PEMF therapy, and discussion with Alane Paulley, CEO of Magnawave

Dr. Allison gets a lot of questions answered about PEMF therapy in general with Alane Paulley, CEO of Magnawave.  Alane tells us about how Magnawave got started as a company with her parents in 2006, and how it has grown and supported its patients and customers.  Alane tells us about what is known about Frequency Therapy in both horses and humans, as their partner company Aurawell builds machines for humans as well.  She also discusses the differences between low frequencies and not-so-low frequencies and how they affect the body differently.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:26

Welcome back to the Full Circle Equine Wellness Podcast. I am Dr. Allison Faber Marshall. I am an equine veterinarian in Richmond, Virginia, with a practice limited to chiropractic and acupuncture and traditional Chinese veterinary medicine, which means herbology and a lot of really interesting bodywork. And my goal with this podcast is to interview lots of a little bit off of regular veterinary medicine techniques so that the horse community, the veterinary community, can understand some of these modalities a little bit better. So today we have Elaine Polly, who is employed and represents MagnaWave. And when I contacted MagnaWave and asked for someone in the know that could really do a great job explaining pulse electromagnetic field treatments, they gave they connected me with Elaine. So I'm so happy for you to be here. Thanks for joining us.

SPEAKER_01 1:23

Well, thank you for having me. And I do want to say this is such an important podcast, and I love the topics because so many times we go one way or another, and there's so much power in implementing different types of wellness and health opportunities into our animals' performance, our own performance. And there isn't enough talk about it. You know, a lot of people are just, we're just avoiding the topic of like, why can't we do what's considered alternative things along with traditional medicine at the same time? And that I believe the good true practitioners of health and wellness and and protectors of the wellness of our animals should be able to talk about both.

SPEAKER_00 1:59

I totally agree with you. And thanks for jumping right in. I joke with my clients all the time that if I have a gunshot wound, I don't want an acupuncturist, I want a good surgeon. But if I have kidney failure or if I have Cushing's disease, there are a lot of medical things that what do we think of as alternative medicine or complementary medicine really address better than our Western medicine is able to. There's so much with my chiropractic and my myofascial exam that flies below the radar of a CT scan of an ultrasound and all those kind of things.

SPEAKER_01 2:30

So I Well, and the brain is a even for horses, the brain is a powerful thing. So it's sure we need to address all of the a lot, so many things more than just the symptoms.

SPEAKER_00 2:40

Yes. I don't think Western medicine does the mind-body connection very well. And I'm not sure it even really addresses it. Like we're just starting in our human health world to talk about gut health and how the serotonin is released through the gut, and how if your microbiome's not good, then your psyche is not good. And it's about time. You know, it's a long time coming. So I would love to hear your backstory. So how tell me how you got with MagnaWave, the company, tell me how you got interested in PEMF, and um, let's hear where you came from.

SPEAKER_01 3:13

Yeah, so I was a television producer for the local NBC affiliate here in Louisville, Kentucky. Um, I did that for about six years. I even produced the infield and the uh paddock for the Kentucky Derby. So I was pretty involved in the realm of sports and broadcast here in Louisville. My father, Pat Zemer, started MagnaWave in 2006. So uh him and my mother traveled all around the United States. They did the first ever session on a horse, and that was probably four years before 2006 here in the United States. They my dad was using PMF on horses, mostly low power units out of Canada. He was turned, uh introduced to a high power unit by my mom who had amazing results at a healthy wana show on herself. And so she looked at it one day and said, What'd you think about that machine? And I think it was $20,000 or something. And he was like, Oh, it was great, but you know, it was very expensive. And she goes, Well, I'm glad that you liked it because it's in the trunk. And I wrote three checks. So uh you have three months to uh get this pay to get this figured out. So my dad began putting it in a suitcase at the time. It was much heavier and it was not on wheels. There was none of that. It was just a desktop unit. And so he started uh putting it in his suitcase and took it to Churchill Downs, which is in our backyard here in Louisville, Kentucky. I mean, again, he had been familiar with health and wellness. He had uh done the launch of Luberson, the marketing and all that. So he was very familiar with horses and everyone thought he was crazy, which also made me think he was crazy. I think I was, you know, right uh in high school at the time and right out of high school. And so, but the results at first everyone thought he was insane, and then they thought, okay, no, he's got voodoo, like because this actually works. Like and then uh it slowly became more and more accepted. And my parents went on this like five-year road show where they were doing sessions, and it very quickly came that my dad ended up contacting the person that he bought from and going out to the manufacturer and designing the case as we see it now, like that. Nice in the one with big wheels uh that you see the utilitarian one for those that are uh listening. And so he designed that uh with the manufacturer and he started selling machines more than just doing sessions after that first five years. And I joined in 2012 after I had been working in the TV industry, and it was still just my mom and dad, and they were like he was selling about two to four machines a month, and so that's a lot. Whatever you have to think, you're training them. There wasn't like and and implementing it and all of that. So he was like, I need help. I need help with the technical side, I need help with just I need somebody else to answer the phone, whatever. So I quit my job. I had two children at the time, and I really like to see them instead of working nights at the TV station. Kind of important. So I decided I'm gonna take this risk. My husband was like, uh, let's give it a year, and if it doesn't work, you can always go back to TV. So uh I jumped in in the first month that I joined, I sold eight machines. And so I was addicted. I mean, it was like the minute, not because of the sales, but because of the stories that I was hearing from the like this is incredible. And so I just started living it in a way that my dad and my mom were living it. After the first initial three or four years, I convinced them to let me hire somebody else to help us because I was getting shingles. Like, I talk about health and mental stress. Like I was in my mid-20s and I was melting down with the pressure. And so um I brought, I started building a team under the under under me. And then in 2017 and 2018, my dad was like, I just want to step back, travel with my my wife without having to be involved in the day-to-day. So I took over the day-to-day. Um, and that that year is the year we um purchased the intellectual property. It was a man who was a NASA scientist who did the original NASA study. Um, I had contacted him aggressively for several days, and he hung up on me a lot. And then he agreed to answer the phone. He said, if you give me 30 minutes, will you stop calling? I said, Yes. So the next day, uh flying out to Idaho to meet him. So, like it worked out that I ended up uh purchasing all of his intellectual property on how to build PMF machines, brought it back to Louisville. Husband joined me, and we started really designing and looking at the machines for about six months. My husband helped, and then I hired an engineer and he's a jockeys agent. He works at the racetrack. So he went back to the racetrack and I kept doing what I love.

