The New Definition of Masculinity (And Why Your Relationship Depends On It)

Masculinity is being redefined — but what does it actually mean for a man to step fully into his power today? In this episode, we get honest about what happens in intimate relationships when the masculine is out of balance, and how our own marriage transformed as we learned to bring our masculine and feminine energies into alignment. This isn’t about old-school toughness or performative strength — it’s about presence, groundedness, and the kind of power that makes real intimacy possible. If you’ve ever wondered how personal growth shows up in a relationship, this conversation is for you.

Holos Healing: 30 Days of Somatic Meditation: https://darci-burke.mykajabi.com/offers/FXbMNHJ7/checkout

@safe2bseen

@holos_heal

@gettinlostisbeingfound

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

How do we look at men and and and define oh they have they have power, they have strength, they're a good man. It's not by their looks, it's not by their muscles, it's not how much money they make, it's not how many women they've been with or any of that. Like, true strength is is what you have been through. True strength is a man being so honest about himself and meeting his own depths and feeling what he needs to feel and taking accountability. That is strength. That is power. And so I thank you for doing that. And for not only me and for our kids, but for the world right now. Like healthy masculine leadership. Examples of that is so needed right now.

SPEAKER_00 0:57

So much of our lives are shaped by scripts we never consciously chose. Patterns around love, success, safety, and belonging. And at some point, those scripts stop working. What once protected us starts to limit us. Safe to be seen is a space for honest conversations about that moment when your body knows it's time for something new. We talk about what it means to build safety first, so growth, intimacy, and expansion don't come at the cost of yourself. This podcast is about updating outdated identities, softening survival patterns, and learning how to stay present through change. We're Darcy and Brandon, and this is Safe to Be Seen. So, Darcy, you know, the role of the masculine, the identity of the masculine, of men has changed a lot throughout the the course of human history. What when you think about healthy masculine manhood, being a man, what comes to mind for you?

SPEAKER_03 2:00

Yeah.

unknown 2:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:01

And it doesn't have to be, sorry, it doesn't have to be all inclusive or comprehensive, but just a few, maybe a few highlights, a few things that are at the top of your list or things that come to mind immediately.

SPEAKER_01 2:11

Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting because we're we're living through a genuine reckoning right now of the way that men and women relate to each other. And I think a lot of people feel it, but they don't have the language for it. And so it is our hope today to be able to offer language to that. But yeah, healthy masculinity, I would define it as presence. I would define it as direct direction. And I would defined it as groundedness. And, you know, these the old structure of the way that I used to view masculinity and it was underneath this internalized both systemically and through like spiritual patriarchy of like power and dominance and control.

SPEAKER_00 2:57

And is this you're saying how you even viewed it?

SPEAKER_01 3:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:00

And were you fully aware of that? Like, did you notice any conflict with that within you? Or was that just like, I guess that's just the way it is?

SPEAKER_01 3:09

Yeah, I mean, I was so unconscious. I was so disembodied from my own power.

SPEAKER_00 3:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:12

That I couldn't recognize that in the masculine. And I don't feel like before I grew up with like um in a I grew up in a patriarchal home. We started our marriage under a patriarchal system. I didn't feel dominance in a way of like I felt controlled. I didn't feel that way at all with my dad or with you. Um, but it was like this overall feeling of especially in like spiritual patriarchy, of like men lead, men have all the spiritual power, men decide, men get the final say. And um, yeah, I was just so unconscious to my own power.

SPEAKER_00 3:48

So you just accepted that?

SPEAKER_01 3:49

Yeah, I was like, I just this is the way that is, I guess, you know. And so I lived underneath that structure. But now that we've done our own healing work and we've come to recognize truly what these energies are and the balance and flow between us, and now I see it for where what it really is because I did my own work with my own femininity.

SPEAKER_03 4:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:08

And so it helped me see like what is the true, what is true healthy masculinity. And I think there's um like a framework within those like presence and groundedness and direction. Like masculine energy provides direction for the feminine to flow and to create beauty. And you know, patriarchy is the system where it's like power over instead of power with. And that's something that we have been learning to reorganize within our marriages is like this power with each other. And so I think healthy masculinity is groundedness, like he can contain himself, he knows how to hold his emotional body without projecting it onto himself or somebody else. It's emotional safety. That healthy masculinity knows how knows how to hold the feminine in that um integrity, like he follows through with what he says, and he has a vision that he holds to and doesn't collapse under pressure. Um so yeah, I that's how I would define healthy masculinity.

SPEAKER_00 5:18

That's that's awesome. How about you? I don't think we need to should we just wrap this up and like that, that's pretty much that's great. Thank you. I don't have really much to add to that, but um Would you did you say that would you say that you viewed how would you say you viewed masculinity before you can start healing?

SPEAKER_01 5:37

Like we had no idea about masculine and feminine energies. We didn't even say the words masculine or feminine in our homes.

SPEAKER_00 5:43

I had no idea what presence was.

SPEAKER_01 5:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:46

I was literally, Darcy, I saw myself as a machine.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

Yeah. I think a lot of men do, hun.

SPEAKER_00 5:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:55

I provide, I protect.

SPEAKER_00 5:57

No one will outwork me.

SPEAKER_01 5:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:59

Like I will work until I like the ends of the earth. I will do whatever I have to do to provide, which is great. Providing materially and and you know, physically is a is an important part of the masculine energy in essence, but we'll get into this a little later. It's not just about physical and material provision, is it?

SPEAKER_01 6:22

No.

SPEAKER_00 6:23

And what's really interesting is um how I I view the evolution of masculine, of the masculine, uh, of masculinity in having been really strongly affected by two things that have um they're kind of like woven into just human history. Okay. The first is that we as time went on and and and the human race evolved and technology changed and jobs changed, um, there became a for most of the world, not all, but for most of the world, there became a cessation, like a doing away with initiation. Where, you know, in in ancient times, primitive times, um more traditionally, what would happen was a boy would be initiated into manhood. And it was a fair it was a ceremonial process. It was something that was it was like a huge part of the people and the development of the boy into a man. And we won't get into all that, but I just wanted to make mention that we we've we've we've evolved in a direction that has taken us away from initiating boys into manhood, like a ceremonial, uh ritualistic, like official initiation. And why is that important? Well, it's been proven now through study of neuroscience that there's actually extraordinary, like it's it's really remarkable how humans knew this kind of stuff before science.

