Beyond Tragedy: A Mother's Path to Healing

In this moving yet uplifting episode of "Might Delete Later Podcast," Shana & Derrick welcome Jessica, who bravely shares her journey through grief after losing her son, Matthew. With humor and honesty, Jessica discusses the messy realities of healing, the power of yoga, and the magic of supportive communities (shoutout to the Goddess Wisdom Council!). Alongside co-hosts, they tackle motherhood, self-care, and the importance of asking for help. Jessica’s resilience shines as she reveals her creative projects and hard-won wisdom, reminding us all that healing is tough—but a little laughter and a lot of love go a long way.

Introduction and Setting the Stage (00:00:00)
Host introduces the episode, shares personal connection, and introduces Jessica and her story.

Jessica’s Family Tragedy (00:01:36)
Jessica’s loss of her son Matthew in 2013 and the impact on the community.

Initial Grief and Support System (00:03:07)
Jessica discusses her immediate response to tragedy and the people who supported her.

Healing Journey and Spiritual Growth (00:06:41)
Jessica describes her healing process, spiritual community, and tools for coping.

Role of Yoga in Healing (00:10:13)
Jessica shares how yoga became a key part of her healing, both before and after her loss.

Coping and Growth of Her Older Son (00:11:57)
Discussion about Jessica’s older son, his therapy, and how he coped with the tragedy.

Guilt, Karma, and Writing as Therapy (00:13:53)
Jessica reflects on feelings of guilt, changing beliefs about karma, and writing as a healing tool.

Book Writing and Reliving Trauma (00:17:50)
Jessica talks about writing her book, the challenges, and how it brings up past trauma.

Finding Spiritual and Writing Communities (00:20:16)
Jessica explains how she found her spiritual and writing communities online and their impact.

Struggles with Addiction and Perseverance (00:22:26)
Jessica discusses her struggles with addiction after her loss and the journey to sobriety.

Personal Transformation After Loss (00:23:51)
Jessica describes how the tragedy changed her as a person and her desire to help others.

Family Impact and Generational Grief (00:28:00)
Jessica shares how her extended family was affected and how her mother is also writing a book.

List of Healing Tools and Inspirations (00:32:04)
Jessica reads a chronological list of things and people that helped her heal.

Community and Sisterhood (00:38:50)
Discussion about the importance of women’s communities and sisterhood in healing.

Advice for Others Experiencing Grief (00:42:20)
Jessica offers advice to others dealing with similar loss and grief.

Closing Remarks and Reflections (00:43:03)
Hosts and Jessica reflect on her strength, inspiration, and the importance of support.

Outro and Support Hotlines (00:45:01)
Host closes the episode and shares domestic violence and child abuse hotline information.

If you or someone you know has been involved with or a victim of child abuse, call the Childhelp National child Abuse Hotline.

If you or someone you know is involved with or a victim of domestic violence, call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 800-799-7233

Transcript

Automatically Transcribed With Podsqueeze

Speaker 1 00:00:00  If you or someone you know is involved with or a victim of child abuse called the Child Help National Child Abuse Hotline at 1-800-422-4453. Help is available. Speak with someone today. Everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Might Delete Later podcast. man, we got a special guest with us today. we're going to do a real different show. but a real special guest that I've been waiting to talk to this person for a long time. This has been a very long. It's been years that I've been waiting to talk to this person, and I finally, tracked her down and got her on the podcast with us. luckily she was, you know, ecstatic to do it. but our guest, this week, you know, there's there's there's things in life sometimes where, you know, you, you think you're having a bad day. You you your car doesn't work and or stops. You have a flat tire, you got fired and all these other things. And some of the things that that this person that we have today, and her family have gone through, you know, makes all of that other stuff seem very trivial.

Speaker 1 00:01:36  You know, it just doesn't matter when you have a family tragedy. so, our guest today, her name is Jessica. And, I'll give you kind of a synopsis of some of the things that she's gone through. her at the time, I want to say this was 2013. Over in the Natomas area in Sacramento. and I lived over there at the time, and, my daughter went to Bandon Creek, Bennett Creek Elementary School, and she was nine years old at the time. and Jessica, actually lost her son Matthew back at that time. And I know, at the time, it affected me like it affected me a lot. For one, my daughter was the same age as Matthew. And then I, when I saw the story, I didn't know who it was. I just know it happened in our neighborhood. And at that time, I was like, wow, that that's. Oh my God. And, Matthew was the same age as my daughter. And then as I start looking further into the story, then I started seeing who it was.

Speaker 1 00:02:53  And then that's when I decided, said, I. I think I know her. I think I know her. And so that's kind of what has gone on. So, Jessica, we're happy to have you here. How are you?

Speaker 2 00:03:07  Hi. Thanks for having me. It's nice to be here.

Speaker 1 00:03:10  Nice to be.