SPEAKER_00 7:44

And this is 2017, we're talking about not that long ago.

SPEAKER_01 7:47

No, not that long ago. I spent the last, you know, eight or nine years not only developing the line of machines that we know now is MagnaWave and Orwell. We only sell what we design and manufacture here in Louisville, but I also got FDA clearance on the human line. So I truly believed that to bring validity, like we had discussed in the beginning, there has to be that mainstream science in the background. And a lot of people thought this is massage or whatever, because that's what the FDA classified it as. So I've worked over the last seven years to get the FDA clearance, but also they recategorized PMF as a modality within the FDA as a class two over-the-counter device. So not only is it a device that does actually have indication of inflammation reduction, it's proven to do so, but it's a consumer-level device that anyone can purchase. So that reclassification was a battle that I fought because I truly believe that people should have access to this, and it's doesn't need to be implemented by a doctor.

SPEAKER_00 8:46

Awesome. Very cool. Here we are today. Shout out to a girlfriend of mine named Marcy Clifton. I think she was one of your she trained with you about 10 years ago, I would say. She's in my practice area here, and she's been plugging away at it. And uh that's in my Virginia practice. And Michaeline West, I think, purchased her Magna Wave unit within the last four or five years, and she's booked like a month out. I think she's all full for the month of May. I can say that coming behind horses that get MagnaWave regularly, their chiropractic corrects better. They just seem in better balance. I just came back from my monthly rotation through Maryland, and one of the barns I went to, I love when I go to barns that they're paying attention to the nutrition, you know, a lot of the con, you know, the feeds with soybean, you know, and and wheat in them tend to have a lot of pesticides. And so these people were all about that, but their horses get magna-waved and massaged once a month. And I worked on a 24-year-old Mustang who was the perfect pony and a couple of off-track theraps, and that's three, right? Like that's a subjective report, but they easily had less to adjust than, and these were the first time I saw them. So they easily had less to adjust. And I attribute that to all of the holistic modalities, just like you said, you know, all of the things go together to create a healthier body. Yeah. So tell us more about what you learned going to the NASA scientists and what you learned as far as the research goes. I'm really interested in that because obviously horses don't lie, right? Like it feels good to them, it helps them or it doesn't. The placebo effect is minimal in equines. But um, you know, everybody's like, oh, does that really work? Help us understand some of that.

SPEAKER_01 10:31

So I will say that first of all, it is much easier to sell this product and explain this product to people who see an animal get a session because just like you said, they don't lie. Like if your horse is switching leads, if your horse is moving faster, if you see the relief in their face, I don't have to go over the placebo effect. You can see it in front of your real in real time. Where with people, they're always they're actually convincing themselves it didn't work or that it's only working because their brain is telling them. And I'm literally fighting that that process of how to get people to understand now that we have FDA, the human line, but animals love it. They love it. I I will walk into a barn and they will nicker. Like when they see they're used to seeing it, they know it, they love it. It's amazing. So that's great. Um, science, science, that's what we're gonna talk about. So when we purchased the intellectual property, I think um I think there's a lot of misinformation. A pulsed electromagnetic field is a very quick pulse of an electromagnetic field into the body. So we penetrate into the cell wall and out very quickly. There is no damage that is caused, there is no hiding, swelling, or inflammation, there is no pain covering up, there's no analgesic effect. A lot of people think that's it, what it is. They compare it to shockwave, right? Um, because they sound a lot and they both have wave, unfortunately, in their life.