SPEAKER_01 8:21

I know. I always think about that.

SPEAKER_00 8:23

Yeah, how extraordinarily powerful it is in your psychological and emotional development as a human being to associate um ritual and ceremony and actually like that for example, uh in this initiation process, in some cultures, boys would be either um, you know, they would be scarred or tattooed, or they would go through some form of physical uh ritual that would help um like solidify, help this initiation from boyhood into manhood truly land. So it wasn't just like you know, reading them some highlights or like telling them what to do as a man. It was like, no, they went through this whole process. The second thing is that everything changed in this regard, as we talk about the role of men in families and in society and masculinity as a whole with the industrial revolution. Because what happened with the Industrial Revolution was where before the Industrial Revolution, the work life of a man was very closely associated with and integrated into his family life, meaning he worked at home or near home, on the family farm, some kind of trade that he, you know, he he learned, uh, and it was done like in or close to the home or a family business. And so the kids, prior to the industrial revolution, saw their father all day long. He was there. He was there. They saw him working, they saw him interacting with other people, with their mother.

SPEAKER_01 10:35

And they worked with him.

SPEAKER_00 10:36

And they worked with him, and they associated, there was like this beautiful integration of like dad isn't just a provider. He doesn't just like pay for things, and that's pretty much it. That's pretty much all we get from him. It that was all integrated into him. And the, you know, being being so close to the home and to the family and associating and um communicating and connecting with them pretty much all day long, all the time. He was right there, you know? And after the Industrial Revolution, men left the home to go work in factories and mills, and um and uh they began you know working extraordinarily long hours.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

Capitalism.

SPEAKER_00 11:26

Like sometimes 60 plus hours a week, you know, like 15, sometimes 15 hours a day for six days a week in these mills and these factories. And man, that changed everything because not only did it take the father out of the home, the man out of the home, and physically took him away. So there was not that interaction, there wasn't that like constant um association of dad with like the family and being around all the time to show us how we do this. And uh like he was gone most of the time. That that was part of it. But I believe what also happened was, and that it's not that work's a bad thing, but it's that so much emphasis placed on the provider role, the physical and material provider role of a man with the Industrial Revolution, kind of took us into a place where uh by and large, the man's main role was was provision. Like as long as he was providing, as long as he was making money, he was deemed successful. You know, that's it's like this, I see the uh the the evolution of masculinity happening that way. That like it went from an integrated man, a a fully like a man that was able to um, you know, we'll get into a lot of the aspects of of what we consider to be healthy masculinity here in a little bit, but like to strictly providing.

SPEAKER_03 13:11

Producing.

SPEAKER_00 13:13

Producing, yeah. And I think what happened too, Darcy, besides the physical taking away of the man from the like from the vicinity of the home where he was in constant view and in constant interaction with his people. In addition to the physical taking away, there was, I believe, it it seems to me that there would also be when a man is viewed, when he views himself or believes that he is viewed by others as pretty much strictly a provider, like he's just gone working all the time, there's a significant disconnection that happens within that man, within himself, the way he views himself. And when a man is disconnected from himself, from his body, from his heart, from his emotions, from his mission, he there's no way that he can be connected to anyone else. And so, anyway, I just wanted to touch on how I view, at least in most recent human history, like from late 18th century, going into the the 19th century and beyond, largely catalyzed by the Industrial Revolution, like the the role of man, the role of the father, the role of the husband, the view and the perception of masculinity changed a lot.

SPEAKER_01 14:54

Yeah, and it's changing a lot right now. And I I see with the feminine awakening and her reclaiming herself, what I see happening is men not knowing how to relate to women anymore underneath this new paradigm, underneath this new way of the of the feminine showing up. And what I see happening is women not needing men for the same reasons that they needed them before. And, you know, now women can take out their own loans, they can start their own businesses, they can provide financially for themselves now. And so the masculine's going, well, like, what am I needed for then? Like, why would you want to be with me? How can I, what's my role in this relationship now that I'm not needed for these things anymore? And it's creating like a shift, and I think a struggle that people are in right now that um is going to cause a lot of healing and shifting and relating to each other in a way that has never been done before. And also with that, I see with the feminine awakening, I see what's happening rightfully so, a lot of rage in the feminine for really coming to recognize her suppression, her mistreatment, the way that her body has been objectified, the power over her instead of power with her. And that rage is real. And believe me, I felt it a lot of that rage in my body, and the healthy femininity, healthy, a healthy woman in her feminine knows how to contain that rage. You know, uh without that containment, you're gonna burn down a whole entire forest. And so I see like don't with with women who are awakening and becoming more embodied and are seeing like the harm to women for so many years, the abuse, the sexual abuse, everything that's coming out with the Epstein files and these foreign sites that basically are teaching men how to take advantage of women. It's disgusting. Yeah, so a lot of women are feeling it. Yeah, and I just want to offer, like, yeah, feel it. Feel that rage in your body you're meant to feel that is gonna help you to create boundaries, but please do it in a way that it you are containing yourself because the last thing we need are more is more forest fires.

SPEAKER_03 17:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:37

Do it in a way, if you need to, ceremony, ritual, like light a fire, go dance around, go sting and yell, like whatever you need to do to feel and express that rage. Um, but in all of that, the only way that like this is really going to work as the feminine is awakening and she's becoming more embodied and alive and recognizing what has been happening in the world for so long is her to stay contained within herself, to not project her anger that's going to cause more harm, that's gonna cause more separation. You know, we we've I think what I'm seeing a lot happening is that women are now like generalizing all men are bad, all men are evil, our all men are unhealed. There's no good men out there. And that's just simply not true. And I am a champion of men. Like I do never would condone these sickening behaviors, these sickening acts on women, on women ever. It's gross, it's disgusting. I have no place, I don't I don't even want to really truly go there for what's been happening with that. But I do see like a lot of wounded little boys who were never integrated, who were never initiated, who probably experienced a lot of deep wounds themselves that were never healed and alchemized inside themselves. And so as the masculine is rising into his leadership and is because the feminine awakening is going to lead to masculine maturity. And we need to somehow, what we see right now happening is just this imbalance. Like patriarchy has been so internalized for so long, and all of these things coming out of the shadow that is being brought to light is because of that. And so, like, we're the the earth is always trying to find balance. Yeah. And these things are being exposed in an attempt to try to find that balance within ourselves and with each other.

