Raise the Boats

Jonathan and Tom try to work through their anger issues, but get stuck on the horrors of Trump's Big Beautiful Bill, rising floods and sinking boats, and AJLT's wild writing misstep.

Transcript

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Tom: [00:00:00] What's up? What's 

Jonathan: up? Episode three. We did it. We did it. How did we do it? Oh, man. Determination, grit, and determination, and blood, sweat, and tears. This 

Tom: is no Homo with Jonathan and Tom. I'm Jonathan. I'm Tom. 

Jonathan: What are we doing here, Tom? 

Tom: We're two best friends. One straight, one gay, riffing on their daily lives.

The insanity of current events, what it means to be a man and gassing each other up all the world. Earns. 

Jonathan: That was so good. Also, you peaked out like that whole time. We just spent so much lovely time trying to figure out this sound. So I think just for everyone's sake, maybe we'll cut it out. Maybe we won't.

Maybe we'll leave it just like this. Either pop down your gain, just a touch and do it again. Or maybe just, just come down on the Uh, Nope, not that one Go up. Nope, not that one. Yeah, there you go. See this is it. It's DIY show. It's DY. We show all the strings. We're not here to try to hide and look like we're anything better than we are.

We are figuring this out. So, um. Let's try it again. Let's try it again. 

Tom: Two best friends, one straight, one gay riffing on their [00:01:00] daily lives. The insanity of current events and what it means to be a man gassing each other up while the world burns. That 

Jonathan: was beautiful. Thank you. That was beautiful. Thank you.

Thank you. Excellent work, man. 

Tom: This is episode three. Uh, we're recording this episode on Monday, July 7th. Uh, we're now gonna start telling you guys the date 'cause um, we don't necessarily know when these are gonna come out. We're aiming for Thursday mornings. 

Jonathan: We're making, we're taking hot off the presses current events and giving lukewarm takes on it.

So we gotta, we gotta let you know just how, how timely it is. That's right. That's right. That's right. Lukewarm takes on hot topics. 

Tom: So let's, let's do a little check-in. How you feeling about the podcast so far? 

Jonathan: Um, what are you hearing? 

Tom: What are you feeling inside your 

Jonathan: heart? The world is a buzz for no homo, no.

Um, it's, it, it feels good. I think that the feedback from like from the world has been positive. You know, I don't think it's, you know. Our friends are listening, which is great. And if no one but our friends ever listen and we still get to hang out once a week and talk, then that's great. For sure. You know?

Um, I think some 

Tom: strangers too. [00:02:00] We've got two listeners in Brazil. We've got two. Oh yeah. What's a Brazil? Two in the Netherlands. All right. We've got two. There's a couple other countries, so it must Nice. I think they must be Jona fans. 'cause 

Jonathan: I don't know who these people are. Did you, Dr. I think you might have just officially, uh, dropped that here.

I don't, yeah, I don't know that you, that was the first time I dropped it in public. Right. Viewed it. Okay. 

Tom: Jonathan fans 33 listening across the aisle. You know, your fiance Beyonce 

Jonathan: asked if I had okayed that and I said, absolutely not. He just came up with it on his own, but I do like it. It's fun. Thank 

Tom: you.

It's fun. I like it. Thank you. Thank you. They needed a name. Yeah. I'm feeling good. We're, we're hearing, you guys are telling us which sections you like in our hodgepodge of. Topics. Yeah. From, and just like that to Gaza. We, we, we, we, we do actually really appreciate the feedback we're getting. Please keep it coming.

We're listening. Yes. Uh, the podcast will probably keep morphing the more we learn about what's working and 

Jonathan: Absolutely. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: Um. And the like, we just dealt with it a little bit, but we really are DIYing so much of this, so it's been like, not only just having it out there, having the finished part of it out there, but the, but the process of finishing the product has been its [00:03:00] own Oof.

It's rough its own journey. It's rough. You know, I've, I've heard that some big time podcast duos have, uh. Like a couple's therapist and like I see that, I see, I see the, I see the, the value in that, you know? Yeah. We, we got a little snippy with each other last week. I think we did a great job though. I think we got snippy.

Yeah. And then we recognized that there were other things outside of uh, uh, you know, it wasn't you I was mad at. It was the bigger, like frustrations at large that I was not, it's not you, it's the dirt. 

Tom: Yeah. No, it's, it's, it is good we're, it's forcing us to communicate more, uh, which is good. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and it's just a lot of work.

So if anybody else there. Wants to edit a podcast for free for two, 

Jonathan: two sweet guys. Yeah. You get a special, a specialist. Thanks. At the end. You, you do. Tom will read you a beautiful, a beautiful thanks. Um, and maybe some swag. Yeah. Um, we'll get that. Uh, yeah, I mean. I, I'm proud of us for figuring it out, but yeah, it's, and I don't think anyone wants to hear too long about all the tech blah, blah, blah that goes into it, but boy, oh boy, [00:04:00] there's a lot of blah, blah, blah.

Yeah. Yeah. What are you, what 

Tom: are you hearing? Are you hearing anything in specific from people? 

Jonathan: Well, um, it's funny you ask. I did get, uh, a little feedback and, um. It hit in a funny way because a friend of mine, um, who's been very supportive of the show and listening all along, and, um, she is, I grew up with her in my hometown in Alabama.

Um, and she let me know that, uh, someone that she still keeps in touch with, that I haven't talked to in years. It's a dude that I went to middle school with, um, that I knew from when I was a kid. And, um, he is. Still in Alabama and still kind of of the mindset there. It sounds pretty regressive thinking like he sounds like he's not really putting much work into, you know, learning anything new.

Um, so kind of a dick and, uh, I guess, I guess one of our clips came across his page. Um, so he was, he reached out to her and was like, Hey, is this that kid that went to our middle school? And also how fuck is my algorithm that it's sending me no homo stuff? And like, so he, she told me that, and she told me in a way of like.