SPEAKER_00 11:56

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 11:57

Yes, but it's not the same. There, you are getting a magnetic field from your phone, you are getting a magnetic field from the computer right now, and you will get more from this than you will ever get in this one hour that maybe we spent spend talking, we're getting more magnetic field than we could get in the lifetime of me running my machine. And the reason is because that machine is so quick, in and out, in and out. There's no magnetic field being released from the machine itself, it is only being released inside the circle. So the magnetic field is created here, and the way to create that magnetic field is to send the right amount of electricity down the perfect amount of copper wire. And the copper wire, the density of it, the way that it's wrapped is what really makes the difference. And then the power supply. So the way that we are getting that electricity out of the power supply and how quickly is going to change the actual wave that is going into the body. So you don't want a consistent magnetic field, you want something that goes in and wakes the body up. It's like a splash of water on your face, but for your cell, right? Like we're getting your body moving. That's the best example. When inflammation, all that is, is right, like your blood cells stacking on top of each other, everything rushes to that area. So a very simple way is that when we put the magna wave on an area, we are splashing that water to clear that those actual non-helpful cells out of the way, right?

SPEAKER_00 13:23

Like it's qi movement, like uh, you know, stuck energy is a bad thing. So you're you're creating uh relief of the stuck energy. That's awesome. I can relate it to Chinese medicine. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:32

Exactly. It's very, it's the same, it's frequency therapy. You can do this with sound waves, you can do this with radio frequency, you can do this with a lot of things. But what we found with the science behind PMF is it's measurable, it's consistent, and it it's a it's actually becoming so accepted in mainstream medicine. And specifically with, you know, the studies that have been going on since the 70s have been extremely interesting. There's very high power PMF machines that like transcranial magnetic stimulation for glioblastoma. There's these machines are extremely strong, but then there's these very low power machines, which also do have a magnetic field, but it's a very low magnetic field that's closer to like like the beamer mats and all of those that are closer to like laying in the grass, right? It's excellent for your body. It's wonderful. But when we're talking about targeted inflammation reduction, the science that has come forward and that we've learned that it to me is the most mind-blowing right now is the type of the way that we're studying regular things, like let's say a dosage of a medicine, you know how much somebody weighs, and you're gonna give them a dose of medicine, and then we're gonna see based on that, if we do the same thing for a hundred people based on their weight, what the results are gonna be. The problem with that is my magnetic field is not measurable in a way that then I could diagnose somebody to use this amount of magnetic field. It doesn't work that way. The only way that our bodies can understand, or a horse's body, even, could understand what needs for them is by setting it comfortably. Okay. And so that's where a lot of mainstream medicine they are struggle, the FDA, everybody, they struggle with the fact of tell me the hertz and the frequency and the exact amount that I need. That makes so much sense. The more I study it, and and FBI is struggling with this really bad right now because they say things like you can only do a thousand gauss, right? But okay, tell me what that is, right? Like get a magnet andometer, do the gaussometer, do the exact reading. It's not possible to measure one machine to be a thousand gauss today and based on a solar flare, which sounds crazy, but it's true, on it could make it 1,500, 3,000 gauss tomorrow. So actually, the mats that you're on, if they're worth anything, or the machines, that fluctuation of how that machine is putting out, even from digital machines like ours, fluctuate. It changes based on the magnetic field of where you are.

SPEAKER_00 15:50

Which I'm assuming our cell phones fluctuate. Like I'm assuming everything electromagnetic fluctuates, right? And we don't know that because we can't see it. And humans don't walk around measuring that with our bodies, like with a gossometer or whatever you might measure stuff with.

SPEAKER_01 16:04

Well, and it would be so hard because there's so many magnetic fields coming from all over the place. And that's so when I had to do the studies for the FDA, they were like, we need three-dimensional studies of the magnetic field with each attachment and each placement with no magnetic field interference from human or otherwise. So, what does that mean? I can't even push the button. So we had to find a complete Faraday cage room, and there was only like two I could find in the whole United States that would measure each setting, each coil, each configuration for me. And then I had to pay to have that done, but also to be able to see. And what's the worst part and the best part? It was it fluctuated enough based on the day and the time that I was like, I'm never gonna get a clear reading. But what I've got now is a range. And now with the studies that we're doing, we're picking a range, which is not normal in most cases, in most clinical trials. They want one measuring point. But with us, we do a low, medium, and high. And we've proven that you have to do that because of the way that the functionality of our bodies is and the way the magnetic field of our bodies is. What's comfortable today may not be comfortable tomorrow. And you have to go by comfort. So we teach in our training about looking at the ears, looking at the eyes, and having the owner or trainer there for the first demo and understanding the way you're looking at the animal so that you can operate this equipment perfectly and no one else is doing that. Most of the hands-on training is just like turn it up, turn it down, place it here, do this. We can't do that. And so the science that has come out in that one part has been it's mind-blowing.