SPEAKER_00 19:40

So you're saying the the inter what I hear you saying is it'll be really interesting to see how women, how the feminine responds to this deep rage, this anger, this justifiably this heavy emotion from having been, even if not themselves, just being a woman and having certainly someone that they know, or an ancestor, a relative, somebody connected to them, oppressed, abused, you know, marginalized, discriminated against. It'll be interesting to see how that is handled.

SPEAKER_03 20:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:35

And will it will it turn into um going to battle against men? Or will it turn into their own personal healing journey which will naturally cause the the masculine to to have to rise up with with the feminine.

SPEAKER_03 21:01

Yeah. Right.

SPEAKER_00 21:02

I think I really hope that it goes that way. I I I believe it will. I believe that the feminine rising will stimulate and catalyze a masculine awakening. And many, many men coming to know themselves after facing themselves and integrating all of their parts and and stepping into true, healthy masculinity. I believe it will. Yeah. But I hope that there's not, there's not, you know, I hope that that we don't turn against each other.

SPEAKER_01 21:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

Because that's I I believe that we are meant to meet. We are meant to rise together. And um, I think I'm confident that we that that'll happen.

SPEAKER_01 21:46

Yeah. And this also is going to expose lots of wounded femininity right now in the way that she is meeting the masculine right now. Because You know, with all that's happening right now and everything that's being exposed, um, the wounded feminism is going to look like collapse, it's going to look like projection, it's going to look like like all men are bad, all men are evil.

SPEAKER_03 22:17

Extreme feminism.

SPEAKER_01 22:18

Extreme feminism. And that's that's not going to help heal what's happening right now. And so it's going to expose a lot of of healing and and these these energies that are out of balance that are trying to come back into balance right now. So I think that it's it's amazing what's happening. It's beautiful. Like this, this, these, these energies that are trying to find balance again within the world. It's going to come with some pain, it's going to come with some grief, it's going to come with some anger. But the the best thing that anybody can be doing right now is containment work.

unknown 22:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:55

And feeling the emotional body without projecting, projection, without hurting themselves, without hurting other people. But allowing yourself to feel that.

unknown 23:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:07

Okay, let's talk about five. I have five things that I want to talk about, Darcy, that are no longer working. Meaning, okay, if let's say in this evolution of man, of the masculine, with cessation of initiation into healthy masculinity, and with the industrial revolution changing the way that man was able to be close to home and integrate his work into his family life naturally, five things I believe happened or have come about or have been introduced into the masculine that are just no longer working. The first is that the unhealthy masculine believes that they need to control. Not only control others, that's that's bad enough, but control their emotions or just be in control of everything, hyper-vigilant, always looking for like what they need to do to like control. And that's just that just doesn't work. And um the second thing is that suppression does not equal strength. And it's really important to understand that one of the most destructive things that have happened to men, resulting in their suffering and the suffering of their women and children and the world as a whole, is that men have disconnected from their hearts. They have disconnected from their emotions, they have learned that they must suppress everything, or they will be viewed as weak. They will be bullied as kids, made fun of as kids, um, called names, shamed, all the things that will cause a little boy to disconnect from his heart and his emotions. That's what happens to little boys. And so suppression does not make you strong. It does not equal strength.

SPEAKER_01 25:26

Yeah, and I think men right now are needing leaders and they're needing models of other men who can show them that you could both you could hold both vulnerability and strength at the same time, which was something that has not been modeled to men. Because vulnerability can be so difficult for men, mainly because it wasn't modeled in them before and for all the reasons that you just said.

SPEAKER_03 25:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:49

And that's what like a healthy masculine can be with his emotions, can be vulnerable and still hold his body and still contain his power in that way.

SPEAKER_00 26:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:01

So that's a huge one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

Yeah. Yeah, because a man that that can't feel, can't lead himself. And if he can't lead himself, how is he supposed to lead his family?

SPEAKER_01 26:13

Yeah, and if or anyone else. Yeah. And if he can't meet his own depths, he cannot hold space for the feminine sense.

SPEAKER_00 26:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:20

Because he doesn't know how to deal out with himself.

SPEAKER_00 26:23

The third one I have, Darcy, is that I already kind of touched on it when we talked about the Industrial Revolution, but the provider identity alone for a man is not enough. Like, I felt that before. And it wasn't to anyone's blame, yours or the kids, but I have felt before, just my own my own beliefs and fears and my own uh projections onto myself. But I have felt that feeling of like, holy shit, I am only good for the money that I make. I'm only I'm only good for providing. You know, and that's a terrible feeling. So for the men out there, I see you who truly feel that, whether your own limiting beliefs and fears, or whether, God forbid, someone in your in your world has made you feel that way, that is so harmful to a man to have that belief or to have that belief projected onto him that all we really care about is if you bring home the money, man. Are you bringing home the money? Okay, good. Then we're happy. You know, that provider identity alone is not enough anymore.

SPEAKER_01 27:40

Yeah, I see that and I feel that and I recognize that. Can I offer like a woman's perspective on that? Yeah. So I think with what we've been talking about, how how men and women have been relating to each other for so long. I think in that a lot of times what has happened is men have, okay, I'm going to provide for you. And if I provide for you, then you better give me this.

SPEAKER_03 28:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:06

Sex, meal on the table, take take care of everything at home. It's almost like this unspoken contract of like, I'm going to financially provide for you. And so you better show up sexually for me.

unknown 28:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:23

And the the women are over here saying, but yeah, I don't feel safe with you. I'm not feeling emotionally met by you. And I've been self-abandoning for a long time inside of myself, which has caused a lot of resentment, which has made my libido completely disappear. Because if you it's it's wild how much a woman's libido will come back online when she stops self-abandoning and she heals that resentment because she's being emotionally met by her partner. And I think that's what's been missing in this like, I'm only a provider, which is a wounded masculine.

SPEAKER_03 29:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:07

It's coming from a wounded masculine.

SPEAKER_03 29:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:09

But on the flip side of that, there's also like the feminine who is like, but well, yeah, but like, thank you for providing for me, but I need more than that.

