Some Cults Are Good

Jonathan is officially a “runner” after completing his first half marathon — and yes, his nipples survived. The boys riff on male body dysmorphia, how it shows up differently in straight and gay communities, and how it shapes their own relationships with exercise and body image.

Transcript

Tom: [00:00:00] What's up? What's up? 

Jonathan: We did it. This is 

Tom: no homo with Jonathan 

Jonathan: and Tom. I'm 

Tom: Jonathan. I'm Tom. What's the good news brother Tom? Yeah, hit it. This is episode number 18. We are graduating high school. We are, uh, we just got accepted into college. We can vote now. Yeah. Uh, we got, we can get enlisted. Uh, is that what it's called?

Um, uh Drafted. Drafted, that's right. Yeah. Um, and we are recording this episode on Monday, October 20th. Um, 

Jonathan: and a lot of states we know, uh, we're legal in a lot of ways and some states we've been legal for many years. Um, anyway, what does that mean? Didn't we? Just didn't? Some states just lower the age of consent to like 14.

Really? There's some, yeah. Let's not get into it right now. Yes, it's gross. It's gnarly. I love that it's released the files anyway. Yes. Yeah. Somewhere, 

Tom: somewhere in the south, I bet. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yikes. Probably. Um, what are you wearing? What is this look? Whoa, this Oh, 

Jonathan: what? Huh? Oh, this, oh, this whole thing. This, oh, this whole thing.

I, I dunno if you knew, but I'm a runner. [00:01:00] I'm a runner. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: What was that? I ran a half marathon this weekend for the first time ever. I, I, I, I ran it, I don't know if you could call it the whole, the whole thing running, but I didn't walk any, I, I was at a jogging pace. I ran a half marathon, 13.1 miles in two hours and 16 minutes and 37 seconds.

Um, wow. Which, yeah, it was incredibly difficult. I mean, it is supposed to be, but um. It was, I'm a runner now. You know, there's nothing, what, what is it? A 

Tom: half marathon again, like, not like the whole New York marathon, but half of it. 

Jonathan: Yes, it is. Yeah. Well also, you know that the marathon is like marathons happen all over the place.

It's just 26, 2, 2 miles. 

Tom: Yeah. The length is always the same. 

Jonathan: Yes. So like the, yeah. So then a half marathon is 13.1 miles. You ran 13 miles. I did. Point one. Don't forget the, the 0.1 was actually the worst part of it. The 0.1 was the hardest part. Where was this? In Long Island, uh, with some friends out there.

Um, and, uh, they, they [00:02:00] run the, a couple, they run pretty frequently. And, um, they were kind enough to stay like with me most of the time. And then the last couple of miles, uh, he took off. He's got, he's a nice, he's a nice leggy gentleman, um, that runs pretty fast. Who's this? So I'm not gonna talk about that right now.

He's not, he doesn't wanna be famous yet. Um, who are these runner friends that I don't know 

Tom: about? 

Jonathan: Wow. You would, I I, you would remember him from, uh, one of the rugged days of building things here at the house. He's one of my rugged, manly friends from Long Island. Oh yeah. 

Tom: Yeah. Um, did, did you win, did you, did you, did I win?

No, you 

Jonathan: and you and Caleb. You and my, you and my 6-year-old son, like, I was trying to get him to, I was telling him about the race and he was like, well, dad, you should, you should win. And I was like, I buddy. I'm. Just, just working on finishing. It's just like, well, you should try to win. Okay. Kidding. That's so cute.

I'm kidding. Just killed 

Tom: that story. I'm kidding. The race, I'm sorry. The race that, 

Jonathan: no, no, no. I, I mean, I appreciate anyone who thinks that I might have a chance at winning a half marathon. I, I won my, my personal race with the, I'm guessing. 87-year-old man that I ran next to for like [00:03:00] the, the last few miles.

Um, I, I was, it was hard. And I mean, the last, the last few miles were awful and it was like in the middle of kind of nowhere. So there's no crowd. There's no nothing. It's just like you and your thoughts after 10 and a half, 11 miles as you just got a little, a little bit more to go, but you can't see where the finish line, you can't see the people yet.

You're just kind of like in nowhere. And it's spread out a lot by that point. So you're not really in a crowd. 'cause people have really paced out. And I came upon this man who was. Old, but he had been a, this means he's been ahead of me for 10 and a half miles. Um, and I thought to myself, I was starting to die.

I was starting to feel horrible and I thought, okay, but like, and, and clearly he's trained, he's done a good job with this. He's lived, lived some kinda life that has made him fit enough for this. But I thought, I'm not. I fucking losing to this guy now that I can see this right here and now. And so I got a little bit and I got ahead of him and I'm pretty sure he looked at me and thought the exact same thing because for the last mile and a half we really were, and I'm talking to the finish line, we were just like edging in and out like we were.

It was, it was a sea biscuit kind of neck and neck kind of, [00:04:00] uh, wow. Wow. Photo finish. And it was this, uh, it was. The, the finish line is like a big, you know, it's like an oasis. You can see it in the future. You're like, I, I, I can get there. I can get there. So you kind of like gear up, you know, to, to show out for that last little bit.

And then I realized as I got closer and I was, my body was hanging on by a thread. Um, but as I got closer, I could see how the people, and there was like a big archway to lead you into the last like. 10th of a mile and go through the people in the finish line was like around the corner, like around the curve.

And I, my body was calculating like just enough time to get to where I thought it was. And I almost fell apart. I almost crawled across the finish line. It became like such a hobble, such a hobble walk to get, uh, it was, it was, it was rough. Um, but it, but I did it. I did it. I'm a runner now. Um, wow. So you can, is that the longest you've ever run?

By 13.1 miles. Yes. Um, I've run, I've run, I mean, no, by, by. Sorry, that's three by 3.1 miles. Yeah. I've run 10 miles before. Um, 

Tom: is that a thing to do a marathon and run a, a distance you've never run before? Is that what people do or, 

Jonathan: uh, I [00:05:00] did not train as well as I should have for this. Um, but, um. I did a I, I've done a, I did a 10 mile run.

I've done that a couple times and I have trained for it a little bit and then kind of not, and I thought like I was, I was training for this and like whatever, you know, life and my A DHD and my, uh, bad life and I just train. I didn't train as much as I wanted to. I did not get a super long run in for this one.

I think that most trainings, it's like you might touch that, that distance at some point, but it's like you train up to around it. But like you don't always have to do the. Main event until the main event, you know, but I would've, I would've liked to get, I think the most I ran this time was like six or seven leading up to it, which is a, wow.

