Harry Potter be read in my fourth grade classroom. Two of the books. And then by the time the third one came out and my teacher was gonna read it, my mom had decided that Harry Potter was Do not disturb.

SPEAKER_03 14:43

Sorry.

SPEAKER_01 14:44

Um my mom had decided that at that point Harry Potter was evil and witchcraft was evil, and I mean, there's an element to of truth to that, but this wasn't real witchcraft for one thing. It was fiction. And she wrote to my school and told them that I was not allowed to listen to the book being read. I couldn't, I couldn't check out the book from the library, I couldn't like anything Harry Potter related, I was not allowed to participate. So I ended up sitting out in the hallway every day when Harry Potter got read to the class. And I was obedient that first year. Because again, I believed the best.

SPEAKER_03 15:27

Right.

SPEAKER_01 15:29

But as my friends were listening to it be read and everything, they were getting all these lessons about, you know, finding the good in situations and and forgiveness and endurance and persistence and all these things that I was missing out on because they were listening to a book that had that content. And and they weren't getting these lessons about, oh, let's participate in, you know, Ouija boards and all this stuff that my mom was afraid of. They were learning how to be better human beings.

SPEAKER_03 16:05

Right.

SPEAKER_01 16:06

And and so I was missing out on it. And then I was also starting to wonder what's really the big deal about all this.

SPEAKER_03 16:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

And it didn't make sense to me. So instead of it, instead of my mom squashing any interest I had in it, it created a deeper interest that I like when I was old enough and moved out, like I literally binge watched the whole series. I read all the books, I I was into it because I was like, what's wrong with this? And yes, the last couple of books get dark, but as with anything, it like any any good versus evil battle, there has to be a point where you think that that good has lost. Yeah, it's kind of the climactic ending, and you you feel like so defeated, and and it brings you in, and then all of a sudden good triumphs. And I was like, isn't that the message that we should receive that that even in the darkest moments that good is gonna win?

SPEAKER_03 17:13

Right.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

And and so it was one of those things where my mom thought she was squashing my interest in, instead, she just enticed me more, and I think that would happen here, but it wouldn't be something that her mom could safely interact with her when you know, as she's diving in, because she's gonna feel like I can't talk to mom about this, I can't talk to grandma about this, I have to keep this hidden, and so she's gonna have to navigate those questions by herself, yeah. Poor little Sadie, who's preteen at oldest right now, and she's gonna be navigating those questions by herself and hiding it from mom and especially from grandma. And so my my advice to mom would be participate with her, take an interest, understand what it is about the movie that she is attracted to that she likes. If it's the music, take an interest. If it's if it's the plot line, because it's a really good plot line, um, take an interest and talk with her about it, help her navigate it so that way she's not picking up the the scary demonic elements and focusing on on that. She's instead focusing in on the positive and the good. And and isn't that what the Bible says for us to do to focus on whatever is true and whatever is worthy and whatever is, you know, like that's what we're supposed to do. We're not supposed to shut out the bad, we're just supposed to focus on the good.

SPEAKER_02 18:49

Right. So if we you're responding to Amber, what would your text message say?

SPEAKER_01 18:54

If I were responding to Amber, first off, I'd be like, your mom, not Linda. I would set if I were you, I would set a clear boundary with Linda that she is not Sadie's mom, you are. And you are within every right to do that. And if she keeps crossing that line, there needs to be there needs to be consequences there. Now, in regard to Sadie, let her be Sadie.

SPEAKER_03 19:24

Right.

SPEAKER_01 19:25

If she has these interests, let her have those interests and be a participant so that way you can help her navigate. Because it like that show really encouraged my oldest or our oldest to to get into the K-pop scene, and now she's like obsessed with several different bands. But there's some not so great bands out there, yeah. And so if you take an interest, you can help steer Sadie in the direction of positive influences in the K-pop scene as opposed to the negative ones. And but if you insist that she can't be involved in this at all, she's gonna sneak.

SPEAKER_03 20:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:08

And it's gonna close a door. She's gonna put up a wall between you and her, and there's gonna be secrets. Yeah. Don't don't let there be secrets.

