Paul Sykes - Britain's Hardest Prisoner (From The Madeley Archives)

He’s a former prisoner who calls himself “a wonderful citizen”, argues like he’s in court even when he’s alone in a front room, and tells a shark story that sounds impossible and somehow still believable. Yes, we’re taking you back to our most-listened to Living With Madeley episode and reuploading our take on the legendary Paul Sykes documentary. 

If you enjoy the show, subscribe, share it with a mate who loves classic British documentaries, and leave us a review so more people can find the podcast. What’s the one Paul Sykes line you can’t stop repeating?

Transcript

Why We’re Reposting Paul Sykes

SPEAKER_07 0:00

Hello and welcome to the UK Nostalgia Podcast. Who remembers? In this episode, we are remembering the Living Wheel episode we did about Paul Sykes. Come and join us.

SPEAKER_06 0:53

Yeah, this. Two reasons. One, it's obviously in the uh a quote from that uh documentary is in our theme tune, but more importantly, Liam, it's our most popular ever episode of Living with Maidly, wouldn't it? Put the Paul Sykes on.

SPEAKER_07 1:12

Yeah, the the sort of pattern tended to be that the early stuff, so the the Maidley episode, which I think in hindsight we probably would have done a lot better. But actually episode two, the adverts one did very well, and we kind of always thought, well, the earlier the R the higher the numbers will be. And Paul Sykes proved us very wrong because it jumped ahead right to the top of the queue. So yeah, we want to get I I suppose like yeah, cards on the table. We we want to get the the most listed to episode from the previous feed onto this one. So I don't know what what do you think? I I don't know, I've not listened to it recently, so I don't I can't sort of judge what we did on the episode, but I I think the documentary we covered is still incredibly intriguing. I I think it holds the the the test of time, the documentary.

SPEAKER_06 1:59

It's an incredible documentary. I've not listened back to this episode, so there might be some effing and Jeffin in there, there might be some sexism in there. Who knows what's in there, Liam? We don't know if we're different men. We're very different people, yeah. So I don't know what to do.

SPEAKER_07 2:14

Something like that.

SPEAKER_06 2:15

Something like that, yeah. So I mean this would I think I think this were a request for someone asked us to do. I can't remember who it was, obviously, but um yeah, and people seem to love this one, not necessarily the episode, but I think the subject of Paul Sykes himself.

SPEAKER_07 2:28

So And and I think I'm not sure kind of where we're gonna trim it down. We're just gonna trim it to the main part of the episode, but it's certainly on YouTube, uh what was it called the documentary watch? Paul Sykes Hardest.

SPEAKER_06 2:39

Yeah, Britain's hardest man, I think it was. I think if you put Yeah, if you put Paul Sykes documentary and you'll find it if you want to uh watch it before you listen to this.

SPEAKER_07 2:48

I'll do that live now just to check uh that that's what you get. So Paul Sykes.

SPEAKER_06 2:53

And obviously people know the main thing of it, but it might not be the best bit. Do you know the ask I swum it, obviously, or you know, I don't read Daily Mail. I go out and have a look. British Art's Prisoner, it was called British Ords Prisoner.

SPEAKER_07 3:05

Uh it's not it's not really long, so it's about half an hour. So go give it a watch. Um watch along with us. And yeah, I d I I still don't know to this day. Um I mean, we sort of found him a bit of a lovable rogue. I've sort of heard bad things after this about that that actually he's quite a sort of dark character, but we were judging the documentary, not not the man.

SPEAKER_06 3:25

So yeah, and at the yeah, and at the time you said it's we might I can't remember what we said, but we might praise him a little bit or whatever, or maybe play down his uh crime. I didn't know I was just following orders. Um but no, I think that we didn't know. I've read some stuff after uh that is a bit well, it's awful, if we're gonna be honest, it's absolutely a problem.

SPEAKER_07 3:47

You know, again, as I say, we we we're judging the documentary, so come and join us for another it's kind of nostalgia of our own nostalgia, isn't it? So that that's the that's the way we've we've included it.

SPEAKER_06 3:59

Archival. Right, let's go.

SPEAKER_07 4:06

Right,

Documentary Names And Crimes List

SPEAKER_07 4:07

let's get into the main party episode, Paul Sykes. Uh recommended by PTRD on uh on Twitter. Um, I'll be honest, I've watched the documentary, I've got lots to comment on. I don't know much of his background. Did you sort of dig into any of Paul Sykes away from this documentary?

SPEAKER_06 4:23

Only a little bit. I mean, you get a lot of it in the documentary. This documentary we're covering is called Paul Sykes at Large, uh, or it's also known as Britain's hardest prisoner.

SPEAKER_07 4:31

And uh, just to clear that bit up. So if you do want to watch it, and if you don't want to listen to his ramble for this episode, I still would recommend you go away and watch it. And on YouTube, it's Paul Sykes, Britain's hardest inmate, is it?

SPEAKER_06 4:45

I think it's Britain's hardest prisoner on YouTube, yeah. But the actual show is called Paul Sykes at Large, so I'm not sure why they why they changed that, to be honest.

SPEAKER_07 4:51

Yeah, yeah. Sorry, carry on.

SPEAKER_06 4:53

Yeah, but the producer Roger Greenwood follows around Paul Sykes uh after he'd just been released from Hull Prison in 1990. Sykes had been locked up for 21 of the previous 26 years for various offences uh leading up to this uh documentary. Um and this is basically where we see him. I I mean we will go through his life story because it goes through as the documentary goes on, but it basically starts with the governor of Hull Police saying he was a violent but very bright man and that it was brighter than most of the people who locked him up. Did you get that from watching this?

SPEAKER_07 5:25

Yeah, um I think let's give a let's give a summary of the the the announcer. I think it's an IT is it an ITV or a Channel 4 documentary, but uh the presenter who basically is only in it at the very start and the very end, but lists some of his crimes. So let's just get a bit of perspective.

SPEAKER_00 5:42

Between 1962 and 1985, Paul Sykes was convicted twice of wounding with intent, twice of robbery, once with violence, five times of assault occasioning actual bodily harm, once of assault occasioning grievous bodily harm, more than once of assaulting police and prison officers.

SPEAKER_06 6:01

Yeah, it was on RTV, you're right. It was our opening because it went to a police constable talking and then went back to his list of crimes after and then went into the documentary. So it was quite a strange opening, I thought.

SPEAKER_07 6:11

Yeah, and just obviously we'll summarise at the end, so I don't want to jump in with too many sort of kind of trying to round it all up right now. But the main thing I'll say is I'm sure loads of people were gonna come to it. There's a famous Paul Sites clip. You might not even know it as Paul Sites, and when we get to it, I reckon most people will have heard it. But yeah, yeah, yeah. Because I knew of that clip, I was expecting this to be not a comedy as such, but uh you know, kind of uh a very humorous look. And it quite quickly it starts and it's quite dark from from the beginning, isn't it?

SPEAKER_06 6:44

Yeah, well people tell you what, people who don't know who he is, I'm gonna play the first clip here of Paul Sites in this documentary. Comes in after two minutes, which is quite a long time, really, given it's a documentary about him. And this is the first thing that he says.

