Writing Historical Fiction with Truth and Tradition: A Conversation with Catherine Astl

In this episode of Traditionally Self-Published, I sit down with historical fiction author and English Literature teacher Catherine Astl to talk about her novel Christmas Serenades—a deeply rooted Smoky Mountain Christmas story filled with truth, tradition, and meticulously researched history.

Catherine shares how her lifelong connection to the Great Smoky Mountains shaped her storytelling, why she stays fiercely committed to historical accuracy, and how she weaves real events and family stories into engaging fiction. We discuss the simple but meaningful holiday traditions of Cades Cove, the importance of preserving the truth even when it’s uncomfortable, and the delicate balance between factual research and narrative imagination.

We Discuss:

• How Christmas Serenades brings Smoky Mountain history to life
• The simple holiday traditions of Cades Cove and why they matter
• Catherine’s extensive research process using family stories and university archives
• Why historical fiction should never “correct” or soften difficult truths
• How she balances teaching full-time with a consistent writing practice
• The power of small details, authentic dialogue, and writing with passion
• Catherine’s “Five Best Tips” for authors of any genre

Where to find Catherine and her book:

• Christmas Serenades: A Novel
• Instagram: @catherineastl
• Catherine on Facebook

About Catherine: 

Catherine Astl, a Florida-based English Literature teacher, holds a Master’s in English-Literature and Curriculum from Southern New Hampshire University, a Bachelor’s in English-American Literature from the University of South Florida, and is a graduate of the International Summer Schools Shakespeare and Literature program at the University of Cambridge. She also has an Associate of Science in Legal Assisting and spent 27 years as a civil litigation trial paralegal before transitioning to education. Catherine has published a trade magazine column, two non-fiction books, and six Smoky Mountain Historical Fiction novels.

Deeply connected to the Great Smoky Mountains—where her North Carolina roots lie—she devotes her work to preserving the stories of the people who once lived there. Inspired by childhood visits and personal ties to the region, Catherine is passionate about bringing the area's history to life, honoring the resilience and spirit of those who built communities in the park's now-preserved landscapes.

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"Traditionally Self-Published" theme music is written by Landon Bailey and performed and produced by LNDÖ

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:06

What's up, Split Twisters, and a warm welcome to my page turn, the intrigue readers and listeners who are just stepping into the story. Whatever title you fancy today, I am so happy you're here with us. You're listening to Traditionally Self-Published, where we unravel the chaos of self-publishing and help you write your own success story like a pro. I'm your host, Mika Merrill Rice, author with a passion for learning and sharing the love. I'm bringing you real talk with publishing pros and indie authors just like me who flipped the script and built thriving author careers on their own terms and are doing it like a pro. So whether you're a first-time author or you're a seasoned pro, you're right where you need to be. Today's guest is not only an English literature teacher, but also a self-published historical fiction author. If you're curious what makes an author stand out in the spotlight rather than hanging behind the stage, this is the episode for you. I'm joined today by Catherine Astell, author of several historical fiction novels. So today we'll cover Christmas Serenades, a historical fiction book with a holiday twist, her process for crafting historical fiction, how she builds her themes and characters, the connection between teacher and writer, her writing process, and then we're gonna conclude with my Ink Starter Lightning Round and Catherine's five best tips for authors. So welcome, Catherine. It's so nice to have you on the show.

SPEAKER_00 1:32

Thank you. Thank you for being here. I'm very excited. Thank you for the opportunity.

SPEAKER_03 1:37

Yes, absolutely. All right, so we're gonna talk about Christmas serenades. So it's holiday time. We're trying to get into the spirit of things this time of year. Can you share a little bit about Christmas serenades and what inspired your story?

