#9: ...the Workin's Work

Part Two: Prayer & Mission

Happy feast of St. Joseph, the worker! Go do some work!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:04

The work within our vocations. Um, really, like it really is work for the people.

SPEAKER_02 0:11

The threefold responsibility of the church, and therefore all Christians, um, proclaiming the word, you know, like the charigma and and like proclaiming the gospel, the sacraments, um, so liturgy, and then charity, you know, the service.

SPEAKER_01 0:26

Really, we're invited every day to set aside time. And and this is when people had to work all day, every day. They had to work for their food, their shelter, everything. And here we have things just delivered to our door from Amazon in 20 minutes, and we can't find time to pray somehow. What's the point of all the technology if we're not making time to pray?

SPEAKER_02 0:51

Okay. Welcome to part two of working while the workings work.

SPEAKER_00 0:56

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 0:58

Last time it was so long ago. It was we uh we ended, we talked a lot about work, we talked about the Olympics, we talked about sex unexpectedly. Um, but that's great. And we ended kind of with this definition of uh we're kind of roundabout way of talking about work, which pointed us to liturgy, which the catechism defines uh liturgy as the um participation of the people of God in the work of God. So, Father Copson, if you're listening to my podcast, you know I've been studying for my midterm. So, yeah, because I'm taking this liturgy and sacraments class right now at Sacred Heart Seminary, and he's uh he's my professor. So I don't think he listens to this podcast. I mean, I'll recommend it to him. Like, hey, I mentioned you.

SPEAKER_01 1:47

Little shout out.

SPEAKER_02 1:48

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:49

Yeah, yeah. So that's there the by definition what liturgy means.

SPEAKER_00 1:55

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:55

Because I've always had this understanding that liturgy is like work. You know, that's some I probably heard it like in a homily or something somewhere. It's like the work of the church or something like that. It was kind of like the way that I understood it. Um, or the or the work wait, I would say it again. Say your definition.

SPEAKER_02 2:08

The participation of the people of God in the work of God. Another definition, I don't know if it's in if the catechism mentions it, I can't remember, but is the the church's uh the public worship of the church. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

So worship, work what does the word liturgy literally mean?

SPEAKER_02 2:28

Liturgia?

SPEAKER_01 2:29

Like where does it come from?

SPEAKER_02 2:30

I don't know. Probably work.

SPEAKER_01 2:32

That's a good question. We'll have to look that up later. We'll come back to that later. I love definitions of words. Yeah, but yeah, so liturgy. So liturgy being we we we talked about this a little bit before, I think, didn't we, when we talked about like rituals and stuff. Yeah, yeah, but like liturgy specifically being like you've got I I'm yeah the Mass, you've got different prayers. Uh yeah, so I remember reading a book about the liturgy before. This is a while ago. It's probably something super famous that I um it might be that book that you have there. Um where it talking about the spirit of the liturgy? Yeah, is there is there multiple parts to that? This is two books. Yeah, yeah. Is it and there's one by Ratzinger and one by somebody else, right?

SPEAKER_02 3:15

Father Romano Gardini. Yes. Yes, okay, this is one of my textbooks.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

I have read this book.

SPEAKER_02 3:19

Oh wow, it's a great book. I'm gonna reference it later.

SPEAKER_01 3:22

See, it was coming into my mind and manifesting, and then there I saw it. It was so strange, yes. Um that I was kind of surprised to learn that liturgy wasn't just like the mass. Okay, so I have a definition. There's another book. Okay, give me the definition, and then I'm gonna come back to liturgy.

SPEAKER_02 3:38

This is for Wikipedia, the ultimate source of all knowledge, divinely inspired. I'm just kidding. The word liturgy, derived from the technical term in ancient Greek, some Greek word, liturgia, which means work or service for the people.

SPEAKER_01 3:53

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 3:53

Work or service for the people. So earlier we were talking about service.

SPEAKER_01 3:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:57

So liturgy and service, it's all intertwined.

SPEAKER_01 4:00

Yeah, yeah. Well, and we kind of finished that up talking about marriage too, right? That like our the work within our vocations, um, really like it really is work for the people. Um, especially if we're thinking of like the sacrament of matrimony is one of the sacraments of service.

SPEAKER_02 4:16

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 4:16

And as you had informed me, which I didn't know that the full title was Sacraments of Service like for the world or for what what was this is something you learned in marriage prep. I remember that maybe it was Alyssa that told me this.

SPEAKER_02 4:27

Well, I don't know if that's the full title, but something in a very enlightening moment of marriage prep uh with our our priest Father Matt, shout out to him, was when he said, like m a lot of people think that the point of marriage, as a Catholic even, and I was going into this thinking that that the point of marriage is to get your spouse to heaven, right? This is a pretty common understanding. But what he said is that's wrong. No. Um it's a it is a goal, but the goal is to you and your spouse together to get everyone around you to heaven, and that's why it's a sacrament of service.

unknown 5:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:03

Similar to a holy orders, which you know, a priest and bishop and deacons, like their job is to get their their um flock, congregation, their flock to heaven. Like that's their job. That's their these are the people entrusted to me at this moment in time. I'm gonna get the people of this parish to heaven.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

So really these vocations, these two vocations are complementary in that both of them, like both matrimony and holy orders, are these sacraments of service for the for the sake of the others around you. Right. And the way that you do it is going to be different in that gift of self versus like, you know, husband and wife versus a priest who's giving himself to the church, that there's like a different way that it's lived out, but the goal is the same.

SPEAKER_02 5:44

So if you think of how the liturgy of holy orders is the mass, right? The church, the public worship of the church is that's our primary, that's the highest form of liturgy is the mass. So it's uh right, we're looking at this, it's similar but not the same in terms of so marriage, the sacrament of marriage, what's the liturgy of marriage?

SPEAKER_01 6:08

Marriage.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

Like I I w Okay. Well, that's the sacrament. So the sacrament of holy orders, I it I would argue that it's the marital union, right? Okay.

SPEAKER_01 6:17

So it's the git like I mean that's the sacramental sign of marriage. Right.

SPEAKER_02 6:21

So it's like That's why I said marriage. And the parallel, right? Like we have the Eucharist, this is my body, this is my blood, right? And then in the marital embrace, you know, this is my body given up for you. So there's that parallel there. So we see that in the life of the church and in the life of, you know, the domestic church, our marriages and families, that there's there's parallels in what how we liturgize, how we how we worship, you know, how we participate in the work of God.

SPEAKER_01 6:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:51

And you didn't expect me to be. Start talking now.

SPEAKER_01 6:57

But but in that liturgy, you know, I like because I had just, you know, I said a few minutes ago that liturgy, like I first was thinking of it just as the Mass. Like, you know, to the liturgy, right? The liturgy, yeah. But we have our liturgical seasons, and um, I'm trying to think of the title of the book that I read. It was um a long time ago. It wasn't Spirit of the Liturgy, but it was another book about liturgy, and that was the first time that I had read the idea that the main liturgy of the church is the liturgy of the hours. That that's the that's what holds the church together. It's not the sacrifice of the mass every day. It's it like I mean, that is yeah, that is, but like the liturgy of the hours, that we have priests and religious around the world praying the liturgy of the hours every day, that is what is keeping the church going.

SPEAKER_02 7:39

So I love the liturgy of the hours, and I don't always pray it and I feel bad, and I don't pray to the city. Liturgy and personality.

