The CEO's Guide to Building a Company That Lasts | Ep. 96 [Emir Avdic]

What separates companies that simply survive from those that continue to grow for decades? In this thought-provoking episode of Industry Ignited, Dr. Leeanne Aguilar welcomes Emir Avdic, President and CEO of Sebright Products Inc., for an in-depth conversation about leadership, innovation, employee ownership, and building organizations where people genuinely care about the company's success. Emir explains how international experience, strategic thinking, and a people-first mindset have helped transform Seabright into a stronger, more connected business while tackling some of the world's biggest recycling and sustainability challenges.

Throughout the episode, you'll learn why communication is every leader's greatest tool, how hiring for adaptability can outperform hiring for experience, and why empowering employees to think like owners creates stronger teams and better business results. From AI and predictive maintenance to company culture and long-term strategy, this episode is packed with valuable takeaways for leaders in every industry. Watch until the end to discover actionable leadership lessons that can help you build a business and a team that lasts.

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Transcript

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 0:04

What if solving waste and recycling challenges is not just about better equipment, but about better leadership, smarter systems, and a culture where every employee thinks like an owner. Welcome to Industry Ignited. I'm Dr. Lianne Aguilar, and today I'm joined by Amir Avdic, President and CEO of Seabright Products. Amir, welcome to the show.

SPEAKER_00 0:25

Good morning, Lianne. Good to be here. Thank you.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 0:28

Yeah, well, thank you for joining me. Now, Amir, you were born in Bosnia, grew up in Germany, studied in the United States, and built a career working across cultures, languages, and industries. How did that international journey shape the leader you are today?

SPEAKER_00 0:43

It is a lot, isn't it? For most people, especially in West Michigan, where I'm located, they're quite interested in the whole story. But talking about leadership, um, I always get back to the common sense. What is it actual common sense to people, and that it's always cultural. Um, imagine you know, you live in four different countries and different continents by the age of 20 and learn different cultures and languages, then the perception of common sense really changes. And you know, sometimes you struggle with what is really common sense in this area. Right. Um, but definitely when you spend time in different cultures, religions, um, work with different people, study different languages, study different materials, uh, the brain starts to think a little bit differently and gives you different perspectives uh to look at things differently uh than most people do in the world. And honestly, I've been very appreciative and fortunate enough to be able to do that. Um, and the life I've been given. So it shapes it in a way, in a very, very positive way.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 1:51

Yeah, that's a good point though. Common sense. I mean, common, it has to be common to that area. So common sense is gonna differ depending on on where you're at culturally in the world. And I've never thought about that before. It's interesting.

SPEAKER_00 2:07

It really is. I mean, common sense in Michigan is a little bit different than what common sense is in Texas, where you were sitting, right?

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 2:12

Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's what's common to that specific area, that culture, that uh religion, like you said, or or you know, different country. Yeah. So now you started in global trade consulting, market entry strategy, and supply chain optimization before stepping into manufacturing leadership. What drew you from advising companies into actually leading one?

SPEAKER_00 2:37

You know, uh in my my background, my background, I could I'm always thinking like I'm 46 now, right? So I'm kind of planning like, what am I gonna do when I get a little bit older and I want to settle down? I'm like, do I want to go back to teaching? And you usually, you know, my previous professors, they're like, well, I used to do it, I can't do it anymore, and I got back to teaching. Um, I don't know if I want to do that, but um it was the opportunity within Seabre Products uh that really presented itself uh to be part of a team and a part of an opportunity in an industry that sometimes does get neglected, especially in this um part of the world. Um and then also Seabrite products used to be my uh customer in the consulting side. So I really got to know the owners of Seabrite. We became really good friends uh through the consulting time over three, four, five years. And the two gentlemen that ran the company and three of them that owned the company really became more like family to me than anything else. Um, and that kind of led from hey, do I want to be in 24 countries on a yearly basis, run different four, five different projects per year, run different companies to I got kids now, they're growing up, I want to spend more time with them. I love West Michigan. Um, it was a lot of different things that really contributed to the uh part of what we want to call it settling down a little bit.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 4:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:08

Um, but it was also easier to you know handle one company versus four at the same time that I was used to at that time. And life gets pretty chaotic when you're uh between Europe and the US every other week, and you have four different companies that you're focusing on for a year and then you're switching to four new ones. Um but it was really the company itself, the people that are at Seabry Products, the long strategic growth of the opportunities that the company had and the products we have.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 4:42

Yeah, right. So I'm hearing like the opportunity really presented itself at the right time, but developed over years of relationships and just your experience working with the company as like you said, they were your client to begin with.

SPEAKER_02 4:56

Exactly. Exactly.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 4:58

So you've worked in multinationals across dozens of countries on process improvement, lean, and operational strategy. What lessons from those international experiences prepared you for Seabright?