SPEAKER_00 1:53

Sure. Well, I've been visiting the Great Smoky Mountains National Park for my entire life, and my father's side of the family hails from the Smoky Mountains since about the 1700s. So I have a personally I have very deep ties to the Smokies. Um, Cades Cove is a real place. It's the most visited national park in the most visited, or actually, it's the most visited site in the most visited national park in America, the Great Smoky Mountains National Park. And I just wanted to bring their traditions alive. I've written a few books about Cades Cove, but I really wanted to write a Christmas book. And I thought, well, this is this is just a perfect setting. Um, and I knew it had to be later in the community's history. Um, so I set it in 1925 because you have to have enough history behind you in order to have traditions. So that's the reasoning behind Christmas Eve of 1925. Very good.

SPEAKER_03 2:53

All right, yeah, and speaking of, so you you chose 1925 for a reason. Um can you explain a little bit the reasoning behind choosing 1925 as kind of that, you know, main time period when you wanted to set this book?

SPEAKER_00 3:08

Yes. So it was right before the National Park Service, the government came in and really started taking over the land and basically, you know, getting people out of their homesteads and their farms to make way for the national park. So it was before it was kind of uh looming at that time, but it hadn't mostly actually happened yet. Um but it was also over a hundred years since that community began. So I thought that is the perfect time, and a lot of things were happening. Uh, you know, the first world world war, which it wasn't a world war then, it was just the great war, because there was no world war two at that point. Um, so the great war was over, um, and America was, you know, pretty alive um in 1925. It was, you know, the roaring 20s. It was booming. So a lot of context and contrast between what was happening in the mountains, basically the so-called sticks of Tennessee, um, versus the big cities in all of America. So I thought that's just the perfect timing um to make to write this story.

SPEAKER_03 4:20

Very good. So, about blending real history with uh fictional storytelling. So, historical fiction is it can be tricky, right? You're trying to pull in these real facts and you're also trying to build this story and still somewhat make it believable. So, how do you go about doing that? Like, what is your tip for blending the two together?

SPEAKER_00 4:44

So, I read a lot of historical fiction. It's my favorite genre. I've read it my entire life, but basically, um, I stay extremely true to the history: people, places, facts, everything. So, in a way, it's kind of a little bit easier because I have the story, um, and I don't really have to make up any characters or happenings or places or any of that. But at the same time, um, it's easy to info dump, you know, just dump a lot of info, um, information on the reader. So you do have to make it, and it is a novel, um, a fiction, historical fiction, which really means it could mean a lot of different things, but to my uh writing process, it means um sticking to the historical facts, but yet making it engaging as well. So that's the tricky balance of the genre that I write in. How do I go about it? Um, I try to use all the, you know, the the foreshadowing and the and the um the hook and the tension, all those, you know, all those plot points of of just a regular fiction writer, but I try to incorporate that into my storytelling. It's tough though. Sometimes it's very tough.

SPEAKER_03 6:06

Yeah, I agree with that. Um, any kind of writing is tough, but trying to remember that you are serving an audience who is looking for a particular thing, I think could probably be very difficult. So, what for the research? Um, you know, you obviously had to do some research for Christmas serenades. Did this involve, you know, trips back to uh the Smoky Mountains? You know, did you talk to people? Did you go to museums? How did you sort of do like this research part of it before you started the book?

SPEAKER_00 6:35

Yeah, great question. Um, yes, all of the above. I go, I rely heavily on the University of Tennessee archives. Um, they are a wealth of information. They have photos, they have memoirs of the actual people I write about, so I rely heavily on that. And if there are memoirs and direct quotes, that's going in the book for sure. I do have to make up a lot of dialogue because we don't know exactly what they said, but if it's if it's in the historical record, it's going in the book for sure. Um I rely on my own family coming from the Smoky Mountains since the 1700s. They're deeply rooted. So I talk to them, you know, all the old timers, so to speak. Um, and I just do a lot of general research, and I've pretty much read every book I can get my hands on about the Smokies, about Cade's Cove, just reading and doing a lot of meticulous research. I make sure everything is right as much as I possibly can. I make sure everything is historically accurate. I want people to open the book, read it, and get a real sense of what it was really like. Not my idea of what it was like, but what it was really like.