SPEAKER_03 29:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:18

And that's why we're seeing this, like this chasm right now in relationships. Because women are like, I don't need you to provide for me anymore. You better learn how to meet me in other ways, or this is not gonna work. You know? So yeah. But I see men in that. Like, I understand how that would feel. Like, why am I why I I feel like the only thing that you guys value me for is bringing home the money and taking us on good vacations. And yeah, I understand that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:49

Thanks for offering that from your perspective. Um, the next thing I have come up with to talk about real quick in what is not working, but what came about through lack of initiation and the industrial revolution is performance over truth. Uh it's just, you know, men get so caught up in seeking external validation and needing to feel enough outside of themselves that they easily, easily try to find that in their work a lot of times. And so pretty soon, if you re if you, you know, these these four things that I've mentioned, you realize that you have a man who is disconnected from his body, his heart, and his emotions. He's learned to suppress. Being disconnected from himself, he's full of fear about what his what he really is. Is he only viewed for his money, for his provision? Um, is he only kept around for his paycheck? Um and you know, then you have this drive of a man who buys into that to be a performer, to be the best performer that he can be, because he's he's he's come to believe that that's how he is viewed. He is viewed and and accepted and and loved based on how well he does something. Because how well he does something usually equates to his provision, to his productivity. And all of a sudden you have this crazy skew of a I mean, we're talking about a human being who literally gets turned into a machine. No feeling, a performer, trying to control everything and everyone so that he can actually like have some kind of false sense of security and safety within himself. It's not true safety, but he you know, by controlling everything, he thinks that he's he's safe. It's it's it's it's really sad.

SPEAKER_01 32:18

Yeah, and I can see like that energy building up with you inside of you right now, just even speaking about it. And that's what I want to name is that these survival energies that you are speaking of, they take up so much space in a man's body. So much space that it leaves not a whole lot of room for him to be able to open up to these other ways that he needs to be met, and the other ways that the feminine needs to be met in his presence. And I think this is where like a lot of compassion comes in for men. You know, right now we're speaking so much about like the wounded feminine and the ways that she's been suppressed and the ways that she's been hurt, which is all true and valid. But it's also time to like be open and honest about the ways that men have been hurt and the ways that the men have been conditioned and trained and um literally wired to show up a certain way in the world, and that's where compassion and forgiveness needs to come in for women, you know.

SPEAKER_03 33:33

Thanks.

SPEAKER_01 33:33

And and then I hope that we'll see more women offering that to men because the only thing that is going to heal this right now in our world is love.

SPEAKER_03 33:40

Yeah, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

Love is the only thing that heals, not resentment, not anger, not fear. And so I hope that people can start recognizing that in men. Like there's so many wounded men out there that have been occupying these survival energies for so long, they don't even know it.

SPEAKER_02 33:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:01

And then they're overweight, they're unhappy, they're depressed, they're disconnected from themselves, they're disconnected from their partners, and they don't know what to do with it, and they don't know where to go with it.

SPEAKER_00 34:12

It's it's really it's so sad.

SPEAKER_01 34:15

It is sad.

SPEAKER_00 34:16

But I think you share the same view as I do. I am I'm so I'm so optimistic though. I really am. I'm so optimistic and I'm so grateful for my own personal journey that has um has has brought to light my own wounds, my survival patterns, and brought me back to myself. Yeah. And I really truly believe that that more and more and more men are going to be afforded the same beautiful opportunity to through their suffering wake up and heal.

SPEAKER_01 35:05

Um it's been uh it's been so beautiful to watch, honey, like your presence online and seeing the way that both men and women are responding and reacting to your message and the the masculine, like the healthy masculine leadership that you are providing, and the way that it's helping men come to truth and honesty with inside themselves. Like we need more of that. We need more men, healthy men online, speaking out about this, creating being a role model for people, a leader for men to look to of how do I do this and where do I go and how do I even begin? Because I think men want it. They do so badly, they just don't know, they just don't know how to find it and how to get there. They haven't had that role model in their lives, probably.

SPEAKER_00 36:00

They don't know. They don't know, most men, that they are actually stuck in boyhood.

SPEAKER_03 36:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:08

Inside, emotionally, psychologically, mostly emotionally. Yeah. But like, yeah, they just a lot of men just don't know.

SPEAKER_03 36:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 36:18

And that's why they think that manhood is all the things we already talked about. You know, that's just not working anymore. And they get to a point in their life where they it becomes painfully obvious that it's not working anymore. But they a lot of men just don't, they don't know what to do from there.

SPEAKER_01 36:34

Yeah. And it's it's I think it's scaring men so bad right now because as the feminine is reclaiming herself, reclaiming her power, reclaiming her authority, and becoming more boundaried in that, she's no longer saying or willing to parent her spouse.

SPEAKER_03 36:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:53

She's no longer willing to be the caregiver. Yeah. She's no longer willing to mother you. And so men are like, uh, what am I gonna do? Yeah. Where do I turn? And a man in that state can go two ways. He can become defensive, he can assert more power over her, he can try to control her more because he doesn't know what to do. Or he can actually, okay, I'm gonna take an honest look at myself. I'm gonna actually become sovereign here. I'm gonna take radical responsibility and accountability from my life. I'm gonna learn how to regulate my own body, and I'm going to like become the man that I everybody knows you can be, you know, and it's beautiful to see like these men stepping into their power and to set this example that the world is so desperately needing right now. And you did not come to this state, it just wasn't handed to you. Like you just didn't know what to do. Like you have gone through hell. You have met yourself in ways that you didn't even know needed to be met. And that takes tremendous, tremendous strength and tremendous power and tremendous courage. You know, we look at men and we're like, what defines strength in a man? What what what is like how do we look at men and and and define, oh, they have they have power, they have strength, they're a good man. It's not by their looks, it's not by their muscles, it's not how much money they make, it's not how many women they've been with or any of that. Like true strength is is what you have been through. True strength is a man being so honest about himself and meeting his own depth and feeling what he needs to feel and taking accountability. That is strength, that is power. And so I thank you for doing that. And for not only me and for kids, but for the world right now. Like healthy masculine leadership examples of that is so needed right now. So thank you. Thank you. Quick pause before we continue. One of the biggest things I see is that people try to change their lives from the mind, but the nervous system is what actually determines what feels safe, possible, and sustainable. That's why I created my somatic repatterning audios. They're short, guided practices designed to help your body release old survival loops and create new patterns through sensation and embodied awareness. If you're ready to move from insight into real integration, you can access the audio library through the link in the show notes. All right, let's continue.