It's a big jump from that to 13. Did 

Tom: you, um, did you like, eat a lot of pasta the day before, all that stuff? Oh, I 

Jonathan: did. I did. I had a big spaghetti and meatballs dinner. 

Tom: Nice. Uh, 

Jonathan: it was, yeah, it was, I carved up. Um, 

Tom: what about the pooping the pants while you're running? Is that a thing? 

Jonathan: No, but I did wonder if I was gonna, I I was not gonna pee my [00:06:00] pants, but I, yeah.

Um. I considered having to stop to pee for a minute, and then like, then I kind of passed the point, it's in Long Island, it ends up on the, um, uh, what's it, Robert, Moses, whatever, like the highway out there, and there's like bridges, so it's kind of beautiful. Oh, that's where the guy dumped bodies? Yeah. Oh, wow.

Yeah. No. Um, and there was no, there was no place to pee, so, uh, I just, I spent some time in my, with my own mind going, um, okay, if it gets worse. We will figure it out. But until then, let's try not to focus on that. And then like other things kinda started hurting enough that it, I did not have to worry about it as much.

Um, 

Tom: nipples chafing. Was that a thing? 

Jonathan: I had band-aids on 'em. I covered my nipples. Oh, nice. Yeah. 

Tom: Nice. Yeah. Um, wow, man. I'm impressed. Good for you. Thanks. Thanks, man. Are you sore? Are you hurting? 

Jonathan: Yeah, I'm, I'm, uh, yeah. Yeah, I got blisters. I got, my feet are a mess. Um, I'm, I'm a little sore right now. I hope you're ready to dance next weekend 'cause we're going out.

I'm, yeah, yeah, we are. I'll be fine man. Okay. I'm ready to dance. [00:07:00] Now that that's what, uh, that that's a different, that's a different gear. Go ahead. Okay. Okay. Alright. Good, good. Well, I'm proud of you. That's amazing. Thank you. Thanks for a little 

Tom: medal. 

Jonathan: Oh, this thing? Oh, well, this is my, this is my, uh, my marathon medal Uhhuh.

They didn't make a half marathon, so now I feel like a real poser, but I, I, I'm still gonna wear it. Um, 

Tom: the back looks, looks like a gold mirror. 

Jonathan: For what? 

Tom: Um, and let's talk about correction corner. I want to, I wanna, I wanna correct, uh, last week I called it Haga, which we knew I was mispronouncing it. I think you were closer.

It's Huga. 

Jonathan: Yeah, I was significantly closer. I, yeah. You were doing like a liquid huga. Yeah. I gave it a little bit of a cute, which, 'cause it's, 'cause it's, uh, well it's Danish and, and, uh, Norwegian. Um, okay. But, uh, the, the 

Tom: exact definition is a quality of coziness and comfortable conviviality that engenders a feeling of contentment or well be [00:08:00] wellbeing.

Um, 

Jonathan: it's a, it's a, it's a what, a defining characteristic of Danish culture. Yes. I like that part. Yes. But it's how I think of the, I I, I thought it was Dutch, and I think that's probably just like thinking it came from my wife's family thinking that those guys are the ones who did it, but it's, they're also a very cozy.

People. So I, um, you know, lot. Yeah. I mean, I remember the 

Tom: delight that I felt when I learned the term. 'cause I really instantly like understood it. Um, yeah. And it was a feeling that like, you, like yeah. It's, you know, how you, sometimes when I was a kid I used to like love when it was a pouring, raining outside For sure.

Yeah. You know, for that reason. Yeah. Yeah, for 

Jonathan: sure. Um, do, do you know, do you remember where, where you learned it? It was definitely like after college, early twenties. Okay. I mean, I, I only, I only recently learned it from, uh, it was Tamara Levitt had it in a, a Calm, uh, from the calm app. Oh, wow. And one of, one of her meditations was on it one day.

Um, not too long ago. 

Tom: Yeah, I, I learned it like early, early twenties. I had like a little, a little book of hooga. Yeah. Um, like a little page after page of things that were hooga. I don't know how get that book. That's cool. [00:09:00] Um, but yeah. So that's our correction corner. What, what did you do this weekend? Uh, other than the marathon race thing?

Yeah. I'll tell you 

Jonathan: what, man, I tell you what I got some steps in. 'cause on Saturday, uh, we both were at no kings protests. We were, we were, we were spread out. Taken the northeast, uh, by storm. Yeah. Um, but it was awesome, man. Tell me about yours though. 

Tom: Yeah. Well, I mean, I went to go visit my family in Connecticut.

Um, and so on the write up we met, uh, my sister, my mom, my aunt, auntie Donna, who you know. Um, mm-hmm. And my cousin tn, who you also know. Mm-hmm. And then a friend of my sister's, uh, who she's known for years, um, and I've known through her for years. Uh, we all met in Cheshire, Connecticut, which is one of the places they were doing the, uh, protests, which is right near my hometown.

Um, and it was not as big as the pictures from New York, but it was a, it was a really nice size. It was probably, that's great. 300 people. Um, it was totally peaceful. It was fun. Um, but it was really, it felt really good to be there with my family members. Yeah, that's cool. And, [00:10:00] um, uh, that was a really nice feeling and I appreciate that they met me there.

And, um, it just, it just felt good to be out there. It felt good to see people out there. There were a couple of like, um, big trucks, always big trucks. Yeah. One with a souped up, obnoxious horn. Um, and like just. Um, angry Men with they all gave the middle finger. Sure. Always with the American flags. Yeah. Um, there, that happened like only four times though, which is good.

Most of the people going by were beeping and like, rah, rah, rah. Yeah. So, yeah. What about you? I love those 

Jonathan: guys. Have those guys have come so far around? They're, they're, they're pro king now. They, uh, yeah. Yeah. They prefer dictatorship. Yeah. Yeah. 

Tom: It's, it's just. 

Jonathan: Yeah. Incredible. Um, yeah, I was in Manhattan, um, at the Times Square rally.

Um, uh, uh, uh, uh, reported over a hundred thousand people were there. It was, it was huge. It was awesome. I, um, my family was, um, was, uh, outta town. They were visiting some friends and I was staying because of the race on Sunday. Um, so I went by [00:11:00] myself, which was a different feeling, but was also really cool.