SPEAKER_03 7:51

Yeah, I can appreciate how you incorporated not just, you know, going to the University of Tennessee and researching there, but also looking to your family. I think sometimes we forget that family can be, you can find some great storytellers there. And especially like if you have your grandparents or even aunts and uncles who remember stories from greats and great greats, and they just keep passing it down. That is so special. And um, it lends a different, um, like a different kind of something to the book, uh, and I think really sets it apart. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 8:29

And they're fun stories. Oh, yes, absolutely. They are fun stories. Um, I love listening to family uh tell about stories, believe me. So, how do you balance staying true the time period and create a story that feels engaging for modern readers?

SPEAKER_00 8:44

That's probably one of my biggest struggles. Um, is staying true to what happened, not just have like a chronology. Okay, this is what happened, but making it uh pop with dialogue and um their feelings. Like what are what are these? I I what I do is I bring up a picture, if there is a picture of the people I write about. And I it sounds a little weird, but I look at that picture and I look into their eyes and I say, okay, what would you have thought? What would you have said? And somehow it just kind of channels, you know. Um, so staying true to the time period, I really do that, but we also have to, you know, I mean, there are, I mean, look, our modern readers, they want short. Um, they, you know, they want short things to read, shorter and shorter these days. Their attention spans are not like they were before. So um that is very tricky. How do I do that? I just kind of um I try to remember to write conversationally. Like, you know, everybody's like, tell me a story. Um, that's really what every book is. Tell me a story. And if I tell the story and it's engaging to me, hopefully it will come across on the page.

SPEAKER_03 10:07

Yep. That's great advice. And do you find ever find yourself tempted to correct history? You know, history can be, I mean, uh any time period really. There's there's tough, there's tough things that we have to face, um, tough topics that we have to face, and things that we as writers are maybe tempted to correct. But do you try to do that to make it more palatable, or you just pretty much tell it how it is, raw and how it is.

SPEAKER_00 10:33

My honest answer, tell it like it is. It is what it is. I'm a teacher, I love history. Um, I believe that there is power in the truth. We might not like it, we we don't like it. Um, a lot of it, a lot of it we do like. There's been great things in history, there's been bad things and everything in between, but it is what it is. We can certainly learn from it, but no, the raw truth is the raw truth. If somebody drank too much moonshine and murdered somebody, that's what happened. Yes, yeah. If somebody was, you know, running from a revenuer and they shot the revenuer, but yet they were still revered by the community, that's what it is. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:19

No, that's good. Good advice too. The raw truth.

unknown 11:22

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 11:23

That's a I think it's a very important aspect. Um, as hard as it is, some of it is very hard to read and know that that's actually what happened, but it's how we learn, you know. Um, it's how we learn to not do things or maybe to do things or continue traditions or not to continue traditions. So all right, let's talk about themes and characters. So, what themes in Christmas serenades do you resonate, do you feel resonate most strongly today?

SPEAKER_00 11:53

Oh, there's so many in my all of my Smoky Mountain books, but especially Christmas serenades, just really the focus on tradition, but simple traditions. We might think, and it's in the book, um, you know, the big cities, they have their lights and their Christmas trees and their turkeys and gifts and everything is hustle bustle. But in the mountains, they shot their guns, they rang their cowbells, they ran around the house, and then they were invited in for treats. You might think, oh, that's so boring, you know, but it it's so important. It was so important, such an important tradition, um, that I think that's the thing that resonates is the simple, the simple things in life, which I think we're really lacking today. And I think that's uh hopefully that's what's gonna tug on the heartstrings of readers, is that it doesn't have to be so elaborate to be really deeply meaningful and lasting.