SPEAKER_00 39:50

Thank you. So, Dar, as we head down the home stretch here in this episode, I thought we would just talk about a few things that that do define healthy masculinity. We've talked about the problem, we've talked about a couple of contributing factors to the problem, why they why they are there, we've talked about what's not working anymore and why. Let's talk about what does work a little bit here at the end, okay?

SPEAKER_03 40:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:18

So I'll start with um, I have for me at the top of the list of a demonstration, an illustration of healthy masculinity is self-leadership. Because to me, Darcy, I touched on this already a little bit earlier, but if a man cannot lead himself, he cannot lead anyone else. And so what does that look like? That looks like self-leadership is a man who is I mean, it's so many things, but for me, like at the uh at the top of of that list of of um self-leadership is like what how does he spend his time? Does he take care of himself, his body? How does he eat? You know, what's his relationship to exercise and movement? How does he like does he allow for himself to have like alone time? Um those are just some simple questions that a man can ask himself in regards to self-leadership. How do I take care of my body? Do I allow for alone time, or do am I just like, I can't stand to be alone? It's too uncomfortable. So I have to always distract myself and keep myself busy. Or maybe a man only wants to be alone because he actually is self-isolating because he he's so disconnected. He doesn't want yeah, he doesn't want to be around anyone else. But self-leadership for me is at the top.

SPEAKER_01 42:04

Yeah, we were just talking yesterday about the TV shows that we grew up watching. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:09

What was the one Married with Children?

SPEAKER_01 42:11

Married with children.

SPEAKER_00 42:11

Yeah. Like this to be to be clear, I did not actually spend very much of my time watching that show.

SPEAKER_01 42:17

I did. I watched it. But we were talking about these models that we had of quote-unquote masculinity in the home. That it was awful.

SPEAKER_00 42:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 42:31

They were overweight, outside potatoes.

SPEAKER_00 42:33

Albundi wasn't a good example of hecking masculinity. Come on.

SPEAKER_01 42:36

No. No. My God, no. So yeah, there's been so many things that have conditioned into us. Like, this is a man's role, this is a man's job. I work, I come home, I sit my ass on the couch, you better give me my meal, then you do it. You take care of all the kids, and then you better give me wild and crazy sex at night, and then we're supposed to start all over again the next day. And the feminine's like, now, the feminine's like, uh no.

SPEAKER_00 42:58

Except Al Bundy's wife wanted the wild, crazy sex, and she he was like, get away from me. That's true.

SPEAKER_01 43:05

That's true. Anyways, yeah, that's that's a huge one. Like you what you say to me all the time, you know, but a way that a man takes care of his body shows healthy masculinity.

SPEAKER_00 43:18

You know, you talk about, I don't even know if people use business cards anymore.

SPEAKER_01 43:22

Do they haven't seen very much?

SPEAKER_00 43:23

But you know when like business cards were huge. A man's business card, like billboard with flashing lights for everyone, whatever he's advertising is his body. And I'm not saying it has to be like model-esque or like you know, perfectly fit. But a man's body says a lot about himself. It it tells you, it gives you a a a pretty good idea of what's going on on the inside of that man.

SPEAKER_01 43:52

How he feels about himself. Yeah, for sure. And that's true for everyone.

SPEAKER_00 43:55

I mean, that's like, yeah, for sure. I mean, that got uh discipline, consistency, Uh, you know, the ability to push through adversity and and and discomfort, uh, you know, all that. Like how much self-love does he have? Yeah, man, the way the way a man takes care of his body says a lot. That's a really big one. And included in that, I want to add, Darcy, you know, in this self-leadership thing is is emotion. Emotional intelligence, I'll say. I I almost said control your emotions, but that's actually not what I want to say. That's the terminology that we used to use. You remember? Like I remember being told all the time, whenever I would lose my cool or whatever, why can't you just control your emotions?

SPEAKER_01 44:36

Which is the same for saying suppressed.

SPEAKER_00 44:38

Exactly. Yeah. And so I don't want to say control your emotions, I want to say emotional intelligence, which means which means that a man is able to feel, first feel the emotion and be so intimately connected to himself that he can identify the emotion, name it, locate it, where in the body, and then proceed accordingly. Like, is does the emotion need to just be sat with for a while? Does the emotion require some movement? Does the emotion require you to have a difficult conversation with someone? You know, whatever it is. But yeah, all that like lumped into self-leadership. It just is so critically important for a man to understand that he has no hope of leading anyone else, his his wife, his children, his company, whatever, if he can't lead himself.

SPEAKER_01 45:33

Yeah. I would like to speak to this a little bit more because I think this is so important. But I think this is where sovereignty is huge. Learning to be sovereign within inside of yourself. And what is sovereignty? You know, if you were, again, I we use this analogy but in a different way a couple episodes ago, but like a fish inside of a fishbowl, it only has enough choice within that, that, that bowl.

SPEAKER_03 45:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 45:56

Within its environment and makes choices based upon like its environment, which is very contained, which is very like limited. Yeah. You know? And sovereignty means you have choice. Sovereignty, you look at yourself and you say, okay, why am I making this decision? Why am I choosing to buy this product? Why am I choosing to act this way? Why am I choosing to behave this way? Is it because somebody told me? Is this am I doing this based upon somebody else's story? Some marketing effect that I have to have this. Sovereignty means you have conscious choice over yourself and over your world.

SPEAKER_03 46:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:37

And there's a lot to be said about sovereignty, but um that is required for both men and women to be in a place of I'm sovereign, you are sovereign, and we are going to meet each other in that. That's what creates polarity, actually. And I think for a long time, like we lived under this in this space of like we are one. We are one in all things. And that oneness is going to get us to where we need to go. But there wasn't a whole lot of like polarity created in that because polarity requires being a self.

SPEAKER_00 47:10

And it requires like difference.

SPEAKER_01 47:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:14

Desire like a positive and a negative charge on a battery. It's not that like if they're both positive or they're both negative, there's no flow of energy.

SPEAKER_01 47:22

Yeah, we need to be different. We're meant to. Yeah. We need, and and desire requires having a self. And I think that's something that has created so much polarity in in our marriage as we've healed. Is that really like seeing our true selves come to light and the color in that has been so beautiful for each of us to observe in each other. Yeah. It's created that that charge between us.

SPEAKER_00 47:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:48

You know? And it's not coming from a need basis, allow like a want basis.