Speaker 2 00:03:11  Here. Nice to see.

Speaker 1 00:03:12  You. Nice to see you, too. Finally, like I said, finally tracking you down. So I just kind of want to talk about, after the family tragedy. how did you go forward? How did you get out of the things that, that you were probably feeling at the time? And I want to start with the people you had around you, because I know I think when we spoke the other day, you said you had somebody that really saved your life at the time, that you were just feeling hopeless. And, yeah, I'm sure you had a huge, hole in your heart. What about those people you had around you that you can kind of.

Speaker 1 00:03:53  Tell us about how they kind of pulled you out of where you were.

Speaker 2 00:03:57  Well, I think that, ultimately people, a variety of people are why? I'm, I'm doing well today, and I'm okay. it did take a while. I did have, It was a process. I would say, like, healing isn't really linear, you know, grief comes and goes. But for the first few years, I didn't really allow myself to grieve. I just went back to work, and, I tried to hold it together, but, I just I ended up falling into a really dark place. And so I would say that it wasn't, Matthew passed away in 2013. It wasn't really till the, towards the end of 2019 that I got to take the time to grieve and process it. And, I was able to take a year off from work, bills paid, not worry about nothing, and just relax and kind of like, okay, like, and, like when Covid hit, I loved it.

Speaker 2 00:05:09  Okay? I was already home, I loved I loved it, I was yeah, I was already there, you know. Yeah, it was great. But, there there are a variety of things. You know, it wasn't just one person or one. I have a list.

Speaker 1 00:05:26  I have a I know. We were sitting here. We were we were just having our pre-show conversation, and, Jessica said, oh. Oh, man. I left the list at home of I stuff I wanted to write down. I gave her a piece of paper and a pen, and I expected, you know, to write 5 to 10 things down, and then we're talking about some other things. And then I turn around and look. And she has a novel sitting in front of her.

Speaker 3 00:05:55  It's a little bit of an over exaggeration. Okay.

Speaker 1 00:05:59  In the matter of. Seven minutes, seven minutes. She. She has a whole novel of things. So. Do you have anything for her?

Speaker 4 00:06:10  no.

Speaker 4 00:06:11  I mean, I could only imagine. Kind of like what you've been through and just seeing you, today. It's just, I don't know. I want to like how today. How are you dealing with, like. you said it's not linear, right? Like, you're still processing, still dealing with everything today. And and and how are you doing that? Like how if it's not a linear thing, like what are you doing today that helps you?

Speaker 2 00:06:41  Okay, so today, I'm in a much stronger place. I won't say it's like something that will ever be okay or that, like, I'll necessarily be over. Quote unquote. But, I've, I've done a lot of healing and spiritual growth. I have, I have a spiritual community goddess wisdom council. They've helped me tremendously. Yeah. I have a few spiritual coaches. and, it's it's it's, today I'm I'm a lot stronger. I'm, I'm I have tools, I have community. Yeah. I still have my days. You know.

Speaker 2 00:07:27  Yeah. But, really, it's just taking time and and kind of like peeling back an onion and layers, like when I started getting into, therapy and, just getting released. My spiritual path led me in. God. Really? so I have another son, so he's always kind of kept me level. my grandson has helped so much. Like, I have a four year old grandson and, another one on the way. And, my grandson, it was like, after all this pain and, like, all these withdrawals, like withdrawal, withdrawal, withdrawal. Close the countdown. you know, I got this big deposit of love. You know, and he's just innocent. And I love him, and he loves me. And it's nice to be needed from an innocent, vulnerable place and not, like, be used or, you know. Yeah. You know, my son, he's 24. He's like, I'm grown, I got it, but my baby needs me, you know? It's nice.

Speaker 2 00:08:35  So today I'm I'm. I still have my days, and I still have, I just feel like I've been going up and up, like I have my lessons, and I.

Speaker 4 00:08:45  See I go through stuff.

Speaker 2 00:08:47  And. And then, you know, sometimes it's either good or it's like an uncomfortable lesson. And then I grow, you know, but I think just, counseling and. Yeah. No no no no, no, I'm okay. Yeah, I'm doing okay.

Speaker 4 00:09:02  I was telling him, he was saying, it's the spiritual thing. I think for me, it's like I see you do yoga and all that, you know, about the chakras and all that. I feel like for a long time I was really lost, and it wasn't. I actually found a group of women, that I connected with. And I did, something called Radiance Trading, where I kind of learned about the, the spirit. I always believed in God. I know there is a god, but I kind of, you know, I wouldn't identify as, like, Christian or Catholic specifically.

Speaker 4 00:09:35  And there was that. You get lost in, like, what do I believe in? But I think once I found that and I found that like the the spiritual part of it for me, I think was just like the chakras and that were all connected and that, you know, mind, body and spirit, they're all related. And I felt like that made a lot of like the stuff that I had been through and it caused me to grow. I don't know if that makes sense, but. Absolutely. that was a huge a huge transformation for me. But, I see you do yoga. Yeah. How's that?