SPEAKER_00 5:11

There is a million of them, right? Um, but when you really considered from process improvement and lean, they kind of like go hand in hand. Um, where operational strategy is a little bit different. Uh, we've touched a little bit on the culture side too. So I used to run projects in different countries in Europe. And Europe is obviously different, a lot different than the United States or Canada. Uh yes, you have a little bit different accents between Texas and Michigan. You have, you know, the South, the North, but in Europe it's a whole different culture, whole different language, a whole different way of doing things. And you know, when you put it in perspective, going from Germany to Italy, it's like traveling from Grand Rapids, Michigan to an Indiana, driving two hours, and everything is different, right? Everything is different. Uh, that really prepares you to, again, think about things differently on how you approach things. But it always comes down to people. Um, there is regardless of the culture, the industry, um, the language people speak, how they go about doing business, at the end of the day, people want to be happy, they want to provide for themselves and their families, they want to have good careers. Um, for a company that's looking to you know implement any of these strategies or do things internationally or get into manufacturing, it really comes down to a few things. And one of those things is the people that you choose to represent you um to execute your strategies. Uh, in the consulting side, uh we used to publish papers um um advising companies on what to do. And I I specifically remember one I worked on is how to pick the proper management to execute your international strategy because that was the most important part. Uh, reason behind it is you can the strategy has to be developed obviously beforehand. Again, whether you're in manufacturing, you're going international, you want to do exporting, you're in sales, it doesn't really matter, but your strategy has to be developed beforehand. Uh, but if that person that's executing that strategy is not not up to the task, then the strategy will not work. It doesn't matter what you do with the strategy. However, if you have a bad strategy, the person that you have running that strategy and executing it for you will fix that strategy alongside with you as they go along uh through the execution process.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 7:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:54

So if I had to wrap up all my international experience in the past 20 years, whether that is in consulting, manufacturing, um, and I worked with automotive industry, aerospace, furniture, you know, top hundred companies in the United States, across Europe, um, it really comes on to the people, the people you choose to represent you, and I always refer to the word as ambassadors of your organization. Um, that is the most important part.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 8:28

Right. Yeah, I can see that. And and like you said, choosing the wrong person, it's a good strategy, it's not gonna fix the wrong person. But if you bring the right person in, even if the strategy is off, if there are gaps, if you know they can see that and they'll bring that to your attention, they'll modify the strategy in order to make it better. So yeah, that's important. You go first. Yeah. So once you're oh I would tell people look for a McGyver.

SPEAKER_00 8:56

I don't know if you ever watched the show MacGyver. That was in the 90s when I was growing up in Germany. That was a big show. And when you look for a person, always look for a McGiver.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 9:06

Yeah. Oh, I know. Yeah, he was he was brilliant in fixing everything with like duct tape or bubblegum or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 9:13

Exactly. Yeah.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 9:16

So when Seabright first engaged you for international expansion, did you ever imagine you would one day be leading the entire company?

SPEAKER_00 9:24

No, no, not at all, honestly speaking. Um I um I love what I did. I love the chaos of execution on the uh consulting side. And we were always hands-on consultants and was not um, you know, we did not just draft papers and present it to our customers and say, hey, this is how you do it. We created a strategy, we negotiated on with countries on behalf of our customers where to put facilities for them. We uh went on the actual boots on the ground in Europe, we would build those facilities, help them build it, set up warehousing, um, and we would really run it for a certain period of time, one, two, three years, and then we would hand it over. And I love that chaos. I love the detective work, I love building out the strategies to fix problems. Um, I loved saving jobs. We had contracts with uh certain states like California on layoff aversion programs where the state would hire us to come in and fix companies up so that they do not lay people off. And I love that aspect of the job because, again, you know, I was raised across different countries, across different cultural barriers, and that was always appealing to me because that's what really that's where you meet the most amazing people on this planet and you can learn from.

SPEAKER_02 10:47

Right.

SPEAKER_00 10:48

Um the part of settling down, I guess it just came with age a little bit, you know, when you turn 40, things change for you. So um, no, to answer your question, never really thought about it, but you never know where the next opportunity lies or how things change in your life.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 11:03

Right. Yeah, and so I think uh like I or I guess did your childhood or your or your experiences you know help shape that love for change and for you know working with chaos? Or do you think you always had you know that inclination and your um experiences growing up just help you manage them better?

SPEAKER_00 11:25

Well, I grew up in a war in Bosnia. I spent two years in a war, so I'm sure that the chaos comes from that. Um but I think it's just I'm a little bit OCD as well. That's why lean uh and processes and you know detective work make a lot of sense to me. Uh my desk has to be a certain way, otherwise I'm I can't think. Uh I have to make decisions with numbers because I don't believe in gut feelings. Uh, certain people are really good at it. I just love to do the detective work and to strategize and plan. Um, but I do believe that yes, your background, your bigger cultural experiences definitely shape as to who you are. Um, in one of my previous jobs, we used to take personality tests every year just to see how your personality changes as you grow and as you learn. And honestly, it is pretty amazing. Um, even if you just use the Strength Finder 2.0, which is pretty simple to use, 40, 40 plus questions, and you test yourself over years, you will see that every person changes.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 12:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:37

And that has a lot to do with the environment that you live in and the people that you deal with. Um, growing up in Germany, it's a whole different culture than Bosnia. You learn different skill sets, you learn different ways of thinking, you learn, you know, the data. You know, everybody knows Germans think 10 times before they make a decision. I'm sure that's where my stuff comes from because I spent eight, nine years over there, went through middle school and high school. Um, and then I came to the United States where things are again done differently. Um, did my studies in international business and then worked in currency trading for almost a decade and then got into MBA and consulting and all those things as you grow and deal with different people, as long as you have an open mind, you can learn a lot. And by learning, it will change you.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 13:26

Yeah. Yeah, you make a good point. And so, how often would you say, or do you take personality tests, or would you say people should take personality checks tests in order to see that progression?

