Worth Beyond Wealth

Worth Beyond Wealth | Ep 7: The Money Talk Most Couples Never Have

• Ryan & Shannon Warwick • Season 1 • Episode 7

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0:00 | 50:36

What if the family finances suddenly became your job? Would you know where to start, or who to call?

A historic amount of money is moving to women right now. A lot of those women have never been asked a single question about any of it.

Raleigh Ann Vachek never planned to work in finance. A college professor told her to go job-shadow an industry she was curious about, she picked investments, and a conversation she had back in the spring of 2000 turned into a job. She's now a CFP and a principal at R|W, and she's spent more than twenty years walking families through big life transitions, the planned ones and the ones nobody sees coming. That includes the phone call no one wants to make.

A lot of her work is something she calls life raft drills. She sits couples down and talks through the what-ifs before anything goes wrong: what could happen, how likely it really is, and what you'd actually do about it. Shannon knows that feeling firsthand. She's married to a wealth advisor, she trusted Ryan completely, and she still couldn't have answered basic questions about their own money. One day Ryan asked her what she wanted to do with their next investment, and she cried, because no one had ever asked her that before.

In this episode, Ryan, Shannon, and Raleigh talk about why both spouses need to be in the room, why money is never just numbers, and where our beliefs about money come from. They get into the hard switch from saving to spending in retirement, why a balance sheet was never enough on its own, and the question almost every family ends up asking... are we going to be okay?

They also talk about the wave of wealth moving to women, why so many women have been left out of the money conversation, and how to start small. One meeting a year. No question too basic. Nobody expects you to know everything on day one.

If you've ever told yourself you'll get to it later, this is the episode.

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💬 Comment: Have you and your spouse ever had the "what if something happened to you" conversation?
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⏱️  TIMESTAMPS:
0:00 Cold Open
0:54 Welcome to Worth Beyond Wealth
1:37 Introducing Raleigh Vachek
2:32 How Raleigh Fell Into Finance
5:03 Being the First Phone Call
6:40 What Money Can't Buy
9:50 What Is a Life Raft Drill?
12:44 "It's Going to Be Okay"
15:47 Why Both Spouses Belong in the Room
21:54 The Psychology of Money Starts in Childhood
27:13 Learning to Spend What You Saved
32:27 Keeping Both Voices Engaged
36:05 The Great Wealth Transfer to Women
41:50 What Real Wisdom Looks Like
46:54 Advice to the Next Generation
49:26 Closing & Disclaimer

⚠️  DISCLAIMER: The opinions expressed are for general informational purposes only. R|W Investment Management, LLC is a registered investment advisor. Past performance is no guarantee of future returns. Investing involves risk and possible loss of principal capital.

#WorthBeyondWealth #WomenAndWealth #GreatWealthTransfer #WealthManagement #FamilyFirst #FinancialPlanning #IntentionalLiving

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⚖️ Disclaimer:
The information shared in this podcast is for educational purposes only and should not be considered financial, legal, or investment advice. Always consult a licensed professional before making financial decisions.

© 2026 Worth Beyond Wealth. All rights reserved.

SPEAKER_02

I get that phone call from you know an adult daughter or son, and mom, dad always said that we could call you, and this has happened, and we don't know what to do, but we're sure you're you're gonna help us through this. I I distinctly remember some phone calls like, wait a minute, where where's where's the money? Why were we in all these tech stocks?

SPEAKER_01

But you said to me one day, I think you should make the next investment. What do you want to do? And I cried because no one had ever asked me that before.

SPEAKER_00

And it came out that this gentleman had a list in his desk of things he wanted to do at some point during your life. His wife is sitting here and has no idea that that list exists.

SPEAKER_01

When Ryan brought up your life raft drills, I loved it. We can actually go through scenarios, we can run a drill, we can talk about the what ifs. I say it's putting the face to that monster that's so scary, and all of a sudden he's not so scary anymore. That's one of the, if not the biggest question that families ask. Are we going to be okay?

SPEAKER_00

Welcome to the Worth Beyond Wealth Podcast, where net worth meets personal worth.

SPEAKER_01

I'm Shannon.

SPEAKER_00

I'm Ryan. We help families navigate the emotional, relational, and personal realities that money alone can't solve.

SPEAKER_01

If you've built wealth but still wonder what it all means, or how to keep your family grounded while protecting your legacy, you're in the right place.

SPEAKER_00

We sit down with experts and with you to talk identity, purpose, and connection beyond the balance sheet.

SPEAKER_01

Because true wealth isn't measured in dollars, it's measured in the impact we make and the relationships we nurture.

SPEAKER_00

So grab a seat, take a breath, and let's redefine what it means to be truly wealthy together. This is the Worth Beyond Wealth Podcast.

SPEAKER_01

I think we can start with just saying that we know there's a historic amount of wealth moving to women in particular. And the job here at RW is to help them feel ready, confident. The word that comes to me is safe. Does that resonate with you? Absolutely. Good. Absolutely. Yeah, and I think in particular, we're introducing Raleigh Bachek today, and you show what strong stewardship looks like in real life, clear plans, shared decision making, simple next steps trying to lower the stress. This episode in particular, we're wanting to give families and women language and habits that they can start to use right away. Who are you here at RW? You? Yes. Principal. Yes. You're a wealth advisor, a CFP. You lead the advisory team and you set the bar for great client meetings. Uh, you started at RW in a support role and you've grown into ownership. Talk about that for a second.