Speaker 2 00:10:13  Yeah. I love you, man, I love yoga. yoga has been a huge part of everything. Even before I lost my son. So when I first did yoga, it was, I want to say 2005, and I just needed one extra credit for my Fafsa. I had like 11 credits. I was trying to get my 12, I need to get my check.

Speaker 2 00:10:34  So I took a yoga class and it was in the middle of my divorce. So it really just helped me breathe through the BS. Just like, really, calmed me down and, like, I used to have panic attacks. I used to, like, pass out my legs would give out and like, it was, I was a little stressed out. So, I started doing yoga. I would say, yoga has been such a big part of my life. When I started dancing, the I was a new dancer and the manager called me in the back and she was just like, honey, you're getting kind of fat. Like, you give me some weight. So I was like, okay, so I started doing hot yoga just for exercise in the beginning, you know? And, it just really, it's it's yoga has been the one thing that's kind of carried me through. But in the beginning, it was just exercise and breathing, like stress. But when I got into, I've taken a few yoga teacher trainings, I've done trauma yoga twice.

Speaker 2 00:11:42  I've done the two, 200 hour, 300 hours. So I'm a 500 hour certified yoga teacher. And in that, the information was just mind blowing.

Speaker 1 00:11:56  Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:11:56  Mine means my life. Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:11:57  I want to circle back around to your older son. Yes. How has he. Have you ever had conversations with him? Has he gone to therapy? And how? How is he today? Now then we're. You know, we don't we don't have to get into, you know, everything with your your older son. But how is he today as opposed to how he was.

Speaker 2 00:12:21  Oh, he's he's doing great. I'm really proud of him. When when his brother passed away. It was a week before his 12th birthday. So he was a kid still. And now he's 24. He's. He's doing great. He works. He's he's a good dad. He's, My son's a lot different than me. He's. I'm very emotional. I'm like a puppy and, like, my heart is on my sleeve.

Speaker 2 00:12:49  He's not really like that, though. You know, he's he's done some therapy and he's he's had his his, a few moments, but, he carries it different. But he, you know, he, carried me, I would say, through my worst times, which is one of my biggest regrets. Like, I can't change it now, but, I try to make up for it still, you know. Yeah. But, he he took care of me for a few years, I would say. Wow. You know. Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:13:24  Wow. Wow. And I know when we spoke the other day, you said something that, I mentioned to Shanna about, you almost feel guilty, because of, like you said, you weren't an angel. You said you weren't an angel. And. But still, as. As me and Shannon were talking. That doesn't mean you deserve to go through things that you've gone through just because you weren't an angel.

Speaker 2 00:13:53  Yeah. And my, My opinion has changed, too, because I used to think it was karma, and, I carried that, and, my mom, she told me one time like, no, that that wasn't your karma.

Speaker 2 00:14:07  Because this broke everyone's heart, you know? And beside of me, like, yes, that's my son. I lost my son. But he's his own soul. He he like he lost like he lost his life. You know what I mean?

Speaker 1 00:14:20  His future was stolen.

Speaker 2 00:14:21  Yeah, yeah. And, like, I was telling you about the movie A Wrinkle in Time like that. That helped me. That helped me kind of remember what I believe in. And I don't think that your soul ever dies. So, just in a different dimension, you know? Yeah, like I have. I'm a writer, too. I'm in the process of writing a book, about my life and about this. And, I'm still editing. I'm done with the draft, but I'm done editing it.

Speaker 1 00:14:53  That's going to be a hell of a book. That is going to be a hell of a book.

Speaker 2 00:14:56  It is, it is. It's a process, that one. But I also have other books. I have another story that's, it's like kind of like a sci fi, story where, it's like what happened with him, but really, like, Space Force came to get him because he's a genius and he's, like, saving the world.

Speaker 2 00:15:14  And then, like, it shows me all like, as a heartbroken. And then he comes back and he's a superhero, like, I like that stuff like that. has also been cathartic. Like, I have, daydreams and stories and, you know, part of part of, after he passed away. So at the time, I was a dancer, and I took a little time off, but then I just. It's time to go back to work. You know, I laid in bed and, like, ate Cheetos for six months. I'm like, okay, you gotta get up. Like, But in the beginning, it was just really, really hard because, like, no one comes to the strip club to see dead kids. You know, nobody and I had a job to do. You know, and plus, even if you do, like, mood killer, but, like, pity's different than respect. Like. Oh. Poor you. Good bye. I'm like, no.