Saying it's good for the world. It's a good that we're doing this, that it's getting out there. But I, [00:05:00] uh, I would be lying if I said I did not feel. Uh, immediately like a 12-year-old, again, like the, the little dude who is trying something artsy but is getting made fun of for it. That is, you know, smaller and slider and the redneck dudes that are on the football team are just gonna like, have a, a field date talking shit about it.

I mean, I doubt smaller and slider now. Well, yeah, you at least got that on him. But, you know, that's why I got, I mean, I couldn't affect my height, but that's why I got, uh, stronger. 'cause I, I was just tired of getting picked on. So, all the stuff you see, all the, all 

Tom: dude, honestly, this is the best you've ever looked.

Jonathan: Thank you. Yeah, I mean, you know, I've been a fan since 

Tom: 2007, but like 

Jonathan: I do 

Tom: know and I appreciate that, that white t-shirt. 

Jonathan: Well look. Yeah, I mean, we're, I think we're both wearing 'em. Well, thanks, man. Um, we, let's just sell white t-shirts as much. No, no, no. Branding. Just white T-shirts. We're just like a, we're a target.

We're just like a 

Tom: That's [00:06:00] amazing. 

Jonathan: Get your needs, get your shampoo, your t-shirts, your socks. Um, no, it was, it was, uh. It's funny that you say that. Yes. Uh, the any muscles that you might see came from a, a, a place of fear came from a place of, uh, being tired of getting picked on and wanting to be able to do something about that.

Um, but kind of to that, that same end, and I don't know, to, it helps me get over that, that feeling like that aggressively like othered feeling and kind of outcast feeling, um, helps me get over that because the same friend told me that, um, she has a daughter who's just like. By getting older, like in her later teens and is like figuring out who she is.

And like her, you know, her sexuality is kind of in flux and her, her preferences and her just who she is, she figured it out as one is going to do. Um, and my friend said that she had sent over some of our clips and so life was helping that she felt like it was helping to show that there are. People that, you know, it's not just, it's not just [00:07:00] North Alabama out there in the world.

It's not just there, there are people who think differently and I, I don't know. There's no, there's no rude, no reason to, to pat ourselves on the back or anything. But I am glad that one of the reasons I wanna do this, even though I still have a residual fear of being othered by bullies, is that I, I think it's important that for me, at least someone who looks like me and sounds like me, uh, and is from where I'm from, uh, still.

Can say, look, whoever you are, you're okay. If you, you figuring you out is what's important. Don't listen to whatever else, whatever bullshit anyone else has given you. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: Um, you know, so whatever else we're doing here and however much fun we're having and whatever happened on HBO Max this week, uh, still, I think at the end of the day, it's pretty cool that we can, at least in some small way, be able to say like, yeah, man.

Hey. That's amazing. You're, you're good being who you are. Yeah. You know? 

Tom: Yeah. That's great. Yeah. I'm still, I'm struggling, man. I mean, I told you episode one, this is, this is probably one of the scariest things I think I've ever done, and that, uh, has not gone away. Episode three, uh, it's still there. Um, but [00:08:00] when people, uh, reach out to me with really thoughtful, um, things to say about the podcast, that means a lot to me.

And, um, uh, it means a lot that people are listening and, um. Yeah, it's really fucking scary to be so vulnerable. I don't like it. I'm usually like, I do everything I can to not do this. And, uh, I know, you know, it's, you know, it's fucked up. A little part of me wants to put it back in the bottle. I know. I'm not gonna lie.

I know 

Jonathan: the, that's the problem. That's the, the reason, one of the reasons that we did this is because when you and I talk, we get into it, we can be, yeah. Super vulnerable and we can get into the deep stuff and we can even like. You know, as well as anyone can like, analyze it and, and kind of work to understand it for what it is.

Um, but putting that out there for the world is a very different thing. It's very different. I don't like it. I don't like that makes me 

Tom: feel, 

Jonathan: I'd rather just talk about, um. It carry shoes. But we do, I think have, I think we, I think it's good for us to keep trying to do that, keep pushing to be more vulnerable and, um, you know, open about this stuff.

Tom: How was your weekend? [00:09:00] Anything? 

Jonathan: My weekend was good. Oh, I do have one thing. I'm gonna put this out there now, especially since we're asking for editors and thanking everyone for listening. I, I need a recommendation because I feel like we have classy listeners. I feel like the people that I know that are listening, I trust their sense of style and I trust them as.

Uh, classy people and I need a recommendation on new pillows. Uh, and this feels like the setup for an ad, and it would be if we had sponsors. We don't yet. This is a genuine ask. My wife and I were at, uh, my in-laws this week. Um, and you know how everyone, like I, I, I think this is a pretty common thing, like the guest room pillows.

Suck. Like the guest room pillows are the hand me down pillows. Yeah. You get new pillows. The old ones go to the guest room, so they're like starting as kind of deflated pillows. Yeah, and that's, I get that. I get that. That's fine. Um, but my wife had the brilliant idea, um. Of taking our current pillows from our house and putting them at, uh, our, my in-laws in the guest room where we stay a lot during the summer.

Uh, 'cause they're wonderful hosts and wonderful people and there's nothing, there's no personal slight that they have bad pillows, but [00:10:00] we're gonna take our still decent pillows, put them in the guest room there, and we need to get some new ones. Yeah. And I just feel like there are people who listen to the show that are gonna have good recommendations for pillows, so I'm 

Tom: sure, I'm sure.

Bring on the pillows. Hit us up in the comments. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. 

Jonathan: Yeah, good. And then we'll sell those, we'll sell white t-shirts, we'll sell shampoo and soap and, uh, pillows. We'll just be like

with no logo, no logo at all. Just, just fully unbranded stuff. Although I gotta say again real quick, um, I gotta, um, um, uh, a message from someone this week that, and from London that they started following me on Instagram because they saw my, uh. Paint nails punched Nazis shirt out in the wild in London.

Someone was wearing it and they asked about it and yada yada the person. So I don't know who was wearing it, but if, if you were wearing it in London, then uh, reach out to us because, uh, you spoke very highly of the, the campaign and the merch and the person was, um, excited and jumped in and started, you know, we started, it's [00:11:00] chatting about it.