SPEAKER_02

I when I talk about how I started in this industry, I fell into it. I had a class, my senior year of college, that was um, you know, really looking at all different areas of finance and investments, and I didn't really know what that meant. But the professor said, write down an industry that you're curious about and that you would like to um maybe go job shadow. So I went and met with a gentleman at an investment firm, and I just said, you know, I really want to help people, but I don't want to sell stuff. Like I'm not really a salesman, but I want to help people. He's like, oh, I think you have a great rapport, you're a good listener, you'd be great in our industry. And this was in northern Colorado, and I said, Well, I I want to move back to Idaho. And this was right in the spring of 2000. So naively, um, I thought it would be really easy for me to, you know, find a job. And it was early enough before the tech bubble that I was able to fall into a job. So he literally picked up the phone, um, called a cohort here in Boise and said, I have a gal you should consider hiring. And he said, I don't have a job open. He's like, We'll make one. And I literally said, I'll do anything. I was just hungry and curious and wanted to learn. And I thought, oh, investments would be great. And so moved to Boise. And at that time, um we had a wire operator, brokers, uh, now hopefully financial advisors, but brokers at that time would handwrite tickets um and we would enter them on the wire to put in orders. So just a very different time. Um, phones were ringing like crazy to locally buy extended systems. Um, so just a very different time. I liked the energy. Every day was something different, but I knew that I wanted something deeper. So I really, really quickly decided I wanted to get my CFP, become a certified financial planner. Um, I did not feel satisfied by picking stocks. Um, I knew there had to be a better way. And, you know, very quickly in the early 2000s, the tech bubble happened. A lot of people lost a lot of money. There definitely was a better way. And so that's kind of how I um I think fell into the industry to start and then got my CFP and then was fortunate to work with another great team and just grow into the planning piece, uh, more professional institutional management. And then so really started from the ground up, though. Just went into an associate advisor role and just really cared about the clients, the people, the planning. That part I really enjoyed.

SPEAKER_01

It's really um kind of an organic story for you.

SPEAKER_00

Yes. When I listened to that story, it's it was intuitive to you to seek worth beyond wealth. So there was nothing attractive about selling the idea of selling, the idea of being a broker, of trading. It was how do I plan for people, how do I help people? I think that that gives you still to this day, that is the activity and and the the stuff that gives you joy.

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

So are there when you think about what gives you joy today in this in this industry, is there anything that comes to mind?

SPEAKER_02

I think we're so fortunate to uh be part of these families. I have said, you know, when I'm working with younger advisors, oftentimes we're a first phone call that happens when there's some amazing news or some tragic news. And what a privilege to be part of these families and and hopefully help guide them. So whether it's a marriage or a new birth, and what should I do for my grandchild, those are the fun conversations, or when it's a scared, unexpected death, and what do I do? Um, you know, we can do that steady voice, that voice of calm. There's there's many instances where I get that phone call from, you know, an adult daughter or son, and mom, dad always said that we could call you and this has happened and we don't know what to do, but we're sure you're you're gonna help us through this. And so I think uh it is such a privilege. And so while it can be hard, at times it's a blessing to be part of these families, and I think that that can give me such joy, just knowing that you can provide a sense of peace of mind, which is really hard. So just you know, knowing you have that phone call, that person that can help you through it during exciting or difficult times. So I think that that's what I was saying too.

SPEAKER_01

So the transitions planned and unplanned, I think. Yeah, all of them. Yeah, absolutely. Worth beyond wealth. When you picture a good life, what matters most that money can't buy when you when you're when you're working with these families. Yeah, you know, that's kind of I'm sure that's always in the back of your mind, right?

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely. And I think families have different but similar challenges. One of the basics that I I think you hear is, gosh, I want the same opportunities for my kids that I had. And if not the same, maybe even better opportunities. Um, so I think that's something that's really important. And and oftentimes that doesn't have anything to do with finances. Sometimes it does, but a lot of times it's just I want I want my kids to have meaningful relationships. I want them to have connections. And so there are challenges in this world today. I mean, even watching our kids grow up, they're growing up in a different world than we did. So I think um just facilitating some of those conversations with families about what's important to you, how are you gonna make that happen? Sometimes it is, you know, maybe encouraging them to do some big family excursion that maybe the gen one is going to finance. Um, but it allows for making memories and connections that and sharing something that's important. So I think oftentimes we're just facilitating some conversations around what's important and then saying, well, have you thought about this? Maybe you should do this. And sometimes that involves, you know, spending some money and and sometimes it involves um getting involved in in charities that are important to them and sharing that with the next gen, um, sharing some of those values.

SPEAKER_01

So do you think just your life experience as a daughter, a wife, a mother, do you think that that has just kind of brought this this holistic picture for you that that helps feed the way you coach families?

SPEAKER_02

Completely. And and maybe you've you've talked about working genius on here or not, but one of my working geniuses is enablement. And I used to think that was a bad word. Um I used to think enablement is is is terrible.

SPEAKER_01

Different than enabling, right? There's different things. When I first heard that, it was because that's me too. I was like, wait a second, that's really negative, right? No. No.

SPEAKER_02

So what I've come to realize um as a daughter, as a wife, as a mother, as an advisor, for me, enablement is really trying to anticipate unmet needs. And and that's me to a T. I can to um to plan and prepare and make sure that there's enough food. I don't want to run out of food. Or, hush, if someone got injured, do I have the right first aid supplies? So just thinking through all those pieces. Um, so so absolutely. I think these other various roles very much has prepared me um for my role as a financial advisor, really a coach, part of that family, coming alongside, helping them um prepare and and and plan ahead.

