Balancing Mission and Margin: Lessons From The Philadelphia Zoo

In this episode of The Metamorphosis Moment, Nancie McDonnell Dougherty sits down with Patrick McMaster, Vice President of Marketing and Communications at Philadelphia Zoo, to explore what it really takes to balance mission with financial reality.

For Patrick and his team, marketing is not just about driving attendance. It is about building belief in the zoo’s mission of conservation and education while ensuring the organization generates the revenue required to sustain it.

Patrick shares how his team approaches storytelling in a way that connects visitors to the animals, the science and the conservation work happening behind the scenes. From the global story of a nearly 100-year-old Galapagos tortoise becoming a first-time mother to the everyday work of animal care teams, these stories help transform a day at the zoo into a deeper connection with the natural world.

The conversation also explores how the Philadelphia Zoo has adapted its marketing strategy since the pandemic, from reaching new audiences to creating experiences that motivate people to leave the couch and reconnect in person. Patrick reflects on the importance of listening across teams, building sponsorships that align with the zoo’s values and rethinking assumptions about how people engage with place-based attractions.

For leaders responsible for both growth and purpose, Patrick offers a clear reminder. Revenue and mission are not in conflict. When approached thoughtfully, they strengthen each other.

Curious how trust, clarity and credibility show up in your own brand? 

At Noetic Consultants, we help leaders align strategy, story and proof. 

Learn more at⁠ noeticconsultants.com⁠.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

One of the first things our CEO, our new CEO, said when she got here was no money, no mission. Like if we don't have the money to drive ever to pay salaries and keep the lights on, then we'll never have the money for the mission.

SPEAKER_00 0:14

Welcome to the Metamorphosis Moment, where marketing transformation takes flight. Hear from Noetic's brightest minds and the industry's game changers as we envision the future of marketing, focusing on the strategies and tools that truly make brains strong and leaders impactful. We're serving up actionable insights that'll have you rethinking everything you thought you knew about marketing and leadership. In times of change, old playbooks just won't work. Learn how to gain new wings and fly. This is the metamorphosis moment where change isn't just embraced, it's the main event.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

Patrick McMaster leads marketing at the Philadelphia Zoo, a 150-year-old institution where the challenge is not just about populating the zoo, it's really about building a community of people who care about conservation, education, and the overall natural world. As vice president of marketing and communications, Patrick really needs to balance aggressive revenue goals with authentic storytelling so that the zoo really matters beyond being just a nice day of entertainment. Over nearly 10 years at the zoo, Patrick has proven that commercial discipline and mission-driven work can strengthen each other, not refute one another. He's grown sponsorship revenue by over 18% in three years, oversees a$1 million advertising budget, and manages marketing strategies that drive both attendance and memberships. Perhaps his proudest moment, he will tell us, might be when the zoo's gates were closed during the pandemic and he rallied the community to raise over$250,000. Proof that the zoo's relationship with the city of Philadelphia really does run deep. Patrick doesn't see revenue emission as opposing forces. He sees them as partners, and you'll hear about that today. He's built sponsorship portfolios that generate millions while protecting the zoo's identity as a trusted conservation partner. He's created omnichannel campaigns that drive ticket sales while telling stories about animal welfare and habitat preservation. And he's learned that the best marketing does not just drive attendance, it really turns visitors into advocates who truly believe in what the zoo stands for. In our episode today, Patrick is sharing with us what it really takes to market a mission-driven institution without sacrificing commercial performance, how you can build partnerships that can serve both brand and bottom line, and why the most sustainable growth comes from turning customers into true believers. Marketing a zoo is a balancing act. You need to drive attendance and you need to grow membership and you need to hit revenue targets. And perhaps most importantly, you are stewarding a mission, conservation, education, and connecting people to the natural world. If you get too focused on just the commercial side, you risk turning the zoo into just another entertainment venue. If you get too focused on just the mission side without the commercial need, then you can't fund the work that really matters. Patrick McMaster has spent nearly a decade figuring out how to strike this balance. As VP of Marketing Communications at the Philadelphia Zoo, he leads a team responsible for driving millions in revenue while protecting the zoo's identity as a trusted conservation partner. He oversees a$1 million advertising budget. He manages brand identity across digital, print, and social. He builds sponsorships and now generates with those over a million dollars annually, up 18% from where they were just a few years ago. What I believe makes Patrick's work especially compelling is how he's proven that revenue goals and mission-driven storytelling don't have to be opposites or in tension with one another. For example, during the pandemic, when the zoo's gates were closed and traditional revenue was simply not there, Patrick led a fundraising campaign that raised over 250,000 from the community. True proof that the zoo had built something deeper. It had really built belief. What really caught my eye about Patrick's work is that nearly 10 years at one institution is rare for marketers today. And I think it signals something really important. Patrick, I think you're really building something. And that kind of commitment, especially through a challenge like the pandemic, is really worth exploring. I'm so glad you're here. Welcome.