Like I didn't have the. The energy, the, the group energy of going with a group and female. Yeah. That kind of thing. But, so I was like, I wanted to be there. I wanted to be a, counted as a body and a number. I wanted to be there to be present. Yeah. And I just kind of like, I mean, I, I participated but I also took like a lot of good pictures.

I took pictures of a bunch of the signs that I liked. I was like, yeah, just observing and kind of took the whole thing in. And I got like emotional plenty of times. Like it was just cool to see. Even, even sometimes, like sometimes I think that the like chance can be kind of silly, you know? Like, whatever, it gets a little rah rah.

But, but even with that, I was like very moving to be there. Yeah. And see so many people coming together for one thing. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: And getting after that one thing and like really feeling it. I, I, I, I loved it. I thought it was, I'm, I'm proud of you for 

Tom: going, um, were there a lot of young people. Yeah. Yeah. Good.

There were not at mine really? Mine was very like the median, median age was like [00:12:00] 68 at my Mars. That's great though. That's 

Jonathan: awesome. '

Tom: cause that's, it is, but it 

Jonathan: like 

Tom: what happens in 10 

Jonathan: years? Well, is the community there? Is there is the. Is there a young community around there? Like is there a young adult 

Tom: or, um, there's certainly young adults in Connecticut.

They, yeah, for sure. But like, I know there were a 

Jonathan: few, 'cause like Stanford had one, so like, I know there were other points. That's rally what what we were talking about 

Tom: is hope, hoping, hoping they were at maybe the bigger cities, Harford and New Haven. Yeah. Um, uh, I never followed up on whether they were or not, but it's still, that was just still kind of disappointing.

But, um, yeah, I'm glad that there were young people at the one who, uh, yeah, it was, 

Jonathan: it was, and it was all of all ages. I saw more than one group of like. 80, 80 plus year old women who, that, that were, they had so signs that were like 87 and still no kings or whatever, you know, like it was like, yeah. And then young people, and then kids, uh, and parents, uh, with their kids.

Um, and it was, it was very cool. I also, like, I think it's cool to be in a place like, like yours, and I saw pictures from, uh, like Alabama, people in my hometown that were, it's a smaller, again, like smaller, and that's like in. A tough [00:13:00] spot to be, you know, like it's, that still somehow has become a, also a pro king kind of area.

Um, 

Tom: yeah. But, 

Jonathan: uh, it was really cool to see people that I know. I, I think it's cool with these smaller rallies and these smaller talents to still show up. Like, it's kind of easy to get into Manhattan and like join and get, like, be a part of a hundred thousand people does not take like that much. You know, like I didn't have to steal myself up to go be there with a hundred thousand people if you're there.

Yeah, totally. 50, 60 people. Like that's pretty cool, you know? Yeah. Even a hundred or something. Cool. Yeah. That, that takes courage. Yeah, 

Tom: I do. There's a lot of fear in going, I know, like, um, you know, I think some of my family members were worried about, um. Violence maybe going mm-hmm. And if they'd be at risk.

And, um, so I, it does, but I, you know, that, uh, number that I've brought up on a previous podcast I did, this is kind of a correction corner. It is 3.5%. I think I got it right when I brought it up before. Yeah. Um, there was a, a, a study that was done, um, uh, and it's, it's a concept that, uh. States that when [00:14:00] 3.5% of the population of a country protest nonviolently against the government, that government is likely to fall from power.

Um, the estimates are that 2.06% of the population, um, protested this last weekend, which is better than the last No Kings, which was 1.7, but we're still not there. Um, though they do estimate that it was about 4% of the number of. People that voted, so that's a good sign. Yeah. But um, yeah, it is. It is. You don't even need to make a sign.

You don't even need to raise your voice. Yeah. Just showing up, showing that you're being in those pictures and being part of those crowds of people, like Yeah. Yeah. Well, good for you, man. That's awesome. 

Jonathan: Yeah, 

Tom: you too, man. Yes. So I went, I, oh, sorry. Go ahead. I was just gonna keep going on about my weekend. Go do it.

Tell me, tell me about it, blah, blah, blah. Mimi, tell me. Um, I went home to see my family. Mm-hmm. Uh, which was really nice. We, we had the pro, uh, the protest and then we went back, uh, to my sister's house and got to see some family members I haven't seen for a while. Um, and then, uh. My aunt, auntie [00:15:00] Donna, who you know and have met a bunch of times, revealed to me that she's, um, now watched every episode, which was really exciting and she had really nice things to say.

Oh, uh, so, so thank you. That's Auntie Donna. I appreciate this support. Yeah. Thank Donna. Hi. And um, yeah, that's cool. Yeah. So that was, that was my weekend. Um, and then Friday we saw, before we left town, we saw Ragtime at Lincoln Center, uh, which, you know, um, yeah, I direct, uh, has a special place in my heart.

Uh, I directed it once. So you were in it, Uhhuh, um, you played Harry Houdini for me. I did. Uh, so I was very excited, excited to see it. Uh, I missed it when they did. This production at City Center, uh, last year. Yeah. Um, as like a more paired down version. So same director, same cast. Um, and I, I will say that I cried a bunch.

I stood up and applauded, joined many people standing up to applaud after Wheels for a dream. Really? Josh? Yeah. Joshua Henry is unbelievable. I 

Jonathan: mean, what a dude. 

Tom: Yeah. And like, it's so nice to see him taking, it's nice when people like the right. Role in the right age at the right time. I hope he [00:16:00] wins a Tony for the first time for this.

It'll be hard 'cause I, I don't think this will make it till the spring, but, um, I don't, it, you know, it's at Lincoln Center, so they have a whole season. But, um, yeah, it, uh, but I, I, uh, I, um. I had I a couple problems with the direction, to be honest. Like it's not my favorite production that I've ever, I've ever seen it.

It's first of all, and this is nothing to do, I don't think with the direction. Um, it's just wild how heavy and dark it plays now compared to when we did it, uh, in 2009, which is also when the last revival was on Broadway, uh, which was right after Obama's election. And, um, yeah. Uh, there's just a different, the show hit differently and it hits much darker now.

Um, and uh, that's a testament to the piece that it can reverberate, um, at different times. In different ways. Yeah, and I think it makes sense to be doing it now for sure. It was a smart choice, uh, by the director who's also the new artistic director at Lincoln Center to do it. Um, but she, okay. There's. [00:17:00] Um, without spoiling anything, there's a magical little surprise at the end of rag time.

Do you know what I'm talking about? There's a magical surprise that comes. 