SPEAKER_00 17:33

It's so cool because it sounds so much like acupuncture. So, you know, I trotted off to acupuncture school 21 years ago thinking I would learn stifle points and hock points and digestive points and kidney points and all that kind of thing. And really, I learned looking at the tongue color and feeling the pulse diagnosis, which sounds bizarre, but guess what? That changes every day. And the tolerance of a horse for acupuncture changes every day. So I have horses that will look drugged every time I work on them. I would argue that they probably need it more. They need more needles to correct their imbalance. I have horses that they've got pain. I learned early on in my career that horses with stomach ulcers didn't tolerate acupuncture. If your pain threshold is here and you're all ready to hear with stomach ulcers, then right, doesn't take much. That's exactly why it's very difficult to study acupuncture because it is so patient specific that it doesn't fit into our double-blinded study modalities, right? It doesn't, it doesn't fit a double-blinded study because there isn't a prescription every day for every weight, for every kidney failure, for every right sacroiliac stagnation or whatever. Just like you said, I think that's the power of it, right?

SPEAKER_01 18:54

So I had to prove that with the clinical to show that because what I'm what we created here is a high power machine, like those giant machines that they have in a clinic for humans, we had to prove it, but we also had to prove that it was safe, like these low power mats.

SPEAKER_00 19:07

That's so cool.

SPEAKER_01 19:08

And so to show them that like you get these results based on this range. And you know, it was um an education for me, it was an education for them. And at the end of the day, I don't care what's going on. A lot of people are like, Well, what if they have this? I don't care. I honestly don't care. Like, you don't need to tell me anything to do with a person or an animal. I know how to put the coil on, I know how to see if they're comfortable. I humans are easy. Are you comfortable? Horses, not so much.

SPEAKER_00 19:33

If you know horses, they're easy.

SPEAKER_01 19:35

Yes, exact exactly. And I always tell people like sometimes people would call and they would say, I want to get one of these, I want to start a horse career because I dreamed of working with horses. I'm like, Whoa, you've never worked with a horse? And they're like, No, I'm like, well, you need to start somewhere else because this isn't where to start, right? You know, like you opted yourself out.

SPEAKER_00 19:52

I have learned that people judge a modality by one time with one horse and one practitioner. So people will say to me, Oh, well, I tried chiropractic on my horse and it didn't work. Well, that is all about the practitioner and all about what was going on with that horse and what was going on that day. It's amazing how malleable that is, right? Like and differ. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:16

Everything get away from using P EMF. Like I tell my staff, I'm like, stop calling it P EMF because the problem is that you cannot take a mat or a blanket and put it next to our equipment and say that you've tried PMF. Like you a mat or a blanket is a form of PMF. If people just hear that, they're thinking, I've tried it. Like you said, I tried it on my horse. My horse did that one of those blankets for three months. I'm not saying that that doesn't work, but you got to give this a try because this is a targeted precision pulse type of frequency that's different.

SPEAKER_00 20:51

That's right. I think that we kid ourselves by thinking that Western medicine fits in a box like that, too. You know, we do these studies on dosages, and I just um was talking to a friend of mine who's in mainstream medicine, and she admitted that probably 25% of horses do very poorly or won't tolerate pergolide for Cushing's disease. 25% is huge. So yeah, it is huge. So again, it's kind of like we think we have a prescription down, but we need to be looking at the bodies, we need to be looking at the response. And if one thing doesn't work, we need to be trying something else. So I have students ride with me who are in acupuncture school, and I say students because they're veterinarians being trained in acupuncture, and the the wave seems to be in veterinary medicine to look at the radiographs, look at the x rays, look at the blood work, look at the CT, look at the bone scan, and we kind of forget to look at the patient. Yes. And how the patient responds to all of what we're doing, right? Is a super important feedback. Like, just like you said.

SPEAKER_01 21:57

Practitioner matters, like the type of I always tell. People you need to have three different opinions. The the practitioner who you're working with and who you're talking with matters that is to the core of the belief of this company of MagdaWave is if they're successful, I'm successful, and that is should be tattooed on my forehead. But I truly believe that their education and one of the things that we do is we have this huge event called MagnaCon, and that's coming up in June. And we do it every two years. 500 people come, we stream it to thousands. The reason that I do that is because there's so much information education out there. I want to give it to them and I want to give it to them every year. We have recertification and we have continuing education every year. And if people think I I already know everything and I don't need to learn anymore, I'm an expert. And that's not the case. You need that practitioner to come and work with you because working with somebody who knows acupuncture or massage and knows how to use MagnaWave and understands how to speak to a vet, that's the perfect way for you to move forward healthy.

SPEAKER_00 22:57

Well, and that takes experience, right? Like they call it practice for a reason. Anytime you're practicing a medicine, but life is practice. So you need to get cases under your belt to see how this machine responds. I was an equine practitioner in the beginning, and then I had kids and stepped away from equine practice and spayed and neutered and was in a great small animal clinic for about three years, but it just wasn't my jam. And so I started my holistic practice. I was a new graduate three times. And when I first started doing chiropractic and acupuncture, I would get that question of how long before we see a difference, and I wouldn't know what to say. And they'd say two weeks. I'm like, yeah, sounds good. You have to practice in order to learn all of that. So one of the questions that I get from my clients a lot is, you know, MagnaWave and Beamer are kind of the big brands in PEMF, the more popular ones. And so based on what I'm hearing you say, I think I'm answering this correctly, that you know, the daily beamer is required daily because it is a much smaller dosage and magna wave isn't daily. And so they're really treating two different things, right? From my understanding of wavelength, magna wave is gonna get deeper into the body with a more powerful wavelength.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