SPEAKER_02 20:16

It's kind of like um, I told you about Pokemon and Harry Potter as that when I was a kid. Now, I was not into those things. So I was like, okay, mom, you know, like no big deal. But I was also not allowed to play with guns, like anything that resembled a gun. I couldn't play with squirt guns, I couldn't play video games with guns in them. But every time I would go to a to a friend's house to play video games, you know, the big game at the time was James Bond, GoldenEye 007. And we played it almost every time I was over there, you know. So um I wasn't supposed to.

SPEAKER_01 20:45

But you snuck snuck it because I didn't see anything wrong with it.

SPEAKER_02 20:48

It was a video game.

SPEAKER_01 20:49

Exactly. And it was one of those things where you you couldn't do it at home, so you'd go somewhere else. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 20:56

So all right, well, that's kind of what these are gonna be like. Um, matter of fact, we're not gonna change families throughout the season. We're gonna focus on this one. So if you're curious where this goes goes from here next, tune in next time. But I guess we're ready for our main content. Um this episode's called Life in Progress. And I guess maybe we should just tell them what's going on with our family. Uh, what changes have happened in the last year. And I feel like there's been a lot that's happened in the last year.

SPEAKER_01 21:23

So much has changed. You want to start? Because I don't even know where to start.

SPEAKER_02 21:29

Well, I think I'm most, you know, I'm other my my as on me personally, I feel like it's not really changed a whole lot, other than, you know, I'm I've become more of a children's pastor than I've ever expected to be. Um getting ready to put my youth pastor hat back on and try and get our youth group going here again. Yeah. Because the kids group is we have kids aging out, getting ready to age into it. Not just my kids, but community kids. And I'm loving every moment of it though. Like I'm definitely more, you know, when I was a youth pastor before, I was more of the big brother than ever wanted. Um you're definitely more like. Like dad. More like dad. Or uncle Jason. Uncle Jason, or yeah. So it's been it's been a big shift on my part, but I think I'm ready to navigate that. So um yeah. Tell them what's new to you, and then we'll get into what's going on with the kids.

SPEAKER_01 22:12

Well, I've been teaching full time at a Christian school in Mount Sterling, and it's been amazing. Um by the way, if you live anywhere near Mount Sterling and and you want to send your kid to a Christian school that you know is you know small and intimate and but like allows them to still be kids, Christian traditional school is a great option. Um they're not paying me to say that. I just work there and I I love it.

SPEAKER_02 22:41

Um we have no we have no um sponsors for this show.

SPEAKER_01 22:45

No. But um but you know, I I don't know much about the elementary side, but I've been I'm at the middle school and the the administrator is amazing, the my other teachers that work there are amazing, the kids are amazing. Um it's just been really a phenomenal, a phenomenal experience. Um and and definitely just something that's like helped boosted my my confidence um as a both a teacher and a pastor, even. Um but it was also a lifesaver this year.

SPEAKER_02 23:21

Yes, and we'll get into why part of this too, like I know at the end of last season we talked about having special episodes. Um this I'm talking to you listeners. Um we were gonna do some special podcast episodes for a bit some crazy life stuff happened and it really kind of threw us for a loop. Threw us for a loop. And we're in some ways we're like still scrambling a little bit? Yeah, scrambling some, but life life is good. God's brought us through it, but boy, it was it was dark there for a while. Um so I guess we'll just start. Like, so our son Ben, he's turned 10 in this last November, so he'll be 11 this year.

SPEAKER_01 23:55

And he helped us close the season last year. And yeah, he, you know, his little random ramblings. Um, but you know, he has those moments where like he just rambles and it's a sign of his ADHD, which up until this year has been unofficial. He he didn't officially he wasn't officially diagnosed, but we could see it.

SPEAKER_02 24:18

And he's still not a um he has he has actually an appointment this week. Yeah. And they have all the tests, the test work back. If you've been through this process, you you probably know what we're doing. But he has it. Um But we're just gonna kind of share with you that journey this year because it they they had some scary moments. Yeah. Um so for starters, it's Nicole's teaching now, that's 40 minutes from where we are. Yeah. Um and so I'm working part-time in a funeral home, and I'm running, you know, pastoring this church. And um I started off, Ben would have these episodes at school. He'd have freak outs, he'd have full-blown meltdowns. Um, and the school would call me and I'd have to come and get him and bring him home. Now there was some bullying aspect to this too, and some of it was other kids toward Ben, and some of it was mutual Ben was bullying them back. Which that that that's a whole nother discussion for another time.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

Yeah. But there was one day in particular that scared the living daylights out of out of both of us.