SPEAKER_05 6:57

I've had ten and a half years for whacking screws and ten years for whacking coppers. Yeah. I d I've never taken a liberty in my life. I've belted a few people. On every case, I went in the right, and it were them that would do it, taking the liberties. And I did what John Wayne did. What any same thinking manager punched them right in the fucking hair hole.

SPEAKER_07 7:20

It's another one of these where it it's so funny, so much of it. It's uh it's actually not. I mean, it's very different to the Daz Sampson thing because they're polar opposites in terms of characters and people, but you say that, I don't know.

SPEAKER_06 7:37

I mean, they're both uh quite I don't know, did this I say they spin a yawn or they exaggerate quite a bit.

SPEAKER_07 7:43

Yeah, I suppose so, but I think ultimately Das Sampson is is you know, as as we've said, we've done this, he's perhaps playing a bit of a character to get some media headlines. I don't think Paul Sykes can be anybody other than Paul Sykes.

SPEAKER_06 7:54

No, no, no, no, no, no, yeah. I agree. I think you've got to put the Paul Sykes, he's like that. I think he's he's this is Paul Sykes, 24-7. He's like mainly, isn't he? Like the there's no filter, it's just comes out with exactly what's on his mind at that time. And let's say like it looks like the 1980s. You might you know what I mean by that? A British man from the 1980s, you draw Paul Sykes, like a short hair, little little mustache, like what were obviously all the rage back then. He looks like it just looks like every single like old family photo I've seen, like my my uncles and my dad and everything like that.

SPEAKER_07 8:29

It does encapsulate that era, doesn't it? But he also looks a bit like do you remember when sort of circus strongman? Before they had sort of proper muscle men, they were just sort of men.

SPEAKER_08 8:37

Yeah, I can't.

SPEAKER_07 8:38

He does look like a sort of circus strongman, he's he's a big bloke, he's got the tash, he's a he's a dangerous-looking man.

SPEAKER_06 8:46

You won't mess with him, you would not mess with his ears.

SPEAKER_07 8:48

He is he is terrifying as a bloke, and yeah, obviously, we we go into some of his his background and his childhood. I don't want to jump ahead of you. Um have you got kind of anything? Base basically, I think the summary of his childhood years is his dad was uh a boxer in the armed forces who basically from from the age of four gave him some boxing gloves and yeah almost made him box.

SPEAKER_06 9:12

I don't think it was uh He used to whack him about, didn't he, and then buy him chocolate recently. I just let's mention his mum, by the way. This is awful, and I'm I imagine she's passed away, so this is not nice, but Paul Sykes as well, so you can't come after me. She reminded me of Mel B of Po Selector with the massive glasses and big curly hair. Come on out, I'll tell you, like just reminded me so much of a postelector, just like well, is she real?

SPEAKER_07 9:38

If Paul Sykes was alive, that I would be deleting that in edit, to be honest.

SPEAKER_06 9:43

Yeah, I think you'd be right to do that as well. But yeah, just she popped on like proper close-up of her face, big curly hair and massive glasses. I mean, she said that she uh never had any problems with him as a kid.

SPEAKER_07 9:56

Yeah, but then you know, later on there's a few bits that creep in where she she turns a blind eye to basically. I think his dad just used to beat him up, and and yeah, you know, not again. This is where the humour just fades away from it all. And and actually it was a young lad who well, I'll play you a quote from him when he's he's been sent boxing several times a week. Don't get the impression he didn't want to go at the time, but this was his assessment of it.

SPEAKER_05 10:18

I'll get him bashed in the face at seven years of age, Tuesday, Thursday, Sunday morning, buff, buff, bashed in the face, learning how to box. How can your dad love you if it lets this happen to you two or three times a week?

SPEAKER_06 10:31

Did I hear it right, or have I got this wrong? I've listened a couple of times, but was his first criminal offence for striking back at his dad? If it was, I missed that. Um I don't I rewind, I I don't know, it was quite clumsily worded. It said Paul, he said his dad used to strike him, Paul fought back, and this saw him got his first criminal offence. I don't even don't know if it means he fought back at society or whatever, or his dad. But by 17, he had 22 offences.

SPEAKER_07 10:57

Yeah, yeah, that's correct. And uh he gets pulled up in court, his mum and dad go to court, and his his mum pops up, uh Mel B pops up again and says, um, ooh. She actually says, and again, this is you know, this is the kind of life that he's had. He's a 17-year-old lad, he's got himself in a bit of bother. He says basically the bubble burst and he was very disillusioned with the world and he and he snapped and he hit out and he hit back. I don't think he means that he's died, I think he means at the world.

SPEAKER_06 11:24

Yeah, I possibly misread that to be fair, but yeah.

SPEAKER_07 11:26

But yeah, his mum goes to visit him and she says, Oh, and I got in trouble with the uh the court official because I said I said to him, I'd hang him for the things he's done. I'd hang him. So that's kind of his mum's opinion at 17. It's not like you know, let's get you back on track, let's send you to the gallows.

SPEAKER_06 11:43

Well, he actually it seems to me throughout the film that Paul actually likes to be in prison out of the world. Yeah, that is a bit of a running thing.

SPEAKER_07 11:52

I mean, he's he's almost uh predetermined to be institutionalised. So there's a clip it's around about seven minutes, Mark, where he says uh made up to be in the nick. Um you know, a nice warm room. In fact, shall we play the clip? He can say it better than I can. Let's play the clip.

SPEAKER_05 12:08

Oh made up when they put me in the nick. They'd do a short lovely warm cell, and all the books I could read are made up. In fact, being in the nick were it easier than being at home.

SPEAKER_07 12:19

Yeah, what what a sad analysis of being locked up as a teenager that it's easier than being at home.

SPEAKER_06 12:25

I mean, this is the thing, you you get jokes and stuff from people say I mean I I know certain people who know people in jail and they they say they love it. They they you know they they enjoy being in jail, which sounds absolutely outrageous to someone like me and yourself and probably everyone listening, but there are people out there like teenage with poor lives, bad upbringings, and you know, getting hammered at home and stuff like that. And obviously, I can't understand it, uh thankfully, but yeah, I mean

Childhood Brutality And Prison As Shelter

SPEAKER_06 12:51

I don't think he's a a sole case with that, is it?

SPEAKER_07 12:53

Well, and then if if we haven't already, I think this follows straight into a clip where we start to see the the the madness, the intensity of the man, the the reason why he gets in so many arguments. I think if if I play this clip, he's he's so convinced he's right, there's no debate in him, and and he just sort of shouts down. But here's the clip.

SPEAKER_05 13:14

When I first came in prison, you walk through the cell door, and in the corner of your cell is the Bible and the rule book. You picked up the rule book, and after a few years, you can recite that rule book, you can recite it. I know the rules and regulations inside out. I am one of a very, very small minority of Great Britons with a set, a written set of statutory rights. I have got rights.

SPEAKER_07 13:41

Can you say the same? This is mental because what he's claiming is because he's in prison, he's got rules to live by. But we all do as a society, we all live by rules, he keeps breaking them, that's why he gets put inside.

SPEAKER_06 13:55

You you find out as it goes on, he's a he's a massive conspiracy theorist, isn't he? And like all the way through it, he sort of thinks I mean, maybe he's right, who knows, but it's all about the government's plans to try and hemming everyone in, and he's he's lashing out against it and flying out.