Jonathan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, 

Tom: yeah. Comes on stage. Yeah. Suddenly at the end of the play, and if you've sat through three hours of GI drama, it is an emotional catharsis and it. All you have to do as the director is, it's not all you. It's, it's not easy, but you have to find the little surprise and you have to make sure, you have to make sure the little surprise is there every night.

Um, but it, it's fucking incredible. And like the audience, the reaction from the audience and it's, it's well deserved. Like it's, it's a payoff. Yeah. Well, the show, the lights. Come on, the opening music starts and the little surprise runs on stage in the first 0.2 seconds of the play. And my heart dropped into my stomach, and I don't think she ever really got me back.

Mm. Um, I just, I cannot fathom why someone would make that choice. And I thought it just kind of really, uh, [00:18:00] really put a stake through it before it even got cooking. Um, I don't know what these metaphors are. Um. The, the other huge problem I had with it is there's a, you know, the play revolves around a Model T Ford.

Mm-hmm. It's a major plot point, and there's a beautiful, beautifully rendered prop version of a Model T Ford on stage that's gorgeous. It comes on during the song, the Ford Song, where they, he buys it from. Henry T. Ford, and it's there when the firemen tear it apart. But you want to know when it's not on stage?

It's not on stage. When they sing wheels of a dream, 

Jonathan: well, they're, they're, they're, oh, a dream. They're not, we're not worried about Yeah. But like they 

Tom: in the lines build, there's like eight lines before wheel, clearly wheel. They've just gotten outta 

Jonathan: the car. They're having, they're having a picnic, right?

They're supposed to be having a picnic outside the car. Like, yeah. Yeah. And like 

Tom: there's lines referencing the car. And in the scene and in the song like, yeah, and you like it was not, obviously not a cheap. [00:19:00] Like, I don't, I just was like beside myself, but then I stood after the song. So 

Jonathan: maybe that's it though.

They're like, we're just gonna clear the set. We're gonna let these guys just do what they do. Let Josh Henry have it. Yeah. Let the chef cook. 

Tom: I thought, I thought that was a really dumb decision. So, so they didn't, they didn't build it on stage though. Uh, that's, they put the wheels on. Okay. They put the wheels on in the last moment.

Yeah. 

Jonathan: But did they, but did it transform into anything else? Uh, no. No, no, no. Well, then they fell short. They fell short. You know, ultimate, the, the, the genius and the directing of that is when you can take a car, when you can build a car on stage, and then you can transition that car into Thanks, man. 

Tom: They 

Jonathan: didn't 

Tom: do 

Jonathan: it.

Tom: No they didn't. I'm, I'm glad I would've sued. No, I'm kidding. I'm kidding. Um, yeah, yeah, yeah. So that was, that was my weekend. 

Jonathan: How was the Houdini? 

Tom: Uh, he was, he 

Jonathan: was, he was good. He was good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was. No, Jonathan Greg. It, it's a, it's a fine role, but it's not, nobody cares. It's fine. Yeah. Yeah. It's 

Tom: like, um.

They had at one point they had in, uh, whatever. [00:20:00] This is not turning into a musical theater podcast. People listening to this are gone right now. They're, they're like out of it. 

Jonathan: This isn't even the 

Tom: longest we've spent on musical theater. No, no.

Jonathan: You don't wanna talk about it anymore. Okay, fine. No, I'm good. I'm moving on from rag time. Alright. Go see it, Quins. Go see it. Go see live theater. Um, I'll probably cleanse with a, I went to, I took myself, the family was gone this weekend and so I, um, Friday night. I also wanted to get some sleep. I wanted to make sure that I was rested for Saturday was gonna be a lot of walking.

Sunday was gonna be a lot of, uh, jogging. Um, so Friday night I took myself to the movies to see Black Phone Two, um, right over near you. And, uh, I haven't seen Black Phone One, but it's the only horror movie out right now, and it's tis the season. And, uh, it's, I don't, I don't really, I, I didn't, it's weird to see a sequel first, but I was just like, whatever, I'm gonna go do it.

And it's kind of like a nude night run Elm Street. Like there's, it's a Freddie kind of guy, I mean. Ethan Hawke. All bangers all the time. Big fan. But, um, it's either Freddie. Yeah. Yeah. [00:21:00] Um-huh. It's called the Grabber, but, um, but the, the movies, whatever, if you, if you like horror movies, it, it, there's some jump stuff.

There's, it's, it's kitchy in the way the horror movies are, kit's the wrong word, but it's, it's got the. Camp of Yeah. You know, good Gore horror. Yeah. But I took myself, uh, out to some drinks before that. There's a place over kind of in your neighborhood called Drink Ology. Do you know it? It's like a, it's like a cocktail bar.

Tom: Where is it? 

Jonathan: Um, 34th Avenue and 44th Street. Okay. Uh, ish. Yeah, I think that's right. Um, so shout out ology. It was a really, it was a beautiful, the, the decor was really cool. Got like a, a cool jazz. I don't know. It's very cool. Very cool spot. Um, and I was in there, I had some, a couple of cocktails and, but so, so I just wanna tell you this story.

It was amazing. There's a couple sitting next to me, um, and they were like. Hot. They were both like, like model hot. It was like this hot couple had come in. They were having sexy drinks. They got like a, a, a charcuterie board. [00:22:00] Um, and that was where the fun came in. They got a charcuterie board. And, um, I, I think that it matters for the, but for the, for the sake of the story, I think it does matter that they're both like really hot people.

Because the woman, I couldn't hear what she said. I didn't hear what she said, but she asked something about the charcuterie board and the bartender goes, uh, those are grapes. Like, I'm pretty sure that he thought. She was at like, like, you know how like hot people, you just don't have, you don't expect a lot from, sometimes you just like assume sometimes, like you're, you've never had to think you're very pretty.

Like, so, and she was like, no, I know. Those are great. Like, it was just a, it was an amazing moment that the way he started was just, those are. Those are grapes. 

Tom: What was she asking? 

Jonathan: I don't know. I don't know. Uh, something else about that. I think like, which cheeses? I mean there, there are parts of it that could use some explaining, you know?

Yeah. There's like multiple cheeses and meats and you're not, those are always like, kind of the same. You don't know which ones which, you know, I think there was like a puff pastry. Maybe they're asking about that too. I don't know. But it was the one thing that was. Clear what it was was [00:23:00] grapes. Uh, so I just thought that was incredible.

Amazing. Did, did you get some grapes? Uh oh, I got the charcuterie board. Yeah. Once I realized it was grapes, I went and I went and got it. 