SPEAKER_01

And helping, I heard you say encouraging them to make memories. Yes. Encouraging them to what's that good life? Memories. That's what I heard you say. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. That that for you is worth beyond well completely.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you you said it, I'll just echo we we are in such a privileged position to be guides for heroes on their journey. It's interesting. Um all the various things. And for one family, it's it's trips, and and for another it might be a second home, and you know, all the the different ways that that family uh values various things. I just want to bring this up. You've done this so well over the years. You you do lifeboat drills with people. Can you talk about that?

SPEAKER_02

And I I think of this in my role right now. So I have a daughter that I just dropped off at college. And how are you doing, Maya? Doing all right. We have orientations today with our daughters. I think if we can talk about some of the what ifs, it's less scary if and when it happens. And um, if we can just prepare, again, it's less scary. So I think with clients, we don't want to just talk about all the exciting fun stuff, which is important. We want to talk about, okay, what are some of your fears? And and let's go down that path. And let's understand, okay, well, what if this does happen? What does this mean for you? Because yes, if that happens to your finances, to your money, what's the impact to your life? What's the impact to your family? So thinking through all those pieces. So when we do lifeboat drills, it's really talking about some of those what-if scenarios. And then from there, I think it's good to talk about, well, what's the likelihood that this could happen? Because you also have to put it in perspective. So I think getting it down on, you know, paper or a whiteboard, talking through it, seeing it, and then also understanding that if we can plan properly, I'm going to be okay. I can navigate a lot of these storms. I can handle it. Maybe I'll have to adjust my lifestyle. Maybe I'll buy, you know, a car every five years instead of every three. You know, you make some changes, but they're choices that you can make. I just think so much of what's important is just it's in talking through those what if scenarios and understanding that I can navigate some of this hard stuff. Same thing with parenting a young daughter, first year of college. What are you most afraid of? And I mean, is that likely to happen? Okay, well, what if it does happen? What do you need to do to be prepared for that?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. It really resounded with me. You know, we're working on the Life RAF project, right? And you have been so lovely with bringing your own stories to the Life Raft. And when Ryan brought up your life raft drills, I loved it. I loved it so much. Okay, we can we can actually go through scenarios, we can run a drill, we can talk about the what ifs. I say it's putting the the face to that monster that's so scary, and all of a sudden, he's not so scary anymore. I can identify him, I know what he looks like. So, you know, he might roar and get really loud, but you know, he's he's not that scary. But I like how you said put it in perspective. So if you're talking to, let's say women, let's say a widow, okay, and and you've run some of these drills, right? You've gone through this, and she comes in and you get that first phone call. And that is, I I think it's important to talk about kind of the the heaviness of that. I mean, that's that's a weight on your shoulders to get that first phone call, right? Absolutely. Right. And so you get the phone call, the thing that we didn't want to happen has happened. What would you say to her? What are some of those first words that you're going to kind of wrap her up in based upon what you've heard and you've seen and you've already run any girl? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

It's going to be okay. And and oftentimes, you know, we're crying with them because these are people that we can see your emotions have known potentially for a long time. Yeah. You're connected with them. 100%. So you're feeling their pain because it's going to be okay. And I think some of the best advice we can give is oh, you don't need to worry about that right now. Like there are things that they do need to take care of right away, but there's a lot of things that can wait. This can wait. And so trying to just, I think, give them um some assurance that if you don't have to get through all of this right now, we're going to be right there beside you every step of the way. And hopefully the ideal scenario, we work with their other professional teams. So we know they're a state attorney, we know their tax accountant. Um, so we're working closely with them to really try to alleviate just some of those immediate fears. And I mean, there is some administration that has to happen, but we can simplify it and try to try to keep it, move it along. And again, but just that peace of mind. I can't emphasize that enough. So it's going to be okay. Do what you need to do with your family right now. Take time to process all of these things that maybe you're worried about. They can wait. There's there's not an urgency to a lot of it. So I think just having that that person you can call. And again, I I just I can't emphasize enough. It's such a privilege and an honor to have that trust in place that you get that phone call and you can provide them some some peace of mind during a tough time.

SPEAKER_01

It's really beautiful. And that's actually one of the big questions. We talk about it in Life Rapts. That's one of the, if not the biggest question that families ask. Are we going to be okay? It's exactly the question that keeps coming back over and over again. So I love that your first response is, it's going to be okay.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And then you start to kind of cut away and get the main focus, right? I can't deal with this. And you don't have to, let me assure you. But I also heard you saying you're kind of, you're, you're running things behind the scenes. Uh-huh. You're starting to coordinate behind the scenes. You're keeping, you said, moving, you're keeping things moving along. But you're creating a space for them to grieve and for them to focus on the immediate need. Everything else will get handled. And we're gonna help you with that. Absolutely guide. Absolutely. That's my job. I love that. Thank you for sharing that. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

How important is it that that spouse, if if we're talking about a loss of a spouse, has been involved before that event?

SPEAKER_02

Yes.

SPEAKER_00

Have you seen it both ways?

SPEAKER_02

I've seen it both ways. Let's talk about that. I've seen it both ways were, you know, especially I think um in a more traditional role. If I rewind in my career back to the early 2000s, you know, tech bubble. I I distinctly remember, you know, some phone calls like, wait a minute, where where's where's the money? Why were we in all these tech stocks? Again, that's why I wanted to go into planning and get to know both spouses.

SPEAKER_00

So you had some people that lost spouses that then realized their spouse had been investing a little aggressively, yes, at that time.