SPEAKER_02 25:14

Um the school late the the school counselor too.

SPEAKER_01 25:17

My administrator rushed into into my classroom and he said, You need to call Jason right now. And like he was he was pale. Jason, tell tell them what what you heard.

SPEAKER_02 25:34

So basically, I go in there and um or basically basically I get a call from the school and Ben had just gotten his class from lunch from breakfast. Uh my kids ride the bus rode the bus to school, still ride the bus school, and um they feed him breakfast. Well, Ben got breakfast, got done with breakfast, went to his classroom, and the teacher says he just got this blank look on his face. Um was kind of unresponsive to people, you know, and and when he did kind of come back to you, he didn't know what his name was, didn't know where he was at. Why he was there, why he was or what was going on. So he was having a full-on panic attack, too, because he's nine years old at the time, and this is scary stuff. And so they call me and he's already in the ambulance on the way to the emergency room. And so I'm like going through all you know, that I'm going through the worst case scenario, like he's having a he could be having a stroke, like did he hit his head on something? Did he eat something he wasn't supposed to? And again, he rides the bus. Did something happen? Did some kid on the bus give him something? Which again, they have my kids have the best bus driver bus aid in the world. Um But we were we were worried. It really scared us to death.

SPEAKER_01 26:43

And so um My boss sent me home right away. He's like, I will cover your class.

SPEAKER_02 26:48

It turned out like he they thought he maybe they they they they weren't sure that they thought maybe he had like a an absence seizure, but they couldn't prove that. Um and then at the same time, too, they thought maybe a little bit of diet dehydration because I did give him an IV and that brought him back around. Well, we thought that was the end of it, things would get pick or pick up from there, but it didn't. It was about another month of constantly being called into the school. And again, I know I got frustrated with the with the school guidance counselor, the principal, any of the teachers at point, um, some points, but I did my best to be professional and polite because I also knew too part of it was it would um if you've been through this, it you're looking to be angry at somebody and you're looking to blame somebody. And I I knew I'm I'm self-aware enough to know that's what I was trying to do. And it wasn't their fault. And I didn't because I didn't want to blame Ben because it wasn't Ben's fault either. Ben was experiencing something and he needed help and he was crying for help, whether he was verbally saying that or not.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

Yeah, and at this point, he was he had gotten to the point where he no longer felt safe at the school. It wasn't because of the teachers, and honestly, I wouldn't even blame the students for this. By that point, like his experience with like way, like not knowing where he was, it has scared him to the point that he would he was not going to respond to him.

SPEAKER_02 28:04

He was making comments about self-harm and things that he would never to the point like I have a I have a 12 gauge and I had to give it to it give it to a church member to hold on to. Like I didn't sell it, I still have it's still mine, but it's at his house.

SPEAKER_01 28:18

And uh in his safe.

SPEAKER_02 28:19

Yeah. Um and he Ben but Ben started making these threats at school. It kind of forces the school's hand when that stuff happens. And thankful, rightfully so, and I'm I'm still grateful that our school system took it seriously. They didn't sweep it on the road, they didn't pretend that you know he's he's he's just he's nine-year-old, he's gonna be fine. Like uh they they tried to help us get him help, and uh he ended up in a place in Lexington uh where he had to stay a couple days um to try and help get medicine figured out, get what get figured out what was going on in his mind. And it I'll tell you what, as a parent, that was one of the hardest things we've ever had to do.

SPEAKER_01 28:52

Yeah, because we didn't even know when he was gonna be able to come home.

SPEAKER_02 28:55

Yeah. Uh and when you drop when you drop him, he's crying, he wants to go home. But you know that's not the right thing. Um and then even getting to call him the next night. You know, we gotta call him on the phone, and he we still didn't have a timetable to give him because they hadn't given us one, and he's trying to figure out when he's coming home and getting his routines all everything's all messed up, and we just and the one thing I kept telling Ben over and over again was Ben, the fastest way through it, the fastest way to deal with this is through it. It's not gonna be fun, it's not gonna be pleasant, but you're gonna have you I trust me, we get through this, we can there's you're gonna see a lot of people are trying to help you. And so he gets out of there, he's there for three or four days, um and he comes home. And but we realized he's not gonna thrive in the school environment that he was in. As much as Estelle Springs tried to help and tried to communicate, I probably shouldn't have dropped the school's name, but as much as they tried to do the right thing.

