Dauntless PR Unfiltered
Dauntless PR Unfiltered is a new no-holds-barred podcast revealing the things people really need to know about building their brand and getting into the media. In each episode, Luana Ribeira, founder of Dauntless PR, and Catherine Ball, an experienced UK journalist, share their PR secrets and tricks of the trade to help entrepreneurs and experts raise their visibility and reach more people.
Dauntless PR Unfiltered
Be the Zebra in a Field Full of Horses
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
The zebra isn’t trying to stand out, it doesn’t need to. It just isn’t a horse 🐴
But imagine if the zebra decided the stripes were a problem - too visible, too exposed etc, and spent its energy hiding them to fit the ‘formula’. Because it’s been told over and over that’s how to hit its goals.
It’s feeling brave because it’s stepping out of its comfort zone… but in trying to stand out, it’s actually blending in.
This is something we’ve noticed happening online among coaches & experts recently, and also it happens in journalist inboxes!
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Welcome to Dauntless PR Unfiltered. And the topic of today's conversation is be the zebra in a field full of horses. So what do we mean by that? Have you noticed how at the minute a lot of people are starting to sound exactly the same? Is this something you've noticed, Catherine?
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. And I think the ironic thing is that the people who all sound the same as each other don't realise it's not people saying like this is a popular opinion. They'll be saying stuff like, well, this is probably an unpopular opinion. And then they're all sharing the same thing. And I'm like, it can't be an unpopular opinion because I've heard this opinion 25 times today. And that's I've not even had breakfast yet. I think there is a real issue with people sort of saying the same things, but not necessarily knowing that they're saying the same things as everybody else, or believing that it's a hugely original idea. And actually, when you sit and think about it, you're like, I think we've been doing this for a while, or I think that's something that everybody kind of knows. I reckon everybody listening will be able to think of some examples where you've come across somebody and they're really hyped up with their message, and then you kind of go, I was already doing that, or I I already knew that. And I don't know why it seems so much more, but I suspect it is partly to do with AI. I don't want to make AI the scapegoat for everything, but I think I think there's a lot of because if you think about the way that AI works, it's being trained on people's input. And so the things that it's putting out is from what people feed in. So people are getting, people are trusting a robot to give them ideas rather than trusting their own genius and intuition and bright spark. So what we're seeing is I guess less less creativity. People think that they're being really creative because they're going, oh, I'm going to do some new content, I'm going to get some new ideas, but they're going to a source which is just culmination of everybody else's ideas that are already out there in the world. And they're picking from them. So it's a bit like sort of, I'm going to compose a new piece of music, but I can only choose from the CDs that are in my old collection to do so. And it's like, well, you're not going to come up with something new. And I genuinely think people sometimes they need to just shut off, stop looking at what else is out there, and just have a bit of silence and listen to their own brain and listen to give themselves the space to actually come up with their own ideas, and that those are the things that are are going to really catch people's attention.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's it. Because it's in social media posts and stuff, but also with things like media pitching, isn't it? Like something I've noticed online is everywhere I look, it's like the same niches, talk generally talking about the same topics. It's very few people actually cut through and grab my attention these days. And it's because that like posts all follow a similar format, like it's predictable, you know what's coming, the kind of wording, similar phrases. I miss seeing everybody's different personality, you know. I miss seeing that. And I was it you, Katherine, who said to me that you would prefer to get to receive a pitch that had a few errors in it than was obviously made by AI. Was that you who said that?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. I would much rather see something that was authentically human, even though because we're humans are flawed. I think this is the big thing. Humans are flawed. So I'd rather see. I'm not suggesting that we all artificially put errors in pictures. That's not not what I'm saying. But like I would much rather get something where maybe there was a slight typo or a little bit of dodgy punctuation or something about it that makes me go, oh, you know, it's clearly not been done deliberately. But it actually came from, you know, a real place of authenticity. That's what they really have to say, that they have a story to tell or a message to send out to the world that they've got something that they want to talk about that is unique, that is interesting, that is something that maybe challenges what I think or makes me see something from a different perspective, than the very obviously AI things. And there are things that are very obviously AI, and there are also people I'm hearing more and more saying, oh, but I did write that myself, but I obviously write like AI, and I think it's because we've got so used to seeing AI writing that people are believing that that is how we should write, and it's probably on a subconscious level. So I don't think that if you went back, I would challenge us all to look back at our social media posts five years ago before any of us used AI. And these things that you say, oh, but that's just how I write. It's not my fault that Chat GPT also writes like that. Did you really use a million M dashes five years ago? Did you really write headlines of everything where you had, you know, medical miracle colon, the real quiet truth behind being healthy over 40 or those kind of very AI type things. And I would be willing