Speaker 2 00:16:12  So I started, you know, I'd have to lie. And I think that's why things got so hard for me. Like before. Before he passed away, my kids were always my inspiration. They're always my motivation. I paid for everything. I did a lot. It just I it was I was on fire. And I loved bragging about them. And I was excited and and, people love helping single moms, you know? But, After he passed away. I would often just say I have one kid, and then that would break my heart. So I started saying, no, I have two, and I would just pretend he was alive. And so, you know, people always asking questions and, you know, I would just make up these stories about, like, how I wish it would be, you know, and get all drunk. And then I'd come home and get sober, and it just hurt. And I ended up, you know, it was it was hard, but, Yeah, I used to make up stories, too, and just.

Speaker 2 00:17:15  I don't know.

Speaker 4 00:17:17  Is it is it healing? Like, I feel like when you talk about the stories about, like, creating these stories about your son or based off of and like, in a sci fi kind of way. I mean, is that is that healing in a way like, is that you just like, you know, imagining what could be like in a in a sense, it just kind of brings you. Yeah, you know, some type of peace just thinking about, I don't know, I think that's beautiful. I don't know, I just, I think that's a beautiful thing to do. I just yeah.

Speaker 2 00:17:50  I think I'm writing. Writing is really healing for me, you know, and even this book now, I started writing this book in 2015, a video director producer that I had worked with reached out to me. And, so initially, I was interested in doing a movie. So initially I was like, well, I want to write the book first, you know? But this dang book has broken me down, thrown me around like I have.

Speaker 2 00:18:18  It took me so long. And then when I finally got the draft, like I wrote it, like in three days.

Speaker 1 00:18:24  Okay, I know a lot of people that have written books and a lot of people that have written books that are talking about their lives. A lot of the times they say it takes them back to certain things. It'll take them back through their lives, and it's like they're reliving certain things over. So has that happened for you, or has the book just been strictly therapeutic for you?

Speaker 2 00:18:45  Oh, no. Absolutely. Absolutely. It's, I'm in a stronger place now. This is this is the first time I didn't break me down. I didn't quit like, when I started this time. So, I mentioned I have a spiritual community earlier. Goddess wisdom Council, one of the goddesses that runs it. Her name's Anita Kopech. She's one of my, spiritual coaches. And, she's amazing. She's become like a sister, and, she's a great friend and, but an amazing spiritual coach.

Speaker 2 00:19:17  And she's a writer as well. She's wrote a couple books. So she started doing, writing. what do you call it?

Speaker 1 00:19:30  I'm not sure.

Speaker 3 00:19:31  Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:19:33  You're not going to find it here.

Speaker 2 00:19:35  I'm having a brain fart. Like, Like writing, like a like a writing course. Like a write. Like. Like. Like writing courses where, Because she's she's a published author. So, like, just a lot of information, and, I met some new writing sisters, but I've, I've with her and also, with another one of my writing sisters I met through her. Laura. I've done five so far. So the the writing communities have helped me as well and helped me keep going. And,

Speaker 1 00:20:08  Now, how did you how did you find these communities? You know what I mean? Because a lot of times stuff happens and people don't know what to do. Oh, how did you how did you find these people?

Speaker 2 00:20:16  God, it was like magic one day. So, I was on Instagram, and, I started getting, like, just into spiritual stuff, and, you know how the algorithm works.

Speaker 2 00:20:28  And so I had seen this girl Anita. I like she kept, you know, the people you don't follow, but they they're like, blended in with the time line. Yeah. So I had seen a few of her posts and I was like, oh, I like that. But then she posted something and she was popping her shit. I don't remember what it was, but.

Speaker 3 00:20:44  She said something.

Speaker 2 00:20:45  I was like, yes, I love her. Follow immediately. And she just happened to be posting, like, it was the Spiritual Community Goddess Wisdom Council. And like, I've never been in a women's group. I've never been in a community. Like, I've never done anything like this, you know? And, also at the time, I had just broke up with this dude I was with, and I was feeling a little crazy. And I'm like, to get different results. You gotta do something different. I'm gonna do some different shit today. So I signed up, and, And then I swear, if I would have waited, like, another day or two, I probably would have been, like, too cool for school.

Speaker 2 00:21:25  I'd be like, I'm not doing this, but I'm glad I did. And, So, we have zoom meetings once a month. We have like a, we have a community where we have a WhatsApp chat and then we go on retreats. I've been on three retreats with them, but there have been, a huge part of a huge, huge part of my healing process, like having, a sisterhood of safe women, okay, that hold space for you and love you. And, you know, in the beginning, I was such a hot mess. And, you know, it's like people can tell you, like, fix this or you're wrong or judge you, but when you can actually have the space to be free and say or do whatever you want and then kind of see, like, I'm a piece of shit or, you know, like, oh, maybe I should change that. And people still love you and they don't judge you. That's powerful. Then you can come to it on your own conclusion.

Speaker 2 00:22:26  And and they've They've just been, I just needed love, I think unconditional love and support. And I had isolated myself so long, because after Matthew died, like for, I would say 2000, 14 to 16, it was just I started drinking a lot. I started doing drugs, like, to the point where I knew if I didn't change my life, I was going to die. And I had to, like, do an intervention on myself type thing.