SPEAKER_01 7:47

That's what it's called. Liturgy and personality.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Oh, that sounds like a it's a good book. So in in referencing the importance of the liturgy of the hours, that I I never heard that before. Because like when we think of the liturgy, it's like, yeah, the liturgy, thumb ass, the holy sacrifice.

SPEAKER_01 8:00

No, but like the liturgy is like the liturgy of the hours. That's the liturgy of the church. That's what's holding it all together.

SPEAKER_02 8:05

Yeah, so we read this document from the 200s in this class um by Saint Hippolytus of Rome. And so it's uh very old. You know, it's from like the earliest. It's not recent. Right. And so it kind of goes through all of these things that um basically relate to liturgical aspects of the early church. And as you're going through it, you're like, oh my gosh, it's so similar to how we celebrate like Mass and Liturgy today. Especially there's a lot of references to like the Easter Vigil. Oh, yeah. And and it doesn't say the Easter Vigil, but it talks about this celebration, this liturgy that um takes place. There's there's people being baptized that like enter into they used to baptize them naked, that's even as adults. That's interesting. We don't do that anymore. So as we see, the church develops and grows, right?

SPEAKER_00 8:58

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:59

Um one of my favorite lines, because there's also just like random things about like the church, you know, kind of some early beliefs and and um not requirements, uh just like advising statements and things like one of my favorites was if someone is an actor or does shows in the theater, either he shall cease or sh he shall be rejected.

SPEAKER_01 9:21

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 9:22

And I was like, hey, what? But then I was like, okay, this was written.

SPEAKER_01 9:25

That was something different. You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:27

Theater was more of a sinful thing back then, more more commonly. So I was like, okay, that makes sense. I'm just gonna see why they would be like, you should stop.

SPEAKER_01 9:34

You need historical context.

SPEAKER_02 9:35

Um but near the ending, also we're in Lent now, so this this line on the elders will fast when they want to was a line that stuck out to me because I'm like, oh, that's why you when you hit 60, you don't have to fast. You just don't want to. You don't want to. I thought that was funny. But again, another like thing that we've carried forth um through the early church, uh, or from the early church. Anyway, the end of this talks a lot about praying to sanctify the day and how it is outlining these days or times of the day to pray, but how that is all kind of further sanctified or or draws its sanctifying power from the sacrifice of the Eucharist, right? Um, and so it talks about kind of the importance of like basically just like going to daily mass. It's like you are to partake of the univ the universe, the Eucharist before eating anything else, right? So kind of this idea of fasting before we receive Holy Communion. Having prayed in the assembly, they will be able to avoid all the evils of the day. So good. Going to church and being part of a community helps us I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

I saw I heard this before that well, I mean, I'm gonna d go on a different topic here. You know, that your prayer is gonna kind of like go back to the mass and keep you kind of sustained throughout the day. That I I feel like I learned somewhere that the liturgy of the not the liturgy of the hours, but like morning prayer and evening prayer were meant to be prayed in the church with the community, um, to kind of begin and end your day. So like you'd have your community, your local church, you'd all gather there twice a day to pray. So, like kind of before work and after work, you'd go and pray together.

SPEAKER_02 11:26

It's actually still advised to clergy and parishes to offer opportunities to celebrate the liturgy of the hours as a community. So this is something more common, uh required in like monasteries and things. But it's like heavily suggested, like you you should provide opportunities. And I think a reason why that's a big reason why most people don't even know what the divine office is. Like, I didn't learn what it was until college because there was never an opportunity to pray night prayer. But I know that uh Divine Child did that during Advent, like it was Sunday nights they offered night prayer as a church. Yeah, so things like that, that is heavily suggested for for parishes to do.

SPEAKER_01 12:07

Yeah, well, and and I think it it let lets you have your community come together not just for mass, but for other aspects of prayer, knowing that you're all working together to do the work for the world, right? Like that you are a community and have that community identity and coming multiple times a day to be able to do that. And then if you can't go to mass for whatever reason, maybe you can go to evening prayer, you know, that there would be an opportunity for something else. And and I think that maybe in our current culture we've just think of going to church as you go to mass, like that's all you do at church, or if maybe there's you know a women's group or a men's group, or you know, you're a knights of Columbus, you're like you have these different things.

SPEAKER_02 12:43

Or even like going for adoration. Yes, yeah. Like you can just go and be here, like this is your home. Yeah. A few weeks ago, I was substituting for a um first grade catechism class at at St. Paul, and I was like, they're little kids, so they're like, Oh, what's this? Whatever. We were doing a church tour. Okay. So I was able to kind of their catechist was there. Or I okay, I was I wasn't subbing, I was doing the church tour for them. Their catechist was here, and they came in and I'm like, Welcome. This is the gathering space, and I kind of did my like blippy voice. You know, you're like, hey kids. Um cartoon catechist. This is the baptismal font, you know, and you kind of do that kid voice, whatever, um, which is great. I love doing that because I'm an actor. Um, apparently I should cease. Um, so it we're walking around, and it was kind of cool just to be like, you know, to to come back to the basics of like this is your church. And in the the document I was using, it was like um one of the questions to ask the kids was like, What are some things that you do in church? You know, and most of them are like, Oh, we go to mass here. Yeah, you know, even they knew that, yeah, even as first graders. Um, and so then some of the examples like, okay, maybe you've come here for a funeral mass or a wedding, maybe. Um, and then at the last thing is like you can just come here to be. Like, do you can come here to pray anytime?

SPEAKER_00 14:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

Like maybe your church isn't unlocked all the time, but maybe it has an adoration chapel.

SPEAKER_01 14:07

Right.

SPEAKER_02 14:08

Um, most churches, you know, they're open during the day, and at least uh many of the churches where I'm, you know, around us, like you can just visit. Yeah, you know, you can just be there.

SPEAKER_01 14:18

I would like to see that more, that sort of like getting away and running to go visit a church, just like to kind of, you know, at kind of wasting time with God, right? Like you're gonna just go and sit there and do nothing.

SPEAKER_02 14:29

Oh, I'm gonna talk about I wanted to talk about that later, wasting time with God.

SPEAKER_01 14:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:33

So uh in this other book, if you've read it too, you kind of know what I'm alluding to, where Father uh Romano Gardini, who's this book also titled The Spirit of the Liturgy, um he talks about the playfulness of the liturgy and how it's like that essentially there's no purpose to the purpose of liturgy is to like worship, right? It's to honor God. But the meaning of the liturgy is like it's an expression of like just that childlike desire to to be very serious about play.

SPEAKER_01 15:07

You have to follow the rules.

SPEAKER_02 15:08

Like you have to follow the rules even though they're made up, right? Yes. Like I think of like liturgical reform and everything, and like how people get mad about that, you're changing the rules. But it's like because we're very serious about the rules of how we play the game.

unknown 15:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:23

And I think of like when I was a kid and I used to play board games or make board games. Yeah. And it was like these, I'm these you have to you have to follow the rules.

SPEAKER_01 15:31

And you can change the rules, but you do have to follow the rules, but it's a game, right?

SPEAKER_02 15:34

And so it's and I'm not trying to say mass is a game or anything, but there's a level of playfulness. There's and and Jesus says, if you're not, you know, those only those who are childlike enter the kingdom of heaven, right? You know, you have to be like this child. So it it's the difference between childishness and childlike.