Tom: Did you get candies that were individually wrapped at the movie, like last time? 

Jonathan: Uh, no. I just got, um, I, I had popcorn and soda at the time. Um, no, I did not. I did not waste all of that plastic.

Did you get the chair that went all the way back? No. No. Oh, shit. No. It was a regular, no. Yeah, no, I still haven't, still haven't gotten one of those. Um, it, yeah, there was like a better view. There was, Tron has all the good theaters right now, I think. And I think there was a theater that had a, a, a bigger viewing of black phone.

But this was like one of the little geeky theaters. They put a second screen or whatever. Um, uh. Yeah, that was it. The movie is, I was looking at my notes. I lost, I got lost my place over here. I got scared again. I don't really do horror, but it's the season and I really don't, because the kids, you know, now I, we don't do like real horror at all, but I used to, and it's still, it's my least favorite, scares me.

[00:24:00] Like I jump and I, I, it doesn't really like get me, the whole story doesn't get me, but then I, the things that are 

Tom: Yeah, jump, 

Jonathan: scary will jump scare me, you know? Yeah. And yeah, I kind of like. I am over it again. I got my fill for a while. 

Tom: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I, that's not my, my movie season is coming up. I like Oscar movie season.

Mm-hmm. I, I, I want that stuff. Um, yeah. Have you seen the car commercial for, um, well, I don't know what car it is, but there's trying to, like John Chu is driving a car and it's wicked music playing. No. And he's, he's like driving and like New York City turns into like Emerald City as he's driving. Oh really?

No. And they're playing, um, I've heard it said from Wicked. It's like, who? When did we start selling cars using Wicked? Because it's a blockbuster hit. It's a, it's a hit, I guess it's a hit two part film. It's a, it's, I 

Jonathan: would've loved to have been in those marketing meetings, I mean. I, I, I think it's just about the algorithm grabbing on white.

Like that's, it's hot, so they're gonna take it and use it, you know. 

Tom: Alright, well let's get into Vulnerable Bros this week. Let's 

Jonathan: do it. 

Tom: I think we decided [00:25:00] we were gonna talk a little bit about some, uh, exercise building off your marathon. 

Jonathan: Well, I'm a runner now. Yeah. You're a runner now, so we might as well talk about it.

Yeah, yeah, 

Tom: yeah. Just talking about our bodies, our exercise. I, I'll tell 

Jonathan: you what, man. Yeah. I thought it was, uh, we discussed it being like a, that. This has been on the, on the docket for a while. How are we gonna fit it in? What are we gonna do? And like, coming out of this, this weekend, it felt like a good topic because I, I know I'm not in, like, I'm not in the best shape I've ever been in, but I don't know that I've ever really spent a lot of time feeling like I'm in good shape and, you know, like it's, I, I don't know about you.

For me, it's hard. Like I think that early on in my adult life, younger adult life. I got, like I was pretty fit and I got feedback on that and then I kind of started, like a lot of my identity was tied to that. Mm-hmm. Uh, which was fun when I was in shape. And then anytime that I didn't feel like as in shape, it's always had a weird kind of mind fuck kind of, you know, uh, self, uh, image kind of, [00:26:00] I don't know, back and forthness to it.

But like what? I don't think I, when I was a kid, I don't think you care about what you look like when you're a kid. You just wanna like either play sports or you don't. Did you, did you play sports? Uh, 'cause yeah, I mean, no, I 

Tom: mean, I told you the story about the poster in the hallway at school and I realized I was fat 'cause of how I had to write down how much I weighed.

Um, so no, um, I mean I did, I played like T-ball, um, and hated it. And then I played, um, like middle school, like. Community basketball league. Okay. Yeah. Um, and then it was like, I did that in fourth and fifth grade, but, but in fifth grade, maybe sixth grade too. But, but, but in sixth grade, some of the, most of the boys my age were moving up to the next league, but I was still in the.

Other league. Yeah. Um, and that was the year I got MVP, but um, it had nothing to do with the fact that my dad was the coach. Um, I just got that on my own accord. Um, I think it was like a, [00:27:00] let's give him this so he finally steps aside kind of thing. Um, I was, I, I just did not, I didn't like it. Um, and, uh. Yeah.

Uh, I, I just like sports. Sports were not my thing. I felt like I wasn't good at them. I felt self-conscious in gym class. Um, I was always like, picked last. When 

Jonathan: Was it just the way, because you, like, you have a, a competitive mentality. 

Tom: Mm-hmm. And 

Jonathan: I feel like you're. Coordination's pretty good. Your hand-eye coordination's pretty good.

Your, uh, your, you know, body control's pretty good. Like, it just didn't, sports were not a thing for you? 

Tom: Yeah, I don't know. I mean, it just didn't, um, I didn't really know. I guess I was competitive like. In school. Uh, I guess that that was something that was like early on. Um, but um, yeah, I don't know why I didn't transfer to.

I think I just was always scared about getting hurt. Um, yeah. And so I was like a little bit of a pussy in that way. Um, can you say that I'm saying it? Fuck that. Yeah. It's my podcast. 

Jonathan: You can say it. Yeah. 

Tom: [00:28:00] Um, and, uh, yeah, I don't know. I also, like, I have been in physical therapy off and on for a couple years now 'cause I have like.

Back issues. I have like herniated discs. Um, so I've been like learning a lot about my body through that Yeah. Process. And, um, I have like hip dysplasia that I was born with. Um, I actually, like the first year out of, uh, when I was born, I, I had to wear like a leg brace to correct the hip dysplasia. Hmm. Um, so I'd like wear that when I was sleeping.

Um. But it's not like fully corrected. So it's just like, if, if I lay down flat on, on the bed, like one of my legs falls open more than the other, which is common. That's, I think everybody has that to a degree, but mine's just more pronounced. 

Jonathan: Yeah. 

Tom: So, I don't know. I kind of have like a little bit of a conjecture that's like, um, well the physical therapist told me like, yeah, it makes sense that you don't like running 'cause it's just never gonna feel good.

Yeah. And running has never, I've never been a runner. Um, there was a time when I could run. Like, I think I got up to running like two miles once at the gym in my early [00:29:00] twenties, but that was the most and I didn't like it even then. 

Jonathan: Yeah. 

Tom: Um, so I tried to do my cardio other ways. I love to bike. I peloton.