Speaker 1 00:23:05  So did you ever get to the point where you said, fine, I don't care if I die?

Speaker 2 00:23:10  Almost? Yes. Kind of. But every time, like I, I, you know, have seen the tunnel. I've talked to my son, you know, but he told me I can't leave Philip. I can't leave my other son like it was always I can't. Almost. But then I remember I have another son, you know. Yeah. So.

Speaker 4 00:23:33  Yeah. Kept you alive?

Speaker 2 00:23:35  Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely.

Speaker 1 00:23:37  Wow.

Speaker 1 00:23:40  what has the situation with Matthew? That situation, how have you changed as a person from that situation?

Speaker 2 00:23:51  Oh, wow. I'm such a better person. I, I was kind of, I don't want to say I'm a terrible. I was a terrible person. because I've always, like, had a good heart and been the best that I could, I guess. Or, what I knew, you know, but I feel like I died, and I was reborn then, and my whole life started over, like, I'm. I'm, 12 right now. Like, I don't know, you know, but, you know, that's I, I would say that before he died. I was trying my hardest. but I was just a very hurt and unaware person, you know? And a lot of the things I was doing in my life, it was hurting people, too. And I wasn't even aware of that. You know, it was normal to me or just the world changed, you know, things changed.

Speaker 2 00:24:48  But, and and I don't know, I, I've, I'm a completely different person. I don't know, I'm, I'm the same. I feel I feel more, who I've always been, like when I was like five and I was like, really? Me? You know, when I was a little kid. But, you know, I, I took a few left turns for a while. I don't know, you know. Yeah, but I'm, I'm, I think that, and everyone's like, you're so strong. I don't know what I would do. I don't, I don't think I could do it like, yes, you can and you would. And it just you keep life keeps going, you know.

Speaker 1 00:25:28  Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:25:29  And, but you just never know. You never know what people are going through. You know, you might look at someone like, oh, they look crazy. You don't know what they're going through, you know? And to my surprise, this type of shit happens every day all around the world.

Speaker 2 00:25:43  Like, I was taken aback when I started seeing how often this happens, you know, no news coverage. And, yeah. So I, I don't really know how yet, but that's what I, I want to help kids. I want to help families. I want to somehow I haven't figured out exactly how, but I really want to help people. Like, even if I could help this prevent happening, one person, it'd be worth it.

Speaker 1 00:26:13  I mean, even even here, people, our audience listening to you, that's going to help somebody, hearing everything that you've gone through. You may not think that, but it will.

Speaker 2 00:26:26  You see, people are always like. You're so strong. I feel crazy, like, you know my delete later. I'll be deleting stuff.

Speaker 3 00:26:32  All the time. Okay?

Speaker 2 00:26:35  I'll feel all spiritual and vulnerable and not, like, put my heart into something and then like, I'll be like, oh, I'm doing too much. Delete.

Speaker 3 00:26:42  Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:26:44  Erase it.

Speaker 1 00:26:45  Then when your books start coming out and things like that, I'm trying to tell you you're going to have so many people like, oh my God, what you wrote helped me. Something you said helped me. seeing your story helped me. Trust me. Yeah. You're going to see that. Thank you.

Speaker 2 00:27:02  I want to I want it to be done with the right intention and with respect. You know, I never wanted to, like, pimp his story out or. Yeah. it has to be. I want people to remember him and know him for who he was. Not like, oh, the kid that got killed by his father. Like, that's not. He was such a bright light. He was such a an amazing kid, like God. He was cool, you know? Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:27:30  Yeah, yeah. you you you touched on something saying that your mom told you that. That everybody was hurt by it. Tell me more about your family life. Because, you know, I hear about Matthew, and I hear about Philip.

Speaker 1 00:27:47  What about your mom? Your dad and your your your rest of your family? tell me some more about them. How how have they been with all of this? And how have they kind of.

Speaker 2 00:28:00  Oh, it broke. It broke everybody. my my grandma Fran, my mom's mom. she was alive when he passed, but it completely broke her heart. Like, she she she found out she had cervical cancer. The day my grandpa died. My grandpa died, I want to say, in 2012, but, So, you know, she was in the middle of her treatments, and the doctors were, like, ordered her on bed rest. And she called my uncles in San Diego, like, pick me up and take me to the funeral. Now, you know, she's, like, pale and sick. She did not care, like, take me to my baby now. But, it it broke her heart through and through. And she used to say she was so glad it happened after grandpa died.