SPEAKER_02

So I think those are good good things of what not to do. But I think it's again, it's not uncommon in certain um traditional you know relationships where you're you're going to have a spouse that has maybe more interest in in the investment piece. Uh, and that is fine. But what we do really want to do is get to know both spouses because it is important for them to have a comfort level with us. So in in an ideal scenario, we've met both spouses, we've worked with both of them, we've talked through their goals, understand the plan together. And again, you might have a point person, which is fine. You should. If you're in a trusted relationship, you you can delegate. You don't have to do everything uh and you don't need to duplicate. Um, but when we don't have any relationship with the spouse, I think that is really challenging because once if something does happen, you know, I've seen it's worked out well where they're like, hey, my husband said to give you a call and that he trusted you, so I'm gonna trust you, which is great. But we also would prefer to have those relationships up front. And then I would also add, we definitely are not licensed um marriage counselors, um, but we often facilitate conversations that happen. Remediating and we're just bringing up some questions and and oftentimes they didn't realize that they would answer it differently. Sure. And we're all busy, you know, I'm married, I have kids, like I'm not having the conversations I should be having at home. You're living your busy lives. And so I think it is so important to try to be that safe space, that area that can facilitate conversations, that can talk through these goals, can talk through these fears, and then hopefully come to a unified front where they feel like, oh yeah, we're in lockstep, we're moving in the same direction, we're really stronger.

SPEAKER_01

We're stronger for having had a conversation that we didn't know we needed to have completely. And we had a good guide mediating that conversation, absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. That's great.

SPEAKER_00

It's the essence of what Life RAF is about. It is actually. We started this journey because we noticed that there's this thing happening in relationships that there's some drift and it's not intentional, but we want to not just prepare people for the loss of a spouse, but we want to uh help facilitate what the acronym is life, living in family enterprise. How do we live a flourishing life? And um, it was interesting when Shannon first started talking about this, and and you called and said Yeah, we had a great conversation.

SPEAKER_01

We did, we did.

SPEAKER_00

You know, if we if we can get vulnerable here, absolutely you said, Hey, I'm I feel some guilt.

SPEAKER_02

I think you said convicted. I'm so convicted. Absolutely. I think Shannon, you were talking a little bit about you know the genesis that you've had as a couple in terms of um just realizing that Ryan's been an entrepreneur, he's been a financial advisor, wealth guy. Um, and you're looking at it. And I've of course trusted him. Yes. But you're like, wait a minute, what if something happens to you? Come on, buddy. Yeah, it's like nothing will happen to me. No. Unless my husband just said something very similar. I'm like, don't worry about it. It's taken care of.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yes, exactly. We kind of and John, you know, so I actually loved something that you you said to Rain. It's not as if we have uneducated spouses that are unaware and don't know what's going on in the world. That's that's not what we're dealing with here. But we're working within something that is just like breathing to us. This is just second nature, and we just handle it. And then we go home. And I think you said, he'll ask me a question and I'll just say to him, I've already taken care of it. It's fine, don't worry. And you felt guilt. Yes. And I think my response to you was, no, I think you're fatigued at the end of the day because you've been doing this all day and it's just second nature, and you know it's okay, and you know you've done your job for your family too. Yes. So you're just kind of ready to go into I'm home mode.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. And so giving yourself a little bit of grace instead of that guilt that you were feeling. But there's also that wake-up call that that we're realizing, that you're realizing, and we all need to have more conversations, more training, intentionality, intentionality.

SPEAKER_02

Yes, completely. I don't know. I think there's an old uh cliche that's like you can't learn a sport from your spouse or something. Like, I don't want my husband tried to teach me tennis, and I was like, that's a disaster zone.

SPEAKER_01

I tried to teach her tennis. He tried to teach me tennis, and we just she can't surf. No, we very quickly said this is a mistake, we want to stay married.

SPEAKER_02

So I think, as you mentioned, you know, this is our world. We live and we breathe in this world, we live and we breathe with the investments, the planning. Um so when when John asks me questions, uh, it's taken care of, because I I, you know, naturally don't have that same level of patience that I should. So I think that's where, again, having that trusted team in place, uh, he's joked and said, Well, who's my financial advisor? And I'm like, okay, we need to get you on because it can't be me. But I have told him, I love it. You know, if something happens, I'm like, call Ryan, yeah. Melissa, call Kim. Like you've got the people in place to take care of you. But it is important. Um, these conversations need to be happening. But you need that trusted partner, you need that facilitator, you need that guide, that person that can fill all those different roles. They can provide that education, they can facilitate conversation, they can mediate if needed. So I think that's also important because while it's money, it's also emotional. Um because it it is one way that we can potentially, you know, achieve some of these goals. Goals that we want to achieve. And so it is emotional. It's personal. And then also spouses have a different lens that they look at when they're looking at money based on their past experiences, based on their childhood. Yes. So that impacts it greatly. I love how secure was their childhood? What kind of you know jobs did their parents have? Was money really tight? Did they talk about money? Did they give generously? And so all of those things vastly impact how spouses look at money in their own lives.