SPEAKER_03 12:55

Yeah, I um I think we go through phases in life. I at least for me, this rings true. You know, we had traditions growing up around the holidays, um, how we celebrated Christmas. And then as I, you know, became a young mother, you know, you're you're trying to fit in and you're trying to, you know, put your place or make your mark uh as a parent. You're trying to introduce these new things, and sometimes it just becomes like overwhelming. And then I feel like as I've gotten older, you look back to some of the older things and you think, you know, I should just go back to the way it was because it was a lot easier. It wasn't so, yeah, it wasn't so like exhausting. It can become exhausting. Um, so in the in the book, you have several characters, right? Do you base your characters on the real historical figures? Do you create fictional ones, or do you kind of did you do a little bit of both in this book?

SPEAKER_00 13:50

Um, every single one of my characters and people in all of my books, they're all real. Um, am I tempted? Sometimes I'm tempted because it's easier to kind of insert a fictional character where you have the freedom to make them whoever you want. But I tend, I always stick to the real history because I wanted to like when I walk into a cabin that the national park has preserved, I want to know what really happened. So I stick to the historical figures. Am I tempted sometimes to go completely out of the box and write like a Smoky Mountain romance? Yes. Absolutely. I haven't done it yet, but stay tuned. All right. For now, it's all real people, real events. Um, I think one of the the magic of books is to live another life for just a few hours through the pages of a book. And I really want to give myself and people that experience. You get to live how it really was. And I I personally love that.

SPEAKER_03 14:57

Yeah, very nice. It came together very nicely. Um, how does the music, since it's in the title, play a role in shaping the mood or the message of the story?

SPEAKER_00 15:07

Music is fantastic. There's a lot of in the book, there's like, for example, the contrast between the music um of Cade's Cove and its suburb of Chestnut Flats, which was the the no-no. That was where you did not go. It was the red light district, so to speak. Um and you know, like it was a lot baudier, um, the lyrics over in Chestnut Flats, and Cades Cove was was very religious. Um, in fact, in the book, a little boy in the school program, they sing jingle bells, and the boy is like, Oh, we weren't allowed, I'd never even heard of this. And Aunt Becky, one of the characters, like, yeah, you wouldn't have because we're not allowed to sing it at any other time of the year, except during Christmas, when all the rules just can get broken. Uh, you just let you're free to do whatever you want, basically, on Christmas Eve. So music is a big part of the story.

SPEAKER_03 16:06

Awesome. All right, let's go into teacher and writer connection because you have a very unique perspective and a very unique gift in all of this, and that you teach. So, first and foremost, thank you for teaching our students. So, you teach English literature. How does teaching influence your writing?

SPEAKER_00 16:24

It influences a lot because we, you know, in the classroom, I have the students pick apart a character, a plot, figurative language, all of those, you know, elements of of fiction and non-fiction and poetry and all of that. So I definitely take that into my writing. Is it flowing? Am I using you know, uh proper metaphors? Is there uh can this point um be better made if it was uh if I used a simile? Things like that. So definitely all of those things that I teach go into my writing. I I practice what I preach, in other words. Um, if I tell a student to to you know analyze a character and an author's choices, well then I'm gonna do the same thing for my own writing.

SPEAKER_03 17:14

Very nice. What about your students? Do they inspire you in any way as a storyteller?

SPEAKER_00 17:19

You know, they really do. I love my students. I have such a passion for for teaching the next generation and you know, um, passing on wisdom. So they definitely inspire me. They inspire me with dialogue sometimes. There's some things that they say, whoo, I can't repeat them, but you know, sometimes like wow, that that's a unique perspective. That's an interesting way to put something. So I'll just kind of jot it down. But really, um, I love when young people are are curious, you know. So my students' curiosity to learn some really fascinating, interesting thing, that definitely inspires me.

SPEAKER_03 18:00

Oh, that's great. I love that. What about are there from the classroom? Are there lessons that you think all writers could benefit from?

SPEAKER_00 18:10

You know what? Yes. So we've all heard the writers, you know, I've been working on my novel for the past 10 years. Procrastination, right? In the classroom, you have deadlines. The essay is due tomorrow. Your research paper is due next week. So I think deadlines um should be put on, you should put deadlines on yourself. This book is due in six months. One of the biggest lessons.