SPEAKER_01 15:53

Being able to be obedient to the rules, even and say, like, these are the rules, and you don't always have to have a logical explanation for why they're the rules, because sometimes it's just because God told us to do it this way. And maybe that will the answer of why will be revealed later on, and we maybe we just don't know right now, and we'll learn later why it's very important that we do it in a particular way.

SPEAKER_02 16:13

Or God has chosen these people and given these people the authority, and they've told us that this is what we're gonna do. So this is where we're gonna do.

SPEAKER_01 16:21

Because it's good for us to obey.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

Yeah, it is. Yeah, because we're children, we're little children. We are um here's another one of my favorite lines taken out of context. Let no one be late in arriving at the assembly.

SPEAKER_01 16:31

Oh boy.

SPEAKER_02 16:32

Yeah. That's a hot topic at um my place of employment. Um that's like every day at lunch, it's like there were so many people running late to mass. And they're like, we're just gonna lock the door at 815.

SPEAKER_01 16:45

And it's 815 Mass, it's not like 15 minutes early, but Yeah, so I I I do think it's important that we're to mass, especially Sunday Mass early. And by early, I mean before mass starts. Ideally, if you got there at least a few minutes early, five to ten minutes at least, so that you can kind of take a breath. You know, like we if especially if you have kids, like you're doing that hustle and bustle to get everybody ready, get out the door, drive there, the whole thing, to stop, to go into church, take a breath, know where you are, to know that you're in the presence of God. I think that would help a lot of people, especially kids, to be more quiet and to be more present in church. Because sometimes I see the school kids that don't maybe don't go to mass as often, but when they're there for like an all-school mass, they just don't know how to behave.

SPEAKER_02 17:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

And if we're more in the routine of you go into church and you're quiet and that's what you do there, that's how you're expected to act, and you have a time before mass to I don't know, to acclimate to that, to that sense of prayer, I think is good. I mean, we shouldn't kick anyone out if they're late because there may be very reasonable reasons why they're late and you don't need to kick them out. Yeah. Um but I don't think it should be a habit to be running late all the time.

SPEAKER_02 17:50

I think tardiness, especially like for mass, is is a is something that we can be uh externally understanding of and inwardly like um hard on ourselves about it, not hard on other people about it. Because I always give most things the benefit of the doubt.

SPEAKER_01 18:09

Yeah. Yeah. And and and I lately have been very uh slow about getting to mass on time. But let me tell you one of my reasons.

SPEAKER_02 18:19

Oh, I'll confess I am late all the time. Currently it bothers me though. I'm hard on myself about it.

SPEAKER_01 18:24

Mass will sometimes start late. So I don't necessarily have an urgency to get there because I know that sometimes it's not totally on schedule. And so now I'm getting trained to not be there on time.

SPEAKER_02 18:39

So you can see, I'm afraid that I did that with like some like youth group meetings where like I would wait until people came and then start, and then now it's like they know they can just show up at 6 15 and nothing's gonna be nothing, it hasn't started yet because I was waiting for them.

SPEAKER_01 18:55

Yeah, so I I'm I was like, uh, you know, it might mass might start a couple minutes late. I'm okay. I can you know take my time.

SPEAKER_02 19:02

I know that our former um associate at uh Divine Child, Father John, used to say like he was very like get to mass five minutes early. He would say 15 minutes early, but yeah, yeah. I think yeah, for the daily mass people, 15 and then Sunday Mass he would say start with five or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 19:21

Yeah, see oh here's another thing you know, lowering the bar. Here's a hot take. Okay. Yesterday Giovanni said that he thinks it's a terrible idea when people say, start with five minutes a day of prayer, you know, just set a timer for five minutes, even two or three, you know, just start the habit of daily prayer. Because he thinks this is a terrible idea, because if you start with five, it turns into zero.

SPEAKER_02 19:47

Because you're like, oh, it's just five minutes.

SPEAKER_01 19:49

It's just five minutes, you know, I'll do it later, whatever, it's just five minutes. But if you set the goal of at least 15 minutes and you set a timer for 15 minutes, maybe that turns into five.

SPEAKER_02 19:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:59

But you're gonna be like, okay, 15 minutes, and and just and instead of saying do five because then it's easier to not fail, like, well, no, what if you just said 15 and be okay with failing and didn't sit there for the whole 15 minutes? Or it's okay if you're bored or uncomfortable or whatever. But five minutes isn't even enough to quiet your heart down enough to even listen to the Lord. Like, what are you gonna do in five minutes? I like you can't even drink a cup of coffee in five minutes. At least drink a cup of coffee during prayer, right? Like pour yourself a cup of coffee, drink that with the Lord. Don't worry about how long it takes, but drink the whole cup of coffee.

SPEAKER_02 20:30

I think, yeah, I think there's a medium of like knowing that you're a human being and recognizing, like, okay, I'm not I pray zero minutes a day right now. I need I need to pray something, so I need to start somewhere. Okay, so I'm gonna start with five minutes, coming at it that perspective, and coming at it maybe from the perspective of I'm a human being, and if I say I'm gonna pray for 10 minutes, I'm gonna, you know, pray for one minute or two minutes. So, yeah, maybe recognizing both of those things about yourself before dying.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

Well, not even all or nothing, you know, it's like, oh, well, I missed one day of prayer, so I guess I'll quit. Like, no.

SPEAKER_02 21:08

I've done that with like adoration on Tuesdays, like, oh, I want to go pray a holy hour.

SPEAKER_01 21:12

Right.

SPEAKER_02 21:12

And then it's like, okay, I'll go at you know 5.30, and then I can 5 30 to 6 30. Yeah. And then I'll get back at, you know, before 7 o'clock when I have people coming over. But then it's like 5 45, and I'm like, oh, well, I might as well not even go because now I can't. Now I'm not gonna get back. It's not gonna and then it's like, what I could have just driven over there, prayed for 10 seconds, and then come back, and that would have been better than just not going at all. So yeah, we do that.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

That's true.

SPEAKER_02 21:41

We're human.

SPEAKER_01 21:42

What else can you tell me about the liturgy?

SPEAKER_02 21:43

So we yeah, we were talking about liturgy, the hours, and I didn't even get to this point that there's it starts going through that there is um like these different hours of the day that you're to pray. You know, pray before if you're at home, pray. Well, I I guess anywhere. If you're at home, pray at the third hour and praise God. So this is um and then down the sixth hour, the ninth hour. So these are um the prayers of terse, uh sext, and none, which are the Latin words for the third, sixth, and ninth hour. So are those which are mid-morning, midday, and mid-afternoon prayers. Daytime prayer.

SPEAKER_01 22:22

What times are those times? Is that three, six, and nine, or is that something else?

SPEAKER_02 22:26

No. So the third hour is about, if I'm uh if I'm correct in this, it's I always think of it as about nine a.m. So I think of them as three hour segments. Like if you woke up at six a. Every three hours, basically. So it's like six a.m. would be morning prayer. That in my head. I don't this is my- You wake up at six a.m. Yes. Say you wake up at six a.m. and you pray morning prayer. Okay. And then you have mid-morning prayer at nine a.m. Okay. Midday at noon, um, which is the sixth hour. So it's basically like sunrise is the first hour.