Amazing. So, yeah, it was cool. Amazing. That's cool. It's 

Tom: good for 

Jonathan: you, man. 

Tom: That's amazing. All right, well, I think it's time to move on to our most controversial, uh, section of the podcast. The, just like that recap. We do have one fan, at least one fan, who thinks the podcast should only be, and just like that.

Podcast. For those of you that don't love this section, we're gonna try to push through it faster than we have. We'll try, we're gonna try. We, we know, we know it's been dragging. Um, and also this show will be over soon. The season will be over soon. Um, but I, I need to come out right outta the gate. I owe Jonathan a big apology.

Um, we did many, many test episodes. Six months, six months of test episodes, six months. They're in the vault. Uh, there, there will be a paywall at some point, and you guys will be able to watch them. But in, in one of those episodes, Jonathan, uh, kind of ragged pretty hard on it just like that. 

Jonathan: Which is funny because of the two episodes we have out, it was way worse than that.

Like the, the one that it was I was given, I was given the feedback to pull way back. 

Tom: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I, 'cause I felt like re rewatching it later. Like it was [00:12:00] just a little mean-spirited. And, uh, Jonathan's an actor, a very talented actor, and I was like, do you really wanna put that energy out there?

And so we decided to pull it back a little bit and, um, but the reason we even started doing this section is 'cause your takes on it. Just like that we're so funny that we wanted to include it. And I have to say that in this last episode, um, Lisa Todd Wesley's father passed away and, um, it, it is. Lisa, this is the second time.

Lisa. Todd. Wes. It's tragic. It's tragic. It's so tragic. It's happened twice. The lightning 

Jonathan: literally struck twice. Her father has died twice in the run of this show. This three seasons show Three seasons. 

Tom: Three seasons worth the show in the first season of the of and just like that. Uh, Lisa told one of the characters that her father had passed away.

I'm pretty 

Jonathan: sure it was Carrie after Big died. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. She was like, I know what this feels like. This is what I felt like When my dad died, 

Tom: her dad died, and then in season two they introduced Billy D. Williams as her father, which by the way, made major character 

Jonathan: way. Anytime you can bring in Billy D.

Williams is a win, so I get it. That Totally get it. They 

Tom: always have great 

Jonathan: guest stars. [00:13:00] Yeah. 

Tom: Yeah. And then just last this past weekend, he passed away. And there was a big funeral and it's cost quite an uproar. And I have to say that I feel like the gloves are now off. I think we can be as mean as we want to.

This horrifically written show. Yeah. This is so bad. This is HBO Max. Yeah. This is the pinnacle of. tv. tv Yeah. Sex in the City is as was at 

Jonathan: one point as highbrow as they come. The height of the zeitgeist, that was the, it was the apex of zeitgeist. Yeah. Yes. And now it's, now it's a joke. Now it's 

Tom: the fact that they didn't catch this.

Yeah. And like, did they catch this or did they just decide to ignore it Because what's, and I don't know what's worse. Yeah. Because just deciding to ignore it, that's what they do on General Hospital. That's what they do on a soap opera. Right. That's been running for 60 

Jonathan: years. Right. You know, who else does that?

AI programs who don't really know what they're saying. I still stand by the theory that the show's written by ai. I think that somewhere in the algorithm, in the bot, it has something about Lt. W's dad. Yeah, yeah. And they just, the bot doesn't really know what to do with it. It just [00:14:00] cycles through the same storylines and it just is like, oh yeah, Lisa's dad, they have to do something with it.

It's 

Tom: so bad. It's so bad. It's so bad. And I've, you know, I've been listening. They have like a writer's podcast. Yeah. So every week after the episode airs, they air a podcast episode where the writers sit and basically. Wax poetic about how talented they are. Like they love, love work. This whole, this whole thing with the dad dying twice has just turned me completely in 180 and I have no support of the show anymore.

Yeah. And we are here to rag how terrible this show is. It's just, but also we'll stick to it time. We know, we know that people don don't want to hear. We gotta move on. We gotta move on. 

Jonathan: But we can take a moment. We can take a moment because it, it is, it is insane. But, uh, I wanna say, um, when, when Lisa's father died for the second time, tragic.

Um. She had to go talk to his, uh, secretary Uhhuh to for some funeral drama. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: And so she goes, I guess, over the bridge to New Jersey to Newark to meet this woman. It's the most. Racist fucking scene. It's, she, they literally, she like, it's like, I thought we, when I thought chicken 

Tom: [00:15:00] waffles hot sauce. Yeah.

In like a, in like 

Jonathan: a funky, like a fucking, I thought like a, like a get shorty kind of funk vibe. Like it like, like, like shaft is somewhere around. I thought I was watching a commercial. Literally I thought it was an ad for another HBO show, like in between cuts. And then I realized what was happening and I was like, this is the.

This is just horribly, this is just aggressively racist. This is just, this is what it was like black people in New Jersey. This is what, that's why I think it's a bot. A bot like is just gathering information is like, okay, I think we've been able to form what black people in New Jersey do. Boom. Here it is.

It's so offensive. It's pretty bad. And then there pretty bad. There's I, we have, we will move on, but like they have to fit in a time to show a giant dick silhouette and then. Everybody around the giant dick silhouette just, just falling over themselves, forgetting the words that they wanna say, like losing their minds.

I have never, I've seen the outline of some giant dicks in my life, really. I'm, I'm sure I'm not the expert in the room on this, but Sure, of course. Alright. I hang out with your that sometimes. [00:16:00] Let's 

Tom: put a pin in. Wow. Let's put a, 

Jonathan: let's put a pin 

Tom: in that 

Jonathan: one. But what I'm saying is I've never watched anyone lose their mind so much that they can't, like, finish the sentence they were saying.

Yeah. And ju or go out of their way to buy bread from a place that just because the people there have giant dicks. That's the only, there's, there's, he's a sexual predator. My charact is character is a sexual predator. 

Tom: What kind of editor wears colored shades when they're editing? Yeah. The final product of a documentary.