SPEAKER_01 18:41

Yeah, I could have definitely used your advice about six years ago.

SPEAKER_03 18:46

You know, I think deadlines are very important, especially, and we're gonna go into this in just a second, but especially as somebody who is balancing many things, right? If you do not say, all right, I am going to dedicate this time or whatever to do this, and I want to get this novel done, it it's gonna take a lot longer. I'm not saying it won't get done, but yeah, um a lot of times it won't get done. Yeah, you're right.

SPEAKER_00 19:10

But a lot of time. So definitely the uh deadlines of uh assignments, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:18

And here, so you're a teacher, okay. You're uh you're teaching, you're probably grading homework. You have a lot of things going on, maybe you do after school help or whatever. So, how do you balance those demands of teaching with your creative process of writing?

SPEAKER_00 19:34

Oh, that's a that's a work in progress. But what I do is um again, kind of practice what I preach. Um, give myself a deadline. I practice extreme time management. So while I'm at work, of course I'm at work. But let's say three o'clock, I'm home. No more grading, no more anything. From about three till about five o'clock every afternoon, I'm writing, or I'm marketing, or I'm doing a social media post. Because you know, writers, we have to market too. So I'm doing something from about three till five almost every day, and usually Saturday and Sunday mornings as well. I've learned to just switch from teacher mode to writing mode. And it's hard. Sometimes I can write five pages of crap. But you know what they say? You can edit crap, but you cannot edit a blank page.

SPEAKER_03 20:29

That is so accurate. And I love the way you have it set up too. I do something similar, except for mine is obviously in the morning. But I think, you know, just making sure you're turning everything off, you know, focusing in on the writing, no matter what it is, you know, whether, you know, if you dedicate an hour or two hours, if you only got 50 words on the page or you got, you know, 2,000 words on the page, it's something to edit. And it's better than doing nothing at all. And I I also like the advice, you know, you sit down and maybe you're writing for your book, or you could be doing other writerly things, you know. So it's important that if you're going to indie publish and really take this, you know, all the way that you treat it as a part-time job because that's that's what it is. There are a lot of things that go into this. I do treat it like a business. It is a absolutely all right. So we're gonna learn from your process. So, what advice would you give indie authors who want to try their hand at historical fiction?

SPEAKER_00 21:33

Well, number one, find the time period that you are really interested in. Just because everybody is doing Regency England right now, you might not like that. And you might want to go back to ancient Rome or 1800 Smoky Mountains. Um, so really find the time period and maybe even a person in history that really speaks to you. Um and stick with that. And advice, another piece of advice. You know, everybody talks about are you an outliner, you know, or like a what do they call it? Panster, you know, fly by the seat of your pants. Well, your outline in historical fiction is not really an outline, it's a timeline. Oh, I've never never thought of it that way. I mean, it is an outline, but I say it's not an outline. So for those of you who are not outliners, you're off the hook. It's not an outline, it's a timeline. That's really get your dates straight and really think about like uh, you're not gonna be watching TV in ancient Rome. Make sure they talk right, they have the right dress, the right food, things like that, uh, the right technology or lack thereof. Just really find something you love, make a timeline, and really research it and know it.

SPEAKER_03 22:59

Very, very good advice. How do you decide what historical details must be included and which ones may just slow the story down too much?

SPEAKER_00 23:09

That's a hard one. I tend to include almost everything that I find, and I somehow try to find a way to put it in. But there are some things where I'm like, you know, this is so great, but it really doesn't fit. It just doesn't fit. So, you know what I do? I have a word uh file for that, things that don't fit. And I just keep it maybe for the next book, um, or a social media post or something that maybe it will fit into later down the road. Um, that's another tip, by the way. Keep everything, even if you don't use it. I promise you it will fit into the next book or the next one that has happened to me. Keep all your research.