SPEAKER_01 22:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 22:58

6 a.m. Then the third, 9 a.m., 12 p.m., 3 p.m. would be the ninth hour.

SPEAKER_01 23:03

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 23:04

In at least in my head. Uh it was different. Like the Romans had a different time thing, and the the Hebrews had a different one. So and then pray also before your body rests on your bed. So night prayer, which is prayed right before you go to bed. Um, and then uh around midnight, rise and wash your hands with water and pray. So that was formerly in the old Liturgy of the Hours, um, there was a prayer at in the middle of the night. You would get up in the middle of the night and pray and then go back to bed. You know, this is too much. Which is called vigils.

SPEAKER_01 23:33

A side story, but I cavemen used to wake up in the middle of the night. This is like a thing that like in our in our genetics, you would have seconds. Yeah, that you would wake up in the middle of the night, they'd have like a whole like day in the middle of the night, they'd like tend the fire, they'd maybe eat a meal, like hang out, whatever, and then go back to sleep and then get up for the next day.

SPEAKER_02 23:53

Yeah, no, it was uh I I remember reading about that a long time ago. That like that was a thing right up until like the Middle Ages.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:59

Um or even beyond, I don't know, like until we had um artificial light.

SPEAKER_01 24:03

I was gonna say, until we had pillows and get so cozy, like nobody ever wants to get up.

SPEAKER_02 24:07

I guess so. But yeah, they would like you would go to bed when the sun went down, no matter what time that was. You would kind of get up maybe six hours later, so what 1 a.m., 2 a.m. maybe, and then you would or maybe even earlier, 11 p.m. midnight, and then you would, yeah, you would eat a meal, you'd hang out, you'd make this makes chores, and then you'd go back to bed, and then wake up.

SPEAKER_01 24:29

Part of the liturgy of the hours, because if everyone was naturally waking up then and you're saying this is like the two hundreds, if that was just part of the routine.

SPEAKER_02 24:35

Yeah. Which also biologically, it's and I I have no authority to say this, but it's better for you if you actually like do that, if you get up in the middle of the night. Like sleeping soundly eight hours is not good for you.

SPEAKER_00 24:47

It's weird.

SPEAKER_02 24:48

Isn't that weird? People say, oh, seven, eight hours, that's you know, the sweet spot or whatever, depending on the right. But maybe we've evolved age and gender and things. I don't know. Maybe today, but uh if it's in the liturgy, the hours I think maybe Now are are we trying to fit our lives into the liturgy, fit the liturgy into our lives?

SPEAKER_01 25:03

What is the liturgy for?

SPEAKER_02 25:04

Again, it's the the what is it, the work for the participation of the people of God and the work of God.

SPEAKER_01 25:10

Yeah, that's exactly yeah, working for the work of God.

SPEAKER_02 25:13

It's not about us, right? It's about the Axiodei, the work of God, the action of God, and that we're just participating in it. So maybe you could argue that God has instilled in us, like for example, this we wake up in the middle of the night. Yeah, and so God's like, I did that, so you'd pray. So sometimes I do wake up.

SPEAKER_01 25:35

I wake up in the middle of the night and I cannot fall back asleep. And whenever this happens, you pray and you fall asleep. I well, sort of. No, I pray for whoever's dying in that moment. And many times the next day, I will have some message from someone or I'll hear about somebody who has passed away. They'll be like, Oh, pray for so and so they just passed away, and it'll be like the same time I was praying. Where like the Lord wakes me up and says, You need to pray for somebody who's dying right now. And so this happened like a week or so ago, and I prayed a divine mercy chaplet. But this is the first time that nobody told me that somebody died at the same time. So somebody out there in the world died and got my prayers.

SPEAKER_02 26:11

There's many people that have died, so that's yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:13

So those prayers were for someone. So I I kind of committed then to say, I'll wake up and pray the divine mercy chaplet and and not fall back asleep. You know, I'll like I'll pray the whole divine mercy chaplet and not back asleep.

SPEAKER_02 26:23

Just to fall asleep. Right, right.

SPEAKER_01 26:25

Like to actually pray it.

SPEAKER_02 26:26

That's I mean, that's a pretty common thing, like, oh, I can't fall asleep. Right. So I'm gonna pray to fall asleep. Counting she's Hail Mary's. I remember doing that as like a kid. Like that would be, you know, you you I can't fall asleep, so I'm gonna start praying Hail Marys. And then like you go to pray at Rosary in the afternoon and you're starting to fall asleep. It's like, why does this make me tired? It's like, I don't know, maybe because you use it to fall asleep and it's psychologically making you tired. Um oh, so at the end here, at the end of this section, it says, likewise at the hour of the cockrow, rise and pray. So like 6 a.m. first thing in the morning, lauds. Um yeah, and it gives a reason for each thing, you know, like pray at the third hour because um this hour Christ was seen nailed to the wood. Pray at the sixth hour because Christ was attached to the wood of the cross, daylight ceased and became darkness. That's why it's I'm thinking it's noon. Yeah. Um, pray at the ninth hour for in that Christ was uh pierced uh that hour Christ was pierced in his side, pouring out water and blood. Also, 3 p.m. Like that this is really cool. Divine mercy. The divine mercy, the hour of divine mercy, obviously came from this. Like, that was a moment for me where I was like, whoa, it all comes together. For in that hour, Christ was pierced in his side, pouring out water and blood, and the rest of the time of the day he gave light until evening. So we have these three things in the image of the divine mercy, the water and the blood and the light coming from them. This was in the 200s. This was written.

SPEAKER_01 27:52

So those people who want to poo-poo the divine mercy and say this is a new thing that was made up.

SPEAKER_02 27:56

It I mean, No, at 3 p.m. Like it this is the ninth hour. Like that was an awesome. I was like, wow, I gotta pray the divine mercy check.

SPEAKER_01 28:04

We're around here, you know, I think in our last episode we were talking about work and being busy and sports and how we're always running around doing all the things we don't have time for anything. That the church has said to us that we should be praying at the like every three hours, 24 hours a day, that we should be stopping what we're doing and praying and making time like that's like really, because you I don't think you can pray the liturgy of the hours well unless you stop what you're doing, right? Like if you're gonna sing a hymn, if you're gonna like s pray a psalm, you can memorize a lot of them and and pray them like while you're working, but you have to like stop and do these things and pray. And most of us out here are like, I'm too busy to pray. I can't set aside those five minutes for prayer. That's too much. Like, you're asking too much for me to do, you know, that five minutes of prayer. You know, I like I had this experience the other day we're we're putting on a retreat uh in a couple weeks. And I saw somebody, one of the women, inviting another woman to attend this retreat. And uh the second woman who was being invited wouldn't even stop to talk. And the other one was like, Oh, I hope to see you at the retreat, and the other lady was just like, I'm too busy. She didn't even say, I'm busy that day, or you know, something like where she had maybe looked at the date and the time. She just automatically assumed that she was too busy. She was too busy to even think about whether or not it would fit into her schedule.

SPEAKER_02 29:22

Too busy to think about stopping to think.

SPEAKER_01 29:24

Yes, that this retreat that's you know a half day long on a Saturday, like I that you can't take time out of your day for this during Lent when really we're invited every day to set aside time. And and this is when people had to work all day, every day. They had to work for their food, their shelter, everything. And here we have things just delivered to our door from Amazon in 20 minutes and we can't find time to pray somehow. What's the point of all the technology if we're not making time to pray?