Okay. I would fire that person immediately. 

Jonathan: Except for there is one, there is one possibility here, Uhhuh, that they're, that they're, uh, blue light blockers. They're red, they're red lenses for blue light blocking, but 

Tom: he wears them everywhere. Which 

Jonathan: you do. Yeah. Which you do. In computer work for a long time, which you might do.

But this, this fits to me, it fits as another proof of ai ai 'cause you would not wear them clearly. You would not wear them. Yeah. To color correct your, your TV show to edit and color Correct your TV show. You need to see all of the colors. You would not be wearing blue blockers for that. So I think it took a [00:17:00] zeitgeist thing and was like, oh, this is something people in front of screens do.

Yeah, but you're right. He does wear 'em all the time. So who knows? Who fucking knows? Who knows? Alright, moving on. We moving on? We gotta move on. Can we, can we do a, can we do a spinoff that really is just shitting on it for 

Tom: I wanna Shit on the Big Beautiful Bill. Oh, okay. Yeah, dude. Dude, I this piece of.

Legislation is so horrific and has just been passed in like in the cover of night. Um, the, the whole way it went down last week is so crazy. And what, what's crazy to me, and this is going back to my original soapbox from episode one, is how few people in this fucking country even know that this bill was passed or even know how bad it is or even know how bad it is for them.

Um. I mean, just to go through some of the, the, the things, if people don't know, there's major cuts to Medicaid and snap. Uh, they're gonna require work requirements for both of those that basically are a way to get people to not meet them. Uh, they're selling public land, they're clean energy tax cuts. So forget about trying to save the environment for all your children.

All you [00:18:00] Republican children are gonna die, um, loopholes for big oil to make more money. Blocking AI regulations at a state and local level. More money for war. ICE will become the largest police force in the history of our country, which is scary. These are the guys who don't wear name tags and wear masks.

I mean, this is how police states are formed. Yeah. This is how, 

Jonathan: um, it was what was the per I saw it and I don't know, I don't have it written down here, but like, is it 40 grand? A 40 grand? Uh. Salary increase per head. Like every, every ice officer. Oh, I, I missed that. That's crazy. Like the numbers are, so Yeah, the numbers in there are like, I think it's 

Tom: 170 billion to immigration enforcement.

A hundred 

Jonathan: billion. Billion, yes. Billion dollars. 

Tom: Yes. But cutting health insurance and food for, um, people who are doing less well, and, and of course the whole crux of this is. A major, um, tax cut for millionaires and billionaires. It's 

Jonathan: the largest transfer of wealth from poor people to old people in the history of America.

Is that true? Is that the true Yeah. Yes. It, it is. [00:19:00] The, it is the largest theft. It is the largest transfer of wealth from young people to old people. Yeah, which is the opposite of how it should happen. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: That's not how, yeah. A civilization is supposed to work. 

Tom: No, no. I, and I was talking to a friend of mine from high school, uh, someone who reached out to me about the podcast, um, said some really nice things and, um, I was joking to her about some.

Jock that we went to high school with, that I always had a crush with. And I was like, do you think Jared, Jared Leto ISS watching? And I mean, it wasn't Jared Leto. I wish, but do you think he's watching it? He'll, he'll realize he always loved me. You know, I'm just setting her up for some witty comeback.

'cause we always joke about it. I know he's not watching and she said that he. She doubted it and that he once said to her, I don't understand why you give a shit about anyone else in the world. And it really like, it really hit me a that 'cause I actually like, sort of really liked this guy, aside from the fact that I thought he was hot.

We always had sort of like a, a fun connection in high school. I thought he was sort of like smarter and more with it than he like let on in class. And uh, [00:20:00] and, and, and so I was like sort of, uh, really. It, it, it hit me really hard that thought, and it made me think, is that really kind of what it all comes down to?

I think it's what it all comes down to. 

Jonathan: Yeah. 

Tom: You either care about other people or you actually just don't, and your whole life, your whole outlook on life, your whole political viewpoint is. Revolves around whether you are just looking out for yourself and your own, or whether you believe taking care of everyone as a whole, all boats, whatever that saying is.

Rising. All. All the, yeah. Yeah. Rising. Rising. No. Raising all the boats. Rising Tides the boats. Raise the boats. Raise the boats. 

Jonathan: Raise the boats. Rising tides. Raise all ships. That's right. Thanks. Raise the boats. Raise the boats. Raise the boats. 

Tom: Raise. 

Jonathan: Raise the votes. Um, yeah, I, there's, there's a clear, um, I, I think there's a clear connection, uh, to a lot of the stuff that's going on.

A lot of the toxicity, a lot of the divide, um, that, yeah, it's like the, it's like the, the difference in scarcity [00:21:00] mentality and abundance mentality. Like I was talking about that with my kids recently. It's like, oh. Kid kids that you watch them start life and they have a scarcity mentality no matter what, because they're just brand new to stuff.

They don't know what it is. They, once it's theirs, they need it. They have like, they, they have to find something to trust and something to ground themselves and something to connect to. And none of it has been there long enough for them to trust any of it. So they, they need all of it. They need to hold it.

And so we try to like, and so you what, what doesn't work? I think we've seen generations of this make this clear, like, can't just yell, like share with, share that, share. You have to share that. It's like. You have to like convince a small child there's enough, like it's okay. Sharing is actually better the way you're gonna have more fun with this.

Now you get to work with someone who will work back with you and you can enjoy that and you can get things from them and you can give, you know, like that's how the whole thing works. But it has to come from a place of not being so worried you're gonna lose your stuff. And I think that there's just such a scarcity mentality for like these, like these people that like, because, because the truth is even if you don't give a shit about people, it, it's actually really shortsighted to think that you can just [00:22:00] like.

Do away with the bottom third of Americans, and then they're gonna just like, what? Die or walk away or just like, go somewhere else. They're gonna fucking come steal your stuff. Like, that's how it works. Also, who's gonna, who's gonna make your 

Tom: McDonald's 

Jonathan: bro? 