SPEAKER_07 14:10

He cleans to little shreds of bits and pieces in the same way that you know there's people online who do it now, but this guy, rather than sort of sending hurtful stuff over over the airwaves about people, and he's out in the street drinking and beating people up. He's he's yeah, you know, he I I think he he firmly believes he's right. I you know, a genuine he sees himself as a a kind of you know he he's policing the streets in the way of the.

SPEAKER_06 14:37

Well he says in the first clip, he says something on uh where he says that he's uh he he's John Wayne, basically. He compares himself to John Wayne.

SPEAKER_07 14:46

Yeah, he does. He's he's a very he's one of these people who I thought this all the way through it. If uh you know, if if he'd sort of been born in tribal times, he'd he'd have been some kind of warlord, tribe leader, or something. You know, he's a yeah, he's a big physical strong bloke who's probably born a couple of thousand years late to to sort of find out.

SPEAKER_06 15:04

Possibly even even earlier, maybe 50, 60s, he might have sort of got away with more than he than he did.

SPEAKER_07 15:11

But I still think you'd have had very similar problems in terms of he he doesn't like authority, he has an awful lot of problems with with the police, with prison uh guards, with bouncers, seems to be a regular recurring thing. He's well being told what to do, basically, does he?

SPEAKER_06 15:25

He didn't he like smash two bounces' heads in or something. His first 13 years of prison sentences, he'd been free for just nine months.

SPEAKER_07 15:32

Yeah, which is such a frightening statistic. But as we've said, he almost seems to he's a whether he enjoys being in there or not, he certainly doesn't fear it. I mean, he you know, he kind of goes through the some of the characters he's been in with there later on, and he's I think he has a good time in there. I think he likes the well, I think he's respected.

SPEAKER_06 15:50

I mean, you know, Charles Bronson uh says that you know, I think he's cited him as like Britain's hardest prisoner. I don't think anyone messed with him really in prison. I think he probably had a status in prison that when he came out he was just a bit of a loser. I think his mum, I think Mel B at the end says something along those lines where she says something like, Ooh, she said uh, ooh, he thinks he's somebody, but you know, he's not a bit. I think in prison he is somebody.

SPEAKER_07 16:13

We've got to be careful if if he's his son might be a madman now, like him, so let we'll we'll ease off on the Mel B stuff, I think. Um but it is a good segue into talking about how he is respected and he's a tough bloke. I when we again, when we get to the clip, most people probably know it. I've seen that clip and I thought it's a bit of a blagger. Actually, the the next bit we move into in the documentary is at the age of 30 he turns to pro boxing.

Pro Boxing And A Dangerous Gift

SPEAKER_06 16:38

This is yeah, this I was stunned by this. I'd I'd I'd read that he was a former boxer, but I presumed amateur like sort of boxer.

SPEAKER_07 16:47

So let's play a clip from his first professional fight.

SPEAKER_02 16:51

So, round one of this eight-round heavyweight contest between Paul Sykes and Wakefield, and he's in the black short against Keith Johnson from Bundeslay. And this is a really intriguing one because this man pulled in something of a miserable settlement. His first professional fight at the age of fellows, and he's giving Johnson beasting right to the left to the body. He's like a machine man.

SPEAKER_06 17:32

I think it were frightening how good he was. I mean, this is his first professional fight at 30 years old. And I don't know.

SPEAKER_07 17:38

It looks dangerous. I mean, I don't I don't think he's had any amateur career. I think he's just learnt his trade fighting on the streets for it. I mean, I know as a kid he's fought in the ring, but I get the impression after that he's just he's just sort of kept himself busy on the streets, really. And he looks deadly, doesn't he? I mean, we we we get together and watch a few different fights, some of the bigger fights. I I was really impressed. He I I don't know who he fights, don't know if he's a name or not, but he absolutely smashes him to bits.

SPEAKER_06 18:06

Yeah. And his manager, Tommy Miller, was his manager. Well, I don't know, to be honest. But um he said he'd be dynamite.

SPEAKER_07 18:13

Yeah, again, he sort of captures the sadness a bit. When when he were training and when he was on it, he were great, but he you know, he says he carried a lot of problems around with him, but once he was in the ring, he was alright.

SPEAKER_06 18:22

And I think being in the gym was like prison to him, which is ironic because not prison in a in a good way that he likes being in prison, you know, that was real prison to him.

SPEAKER_07 18:31

Yeah, and he doesn't say whether it's his second fight or not, I'm not sure, but then he fights a guy uh called Dan Wilson.

SPEAKER_06 18:38

David Wilson.

SPEAKER_07 18:39

Is it David? Sorry, yeah, Dave Wilson I've written down, yeah. Yeah, yeah, he sort of says before the fight, you know, I don't just want to win this one, I need to win him big style, I need to smash him up.

SPEAKER_06 18:49

Well I think we have to play a cloak. This is one of the funniest bits of the film actually, where he's talking about his next fight to a report, I'll just play it here.

SPEAKER_03 18:57

Without swearing it's shit a bus. I'll turn it in if I don't win this. And I won't I've got to win it back in great style. But this is not just gonna win. I've got to really the business.

SPEAKER_07 19:09

Yeah, I mean, uh again in his sort of way with words, he puts it perfectly, but yeah, you know, he claims he's gotta go out there and hurt him, and then not only does he beat him, he absolutely smashes him up so he doesn't get up, and this guy spends a month in hospital.

SPEAKER_06 19:23

Well, on a life support machine.

SPEAKER_07 19:25

Yeah, I mean he he really he kind of has him on the ropes, and it again it's like a street ball, he's absolutely smashing him, and yeah, uh he is a danger, clear, very clearly a day. I suppose the point I'm trying to make is that you know there's various documentaries about sort of hard people, and I'm I'm sure in the right circumstances and you know in a bar they can be deadly, but this guy is a tough bloke, this guy is a nutcase.

SPEAKER_06 19:48

I mean the thing with this David Wilson thing is he knocked him out called. I've seen like so I've run a bit into this, and a lot of people have criticised him for this fight and said that he carried on punching him once he'd knocked him out. So I were expecting this guy to be on the floor and then Sykes is you know on top of him hitting him. But to be fair, I I don't think he really does much wrong. The ref don't really step in until very late.

SPEAKER_07 20:08

The ref does stop it as he's doing it. The only thing I thought was the last punch he throws, so he's he's kind of got him on the ropes and he's gone.

SPEAKER_06 20:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 20:14

The last punch he throws, it's it's not a punch, so it's almost like a hammer fist. He he brings his fist down on him, which obviously there's no padding underneath your fist.

SPEAKER_06 20:22

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 20:23

I think that's the that's the one almost that I thought, oh god, he that last put that last blow looked bad, and then yeah, he doesn't but I mean to be fair, he he's interviewed after the fight.

SPEAKER_06 20:33

Yeah, and he's he is gutted, isn't he? Yeah, I believe he's gutted as well. I think this is I do, you know.