SPEAKER_01

So I think those are conversations. I love that you brought that up because that is also in LifeRact. We've learned so much in the psychology of money, just that these the world view of money that you have does get formed in your childhood. And we carry it with us and then we carry it into our relationships. And we don't even necessarily understand where it's coming from or why we have that view of money, but exactly it goes back to that early development and what we witnessed with money. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02

And those are often some of the questions we're asking when we're first meeting with a couple. And it is it never fails to amaze me. Oftentimes, like they'll the couples will be like, oh, that's why you're that way with money. Wow. And so there are these light bulb moments where again, if we just go back in time and oh, what was your mom's job? What was your dad's job? Um, did they talk about money? Did they talk about investing? And then it really brings out some great stories and then oftentimes helps spouses understand each other. And oh, that's why, you know, you always buy the generic brand and I tell you not to. Right. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01

I think there is something incredibly powerful, and and the word that I'm thinking is sweet to this, because instead of this hurried, can we just get on with business? Can you just sign the papers? Can you just let me do my job and take care of your portfolio? And just I'll see you in a year for the review. You're stopping and saying, What was it like when you were a kid? How did it look in your house? And all of a sudden, relationship can get stronger. And maybe we can learn something about ourselves and why we tick the way we tick. 100%. And it can be healing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

Clients and tell their stories of you know living in a hotel, living, living in their car.

SPEAKER_01

Paycheck to paycheck.

SPEAKER_00

Not always wanting, you know, it's interesting. Wanting some of the same things for their for their family, but also wanting to give them a better, a better life. And it's hard to balance that. The way we attach to money based on how we were raised is is such a vital component in this thing called the cycle she line. It can impact our relationships.

SPEAKER_01

Absolutely. And we're trying to live, as you said, in family enterprise. But how can we do that if we don't even understand what the dynamic is between us and why it's there?

SPEAKER_02

And then are you intentionally choosing that? I mean, I think that's the other thing. We all have our defaults that we lean into. So when you have the conversation, you're like, oh, that is why I default that way, but I don't want to default that way.

SPEAKER_01

And I recognize I don't have to. Right. If I'm willing to learn and change, work with my trusted advisor, this good guide, and kind of stretch and get vulnerable. That's not always comfortable. Right. But it can be so good. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02

So freaking. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

I had a situation where we were we were talking, you know, similar, just drawing out information, and and it came out that this um gentleman had a list in his desk of uh things he wanted to do at some point during his life. And and his wife is sitting here and has no idea that that list exists. And they both go to tears, and you know, and it was through that process then that they even learned that they could start thinking about retirement a few months later and getting a phone call. And so it was just fun to see facilitation of conversation and to then to now watch them living this, I think, flourishing life because they took steps that they otherwise wouldn't have. What what sticks out to me is how I've probably watched this half a dozen times. People get to retirement and they're gone within a year. Yeah, absolutely. It happens all the time. We know. So, I mean, you've probably seen that. I was gonna say, have you had this happen? And yes, you know, and and so I think that's part of this worth beyond wealth that we that we want to talk about. So any any stories that come to mind or any well, I think it it does happen.

SPEAKER_02

And I think similar to the conversation with a a new widow, a new retiree, um, we want to get them excited about that next chapter. But it's also a conversation about um, I think being patient, like this is a another major life transition. And maybe you don't quite know what it's going to look like. Um, but try a few different things. And and I think the other piece that we're facilitating that conversation well in advance of retirement. And I think that helps. Um in your drills? Just just talking about what does it look like? What do you want it to look like?

SPEAKER_01

Because this is control and this is safety and this is security. There wasn't enough.

SPEAKER_00

And and I have to hold very tightly to when you just you you've been seeing money go in and the account balance grow and grow and grow for three, four decades. And we're asking them to shift. Right.

SPEAKER_01

So one of the things No more saving. Right, right.

SPEAKER_00

Start taking.

SPEAKER_01

Wait, that's that's but if we talk about our brain and the way that we're wired, it it this neuroplasticity we've talked about, you know, our brains have the ability to learn and shift and crow and change and mold. But if you've heard the phrase fire together, wire together, these neuropathways for all of these years have been firing in one direction. Save, invest, right? Plan, build, prepare, build. All of the so we've been firing in one direction, and then one day we're supposed to fire in a different direction and we're supposed to draw that down. Well, that's all of a sudden very uncommon. I know that's been the goal, but I haven't been doing it. And so now I don't know how to do that. Right.

SPEAKER_02

So we're having those conversations. Um, we know one of the planning tools we use runs a you know a Monte Carlo simulation, and you know, of clients with a score of 99, and I tell them you can't get 100 and you don't want a hundred. Um, you're not taking this with you. Remember these these dreams, these goals you've talked about? Those memories you're trying to encourage them to make it. Yeah, some of it is spending some money, some of it's giving away. Yeah, maybe you want to start this scholarship fund at your alma mater. Like maybe there's different things that are important to you. So again, uh running them through their plan so that they can see they're okay, they're okay financially, but you're right. It's a it's a major um mental emotional shift to start spending their assets. And but we try to give permission. I love that.

SPEAKER_00

I've been thinking about this concept of today versus tomorrow and how our industry historically puts more emphasis on tomorrow. And I think that they're both important.

SPEAKER_04

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

And I think that's what we're what you're saying here is that you can't just save and save and save forever. And who cares if you leave a big, you know, nest egg, but you miss out on experiences, you miss out on a relationship. Kids don't just want your wealth, or maybe they don't want your wealth, they want they want you, they want a relationship, right? So I I think that we need to honor both and somehow, you know, how do you beyond what you've already said, maybe guide people in this concept of let's honor today and tomorrow. You know, we need to save appropriately, but we also need to have experiences. Have you read um Die with zero?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I was gonna ask you about Die with Zero. Yeah, but I'm curious about it.