SPEAKER_00 13:37

So I truly, truly believe in these personality tests. So when we hire people at Seabried Products, we have them take the it's simple, it's free. Strength Finder 2.0. We use that. I believe it's 45 questions. Uh, it gives us a really good idea of what type of person we're dealing with: introverted, extroverted, do they make decisions with their gut or do they you know have feelings? Do they not necessarily that you wouldn't hire a person with a certain skill set that you're not looking for? It just lets us know. Everybody knows in this company, we have a database where you can go and take a look what that person's personality is. And we even have fun with it, right? And during our meetings, we will bring it up and have fictional characters, and so mine turns out to be Darth Vader. Uh, so I have a whole bunch of things in my office that people will just drop off because it is Darth Vader, right? They're just having fun with it. Uh, but I do take it every year, and I've been doing that since 2008, I believe. And so I used to do take disc profiles and then switch to the FRIM One. And now for the past 10 years or so, I'm just stuck on a Strength Finder 2.0 just because it's easier to do, and it's really gonna be a quick overview. But when you bring people in um to the team, you want to make sure that they have at least something in common, right? You don't want to put an accountant or a person that has accounting personality with somebody in sales, right? Extroverted person who's a go-getter, competitive, you know, they're they're joking, and then you have the accounting person that's a bit more introverted. Um, you know, they make decisions with with numbers. Um, they might not be as outspoken, they're not gonna click. So we use that to our advantage when we hire people, and our turnover is really, really low. But we lose it.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 15:35

That's so interesting. Yeah, just intentionally right, matching personalities and bringing people based on their fit with the specific type of position and and with other people that they're they'll be working with. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

I also I mean, I believe that you hire for people for their uh potential, not necessarily their experience. So that gives us another venue to look at, okay, when you hire somebody and you lay out a three-year plan in front of them and said, I'm I'm hiring for this position, and this position is going to advance to here, how does that look to you? And then you match it up with personality tests and the team, and we also involve five, six people that they would be working with to actually make a decision whether we hire that person or we don't. Uh, and then obviously democracy wins. Um it really helps. It really does.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 16:27

So you've been taking the personality tests yearly since 2008. You mentioned so have you seen like as your personality evolved? Um and you know, what have you seen, I guess, as it's evolved? And do you do things like if you see it going in one direction, um, do you uh do things intentionally to like redirect yourself if you're wanting to develop certain other skills?

SPEAKER_00 16:51

I don't do it intentionally, but you will do it anyway.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

Because you're not in control of the of your of your emotions, right? I mean, we try to be.

SPEAKER_02 17:01

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 17:02

We try we're all humans, right? We all have emotions, we all have feelings, we all get hurt, we all uh go home and take the work in our heads with us. We bring stuff from home to the workplace, whether it's good or bad. Um, but over the years, and again, it could be the personality test, it could be the age, it could be the experience, it could be a lot of different things, but as I age, I also realize that I'm not as I wouldn't call it aggressive, but you you think before you speak more often. Um, and that does go back to my personality test because when I review it, um you you can see how it shifts, right? So I started implementing something about two years ago, five to ten second rule um on before responding. If I don't like something, take a deep breath, take a deep breath, sit there and just look. And sometimes, honestly, the psychological aspect of it will work on people as well, and they will rephrase their questions, they will try to explain, and you haven't said anything, and they give you actually more information that if you just had an outburst that comes out of you and you say, Well, I don't like this, or you know, you start getting into criticism or whatever whatever else. So it does help as long as you think about it and as long as you take it seriously.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 18:30

Yeah, no, I think that's a a good strategy. Yeah, just pause two to five seconds, like you said, take a deep breath. That's always really good, and then respond. I mean, I've uh like in the last year, did uh done a lot of coaching um uh training. And one program I went through was on emotional intelligence, and they you know, bring, you know, suggest and bring up a lot of breathing and stuff, and um work on myself even to not be as reactive and so and to not be reactive, again, it's it's pausing, taking a breath, waiting before you respond, and and it makes a huge difference, yeah. So I think it's just one of those things you have to identify and then intentionally you know work on. Wow. Seabright's been designing and manufacturing waste handling and recycling equipment for over four decades. For listeners who may not know the industry well, what problem does Seabright solve and why do those solutions matter so much today?

SPEAKER_00 19:30

What we design is really uh customer-specific, tailored to our customers. Um we make equipment that is focused specifically on recycling and trash solutions. We work with cities, we work with private companies, we work with you know top 100 organizations in the world. Uh we sell equipment to them. But really, our focus, if I had to narrow it down, it would be on cost reduction and profitability on recycling itself. So we've we focus on the ROIs specifically, so we will work with waste haulers that are in every town of this country, and we will design and make equipment for them that reduces the amount of runs that they have to use or do with their uh trucks when they pick up your uh residential or uh commercial trash. We also then work with these companies that provide equipment where they separate out the trash and what can be recycled and what can't be recycled, what goes into landfills. We try to do a landfill aversion, obviously, with and this is one of the reasons why I love Seabright, is we want to leave this world better than we found it when we leave. And with the global warming and with everything that's currently going on, whether you believe in warming or the climate change or not, not really the point, but I can feel it in Michigan. Uh, we just talked earlier about how we don't have spring anymore. It's either winter or it's summer. Right. Yeah. Um but we can see that there is um pollution in the world. We can see that the waterways across the world are being polluted with trash bottles. So that is what we focus on. We focus on equipment that helps our customers to divert for throwing waste or putting it into ground, where we then you know end up with PFAS, we end up with these chemicals in the waterways. Uh, we have companies in Michigan being shut down, huge companies because of PFAS pollution. We have equipment that deals with that. But really, it comes down to the ROIs and making sense to companies that instead of throwing and paying the disposal company to take your trash and put it in the ground somewhere in the United States, Canada, or Mexico, or the world, because we sell worldwide. How about we create equipment for you that will actually Generate return on investment for you. And then you can sell that product so that you can make more bottles or bags or different products out of it. And that is really our value proposition to our customers. Now, you know, with oil going on right now, the straight of Vermous being closed and all these things, obviously oil is going up, which means gasoline is going up. Um, when you have equipment that will take 50 semi-trucks and condense it down into one, that is what we do.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 22:34