SPEAKER_02 5:13

Thanks, Nancy. Thanks for having me. I'm I'm excited to join the podcast today and share more about really just how special Philadelphia Zoo is and why I've been here for almost 10 years now.

SPEAKER_01 5:25

Yeah, awesome. As I said, a bit of a rarity these days in the marketing world, as many marketers know. And, you know, as I mentioned at the top, you know, driving revenue and serving a mission can be difficult to balance the both. You're accountable for attendance, membership, sponsorship, ticket sales, but you're also stewarding a brand that you really need to be trusted. So I want to dig in there. How do you think about the relationship between revenue goals and mission?

SPEAKER_02 5:58

Sure. Yeah, I think the unique thing here with the zoo is that we are an attraction at the end of the day. Like I have two young kids at home and we love to find things to do on the weekends. And that's who our competition is it's the birthday parties and the bounce houses and the baseball games and all of those kind of things. So we are an attraction at our core, but also we're we're this iconic cultural institution here in Philadelphia that means so much to so many people given our long history. So what we're trying to do from our marketing team is balance how do we get people to come here, but then when they're here, not only be entertained, but also learn something when they're here. And that's kudos to our great conservation education team that there's all kinds of things to do on the path when people are here that are not just showing you up close to an animal, but you're learning something about that animal and ultimately learning what you can do in your day-to-day life to help preserve these animals in the wild.

SPEAKER_01 6:57

Yeah. What is an example, perhaps even from when you've been there, or that you know you've seen where people seem particularly like wow, or GWS factor around learning something once they're there?

SPEAKER_02 7:10

Yeah. I mean, one of the biggest stories we had this spring, and and hopefully it's made it to you and some of your listeners, was the story of mommy, our nearly 100-year-old Galapagos tortoise who who gave birth to 14 hatchlings over the course of the last several months. And she was a first-time mom. This is something that made global news, billions and billions of impressions across the landscape. And I think I would say that people in the Philadelphia region learn more about Galapagos tortoises and their breeding habits and those things than they probably ever thought to know before. So that's just one example of like, yeah, it's it's a great day out. It's a great day to visit the zoo and be with your family and friends. But at the end of the day, you get to see these animals that, you know, you you may never have the opportunity to see in the wild, and also learn about them and their plight in the wild and what you can do to help them to continue this species uh for generations to come.

SPEAKER_01 8:04

Yeah, it's just amazing, like first-time mom at a hundred.

SPEAKER_02 8:09

Yeah. And I and it's not even the story, not even just the story of that she's a first-time mom. It's it's the work that the zoo team here put in to make that happen. So we had to put in, we had to do some renovations to our reptile house, and we had to really in some instances listen to mommy, the the mother Galapagos sortis, about what she wanted to create a unique and create a space for her that she felt comfortable laying eggs and those eggs becoming viable. So we did some work to, we invested in in the reptile house to make sure that it had the appropriate warmers and the appropriate, you know, that where she laid her eggs was the right space and the right temperature and all those things to really the work that the animal team put in to make that happen is just amazing.

SPEAKER_01 8:55

Yeah, true, truly, truly amazing. And, you know, as you as you share that example, it really shows what I think can be that potential tension between, you know, the revenue opportunity, but also the investment that it takes to do things well from the standpoint of you know welfare for the animals or whether that's sustainability or conservation. Are there times when it's hard to make those trade-offs?