Is that is that all yeah, a more powerful wavelength? So it's gonna go all the way into the bone marrow very quickly, immediately. And where with beamer, you're looking at microcirculation, fascia. Um, excellent to do in between targeted MagnaWave sessions, but any animal that's in performance needs to be getting like a Magna Wave session once a week, even if there's nothing wrong, or twice a month, maybe just keep them feeling good, keep the blood flow, and then doing those beamer sessions in between, great. You're doing everything. But that's like saying, Oh, well, driving my Mustang and riding a bike are the same thing. And they're not riding a bike's good for your body. You get the exercise, you do all of that, and you could get to them all, but driving the Mustang is gonna get you there way faster in a way different way, right? So it really depends on are you dealing with a chronic injury? And if you are, then if it's like a serious injury, you know, we're gonna go all the way through the cast of uh to help heal a wound. We're gonna penetrate the the actual um hoof area, like where we will pull an abscess where with beamer, you're gonna overall be working on those daily function and and relaxation. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 25:22

Okay. Oh, cool. So, so in your per humble opinion, I always say that so I don't offend anybody, beamer's more for maintenance, it sounds like, you know, for for some low-level maintenance. That's awesome. Yeah. I have a great story that um I was invited by a friend of mine who was a massage therapist to like do a presentation at an equine extravaganza kind of thing. And she said, I really want to talk about a lot of different modalities. So if you'll come and talk about chiropractic and acupuncture, and I'm gonna talk about massage. And then I said, Um, I'd love to bring my friend who just got her a magna wave machine. If she could come and participate, that'd be great. And I'm not sure my friend, the massage therapist, really loved that idea, but she started with the horse and she picked the horse, uh, who was an off-track thoroughbred for the demo horse, and she worked on the horse and it didn't stand very well. And I was standing there going, all horses love chiropractic and myofascial release. Didn't stand very well for me either. My friend came out with the beamer and head to the ground, like it was a fabulous demonstration on the different modalities. And I do believe that massage and chiropractic are really good, but at that moment, to your point, that horse really needed the magna wave or was benefiting from that more so than that.

SPEAKER_01 26:38

I I think the beamer works, it's just a different experience in what you're looking for to get done, right? Like they can be were used side by side, but unfortunately, and in the same animal, like throughout the just for health and wellness, you should be doing both. But the problem is that unfortunately, and we've pitted people against each other. And I will never speak badly about any company because I want to stand on the fact of what we do. But the fact is that there is no reason to be working against each other. We should be working together on spreading the whole entire spectrum of magnetic fields because a light bulb has a lights have a whole spectrum of light. Well, a laser is not the same as a red light device you can have at your house. It's just not. So why can't we talk about the uses and the differences and work together? Most of the time, when it comes to nasty things, it has to do with selling.

SPEAKER_00 27:30

100%. 100%. And I don't know if I if I slipped and said beamer during that. That my friend who did the magna wave was the one that came and the horse just dropped his head. Like it, it was just it was impressive. It's immediate. Yeah, it is immediate. It is immediate. And I've had some on myself too. It definitely is relaxing. And I think it's fascinating. I think as humans, we tend to want to have a diagnosis, want to know what's going on, want to analyze it, and blah, blah, blah. And some same thing with acupuncture, sometimes and chiropractic. I had somebody call the other day and say, Well, this horse is doing weird stuff, and I'm sure you want to go out, come on, come out and watch it go under saddle and watch it on a lunge line. And I said, actually, I watch it about 10 steps at a jog, and I can see a lot with that, but none of that changes what I do. And we need to apply, you know, the chiropractic and the myofascial release and acupuncture and see how much it helps the horse. It's like peeling the layers of the onion. And so many of those holistic modalities peel different layers and therefore integrate really well, in my humble opinion.

SPEAKER_01 28:34

Yeah, you're exactly right. I love the way you said that because I think a lot of times it's about the response after the first session that gives us the like roadmap to where they need to be. And I think, you know, something for anybody to keep in mind. If you are looking for alternative options that you are whoever you're working with should, again, not be bashing other ones and talking about how they work together because the complementary things that I've seen between massage and magna wave and even red light and even acupuncture has been incredible. And there is one, there isn't one that's better than the other. They can all work together. It's just knowing when to use them and having an open mind enough to be able to navigate that process with a trusted practitioner.

SPEAKER_00 29:16

Absolutely. The one thing that's really been ringing home to me lately, because I do a lot of Chinese herbology, and I have figured out if I can hit the nail on the head with an herb, it's like a daily dose of acupuncture. But bottom line, we don't know what's going to help until we try. And again, I don't care if it's medications, I don't care if it's holistic things, I don't care what your approach is. And the other thing that Bears saying is that the longer a problem has been around for me and for a lot of other things, the harder it is to fix with any medicine.