SPEAKER_07 20:38

I certainly don't think he's an actor or or a liar. I think he tells tales when he kind of gets in a role and he's had a drink, maybe, but I think I think in terms of emotion, I don't think he could act that. I think he's very genuinely gutted that he's hurt this bloke.

SPEAKER_06 20:52

Yeah. He has to walk away from the camera at one point, doesn't he? Because he's that gutter. Yeah, yeah. Um but what this is how good he was, though. By his eighth fight, and I I don't know if this is unusual or not. I don't know much about boxing. You're you're more of an official than I am, but by his eighth fight, he had the chance to win the British and Commonwealth titles. By his eighth fight, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 21:12

I mean, uh he's obviously a name and he's known because the the same big things are expected of him right from the start. So whether whether his name carries him certain certain places, but yeah, I mean he gets his shot and it seems like he's earned it. And i I find it really frustrating actually the fight because it whether he hadn't trained properly or whatever, but he he just seemed to burn himself out, and I think it's in the sixth round.

SPEAKER_06 21:34

I actually watched that you can watch the full fights against General Gardner, and you can watch the full fight back on YouTube. And I actually watched it back, and he's outclassed. There's uh there's no doubt the other guys are Miles' better boxer. I mean, do you know John Al Gardner at all?

SPEAKER_07 21:47

No, and I and I didn't know that full fight was available actually. So I've only seen the clip we see, and and it seems like in in his usual style, kind of you know, like steams in, but I think he's he's burnt out, and I think it he just He's taking a lot of punishment, and actually, to be fair, the commentator says, you know, you can't put him down, he's not gonna put him down. And there's just a split second where he just turns away and the referee stops it and he says he turned away, that's it.

SPEAKER_06 22:10

And yeah, and I think and that were it, that was the end of his career. I mean, normally boxers will just carry on and go to the next, you know what I mean? Yeah, maybe have another go at it.

SPEAKER_07 22:18

It seemed to me like there was enough there that possibly if he trained better and harder, it it wasn't it wasn't sort of so one-sided from what I the small bit I saw that that was it. But

Losing The Title Shot And Finding Books

SPEAKER_07 22:29

less than a year later triggered a trip back into sort of crime and prison then. Yeah, didn't it?

SPEAKER_06 22:34

Less than a year later in jail for five years when his box and career were completely done.

SPEAKER_07 22:38

And then he's back inside when we meet him. And I think this is a you know, people keep saying he's clever, and he clearly he clearly is. I think he's a he's a massive overthinker, to be honest. I think he he ties his own head in knots. But I think this this was kind of quite insightful. We we see him again, he's back in prison. It's funny how like every you know, every other scene he's back in prison laid on his belt.

SPEAKER_06 22:58

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like a sketch, innit?

SPEAKER_07 22:59

Yeah, yeah. This is his uh this is his thoughts on almost where he's gone wrong and how he can try and fix it.

SPEAKER_05 23:06

What's got me into trouble in the past is having my physique trained as a child, but not my emotions. I've altered the physical side to the intellectual side, if you want, the academic side, but using my brain instead of my body. It's all the same machine, and I didn't realise I'd got such a good brain until I took the wraps off and started using it.

SPEAKER_07 23:28

Yeah, and just to follow that on, you know, to prove he's not sort of just talking the talk. He he then goes on to tell us some of the stuff that he's been reading, which you know it's it's quite an extensive list for I I don't know all these authors if I'm honest, but you know, it's quite an extensive list to reel off off the top of your head. So let's authors.

SPEAKER_05 23:47

I've read and read and read and read. Richard Powell, he's a good author, I like him. Norman Mailer, for storytelling, R. F. Delderfield, A.J. Cronin, Howard Spring, J. D. MacDonald, Nicholas Montserrat. There's so many good authors. The the French one, Sabatini, Hugo, so many that I admire.

SPEAKER_06 24:07

Loads of sort of people I'd never heard of before, like, and obviously he's writing his own book, isn't he? Sweet Agony, which you can buy, it is out. He did come out as we'll see at the end of the film, and that won a cursor award for artistic achievement whilst he were in prison.

SPEAKER_07 24:20

Bit of a yeah, sorry, I'm just on a tangent there before we kind of go into his book, but something that made me laugh there, because what's the there's a French author that he names at the end. Is it oh oh it let's say it's Babatino or something like that. Babatino. But what made me laugh is he says it in a really broad Yorkshire accent. Um we came out of the match a couple of weeks ago and I overheard two people talking, and uh I'm laughing about this for ages. Someone said, What are you doing tonight? And he said, Uh, I've got me sent a box of them Ferrari Rochers.

SPEAKER_06 24:57

Ferrere Rochers, yeah. Probably like angry, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 25:02

I love like sort of that broad northern accent trying to pronounce something like that. And it were good in that instance as well. I love the idea that what you're doing for your night is if that's my night cover. I've got a box of Ferrari Roshiers.

SPEAKER_06 25:13

And it were good because you were angry because we'd lost, and everyone else would be like, nobody fee, what's going on? I've got a box of them Ferrari Roshi. Brilliant. By the way, just before I go on, does he remind you any Paul Sig, does he might just be me, does he remind you of all of Tyson Fiora?

SPEAKER_07 25:29

Yeah, I didn't think that as I watched it, but I can see where you're coming from. Yeah, he's he's he's he's a talker. He can he can quite happily talk.

SPEAKER_06 25:36

There's a lot going on, there's a lot in his mind going on.

SPEAKER_07 25:39

Yeah, I think he's he's got the gift of the garb. I think I can imagine him sat in the same way Tyson Fiora, I can imagine him sat telling stories entertaining a room as long as he wanted to, really. Yeah, he's he's definitely an entertainer. I think he would he would certainly kind of class himself as a man of the people as well. He's he's not you know, he's certainly not showbiz, he's not you know, he is what he is, and I don't think it matters if he's every weight champion of the world or just training his local gym. I don't think he's a different bloke, and and Tyson Fury's probably quite like that.

SPEAKER_06 26:11

So then he he he's released from prison, and this is where we sort of meet him like in the documentary. The documentary by this point is all going back, and this is what he did, and this is what he did, and now we're in the present day with him. And we meet Paul's girlfriend, Kath, who I think has one line in the entire I think one line in the entire documentary, and she's in it quite a lot.

SPEAKER_07 26:33

Well, yeah, I think she says, we're friends, that's it, we're friends.

SPEAKER_06 26:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 26:38

Yeah, I mean, I don't know what's to make of her because we don't see enough. She's she's 15 years younger than him. She lived on the same street as him. Um Yeah, I I you know, I don't have any sort of reason to doubt their their affection for each other, but she does very much play that role of of a kind of bygone era where she's you know when the man speaks she she's quiet almost.

SPEAKER_06 27:01

That's what it's and then uh Mum B at this point uh comes out with something about I mean I don't know, imagine if you're coming out of prison, you your family would be delighted, whatever you've done, oh he's out, you know, but this is how his mum reacts to it.

SPEAKER_01 27:16

We've always hoped that when he came out that there'd be a fresh start, and there's always been something there for him to come to. But then next thing you know, is it's somebody else and is back again.

SPEAKER_07 27:31

Well, just before that, as well, actually, there's another bit, a clip that I liked, and it ties back into what you said about him being a conspiracy theorist. Um, this is when he's on his way back home in the car after coming out of prison.