SPEAKER_00

I've heard it. You know, it's not the idea that you really need to have zero at death. It's the idea that experiences need to happen in the right order in life because guess what, Raleigh? You can't take your infant or toddlers back to Disneyland. Right. Right? You can't have those kind of experiences. So if we say no, save it, save, save, we we can miss out on certain things.

SPEAKER_02

I I go back to the word, what are the words? Um, what are you intentionally choosing? And so if you're in retirement and yes, you want to just keep building this, be intentional. Is that what you're choosing? Yeah, but what are you saying no to as well? And so I think it it's just facilitating those conversations, asking the right questions so that they can understand I'm choosing this. I don't want it to be fear-based. Like we want to try to address the fears. Um, and so if the fears are addressed, are you intentionally choosing this path over another? And it's often, um, in fact, it just happened last week where you know, I met with a client for a review, and in this scenario, it was like, oh, we talked about this is a year for a new car. He's like, oh no, I'm I'm good. A few days later, called in, spoke with uh one of our other advisors. Oh, yeah, I met with Raleigh, and you know what? We're we are gonna go buy that new car. We actually do want that new car. So um sometimes it's just reminding them that we planned for this, we prepared for it. The the money is set aside for that. It's fine if you don't want to do that.

SPEAKER_01

That's fine.

SPEAKER_02

But uh but it's just again, you know, back to um permission. Permission.

SPEAKER_01

Permission. It's a little silly.

SPEAKER_02

No, it's uh you've worked hard, you've been a good steward in your money. What do you want to do with it? Um another, I guess, one of my favorite examples. Um it's a family that we have the privilege of, I guess, serving three generations. Um, but they did a major uh family trip. But every single one of those family members that I spoke with was like best memory ever. Like just it had such impact, whether um it was 22-year-old grandson or 55-year-old, you know, adult um son. Like the just the impact was amazing, the memories they made. And that's always stood out to me. And I thought, gosh, someday if I can do that with my kids and their spouses and our grandkids, how special um to just be able to take one of those once-in-a-lifetime trips and do that as a family and make those memories together. That's really precious.

SPEAKER_01

I love that.

SPEAKER_02

And I I know that costs a lot of money.

SPEAKER_01

But my grandma funded. So thanks, grandma.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So on stewardship, how do you keep was we've talked a lot about marriages or or relationships, but how do you keep both voices engaged in a couple over that long run? How do you how do you how do you try to keep them both engaged, both feeding the conversation, both having a voice?

SPEAKER_02

Great question, Shannon. I think it ebbs and flows. I think um, as I mentioned, it's not uncommon that one spouse has more interest in this topic. Sure. Um, so perhaps, you know, I think a win for me is if we can sit down together at least once a year. So if we can try to have that face-to-face connection at least once a year with both spouses.

SPEAKER_01

At a minimum.

SPEAKER_02

At a minimum.

SPEAKER_01

What would you prefer?

SPEAKER_02

You know, probably depends on this situation. Um I think once a year is is fine. Um, because as long as you're able to really connect and make sure that we're still rowing in the same direction for everyone's goals and make sure that those fears aren't suddenly accumulating. I would also add if there's a health issue that happens, that oftentimes gets both spouses re-engaged because now, you know, our uh fragility feels real again. Again. Um, so I I think if we have that relationship built, if they know they can reach out um and they're willing to sit down and it's not too painful once a year to go for everything. We try to keep it fun. That's I think that's the once a year at a minimum.

SPEAKER_01

But if something if an unexpected life event happens, or if there's some fears that we're starting to percolate, and gosh, we I mean we met three months ago, but I feel this way. Call.

unknown

Okay.

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely call. And and we don't want we're if there's anything keeping up at night. I mean, just we're a phone call away. And and maybe that results in a meeting. Um, but oftentimes it's just a phone call. And then oftentimes as we're talking through, it often has nothing to do with the initial fear. It's like digging deeper. Oh, there's something else going on. That's really referred pain, is maybe a term in the medical world. Yes. So I think that's that's not that different in the financial world where I'm frustrated, I'm scared, this is coming out. Oh, this is the real issue. And so that's where we just have to take time, we have to be patient, we have to listen, we have to ask those questions and really understand what's going on.

SPEAKER_01

It's a systems check. Yeah. Yeah. And so you kind of find often there's there's a symptom and and we want to pay attention because a pain, let's say pain, that that's not a bad thing. Oh, everybody is like pain's bad. Pain can actually be really beneficial because it is an alert and it's telling us we need to do a systems check. And then we can go down and find, oh, it's actually here. Okay. So instead of waiting that year, we dealt with it very quickly. And then once that review comes up, it's a really great review.

SPEAKER_02

That's a great analogy. Um, write that down, Rand. We gotta think through a systems check. Systems check. There's some pain, there's some fear happening. Not a bad thing, really good. Let's make sure we're checking all the boxes, and then we might discover, oh, that's really what's scary. Like in some cases, maybe it's your sleep at night, your savings account. Maybe you dipped into it. Um, and now it's that's what's oh, let's replenish that. I mean, or you know, just simple little things um that we can address.

SPEAKER_01

And it's kind of funny because you know, someone will come in and say, I'm having this pain. And instead of, oh I I'm sorry you're having pain, and yet I'm not, because I'm so glad that you're here.

SPEAKER_02

Right. What's going on? Yeah. What's going on? How can we have yeah, us having conversation? Really good.

SPEAKER_00

What's been on my mind is, you know, this there's this historic transfer of wealth happening. And I I've had two, two situations uh where where I've thought about this. So one was I was presenting at uh an organization and I looked around the room at the business owners, and and it was about 25 men and two or three women. You know, the data says that most of those men have spouses. Most of those men are probably the ones taking care of the money decisions right now because they're running businesses, so they're the ones that know. And yet no. That's right.