Wow. Yeah. So like you said, really making processes and more efficient and uh return on investment a lot greater over time because yeah, politics aside trash is is an issue. We you know, we see it like the oceans, you know, and and waterways, like you said, have a lot of pollution and it's not you know going away. It's only as we become more and more of a disposable society, you know, trash is only uh increasing. So it's uh it will never go away. It won't go go away. You're right. Now your product portfolio is unusually broad from compactors and balers to wastewater and dewatering systems. How has that diversity become a strategic advantage for Seabright?

SPEAKER_00 23:20

That's a really good question. Um so the gentleman that started the company um 40 plus years ago, um they were always they started with compactors, which is a simple, simple product group that we did for uh one of the largest rental companies in the United States. And being really customer focused with engineering in mind, we would get customers that would come in and say, hey, listen, I have this problem, can you find a solution for me? And we would do prototyping, we would figure the problem out. Uh, we had a manufacturing skill set, we had the brains behind it, we had engineering. So we would create these product lines for customers, and then we would realize that there's an actually a bigger issue across the world that could use the same solution. And we would adapt and change and do different things. So, right now we have 12 different product lines. Um, there's two product lines that we bring in from Europe that are maybe available here, but not really. Uh, just because Europe is a little bit more ahead of us when it comes to recycling and you know, a version from landfills and things are more expensive. I mean, I just spoke with a guy in Munich this morning. He said a gallon of diesel is about twelve dollars per gallon.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 24:37

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 24:38

Oh wow. Yeah, when you're dealing with costs like that, uh, you start to really use trash to burn it to uh create energy and use it as gas. So Europeans are a lot more um innovative when it comes to that because again, they have costs. They don't have a lot of land like we do in the United States. So throughout the years, Seabread Products has really um done really well on having that pride in helping customers out, and that just led from one product group to the next to the next to the next, and now we make 10 ourselves here in uh in Michigan.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 25:15

Yeah. Well, and having that international background, though, I think that helps you look for or problems or solve problems in unique ways and look for solutions in in places where you know people without that experience might not look. And that's interesting, yeah. So Steve Wright's mission is centered on solving waste and recycling challenges through innovative in an engineering and manufacturing. Where do you see the greatest need right now in the market?

SPEAKER_00 25:44

That is that is a lot of a question. We have honestly right now, I think we're at 45 different projects that we're working on. Um if I had to summarize it, um I think that the um landfill aversion of trash is is a huge, huge problem. Um large states with a lot of population on the East Coast and West Coast, obviously they do not have land. Right. I met with California about a month ago, and they're shipping trash from Los Angeles, Southern California into Arizona right now. Really? Yeah, because they can't put it anywhere. You have New York City that has literally trains leaving every single day the city that will go into different states because they don't know what to do with the trash. And it's just train after train, train after train.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 26:45

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 26:45

So landfill aversion and having smaller segments of what they call material recovery facilities to do more recycling. Okay, to um really make people aware, and especially cities that are running, people that are running these cities, that there's other solutions out there that you can utilize uh and actually make money at it. So that's one aspect. The other one is the plastics recycling. So recycling, uh, we met with the state of Michigan a couple of weeks ago as well. Um, and there are certain coalitions that we have in the state that really influence the um legislative side of the of the government, trying to you know do some research and figure out what are we doing in Michigan that we could be doing better so that um you know we are not putting hundreds, thousands of tons of trash every single year into the ground because we know that at some point in time all that is going to come back to us and it's gonna haunt our next generations. We see it right now with PFAS going on. And PFAS is another aspect. It's basically a chemical that's in your water waste that kills us if you drink it. And we have that pollution pretty much in every single state. We rent out equipment that deals with that. It goes literally from the East Coast all the way up to Alaska. We rent it out, we sell it, we we put it in for our customers, for the government US government uses us as well. Right. Um, and then also the CO2 emission reduction. That's that's a huge thing. Again, leading back to global warming, the things that are happening. Um, having less trucks on the road doesn't just help you with your road rage, right?

unknown 28:32

Right.

SPEAKER_00 28:32

But it also helps with with everything else that's going on around us, and it saves companies money.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 28:40

Now that you are mentioning the PFATs, which I think are known as the forever chemicals, right? So it's like they actually never leave your your body, your system. And um, you know, it's it's yeah, they accumulate and can cause a lot of a lot of harm and and they're um toxic. And uh I mean they're pretty much in uh all of all plastics, right? From what I understand, at some degree, including drinking water. Drinking the ones you drink from.

SPEAKER_00 29:09

So it's plastic, it's so think of it this way you put a whole bunch of bunch of trash or a lot of trash in the ground. That trash is gonna decompose. Some does, some doesn't. With that decomposition, and I'm not a chemist, so please don't take it that way, but this is what I learned. Uh, with that happening, water will always find its way to go somewhere, and usually into streams, which are deep, deep underground that we can't, you know, we usually don't check, and then it will bubble up. And all those chemicals that mix together could cause us cancers, it'd cause us, I mean, a lot, a lot of different issues.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 29:48

A lot of issues, wow. So sustainability is clearly at the core of your work. How do you help customers see waste handling and recycling equipment not as a cost center, but as an investment with real return on environmental impact?