SPEAKER_00 47:53

Yeah, I'm getting all horny, just you talking about it.

SPEAKER_01 47:57

Sorry, Kara.

SPEAKER_03 48:02

Okay. That's good.

SPEAKER_00 48:09

Don't cut that out. No, if you can keep it in, I don't care.

SPEAKER_01 48:13

Anyways, um, now that now I lost my train of thought. That's all right. Okay, what's the next one?

SPEAKER_00 48:17

The next thing is this is so, so difficult. It's it's crazy why this is so difficult, Thurce. But you can attest to how difficult I have had, a difficult time I have had with this one. Accountability over defensiveness. Oh my gosh, it's so hard when you feel attacked or you feel picked on or not enough, or one more thing that she's finding that I don't do right, nagging, whatever a man wants to say in regards to being shown or told that he can do better. When a man goes defensive instead of just taking accountability, it completely shuts down the connection and the intimacy. And so for healthy masculine leadership to exist in relationship, a man has to be able to take radical accountability for himself and his role in whatever is going on.

SPEAKER_01 49:23

That's so true. And also, too, with you know, speaking of like going back to the feminine waking up and these this new way of meeting each other is changing. I think really what like what the feminine is asking right now is just recognition.

SPEAKER_03 49:38

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 49:39

Like I mean, we just want men to say, listen, we see you, we recognize the ways that you have been hurt and abused and suppressed, and we have benefited from this system.

unknown 49:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:52

Just to have men say that, even if they haven't been actively a part of the harm, or they haven't done, they haven't abused another woman. Just for men to be like, I see you women, I see what you have been living under. Recognition will go so far in offering that to women right now from men. I've benefited from this. I'm sorry. Even though I haven't like actively been a part of it, I've benefited from it.

SPEAKER_00 50:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:24

Unconsciously.

SPEAKER_00 50:26

Darcy.

SPEAKER_01 50:27

A lot of men.

SPEAKER_00 50:28

What is your uh like just following up with that? What is your reaction to or what happens with you when I just take accountability? When I recognize what I have done may have been hurtful, or even if it's like not putting away my clothes, or like, you know, not not rinsing off the dishes or something like that, like it just like owning it.

SPEAKER_01 50:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:54

Genuinely owning it. What does that do for you?

SPEAKER_01 50:56

I mean so much. It creates polarity, one. It shows devotion. It shows that I mean something to you. It shows that you really care. And it also shows me how embodied you are and how safe you feel inside of your own body. Because a man that cannot take accountability does not feel safe inside of his own body. He will never want to admit that, but that's the truth. He does not have the capacity within himself to be able to hold that truth about himself. And so we're what everything boils down to the nervous system. What we're talking about is the capacity within a man to hold that.

SPEAKER_03 51:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 51:37

And capacity can be built and changed, but I I don't think men truly know what like what that does for the women in their lives when they they can just take accountability.

SPEAKER_00 51:50

I don't know why it's so hard sometimes. I mean, I do know why. We won't get into that right now. It's it's because the the little boy inside feels attacked, feels feels not enough, feels like he needs to defend himself. But I am so sorry. I apologize for all the times that like because now like looking back, and I'm not per I'm not saying I'm perfect at it, like I've got it figured out. I know I still mess up. But what I'm saying is I I recognize all the times that I just could not simply own my mistake. Like or either I wouldn't say anything, I would just move on, or I would like try to defend, rationalize, explain. Don't do that, man. Don't don't don't even try to explain why, like, you don't need to explain to try to soften it. Just own it.

SPEAKER_01 52:38

I mean, she just wants to minute. Yeah, she just wants to meet it. But with that brand, can we take a second here just to talk about like the feminine's the woman's role in helping men rise to this leadership? Because the women in your life have a role in this. And they're the like you want to talk about real feminine power. Real feminine power comes from a place of knowing how to meet the masculine so that he wants to rise. Yeah, he wants to be in his embodied power.

SPEAKER_03 53:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:04

And that's gonna take um like radical also responsibility for women and how what what the frequency that she is putting into the relationship that a man can also feel.

SPEAKER_03 53:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:16

And I want to speak to women who who have taken a lot uh on a lot of masculine energy. Like men can feel that. Yeah, and men want to feel needed, they want to provide, they want to give. And if you have a woman who's always like, I'll take care of everything, like I'll do it because I can do it better. I'll take care of all the kids, I'll make all their lunches, I'll do all the grocery shopping, I'll do all the cooking, I'll do all, I'll pay the bills, like just let me do it. I'll do it, I can do it better. That that's not the man's life, that's not the man's fault necessarily. Because for women to be able to like soften into your feminine energy, you need to create that flow with inside of your body so you can receive from the masculine, so that you can let him give to you which he wants to do.

SPEAKER_00 54:13

So bad. So bad. We want to give it all to you.

SPEAKER_01 54:18

Okay, anyways. Um, so there's healing work that needs to be done there, and I think men, you we always talk about how like women can feel men, like they can feel their energy, but men can feel women too. And they can feel when they're not needed, yeah, they can feel when um she's not soft and she's not accepting of receiving. And for a long time, I think I was like really in like a lot of my masculine energy, unconscious to it.

SPEAKER_00 54:52

Well, you had to be because I was not showing up.

SPEAKER_01 54:54

Yeah, that's true. It's it's this dynamic, it's this, it's this dance, you know, of like you're not you're not to blame for that. Yeah, I don't blame myself, but I do take ownership of like my self-abandonment was on me. Yeah, I was unconscious to it, so it's like I I have compassion for myself in that. But um, it's the way that you meet the men in your life. Like when you when you want something, when you need something from him, if you come at him like attacking, like you're so lazy, like get off your ass. I need you to do this right now. I need this done right now. Why can't you do this for me? You're not going to meet him in his power. You are not going to help him rise in his power when you talk to him like that.