SPEAKER_01 29:46

Yes, that's the same with MagnaWave. You've had this pain for nine, this horse has been having this problem for nine years. Right. And you're asking me, is it okay? So I paid for one session. Is it better now? Like, do you actually ever take it gotten rid of your chronic disability the pain in one Tylenol? No, ma'am. Like you need to be prepared to make the life change for this animal and for yourself. But it can be, it can be better if we put our mind to it, learn and grow together, but it's not gonna be like that. And anybody who says it is, they're part of the problem.

SPEAKER_00 30:19

I totally agree. I totally agree. An acupuncturist that I used to go to would require everybody to have at least five sessions. You know, I think kind of to your point, is it that people think they know what's going on with them, number one, and usually the problem is elsewhere our fascia is so interconnected that it can pull on different areas of our body from scar tissue or whatever. But we think we know where it is, but it just takes a while. I was taught that the Chinese, I love, they don't believe in allergies. So anything that gets deemed allergic is actually an imbalance in the body. And if it takes four years to make bad skin, it's gonna probably take me a year or two to unmake it, but we have to have patience in that progress, in that process. And it's a whole lot more powerful on a subtle level than Zertec, you know, or medications trying to quickly alleviate symptoms, you know, it's truly about healing and healing just takes time.

SPEAKER_01 31:14

Hope we're switching there, though, as a society. I agree with you. We are on the cusp of that. I really do. I think people want COVID was a kick in the face, and I think a lot of people want their health and wellness in their own hands. And you know, what used to be crazy. I have had some amazing conversation with mainstream doctors who six or seven years ago thought I was nuts, okay? And now are calling me and they're like, you know, frequency therapy is something, you know, and I'm like, no shit, excuse my friend, right? But no way, like it is like there is frequency, there is there's power in sound, yes, there's power in light, there's in weather you want and in magnetic fields, and you can fight it all you want, but it is we are a product of this earth, and if you turned off the magnetic field of the earth right now, we would all drop dead. Right. So that is a huge statement to how our cells even communicate with each other, is a they communicate with electromagnetic signals. So why wouldn't we want to help them do that?

SPEAKER_00 32:13

Absolutely. You remind me of a session that when we when I go to teach acupuncture down at Qi University, we have local horses come and their owners stand there for four hours or whatever while we teach the points and they get a free treatment and free herbs and everything. One of the people that would come would bring this fabulous horse. She moved to Utah, sadly, but he was 18 hands and he was a grand prix dressage horse.

SPEAKER_01 32:36

And wow.

SPEAKER_00 32:37

Yeah, and he was so functional for 18 hands. You know, usually the big ones are the first ones that fall apart. But um, so functional and so cool. And I remember talking about something about, you know, how weird and all the crazy things that are going on for horses. And she texted me later and she said, Well, it makes sense. The Schumann resonance is off the charts. And I'm like, Schumann resonance, what in the world? It's a thing, right? It's Wikipedia. And you probably know this because of what you're saying.

SPEAKER_01 33:06

It's not the mindfield of the earth, it's the range and the heartbeat of the earth. Right. And it matters. Every single digital machine that I sell has a Schuman resonance underneath each setting. So when you're using the Cimitan, the Aura wave, all of them, when you're using these machines, so the machine is pulsing. What you hear, we also send these little clickers with it. When you put that in the circle, you hear two pulses. You are the clicking of the frequency that you picked on the machine, and then you have that really fast functioning of the Earth's magnetic field. Because if you have that grounding and you have that inflammation reduction signal, we're using both at the same time. The results are astronomical. The minute that I learned that and I saw that in the studies, I implemented it into every digital machine. Now, it's not possible with the spark chamber units, like the giant big ones, like the spark chamber unit. And that you would have to have two big spark chambers to make that happen. But the digital machines are able to do that. And it's, you know, it's I get brain fog. And if I go look, on days when I have really bad brain fog, I'll go look and I can actually see the spike.

SPEAKER_00 34:08

And I'm like, with the Schumann resonance, yes. And my understanding is that what Wikipedia says it is, is that it's a an ultra nano wavelength between the Earth's crust and the ionosphere that is created and perpetuated by a lightning, right? And so, like last year.

SPEAKER_01 34:26

By the electricity and the by the sun, and yeah, I mean, it's okay. Actual, I mean, we get energy, we get everything comes when there's those big solar flares. So that pushes down on the ionosphere, and that's that it all the the way lightning is created, all of this is connected from and that's right. If you've ever seen ground lightning where it comes up from the ground into the cloud, wow, it's it's the same, it's all one big thing that we humans have lost the ability to feel. So I believe at one point in time.

SPEAKER_00 34:58

We don't pay attention to it.

SPEAKER_01 34:59

Yeah, I think we did physically. I think we had to know that to keep to keep if you've ever been outside and be like, uh, it not that it smells like, but it feels like it's about to thunderstorm. Like you feel the energy, yes. And what they found is even wolves and they've never known they actually follow them when the magnetic field of the earth shifts and when the uh human residence shifts, their like hunting paths change and their migration paths change based on that. And that's how they know where they are, and that's how they and and birds do the same thing. So I think at one time we had a better sense of that, and we've lost it. And when I used to say that, people would look at me like okay.

SPEAKER_00 35:34

Right, right. Like I did with the text. I'm like, huh?