Speaker 2 00:28:46  Because she thought it would have killed my grandpa, you know? But, I have an amazing family. We were. All I remember is my grandparents. Until we moved here. And then I went from them. I had another little lady that watched me, but, But, my grandma died about a year later. and my Aunt Sarah died, and we just had a lot of death in our family at once. So it wasn't just Matthew. It was my grandpa Matthew, my grandma, my aunt Sarah. was my answer as my mom's little sister. it just it broke everyone. All the kids and the cousins and my brother and, you know, my mom, my mom is is has really helped me get through this. You know, I talk to my dad sometimes. You know, my dad's in Albuquerque, and, I'm a lot closer to my mom and my mom's side. but they've, you know, I think it really just. Yeah. Yeah. My mom, my mom's writing a book, too.

Speaker 2 00:29:58  Actually, she she is. She's a writer as well. She's badass. Yeah. She's.

Speaker 1 00:30:03  What is her book about?

Speaker 2 00:30:04  It's about Matthew. It's about their relationship and the grandmother's view. And, you know, she asked me permission about it. I was like, yes. Like, that's her grandson, too. But I thought that would probably help a lot of grandparents. Yeah. You know.

Speaker 4 00:30:17  Now that your grandma. Do you like.

Speaker 3 00:30:20  Oh my goodness.

Speaker 4 00:30:21  You understand to a little more.

Speaker 2 00:30:23  And man, they say you love your grandkids more. And sorry.

Speaker 3 00:30:27  It's true.

Speaker 2 00:30:29  you know, I love my kids. I love my both my sons, you know. But. And my grandson, I mean.

Speaker 4 00:30:40  Yeah. I feel like I, I give my mom a lot of hate because my mom, man, I it's hilarious to see my mom just be my mom and then see her be a grandma to my kids. And I'm like, who the hell.

Speaker 3 00:30:53  Is this.

Speaker 1 00:30:55  Like.

Speaker 3 00:30:55  That? Yeah, I am the way I am. I'm crazy yelling at my kids like, do this.

Speaker 1 00:31:00  When.

Speaker 3 00:31:00  I was little. Yeah, no, she was mean.

Speaker 4 00:31:03  And then now I'm like, my kids can do whatever whenever. And I'm like, no. Like, no. But she's like, you know, she tries to tell me. She's like, when you have grandkids, you're gonna you're gonna get it. You'll understand. It's it's different. I'm like, she was like. And I think my mom said that same statement. She was just like, you know, it's not that I didn't love you guys. I think it's just that, you know, I love my grandkids more and I'm like, damn.

Speaker 2 00:31:26  It's just.

Speaker 4 00:31:26  Different. Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:31:27  You know.

Speaker 1 00:31:29  What? when, Hold on. Lost my train of thought. Sorry. it's just a great story. All of the the books and and things like that. And I know you said that there were some other, you know, people around and other things that you do.

Speaker 1 00:31:46  So we had the yoga. You had the book writing. Were there anything, anything else that kind of helped you through all of this stuff or or any other people.

Speaker 2 00:31:56  community, you know, my, my, my friends and family. I have a list when I read the list. Sure, I.

Speaker 1 00:32:02  Read the list. Okay.

Speaker 2 00:32:04  These are these are kind of, kind of in chronological order from when, I would say I came. I woke up at the dark and I came to the light. And I was like, okay, I want to live again, okay in my life. Okay. So and then I'll tell you, I'll just read them and.

Speaker 1 00:32:26  Then and I know some of your friends too, because we all we went to the same school. So I know some of your friends. So go ahead.

Speaker 2 00:32:31  Okay. So, Cardi B and Bodak Yellow Goddess detox pearls, plant based diet yoga both doing it, and the teacher trainings which I already talked about that, prayer and God and perseverance.

Speaker 2 00:32:49  because I did get sober by myself with no help in private working at a nightclub, and I failed over and over and over for about two years, and I finally got it. But like, it went from every day to every other day to once a week. And finally I just kept falling on my face. But I had to get back up. So perseverance was a big part of that. taking a year off, which was completely paid for. I am forever grateful for that. That was. Thank you. Thank you daddy. That was great. And, Goddess Wisdom Council, as I mentioned, and my spiritual coaches. I've worked with Anita Coppock and also Yadi. but also the other two girls, Coco and Ivana. Goddesses, girls. But I've worked with all of them within the group. But that community. working with the coaches as well as some of my sisters. the sisterhood I gained. that's helped so much. family and friends. My mom, my dog. You know, my son, of course.

Speaker 2 00:33:57  New friends. You know, some. I have some new friends that they weren't around, but they just distract me. Hey, let's go out to eat. Come on. Let's let's go do something like they see me. You know, that really helped. But old friends. some of my friends that that, you know. just some of my old friends that know my kids and they know Matthew. They knew him. They knew me. They knew my other son, Philip, before we lost him so that I. They help anchor me. They help give me, like, a like a blanket of security because I feel like they know me. They know my son. They just. They just know I say less. You know, I get like, I, I still, you know. Everything I, I some of the things I went through are embarrassing. You know, it's just like you don't have to explain that to old friends. What else do we got? self-care, like, really pouring into myself.