SPEAKER_03 55:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 55:38

Instead of, hey, babe, um, like I've been I've been feeling this way. I've been feeling, I'm just gonna give some random example. Let's say there's like the yard is really messy, and there's like maybe tools out there or stuff left outside that is dangerous for kids to go play in, and it's causing stress for a woman because it's like she needs her kids to go play outside and to be safe. So there might need some yard work, there might need some fencing put in. And so if she approaches her husband, is like, you know, she's feeling the stress in her body, she needs help. If she approaches her man through like blame of like, why do you spend your Saturdays just playing video games or watching football games? Like, you need to go out there and you need to take care of the yard and like get off your ass and get this done, you know? And men what might like do it, but they're gonna feel resentment for being spoken to that way. Instead of like being able to commute communicate to your man your needs, he will meet you in those needs, being able to say, I've just been feeling really stressed and really overwhelmed lately because the kids have been in the house way too much, they can't go play outside because the yard is messy and it's making me really exhausted and it's making me really tired. And a healthy man will be like, Oh my gosh, you're right. I'm so sorry, babe. Like, I will get on that right now. So it's this dance, it's this, it's this polarity, it's this dynamic that you create between each other.

SPEAKER_00 57:09

Literally, this flow of energy like blaming you, it's not blaming me.

SPEAKER_01 57:14

And yeah, there are communication techniques, but communication can be faked. Yeah, it's the energy that you feel between each other. And so there's so many things that a woman can be doing to help men rise in their leadership, and one of them is to let them take care of you.

SPEAKER_00 57:29

That's good. Let them take care of you.

SPEAKER_01 57:32

Let them give to you and maybe soften a little bit in your feminine energy. Like I have people say to me, like, you look different. You've softened. Like, even like the structure of my body, I feel like has changed because I've allowed for like more of that softness and that that feminine and that receding to come into my life.

SPEAKER_03 57:56

Yeah, you have.

SPEAKER_01 57:56

And it's been so beautiful and so needed. Like, I thank you so much. It's been work that we had to do from each other. I think it's still a work in progress. I still sometimes have a hard time. Like, you you want to give to me all the time. And I there's a part of me still that feels guilty for taking from you.

SPEAKER_00 58:14

And I have a lot of love to give to just let me give it to you.

SPEAKER_01 58:18

I know. It's been amazing, but I think women need to become aware of the ways that they're blocking men from rising into their leadership.

SPEAKER_03 58:26

That's a good idea.

SPEAKER_01 58:27

And and women lead in their home in that way. Women lead by creating that energy in their home that men want to rise. Yeah. Men want to provide. Men want to hold that containment for you. But if they feel resentment, if they feel she doesn't need me. So I'll just sit on my ass all day and I'll just provide the paycheck because she's not letting me do anything else. You know? And for letting you let women really feel emotions in their body and to create that flow, because a woman who a woman who does not feel her body and doesn't allow for emotions to flow through her is going to create a really dense body.

SPEAKER_03 59:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:12

Density in all ways. And it's going to be closed.

SPEAKER_03 59:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:17

And um, so I just wanted to offer that. Like the will women play a role in that too.

SPEAKER_00 59:23

Yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 59:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:24

That's that's very, very helpful. So another thing that I have to talk about, um, Darcy, is for uh the healthy masculine leadership to be devoted to a mission. A mission which does not validate, it's not to validate him, it's not to stroke his ego, it's not, it doesn't even have to be his work, like his job. But uh the healthy masculine has a mission for which he is here, for which he is alive, and he will uh put that mission above everything and everyone, and that devotion to that mission is so important because uh if he's not completely devoted to a mission like that, he will stray here, fall there, be deceived there, like he will wander, he will leak his energy all over the place, he will be constantly caught up in everything that we've already talked about that doesn't work. Performing, um, thinking that he's only a he's only good for for provision, controlling, suppressing. So a mission for the masculine is extraordinarily important.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:58

So important. It gives their nervous system direction in.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:02

Yeah, it's really big.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:03

And it also provides, I see a lot of men not having value and not having purpose in their life. And I think this is also where sovereignty needs to be spoken about again, because sovereignty gives you choice. You're not acting off of roles that you inherited, scripts that you inherited, stories that you inherited. You're like, no, I'm choosing something different now. Like, what do I actually value in my life? Not what culture told me to value, not my religion told me to value, not even what my own parents told me to value. But like, what do I value?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:37

And not even what my woman wants me to value.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:40

What do I value as a man? And forming your purpose based upon like letting your life revolve around those values, which will then drive your purpose, which will then drive your mission.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:52

Very good. I have um the healthy masculine leadership will look like never create, not not wanting to create conflict or seeking out conflict. However, when inevitably conflict arises, he welcomes it. And why does healthy masculine leadership welcome conflict? Because it's he knows that it's in the conflict that intimacy is deepened. It's in the conflict that he gets to, he has the privilege of seeing where he is still not free. And so welcoming the conflict because you understand the role of the conflict, that it's not, it's not, it doesn't have to be destructive. It doesn't have to mean, oh great, here comes a big fight with my wife. You know, and if that's the case, that's just an old pattern that needs to be looked at really closely as to what like you and I always talk about like conflict is okay. It's how effectively and how quickly do we repair.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:10

Yeah. Right? The depth of your relationship is revealed is revealed during conflict.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:15

Yes. So it's it's a it's it's it's an important, necessary part of a relationship. And um, yeah, I just I I wanted to make sure we noted that because all too often, Darcy, men who are not connected to themselves are in some form not quite in their healthy masculine, they will run as far and as fast from conflict as they can. They will shut their voice down just to make sure that no feathers are ruffled. I work with men all the time who tell me, like, I can't speak my truth because if I do, it will cause a dumpster fire in my house. And it's so sad.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:02

Well, so what exclusion is that, do you think?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:05

Well, you have to you have to speak your truth. Like you're not responsible for what people hear you say. You're only responsible for what you say.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:13

So ultimately, Brand, what is the deep fear with inside the masculine? If I voice my truth to you and you're not contained and you you you lose yourself on me, you create this storm, what is that what is that going to do to them? Like what what is the deep-rooted fear in the masculine that will do to him?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:34

There's a lot. There's a few, okay? Not being seen. Like if a man does speak his truth and he is shut down, or he is dismissed, or to whomever he's speaking, spe starts to defend themselves. He feels unseen. And he confirms his own belief already that he's not seen. He just confirms it. He's looking for it, he confirms it. So it's a fear of not being seen, it's a fear of rejection. Like a some men I work with who I'm trying to get them to open up to their partner, to their wife, to their girlfriend, whatever the case, and they're just like terrified. And I'm like, look, it well, it just becomes very clear to me that they're they're they're afraid of they're expecting to not be seen, you know, to be shut down, dismissed, or whatever, but they're also in that they're so terrified of being rejected. They're they're terrified of confirming one of their greatest fears. And that is that they will be rejected if they speak their truth. And so again, it takes them into this world of I'm just a provider, I'm a machine, I'm here to produce, I'm here to protect my family from. Burglars and robbers, otherwise, like I just keep my mouth shut.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:04