SPEAKER_02

Sorry, I had to emphasize that.

SPEAKER_00

And yeah, at some point, they're not going to be there. And that spouse is going to find themselves responsible for, in in this case, large family wealth, what we call you know, a family enterprise that in many cases is bigger than most businesses ever grow to. I think most businesses, the the vast majority, 90%, maybe never get to a million dollars in sales. So these largely women will find themselves in charge of something that they're not equipped for. And I think that's what is resonating with me about what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_02

I'm gonna maybe interject and just say it's not that they're they're not equipped for it, they haven't been prepared for it.

SPEAKER_01

That's right.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_01

I I think yeah, and that's uh just here in just some of the research that that I had pulled, just many women reporting feeling unprepared to manage that that windfall of inheritance. Yes. Um, and so those challenges and considerations that are coming up, um, low confidence in managing inherited wealth. I thought this was interesting. A significant share of women have not yet opened investment accounts or established estate plans on their own. Like they've never touched this world, it's all been done for them. That resonated personally with me because I remember the day we were sitting in our dining room and I'd been involved. You know, you would say, Hey, this opportunity's come up. I really feel that we should. And oh, okay, that that sounds great. I'd love to meet him. But you said to me one day, I think you should make the next investment. What do you want to do? And I cried because no one had ever asked me that before. And so that was really a growing opportunity for us in our marriage and the fact that oh, you're my financial advisor. Like I had never been asked that question, right? And so I I look at this and I think oh, there's a whole world that can open up for women who are not in finance, and so what how can RW get ready for this this great opportunity to prepare for I think that's so important and I I think changing, I think oftentimes women do still have a heavier load of the historical home responsibilities.

SPEAKER_02

They do. So whether it's caring for the young kids, um, whether it's taking them to school, drop-off, the household duties, um, aging, doctors, appointments, aging pay on all of those things. So I think it's challenging. Um, so it's also meeting them where they are.

SPEAKER_01

I love that.

SPEAKER_02

So what because you're not wanting to overwhelm correctly. You're wanting to simplify this. Yes. So it's meeting them where they are today and what what can they take on today? So I think um that's going to look different in every scenario. So first and foremost, it's it's letting them know that we exist. Hi, Shannon. I'm here. I love it. I'm here. I'm here. If you have any questions, if you're scared, call. I'm here.

SPEAKER_01

Are my questions stupid?

SPEAKER_02

No questions are stupid.

SPEAKER_01

Okay.

SPEAKER_02

And I think that's in fact, should I know this?

SPEAKER_01

Why don't I know this? Right.

SPEAKER_02

Why would you just talking through all of it? And I but the back to that initial gosh, if we can, if we can take one meeting a year to start, like and and I know at certain times in your lives, that seems overwhelming. Yep. Okay, I gotta get, I gotta get child care. I need to arrange for this, but you know what? Let's sit down for one meeting a year. And then what I've noticed is the curiosity happens and the trust goes up. And then uh you start having maybe more frequent meetings, or then an email happens or a phone call. Yes. So I think um it doesn't have to happen all at once. In fact, that can be overwhelming.

SPEAKER_01

Aurevia's still an annual meeting, but all of a sudden you're not as quiet as you were. Yes. You have a lot more to ask or say or participate in. Yes.

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely. And then really, you know, providing that safe space that um, okay, that's this is what Ryan is, you know, curious about, but what's Shannon curious about? And so just really trying to open it, it's going back to some of those questions, like what was your childhood like? And and so again, that informs so much information about how we look about look at money, how we think about money, how we think about spending, saving, investing, all of it. So I think meeting them where they are, um, which guess what? Maybe it has to do with their aging parents. Maybe all of their questions right now have nothing to do with their own personal finances. But they're like, you know what? I need to be introduced to an elder law attorney. I need to know how to navigate this with mom, you know. I need to know we Do I have the money to help care for her if they don't have completely so often it's just all of those questions um that are happening first, too. That's just being there.

SPEAKER_00

For last thoughts, what is your definition of real wisdom?

SPEAKER_02

Gray hair. No, I'm kidding. Um great for all the things.

SPEAKER_00

I don't think we have to be though. I mean, I think that's an that's an interesting and it's why we talk about stewardship, right? Correct. So you can be a fiduciary and having uh you you have passed your test yesterday, so you have no experience. So I think there is a a real depth to this definition that comes with experience.

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely. I all I can think about right now is again, since I dropped my daughter off at college, I've had so I have an 18-year-old daughter and a 16-year-old daughter, and and they're brilliant, and they are little sponges and they can absorb things so quickly, and there's so many things that they are better at than I am. But I tell them, but I have time and wisdom and maturity, and which they just laugh at. Yeah, you're old, you know. Um that there is just something about, gosh, I've I've experienced this or I've witnessed this scenario, or um, so I think I think real wisdom, it doesn't have to be about age or maturity necessarily, but it does, it does take some experience, some observation, some collective exposure.

SPEAKER_00

Um humility.

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely, absolutely, which I think maybe that comes with age. I think that's hard to happen right away.

SPEAKER_00

I don't think it always does.

SPEAKER_02

No, it doesn't. But um, so so yes, just talking through, you know, finding that guide, finding that mentor, be willing to listen, be humble. Um, you don't have all the answers. And with our teenagers, your brains aren't fully developed. So I love to remind them that. So yes.