SPEAKER_00 30:02

That's exactly what we do. So we we have customers that we go to. Um I'm gonna pick on top three automotive industry in the United States that we're currently have been working with, but we're expanding on that. And we showcase them, whether that's a big company or a small company, exactly the products they're using, the processes they're uh utilizing in their facilities. Um we analyze their costs, we see what goes into landfills, what's being recycled, how much do they actually pay to dispose of these products, what can be sold off, and then we will pitch them with numbers with an ROI calculator, and we will say, hey, it will cost you this much to buy this machine, and it will cost over so many months or years, usually never more than a year. Um this is what you will generate back. And when you run the numbers, depending on who you're talking to, if I'm talking to a maintenance person, they're not gonna care about the numbers. What they care about is I have a process flow problem in my facility. I have just truckloads of cardboard sitting in one corner. I don't know what to do with. Um, but if I'm talking to the CFO, or if our people are talking to the CFO, those numbers will click with the CFO and they will find ways to work with us just to make that happen. We also run the costs, all right, to find uh find ways to help the customer sometimes on the ROI. So if they, for example, if they use EPS foam and they don't know what to do with it, we have waste and and and potential buyers that will come in and buy that foam off them instead of just disposing it. Think of it this way you're paying probably you know thousands and thousands of dollars a year to dispose of EPS foam just so people can put it underground. When you could be making 25 to 35 cents a pound to get rid of it, and we have equipment that could be less than three months that really pays itself off, and the equipment will last 20 years.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 32:09

Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:11

So running the numbers, running the processes, showcasing to customers what value we bring. Hey, and if we find out it does not work, it doesn't work. It's okay.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 32:20

Yeah. So I'm hearing like part of the of what you do then is educate your customers and not only that, but run the numbers, help work with them on the financial side to create a solution that's really economically uh sound as well.

SPEAKER_00 32:34

Correct. Yeah. Always comes down to the dollars.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 32:38

Right. Yeah, it does.

SPEAKER_00 32:39

Yeah.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 32:40

Now when when you stepped into Sea Bright, you inherited a company with strong roots, but also silos, disconnected systems, and cultural barriers. What did you see as that first uh challenge that we really needed to be addressed?

SPEAKER_00 32:55

Yeah, that was five years ago now. Um communication. Um, if I truly thought about it, which still you can never improve on communication. Um but it was really communication that was the first thing. Um I knew Seabrite from before, I knew the owners, amazing people. I knew a little bit about the departments and who you know how they how they deal uh and work and how they build the equipment, but really getting down into the uh trenches and trying to figure out um what's truly the biggest barrier to people. I remember one of the first things I did was a survey when I came in as a consultant. And I wrote up 30 questions on happiness, on what do you need at your job, on do you feel like you're being compensated properly? Um how is your vacation? Um just a lot of random questions that people would not put their name on, and they would just take it and put it in a box that only I had a key to, and I've asked everybody to do that. And then I've spent about two weeks deciphering all the things and running a word cloud on it, trying to understand what was the biggest biggest issue within the organization itself that the employees thought was the biggest issue. Not the owners, but the employees. I have the owner's side because they will tell me, you know, in a conference room what their issues are, but getting the employees to open up to somebody it is really hard, especially the owners of the company. They will never do that.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 34:34

Right, of course, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 34:36

Yeah, but that's where the consulting people come in, and you know, when you really have unbiased mentality, whether that is the owner or the employees, and you're just trying to solve a problem, and you let people know that hey, I'll I'm gonna get paid either way, as I'm doing this. To me, it doesn't matter, but you might want to take the opportunity to actually make a difference for yourself. People didn't buy into it right away. So I did it again three months. I waited three months, I did it again. In the meantime, it gave me some opportunities to make implement some changes across the board in every department for the better for the employees. Give some raises, um, identify some tools that they needed, update new computers, roll out new carts, just simple stuff that would really give people the chance to say, hey, we did this once and I actually got something out of it. So when I give it to them again in three months, right? You got the garret and the stick. I like the carrot.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 35:35

Exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:37

When I do it again in three months, they're gonna be a lot more open. So we just I just kept doing that. Kept doing that. I think I did that for three years, every six months.

SPEAKER_02 35:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:48

And communication was was one of the biggest problems all the time. So internal, external with customers. We also had um a lack of systems. We had systems, um, but they were not the systems that really gave us a full picture as to what's going on. So, systems to make sure we have on-time deliveries to our customers, that is a number one thing, which our on-time delivery at that time was not greatest because it was right after COVID. Um, quality and processes, specifically for quality, on how we implementing a shop system between different departments. Uh, we rolled out CRMs and ERP systems, and then the culture, right? So with the communication goes the culture. So as you're working other things out, culture never leaves your site because that's the most important thing that we have. I can have ERP systems, I can have CRMs, I can hire smart people, I can put quality processes in place. But if people don't really buy into the culture of a family-owned business and they feel like they're part of it, um, it will never work.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 36:55

Yeah. But you're right. And yeah, you bring up a really good point. The communication is always an issue because I mean, there's always a, I guess, a power difference. And employees, I mean, I've experienced this myself as a business owner, that no matter how you know warm and inviting you are and encouraging for people to share things, because of that power difference, they will withhold and they don't tell you everything. And you end up hearing it about it later from you know, like from somebody else who heard it from somebody else, and who ultimately tells you, and then you go to that person, and then they, you know, they're still not, even though you address them and you're like, please tell me. They still don't share freely necessarily. Um, but yeah, I guess establishing a culture that does encourage that where they feel like okay, they are heard, and like you said, the carrot and the stick for you know, if they do share it, then they are rewarded, and then that leads to more to more openness. Um, but but it can be can be a challenge. Uh, yeah, definitely.