SPEAKER_01 35:37

Yeah, but it's getting better. People are realizing that oh, yeah, wow, this is just like we need light. We need light, we need water, we need food and sustenance, we need magnetic fields.

SPEAKER_00 35:48

That's so cool. So that leads me to my next questions. You know, the when I read about the Schumann resonance and the Schumann resonance is off the chart. And so last summer, at least, like all summer, June, July, and August in Virginia, we didn't just have rain. Anytime we had rain, it was violent thunder and lightning. So Schumann resonance off the chart. We were talking about all that. Is it like how much is too much? I understand that the wavelengths are probably part of the pranayama chi energy that makes us tick, right? Like it we plug into that probably as humans, but is do you know, is there a point in which like people talk about gee, the radiation being so bad for us, blah, blah, blah. So is there any science behind any kind of electromagnetic thing being too much?

SPEAKER_01 36:38

Yes, there is, especially when it comes to constant magnetic fields. Okay. So the best way for me to describe this is like if you live next to a like let's say you go to the beach and you get in the ocean and the salt water feels good and the sun feels good, right? And it's good for your body, but you're done, right? That was fun for the 30 minutes hour that you were in the water or under the sun. If you go, it's very much like sunlight, but if you were to go and be in that ocean under that sun for hours and days, you would destroy your skin, destroy your body. You cannot be submerged in a constant magnetic field, just like you cannot be in a constant sunshine. Okay. So the problem with the constant magnetic field, like from a radio tower or 5G, is that you can't feel it. So like when you're in the sun, you know you're getting a burn, right? But when you are sitting next to a tower that causes brain cancer, and there's this giant amount of magnetic field coming from this tower, and and you can't feel it, your children can't feel it, it is actually just it's like being under a sunlamp, but to yourselves, you're actually causing damage to yourselves by doing that, and you can't see it. And part of the that means that people are exposed to it for long periods of time, and electrical companies and they can come out and do a reading and say to you, Oh, it's fine. Look, it's it within the safe limits, but just like I explained to you before, these things change the amount of electricity being pulled through that wire, the amount of um the the I the ionosphere of the earth, all of that can take what was, you know, a hundred gals to 40,000 gals in the as little as a second.

SPEAKER_00 38:14

Right.

SPEAKER_01 38:14

That's what you're standing next to. So that's going from, oh, I was sitting in the sunshine for 30 minutes to I just spent three days like that. So that's the best way for me to describe like how it affects your cells. It's like burning your skin, but on your cells. Now, the thing about pulse electromagnetic fields is that, like I said before, we are not a constant magnetic field. This is in, out, in, out, in, out, super quick. So literally nanoseconds into the body and out. So even your cell phone, you again, I've gotten more from this cell phone today than I'll ever get from operating this machine or using this machine. But what happens is when you use this machine, we are going in the cell, we're waking it up, we're causing some uh movement, and we with that you get a you get actual detoxification. And the detoxification is the only, I guess if you sat on a Magna Wave for like 40 years, there could be a but like the thing is is that using the Magna Wave for the short periods of time, like it's just like being in a sauna or getting a deep tissue massage is the worst that can happen where you are sitting there like, oh gosh, like I'm a little detoxed, I I've detoxed, I need to drink some water and rehydrate. That feels for your effects.

SPEAKER_00 39:25

Yeah, yeah, that's so cool. Because I've always been told that when nerves are compromised by chiropractic restrictions, that when you open those nerves back up, you need to give the dead body a day to heal, you know, day off of me and after me. And I'm sound like it sounds like the magna wave is the same.

SPEAKER_01 39:42

Exactly. Yeah. So what I like recommend doing is doing a session. I usually recommend doing like the first initial session, maybe half the time and half the strength than you think. So you go in, you do a session, instead of doing 45 minutes, you may do 25, you know, do a setting, the horse is comfortable, and then come back and say one of three things is gonna happen after any session for animals or humans. And what you're gonna know is A, they feel better, which is great, they feel nothing, which means that we can do more and go a little deeper, or they feel horrible, and that's actually good too. Because what it tells me is okay, we addressed that there's an issue, now we need to keep working on it. So I'll say, like, if your animal feels worse or you feel worse, you're detoxing and you need to 100% keep doing the sessions because healing hurts sometimes. Detoxing that out of the body, moving those things through. I'm not saying immediately turn it up really high and go for hours. What I'm saying is, you know, work with your practitioner and come back in, you know, 48 hours. And instead of just doing those 20 minutes, why don't we do a 45-minute session? Let's get it out. You know, let's get it out. Drink some water and take some hydration. And eventually what's gonna happen is you're gonna have that oh, like that release of like your body's gonna start functioning better. I see this a lot with humans who have heavy metal buildup. Wow. Smokers, I've had smokers throw up black, tar, diarrhea, where it's like it's getting the body out.

SPEAKER_00 41:07

Body's getting it out, yeah. Immediately.