SPEAKER_02 9:23

I'm not sure I would say it's hard. It's in some ways there are challenges with the different stakeholders throughout the organization, meaning that like I've worked in the sports world before coming here and in NASCAR and minor league baseball. And like in those instances, I think everyone's kind of pulling in the same direction. They understand that the mission is to is to get people to come and see your sports venue. Here it's a little bit different where this is like its own little city. So we have certain stakeholders that are involved in caring for their animals. There are certain stakeholders that are involved with educating guests, there are certain ones that are making sure that the bathrooms are clean and all of those things. So you have to take into account all of those stakeholders and what that really means to the cohesiveness of this entire organization, that ultimately when people leave here, they understand the mission of the zoo, had a good time, understand the mission, and and and hopefully got something out of it on their way home.

SPEAKER_01 10:18

Yeah. And when you think about those different, like just focusing on the internal team members, as you say, you know, different priorities depending upon, you know, where you sit in that. How have you seen or or what have you seen be most powerful in getting alignment when you need it for those key initiatives? Knowing that you can't please all the people all the time.

SPEAKER_02 10:40

I I think it's listening. I think that's the biggest thing is that we have, you know, we'll get questions from certain animal uh keepers and and animal care specialists to say, like, hey, I don't see my animal on social media, or how do we get my animal on or my conservation, my conservation impact that they're doing? How do we get that focused on a little bit more on the website or on social media? And it's listening to them and ultimately really hearing the stories. You know, I sit in an office. Some days I don't even go into the zoo quite often. I come here, I park my car in the parking lot, and I come in my office. And sometimes I almost forget that we have animals here because I'm so focused on driving attendance and driving people to the zoo. So it's it's listening to those animal care specialists or animal directors or or even horticulturists around the zoo to hear their story and what they're doing on a day-to-day, a day-to-day basis. And how do we then tell that story to our guests? Because there are different subset of guests that are coming here for different reasons. Some people may be coming here to see a gorilla, some people may be coming here to see our diverse horticulture, and some people may be coming here to just walk around with their kids and tire them out for a couple of hours. So we we have a diversity of staff, but also a diversity of guests and audience.

SPEAKER_01 11:51

Yes, absolutely. I want to talk for a minute about sponsorship because this is a this is an area, frankly, you have just excelled. I I know it's not single-handed, I know it's a team effort. Curious about how you have really positively influenced potential sponsors to become actual sponsors by really showing them how the zoo is such a valuable platform and vehicle for them.

unknown 12:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:20

So that's how I started here at the zoo 10 years ago. I started as the director of sponsorship. And I think what sets us apart, the zoo did a great job even before I got here with sponsorship. And we did a good job of not just, you know, taking every small sponsorship and putting signs up everywhere and doing those things, but being very strategic with the partners that we worked with. And I think what I did when I got here was just to try to tell that message of look, we're the second outside of the Phillies, we're the highest attended ticketed attraction in the city. You know, we're getting almost a million people a year. And pre-COVID, we were getting a million. We're almost back there this year. So we're getting nearly a million people a year. And that's your customers. That's, you know, that's the families, and that's, you know, the moms and the dads that are coming here with their family. So, and we can tell that we can tell the story of your brand from a sponsorship perspective in a unique way that other people can't, and we can tie it to the affinity that people in the region here have for Philadelphia Zoo. And we've done a good job of doing that, whether that's, you know, Independence Blue Cross, whose sponsors are nursing station. That was one of the things when we got when I got here, our head of guest engagement was like, hey, we really need this nursing pod, but we don't really have it in the budget to do it. Can we find a sponsor to make that happen? And that was one of the things that our team went out and got in order to purchase that and then have a sponsor come on board to cover the cost of that. So I think we've done a good job of telling our story and continuing to tell our story to brands in the region of like, we are uh, you may not think like sports teams, it's easy to think, oh yeah, they have sponsors and they have, you know, the Phillies have a sleeve patch or they have outfield billboard signs.

SPEAKER_01 13:57

It's sort of just more expected in that world. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:59

Correct. We don't have that like or that thought of uh signage, but we can come up with those unique things to to really tell the the story of your brand.