SPEAKER_05 27:42

And remember what the Conservative Party announced a few years ago? Well, no, not a few years ago, a few months ago in the papers of spending £216 billion on extending the motorways, widening motorways, and building new motorways to deal with the increase in traffic in the year 2025. When, and you can see for yourself, petrol runs out in 2019, so they're talking about pull the kid in, the building of skateboards.

SPEAKER_07 28:14

What I love about that clip is you know, again, it's this conspiracy theorist in him. He's absolutely certain that petrol will run out in 2019. Where he's got that number from, I'm sure he's read it somewhere, but this is a guy who will gladly start a fight and beat up six to seven blokes if one of them doubts that number. This is how certain he is of that 2019. I think this is where all his problems stem from, I think. He's he he picks up bits of information and then he's adamant on it, and and it's a good link into actually where he gets back home again. I mean, this is I love this man. I'm sure you've got a note of this.

SPEAKER_06 28:50

Yeah, this scene is funny and horrible at the same time, I think.

SPEAKER_07 28:55

Yeah, I mean it it it really is. So well, let's play it first. What's I like doing home?

SPEAKER_05 29:03

What's I like doing home, Cat? I've told you my statutory right in prison is to be in a room where you don't require artificial light. Yeah, why's that? Because it's medical. If it's a statutory right, it's medical. So I don't wear glasses. Well then, just give it a second. Well, your eyes are just yeah? Are we right now? Yeah. If you don't use your eye muscles, the active fire, might as well none have them. Come on.

SPEAKER_07 29:32

So he's just got in, he's back from prison, he's he's immediately ranting, and she's not offering him any argument, he's kind of almost arguing with it.

SPEAKER_06 29:40

I should say it's just him and just him and his uh his missus uh at this point, like they've gone back to live at her house, and he's just ranting about like nothing.

SPEAKER_07 29:51

Yeah, he's come in, he's immediately f I mean, like I say, this is a bloke who can start an argument in a room just on his own, I'm sure. And he this is why I think he must be so dangerous to be around because I think in that moment you can't question any, and I think this is why she says nothing, because I think if you question him, well, I mean, actually his rant continues, doesn't it? He starts he starts on straight up.

SPEAKER_06 30:13

I've played the end of this rant because there's a bit at the end of this rant which I love.

SPEAKER_05 30:16

You've got to use every sense that you're given, and people are having them talk off and they'll be nutrified with televisions and radios, and that early doesn't work, and that eyes don't work, and they're daft. And why are they daft? They want them to die early. Why do they want them to die early? It's six billion of us, that's why they want them to die early. There's not enough food. Go look after the food and go feed the kids. Well if you while ever kids are living. And we've got two railers there, and I've had them, we've got a good family cat, and it's our duty to look after them. And I'm gonna tell you something else. It tells you that in here. You know I'm not a Christian, don't you?

SPEAKER_06 30:54

So he's got on this bite, sort of big, almost like philosophical at the very end, he points to the Bible and says, and it says it in there, and then he casually boots the Bible like under the set E. I love it. Like, he's he's sort of pointing at this Bible like that, and it says it in there, doesn't it? And then he just boots it under a set E, like no respect for it whatsoever.

SPEAKER_07 31:14

Yeah, you know, I'm not Christian, and then it his kind of go-to thing seems to be when he's getting carried away, is that he says, I'm gonna make a cup of tea, and everyone says, Alright, Paul, and that's it. I think that seems to be the you know, you don't question him in that moment, and you and you wouldn't, let's be honest. That is you know, of all the sort of things you can watch and you can sort of see these people and think, oh yeah, you know, they they think they're tough and whatever. I I don't have any doubts this guy is tough.

SPEAKER_06 31:42

Um I mean we're coming now to the most famous speech of the entire film, which people will have heard. We'll we'll try and break this up, I think, because

Wonderful Citizen Rant And Shark Swim

SPEAKER_06 31:50

maybe I'll analyse it as we go. What do you reckon?

SPEAKER_07 31:53

Alright, yeah, let's play the first bit. And again, I'm I'm expecting if people at this moment don't necessarily know who he is, I think from this point they will.

SPEAKER_05 32:02

I'm a wonderful citizen. How do you think I've got this house and where I'm living now if I wasn't? They've give me this council. We've got the bet this is the best little city on on earth. How do I know? I've been everywhere else, I'm here now, right on the family patch.

SPEAKER_07 32:17

Yeah, I love I absolutely love how he says patch. I love uh he delivers that line. I've you know what's this? I I'm a wonderful citizen, I love that. He's been locked up, man to his life. And he's right here now on the family patch.

SPEAKER_06 32:33

Like, what who says that so angry? It should be a nice thing. I'm right here now on the family party. It's like if you were reading it as an actor, you'd be saying, No, do that again, mate. No, but you're on a boy so angry. You're on the family party.

SPEAKER_07 32:44

And this is a clip people have probably heard we're we're gonna carry it on, but just for context, he's sat in his garden, um, he's got a fag and a cup of tea, it looks like, and yeah, he's you know, he's he's he's obviously he's getting on a bit now, so he's you know, his hair's thinning, he's got teeth missing, but he's still you know, he's still quite an imposing bloke.

SPEAKER_06 33:03

Oh, yeah. And he says, by the way, it's the greatest estate in the world, and I can only see his garden, and I can categorically say that's not the not the case.

SPEAKER_07 33:13

Uh yeah, I I d I don't know. Um unlike Paul Sykes, I've not been everywhere, but I'm not hopeful.

SPEAKER_06 33:22

I say this as someone who's like lived in a Masonette when I were younger, so I'm not playing like some sort of snobbish card, but I'll just look at the houses behind and I'm thinking, yeah, but it's probably not the greatest estate in the world. But anyway, let's carry on. Yeah, so his rant continues.

SPEAKER_05 33:37

Yeah, I know where it is. I've been, I've been nobody can tell me anything. I don't read Delhi Merants, and I go and have a look. I go and have a look, and I've been, I've lived in the forests of North America, I've lived in the out back of the Ivory Coast, I've lived in India and Russia. I had my breakfast in Moscow and my tea in Good Street, Nick. Yeah, I've been about a bit.

SPEAKER_07 33:59

The bit I found interesting about this is I don't know if you're any of your research fanists are like how much of this is true? I don't know. Yeah. I think that's what when I f again, when I first heard it, I just thought this was a guy, you know, kind of ex-alcoholic talking nonsense. But he clearly has had a very colourful life. I mean the only thing is I don't know if he's had the time you know without sort of taking.

SPEAKER_06 34:23

Why is he being in North why has he been in Ivory Coast?

SPEAKER_07 34:26

I don't understand that bit. I don't know. I don't know if because we, you know, we come to a bit later on. He does some dec collection for people and he's he's bothering. He said he had his team Russia and stuff. I don't yeah, but maybe you're right. Maybe he's I I don't know. Well, well, I think, you know, if we kind of come to the final bit he says, I think not saying it isn't true, so I've got no idea, but it's he certainly knows how to tell a tale.