Speaker 2 00:34:56  I used to be the type of person. Like, everything went to my kids and my husband and my home and my family. And, when I first had kids. So, like, it took me a long time. Even when I was making a lot of money, it took me. Everything was all about making more money. Like, is this an asset? Is this going to. Yeah. Am I buy this dress? Is this going to make me like it wasn't? it took me a while to just do self-care for me. You know, without a purpose behind it or to get something out of it and just really, Vacations are therapeutic.

Speaker 4 00:35:27  Yes.

Speaker 2 00:35:30  I would say, inspiration as well. Community leaders. People that are just, like, leading by example and helping. You know, I would say locally, like Mr. Fab Wallow. Earn your leisure. People that are out here giving their heart in and helping and teaching and inspiring. I would say my inspiration is in other other people doing it.

Speaker 2 00:35:56  You know. Yeah. And, yeah, I'm actually working on a magazine as well. So that's exciting.

Speaker 1 00:36:02  So magazine as.

Speaker 2 00:36:03  Well.

Speaker 1 00:36:03  Yes. What what type of magazine is that?

Speaker 2 00:36:06  it's a lifestyle magazine. So, like, our music, spirituality, travel, fly shit. You know.

Speaker 1 00:36:18  Okay. Okay.

Speaker 2 00:36:20  That's my list. That's how I got started. And that's kind of.

Speaker 1 00:36:22  Where.

Speaker 4 00:36:23  It's crazy to kind of I don't know I guess witness this right. for me because so when I joined Radiance Trading and I still I guess I've always had my doubts. Right. And radiance training and meeting this community women, I think people really underestimate how life changing it can be. I know that from my experience, it was, life changing. I was going through a really tough time. I was in a really dark place. And then, you know, I never asked myself questions like, what do I like? You know, I think as a mom, you get lost and we call it survival mode and where you're just like, I gotta hustle, I gotta do this.

Speaker 4 00:37:01  I gotta take care of everybody. I gotta take care of like how you said. You gotta take care of everybody around you. You don't know how to take care of yourself. But it's it's it's beautiful in a sense, I guess from for me, because I still kind of go back and forth because I'm like, just barely. I mean, this is like last year and I kind of move in and move out of it. but I have my doubts, I guess. I always think, oh, people are in it for the money or it's not really real. Or I tell myself that these things aren't real, like aren't real. but seeing you and hearing your story and the community that you found and all the things that you got in, I'm like, damn, it's real, it's real, it's real.

Speaker 1 00:37:37  Telling you you're going to help somebody. Yeah. Didn't I tell.

Speaker 4 00:37:40  You it's real?

Speaker 1 00:37:41  It helps someone in this room.

Speaker 4 00:37:43  And even, like, being there. It's like, for me, I think I have a hard time, I guess making a connection with women, especially, I'm just awkward by nature, you know? I don't know, like, I've.

Speaker 4 00:37:55  I've connected. And it's crazy because you talk about the trips and all this, and they do all of that, right? and I still go to, like, some things, but I've kind of, like, phased out a little bit to where I'm not into it, but I don't know. It's crazy. Just like hearing your story just makes me want to be like, all right, I gotta I gotta tap back into that because I. It's crazy because you get to moments in your life where you're like, oh, I'm feeling a little lost. I feel like I'm just surviving. I'm just everyday. There's nothing really to look forward to. But, yeah, it's crazy that you're talking about all this stuff because I'm like, wow, I and what's crazy is I know it worked because when I did it, I, I evolved like who I was as a person, you know, and then you kind of like phase out and you go back to everyday life and then, you know, now I'm like, oh, I need to go back.

Speaker 4 00:38:48  I need to go back, man.

Speaker 2 00:38:50  Having having a good, strong community of of safe women. Yeah. That's just we all need that. We all need that, you know, and, they kind of they healed my sisterhood wounds that I had because, you know, out in Vegas, a lot of these girls. Not really.

Speaker 1 00:39:07  Friends.

Speaker 2 00:39:09  Actually.

Speaker 1 00:39:09  That's the OP's.

Speaker 2 00:39:10  Some are. Some are really good. I have some I have good people from all jobs, all walks of life. But I mean, in general, you know, it was just God, they saved me. You know, when I joined them, I told them I want to be a better person and I don't know how. My grandson was like two weeks old, and I just went through this thing like when he was born, I it was just my my son was like, who are you? You're real brand new. Like, I just wanted to be just a grandma. I, you know, I, I my son, my grandson deserves grandma.

Speaker 2 00:39:46  There's like, I had I had real grandmas. Yeah. You know, so yeah, that's but you know, that's, I'm, I'm glad to hear that. There's other stuff out here too, and you can always check us out sometime.