SPEAKER_01 14:07

And and then frankly, you know, even more breakthrough. You know, sometimes you can be at a sports venue and it's just so much with the sponsorship that I don't know where to look. And I'm not really sure, you know, each brand maybe fully gets their moment depending upon how it's done. And so, you know, I love the idea of it being kind of a surprise and delight when you see that and when it's a good brand fit, it's just beautiful. You mentioned that you started in sports marketing, both baseball, motor sports, and it's different, right? And and then you move to the zoo. I'm curious what, if you can think back, what surprised you most about marketing an institution like Philadelphia Zoo as opposed to a sports?

SPEAKER_02 14:54

Yeah, I think I alluded to this earlier, is that, and I tell people this all the time when they start here, is that there is this is the most unique place I've ever worked in terms of just stakeholders. Again, there's a lot of different people pulling in a lot of different directions. So I think that's one of them, that there's, you know, people see their their respective jobs in different ways, meaning that they may just be involved with animal care or or other things. They're not necessarily involved with getting people to the zoo or or to the the stadium almost like many, many missions within. Yeah, for sure. And I think it's a different, you know, sports teams in particular. I worked in minor league baseball, so it's not as there's not as much of an affinity with the minor league baseball team necessarily as there may be with the Phillies or the Eagles here in Philadelphia. But that's one of the things that I've got the Eagles, yeah. Yeah, people are kind of into them here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:43

I've noticed, yes.

SPEAKER_02 15:45

So that's one of the things that I think I didn't notice quite as much when I got here is how much it's a different kind of affinity, but how much people love this institution and love Philadelphia Zoo. If you walk around and you could go to running terminal market right now and ask anybody who's from Philadelphia what they know about the zoo, and they will tell you a zoo story. They have whether that's a picture when they were 12 in front of our elephant statue, or whether that was the first time they came here and saw a tiger walking through our zoo, our zoo 360 trails, everyone has some sort of zoo story, and it's and that helps us all as we're looking to market this place, or as we're looking to have sponsorships. The brand and the affinity that people have for this organization and city is is tremendous. And it's unlike anywhere else I've ever worked for sure.

SPEAKER_01 16:31

Yeah, that's amazing. And and it's really just a joy when you have when you can tap into that kind of nostalgia. Yeah, you know, nostalgia is a big thing happening right now, but nostalgia is always a powerful force. And if you have what I would call what you're describing as like timeless nostalgia, yeah. That's super, super powerful.

SPEAKER_02 16:50

For sure, but we also have to kind of reinvent ourselves, and I'm sure we'll talk about this. But like post-COVID, it's a lot harder for to get people off their couch to get people out of their house. So, how do we do different things in order to give people a unique reason to come here? And and we are getting ready in 2026 to open a new Bear Country exhibit, which is the first exhibit, first major exhibit that we've done in 10 or 12 years. Right now for Luminature, our winter experience in two days, we're opening. I'm pointing behind me because it's right here at on our plaza. We're unveiling a 110-foot-tall Ferris wheel that'll kind of take the place of where the Zoopaloon was. So we're trying to create some unique experiences outside of just the animal experience to get people a reason to visit.

SPEAKER_01 17:36

Yeah. So let's let's go into that for a minute. I I do want to go to the COVID fundraising campaign. Tell us a bit about if you can like walk us through how did you approach that? What messaging was resonating? How did you make that happen at such a volatile time?

SPEAKER_02 17:55

Yeah, I mean, it was certainly a volatile time. We closed that year, like most places, in March 15th, 16, 17, something like that. And we were closed for 111 days. And it was the it was 111 of our busiest days. And when you're a an organization like us, that's very difficult to kind of crawl out of. So we, from a COVID fundraising perspective, it was reaching out to a lot of our current partners. And even though we may not be able to deliver on, you know, the guests that we were planning to have over that time, how could we kind of create different things, whether that's digitally or socially, to get to still provide those sponsors some benefit and to show them the benefit of Philadelphia Zoo and continuing to contribute to them. The other thing that we did that was just that really put into perspective for me of how important this organization is is we partnered with Six ABC, the local ABC affiliate here in Philadelphia, and we did a zoo at them. So we actually, old school style, we had we set up a bunch of phone numbers and people called in and they ran it over the course of an entire day on the news of like call in and donate to Philadelphia Zoo for animal care and and just to uh to kind of support the zoo. And I actually took phone calls that night. Everyone in our building took phone calls, and it was like nonstop ringing of people just calling to share how important this organization was to them and donating money. And we raised just from that one day we raised nearly a million dollars for the zoo.