SPEAKER_05 34:47

I'm the only man in the history of mankind that has swum across the straits of Johor to avoid a police launch. It were either that or Changinick, they've got me passporting Singapore. Yeah, I swam it. Yeah, nobody's ever done it before, not because of the currents or anything like that, nothing like that. It sharks. Not shark-infested, but none of the locals go paddling. Yeah, I swam it. I know about sharks, I know about sharks, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 35:18

I love that clip. I don't know if it's true. I would imagine it's embellished if it's if it's close to being true. But my favourite bit is there when he says uh it's not the currents, uh it's the sharks. And then he pauses and he says, not shark infested.

SPEAKER_06 35:32

No, the the best thing is this is why I think if you're a psychologist, you could probably possibly pick him out as a lawyer because he says it weren't the currents, it were the and then he pauses and goes, sharks, as if like he's just made it up, not shark infested. It's almost like he's thinking, shit, that's a little bit too much bollocks. Shark, not shark infested.

SPEAKER_07 35:54

I love her as well. He says he has these pumps, he points to shoes on his feet. I had these pumps tied round my neck at time. He's referred to these points, he tells him these pumps are being all over the world. It's a bit earlier on where it's like. Yeah, he dumped pumps then, don't I? Yeah, there's a prison guard, and he leaves prison. He said and he comes back, I think, four years later and the same guard's there, and he says, you know, he's only studying these prison guards. These pumps have been on five continents, seven countries, and he names all these countries. I mean, yeah, I don't know if he has been there. I suspect he hasn't had the same pumps on for all this time.

SPEAKER_06 36:25

If he's been wearing them same pumps and some like you know what I mean, just get some new trainers. I mean, I know it's 80s, but what what were around in the 80s? Sugsport. Yeah, yeah, suck, yeah, yeah. Sugsport, gotta suck sport, mate. I mean, you get yourself some new trainers. But now I reckon that I I don't know, maybe it's true, who knows? I've tried to do a little bit of research onto it, and there's lots of people saying what a lot of bollocks, but no one's actually given any sort of concrete evidence why.

SPEAKER_07 36:54

He's clearly lived a colour, you know, despite spending a lot of his time in prison, he's clearly lived a life, and I think I I suspect, again, I suspect some of it is exaggeration. I th I think he's he's done a lot. I don't know how much of what he says is true. I don't know if it matters, to be honest. I think he's just telling a tale, and I think this takes us into probably my favourite clip in the whole thing.

Dad Damage And A Wedding Derails

SPEAKER_07 37:17

It starts off with him, he's basically got to a point where his dad's old and he's old, and it's funny, it's taken him all his time to basically almost stand up to his dad and said, No, you don't tell me what to do anymore. Um there's a bit where he he sort of says, you know, he's old now. Uh he's I can't remember how he words it. And then he pauses, he's blind. He's not blind, but it's it says he's blind. But then uh this is this is my favourite line of how he sums up why he knows his dad's no good.

SPEAKER_05 37:48

Well, have a look at him, he's got a finger missing for a start. He gives somebody a belt in the teeth, it's gone rotten, it's fell off, like he's had to have it amputated, yeah. He's blind all my life. I can never ever remember dad. My dad, at least twice a week, he's come home with dog shit on his shoes. That's how clever he is.

SPEAKER_06 38:08

So good that. Imagine if I think that you're like sort of I don't know, like, well, you're not an intelligent man, you've got dog shit on your shoes for one.

SPEAKER_07 38:17

So this was the bit where the humour sort of was coming back to me. So the last this this sort of ten minutes was was really funny, and despite it being quite dark, that made me laugh out loud if I'm honest when I was watching it.

SPEAKER_06 38:27

Well, the whole scene of that is his dad's really upset, and he says he don't think he loves him, doesn't he?

SPEAKER_07 38:32

Well, yeah, so straight after that bit and made me laugh out loud. He goes to him interviewing his dad, and they say, you know, how much fatherly love is left for your son. And and he's he says, Well, not much really. I might as well be honest to the camera, there's none left. It's all none left. I mean, Paul's awful. I'm basically saying, you know, he he's turned his son into this character he is today, because it does say we're too strict with him.

SPEAKER_06 38:56

Yeah, and his mum says his mum, his mum blames his dad for how Paul turned out throughout the film.

SPEAKER_07 39:01

And he's you know, so he's his dad basically says, I don't love him, and then it says to Paul, you know, what do you think, your dad? Do you love your dad? And he says, Look, I'm the only person in the world who gets to call him useless.

SPEAKER_06 39:13

Yeah, I'm the only one who can call him a bastard, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 39:15

Yeah, he's you know, he's my dad. So I think he clearly still does have some affection for his dad. Despite him very clearly being a product of his dad's upbringing, and his dad's sort of washed his hands of him.

SPEAKER_06 39:25

The dynamic they're never seen in the same scene, are they? Which is weird though.

SPEAKER_07 39:30

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then we skip to So he's getting wedding. He's getting wedding, he's getting married, it's his wedding.

SPEAKER_06 39:36

He's getting married, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 39:37

Um and this was a a really weird scene. I don't know what you said.

SPEAKER_06 39:40

This is bizarre, right? The best thing about this scene by Mile, the service is conducted by someone called Delroy Showers.

SPEAKER_07 39:47

Yeah, Delroy Showers is uh an inmate that he's spent he's done time with.

unknown 39:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 39:52

And actually, I mean, I don't know if there's any clips that can kind of do this justice, but Delroy Showers wants to be a kind of formal wedding and he wants to do a sort of do it the the religious parts of it. And Paul very quickly sort of turns on that. And then when he mentions, you know, Delroy's obviously trying to sort of say the right thing, and he says, There's a lot of old-fashioned stuff about women must be the servant and subservient. He says, I actually think Paul, you know, you need to learn to do right by her. And he he kind of flips out really. And he goes mad, he goes absolutely mad for no apparent reason. Well, Delroy Showers mentions her, because if you don't sorry, it's a brilliant name. Go on. It says uh if you don't, she'll divorce you. And he and he absolutely flips out and he Yeah, he starts shouting that I'll never do anything to make her not love me. And and that's his basically his his ethos on that. And it sort of says, you know, there's a there's a reason why with the boats were sinking women and children first because they can't look after him. So he's pointing out I stood next to him.

SPEAKER_06 40:51

Yeah, and she just sat there like silent, which to be fair, I'll say. But the thing isn't the man get married. He doesn't get married because Delroy Showers never goes through with it and says, like, you know, and I pronounce you man and wife. But he thinks he's married, I think.

SPEAKER_07 41:05

Yeah, strange ending that. I I didn't quite get. Delroy Showers sort of says, uh, I feel like a gooseberry now. And he says, No, no, you're alright, Delroy, but they I don't think they finish it. So so yeah, another very strange scene.

SPEAKER_06 41:19

And then uh And then this is even stranger, I think. This is the 35th minute of the film. Um the documentary is I think it's 50 minutes, isn't it? I think.

SPEAKER_08 41:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 41:27

And we find out he's got kids, which I think this is the first time he mentioned that he's got kids.

SPEAKER_07 41:32

So yeah, I've seen him walking around with younger kids before. Um which I must admit I've probably assumed there was kids, but yeah, he's never he's never mentioned um the I think there is a bit where he says something along the lines of I have thought about bringing up kids because of the way my dad brought me up. So I think there is but he doesn't mention my name as well.