SPEAKER_01 30:00

He just he was at a mental state where he could not go back.

SPEAKER_02 30:05

Yeah. And partially so too. I like if put yourself in that nine-year-old boy's shoes, you've had all these episodes. It's embarrassing. Yeah. Um you don't know who you're still trying to figure out who you are and what you're dealing and trying to understand what you're dealing with at that age. And then meanwhile, you got the kids around you that are like what's what happened to you? Scared and upset the teachers. So we just felt it was best to get him out of that environment. And that's where Nicole's school came in handy, or came in as a godsend, it was a blessing in disguise. Like the whole the whole fact that she ended up at the school was a blessing.

SPEAKER_01 30:39

So um, but yeah, so I was able to talk with my administrator through the whole process. He was super understanding. And when I asked him if we could bring Ben to the school, he he didn't even hesitate. He's like, absolutely. Um, so you know, Ben Ben started coming with me to school the last or you know, the final three quarters of the school year. Um, and you know, it was it was still really rough going. Yeah. Like the first nine weeks he was there, it was almost constant calls home and and trying like he would come into my room in the middle of me teaching because of a meltdown.

SPEAKER_02 31:25

Yeah, and so he was happening to relearn who he how to handle his own emotions at that point. And at the same time, too, he he's in a new school, new people. Now the crowd the the classroom sizes were small.

SPEAKER_01 31:37

Yeah, it was it's 11 to 1.

SPEAKER_02 31:39

Yeah. But he um he was it was a struggle. But I did tell him, sit down and tell him, like, yo, Ben, I'm not worried about your grades right now. We gotta get you feeling safe first. But now, with that being said, we did have to have a hard come to Jesus meeting at one point, though, because Ben had you know, kids are gonna be kids. And if kids don't like school and they don't be at school, they're gonna figure out ways to be out of school. And so Ben had kind of picked up too of okay, if I throw a big enough fit, I'll gotta go home.

SPEAKER_01 32:06

Or if I say I don't feel good.

SPEAKER_02 32:08

If I don't say if I don't feel good, I'll give you home. And so finally I had to sit him down and just tell him, listen, Ben, I love you. No matter what you do, I'm gonna love you. You're my son, I'm I'm always gonna be proud of you. You don't have to earn that.

SPEAKER_01 32:21

Like But if you come home early in the middle of the day again, you're not getting your phone back.

SPEAKER_02 32:29

You're losing the phone. But at the same time, too, I also tell him, like, look, there is no scenario in this world where you're not going to school. Like, school's this is what you have to do for right now. And just like before, the the fastest way to deal with this is through it, not around it. So you're gonna have to figure this out. Um, and so slowly, again, through Nicole, through um Miss McCaffrey, his teacher, and Mr. You know, Mr. Hess, the administrator there, Ben started turning around. Um got to where he felt safe, and so then it became time to start focusing in on his grades. And that was a whole nother adventure.

SPEAKER_01 33:10

His second quarter at the school, he did all of his work, but he never turned any of it in.

SPEAKER_02 33:14

Yeah, now that first quarter he had a bunch of Fs, and I told him you're gonna have to you know buckle down and get your homework done. So we started making sure he was doing his homework, you know, because again, he started he was starting to feel safe. Again, homework is not I'm just gonna say this the homework is not as important as what the child is feeling.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:28

Because until Ben felt safe with who he was and in the environment he was in, he wasn't gonna be able to do schoolwork or turn in quality work. Um we you know we pushed him some, but not hard. But when the second quarter rolls around, again, he was in a different spot. And so we we started making sure he was doing his homework, getting it in. Well, doing his homework. We didn't make sure he was turning it in.

SPEAKER_01 33:50

I I kind of figured that was gonna be self-explanatory, but apparently not.

SPEAKER_02 33:54

But he would come home every night and he would do his homework for like an hour, but he wouldn't turn it in.

SPEAKER_03 33:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:58

And like, and so he we were very surprised at the end of that quarter where he got his report card back, and we're like, Ben, why? He's not turning his homework in.