SPEAKER_03 23:55

Yeah, I I couldn't agree more. I I do sometimes I'll tease out things either in my newsletter or on social posts that I deleted a chapter, but that's really not deleting. I would never do that. I move it to another file because you never know. It may be just that nugget of another story, or maybe it's something that can help you. So I definitely agree with that as well. All right, so in the book, and I'm just gonna go back to Christmas serenades for just a second here. Um, and you just spoke about it too, is just really knowing the time period, how they spoke, what they ate, what they how they dress. And in Christmas serenades, of course, you're in the Smoky Mountains, they have a thick southern draw. It's ma's, it's paws, you know, uh, it's all kinds of things uh in there that you have that helped with this dialogue. So, what what is your process for ensuring that accuracy in the dialogue and voice? Like, how did you get to know this is how they actually spoke?

SPEAKER_00 24:55

Right. Well, number one, my family. Um, I know how they talk. They would never say, I think that was wonderful. They would say, reckon it was wonderful. So that, and also researching the memoirs, I look at the style of the people. They actually wrote their memoirs, and some of them were more uh formal and they could read or write, but most of them were illiterate and they could not read or write. And they were very, you know, it was slang and it was very uh very much in the southern dialect. Um, so keeping true to that um is very important. I think it lends a very authentic air. Because imagine if somebody would say, you know, I reckon that my mother, you know, or I know I I think that my mother is making cornbread tonight. That would never happen. You know, reckon mom's making that cornbread, that's how they talk. Yes, that's I sometimes I go through, I'm like, ah, that's just too formal. That would never happen. So it just takes going over and over and over. And and honestly, um, here's another little tip: talk it out loud. I read to myself, or I have the computer read to me, and you really pick up on a lot if you do that.

SPEAKER_01 26:16

I just have to say that it's probably very hard for you as an English teacher.

SPEAKER_03 26:22

So with this some of the dialogue that's going on in this book, I'm like, oh, how did she do that?

SPEAKER_01 26:27

And just be like, all right, we're just gonna just gonna let this go. Oh, it kills the English teacher in me.

SPEAKER_00 26:35

It kills me, but um, but I you know, but I also love the folksy um talk. I think it's I think it's fantastic. So yeah, it it grates on me sometimes as an English teacher, but you know, as a writer, it's it's wonderful.

SPEAKER_03 26:53

Yeah, well, that's why it's important to just make this your writing space and leave the job behind, right? All right, Catherine. We've made it to the Ink Starter Lightning Round. So I'm gonna ask you a few questions and you just give me an answer. So favorite historical fiction author.

SPEAKER_00 27:12

There are two. Um, one is Philippa Gregory. She writes about Tudor England, which I love. And the other one is Edward Rutherford, and he writes uh very sweeping um epics um of his the history of England, the history of Russia, the history of uh Rome, Egypt. So he's um very he's meticulous, and he's got like thousand-page novels.

SPEAKER_01 27:40

But they are great. That's great.

SPEAKER_03 27:43

All right, a book you always recommend to your students.

SPEAKER_00 27:48

So a novel, I love The Thornbirds by Colleen McCullough. I love that book. So if they want to read a novel, I recommend that. If they want to learn more about writing, I recommend Stephen King's On Writing. I don't like the horror genre, but I love, I of course I respect Stephen King and I love his writing book. So those are books that I recommend always.

SPEAKER_03 28:13

Yes, that is one of my favorite books. Um for writing. Yes, very inspirational. I think people would, if they haven't read it yet, I think they would probably be very surprised. Um he's a very just a human being with a great story. Yeah. Okay. All right. One historical era you'd love to write about someday besides the early 1900s.

SPEAKER_00 28:37

Besides that, um, I would love Tudor England, you know, Henry VIII, the six wives. I think that is just fascinating. Um, and I also love ancient, well, I love very, very medieval Italy. My mom's side of the family comes from Sicily, and uh there's a lot of history there. So I think that would be that would be great. I might tackle that one day in my spare time.