SPEAKER_06 41:52

But he doesn't necessarily say he's got kids. I was quite because I saw him with these people, and I thought, or maybe they're just you know nephews or whatever. Or maybe I thought they were his girlfriend's kids to maybe another, but they're actually his kids. And the first thing we see him doing with them is he's

Kids, Boys Club And Debt Collecting

SPEAKER_06 42:06

teaching the kids how to defend themselves, aren't they?

SPEAKER_07 42:09

Yeah, so he t well he takes takes one of his lads out to the field and as a go at him for having his hands in his pockets, uh use their hands for it's the there to use. Yeah, and then there's a you know, and he said something like, Do you understand why I just give you a clip round here? Or he's obviously just giving him a whack, and as he kind of goes to touch him, a moot his kid sort of puts his hand up as if he's gonna hit him again. So yeah, another sign.

SPEAKER_06 42:32

Well, there's a scene here which sort of sums it up again. This is funny and sad as well. This is basically Paul's kids, one of them at least, Paul believes that he's taken a tenor out of his mum's purse. I think it's his purse, uh purse, should I say?

SPEAKER_07 42:48

Yeah, so what he says is she had two tennis in there, one's been taken out, eight pounds have been put.

SPEAKER_06 42:54

The best thing about that, by the way, does the the the action of how the tenor's been taken out in such a like an effeminate way. He's been taken out on like white pins his finger up. Um yeah, but so obviously Paul thinks they've been stealing. This is Paul, firstly, I'm gonna start with this. This is Paul's description of his own kids.

SPEAKER_04 43:12

They do the wind me up, winds me up. They're both liars and he just smirks and grins and everything.

SPEAKER_05 43:17

Oh no, it's him. He went through my pockets last night when I come in. Undespicable, dirty sh, I'm telling you.

SPEAKER_06 43:25

And then, so you think so he's obviously not happy. And then I love how they're the only way you can think to deal. Well, it's it's not funny because I'll tell you later what happened to his kids, but this is this is the way he thinks he's he's gotta deal with it.

SPEAKER_04 43:42

Telling you, I'm what I'm gonna do with him. I'll have I'm gonna have to beat him up. I'm gonna have to do.

SPEAKER_06 43:48

I love how nonchalant he says it. Like, I don't have to beat him up. It's anything they know. Like that, and it's just like that's it.

SPEAKER_07 43:56

This is what he's been shown, this is what he knows, and he as much as he's sort of Said he's trying to be different. He's clearly sort of following in his dad's footsteps, and I think, yeah, it's sad. And then there's a quite thoughtful bit. Just before you go in, by the way, with his are he moving on from his kids or well now I'll just I'll just play the sort of final piece before he's quite thoughtful, but then again finishes with a bit that made me laugh.

SPEAKER_05 44:18

He's a terrible disgrace of a lad. Am I to blame? I don't know. It'd still be a useless bastard, whether I'd have been there or not.

SPEAKER_06 44:26

This is again, it's a little bit like the the Tourette's documentary that we did in a way. In uh it's really sad, but there's definitely a laugh out loud moments the way he delivers stuff.

SPEAKER_07 44:35

Um he's a character, he's he's he's kind of comic time and he's great, even if he's not trying to be funny. And yeah, it's it's it's sad, but but you can't kind of fault that he the way he says says things is is entertaining. He's got that Peter Kaye style sort of just speaking, it's funny, whatever he's saying, really. But yeah, it's not a hilarious subject matter at all, is it?

SPEAKER_06 44:58

Not really, no, but I mean it gets less hilarious when I tell you what happened to his kids. Um they're both in prison uh for serving life sentences for murder.

SPEAKER_07 45:08

Really?

SPEAKER_06 45:09

Yeah, so Paul's not really done differently to what his dad did, I suppose, in the way they put that possible.

SPEAKER_07 45:20

I didn't know that, and that's even more sad that the cycle's kind of continued to another generation, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 45:26

Yeah, so though I mean there's a very small documentary around where it's Paul Sykes' kids, one of his kids in prison. And he's like a bit of an R case, like sort of the the cock of the of the prison as well. So they've just all followed on, obviously, from from from from the Dodge.

SPEAKER_07 45:42

Yeah, and uh you know we're sort of coming to the I wouldn't say towards the end, but we're getting we're getting well into it now. Um he's decided he wants to run a boys' club, and I think it's very well intentioned. I think he wants to get kids off the street. Um I think he's uh you know he actually goes to kind of announce this at a work in man's club where he does a raffle where he raffles off uh an ivory necklace he's bought. He says he's bought it off a kid outside a hotel in Lagos, which presumably that's true. Why you know he's got he's got the the thing with him. Um so yeah, why he was in Lagos, I've got no idea. Um then it's funny because the the crowd are sort of listening along to him, but he then produces a painting by Patrick Mackay, yeah, and he says uh most of you won't know Patrick Mackay, um, but he's in the ABC book of Mass Murderers, and I've served time with him. And everybody cheers in class.

SPEAKER_08 46:35

I love that. I love it.

SPEAKER_05 46:40

Is a Patrick Mackay original painting? An original I know. Well, you've never heard of Patrick Mackay. I doubt if you know much about painting, but Patrick Mackay is in the ABC book of Mass Murderers, and he's a bit of mine.

SPEAKER_06 47:05

I absolutely love that one.

SPEAKER_07 47:11

No, it won't be. No, he he he has done time with him. So, yeah, he's got these pictures. There's a there's a bit in this boys' club bit which uh I don't know if you made a note of it, but it sort of sums up like even when he's trying to do good, he's such a product of kind of how he's been brought up. So he's summarising, he's got these kids, he's he's sort of making them do press-ups and sit-ups, and this is his assessment of how he can help them.

SPEAKER_05 47:35

One, two, three. And I can prove it, I can lead by example, and I can show them, and I can I can bully them into do it and I can give him the feeling of belonging.

SPEAKER_07 47:45

Very, very good. Yeah, part part of his ethos is that that bully them, and I think he does he just doesn't know any different. He thinks that's part of what sort of being brought up with beer blokes, is being a good thing.

SPEAKER_06 47:56

He says he says, I mean, you hear it today from people. Kids today, they're weak, and everyone says that, but you know, his version of week is far different to most people's version of week, I think.

SPEAKER_07 48:07

Oh yeah, yeah. I mean he's he is just I think one of the commentators says he's a machine. I think he is, I think he's uh you know, he he's absolutely deadly, and I think he thinks everybody should have that intensity about them.

SPEAKER_06 48:18

Yeah, yeah. He's a he's a rhaptic type, by the way. I'd just like to add in this, but don't nothing to play, but he says he has 12 pints to hydrate his kidney.

SPEAKER_07 48:27

Yeah, he says he has five five pints a day, uh just to keep me ticking over. Um and then he says, yeah, and people don't know I've got a kidney injury playing football, so I need 12 pints of fluid just to keep my kidney hydrated. Yeah, I'm not a doctor, you're not a doctor. I suspect 12 pints of alcohol is not good for your kidney.