SPEAKER_01 34:10

Oh, why would you do all the work and not turn your homework in, child? Yeah, like three of his NTI packets that I know he did because I helped him, I helped him on a few of the questions. He never turned in, and I was like, boy, what are you doing? Um, but it was it was the same way with his reading logs and pretty much all of his homework. He just wasn't doing it. Um, but then we had another conversation with him, and we're just like, you gotta turn stuff in. If you have any missing work, there's gonna be consequences this final quarter. And this final quarter, he didn't have any missing work.

SPEAKER_02 34:48

No, he turned his homework in and he did the best he could.

SPEAKER_03 34:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 34:53

Now I'm not gonna sit here and pretend that he was a straight A student, but one of the things I did tell him was like, Ben, I'm not expecting you to be a straight A student. What I'm expecting you to do is your best.

SPEAKER_01 35:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:01

I'm expecting you to try.

SPEAKER_01 35:02

And I'll say this. Um, so the way our school works is at the end of the at the end of the year, the students will get their fourth quarter grade and then they'll get their cumulative grade, which is all four quarters combined into one. And so again, Ben wasn't here for the first quarter. And then his first nine weeks, he failed everything but Bible art and um MPE. And that was those are the only things that he didn't fail. And then the third nine weeks he he had five Fs.

SPEAKER_03 35:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:45

Well, he brought everything up enough for the cumulative score that he only had three high F's that final like for his cumulative score. So I was pretty proud of that. And and he worked really hard. He worked really hard, and I was so proud of him for that. And and the the areas where he was struggling, he was struggling before. Um, it was math and handwriting and reading comprehension. So we're gonna be working on that this summer, but I'm very proud of him that he he was able to boost his his cumulative scores up enough to where he was really within like a fraction of a of a percentage.

SPEAKER_02 36:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:25

Um yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:26

But now again, I'll I'll be honest, there were times this school year where I was so frustrated. Like, because one, you feel like you're failing as a parent. You're feeling like the school isn't listening to you. Um but again, what helped me was again stopping and realizing one, the school is dealing with 30 other children just in that class, not just your child. Yeah. That that perspective really helps. They're doing the best they can with the people that they have that that are doing the best they can. I firmly believe that, I firmly believe they cared. Um so you know, when I those moments where I was discouraged a little bit with or or frustrated at them, I I you know the Lord always helped me remember that. But I know for myself, again, it was like, man, what am I doing wrong as dad? Yeah, how how do I how do I help him? Um again, you know, so many of us, we were we were raised in that moment. We, you know, you know, all kinds of groundings, taking things away, yelling, screaming, uh spankings, spankings and stuff like that now. But that really the grade wasn't the issue. It was even when he he came home and he had the 5,000, the grade wasn't the issue. The issue was, again, Ben had to feel safe first.

SPEAKER_03 37:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:49

And then he also had to understand that, okay, my love for you, the way I feel about you as my son is not tied to performance. I'm gonna be in your corner no matter what. Um and I think that I do think that helped. I think that went a long way. I think as a parent, you know, we when we have to give ourselves grace, be gracious toward ourselves when we are going through when we're going through those hard moments like that. Be gracious as you're parenting together, yeah, you know. Um It's hard. And when when you you might get a little snippety with each other through it at times. But understand that's not it's not it's frustrations coming out. It's not animosity or hatred. And not even hatred, you know, if you're again there were times where I wanted to take Ben just smack him outside the head.

SPEAKER_01 38:43

But really, it was the situation, it wasn't Ben.

SPEAKER_02 38:47

Um I just I chose to show him that I believed in him. Yeah. Um so again, am I do I wish his grades were right? Absolutely. I think he's way too smart for any of those things to be where he's at with that. But given the circumstances where he started this year and where he finished it, the Lord really helped him. Um so again, give give you know give yourself grace as a parent. Give yourself give your kid grace. Uh most of again, it's not per they should know that your love for them is not based on their performance, not based on what they do or they don't do. Right? That we don't it's that's that way with God. We don't earn God's love. We don't earn his grace. He just gives it to us. And he's again, he's the one that gave us free will, and we do whatever we want, that free will to and some how many times do you think we hurt him or frustrate him or with the things that we do?