SPEAKER_00 19:22

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 19:22

And that we still in one day, in one day we raised nearly a million dollars. So, and that we still talk about just like how well we've continued iterations of Zooathon since then, but we still all talk about like again to me that really put into perspective how much this organization means to the entire region.

SPEAKER_01 19:40

Absolutely. I mean, that is just astounding in the best way. So, so then, you know, fast forward from there, you mentioned it really has changed how people are using their leisure time and that it takes more to get people off the couch. Tell us a little bit about that. How are you strategically thinking now about motivating people to consider and visit?

SPEAKER_02 20:06

Sure. So from a marketing perspective, you know, we we kind of we're continuing to find ways to share through our creative, through our channels of like that this is a way to kind of connect with your family and friends. You know, I think that's something that's kind of lacking across the board in this country since COVID is that people stay home more. They don't have you you read about it all the time that people aren't, they don't have the deep relationships that they had prior to COVID. So a lot of with our creative and our channels, we're trying to market to that. The other thing that we're trying to do is diversify our audience. You know, we and everyone is to an extent, but like when people think of zoos, they probably most likely think of families. You know, if I always use the example of if you walk around here on a Saturday, you're dodging a lot of strollers. Right, lots of strollers.

SPEAKER_01 20:56

And then you've got to and then you've got grandparents.

SPEAKER_02 20:59

Yep. But we need to find, especially in a city like Philadelphia, how do we market to those 30 somethings that don't have kids? People are having less kids, they're having kids later in life. And that is that's our core demo. So, how do we find another demographic? And that's partly the campaigns that we're running and the targeted ads that we're running and how we're targeting these groups. But it's also internally how are we creating programmatic things that are targeted to these people? So, one of the things that we did last year to some success, you know, we're trying things, is we did a summer Friday program in our beer garden. So we had, you know, nobody works on Fridays anymore for the most part, at least in the office. So we did Friday afternoon.

SPEAKER_01 21:42

So I'm doing it wrong because I'm working on Fridays. So I forget you telling you that. I need to smile myself.

SPEAKER_02 21:48

I am too, in case my boss listens to this.

SPEAKER_01 21:50

So right, right, right, right. Of course.

SPEAKER_02 21:53

So we did some uh some music and some entertainment in the beer garden, some discounted drink specials and those kind of things to kind of. Target a different audience. So we're trying those type of things in order to uh to try to find different groups of people to visit the zoo. And then again, ultimately build affinity, move into those different phases of life as a family, as a grandparent, potentially as a donor down the road to support the zoo in different ways.

SPEAKER_01 22:17

Yeah. So it's both motivating differently, right? Different reasoning, but also bringing in new audiences and different audiences. I I touched at the beginning about your tenure. And while not, you know, completely out of the realm, like somewhat unusual to be 10 years in a role in marketing. What has kept you engaged and growing in this role? And what do you find has been true for you in this, in these recent years? Cause you've you've had this momentum over time.

SPEAKER_02 22:53

Yeah, I think, you know, I've been fortunate when I started here, I was just really doing sponsorship and have grown over the last 10 years to doing sponsorship, to managing our group sales, to, you know, now ultimately being the vice president of marketing and communication. So I I've been fortunate to grow within the organization over those 10 years and do different things and see the organization in a different light.

SPEAKER_01 23:16

That because you've had this tenure, you know, what do you find from a momentum standpoint or a growth standpoint is like more true for you in recent years, having been there for this long?

SPEAKER_02 23:28

Yeah, I think one of the things that is exciting about the organization in the last few years, we've had some new leadership. We are Dr. Joel Mogerman is our CEO. She's been here for only about two years. And now we also have a new strategic plan that we're we're beginning to implement. Again, as I alluded to, we have this new Bear Country exhibit, which is a$20 million plus exhibit that will open this spring. So there's a lot of things to be very excited about and a lot of really positive momentum for this organization moving forward. And I think that's what's kind of that, along with the just the love of this place from throughout the region. I feel a certain responsibility as kind of a caretaker and a person on the executive leadership team of the organization to to kind of steward it into the next phase of what this place looks like. And I think we're right on kind of the cusp of that with some really exciting changes happening. And frankly, I want to be a part of it. And that's why I continue to sit here.