SPEAKER_00 38:01

So it's a good idea. I don't know where I read it, or even if I read it, or how I came about it, but I had this idea maybe like two years into it, when we were in meetings, that people would not open up. They would call for a meeting, but they wouldn't, they would just sit there and be like, okay, well, you're the boss, if you will. Exactly. The issue like that, you fix it for me. And I'm like, how how would you get people to actually own up to the meeting and actually speak up? So I came up with the idea in a conference room. We have a gavel with a hammer, like a judge. Uh-huh.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 38:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:35

And if you call a meeting, that's your meeting. And all the titles go out the window.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 38:40

Awesome.

SPEAKER_00 38:42

So whoever runs the meeting gets the gavel, they're in charge. And I don't care if you're a C-level executive or you're a maintenance person or you're the salesperson or install crew or in the manufacturing floor, in that meeting, you are the boss. Right? It is your meeting. And that really, I I think people make fun of it sometimes. They're like, oh, what's the gavel for? I'm like, everybody knows here what the gavel is for. But it it really works, right? It's the find a system that makes people people feel safe and they know that you as a human being are not going to come after them just because they spoke up.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 39:19

Right. And does it work there? Are do people like lower um people with you know lower um on the totem pole, I guess you would. I mean, I don't want to like um around the chart, yeah. Does it work? Yeah, who aren't in charge, who don't have aren't the executives, do they initiate meetings?

SPEAKER_00 39:37

Yes, they do actually. They do. Um they initiate meetings. Some people use the gavel, some feel silly, right? But I think we're at a point now that they know, hey, if I um if I call this meeting, if we're in a meeting, everybody wants me to speak up because if I don't speak up, somebody's gonna call me out and be like, what do you think? And I do that to people all the time. Especially I love to do that to new people that we bring on the board.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 39:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:00

When we have new hires, so we'll go through it and I'll usually have them shadow me for three, four, or five months, depending on the position. Um, and they'll go to meetings with me, and in that meeting, I will ask them for a specific reason because they're new, they bring a new, fresh perspective. I'm looking at this for six months for this specific problem. At some point in time, it all starts looking the same. And you come to um a halt. When you bring a person in that has zero experience in a problem, kind of like a child, right? You bring a child, a 10-year-old in, and you say, These are my issues, listen to that kid because it's probably going to be the solution, whatever that kid tells you. It usually is the simplest solution to any problem.

SPEAKER_02 40:46

Right.

SPEAKER_00 40:47

And I love doing that because then I get a perspective from people that are not biased in any way.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 40:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:52

And they actually give you the straight, honest answer. So we try to encourage people to speak up. There's no wrong answers.

unknown 41:00

Right.

SPEAKER_00 41:00

And make decisions. If you make a decision, even if it's a wrong one, it's okay. Just please make one.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 41:05

Make one, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:06

Yeah.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 41:07

Now you've helped guide Seabright into becoming a 100% employee-owned company. Why was that transition so important? And how has employee ownership changed the culture and performance of the business?

SPEAKER_00 41:21

Yeah, ESAP was a huge deal for us. Uh, so that is employee style option ownership. Every employee owns um Seabried products. There are certain companies out there that are a certain percentage, you have to be minimum 30% owned by ASAP, rest of it to be owned by one person or somebody else. We are 100% employee-owned. I believe we are the only company in our industry that is an actual ESOP company. Um, but to answer your question, um, again, the people that started Seabright, um, that ran Seabrite, that made Seabrite what Seabrite is today. We're in small town Hopkins in western Michigan. Everything is local. People know each other. They still have the values of human connection. They have the values of handshakes. They want to make sure jobs stay here. We have 120 employees. We've been here for 40 years. Uh they don't want the uh PE firm to come in and split up all the different product lines and you know, send it off somewhere else. They want it to leave a legacy behind. Um so all of these things really, when I came in, was okay, what is the transition going to look like from us to what do we do next? And we explored a few different options, but really ESOP to make sure that Seabright stays where it's at and that the profitability goes back to all the employees, not just few, was the final decision that that is what we wanted to do. Now, when it comes to culture and how ESOP affects culture, honestly speaking, we have not seen it yet because we have I'm sure it is there. Okay. We talk about it, we every three months we have town hall meetings, we talk about the ESOP, but we just rolled out ESOP April 1st of 2025. And as you go through ESOP, obviously the stocks are being issued, but because we just bought it, the stock value is still pretty low, so people don't see the financial uh gains, but we try to educate them, we try to explain how this works. Again, this is all based on models, financial models that we put together. If we do this, this will happen. If we do this, this will happen. Um, but we have been working on the culture, right? I've been uh pushing the culture for the past five years because I think to me, the e sub side makes the most sense. Now we talked about cultures, we Talk about living in different places, right? Um like I grew up in Western Europe, it's a social democracy. So ESOP makes one million percent to me, right? As a person, as where we want to go with business, as how do we want to take care of our employees, we as a group, the collective, because one person can do everything themselves. Seabrite products would not be here if it was just Brent Seabright, Dave Seabright, or Lee Murray. It would not be here if it's just me. Uh, every person has a place, and every person should be part owner. And that was really the drive to get us to an eSOP. But I I do see that there is um a benefit in eSOP, and I'm sure, I'm sure it affects us on a daily basis because I hear it from people saying, well, we're we're employees now, and the nice part is that they hold each other accountable because they're looking at it a little bit differently now. And that's the nice part about e-sop. Now you can't go overboard, right? Because people can start getting into arguments, and we go to eSOP conferences and they have all these horror stories. As soon as we turn an eSop, um, a couple of the executives and myself went to this conference just to learn as to how you know what is the culture like in an eSOP company? And I didn't want to hear the good, I want to hear the bad. Tell me the bad stuff. Like, what did you do that really went horribly wrong? Because I don't want to do that.