SPEAKER_06 48:51

I might try it out, see what happens. You fell asleep. I had 12 pints last week. We went out a couple of weeks ago and I had 12 pints, and uh it didn't help me, can tell you that.

SPEAKER_07 49:00

You're asleep at a table.

SPEAKER_06 49:02

Exactly. But your kidney was hydrated though, isn't it? Well my kidney were fine, I've never felt better since. Uh but then um because he's been unemployed till this point. We then hear he's set up a debt collecting company called Last Resort Debt Collecting Agency. I love this businessman that he meets called Dennis Flint. God, what a character.

SPEAKER_08 49:21

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 49:22

He's brilliant, he's like a really he's like every 80s football chairman.

SPEAKER_07 49:26

Yeah, he's he's I don't know, he looks like he should be wearing a sort of sheepskin coat, doesn't he?

SPEAKER_06 49:31

He's he's yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's such an amazing wheeler dealer. So 80s rich, if that makes sense. And if you think of it, right draw a picture of a rich 80s man, that's him. Can you imagine it's cigar out and do you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_07 49:43

Yeah, yeah, yeah, sort of perm hair, and he he's yeah, he looks amazing. But yeah, he sent him off to collect some money in Spain, I think. So Paul Sykes had himself a bit of a break and went and got some money off someone. It says he he went to uh a wedding and told the groom if he didn't pay up, he was gonna put his head through the wedding cake, so the groom give him the bride's engagement ring. Um I can imagine him a very good debt collector because you It'd be the best debt collector of all time.

SPEAKER_06 50:09

I'd give him even stuff I didn't know. Just have it, mate, honestly, get out, please, leave me alone.

SPEAKER_07 50:16

Yeah. Then we sort of I mean, to be honest, I'm coming towards the end of my notes a little bit more now, but this is when he starts gaining some credibility as as an author.

SPEAKER_06 50:25

It it tries to end on a high note, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_07 50:28

Yeah, so I what I find funny here, I don't know I don't know if you've got this, but is how he just assumes his book will be an instant success.

SPEAKER_06 50:36

Um, this is this is the bit that remind me of Dar Sampson.

SPEAKER_07 50:40

Yeah, should we shall we play a clip of him assuming he's gonna have a bestseller?

SPEAKER_05 50:44

I think it'll burst on the scene like The Virgin Soldiers of Saturday night and Sunday morning. They're both first-time books. So both autobiographical. You know, Alan Sillito and Leslie Thomas, and they're both well-established authors now. I think it'll burst on the scene as in in that uh that similar vein.

SPEAKER_06 51:06

Do you know what I mean by this, Dark Samson thing?

SPEAKER_07 51:08

Yeah, I I see where you're coming from.

What Happens After The Cameras Leave

SPEAKER_07 51:10

I think this is the this is the optimist in him. I think he he is trying to be positive and he is trying to assume things will go right. And yeah, I think he's I think the I wonder whether part of the problem is nobody would ever tell him. Can you imagine reading it and tell him you didn't like it?

SPEAKER_06 51:25

Oh yeah, completely.

SPEAKER_07 51:26

It's rubbish this, mate.

SPEAKER_06 51:28

Imagine that.

SPEAKER_07 51:29

Just straight away just getting knocked out, knocking out.

SPEAKER_06 51:32

I think even if he said like, oh yeah, it's good, it's really good, actually. Just one thing. What the fuck? Going mental.

SPEAKER_07 51:39

Yeah, but I I mean, to be fair, I haven't read his book. I don't know how well it's been received. As far as I know, I think it said it it was selling quite well on its first press, first release. So yeah, I I think it's it like as you say, they try and end it on a bit of a high. He's clearly trying to turn a corner. Um and this is kind of where really to me the documentary's coming to an ending. I don't know if you're not going to be able to do it.

SPEAKER_06 52:02

Yeah, I mean, do you want to just say the last word from him? Because the last word is sort of I don't know, yeah, it's an upbeat ending, really.

SPEAKER_05 52:09

I've got this far now. There'll be no bubble bursting, and with a little bit of help from my friends, I'll uh I'll finish the course. I'll finish the course.

SPEAKER_07 52:20

Right, so that's that's really that's for me, that's the documentary done, that's the end of my notes. But I know you you did a little bit of sort of looking around at what the bigger picture of Paul Sight, so have you got anything you want to add in?

SPEAKER_06 52:32

Well I'll I'm gonna I'm putting you on the spot, I probably shouldn't do this. But can you have a guess what happened next? I would imagine he gets sent back to prison. No, it's worse. Well, it is worse for him, actually. He couldn't control his drinking, his life began to crumble, he became a notorious character in Wakefield. In two in the year 2000, Wakefield Council secured a two-year ASBO banning him from the city centre after a string of aggressive drunken incidents, including shouting, abuse, and urinating in public. By all accounts, from what I can gather, he pissed into an old woman's shopping. So I don't know why. You are sorry? As you were moving. Apparently we're at a bus stop. So um yeah, basically he lost the plot. Some local hard cases, like young kids, like 15-year-old, tried to set him on fire. And uh apparently they nearly succeeded. But by I think by the end of his life, essentially he was a washed-up hard man, if you know what I mean. So people wanted to take he ended up homeless. He obviously people wanted to take shots at him because he's the famous Paul Sykes, and he wasn't the person that he once was. So he was arrested in uh August 2003 for violating the ban where he wasn't allowed to go into Wakefield City Centre by making an appointment to an optician's, which I think is um it's such Paul Sykes thing to do, innit?

SPEAKER_08 53:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 54:00

It's sad though, innit? Because it it's you know, this is a guy who was you know was a few rounds away from being British Commonwealth champion. I don't know whether his life would have turned out any differently, but this is a guy who had potential in in a few different ways and just shows kind of how that that can go to nothing ultimately.

SPEAKER_06 54:17

Yeah, yeah. And then in uh March

Final Verdict And How To Get In Touch

SPEAKER_06 54:20

2007, um he died. His his cause of death was liver corrosis and pneumonia. His d uh death certificate stated his occupation as retired author.

SPEAKER_07 54:30

Yeah, sad ending.

SPEAKER_06 54:32

It's really sad, it's a sad end, but then again, I suppose if you knew the guy and he'd done stuff to you, then you're probably thinking he deserved it. I don't know.

SPEAKER_07 54:41

Yeah, I don't know. My my small take on his life, I think he's uh he was a very troubled man, so yeah, it's a shame for him, I think. Uh I think that yeah, let's let's wrap it up. I think you know, we try and be honest about whether we think this is one to watch or not. I would say I would say this is worth watching, definitely.

SPEAKER_06 54:59

Oh, 100% worth a watch. I mean, like I say, the everyone will see the funny clips, and it is funny. And PTR, who sent it, said like, you know, you will have quotable stuff from it. We're not sort of playing a Debbie Downer, but we're obviously we're obviously sort of doing the old documentary. And it is a sad story with unbelievably funny bits in it. Thank you for listening to Who Remembers. If you want to get in touch with us, you can find it at Whorrememberspod.com. If you are a right-wing fascist, you can find it on Twitter at WhoremembersPods. Or if you're a book, you can find it on Blue Sky at Who Remembers Podcasts. Once again, thank you for listening.