to place a bet that you didn't, you didn't write like that. You wrote completely differently. You probably had a raw writing style, so like a less polished writing style, it probably was just kind of more how you would speak to people. Because actually, if you read AI out loud, this is my big top tip too. If you either use AI or you are worried that maybe your writing style will look like AI, even when it's not, is read it out loud because nobody actually speaks like AI writes. So if you read it out loud and if you walked up to somebody and had a conversation with them with that kind of turn of phrase, would they look at you strangely? Because actually, I'd much rather have somebody presenting something, just how they would tell me the story in the clearest, most direct, simplest way possible than have the funny two-word sentences as well. I mean, what's all that about? I spent my entire career telling people to have shorter, simpler sentences, and then AI suddenly came out with millions of two-word sentences, and I was like, no, guys, like longer sentences, actual sentences with a with a verb and a subject and an object, and all the things that you learn at school, not just kind of quiet resilience, full stop, whispered conversations, full stop, the leadership lessons everybody needs to be learning. Nobody speaks like that. You wouldn't, if someone walked up to you at a conference and started talking to you like that, you'd think they were malfunctioning. You would be like, Are you okay? Do you need some water? Would you like a sit down? Like, why are we talking to people like that in in our social media and when we're pitching journalists? And I I think I've mentioned it on the podcast before, there is starting to be a real backlash in the media against AI because there's even a fear that some of the people that journalists are being pitched aren't even real people, you know, they're just made-up bots. Yeah. And there is a fear that you might end up featuring a quote from a made-up AI sort of avatar and not a real person with real credentials or real experience. And so anything that looks AI generated is just creating an element of suspicion and distrust. But also, I just think even if that wasn't true, it's just if you are an expert, and I believe anybody that really wants to be raise a visibility, it's because they've got a passion for what they do, it's because they really believe it's important, they've got a purpose. Why would you want to trust like a program, a computer program, over like your own brain and what you could do? So that's my biggest thing is like don't hand over, don't you know, it's like being in sort of a self-driving car. Like, don't hand over the control of what you're doing to something else. Like, keep the steering wheel for yourself.
SPEAKER_00The ones who can fully like lean into that and really step own their opinions and their knowledge and everything that they've learned in all of their years of training and the experience they've got and all of these, you know, all of the times that they've been working with clients and they've got amazing results. I think the people who lean into that and back themselves fully without second guessing themselves, they're the ones that go really far. Because what happens is most people are in the middle, most people won't unleash. Like you've got people who are terrified of visibility and they find it really hard. Okay. And then you've got the most common version is when people are in this middle stage where they feel like they're being really edgy, they feel like that they're being like they they might post something and be afraid that they're gonna get cancelled for posting it or something like that, and then nothing will happen. But then this fear will keep coming up, and I think that's that's a big one, isn't it? Like, fear of being cancelled is absolutely real. Like people can really be held back by that, but like, what does cancelling actually mean? Like, like nobody can actually cancel you, you know. Every you can recover, you know what I mean? Like, there's always going to be ups and downs and blips and people getting you wrong, and people supporting you, and other people not getting you, it's all just part of the journey. But when people, it's like everybody wants to be the fullest version of themselves, but everybody does that to a certain degree, but they don't fully unleash. But most people will unleash more when they feel like they're in a safe space. So if they're working with their like a bunch of their favorite one-to-one clients, or they're talking to their business bestie, or they're talking to their team, like they'll say stuff that they would never say publicly. And most of that, oh, that's the stuff to bring public.
SPEAKER_01It's the gold, isn't it? That is the gold that you will say, and people will often say to me on on calls and stuff, and they'll be like, they'll say something really interesting, and they'll say, No, but I wouldn't say that in public. And I'll be like, Why not? I mean, clearly there are some things that could get you cancelled to a certain thing, you know. If you're being hateful, if you are being no, we're not wrong about that. Yeah, so any of those things, like, is it something horrible and hateful? And I would hope that nobody I I trust we don't have horrible, hateful people. Exactly. That's my only litmus test. Is it harmful and hateful? If it's not harmful and hateful, if it's just controversial, then that's a completely different matter. You know, there's things that are unpopular opinions, but they're still valuable opinions, they're still things that people need to hear. And it doesn't mean, and I'm not talking about deliberately caught in controversy, it's actually thinking, what do people need to hear? What is the real stuff that people need? It's not thinking, how can I be controversial?
SPEAKER_00Oh, exactly. No, that reminds me. Somebody messaged me and they were like, they'd heard us talking about this before on a podcast, and they message saying, like, I want to ruffle feathers, like, how can I ruffle feathers? And I'm like, Well, no, we're not here to purposefully ruffle feathers, it's just what happens as a result of us sharing what's true for us, then it's gonna divide. If we do that powerfully, it's gonna divide, but we never go in with the intention of, oh, let's ruffle feathers.