Um, I think you can sometimes. Yeah. Shut it. Peloton. Yeah, we see it. Can see it back there. You can see. Um, so yeah. But, um, I don't know. That could just be in my head. I don't have any proof that that's true. 

Jonathan: No, I think, I think we take it. I think that that's, I think that that's true. I think that if it weren't for that, you've got star athlete written all over you.

Uh, thank you. Uh. I mean, I, I think it's funny, like for me. I, I liked sports growing up. I like, I liked, I liked sports growing up. Now that I look back on it, I think like I, I was good. Not great at all of 'em. I played pretty regularly, but I'm, I'm kinda the same way. Like when everyone started getting onto the school teams, like I played club, I played city baseball.

I played peewee football, I played, you know, rec league soccer. Um, I played rec league basketball. But then you get into middle school and high school and everyone starts joining the school teams. You try out for these teams, you join the teams. And I wasn't on any of my school teams. I, part of it was like in high [00:30:00] school, uh, like the musical theater rehearsals conflicted with a lot of the sports.

And, you know, it couldn't do both. But also part of it was like, I was not gonna be that I was not that good of an athlete. I was good enough to be a rec league athlete. And I think looking back on it like. I know I talked about it here with like dance before, um, choosing sports over dance and that being because of more social pressure than like the athletics of it.

Mm-hmm. Um, you know, and I, I honestly, I think if I had, if I had committed sooner to just like accepting that I was, uh, kind of nerdy and liked theater, I could've been thriving more in both academics and theater. But I was like, I was, I'm a boy in the south and I play sports and this is what I do with my summer.

This is what I do with my, you know, my, my seasonal sports. This is, this is how it works. And, um. I, I, it's just like, that was almost more like the social aspect, uh, than the, the drive of sports. Um, and then I was like, I mean, I, I spent, I was not fat, I was skinny. I was short and skinny and got, you know, picked on plenty and, uh, not just Luke [00:31:00] Barnes, but uh, in high school that was like actual dickheads who would like, you know, actually kind of bully me and pick on me.

And, um, by the time I left high school and got into college, I, uh, just decided I wasn't gonna be. Skinny anymore. I started working out and just got bigger and, uh, chip, who's that? I couldn't see Chip. Hi Chips. 

Tom: Did you hear me out? She, she, she announced her entrance. 

Jonathan: Hi. She, she doesn't, she gets mad at the mic.

She's not one, not wanna speak. 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: But yeah, it was kind of like a, I don't know, I, it started coming from a place, like, I want to be stronger, but then, like I was saying, like I got stronger and then I got positive feedback from it and loved it and, you know, so then it was like. As much vanity as it was anything else.

And I think that like, and also I crossfitted for a while and there was a time when before kids, and I was like a sometimes working actor, which meant I had. Hours a day to spend to the gym if I wanted to. And so I was in pretty good shape at that point. Yeah. And like, oh yeah, wo, you know, the, the CrossFit community is its own, kind of like, that was the best 

Tom: you'd ever looked until [00:32:00] you got kind of fat and then that was the best you ever looked like.

We loved Fat Jonathan in this 

Jonathan: house. Yeah, I, I appreciate that. It's hard for me to, to accept that one. I remember, I, I. Going to Pride two years ago, maybe it was three. I don't remember. Sometime in the past, recent past, not this year, but one of those, all your prides, they just blend together. They all blend together.

Uh, but I had been on keto and I had lost a bunch of weight and more than one of your friends was like, why did you do that? 

Tom: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Body issues in the gay community are so fucked up. It's, I, I mean, that was the really like, um, in my thirties when I really started going to the gym and noticing a difference in how I was pr received in the gay community.

Yeah. And like the. Sex I was having and the kind of guys I was having sex with, I was like, oh, I need to keep doing this, this, this is paying off. Yeah. Um, which is fucked up, but it's true. But there's, you know, I mean there's also so many different, uh, types of gay men [00:33:00] and we love to categorize ourselves.

Yeah. Um, and, but it's funny, like you can get away with if you're cute enough and hot enough, you can get away with not working out at all when you're in your twenties as a game man. Yeah. Um. And that very quickly, um, fades away. Uh, and, um, that does not age well in the gay community. Yeah. And, um, so then there's only, there's limited routes you can go as you get older as a gay man.

Yeah. Um, which, what's strange is bears, um, often most bears don't actually look so great in their twenties. Um, 'cause it's like that. You know, you've got that face that like, looks better with a beard. You don't have a beard yet. Yeah. Um, and there's like a barrel 

Jonathan: chest of this to it. There's like a broader ness to it.

Yeah. That 

Tom: you need to grow into it. That's not just, 

Jonathan: that's not just muscle, that's not just working on muscle. That's like Yeah. Actual structure. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. 

Tom: So, um, but I also think it's why bears can be so sort of, um, uh, um, you know, still [00:34:00] figuring it out at an older age because it's, it's a mind fuck to suddenly be.

Yeah. Perceived as hot when for 30 something years you were not. Um, and so I think a lot of bears like kind of, um, ricochet because of that. Yeah. Um, but yeah, I mean it's, that's my experience of it. 

Jonathan: Well, I tell you what, when I, you know, I worked at Atlas Social Club for a while, um, in Hell's Kitchen and like the most, so, which is a gay, a gay bar in, uh, on 51st, I think.

Um, and like ninth Avenue, um, and the like, the. Only because other people would tell me this. Uh, I can try to believe that. I had like pretty intense body dysmorphia at that time. 'cause I was like, the men behind the bar, there are beautiful ripped men. And I was working there and I was like, I'm, I'm okay, but I'm not that.

Like I, I know I'm not that I, I, I don't, that's not what I am. And so it was, that was like always such a weird comparison. And the gay guys that would come in there and it was like, I, I felt like I was like. The [00:35:00] funny one behind the bar, you know, like, like there's like the hot guys, the funny one. Yeah. Yeah.

And also like the straight one, which won me a lot of points, you know, of like that was, yeah, of course it was easy to get attention for that. But as far as like just aesthetics goes, I was always like, I mean this is not, I'm trying so hard and I am not these guys at all. 

Tom: Yeah. But surely you felt the shift in like even just general, um.

The general zeitgeist that like dad bods and Yeah. Yeah. A little bit of meat is ways people find ways sexier now. 

Jonathan: Yeah. 

Tom: And 

Jonathan: that is true. It's a weird thing to, uh, actually like internalize. And I think that it's so funny you're talking about like the, the groups and the gay community like. And this is not even an original thought.