Tom: Right, right, right. Like. 

Jonathan: What do you Yeah, yeah.

Tom: You know, uh, is, is empathy. Is empathy learned? Is empathy, is empathy something you're born with? 

Jonathan: I think that empathy is something you're, let's see. That's a good question. I think that you're born with it. I think that you're taught, I think that, that you're taught to be scared. I think that scarcity mentality can, I'm not sure.

That's a good question. Now I'm not really sure 'cause I'm looking at it through the, like my kids' eyes. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: Uh, they do have to be taught the idea of sharing. But I, I think that the idea of like. This is what I talk to my kids about. That stuff you're feeling inside right now, you know how you're feeling that stuff inside.

Everyone feels that that's what we, that's what this is. That's what we're all doing, is like feeling that stuff. And when it doesn't feel good or it feels very lonely, or whatever it is that you're feeling, I feel that way too sometimes. And I, I, I guess maybe like, if you don't ever make that connection and so [00:23:00] maybe you don't, maybe empathy is learned and you 

Tom: Yeah.

Can go 

Jonathan: with, you can, you can go without learning that. I don't know. Yeah. 

Tom: I mean, I'm, I, you know, I, I think I understand that it exists on some sort of continuum and I would. You know, dare say, maybe I experience it too much. Um, but, uh. Yeah, I don't know, man. I think about when I was a kid, um, you know, we were, uh, people, people would make fun of people on welfare and on food stamps.

And like I remember at a young age in grade school, like knowing that that was something to be ashamed of. And like the kids that, the kids that got free lunch, like. I remember being really relieved. I wasn't in that line. Yeah. Looking back on it now, my parents probably really could have used me to be on that line.

Yeah. That would've really helped us out. But I was so relieved that I wasn't. And then I remember, um, my aunt that, my aunt that I'm the closest to, um, somehow at some early age talking to her about food stamps and she told me about a friend of hers who had just gotten out of a really [00:24:00] bad marriage from someone who.

I mean, I didn't, I was young, I didn't hear the details, but I get the sense that it was not good. She had a really young son, so she was a single mother trying to pull herself up by her bootstraps and she told me, you know, my friend was on food stamps for five years and it helped her during that really hard transition.

And then she got a job and eventually she went off them and that at, at a young age, 10 years old or whatever it was. Then I understood, like I was able to understand why food stamps could help someone and this, uh, God man, I just. Really don't understand how so many people 

Jonathan: Yeah, I, I mean, I don't know. It's just that fear is easier to stir, right?

Yeah. Like fear is, fear is an easy emotion to, to get moving and to fear's an easy motivator. And so I think that, like, one thing that has, I mean I, that's, that's kind of like the know the Republican party as a party, uh, certainly has done better at clocking the. Capacity for evil in people or, and the, the capacity to lack empathy, whatever negative capacity is.

Like they, yeah. They're able [00:25:00] to really capitalize on and weaponize that Yeah. That spot, that fear and that, that lack of empathy, um, and really make moves there and like, like really lean into that and use that. And that's what all this shit is. Like, this, this stuff is all this, this, this stuff is insane.

It's so, it's so bad for the economy. It puts us in such a bad spot when it comes to interest rates. We're gonna get. Fucked on our deficit. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: And all also the, the rich can get richer. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: That's, that's all it is. Rich families are gonna get richer, rich old people are gonna get richer. Their kids are gonna stay richer.

Yeah. It's, it's, it's pushing inequity. I. It's, it's fucking putting our whole economy on a tightrope and hoping that it all goes well with a whole bunch of stuff that's never happened before. Yeah. Which just seems highly unlikely that it all goes well for the sake of making the rich richer. 

Tom: I mean, no human society with this much, um, wealth division has ever lasted.

Yeah. Like it becomes a breaking point at some point, and we're nearing that. Um, yeah. I want to talk a little bit about the. The floods in [00:26:00] Texas this weekend. Yeah, because I, I do think it's connected. It's terrible. Yeah. Um, I think the death toll last I heard is up to 95. Geez, 27 of those were, uh, the campers that were at Camp Mystic.

Um, uh, and, and you know, people, you know, we always hear this thing of, we, we don't want, obviously our hearts are breaking for these families and the people that went through this. Um, but I, I feel compelled to point out of. Care County is one of the number one counties where this devastation happened. Um, Republican in Care County in 20 24, 76 point 51% of the vote was for, uh, Donald Trump.

Democrats received just under 23% of the vote. Um. People in Care County have come forward and said that there, there exists technology that could have predicted and given warnings for these floods and Care County decided not the taxpayers won't pay for it is what uh, one Care County judge came forward and said, um, national Weather Service in that area, the San Angelo office.

[00:27:00] Um. They have, they're, they're missing a meteorologist who took the early retirement package that was offered by Doge, the Doge cuts earlier this year. That's why, that's 

Jonathan: why the, the people of Care County think they can save a buck by not getting it for the area. 'cause they're gonna rely on the National Weather Service and they're gonna rely on the federal, uh, level of this, except for everyone just got cleaned out.

Everyone just got given early retirement packages or fucking cut from Doge and they haven't gotten their job back yet. And it's like, this is, this is what happens. This is what happens when you. Put an irresponsible child with a machete in the room. Like it's not just silly and it's not just like, mean, it's deeply dangerous.

We lose, like if you, there's plenty of waste. There's plenty of waste in the federal government. There's no question about that. I'm sure that there's plenty of ways that we could, we could tighten that up. But when, when your lack of evidence is your reason for cutting something, the, the lack of evidence means that it's working.

Yeah. Like, like, like when we, when we haven't had more outbreaks for, you know, for years and when we don't have major weather problems, when we have, when infrastructure works, it's because the, the pieces are in place for it to work. [00:28:00] And you start cutting those and you get cavalier about cutting those, and this is what happens.

People fucking die. And I, it is awful to, I, in no way do I want to politicize the death of like a hundred people. That's horrible. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: But like. There has to be some accountability. Look at this. This is be, this is because services were cut. This is because jobs were cut. This is an intentional move. Yeah.