SPEAKER_03 39:44

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 39:45

But each and every but he's always there to love us, guide us, correct us, offer grace to us when we seek him out. Not just you know, um and so we that's kind of we have to have that kind of love for our kids as we're parenting. Um being ready to come alongside them and walk with them in those moments. Uh even those low moments. Uh because that's what helps them learn to keep going and not give up. So I kind of kind of like into this. Um I was mostly you know I was in the military. I was you know Army National Guard for Indiana Combat Medic. And so that means I had to do my medic training in Fort Sam Houston, Texas. And I push-ups were always my worst event, you know, because you you know you can PT test, you had to do two minutes of push-up, two minutes of sit-ups, two-mile run. Well, the two-mile run was my specialty. Like I could I could do that one really well. Except for near the end of medic training, I we were doing what's called the eight-count push-up. And burpees, for those of maybe that's more of a term that most of you recognize, but there's a moment where you have to like you start standing and you drop down to the push-up position, right? And you kick your legs out. Well, I went to kick my leg back and I felt something my leg pull and pop. And it hurt really bad. And I all I know is my my runtime dropped by two minutes.

SPEAKER_03 41:09

Oh no.

SPEAKER_02 41:10

I was like thirty, like my lot like my fastest two-mile was 13 flat. It dropped to 15 almost immediately. And I remember though, that last two-mile ran, I was ready to quit. I was ready to give up. But our first sergeant, who didn't know me from Adam, you know, I'm gonna pretend he did. It's like five o'clock in the morning, but he's standing at the finish like, hey, keep going, don't quit, don't quit, keep going. And there's that little bit of encouragement. I'm not gonna say I ran faster, but it encouraged me not to quit and keep going a little bit further. And if we if if we can learn to do that for our kids, imagine and just show a little bit of belief mixed with the love, watch what they'll do.

SPEAKER_01 41:56

Now, we have two other children, not just Ben.

SPEAKER_03 42:00

We do.

SPEAKER_01 42:01

Um, and and honestly, this year's been kind of challenging for them as well because we've had to focus a lot on Ben.

SPEAKER_02 42:09

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 42:09

And so we've seen some behaviors coming out on Emiris's side where she's, you know, kind of being a little turd nugget sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 42:17

And she has an ability to be able to read and understand people.

SPEAKER_01 42:21

And she knows how to push buttons.

SPEAKER_02 42:23

Yes, and right, so right now she uses her newfound knowledge for evil. Um but we're we're working with her on it.

SPEAKER_01 42:31

And then and then Jaden, you know, she's you know, a middle schooler and she's she had her heart broken this year. Um and and then she's been dealing with like she's trying to navigate having healthy boundaries with friends and and you know, trying to trying to still be a good a good um role model for her friends, but also like not super snob snobby or snooty about it. She's and she's she's doing so well, but you know, during during our time where we were having to focus so much on Ben, you know, you could see her suffering.

SPEAKER_02 43:09

Yeah, because Jaden's very much a child that her love language is words of affirmation. Um matter of fact, one of my favorite videos of Jaden, she's like two, and we're at this park in c Littleton, Colorado, and she would go down the slide and get them go, drill Jaden, then clap her hands, you know, and because that's what mommy and daddy would do when she would just go down the slide or do something like that. And so that's her love language, is words of affirmation. And but again, we are so focused on Ben that she wasn't hearing as much of that as she was before.

SPEAKER_01 43:37

Well, and even when she was hearing it, she wasn't seeing it as much.

SPEAKER_02 43:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:41

And so it was it was a trying time for our our girls. And um, so now, you know, Jaden, I think I think that's part of her reason for her decision. But she's wanting to she's wanting to go to school with me next year so that way we get some more one on one time. And Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:00

And uh Yeah, and we've made really made a point. Like one of the things that we've lost over the last year for a period was we have always been a family that sat down at the dinner table together. And that kind of disappeared for a while.

SPEAKER_03 44:13

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 44:13

Because there was just so much happening. And you know, keep in mind, you know, it's life. You know, you've all I'm sure you're listening, you've been there. Um and but here really the last you know, since the start of the new year, I've really made it a point, and Nicole's made it a point that we're gonna sit down at the dinner table and eat together.

SPEAKER_03 44:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:30

And sometimes just that helps. Giving your kids that chance to sit down, there's no distractions, you're all paying attention, you know, nobody's allowed to have their phone with our phones are nearby. But I'm not gonna pretend they're not, but uh we're not playing on our phones, we're just family time. Family time, we're there together. Um, so yeah, find those little things helped.