SPEAKER_01

I need to be I tell them all the time. Yeah, I tell them all the time, you know, your frontal lobe is very spishy.

SPEAKER_02

Yes, that's a white chair. So we're helping guide them. Um not sure I answered that fully.

SPEAKER_00

No, I think that's a great answer.

SPEAKER_02

I think it's a combination of all of that.

SPEAKER_00

It's experience and humility.

SPEAKER_02

Experience and humility, yes.

SPEAKER_00

Gray hair is a great one liner.

SPEAKER_02

Oftentimes knowing what you don't you don't have any though. I that's uh don't go. That gets fixed every few months. Go there where we I think it's powerful in being vulnerable and saying, hey, I don't know what I don't know. And so asking questions. Um, my younger daughter is uh looking at colleges, looking at playing um college soccer, we're going through the recruiting process. You know, I very often am encouraging her to ask them, what do you think I should be thinking about? Or, you know, just turn the roll around because we don't know everything. And so being humble enough to say, I don't know, this is my first time going through this. Right. What do you think I should be considering? What are the what are some non-negotiables? And you know, just um not that you're going to agree with everything, but having the conversation. So I think that's wisdom. That's great.

SPEAKER_00

One thing that just constantly comes back to me is when I walked through the program, uh, the the Chartered Financial Analyst program, and I learned a lot. But at the end of that program, I felt like now I just know how much information is out there in the world. Not that I'm an expert. Uh so my humility actually grew. My my awareness of all the things that existed that I didn't even know before. And I'm sure you had a similar experience through the through the CFP program. But I think it's uh that's an important uh aspect of of looking for a guide. I mean, I I I I think at at RW we we try to bring wisdom, and and wisdom is this combination of of experience mixed with humility. Uh and we talk about the you know, the care skill and caution we bring to relationships based on our experience and education. So yeah, we want to have industry best credentials and education, but man, we have to have we have to have some gray hair and and some humility. So any last words on any of that?

SPEAKER_02

I think I would just add, um, I don't have all the answers. And and and you just I I think summarize that. Um, you know, oftentimes when we go through some advanced training, we realize what we don't know. But also having the perspective of, I will find out that answer. Like who should I talk to? Who should I connect you with? Um and and being humble enough to make those phone calls, you know, understand, hey, this is something I haven't seen before. And I think that's what's really special about RW is um we often are sitting in a meeting with our advisors. Hey, I have this situation come up. Have you seen this before? So good. And often uh collectively, one of us have been through something similar. So we can help point them in the right direction. Let's let's call this other professional, let's let's do this. Um, so I think that's so important is still the shared experience, um, the shared wisdom. Uh, back to you know, being humble enough. I don't have all the answers. I could probably find the answer.

SPEAKER_01

But that's a steward, right? Yeah. Hey, team, I I don't know, but I have to do what's best for this client. Help me serve them well. That's really beautiful. And I know we said we'd wrap up, but I do have a question, like as a mom who just dropped off this beautiful girl at school. Yes. What would you say to a young lady who came to you and said, Hey, Mrs. Vachek, what would you say to me? I'm thinking about going into finance. I don't know anything about this. What would you say to a young lady who is interested in the financial industry?

SPEAKER_02

Um, I would say jump in. I think you can do hard things. And oftentimes, um, again, I I don't know why, but oftentimes I've seen it with my young daughters. You get to a certain point in school and they start opting out of certain classes. Yeah. But I constantly remind them, like, lean into that. You can do hard things. And then I also, at least in our area of finance, we're so blessed. Um, yes, there's so many important things that happen behind the scenes that are numbers, it's data. And that is very important, but it's um it's the human piece. So connection. I would encourage any uh young individuals today to go do some job shadowing, find some people in the community, find mentors, look for internship opportunities. I think the more uh real life experiences you can have, the better. Um, as I mentioned, my story, I mean that's how I fell into this career was I'm thankful I had a professor that asked some of those questions and then I happened upon it, you know, a job shadow that turned into a job. And so I think um just be open. And then the other piece of advice, which my mom gave me, uh, which I try to tell my children to, no job is beneath you. So just realizing that where you start is not where you end. And but jump in and be willing to do whatever, even if you think you're overqualified for it. Be willing to file paperwork, be willing to scan documents, be willing to do things that fill beneath your qualifications, but no job is beneath you. So it does come back to that humility. I was just kind of humility is really important. Humility.

SPEAKER_01

And I guarantee you, when you're scanning those documents, when you're filing that paperwork, you'll learn something you didn't know in your open. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I've typed data into a DOS system for two years.

SPEAKER_02

Yes, you got really good.

SPEAKER_00

That's right.

SPEAKER_02

Tiki.

SPEAKER_00

Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02

Thank you. That was fun. Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00

Thank you for listening to the Worth Beyond Wealth podcast. If you liked this podcast, please like, share, and subscribe. The highest compliment you could give would be sharing this with a friend. Thank you. The opinions expressed in this program are for general informational purposes only and are not intended to provide specific advice or recommendations for any individual or any specific security. RW Investment Management LLC, DBARW Investment Management, is a registered investment advisor. Testimonials given by current clients are not in exchange for compensation. This document is solely for informational purposes. Advisory services are only offered to clients or prospective clients where RWIM and its representatives are properly licensed or exempt from licensure. Past performance is no guarantee of future returns. Investing involves risk and possible loss of principal capital. No advice may be rendered by RWIM unless a client service agreement is in place. RWIM is not a legal or tax advisor.