To take away from the things that keep us safe. 

Tom: I think we should politicize it. I don't really fucking care. 

Jonathan: Yeah, 

Tom: right. You're right. It's, it's a tragedy. It's terrible. They shouldn't have died. And there's reasons that it happened. Yeah, you're right. Avoidable reasons. You're right. I take 

Jonathan: that back. Yeah, you're 

Tom: right.

Fuck that. Fuck that.

Oh, man. You know, we, we, we started this podcast. One of the reasons we both started it is 'cause we were both feeling so angry about the state of the world. 

Jonathan: This does help. This will 

Tom: help this, is this one of the reasons why I got this case? 

Jonathan: Yeah, that's a good reason. This is Phish everybody. This 

Tom: is Fish's debut on no homo.

Hey Fish, if you're listening, she's quiet right now. You can't, you can't. You have to watch it on YouTube. 

Jonathan: Um, [00:29:00] yeah, the anger component was like a big part of, a big part of this, uh, starting this in general. Um, yeah. And then we've gone through so many different, like, people, people saying like, and even us feeling like feels pretty angry.

Like we're leaning into that. Yeah. We both feeling it. Yeah. Yeah. I I 

Tom: was feeling like I needed an outlet for it. Yeah. I remembered one thing I wanted to say about what we were just talking about. Yeah. Which is, I, I feel so grateful that there are people in the world that studied the weather because I did not study the weather.

I studied fucking musical theater. If you wanna hear a. An essay about why pal Joey featured the first anti-hero in musical theater. I am your man, and you will be entertained by what I would tell you. 

Jonathan: Absolutely you will. But I Can you get a one man show of it too. It's question. You can get a 

Tom: one man show, but I cannot tell you about floods and when they're gonna come.

I cannot predict hurricanes. I am so grateful for experts and I don't understand why we have in the last. 5, 6, 10 years of this Trump disaster. Why we have villainized [00:30:00] science and why we have villainized experts. Yeah. I think something really beautiful about the human race is that over time we have siloed into these things and we've all decided I'm gonna be an expert in this and I'm gonna be an expert in this.

And we can all, all the boats. All the boats. All the boats. All the boats. Raise the boats. The boats, all the boats can be raised. Raise the boats. Yeah. We can work 

Jonathan: together. Yeah. It's so, it's so counterproductive to society to. Try and stop that to try and, I mean, first of all, it's fucking dumb. Why are there so many people acting like you know, something about the weather?

Same thing happened, like, and we are not gonna spend any time on COVID right now, but that shit happened all the time through COVID. Like you, why, why you fucking some dude that barely passed biology in high school? You're gonna argue with national scientists and doctors. Like, shut up. Shut, shut up. You have a weird feeling about it.

Shut up. I'm so tired of that villainizing knowledge and somehow, uh, raising the idea of ignorance and like. Anger and ignorance is somehow, uh, championed. It's, 

Tom: yeah. 

Jonathan: Uh, so anger. So we, uh, we've both, we've both been a little [00:31:00] angry. We have, we have, 

Tom: we have. It made me think about this story, you know, this story, but I want to tell it 'cause I think it's a good one.

I've been excited 

Jonathan: for you to tell this story. Yeah. Like, since we had this idea. Yeah, 

Tom: yeah, yeah. So, Jonathan and I met a long time ago doing theater. Uh, I directed him in a bunch of plays. Um, and for many years I ran a theater company in Astoria, New York, the Astoria Performing Arts Center. Um, I was the artistic director there and, um, this was maybe like 2010 ish, a hurricane before Hurricane Sandy, maybe Irene.

Jonathan: Yeah. 

Tom: Um, it was like August and I, we were operating the, the theater was producing out of a, uh, church in Astoria and we, we took over, they had a large gymnasium with a huge stage and we transformed it into an off, off Broadway house. And we, we. Kept everything there. All our stuff was there, our props, our costumes, and bef at the beginning of every season in the summer, I would go and I would like sort of get the space ready.

And so I, I had spent a weekend there getting this space ready and doing a lot of cleaning and like, like physical labor. And I was outside of the [00:32:00] church and it was, um, like the day before the hurricane was coming, but there was something in the air. There was like an energy in the air. You could feel the weather was getting weird.

And uh, this guy was walking down the street and he was this little. Pit bull of a man. He was like, um, yeah, five four or something, but like sort of muscly little pit bull of a man walking his little pit bull dog. And he's just one of those people that had like a cloud of, um, anger around him. You could just see it as he came and I'd seen him before walking his dog in the neighborhood.

Wow. So he walked right in front of me with his dog and they, they, they, they stopped in front of the church and his dog took a shit in front of the church. And then the guy had little shit bags with him, whatever they call those. Mm-hmm. To pick up, pick up your dogs. Poop shit. Bags we're sell shit to you by the way.

We'll sell some shit. Bags and pillows. And he picked up the the shit and wrapped it in the bag and then he left it on the sidewalk, right where the dog had just pooped, but in the bag. And I, uh, uh. A, a, a wellspring of anger induced by the coming hurricane, like [00:33:00] welled up within me and the guy went up the street and turned the corner and I picked up the bag and I walked up the street and I turned the corner and he saw me and I was holding the bag and I was like, I think you dropped something.

And the look in this guy's eye, dude, he unleashed on me. I've never been. Assaulted in this way. He didn't physically attack me, but he got in my face. He threatened to attack me. He threatened to kill me. He called me a fucking faggot. It was like 10 or 15 minutes of, he was just coming at me and he, he, he turned like a color purple, and it was like, it was like lighting a match.

Um, and I think, I think a little part of me knew I would do it by handing it to him. And I don't know where the fuck I got the balls to do it. I don't know what I thought I was gonna accomplish. Um, and it was bad. It was scary. I've never been more scared in my life until we put out this podcast. Um, and so I was, I was freaking out.

And then this, uh, a friend of mine, a, a costume designer who I was meeting with, came around the corner at the moment and helped me dis diffuse the situation. We went back inside, he went away and, [00:34:00] and I. Was scared shitless and I thought about it for a couple days. Flash forward a couple days later, there's a yoga studio down the block for me.