SPEAKER_02 29:50

Preach. Yeah. I well, yeah, I don't technology, I don't think it's helping us more than it's harming. But shouldn't it be if we're using it well it should make more time for us to give to God to serve mankind and free up time, then why are we like more anxious anxious than ever? Yeah. Then like we're gonna be able to do that.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

If the glory of God is man fully alive, are we more fully alive when we're using our technology? Like, is it making us more fully alive? Is it?

SPEAKER_02 30:17

I don't think so.

SPEAKER_01 30:18

Can we use it to to be more fully alive?

SPEAKER_02 30:20

I mean, you can talk, I mean, we could talk about that for a while. Like, even look at the image of like how we bow our heads in prayer and how you bow your head to look at your phone, and like how that's that's sim it's a symbolic action, you know, that we we attribute to worship, but then like we we don't even realize we find ourselves doing that to like yeah, I mean, okay, and maybe that's a stretch because you also like you know lean your head over to read a book or something, but it's it's just it's an interesting thing to think about.

SPEAKER_01 30:50

Yeah, yeah, it's probably not that deep.

SPEAKER_02 30:52

I don't think it's that deep.

SPEAKER_01 30:53

Um but something to ponder on.

SPEAKER_02 30:55

I was listening to a podcast uh you talked about being busy, and this this host on this podcast says this all the time about how busy is an acronym, burdened under Satan's yoke. You ever heard that? Yeah, yeah. It's it's like the yeah, we don't stop to think about anything. So I I want to read this section. Did you have something to say? No, no, no. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 31:15

Carry on.

SPEAKER_02 31:16

I want to carry on talking about um this prayer in the middle of the night. Um, before I go into this, and I don't think he says this here, maybe he does, that nighttime is is when we should pray most intentionally, I think. At least in the domestic church, because you're home, at least you should be. Where do you know where your kids are right now? Praying at home. Hands are folded, hands are folded in prayer over their bed. But like, that's okay, so that's most people when when you approach them and like, you know, oh, you should pray more. Our intuitive response is like, oh, I'm gonna either pray before I go to bed or I'm gonna pray before I get up in the morning.

SPEAKER_01 31:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:57

So my kind of challenge and maybe a new perspective is like, why not in the middle of the night?

SPEAKER_01 32:01

Well, try that.

SPEAKER_02 32:02

So I think because the nighttime is scary, right? We just have like it's dark. Darkness, we just have a a conditioned and like there's just a natural uh um awareness that like there's scary things that move in the dark. Yeah, we need light, whether it's whether it's the woods or our basements or whatever it is, yeah, we need light. And right, that's a reflection of the light of Christ and and the light of truth and all these things. But why then why are we like we just we just turn off during the night, right? And we kind of just we're unaware of all of our faculties, right? We shut off our bodies and we're in like a semi-unconscious state. Have you tried restarting? Eight hours. Have I tried restarting?

SPEAKER_01 32:43

Yeah, yeah. So you know, like if you're having a bad day, you just have to restart. You know, like if your phone's not working, you turn it off and back on again. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you gotta do it with your mind.

SPEAKER_02 32:51

Sleep. Like, and and my mom was talking about how her new favorite form of prayer is taking a nap.

SPEAKER_00 32:57

Oh, yes.

SPEAKER_02 32:58

Right. And I was like, okay, yeah, that's funny. But like, yeah, you're okay, whatever, you're gonna take a nap, that's prayer. But I mean, like, thinking more about this, at least in the nighttime. Okay, most of us sleep at nighttime, right? That's when we're supposed to sleep, it's when we're biologically made to sleep. And the devil knows that we're scared of the dark, right? Naturally. So he's gonna use that time. Like most, I think most sinning happens at nighttime. I don't know. Maybe I'm just making a broad generalization, but it there's just an inclination to the darkness, right?

SPEAKER_01 33:30

There's something scriptural there, right? That like the I don't know what I'm getting at. Hiding things in the dark, and like that people have to be.

SPEAKER_02 33:36

Everything that will come in the dark will be will be shown into the light, right? Yeah. So there isn't there is an a special importance to sanctify the nighttime. Okay, that's the preface I'm gonna give. I'm gonna read this. Around midnight, rise and wash your hands with water and pray. If I I said that earlier. If you are married, pray together. So if you're married, like wake your spouse up, we're gonna pray. It's midnight, come on. But if your spouse is not yet baptized, go into another room to pray and then return to bed. It's important, yeah. Do not hesitate to pray, for one who has been joined in marital relations is not impure. Those who have bathed have no need to wash again, for they are pure. So he's see, they they kind of throw in other stuff about like doctrine and things. Um, by catching your breath in your hand and signing yourself with the moisture of your breath, your body is purified even to the feet. So when we make the sign of the cross. For the gift of the Spirit and the outpouring of the baptism, which sign of the cross is a sign of our baptism in the Trinity, proceeding from the heart of the believer as though from a fountain, purifies the one who has believed. So get up in the middle of the night and make the sign of the cross. At least. Like that's like if that's your prayer, boom. Thus it is necessary to pray at this hour. For those elders who handed down the tradition to us taught that in this hour every creature hushes for a brief moment to praise the Lord. Stars and trees and waters stand still for an instant. All the hosts of angels serving him, together with the souls of the righteous, praise God. This is why it is important that all those who believe make certain to pray at the at that hour. Testifying to this, the Lord said thus, Behold, a cry was made at midnight, saying, Behold, the bridegroom is coming, arise to meet him. And he adds, saying, Watch, therefore, for you do not know when the hour is coming. So how long ago I never realized that it was midnight in that scripture until I read this.

SPEAKER_01 35:27

How long ago did you read this?

SPEAKER_02 35:30

About uh two or three weeks ago.

SPEAKER_01 35:32

So, how many times have you woken up at midnight to pray since then?

SPEAKER_02 35:35

None. And this is why I'm a wretched sinner and need to strive more to pray in the middle of the night. But several times, at least unintentionally, I have been actually, this is providential and funny that you bring that up. Because about a week ago, Alyssa and I both have noticed that we have been struggling to sleep or waking up several times in the middle of the night for no reason. Maybe there is a reason. And now, see, the Lord reveals I had to talk it out. And now, and together we would notice like she would wake up and then I would wake up a minute later, and and then you know, well, and you're probably waking each other up, which is but but yeah, why what is the reason?

SPEAKER_01 36:13

But now it's like nighttime waking.

SPEAKER_02 36:14

But it's just so interesting how the early church recognized that it was necessary to pray at midnight.

SPEAKER_01 36:20

Well, and if you're praying night prayer before you go to bed, you're already kind of like setting your sleep apart to God. And I like to like, as I'm falling asleep, think of like, okay, ask the Lord to give me good dreams and to help me sleep well and to be rested for the next day. And part of that's even in night prayer, like that you can be rested to return to your work tomorrow for the Lord, and that's part of it. Um But yeah, kind of thinking of like as you fall asleep to give your sleep to the Lord. Like you can offer anything to God. Why not offer our sleep to him? And to say, if I do wake up, remind me to pray, you know, just to ask the Lord to do that for you. Like ask Blessed Mother, she'll she'll remind you, you know, she'll be like, Hey, remember you said you were gonna pray. It's 3 a.m. Let's go. Like, you know, you've you didn't find time to pray today. I found it for you. Here it is at 2 47 a.m. Wake up and pray. I'm gonna do that.