Speaker 4 00:40:01  No. I'm interested. I mean, I'm interested in in in all of it and it's, it's crazy because like I mentioned like I kind of lost my way even though this thing I know, it just made this huge impact in my life and it was life changing for me. Like, I, I never and I don't know, hearing your story and how you talk about like, even self-care, it's like I forget to do those things. And it's like during that time I started asking myself like, okay, well, what does Shanna like? Like, you know, I'm I'm 30. Well, I'm, I'm 32. but I'm a woman. I'm in my 30s, I have two kids, and I never asked myself, what does Shanna set up? It's like I never asked Shanna what Shanna likes to do.

Speaker 4 00:40:45  Like when they. When somebody asked me, well, what do you like to do? And I couldn't answer that question. It's crazy because you like, damn. Like you don't care about yourself. You don't. I give and I give and I give and I give and I give. I never give back to myself. And so, I don't know. I can ramble on forever about all of it, but it is inspiring because again, it's just like I always go back to, the doubt and just being like, is this really a thing? You know, you get lost, you separate, and you're like, all right. Do I really believe in this? But again, it's just like inspiring to hear your story. And I'm like, damn. Like, how do you how do you get lost? You know, you find something and it's so great. And then you back out of it and then life kind of goes back to how it was and, you know, like, oh, I could just go right there and I'm gonna find myself again and you just don't.

Speaker 4 00:41:42  But then it takes simple things like this, this moment, right, for me to realize, like, damn, damn, it's right there. It's right there. It is real. It's true. It's. Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:41:54  That's like.

Speaker 4 00:41:55  Though.

Speaker 2 00:41:55  You know, the ebbs and flows and the ups and downs and, you know, the adventure. All part of the adventure.

Speaker 4 00:42:02  Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:42:03  You know.

Speaker 1 00:42:04  So, Jessica, what would, What if you would have any words for anyone else out there that's kind of going through the same thing, or that has gone through the same thing? Is there any any advice you would have for anyone?

Speaker 2 00:42:20  I can think of some. Let's see. yeah. Don't give up and be gentle with yourself. You know, it's okay. Like it's say it's not your fault. But it's okay to not be okay. It's okay to grieve things when it's okay to be sad. You know? when things hurt, it's okay to cry. It's okay to ask for help.

Speaker 2 00:42:53  You know, it's it's, God, it's it's okay, you know.

Speaker 1 00:43:03  Well, I am going to tell you something that you said you've heard a lot and you're sick of hearing, but you're going to hear it one more time. Yes, Derek, you are a very strong person. Thank you. Very strong. Because I there's a lot of people that wouldn't be where they are now if the same thing had happened to them.

Speaker 4 00:43:24  Right.

Speaker 1 00:43:25  So you are a very strong person. Thank you. And I knew that from the second that we communicated on social media. I knew that from that very second. So that is something that that you're going to hear over and over and over and over again because it's true. That's why you're going to hear that.

Speaker 2 00:43:44  Thank you. The irony of that is, is I often feel weaker. I feel like like before all this I was so solid. I was so cool. I was I was a lot cooler. Like, I'm a little bit of a loose pass.

Speaker 2 00:43:59  Now, like, I don't I don't know how to explain it. Like, I don't feel all the time. Like I embody all of this strength that everybody sees in me. You know.

Speaker 1 00:44:12  We see it from the outside. You may not feel that on the inside, but we see it from the outside.

Speaker 2 00:44:16  Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:44:17  See it from the outside.

Speaker 2 00:44:18  My heart is pure, so it'd be all right.

Speaker 1 00:44:20  You see it from the outside. Thank you. Yes. So, Shanna, I'll give you the last word.

Speaker 4 00:44:24  Yeah. I think that you're inspiring. I think just witnessing you and knowing what you. You've been through, right? And seeing you here and now, it's inspiring and. Yeah, double back on what Derek said, but I think you're an amazing woman. And just seeing you here in the flesh and just radiating, like, just your aura, you know, it's, It's amazing. Awesome. Yeah.

Speaker 2 00:44:48  I love that. Thank you. And, thank you both for having me.

Speaker 2 00:44:52  And, Yeah. Great. You're beautiful.

Speaker 4 00:44:56  Too. Thank you. I'm hot. Derek, turn the AC off. I'm turning.

Speaker 1 00:45:01  And that's the end of our show, you guys. So, hopefully you guys enjoyed the show. stick around, because we're going to have a break after this, and we're going to kind of give you guys some hot lines of, you know, if you're going through a situation, of domestic violence, child abuse. So, don't cut this off yet because there's going to be something after and, you know, we'll see you guys again next week. So thank you guys for tuning in. We'll see you.

Speaker 4 00:45:34  Bye.

Speaker 2 00:45:35  So.

Speaker 1 00:45:40  If you or someone you know has been involved with or a victim of domestic violence, call the National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-7233. Help is available. Speak with someone today.