This thought has been out there and straight men seem to not be able to grasp it, which is like women have been very clear about the kind of man they want to be with and the kind of man they wanna fuck and the kind of man they want around is not an an eight abed, you know, ripped up kind of dude. Yeah.

It's, it's got, it's a guy who's got something. It, I think like it used to be like, oh, it's because a guy who has a little [00:36:00] bit of meat on him. Is paying attention to other things in the world. He's not just working out all the time. And I think that there's some truth to that, but also I think I can admit, like, uh, to scale, a lot of women are like physically attracted to a little bit of man, not just, not just, uh, you know, lean muscle.

So it's kind of like in the straight world. Dudes are working out to impress other dudes. They're still, men are still working out straight, men are still working out for men. The women are not asking anyone to do that. Yeah. Yeah. Which is a weird it's own, it's own weird mind fuck. 

Tom: Do you, are you attracted to like a woman weightlifter, like that kind of a body type on a woman?

Jonathan: Yeah. Well, I, I don't know that I, I, I have. I'm pretty wide open as far as like a type and attraction goes, you know, um, uh, I've, I, I can find a lot of different things attractive, but I think also because of my CrossFit time, um, there were just like gorgeous women who looked great in a dress and then could lift incredible amounts of weight and looked strong.

And I'm all sure I can get into that. Like, I, uh, it, [00:37:00] it became, I don't know if like. Yeah, there are some, there are some hot women who are super jacked, uh, that yes are hot no matter what. I, I can find myself attracted to all the time. And then there are others that like, maybe I wouldn't be as physically attracted, but then when I watch them do something, like in cr, like I watched them perform something impressive.

I'm like, that's fucking insane. That's incredible. Like, that's very hot. And it might not be like horny hot, but it is like, that's that's very impressive that you can do that. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It makes it hot, you know? 

Tom: Yeah. 

Jonathan: Um, so yes. Do you miss your, do you miss your CrossFit days? Uh, I do, I miss the, uh, the, it's kind of a, I mean, I know everyone jokes about it being kind of culty and it is, but it's like a, it's a group of people.

I mean, there are some upsides to a cult. You know, there's, they take a turn eventually, but there are some upsides. Why is it so 

Tom: culty? Like, break it down for us. 

Jonathan: I, I don't really know. I honestly like it has been broken down. People have, uh, I'm pretty sure there's a podcast called, is it a Cult? And they have done CrossFit and they do a pretty good job at breaking down what it is.

But like Do they do Burning Man too? They must. I think they do. Yeah. Yeah, I think they do. [00:38:00] Um, we should check in with their, just their list of episodes and see what all we can tap into. Um, but, and I, I don't know, without getting too like, uh, inside baseball, uh, on the CrossFit stuff. It really, uh, focuses on the group.

Like the group mentality is a big part of it. And there's like, there's built in comradery. So there is that kind of like group feeling to it. There's a competition, but also support is a big thing that's, that's taught from the top down. Um, I, I don't really know enough about, I, I think that someone smarter who understands more about the inner workings of cults would be able to say like, this is why it is.

And I think it hits a lot of the points, but just like any kind of like. Any like a marketing tool that cults are like, as long as you don't go too far and you're not making it too, you're not making it bad for people. Like the, some of the tenets of a cult are not the worst things to be around, you know?

Wow. You heard it 

Tom: here first. Cults 

Jonathan: are 

Tom: good. 

Jonathan: Jonathan. 

Tom: Greg says, 

Jonathan: not all, not all cults. Okay. Not all cults. 

Tom: Some cults are good. Quote, Jonathan, Greg, some cults are good. What, [00:39:00] what is the, what is the like. Schedule, like CrossFit, isn't it like you have to go every day? Or what is the like rules to begin? Yeah, I mean it depends, 

Jonathan: and that's one of the things, like different places do it, different boxes, because they're not gyms, they're boxes.

Right. That's a, it's kind of, I know that's part of it is like you give yourself your own language and so then you have like an inside insider knowledge. You know, you get your own vocabulary for things. Um. And there's reasons behind that. 'cause it's mostly like very sparse garages, kind of, you know, setup.

Um, but yeah, some places do it based on like these very competitive schedules about like, yes, you're gonna do this kind of lift and this kind of a wad. That's another one. WOD, the workout of the day. Oh yeah, you like that? See? Yeah. You like that? I, you know what? You can, you can poo poo it, but I think you would love it.

I think there, I mean, talk about some bears. I think you would, I think you would love across the gym. Yeah. And like guys take their, it's encouraged to take your shirt off, you know, like it's one of few gyms out there where they're like, yeah, take your shirt off, man. Yeah, yeah. You know, I would 

Tom: be, I would check it out.

The prices is always like, um, yeah, help me back, but maybe someday. Yeah. It 

Jonathan: feels that's another, that, that's [00:40:00] probably like on the, on the cult spectrum, that probably leans it more towards cult like it doesn't really ever, so there's like affiliate fees you have to pay to capital C, CrossFit, right. So like there's a lot of money there.

But then like so much of the branding is about the sparsity of like, it's just weights and people Yeah. You know, like there's not a lot of fancy stuff. Yeah. And then you're like, why am I paying? Two plus a month to be in a big steel box with a box. Yeah, yeah. To be in a box. Like what's a, and that's part of the, that's part of the, you know, the whole marketing, uh, behind it.

Uh, you know, like, I, I think that there's a lot, I think that a lot of the complaints about CrossFit are totally valid. I also think that I got in really good shape and enjoy doing it. Um, people can get hurt because people can get excited and get ahead of themselves and, and do too much too soon and not really know what they're doing and just wanna be fast and loud and, you know, and like.

Sure that it, it's got its downsides and capital C, CrossFit, I have major problems with, um, I, I can't believe, like some things have gone very wrong at the [00:41:00] top of CrossFit. Like bad, like, like, like a lot of industries, but like the CEO said some hella racist stuff or whatever, and like, you know, or like, and so then he's gotta go with, then nobody else really moves.

The, the, the, the, the culture doesn't change. Just one guy gets, you know, gets booted and there's, it, it's got its own competition. So like there's it, there's its own branding. And then they run a giant Olympic style competition, but they also oversee the whole thing. So any of the like, uh, uh, band substances oversight, the, the, um, uh, whatever, it's like the standards kind of like, of the movements.

Like it becomes almost like there's, there's no, um, hard evidence to this, but they, it starts to feel a little conspiracy theory ish about like, it's almost WWE e style, like the pe the ones that people, like, the ones that do well for a minute then do well for like, if you're a good, if you're a CrossFit.