SPEAKER_01 24:27

And I I do think being being a true brand steward, it takes time. It really takes time to build that. And so one of the things I often am concerned about with how often marketers turn in and out of roles, which by the way, oftentimes is not driven by the marketer themselves, but oftentimes by the market or the organization, is that I do think it takes a lot of time to know the brand or brands in your bones and to really be able to be that true steward. So, you know, what you're saying is born of having been there and now being in that leadership role where you feel not just a passion but a responsibility, which I which is wonderful. I wonder if there's anything, you know, since your early years when it comes to marketing and attraction that you feel like you've had to rethink. You know, maybe you thought about it one way and now you're like, not in today's world.

SPEAKER_02 25:26

Yeah, I think again, it goes back to this like, and even though COVID was so long ago, sorta, it's five years ago, but it feels more it, yeah, it feels more recent than that. And I think that's the biggest difference for me is like, how do we look at at this 42 acres differently than we did in 2019? Because it's a totally different world. People's travel patterns are different, people's, you know, work habits are different, even here in the office. Like we used to be here five days a week, and now we're on more of a hybrid schedule. And you think about that at scale with people in Philadelphia that maybe are not coming into the city quite as much. So they're not seeing our, you know, you're not seeing billboards in certain areas, or your even your digital presence is different than it was five years ago. And so we have to think about how we market to them a little bit differently and how we kind of meet them where they are. And I think we're still learning a lot of that. And I think from an experience standpoint within the zoo, we need to think a little bit more about what people want. You know, there's we've done a lot of focus groups and we've done a lot of research where it's like that walk and look experience is not what people are looking for. They're looking for ways to truly experience what they're doing and not just walk and see an animal and see it in its habitat. They want to see, they want to be able to be involved in the experience. And we're trying to change how we develop our actual exhibits here at the zoo to make them more hands-on.

SPEAKER_01 26:52

Yeah. So if so, if there is a listener out there who is newer in a role of heading marketing for a place-based attraction, what's the one bit of advice you would offer to them?

SPEAKER_02 27:08

I think the one piece of advice I would say, and I'm trying to do that here, is just rethink everything. As kind of as crazy as that sounds, and I said this to someone on our team today of like, we can't just continue to do the same thing that we've always done and expect different results. I mean, I know that's definition of insanity or whatever that may be, but I think we need to always be thinking about how we can reach people in a different way. And like, whether that's, you know, you're the agency that you're buying ads with or whoever it may be, you really need to just kind of think about how do we think in a different way in order to reach people. And that's on our creative, on our inventory and where we're placing ads. And again, it's within the 42 acres of the zoo and what that zoo experience looks like and what it looks like to each different audience.

SPEAKER_01 27:58

So, kind of a cousin to that question is there a specific skill or mindset that you think a leader coming into this space must have to be successful?

SPEAKER_02 28:11

I think you need to know that you don't know it. And I think that's where I kind of am in this space is I want people in my team to question things that we're doing and say, like, well, why does this make sense? And how maybe we should try this? Let's come up with different ideas because I think we all think we, you know, the best marketer out there probably thinks they know what they're doing, but I I'm not so sure that we do.

SPEAKER_00 28:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:35

And we're trying to kind of revisit things that may have worked in the past, even six months ago, may not be working now as it's evolving so quickly. So I think it's just questioning everything that you're doing and and having good people around you to be able to feel comfortable to ask those questions.

SPEAKER_01 28:50

Yeah, I had a uh senior marketer recently say exactly what you're saying to me in such an interesting way. She said, when I get to the point that I think I know, it makes me nervous.

SPEAKER_00 29:03

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 29:04

I I should never feel that I know. I should always be questioning. And I think especially, especially at the pace now, I mean, probably always true, just more true now. And so when we think about the pace of the change, we certainly can't talk about that without speaking about AI.