I have lived, I lived in this apartment for a while at this point, like 10 years, and I had never used this yoga studio. I had never done a yoga class in my life and I'd been curious about it. It was 32nd walk from my apartment. Seemed like a great way to exercise, but I had, um, sort of psyched myself out of it.

It's that little like fat kid from gym class. Part of me that was scared to do yoga for the first time and didn't know if I'd be 

Jonathan: sure. 

Tom: Like, make a, make a fool outta myself. So I, yeah, for sure. I, I didn't do it somehow. 

Jonathan: Yoga's scary. But lemme just say, let me give you some like, like the, like, uh, thank you.

Validate that yoga, scary. Especially the first time. Yoga's scary the first time. It's so, it's a real ingroup not scary 

Tom: as outside. It is. Yeah. But it's like 

Jonathan: real ingroup. Everyone fucking loves. It's a real click. And they, it might not be, they probably, it's very welcoming, but it feels from the outside feels very like in group.

And some, some 

Tom: studios can be that way, I think more than others. Very intimidating. Yeah. So I'm with you on that. I get that. So I finally got up the balls like three days later to go to this [00:35:00] yoga class. Took my first yoga class. It went really well. I, I, I, I was proud of myself. At the end of the class, the, we were, we were sitting, um, and in, in like a.

Indians. What, what do they, you can't say Indians cross applesauce. Crisscross applesauce. Thank you. Yeah. Um, and we, we were, um, we were the, the teacher told us to send positive energy out into the world, to someone we loved. And I thought about someone in my life that I loved. Mm-hmm. And then she said, now I want you to imagine an enemy.

And I want you to imagine having a conversation with them and I want you to send them positive energy. And this thing had just happened with the guy. Mm-hmm. So I literally imagined having a conversation with this guy. I imagined him coming towards me and apologizing for how he had just behaved the other night.

And I sent that energy out in the world, dude, a week. Later I was back at the church I had, was standing out in front of the church alone, and I see him come around the corner with the dog. My heart was in my stomach. I was like, I'll go, here we go. I'm gonna get the shit beat outta me. He came up to me. I got, I'm, I'm getting shivers down my spine as I [00:36:00] tell you this word for word, what I heard in the yoga session.

He apologized. Wow. We became friends. I still have his number in my phone. I would get him free tickets to every show we did from then on. Like, uh, yeah. So there's a lesson in there. I'm not quite sure what it 

Jonathan: is, but it's somewhere in there. I'll tell you, I'll tell you what though. I think that, that, I don't know that that thing, that, that thing that, uh, hippies do, yoga instructors and, uh, me guides, um, Samara Levitt does this like once a quarter, where at the end of a meditation it's like, all right, give love to someone you love and then send love to someone you don't love.

Then send love to everyone in the whole world and then send love to yourself. And I tell you what, I fucking cannot. Do it. Like I can do, I can do the first one for sure. It's easy to think of a person and I can do the second, I can do the one that's like someone you hate, someone that you're mad at. And I can kind of like get to the place of like, I understand how the energy like it's will be better for all of us.

Better for me if I don't ho hold this. [00:37:00] The one for everyone is hard because I just, I don't know how I feel about humanity. Yeah. It's hard to really like do that and I'll tell you what, I feel it, I feel, I feel the crust of. S defense mechanisms around me when it comes to the give it to yourself. And I like can't, it's like, I feel the block because, uh, like it's kinda like you popping off in that moment, like that was building from somewhere.

You've, you know, you've been holding onto something that got you to that point. Yeah. And like, that's just like, that's autobi, that's biography for me, that's like day, day one stuff that, like, the earliest things I remember are people telling me that I am too angry and I was just fucking stressed. I was like, I had anxiety about.

Everything. My, I don't think my parents are listening to this, so I don't think it will really matter, but I, if they do, I'll, I'll hear about this. I'll get grief for this, but like when I was a kid, I remember they, and they just didn't get it. They didn't understand what was going on. So I understand that I can forgive them for that, but I like they always would joke like.

That I would, I was real quick to cry, like I was a real cry baby. And I would [00:38:00] cry like even as, as I was getting older, even in elementary school, 7, 8, 9 years old, I would cry like when my sandwich fell apart, you know, like in the insides fall out of a sandwich or whatever, and I would like lose it. I would start crying and they would like laugh about it.

And at the time, all I could think was like, yeah, I, I have, I have no control over my emotions. I am, I'm miscalibrated. I am doing, I'm doing this wrong on the inside. And then it wasn't until later in life I was like, who the fuck laughs at a child? Who's that stressed out like that is clearly an anxious child, like.

I get that. It's funny. Take a fucking moment and try to acknowledge, like I, I think that it's because I went through that, but now with my kids, when I see them get stressed out about something, frankly there's no reason to get stressed out about, they get upset about something. I have to think like, why is this such a big deal to you right now?

And that's not, that's not just empathy. It's because I remember what it feels like to beat. To be convinced that I was crazy, that I, that my, I, I just spent so much of my life not having a, a grounded center because I thought my emotions were [00:39:00] miscalibrated. I thought that I was just like. Doing it wrong or like built wrong.

Yeah. And I like could, I didn't know how, so it's been like faking it, like trying to figure out what to do with this anger and never learning a healthy, uh, outlet for it. Never learning how to do anything else with it. Just squeeze it down and push it to the side and that doesn't work at all. It just gets weirder and harder at some point.

Yeah. And well, I have 

Tom: two things I wanna say. One of anybody in my life. You are the number one person I know who's like doing the work to figure this shit out. So, and it's working. So, uh, thanks man. Thank you. Yeah, for sure. And also like you're a great guy and a great father, and your brothers and sisters are pretty great people too.

So your parents did something right? A hundred percent. Yes. 

Jonathan: A hundred percent, yes. Yeah, I don't wanna just say that they, that was just one thing. I think they just didn't have any idea what it was like to have like an anxious child, like a, like a high stress. I mean, I'm not sure if 5-year-old should be high stress.