SPEAKER_02 37:06

If I wake up at 2 47 tomorrow, I whoa look at the clock, I will make a note. So I but yeah, I just we don't know the day nor the hour, and midnight is a good as time as any to pray. But yes, I do think that like night prayer in and not only how it serves in sanctifying the night time and and um it's just like a one last act of surrender before you go to sleep, right? And and like Lord, sanctify this night of sleep, you know, protect me from uh and you know, protect us, Lord, as we stay awake, watch over us as we sleep, that awake we may keep watch with Christ, and asleep rest in his peace. So it's like there's there's a lot of imagery of death and dying, and how sleep is like uh, you know, we're not it's it's the the most normal uh closest thing we get to dying.

SPEAKER_01 37:56

It's the most alive type thing of dying.

SPEAKER_02 37:58

Yeah, I don't know how that works, but and then the last line, you know, may the all-powerful Lord grant us a restful night and a peaceful death, right? There's that that twin kind of imagery of of dying and sleep and in the middle of the night we're not dead, and so we we should pray then. Right, it's reminded I'm not dead yet. I'm not dead yet, so I'm gonna pray. Um but even how like when we talk about the saints and like those who have died in Christ are only asleep, yeah, and how this imagery of sleep is is not like sleep is an imagery of death, but that death is an image of sleep.

SPEAKER_01 38:32

That we're resting, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:33

That it's just resting until the second coming, you know, until we return back our our our body-soul union. That even in a way, when we sleep is a reflection of that body-soul disunion, right? That our kind of our minds go off and go into dream land and kind of just sit in the spirit world for eight hours, maybe. That's a I don't know if that's the best way of putting it, but the dream world, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 39:00

Sleeping.

SPEAKER_02 39:00

But then our bodies are just sitting there, they're like they're still operating, you know. It's it's it's a time uh sleep is a really good time to reflect on your mortality and and the state of your mortal soul.

SPEAKER_01 39:11

Yeah. Yeah, and have prophetic dreams.

SPEAKER_02 39:15

And maybe, yeah. Why not? You know you think your dreams are prophetic?

SPEAKER_01 39:17

Sometimes they are.

SPEAKER_02 39:18

I think sometimes my dreams are pathetic.

SPEAKER_01 39:21

I have weird dreams sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 39:23

Alyssa has she says she dreams every night, and I'm like, what? Yeah, I don't think I dream once a week.

SPEAKER_01 39:30

I probably dream most nights, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:32

That is wild.

SPEAKER_01 39:33

And now and and I'd say most of them are just weird dreams. So you know they're not. But every once in a while you get one and it's like, hmm, that was that was interesting. That seems significant, and sometimes it'll be something that relates back to something like that.

SPEAKER_02 39:45

I think when I do dream, I usually try to interpret it, and sometimes it's yeah, meaningless, and sometimes I'm like, Yeah. What am I thinking about? Or what are you placing upon my heart? I mean, I don't know if the catechism says this or if this is just like lowercase treat tea tradition or something that like God can use our dreams. I mean, we know that from the scripturally, yeah. Joseph and and both Joseph's biblical uh, is this like old men will dream dreams and young men will say there's something in scripture?

SPEAKER_01 40:13

Something in the Bible somewhere about dreaming dreams.

SPEAKER_02 40:15

Yeah, I'm really I quote scripture very evil one can use dreams as well to you know maybe bring bring to the surface shame that we don't want to face or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 40:26

Well, and that and maybe all the more important that before we go to sleep we're offering our sleep to God.

SPEAKER_00 40:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:30

You know, that like there's no room for the devil if you've only invited the Holy Spirit into your sleep, you know? So with the Liturgy of the Hours, how do you pray? Do you pray much of the Liturgy of the Hours or or how how do you think personally?

SPEAKER_02 40:45

For Lent, I have committed to praying morning and evening prayer.

SPEAKER_01 40:50

All right.

SPEAKER_02 40:51

So and we've already been praying night prayer. Uh you know, Alyssa and I. So we do that every night. Most nights. We we sometimes if we've had a long day and we'll we'll kind of just like pray our evening um litany, we do a marriage litany, and like that we kind of call it a day and and that. But most nights we we have committed to praying night prayer. So for Lent, I was like, I really want to, you know, incorporate that more into the daily prayer. So I have committed to doing morning and evening prayer, and I have like um the the brevery, but I also have uh I was given a copy of the subscription from Word on Fire for February and then March. So um I have like a nice uh book cover, uh uh leather um you get to have you get to have a pretty much pretty. So it's like it like it moves my heart to pray. I'm I'm very much a proponent of like if you want to pray more, buy yourself a really expensive, beautiful looking Bible.

SPEAKER_01 41:48

Like if you want to read the Bible more, that's like your love language is those money on it. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:52

I mean, like I I I'll admit that I have a lot of stuff, and I don't like that I like stuff, but I recognize that I do it.

SPEAKER_01 41:59

Well, and if you do like stuff, let it be for God's glory.

SPEAKER_02 42:02

Yeah, yeah. So like if you're like, man, I just I want to pray the Bible, but all I have is this like ratty old thing. If you like that, that's great. It's still the word of God.

SPEAKER_00 42:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:11

But if you're like, if you like stuff, then buy yourself a really nice, expensive Bible and then and then read it. As Jeff Cavins says a lot, like the best Bible translation is the one you read. Yeah, so like the best Bible is the one that you're gonna be able to do.

SPEAKER_01 42:26

Okay, but what if you get one of those weird Bible translation that's like one of those Protestant ones that kind of makes things in modern language and then you read it and you're like, I don't know if that's what Jesus meant by that?

SPEAKER_02 42:37

Like, God can work through anything, I mean, but there's a point where it's I think, yeah, it does stop reflecting his word.

SPEAKER_01 42:46

Yeah, is I mean, what what does the Catholic Church have a perspective on that? Like those Protestant Bibles that have really gone into these different translations, are they like can you read them and still like is it still the inspired word of God, or does it at some point become like a human's you know, work of it? You know, like a whole your interpretation of scripture and not the actual scripture.

SPEAKER_02 43:09

Well, is me quoting scripture scripture?

SPEAKER_01 43:12

I I don't know. When I quote it poorly, I mean I know that that's not scripture, but I'm not doing that with the word and is in scripture.

SPEAKER_02 43:21

When I write the word and is that.

SPEAKER_01 43:24

Well, I'm brother.

SPEAKER_02 43:26

I'm I'm getting at how the Translation matters though.

SPEAKER_01 43:30

It does.

SPEAKER_02 43:31

Because you don't want it to be a good idea.

SPEAKER_01 43:33

The meaning needs to be significant. Yes, yes. And so this is the yeah, like why speak in tongues if you have no one to interpret? Like you need to have the interpretation to be correct. So if somebody's taking the translation and then changing it ten different times from the original translation and it's not really having the same meaning anymore, yeah, I don't know. I guess I'll have to look into that. If there's like anything that the Catholic Church says, like about various translations of the Bible, like maybe you shouldn't read these ones because they're not necessarily.