Baby, you continue to keep winning. It seems like, it seems like it works out in your favor, you know? Like it's, and it's hard to think that a brand who is making money off of its brand and then [00:42:00] hosting competitions of its brand are not gonna let the ones who are most marketable win. You know? And like, it's just, but how do they cheat?

Uh, I mean, I don't, I, it's if the workouts are built, like, uh, the, uh, customized more for the, the strengths of the people that are already doing well. Mm. There's always been questions about the, um. The regulations and the oversight for ban substances. Um, I, I don't know. All of that is like things that people, like people will, yeah.

Jibber jabber about, and there's. They have a, I don't, I don't know that there's any backing to it, but it's also like, makes sense to, to jibber jabber. But, you know, go after you finish all of our episodes. Go watch, go listen to, uh, I think it's called, is it a cult? I Can, is it a cult? It'll, it'll be in the corrections corner next week.

They'll do a better job than I just did. 

Tom: Amazing. Alright, well you know what it's time for. I do. Who would you fight? Who would you fight? Powow. Ooh, wow. I love it. I love it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was a little different. Love it. I love it. You go first. I, I [00:43:00] honestly don't know if I remember the original melody anymore.

I've done so many alternate melodies now. It's just, yeah, we're gonna layer it all together though. We're gonna take all of them 

Jonathan: and layer it into an 18 part harmony. 

Tom: Ooh, I am gonna fight water parks. Um, I'm gonna fight water parks. They're disgusting. 

Jonathan: Why do you hate 

Tom: fun? 

Jonathan: You hate 

Tom: fun. I don't. I love fun, you know?

You know, I love fun, but. I do not like, I was at a waterpark once and I was there with a friend and his family and there were children. So we were at the part, um, where there's like mushrooms and they're sprinkling and there's little, do you know what I'm talking about? Sure. Yeah. What do they call it?

Like a 

Jonathan: splash? Like a splash pad. Splash pad, 

Tom: yeah. And it's like two feet of water, mushrooms. And we're just sitting there. We're on the little, we're on the seats, like in our sunglasses, watching the kids. And then. The, the, the guy blows the whistle. Everybody out. 'cause some kid took a [00:44:00] shit. Oh, see Eva chips didn't like that either.

Did you hear that? She said, no, she didn't like it. So some kid took and then the water slides. Yeah, I have some, I have some videos that come across my feeds of. Dangerous things on the water slides, and I just, we are not meant to be going. Remember we went to that, um, death? Yeah. That was not exactly a water park.

What was it called? I wondered if that was 

Jonathan: gonna be on the Liz uh, brownstone. Brownstone. Brownstone Water park. It's a water park. 

Tom: It was a water park that, 

Jonathan: it was in Brownstone Quarry, which is where all the brownstone for the brownstones and Brooklyn came from. Yes. Until a fucking flash flood flooded that quarry and Yes.

Killed everyone that was there. Killed all the workers. Yes, yes. Just flooded them. And then they put a water park in. 

Tom: And I think we learned all that when I was reading the Wikipedia on the ride home to try and figure out how many people died there. Oh my 

Jonathan: God. We, like, we had this like, just like, um, suspension of disbelief, I guess, that you're like, you're like, you just trust a and now clearly you don't, you've been doing your research and you don't anymore.

But like at the time we were young and naive and [00:45:00] thought, well, if this place is still open. Clearly people aren't getting hurt and dying here. This must be, this must be working. They, they're, no, they're somehow affording the insurance. They're not getting closed down. So this is safe. 'cause the rides there were janky, the slides were janky, the rope swings were giant and crazy.

Nothing, 

Tom: none of it's safe. And like action Park the, um, HBO documentary about the park in New Jersey. Terrifying. Watch that. Oh yeah. 

Jonathan: Okay. 

Tom: Um, but I do wanna carve out, so I'm fighting water parks, but I have a carve out for Lazy Rivers. I love a lazy river. I am fine for lazy rivers to continue. I love nothing more than a lazy river.

Why do you don't like lazy rivers? They're the dumbest part of a waterpark. They're nothing. No. You could just float with your friends if you could have a drink. All the better. They're so fun. I love a lazy river, so yeah. Special carve out 

Jonathan: for Lazy Rivers. I love that. I love that we took the kids to water park this summer and it was like kind of small.

I mean it was fine and I really thought Caleb would wanna ride rides and he [00:46:00] was like, Nope. He did not wanna do with his slides. Smart boy. Smart boy. Yeah, he did not wanna do it. Um, alright, I want to fight. It's funny that you said that documentary, because I wanna fight, uh, the HBO Max app or the Mac, whatever, whatever that thing is called now, whatever it is, the artist formerly known as HBO, the app is like, I don't.

I don't know if there's some kind of like genius behind that. They're like, somehow it's like they'll stay on here more. They can never find what they're looking for. I don't know if there's like some kind of smart something behind it, but it seems like a bunch of dumb asses. Just like through app pieces at an app and like the, the, the continue watching the, like how to skip episodes.

All, it's the, it's the most insane. It drives me crazy. I would stop watching. All I, I'm, I, I mean, I won't 'cause they end up making good television. HBO continues to make, uh, yeah. High caliber television. But I wish that they weren't making such good television, because I hate that app so much. Yeah. Yeah. I wanna fight that 

Tom: app.

That's a good one. All right. 

Jonathan: Thanks. 

Tom: Fix it HBO Fix it. Yeah, 

Jonathan: fix it [00:47:00] whoever you are, 

Tom: bro. This is the hottest you've ever looked. I think it's the marathon. It's the marathon. It's the, the badge, the, what's it called? The metal? 

Jonathan: Yeah, it's, it's called the, uh, the Golden Mirror. 

Tom: It would've been nice to see just the, the.

That with no shirt. 

Jonathan: Okay. Well, in 

Tom: the Patreon. 

Jonathan: In the Patreon. 

Tom: All right. I'll read this out. 

Jonathan: Okay. 

Tom: Thank you for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to like and subscribe to No Homo with Jonathan and Tom on all podcast platforms and YouTube graphics and music by Matt Ladner. In a cursory thanks to Jen Dorn Bosch and Quan Williams, the opinions expressed in this podcast are solely those of the hosts and are intended for entertainment purposes only.

Booya. 

Jonathan: Beautiful. You back in it. Back in the saddle. Nice. Thanks. Cursory was good calling like that. I love you. Bye. Bye.