SPEAKER_02 29:21

Sure.

SPEAKER_01 29:22

So how are you finding AI is helping you and your team so far in your marketing work?

SPEAKER_02 29:31

Sure. We, I mean, aside from you know, what our agency may be doing from like optimizing lists and optimizing audiences and those kind of things, from an internal perspective, I think what we've used it most for is just kind of idea generation of like, all right, what about how can we what's some ideas to kind of drive this audience and like starting to just use it to kind of get our brains flowing a little bit? And we've also dipped our toe into using it from an attendance prediction. We're trying to get some modeling done so we can put it in and say, include the weather and include, you know, past history on attendance, and then give us an idea of what our attendance will be for the next 10 days. We found that it's been pretty accurate for the next 10 days, it's not been as accurate into the future.

SPEAKER_01 30:21

We've tried to use it on larger scale, but this is like the classic, like, you know, weather, weatherman dilemma.

SPEAKER_02 30:29

Oh, yeah, sure. Yes, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 30:31

I I'm right percent of the time. So in the 10 day, yes, but beyond that, not.

SPEAKER_02 30:36

But but I mean not so much.

SPEAKER_01 30:38

Right. In all seriousness, though, that is super cool. I mean, even if it even even if it could give you accuracy in in the 10 day, right? And then you can replicate that for another, that's that in another.

SPEAKER_02 30:50

Yeah, and it helps us, you know, with cutting costs for as far as staffing goes and and staffing up or staffing down and all those kind of things. So that's our hope that we can continue to build out our internal models that at some point it'll be able to kind of model our attendance a little closer in the longer term.

SPEAKER_01 31:06

Yeah, yeah, gotcha. And so speaking of weather and and turbulent weather, you know, yes, we're past COVID proper, but these are tricky times. I'm curious, as a leader, what you do to keep yourself afloat. What do you do? Do you have any specific practices you do or mindsets you hold to keep yourself resilient and adaptable?

SPEAKER_02 31:32

I think it's it kind of goes back to my staff and like just helping working with my staff to keep us grounded of like, how do we make sure that to some of the earlier questions that we are we're focusing on revenue and we're driving revenue? I mean, one of the first things our CEO, our new CEO said when she got here was no money, no mission. Like if we don't have the money to drive ever to pay salaries and keep the lights on, then we'll we'll never have the money for the mission. So we have to, that's and I take that very seriously. Like I understand this is a mission-driven organization, and but my job is to drive revenue in order to finance that mission. So I think using working so closely with our staff, and we I have a great team here to keep us grounded, keep me grounded, and make sure that we are making the right decisions and being nimble and quick in some of the decisions that we're making in order to drive revenue and ultimately visitation.

SPEAKER_01 32:27

Yeah. And is it fair to say that if you feel that you're doing that, that you're on course with that, that it reduces like the noise in your head?

SPEAKER_02 32:38

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 32:39

I mean, I think you know that's what I heard you saying. You know, it's like it's really yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:44

Yeah. Good good news and good sales, uh, that makes us all feel a little bit better, right? And it makes us, you know, not be scrambling to try to pick up an extra thousand tickets for this weekend's Luminature opening. How do we make sure we're doing the plan the right way and feel confident in it and then working it from there?

SPEAKER_01 33:01

Yeah. Yeah. So we always like to end by asking our guests about a pivotal moment that they've had in their in their careers or their personal lives. Pivotal meaning, you know, something happened or you learned something that really changed your outlook or your trajectory from that moment. Can you share with us a moment like that?

SPEAKER_02 33:22

Yeah, I think we kind of talked about this a little bit, but I think for me, it was COVID. Like I look back when those 111 days that we were closed and how stressful it was from a personal perspective, how stressful it was from a professional perspective. But then the good that came out of it, I think, was we all learned within all of us, meaning everyone that works here at the zoo, how important this institution is to everyone. And I think it everyone that worked here at the time left that six months, eight months, a year with a different perspective of like this place means so much to so many people that we are true stewards of this organization, not just for Philadelphia Zoo and Zoological Society of Philadelphia, but for Philadelphia, that this place, this organization means so much to the entire region that we are stewards of it and we can't take that lightly and need to do our best work and work hard as as hard as we can in order to kind of steward this place into the next into the next 150 years.