SPEAKER_02 44:00

necessarily going to to follow up so in um in college I remember taking this class on logic and and critical thinking and talked a lot about how we kind of have we have words and we have concepts right and often when we think when we hear a word like language like language represents the concept of what we're talking about. So like an apple. Like the word apple is not what an apple is in its essence. Right. So like we have the concept of an apple but then we have the word apple but then other people have the word manzana which is you know Spanish for apple. Yeah. So it's like it's a completely different word language but then it's the same concept. So it's like and there's different translations of the Bible okay so there's different English translations. I'm sure there's different you know other languages that are like they have maybe they don't maybe they just this is the Spanish translation. I don't know I don't speak Spanish. Somebody who speaks Spanish will have to tell me that um but like at least in English there's like so many different translations of the Bible. So I think that an a poor translation would be one that disregards the concept for the sake of the word.

SPEAKER_01 45:19

Okay so here's the thing in China they have Bibles that the Chinese government is like allowing to be printed and distributed where they actually have changed text within it. So in and to me that would be a Bible you don't want to read.

SPEAKER_02 45:34

That we would like do what's the only Bible you have access to?

SPEAKER_01 45:38

I don't know because they're the main is the actual I'm I'm gonna try to think of the example because it was something very problematic that was changed that actually changes the whole like concept of the gospel and like it it just it's a lot of what you're talking about but I don't know the example like it actually is changing the gospel message. Yeah. And so do we still say that that's the Bible or at what point is it not the Bible anymore and it's just somebody making some like fan fiction or something? Like what you know what what makes it the word of God well this is why we need scripture and tradition right and that and why I'm going to read Catholic Bibles because I have the authority of the church behind them and so I can trust them.

SPEAKER_02 46:19

Yes. And it's not just like well it's we can interpret it for ourselves. And that you can see through this conversation how that can be dangerous where it's like well just listen to the words and the words will tell you God will tell you and there is some of that I think we can pray that you know those Chinese citizens who have a corrupted Bible can can maybe have the maybe the Holy Spirit can work through that in it still in some way and and maybe give them the inkling like okay this this isn't what I intended but you never know and and you just have to pray that the s the the hearts of the authorities who are doing that will be won over.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

And pray for those missionaries who go there and and actually speak the the truth to people and that I mean that kind of work too like going out and telling people the truth not just saying we have to do the work you know we have to do the prayer each day we have to you know for our own spiritual lives set aside the five minutes or 15 minutes or wake up at midnight um but for our own sake but also to go out into the world and do that. You know, to have that mission mentality of you know I'm not just gonna pray the liturgy of the hours for myself so that I can get holy so that I can you know get some gold bars in heaven but that it's all of the work that we're doing will be to unite with Christ so that we can go out to the world and share the good news and do acts of service and be humbled and do all of those things for others.

SPEAKER_02 47:47

So that it's not just you know taking care of our own it's interesting because last time last episode we talked about like service as like a clear example of work, right? Works, you know and how now we've kind of talked about like work prayer as work, right? Liturgy as as prayer, participation in the work of God but it's still like there's a a a there's something required of us right in prayer. That is that is a work. You know it might be it's an expression I think it's the most clear expression of faith right moving through us. So yeah and then there's there's mission right and so actually in Deus Caritas est when it's talking about charity and charitable service um it talks about like the three things that are the threefold responsibility of the church and therefore all Christians um proclaiming the word you know like the charigma and and like proclaiming the gospel the sacraments um so liturgy and then charity you know the the service dia dia um not diaconet but diaconia or whatever like the word that we get diaconate from which is actually like the those who serve. Okay. So it's like this is the threefold mission like charity um the sacraments and the word so it's like okay sacraments we have liturgy that's prayer we have um service that's you know our charitable mission and then we have the proc proclamation of the word like evangelization so providentially we've kind of come around to this point this which is the first point in Dave's cardassess that it mentions but like on how all of these things are it's like a three-legged stool right you can't have one without the other two or you can't have two without the other one the stool falls over right so you know without with just charity and um mission you know okay so by with just prayer and service you miss the proclamation of the word you know the evangelization the stool falls over right it's not fully alive right it's not man fully alive so I guess yeah the point we're trying to get at is like you need all these three things. Yeah it's a mission. So the this is like the I love Jesus so much I pray so much and I want to tell other people about it. Right. Right?

SPEAKER_01 50:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:01

Yeah well and and that like you can see that in some people where they go out there and they're telling everybody about Jesus but you can tell like sometimes you're like does that person know the same Jesus I know and you're like Do you think it's the most obvious of these three that like seems like you could tell the other two are missing?

SPEAKER_01 50:20

Um I don't know. I well I'll I'll say this I think that it's easiest to let prayer go to the wayside because I maybe this is my perception of it. Um that it seems not as important. There's like some urgency to telling people about Jesus there's urgency to caring for the poor to providing for these charitable needs like we can see that as as people that there's an urgency to those things. And prayer we can kind of like set aside because we feel like we have to do those other things more and so maybe some of us will go out into the world and start doing those things before we actually have that sense of relationship with God and actually know why we're doing it and like have like Saint Catherine of Sienna will be one of those saints that everybody talks about like oh she wrote the Pope and she got the Pope to move back to Rome and she did these crazy things and she we need more Saint Catherine of Sienna's in the world because she did all these great things for the church. She spent like 10 years like living in her room alone eating just vegetables before she did that. Like she had a huge prayer life like she had this union this mystical union with Mother Teresa before she went out into the world. Like she had this like passionate love for God before she went out and did all these things. So like we can't say like oh we have to go out and do all the things like oh you're not speaking up against these horrible things that are happening. Because I I don't want to do something that God is not telling me to do. And it's gonna be on God's timetable and not that person over there that says I should do it a certain way.

SPEAKER_02 51:51

Yeah well I was yeah like Mother Teresa like all this great humanitarian and she's done all this charitable work but then she was telling her um the sisters and her you know the sisters of charity right yeah uh missionaries of charity of charity like if you're not praying if you don't have time to pray a holy hour every day you should pray two. Yeah right it's like if you're so busy right back to this like that you can't pray one hour you should be praying two hours because it's that important. Yes. Right that all of her mission all of her like service stemmed from that relationship.

SPEAKER_01 52:23

Well and like of course it is important for us to serve others but it's more important that we serve God. Like why did God make you like why? Why do we exist?

SPEAKER_02 52:32

For our own holiness to be holy.

SPEAKER_01 52:35

I mean not for us.

SPEAKER_02 52:36

I don't exist for myself to be with him God made me yes for him for him yes for him in the world that's what I mean sanctification yes it like we're we're here for God.

SPEAKER_01 52:45

Life in Christ living in us yeah so I that's something I had to memorize I don't know somewhere in elementary school it was like why did God made me God made me to show forth his glory catechism and yeah something like that something about showing forth his goodness and to spend heaven spend eternity with him in heaven something like that. It sounds like something from like that it's totally to memorize it that's like a sacrament is an outward sign instituted by Christ to give grace like you know I got this like thing memorized in my head but visible sign of an invisible reality. Yes yeah but I that I have that you know ingrained in my head which there's some some good things about that.

SPEAKER_02 53:17

Liturgy is the participation of the people of God in the work of God.

SPEAKER_01 53:20

Exactly sometimes you just have to memorize the intellectual side and that will speak to your heart and then you also have your heart encouraging you to go out and do the do the work too.