So I get it. I get why they were, I get why they didn't understand that. 

Tom: What were you, there's a little part of me that wants to like, fuck with your sandwich. The next time we're eating a sandwich together. [00:40:00] 

Jonathan: I'll tell you what I used to tell people. If you think that I'm such a, a menace when I get mad, why the fuck would you wanna make me mad?

You think it's fun, you think you wanna see it, you wanna see. It's a little fun when you get riled up. You like it 'cause you're like, oh, you wanna fight, you wanna take it? Let's take over clothes and fight Uhhuh. 

Tom: Oh my God, if, if we f***ed I would try to get you mad all the time. It's 

Jonathan: such a lose lose for, it's such a win-win for you.

I won't say it's a lose lose for me. It's a win-win for you. You, you make. You could make me mad and then it's a win-win for you out that. Yeah, I kind of think it'd be a win-win for you too. I get it. Yeah. I mean, yeah, it would be. I get it. It would be, we should try.

I think that our most, I think that the, I could be wrong. Like I think that our most popular clip online right now is the power bottom clip, as you explaining to me what power bottom is. Yeah. Yeah. 

Tom: We're we're getting a lot of mileage outta that. Yeah. Yeah. It's alright. You know what, it's time for. Yeah, I do.

Who would you fight? Who would you fight? Who would you fight? Fight. [00:41:00] Pow. Pow. Why do you change the timing? What are you doing? What 

Jonathan: are you doing? I'm trying to follow you. No, you have, you said it. I'm jumping in. I'm catching the wave it. You're the rising tide on the boats. Raise the boats. Raise the boats.

Raise the boat. Alright. Who are you fighting this week? I think it should just be, I think it should just be your thing. Just to be clear, I think that you're gonna do it from now on. Okay. Um, I kind of thought you said that last week, to be honest. That's why I just. Like went, oh, maybe this is the first one we edit.

Do it again by right now. We're not gonna waste time on it, but do it again right now. Go. Who would you fight? Who would you fight? Pow. Pow. Okay. You also did peek out through that whole thing, so let's do it one more time. Oh, no, no. I refuse. I refuse. Who are you fighting? Okay, I'm gonna fight everyone. Uh, all.

All them. All everyone. Period. Bye. And close episode. Good news is I've fixed my anger issues. Bad news is I'm fighting everyone in the world. I wouldn't fight everyone who used the economy as a reason they were voting for Donald Trump. People made me feel very dumb because I would say things like, yeah, I don't fucking actually know that how [00:42:00] economies work.

So maybe, maybe you're, I think that he's a grifter and a conman and a buffoon, but maybe I'm wrong. Maybe you see something I don't see. Well, the big beautiful Bill, uh, is projected to add at least $3.3 trillion to our deficit so you can fuck off with your economy talk anymore. I will fight you. 

Tom: Yeah, it's really dumb.

I, I, my empathy, I'm losing empathy for people that voted for Trump. Yeah. I really don't have empathy for them. I, I hope terrible things happen to them in their families as a result of their actions. I really do, including people I know, including people that I have known for many, many years. It's hard because 

Jonathan: like we, we.

They voted. They voted. These are the things I voted for specifically. We said this is what's gonna happen. This is going to be bad. This is what's coming. And I, and I was told, you just don't understand the economy. You don't understand how, yeah, the economy works. Alright, well fuck off. It's $3.3 trillion at least.

Yeah. And arguably I think I heard, no, I'm not gonna give false because I didn't vet this unvetted, predict unvetted prediction. The big beautiful bill might kill up to 51,000 people a year because of the losses in, uh, Medicare and uh, funding for people. You mentioned this fact to me, it's a [00:43:00] scary fact.

Scary fact unvetted, 

Tom: but scary fact. If it's true, maybe next week we'll tell you guys where that fact came from. Yeah. Um, I want to fight people who are into conspiracy theories except for the one I just said. Except for that. Another, like, I get, I get, I get the appeal. I do, I get the appeal. There's, but you know, I saw JFKI, I get conspiracy theories and I do think some of them are real.

Like people obviously keep shit from us. People in power keep shit from us. Yeah. That is real. But I think that. There people have taken this ID people who are into conspiracy theories and build their whole personality around it, and their whole outlook on politics and on the world. It's a really dangerous, dangerous way to approach life.

And if you have kids, if you have grandkids, and this is how you approach the world, you are not setting these people up for success. Yeah. You're not setting your loved ones up for success. So I wanna fight people that. Um, think school shootings were actors. [00:44:00] Actors, 

Jonathan: paid. 

Tom: Actors. Actors. 

Jonathan: Get the fuck outta here with that.

I have challenged Alex Jones to a fight. Never heard back from him either. I had challenged him to a charity fight, um, because fuck that motherfucker for making, I don't even, he's not a conspiracy theorist. He's just a grifter. He just made millions of dollars off of convincing other people to be conspiracy theorists.

Tom: He did. Did Jeff Bezos get back to you? Is he fighting you? 

Jonathan: He hasn't. I think he's still on his honeymoon. Um. He'll, he'll watch this after the honeymoon probably. But I did, I submitted the, uh, challenge via Prime, so it's supposed to be a two day, so I should be, I should hear back from him. At least he's already missed his prime window to get back to me.

Amazing. Um, alright. I think that's it for 

Tom: the episode. We did it. We did it. 

Jonathan: You wanna read us out or am I reading us out? Sure, yeah, you do it. I'll do it. I'll do one, uh, for, for funsies. Okay. All. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please make sure to like and subscribe to No Homa with Jonathan and Tom on all podcast platforms and YouTube graphics and music by Matt Ladner.

And special thanks to Jen Dornbach, Quan Williams and Forrest Malloy. The opinions expressed on this podcast are solely those of the hosts and are [00:45:00] intended for entertainment per purposes only. I got close. I got so close. 

Tom: I got so close. 

Jonathan: Thanks guys. Thanks for listening. All right. Bye. I love you. Love you.