SPEAKER_01 34:25

Yeah, yeah. And perhaps without, not that we would have wanted it to happen, like a global pandemic was awful, but there was a gift in that, I think is what you're saying, that you know, it enabled seeing the depth of that dedication and therefore the depth of that responsibility to stewards.

SPEAKER_02 34:44

For sure.

SPEAKER_01 34:44

Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah. I I myself often think about the the gift of COVID when we lost one of our biggest clients because they were a healthcare organization that needed to focus 100% of their resources on caring for people suffering with COVID. And I remember exactly where I was sitting when I heard that. And I knew that we would not recover that. That moment and then all the moments that followed where we figured out what to do and how to compensate and how to sustain. I often reflect back on that. And it's a source of strength, not trauma. Or maybe a little bit of both, and I'm totally honest. But there's a gift in that because I can always say, Yeah, we figured that one out. We can figure out most anything if we could have figured that out, because there was so many things upside down. So I really appreciate that it really helped you see almost with fresh eyes or with a depth what it was really. What stands out for me is, and and you just said it a moment ago, you know, no money, no mission. Like you really strike that balance of the commercial with the mission. Um, it's not a conflict for you, you know, it they definitely have to be in in resonance. And I and I see that in in all of our dialogue here. And I I really appreciate your being so generous with your insights. I think what you all are doing there is really fantastic. And I am super excited about 2026. And I don't know if before we close, if you want to talk a little bit about that. Sure.

SPEAKER_02 36:22

Yeah, we are all of us here in Philadelphia are very excited about 2026. So, as some listeners may know, 2026 is the, and I have had to say this word many times now, the semi-quincentennial of the United States. So it's the 250th anniversary of the founding of the United States. That is an amazing not only, yeah. Not only that, you know, obviously, you know, the founding of the country was right here in Philadelphia, and we have the Liberty Bell and a lot of very historical sites. So the city is anticipating an uptick in in visitation from outside tourism due to that. In addition to that, we also are hosting several World World FIFA World Cup games here in Philadelphia next year, the MLB All-Star Games, NCAA basketball tournament games. So there's a lot, a lot of going on in the city this year. And we are excited not only for those things happening in the city, we're also opening, as I alluded to, Carrie Bear Country in spring of 2026, our first major exhibit renovation opening in 12, 15 years, the first one since I've been here. And I've been here, as you said, almost 10 years. We have a 110-foot-tall Ferris wheel that is opening actually in two days. So, and that'll continue all through next year. So we are very excited. It's a great time to be in Philadelphia. It's a great time to be at Philadelphia Zoo. And I think as we 12 months from now, I think we'll be thinking about this organization in a much different way than we did 12 months ago. So I'm very excited. I'm excited to be a part of it. And I'm looking forward to, you know, where we go over the next, you know, 12 to 18 months.

SPEAKER_01 37:51

Amazing. Well, I appreciate your taking the time to share your insights with our listeners, particularly at such a busy time for you all. And we will be, we'll be tracking. I will be in and out of Philly for sure. And so I really look forward to visiting and appreciate you spending the time with us today.

SPEAKER_02 38:08

That's great. Yeah, thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it. I had a great time chatting.

SPEAKER_01 38:12

Absolutely. And if today's conversation with Patrick hit home, maybe you're leading marketing at a mission-driven institution, maybe you are struggling with the balance of revenue with mission, or you're trying to build partnerships to serve both the brand. And the bottom line, many are out there trying to do the same. Whether you're at a zoo, a hospital, a university, a nonprofit of any kind, the challenge typically is in some shape or form how do you drive commercial results while you are stewarding something that really matters. At Noetic, we work with marketing leaders who are navigating these types of tensions. We help organizations clarify their brand identity. We help them build strategies that honor both mission and margin. And we help develop leaders who can hold space for these complexities without losing sight of what really matters. If you would like to talk through what this might look like in your world, please visit us at noeticconsultants.com or find me on LinkedIn. And until next time, keep strengthening brands and the leaders who bring them to life, most especially the leader within you. We'll see you next time.

SPEAKER_00 39:29

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