SPEAKER_02 53:31

One of my favorite things that I learned in this class liturgy and sacraments is something it's one of those things that you learn but you already knew and you're like now you just have like the words and the terms is the eight different um uh aspects of the Eucharistic prayer wow eight and there's eight aspects and you're like oh my gosh yeah the every all of the you all the the different Eucharistic prayers follow this formula without even like me realizing it but like they all follow this of okay now here's my real test thanksgiving acclamation so you have in the preface you know starting there you know you have we give it is right to give thanks and praise you know yeah it's truly right and just um so we have thanksgiving acclamation the sanctus and then there's uh the epiclesis the calling the invocation of the Holy Spirit that's where that first bell rings you know and then the institution narrative the consecration kind of the the when the when Jesus's the bread and wine turn into Jesus' body and blood, soul and divinity. And then um after that you have the anemnesis the re the the remembering the remembering the representation um and the oblation where it's like we offer Jesus back to God the Father and then the intercessions you know through the saints and all and then like we pray for the church and all those things and then the concluding doxology. Boom Father Copson there we go. Good job.

SPEAKER_01 54:47

One time we have we had so in the um the Ascension press catechism you know that it's like nice it's like soft bound and it lays flat and all this so I this is not an ad for it. I just like it. If you flip to the back there's just like definitions. Yeah and one of them is anamnesis and we were one time playing this game because this is a normal Catholic family thing to do where we were just picking out random words and seeing who could define them. And so that was one of the ones that we would like pick out and be like who could define this. And so now all of our kids and all of us know that anamnesis means remembering that the memorial acclamation like that remembering of like what the church is all about.

SPEAKER_02 55:23

Not just the memory but like recalling bringing it to real like it's real.

SPEAKER_01 55:29

Like yes this is like the yes. So anyway we all learned that that's just a side note.

SPEAKER_02 55:34

And that's a great thing that's a great way to bring liturgy into your domestic church quiz on weird words. Quiz on weird words in the church. Wow we're already almost up to an hour in the second part of the episode I'm very glad we split this episode into the liturgy of this hour. The liturgy of this hour and last week your last time's hour it's like an hour ago for us but um this is great. Any last thoughts on on liturgy and work and the threefold responsibility of the church and how we worship and all that?

SPEAKER_01 56:02

You know I think just remembering that having anumnesis no just kidding that that kind of remembering within our vocations that we can live the work of the church in our vocations. That our vocations and the work of God are not like separate things. So if you're married, if you have kids if you know all this stuff going on that work and that prayer of the church can be a part of that too. That they're meant to be together. It's not that you keep them separate or you have to be like you have to find time for God to fit in there. It's designed like God has designed it that it's to go together and like maybe to go out with that idea.

SPEAKER_02 56:37

And I guess that's why I like the concept of the liturgy of the hours right and and what we were reading from this early church document of like you have to sanctify the day. Not you. You have to allow God to sanctify your day by pausing by taking that moment you know at and it doesn't it's oh I it's the sixth hour I have to pray now.

SPEAKER_01 56:56

But like But you could you could set a timer yeah that'd be great.

SPEAKER_02 57:00

You know like the Angelus these things these modern devotions that we still have yeah um or I should say ancient devotions we still have of like you stop and pray at this time of day and how God of the the God of the universe who has ordained everything to be as it is now has chosen that we have a 24 hour day right in our modern calendar. Okay maybe a little bit here and there. I don't know how it works with leap days and everything. Some extra seconds I don't even know how it works but so right now you have the opportunity to set an alarm right or whatever it is. Um but that the important thing the meaning behind that is that we allow God to sanctify our day whether we're at work whether we're with our families whether we're at sports you know at our sporting team that we're maybe we're on the sidelines and you're just like thank you God for this opportunity thank you that I have legs that can run. Thank you for this sunset. This fog the past few days has been crazy. I love fog. And I was like this is scary but also like cool it's a great way to start Lent I was like it felt like the three days of darkness like I was like Lord this is this is interesting.

SPEAKER_01 58:05

This is new thank you for this opportunity to drive very carefully is actually one of my favorite types of weather I love when it's foggy out I love it the mystery of driving down the road and not knowing if there's a stoplight ahead of you I love it.

SPEAKER_02 58:17

I love it I think there's so many like horror movies and things like where it's like foggy and yeah but I think it's wonderful. It's otherworldly it's I don't know it's not scary to me.

SPEAKER_01 58:27

I know people don't like driving in it you know they don't like the fog. I don't know but I think it's so enjoyable I'd rather have a sunny day to be to be fair.

SPEAKER_02 58:36

I think internally in my own life it was like God was punishing me because I keep complaining about how I'm ready for spring and then God gives me three days of foggy darkness I'm like all right Lord I'll I'll wait I'll be patient with that why do we always not you and I personally we everyone the royal we at some point in conversations always talk about the weather every everyone you're you could talk about with your your spouse I'm sorry I brought it up your spouse a random person on the street your best friend anybody we always end up talking about weather so weird I the maybe it's that shared experience and and it's out of our control. And so we can all just Yeah I think I mean God uses the weather a lot in scripture I mean there's the cloud of uh the pillar of fire and then the cloud of or yeah pillar of fire at night and the cloud during the day pillar of cloud at day and then Saint Scholastica who made that thunderstorm come so her brother wouldn't leave yes best story. Love that I love that story. Yeah God is I think God is present in weather yeah it's something you can't control he's kind of like a cloud he's kind of always there you know but like very powerful you know he can let he lets the rain down light the clouds move to show us the sun I don't know there's some there's some imagery there. Yeah you think I mean I don't know yeah weather's cool talk about the weather yeah usually you start with people talking about we're gonna finish with talking about yeah so go outside look at the weather report back hopefully it's nicer than it is out right now I d I don't mind fog but I hate gloomy cloudy drag oh yeah yeah this is not fun there's no fog so I hope it's sunny wherever you're listening if you're listening to this in bright sunny Florida then uh great good for you good for you if you're not and you're in a drab cloudy day like us good for you you two better for you yeah better for you honestly not your vitamin D levels though yeah every mesh every Michigander needs to take vitamin D. Alright well thank you for listening to Ordinary Time go out and enjoy an ordinary day make today allow God to make even the ordinary extraordinary in Jesus' name. If you are not already subscribed following all those things do that ring the bells like it review it if you're interested in uh participating as a um uh giver I don't know what the word is if you want to contribute to Ordinary Time Podcast you can do that now um by giving monthly your one time gifts I don't know how it works or if it's tax deductible probably not um do it if you feel like it if you don't like do it if you don't want to great you don't have to we're not gonna give you any money that's not gonna give you anything except a high five if we see you and a thank you. Maybe we'll shout out uh new new patrons on the show.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:26

That'd be a good way to well what if they don't want to what if they're like they're embarrassed by that then you can remain anonymous I'm pretty sure but what if they want us to know who they are but they don't want the world to know then tell us.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:36

Email us. If you have any questions or a topic you'd like us to talk about uh you can email us at admin at ordinarytimepodcast dot com. Uh that's about it I think.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:47

Yeah sounds great.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:48

I like your green shirts by the way thank you I wear a lot of green because the green in my eyes.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:54

Yeah in the ordinary time.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:56

Yes. Great I try to wear green when we record because it's ordinary it is and it can remind you of spring. Yes I'm ready for spring. Alright God bless everyone and thank you for listening