SPEAKER_02 45:31

Right.

SPEAKER_00 45:32

So, and that was really it was a communication to the employees as to what does this truly mean. Yes, you're an employee, uh, you're you're an owner of a company, but you're also an employee. There's still things that you have to do, you still have to show up to work, you have to act a certain way. You can't just, you know, just simply walking around rude and telling people, you know, whatever you want. There's actually more responsibility on you now, but there's also the financial gain and the part of feeling like an owner of the company and the respect. And people really take pride in that. And I believe that our team has done a great job rolling it out, explaining it to people, educating our partners here at Seabry Products, all of us, on you know what this means to them, how this is going to go forward, how as a collective we need to act. And that again, not just a sales team, but everybody is uh an ambassador of Seabray Products. So whether you are on a call, you're talking to a customer, you're sitting in a restaurant, you're you're in a church, you're you know attending school uh events, you're representing all of us. So we all have to act accordingly, and people really try to take pride in that. We have rolled out t-shirts where it says Seabre products, I'm an owner of CBRET products, you know, with our logos, and people love those t-shirts because they truly, truly take pride in it.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 47:00

Yeah. Wow, yeah. So I'm really hearing being intentional with the communication and then just doing things to help. I mean, people see that they are owners and being part owner in a company really means that they have to act as a unified organization too. And uh it doesn't mean that you could just sit back on your lower rules and connect the you know, collect the profits, it means that you're actually invested. So that means you actually have to, you know, work work harder more intentionally and as a team member.

SPEAKER_00 47:31

Yes, it's all about the team.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 47:34

Now you've also implemented systems like ERP and brought more structure, visibility, and accountability into the business. How did those operational changes unlock profitability and growth?

SPEAKER_00 47:47

Um, so with an ERP system, I I in my consulting days, I think this was the 14th time I rolled out an ERP system in the company. And this was the easiest. Um, maybe because I had the experience, but also I had a really great team that that helped me out. Um, it gave us a chance to understand the costs because that's what we struggled with. We're a small Midwest company uh that's really out there to focus on the customer, but we forget as to why we're here and what we need to do. So things slip out a little bit. So it gives us a chance to understand the costs, but also understand labor, materials, inventory, uh, which product groups we're profitable in and which we're not. So then that could lead us to we could decide what equipment we want to push based on margins and profitability through marketing and sales. We know that oil gets affected, certain products go up, okay. Products that will affect oil, these are the products that we want to push this year. This is what we want to focus on. It goes vice versa too. Um, we also gave us a chance to understand where to grow sales, you know, when you're talking about CRMs and all of that, which regions we have gaps in, where do we want to hire? Because our we have inside and outside CLT members, so the outside CLT members are customer facing at all times, and they're distributed you know strategically across the United States in different states that they live in. So they're closer to those regions and those customers. Um, but also you utilize market research uh quite a bit, actually. We have two people here that do that quite a bit, just market research on the industry, on where trends are going, on what the government is doing, what the legislation is doing, so that we can understand the state to local rules and regulations that impact our customers. Because obviously, how you deal with recycling in California is a lot different than how you deal with recycling in Alabama. When I put a recycling machine into California, it has to be rated for earthquakes. Nowhere else does it have to happen that, right? So you have to have certain um expectations that the customer is going to have. So um all of that, right? The really the ERP and the systems gave us a huge, huge advantage than what we had prior.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 50:08

Okay. Now, looking ahead, you're focused on growth across the United States, international expansion, robotics, AI, and predictive maintenance. What excites you most about the future of Seabrite?

SPEAKER_00 50:22

So you have all of those. We have some very, very talented people at Seabright. I take pride in seeing those people grow. Um, and you know, I'm really excited what the next 10-15 years hold for those people. From AI, international, manufacturing, you know, lean. International has always been obviously exciting for me. That's what I studied, uh, international business. Um it is exciting because we see issues across the world that nobody's tackling, and we want to tackle those. Again, there's only 120 of us in western Michigan, but we are going after India right now, and we're trying to build equipment in India so that we can uh clean up the waterways with companies in India. And um that happens from Hopkins, Michigan. You would never believe that, but it really does. Um also excited about the AI. Um, I love AI, I'm very geeky in that way, if that's the proper word. Um I always try to um that's my nature to break things down to see how they work, but at the same time try to break the process to see if I can improve it somehow. And AI has helped me tremendously. Actually, I'm attending a friend of mine is throwing an AI conference here in Grand Rapids, Michigan uh next week uh with some executives, and I'm attending that for breakfast and listening about it and trying to learn. Uh, we have a business intelligence manager on staff, uh, an amazing person, uh, goes to a lot of different conferences, learns about it, uh, implements them here. Our CFO really loves AI as well. He's implementing it. So we're trying at the top and trying to figure out what works for us. But um I'm very excited about AI, cautious, but excited. Um, in 2026, we're working on predictive maintenance that we can offer solutions to Fortune 100 companies. Um, I can't reveal too much, but it is something that they are asking for and something that gives them visibility into their facilities, especially when they have hundred facilities worldwide and they want to have visibility into what each visit uh facility has and the throughput, and and they can just bring it up on their phone and they can just scroll through it instead of trying to reach out to 12 different time zones worldwide.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 52:59