SPEAKER_03 29:04

I know, I was gonna say, we're looking we're gonna be looking for romance history in Italy and England. That's great. All right, and what's one Christmas tradition that inspires you personally?

SPEAKER_00 29:16

Well, it's our annual baking day, so the whole family gets together around a few days before Christmas and spends the entire day in the kitchen baking cookies and cakes and treats, and we have the Christmas music on. And I think that's just it's really about traditions and family and you know the the things that we do every year that are really important and meaningful. It just brings meaning to our lives. So that's a very like heartfelt um Christmas tradition in our family.

SPEAKER_03 29:48

Awesome. Well, Catherine, this has been fun. We are going to start to get to close here, but before we do, you're gonna give us your five best tips for authors. So what's important here is that you're giving us the tips that you just think will help your will help any author, whether they're indie or they're gonna go the traditional route, elevate their writing and take it to the next level.

SPEAKER_00 30:11

Yes. Okay, so number one, set a timer and go. On your phone, you set that timer for 25 minutes, 45 minutes, and you write. Don't stare into space, don't say, I don't know what to write, just write anything, even if it's I don't know what to write, I don't know what to write. Just do it and something will come out. So that's number one. Just basically do it. Uh, number two, use the five senses, but in a different way. Like you usually feel the breeze, um, but can you taste the breeze? Um, so use your five senses, but try to shake it up and use it in different ways. Um, three, this is the teacher in me coming out. Use your figurative language, use your personification and your similes and your metaphors. Um, they make writing richer. I I believe that. Number four, or yeah, number four, write with passion. Care about what you are writing about. Don't just say, what do I think people want? And what is the market calling for these days? If you have passion for your subject, I really truly believe that it will come across on the page. And look into your characters' eyes, even if you have to close your eyes and in your mind, but really feel your characters and have a passion. And finally, um, number five, it's probably cliche, but never ever give up because excellence is never an accident. Ever. The people who are successful or at least somewhat successful, they're the ones that just did not stop no matter what. So never, never stop. Keep your passion in your heart.

SPEAKER_03 32:04

Awesome. I those are the best tips. I love them all. And I think that um I know for certain I am going to take some of this. I love the advice about looking into the character's eyes. It's something that I think that I will use in my own writing and just try to understand where they're coming from because I think, as you know, as a writer, getting your characters are telling you who they are. We don't tell them who they're they are.

SPEAKER_00 32:28

Exactly. It's in Philly, and you're like, oh, well, that doesn't work. But I promise you, it really, really works.

SPEAKER_03 32:38

Awesome. All right. Where can listeners find Christmas serenades or any other of your Smoky Mountain historical books?

SPEAKER_00 32:46

Well, all of my books can be found um on Amazon, of course, in Kindle or uh Paperback, Barnes and Noble, um, a lot of stores up in the Smoky Mountains, basically anywhere um books are sold, thrift books. It's they're widely available. Um, so yes, pretty much anywhere you find you find books. Great. And what's next for you as a writer and a teacher? Ah, well, I am working on my 11th um book overall, but my seventh Smoky Mountain Historical Fiction book. It's um it's gonna be set in Elkmont, Tennessee, which was a thriving resort town before the park came through, the national park. Um so I'm I'm definitely going to keep on um continuing with my Smoky Mountain historical fiction. But like we talked about, you never know. Maybe there's a little romance in the future. Oh yeah, teacher, I'm just gonna keep on uh plugging away at that and uh just um you know try to inspire the next generation.

SPEAKER_03 33:49

Great. Thank you so much, Catherine. This has been such a fantastic discussion. Um, really enjoyed Christmas serenades. I love the story of Kate's Cove, and I hope others come to know it as well. Thank you. Thank you. I hope so too. Thank you for listening to this episode of Traditionally Self-Published. If this episode helped you, subscribe, leave a review, and share with your author and writer friends a like. And be sure to check the first episode where I share a bit about how this all can be and why building a helpful community is so important.

SPEAKER_02 34:23

And how next time you have people right now.