Yeah, it's so sad.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:05

It's so sad.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:06

And I think also, too, they're probably fearing like if I voice a truth to my wife and she loses herself, she can't contain herself, she explodes on me in this big fight, you know, the chaos that's gonna bring. She might not want to have sex with me for a few days.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:23

And I would just rather hold it all in so I can get these other things met.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:28

And it's just not a healthy way of holding that relationship.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:33

You know, masculine energy is direction.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:37

And you're not providing direction for that relationship to grow and to build if you are just suppressing your needs.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:47

And you mentioned this in a previous episode we recorded. But what's really tragic about any human being who holds in out of fear of conflict or rejection or whatever along those lines is you sooner than later, you have a human being who you don't even really know.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:09

Because they're not speaking their truth.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:11

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:12

So you don't know them.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:13

And if you're married to a person like that, whom you don't even know, because for lack of a better way of describing this dynamic, they're being completely fake.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:24

Yeah. Intimacy requires They're putting on a facade.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:27

They're wearing a mask, and intimacy requires authenticity and vulnerability and truth.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:32

Being known.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:33

Yeah. You talked, you talked about this, and this is your area of expertise, so if you don't mind just taking a few minutes, I I have next that healthy masculine leadership is it we already talked about like emotional intelligence and that process. But I wanted to talk about nerve like nervous system specifically. Like I feel like healthy masculine leadership needs to be able to regulate their nervous system. And I'm not talking about remain calm all the time when I say regulate their nervous system. I'm talking about um a man being able to be fully expressed in his truth because his nervous system allows it. His nervous system allows him internal safety. And sometimes we miss, we we kind of we think regulated nervous system equals calm. That doesn't regulated nervous system equals being able to be fully expressed, being able to be um grounded in your truth. And if you just want to speak to that for just a minute, if you have anything to add.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:49

Yeah, I know. I mean, I mean that's beautifully well said.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:53

But I would just say that nervous system help comes down to capacity. And when you have a man that doesn't know how to be with his emotions, that doesn't know how to be with his wife and her emotions, that doesn't mean there's something wrong with him or that something broke it. It needs, he needs to build capacity within himself to meet himself and to meet his partner. And capacity, like I said, is something that you build over time. Um, and you build capacity by being with discomfort in a healthy way. And you're right, like nervous system regulation should actually be called nervous system expression. Yeah, it should be called resonance. I love the word resonance so much more than regulation because resonance to me speaks of aliveness and coherency and energy flow. And you know, like it's so much more about energy and that dynamic. And um men have a lot to express in so many ways. Yeah, sexual expression and movement and intelligence, and like men have so much to offer this world, so much that I'm so grateful for. And I think that men need to become more connected to their aliveness. Yeah, they need and all these ways that you've spoken about, and all these ways that you show on social media, dancing and playing music and presence and truth and accountability. That is nervous system regulation. It's being able to like, like, well, what do you do when you feel anger now? How do you express your anger now in a healthy way?

SPEAKER_00 1:10:26

Um, I have a few different ways. It depends on the level of the anger and where it's coming from, but um I'll do anything from express anger through resistance training, you know, through some type of movement, through I like to drum. I like to and don't think that every time I'm drumming, I'm angry because I drum a lot.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:50

You do, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:51

It's it man, when you really get drumming, you really get feeling that music flowing through you. And if you have some anger that needs to move, it's really helpful. Percussion, you know, you're hitting, you're hitting the drum. And so maybe if you hear me hitting it really hard and like it's getting really loud, maybe then you can know that I'm moving some anger. Hey, it's okay. Um breath is really big. Being connected to your breath and being able to literally move energy through your breath, whatever the emotion is, but is is is useful for anger too.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:23

Okay, see, men, that is regulation. Yeah. And I think what happens is that men throughout the day, they have so much pressure. They they don't offer the space within themselves to be able to move these energies through their body. And it just builds up and it just builds up and this builds up. And then they come home and they explode on their wives and they explode on their kids, and they take it out on, you know what happens when you're dysregulated? You take it out on the person that you love the most, which is so sad, but it is so true. And um the opposite of that, of that, like the reframe around that, is that out of all the billion of people, out of the eight billion people in this world, that I get to be the one, you get to be the one that helps bring our bodies back into safety and back into appearance and back into regulation. And it's not a job, but it's like a devotion to each other, being, hey, babe, I'm more resourced right now. Like you always say this to me. Like I'm feeling really resourced right now. Like, I got you. Where do you need to like surrender more? I can do more for you right now. And sometimes maybe I might be a little bit more resourced. And just being in agreement with that and conscious of that, so we can work inside that dynamic. But the most powerful man in the room, I've said this before, the most powerful man in the room is the most present, is the most contained. And it's an energy that you feel long before words are ever spoken. And um, yeah, like I think men need to slow down. I think they need to um stop performing. I think they need to stop trying so hard to make so much effing money in the world that they forget their like what they really have to offer.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:06

And to be connected more to their truth and to express that. Like the world needs it in a healthy way.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:16

So good. Thanks, Dave. Do you have anything else you want to add before we close up?

SPEAKER_01 1:13:20

No, I just want well, I just want to say that I'm a champion of men and I'm a champion of the work that you do, and so grateful that there are male leaders like you stepping up, being honest about their story, being honest about the weights that they have carried, the pain that they have felt, the harm that they have done, and the ways that they are moving through that, and the ways that they are becoming the men that was just um filtered through this all these other lenses and through this fog that they couldn't even see themselves.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:01

And I hope that men can listen to this episode and to feel hope. And coming from a woman of like, I see, I see men. I do. I see your pain. I see the ways that you've been wounded, I see the ways that you have had to carry so much in the world that uh maybe even your own wives haven't even recognized. And um that I I hope that men can live in a world where they can be fully expressed, they can feel free, they can feel powerful in a way that meets the feminine and that does not dominate her. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:38

There's nothing else I need to add to that. So thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:41

Yeah, I love you, made him proud of you.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:43

Thank you. I love you so much.