Right. Yeah. But wow, I really hear your your passion and commitment though to solving problems worldwide and and being able to approach, you know, um other either whether it's companies or or municipalities or you know, countries with solutions too, because I know I've heard um from others, you know, massive um issues with the trash in like Jakarta, for example, and br Brazil, you know, other parts of the world. So just having that ability to actually have a solution that you can approach um, you know, the the powers that be with you know with the solution is is empowering. That's exciting, inspiring. Thank you. Yeah. Now you've said that your personal growth and success depend on your ability to deal with people. How has that belief shaped your leadership philosophy, especially during times of change?

SPEAKER_00 53:54

I really live by it. I really do. I I do believe that every problem has a solution. Um, and I I'm gonna reference one of my favorite quotes here, okay? It kind of goes hand in hand, but Isaac Newton once said that I can calculate uh the motions of heavenly bodies, right? But not the madness of people. There is always the science behind things, um, but there's also the art behind things. Uh we talked about the personality tests, and you know, I make decisions with with data. That's the science behind it. But that doesn't always paint the full picture. You also have to use the arts, and that's where experience, your your feelings come in. I try not to rely on those as much. I I I do like the science behind it more because it makes me reconfirm my thoughts, and the numbers never lie. Uh but you still have to rely on that too. So it definitely everything that I have done in my life, which, you know, nothing extraordinary, but it always had to deal with people. Always. Um, I don't take things personally when I deal with people. I know it's easier said than done. Uh, but again, living in a lot of different cultures, different countries, speaking different languages, I don't confine myself to one specific country. I I truly believe that I'm a citizen of the world. Hence our strategy and see where products go after the world. I do believe that every country and every culture and every religion really will teach you something. Every person will teach you something, as long as you have an open mind. So it depends on that person that's receiving it. And then, you know, dealing with people, you have to show respect. It's not just given, you have to earn it, but you also have to give it.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 55:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 55:46

So, you know, whether you're dealing with the janitor or the CEO of a company when you're talking to somebody, shake the person's hand, be be nice, be courteous, be respectful, right?

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 55:58

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 55:59

But then also, you gotta have you have to watch out for yourself, you have to stand up for yourself, you have to believe to your core in what you believe in and stick by it. Don't don't give in, right? Um, I learned from one of my previous mentors in my consulting time, um, David Hemmings is his name. One time, I don't even know if he probably would remember this, but one time he told me that, uh, and I wrote it down. He said, watch how people treat you when you say no. Without explaining why you said no, because that is truly the purest form of the truth you will ever see from that person.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 56:40

Wow. Yeah, insightful.

SPEAKER_00 56:44

It really is, right? Um and there's a few nuggets here and there. I have my notebooks that I carry with me, but every time I fill up a notebook, the front page, I have a few different nuggets that I got from a few different people that really keep me in line. And I will always copy and paste those over with my hand. It helps me memorize them too.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 57:02

Yeah. Um great nuggets. Yeah, yeah, awesome. All right. And Amir, finally, for leaders entering manufacturing or stepping into executive roles, what advice would you give about building resilient teams, leading through complexity, and creating a culture that lasts?

SPEAKER_00 57:21

Can never plan enough. Plan, plan, plan. Good strategy is going to work. Uh whether you're in manufacturing, you're stepping into the executive role, um, you know, you're building teams, over-communicate, over-communicate. Let people know. If you're in a meeting, I'm a big fan of Elon Musk, obviously, because the things that he does. Now, politics aside, I don't care about that. I care about the work. Um, if you're in a meeting that's a strategy and it doesn't pertain to you, you can't contribute, please just get up and leave. Go do something that you're good at. Um, treat the janitor, mentioned us, treat the janitor the same as the CEO. I know it's hard to do, but it will pay off. Um hire always for adaptability and learning, not for the experience. Experience is handy. If you hire an engineer, obviously they have to have the engineering background. Uh, it can't be a soccer coach. Yeah. But but there's if you're on a verge, hire for that adaptability and learning. Experience should not be the only thing that you're hiring for. Um I mentioned this before too. Count to five before you respond. Um and I, if I had to say one true thing is if you truly want to be a leader and you want to be um want people to have respect for you, know everybody's job, at least to 75%. When we rolled out the CRM, I actually mapped it, I planned it with my team, I rolled it out. I'm the probably the best person in the whole company that knows our CRM system.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 59:02

Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 59:03

Same thing with the ERP system, right? I have another person. Uh, she is there's probably a few people now that are a lot better than me. But when we started, it was two of us. You gotta know what other people do because that's how you earn respect.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 59:18

Yeah, absolutely. And that's how you can uh I mean, being knowledgeable about um different people's jobs and what they do, and and uh you can understand the systems better, and you can you'll be better at making decisions and and uh yeah. Well, Amir, thank you for joining me. Yeah, fascinating conversation. I learned a lot. Uh, how can listeners learn more about you and Seabright Products?

SPEAKER_00 59:42

Just visit us at seabrightproducts.com. That's really the easiest way. And thank you for having me. This was really a pleasure.

Dr. Leeanne Aguilar 59:48

Absolutely, yeah, it was a pleasure. And thank you to our listeners for tuning in to Industry Ignited. Be sure to subscribe and join us for the next episode. Until next time, stay bold, stay curious, and keep igniting industry.