SPEAKER_03 44:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:56

So again, life, you know, grace meets people in progress. And if he God's grace meets us when we're in progress as a person, he meets our families as we're in progress, too. Um, you know, whatever battle comes your way, you're gonna have to face it together. And just like I told Ben, the fastest way is not around it, it's not pretending it doesn't exist, it's not sticking your head in the sand, it's it's through it's through it.

SPEAKER_01 45:23

And and you know, our family's messy. We're pastors, and our family's messy. So if you're looking at your family and you're like, hey, my family's messy, it's okay. Yeah, we get it.

SPEAKER_02 45:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:39

Again, like you know, we we talk to people all the time, people are asking us for advice. I have parents of my students asking me for advice on how to deal with their kids, and I'm I'm just like, if you knew, you would have you wouldn't be asking me. But but here's the thing everybody's family is messy, and we need to stop trying to hide it and start recognizing that every family is a work in progress, every family is going through stuff, and and it doesn't matter if you are a new a new family with an infant or even no kids at all, you're a work in progress. And it doesn't and if you're 80 years old and your children are grown and they and you have grandchildren, guess what? You're still a work in progress. You're your kids are still dealing with stuff, you're still dealing with stuff, your grandkids are dealing with stuff, and it's okay that you're messy.

SPEAKER_02 46:33

Yes. Yes, and whatever, like there's no so many times we look at ourselves and think, this is where I should be.

SPEAKER_01 46:43

There's no should be.

SPEAKER_02 46:45

But remember what Gesus is uh was it in Matthew 7, do not judge or you two will be judged for the measure you used will be used against you. That's what he's talking about. We're measuring things by our standards or worldly standards or somebody else's standards. We're doing it by Linda's standard, like hey, Sadie shouldn't be watching that movie. But the reality of it is that's not God's standard. Stop it. Let go of that standard and let just be where you're at. Grow in the moment that you're in.

SPEAKER_03 47:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:18

Because God's not gonna give you a new lesson until you've learned that one.

SPEAKER_01 47:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:22

Uh isn't so trust Him through it.

SPEAKER_01 47:25

Yeah. Learn to adapt. It's okay that everything isn't where you want it to be right now. And the main thing is if you're a parent, you're loving your kids. That's right. Like that's that's one one thing that I am so appreciative about this whole situation, this whole year, is the fact that Ben never doubted that we loved him. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:53

And beyond that, we had a church family that didn't look at Ben and say, This is a bad kid, or kid that they loved him and they loved us. Yes. Uh, we were very fortunate that we were surrounded by a church that genuinely loves our kids. And we're there for them. Yes. And there for us. Did whatever we needed them to do. And that goes a long way. So if you're maybe you're not a parent in that situation, or maybe your grandparent listened to this. Maybe the most loving thing you can do, maybe you're just a generic church member, you don't have any kids involved in the say whatever. The best thing you can do is love the families and love their kids right where they're at, as messy as they are. Because sometimes that's what they need. They just need somebody that loves them for them.

SPEAKER_03 48:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:40

Yeah. So I I guess that's it um for our year, right? Yeah. So uh like that was that was the highlight. I'm not sure that's a great highlight, but it it covered it. And so, you know, hey, you know, thank you. Thank you for listening to us share our year.

SPEAKER_02 49:07

Yes, coming back for season two.

SPEAKER_01 49:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 49:10

Uh, but we're really excited for the conversations that we're gonna have this season. Some of them are gonna be funny, some are gonna be difficult, and some that are gonna be really close to home.

SPEAKER_01 49:19

And so, you know, if today's episode encouraged you, made you laugh, or, you know, reminded you that you're not alone in the in the mess of everything, we'd love for you to share it, you know, with with us or with someone else. Uh just it's important that we that we're honest about our struggles.

SPEAKER_02 49:39

That's right. And if you've ever had a weird church parenting or family moment, trust us. Uh, we probably understand more than you think. All right.

SPEAKER_01 49:49

And we'd love to hear those stories.

SPEAKER_02 49:51

Yes. Uh, until next time.

SPEAKER_01 49:53

Grace and peace to you in the name of Jesus.

SPEAKER_00 50:01

Our life's held together by grace and a few hugs. Stay set, cheese up, miss we said, oh two. It's not about matters, it's me and you. Serving the kingdom and eight for ten games. Last lines and cowards and all the routines. Love it, face with the side of face, fill, side, two.