SPEAKER_01I'm gonna say something unpopular, I think. Seeing as we're talking about saying unpopular, what I would suggest people do, and I bet people are gonna listen to this and go, oh my gosh, no, I don't want to do that, is actually in the same ways I always tell people, have a look at the media, have a look at what other people in your space are saying. And I'm not saying this to say copy them or get ideas from them or get inspiration from them. That isn't what I mean, but have a look because your groundbreaking nobody saying this idea might be what they're all saying as well. And it's important to know that, it's important to do that kind of market research because I have spoken to lots of people, particularly I would say, over the last couple of years, more so than before, where they've said something to me and they've presented the idea to me as something that they don't believe I'll have ever heard before. And I've spoken to multiple people saying something very similar, yeah. And they're in the same sort of space as each other. And I won't say what space, I don't want people to be like, oh, was that me? And what they were saying was great stuff, but it was also what other people were saying. So I think sometimes knowing, okay, so what are the common things that people are talking about? Not because you shouldn't talk about those things, but also if you know, okay, so this is quite widely talked about by other people. So how can I take it forward? What else can I be offering? Yeah. Uh finding what's incomplete. Yeah, what more do I need to say? Because sometimes people will be kind of like, oh, well, and again, it's that, oh well, for the pe for my inner circle, I would then go on and say that and the other. But actually, they're believing that the sort of gateway knowledge isn't commonly known and that this is going to blow people's minds. And actually, they're hearing that all the time, and they need something a little bit more because you know, there's there are lots of things I think that because ideas are constantly evolving, so there are lots of things that probably were mind-blowing five or 10 years ago that have now become commonly accepted bits of advice and truth. I mean, think I'm going to use mindfulness as an example. If 10 years ago you had been talking about mindfulness, lots of people would have been like, okay, what's that? Like, how does that help? If you'd have mentioned it 20 years ago, people would have been like, oh, whoa, like this is really new stuff. But if you say, Oh, I've got some mindfulness tips now, everyone's like, great, love that, but so's everybody. Everyone, like, there's lots and lots of people have got that. There's a lot of content around about that. Does that mean that you've got nothing new to share on that topic if mindfulness is your thing? Absolutely not. But you need to be thinking, okay, this is what everybody already knows. Like, what else is there? What new, interesting things are? When I used to work for Mother and Baby magazine, we had a rule because I used to work on the printed part of the magazine. There was the website, but it they operated very differently. There was a rule that the what we had in articles could not be something people could find online, should not include information. And when you actually think about how vast the internet is, that's actually quite tricky. It is, yeah. You had to have tips that were not tips that people could already know that were just around. Like, yes, they might know it because they'd done a PhD in it or something, but they couldn't just be stuff where you could put in and be like, How do I get my baby to sleep? and just the stuff that would spew up. Well, I mean, that's the level of extra, if you can come up with stuff that isn't already out there, that isn't just stuff that people have already talked about, that will really make you stand out. But then the caveat of that is then once you've talked about it, it it is out there, and that's why that's why ideas don't stay original for long, because people talk about them, and then people, you know, will get on and be like, wow, look at this. And you know, you see sometimes a real buzz about an idea, like on social media, so someone will give an interview and they'll say something, and you'll just love the way that they say something. I WhatsApp to something last night, I think, that like Jamil had said, and I was like, Oh, the way that she says it. When people hear something that speaks to them and somebody says something in a way that they haven't heard before, it might be saying something that they believe in and agree with and know to be true, but the way that it's worded is some a way that they haven't heard before, and they go, You've just put into words what I've been thinking, or yeah, what I knew to be true, but I didn't know how to word it. Then people start sharing it, they start talking about you. There's a buzz around you, people want to feature in the media, but then that idea becomes something that people go, oh, okay, that's now an accepted idea. So it's as with anything, you know, ideas in the media have to constantly be evolving. Journalists don't want to hear something that would have been original 10 years ago. They want to hear, like, what have you got to say now? What are you gonna say to me that hasn't already been said before, that someone hasn't already had this idea, that's not one of those, yeah, yeah, everybody says that things. And, you know, it's a challenge to come up with those things, but I believe everybody who is truly an expert in your niche, you have these things. You just have to trust in yourself and listen to yourself, listen to your own like inner guidance on what those things are. Like, what are the real things that matter? What are the real game changers that you help people with that isn't just the surface level things that everybody's talking about?
SPEAKER_00And I love the way that you put that as well about the um how like everybody, every niche has these things that are just true, so everybody does talk about them because they're just true and everybody knows it, so they don't speak on that, but to see if they can give it something extra or something from lived experience, or like you say, share it in a different way, you know, even if it is something that they know, like sharing it in a way that'll make people that'll make it easier to land for people. Okay, do you know what? To finish up, I'm gonna give an action for our listeners to take. What I would love for all of you to do, and I would love for you to email us with this, hello at dauntlesspr.com. Think of something that you've been holding back on saying, something that you know is true, that you might have shared with your inner circle, your best clients, you might have shared it with your business bestie, you might have ranted about it to your team. And what I'd love for you to do is to write it down, and you don't have to share it at this point, you don't have to do anything with it. Just write it down as a post or something like that, and just so that it's there and you're aware of it, and then see how you feel after that. So at this stage, there's no pressure to go ahead and share it, but what you're feeling called to share, but you've been holding back from, write it and then see how you feel. I would love for you to email us and let us know what that thing was. If you do feel comfortable enough to go ahead and share it online, do that, send us the link. That'd be really awesome. Absolutely. Okay, I'm looking forward to receiving these. We will see you next time. Remember, hello at dauntlesspr.com.