SPEAKER_01 41:09

And people get scared if you don't tell them that, and they'll get scared with their horse. Like, my horse was lame, I didn't know what was going on, the vet didn't know what was going on. So you go out and you magna wave it for 30 minutes, and now it's lame on the other side, but it's not on this side. And it's like, okay, wait, that's okay. Let's talk to the vet, but then let's also do a session and you're gonna watch it move out of the body.

SPEAKER_00 41:28

Right. That's so cool. I I often find that that detox response or what I was taught was a healing crisis, right? Like the body's got to take a big step backward in order to come forward to heal. It is directly proportional to how much junk there is in the body. And I tell people 30% of my patients get worse before they get better. And that's a good thing. Just like you said, I will never forget I did 20% dogs for the first nine years of my practice. I don't do dogs anymore, just to clarify for everybody. But um uh I remember a year and a half old Great Dane that came to me. I don't remember what the presenting complaint was, but I just remember thinking, oh, I can do chiropractic and acupuncture on the same day. And I think it was a um a neck issue, like a wobbler of CBM. And uh we I did electroacupuncture, I adjusted them. The people said they had to wait, is it a year and a half old, had to wake the dog up to go out for like three days after that. And what that told me was that neck was way worse than what I assumed that it was just in a year and a half old. You know, young doesn't necessarily mean um any more, any less uh compromised, right?

SPEAKER_01 42:37

Like they just I actually had a woman one time who had a her son was was speaking and talking and had all was a totally normal kid. They had moved to a new house and they lived there for about two years, and this child had like regressed back and was not speaking and was having trouble with like motor function. They couldn't figure out what was going on, and they tried all these different things and they kept saying autism, autism. And I'm not I'm not saying any of that, but what we had found what she ended up doing, did a session and had he was sick, like diarrhea afterwards. And I'm like, you need to go to the doctor. Well, the doctor then realized that he had lead poisoning.

SPEAKER_00 43:15

I was just gonna say that sounds like a heavy metal toxicity.

SPEAKER_01 43:18

Yes, and it was a heavy, a lead poisoning from they had they had she had put a garden next to this barn, and the paint had been for generations had been peeling off into the garden. Oh my god. And she was growing and eating all of her vegetables, all of their food. I mean, these were very, very healthy people. They only ate what they grew really, and so organically Yes, and so he completely came back and we worked through with the doctor and doing the orwell sessions, like using the human device, and his results were so fast and so good. His abilities were great. And so I think that uh yeah, it you don't know what's going on, but finding out having a good practitioner who educates you on these things can happen before so that you understand the healing crisis is I have to battle because that'll scare people away.

SPEAKER_00 44:02

No, absolutely. I totally agree with you. Awesome. Well, for anybody who is listening to our podcast, how can a general practitioner in Montana, Utah, Michigan, Georgia, how can we find MagnaWave people who are certified and trained in MagnaWave? Do you have a good website for that?

SPEAKER_01 44:21

I do. Oh, I do. So the website is magnawave.com or M W P E M F dot com. There is a uh find a practitioner right at the top tab. And uh you can go there. There's an awesome map, and you just put your information in with your your where you're located, and it will take you to all of the local practitioners nearby and tell you where the what they're certified in. So whether it's livestock, which we're doing amazing things with dairy cows right now, small animals, large animals, or humans, you can find at Orpwell, which is A-U-R-A-W-E-L-L.com. And then I always encourage people to go check out PEMF Professionals.com. That's the A O P P. It is an amazing group. It's a nonprofit, and they really work to spread the information for all of the different types of PMF. And it's a great resource to find practitioners and things there. But M W PMF.com, O L A-U-R-A-W-E-L-L, and we can match you with somebody in your area. We also have trials. If somebody wants to try a machine for 30 days, we do that. If you don't love it at the end of that 30 days, you pay our rental fee. We will give you half of that rental money back, and you can just send the money back, the machine back. If you love it, 100% of that rental fee comes off the purchase price. Uh and we have in-house financing. So we train you, we treat you, and we can help you and your animals feel better.

SPEAKER_00 45:42

So are most people using it as a business when they invest in something like that? Or do you find there's a lot of folks that buy it for their large training bar?

SPEAKER_01 45:51

I find a lot of people will buy it for one horse.

SPEAKER_00 45:53

No kidding.

SPEAKER_01 45:54

It's crazy. Because they last for 10 years. It's not actually that crazy. They the machine lasts for 10 years. They want to do sessions every day. They may have a dog. Most, most 80% of horse owners have a dog. So it works for the dogs. And I find a lot of people will then get it, even get a machine for themselves. Which what blew my mind when I first started doing this is when I built our contact management system and I started really manufacturing and keeping track of all the serial numbers. And I realized that if if you buy a machine and you have success with it, within the first two years, you'll buy a second. And there's a really good chance you'll end up with four. So like most people don't just buy one, they buy two. And most people uh recommend it to their families because they want their mom to feel better. They want their dad to feel their best friend who has horses, their their friend, you know. I mean, that the idea is that this is a lifestyle. It's it's a it's a movement, not a machine. And and it's all about, you know, uh changing the way that we present ourselves every day. It has to be a practice, right? It's not so businesses, yes, those people have like five to ten and they rent hot machines and they run several, and then uh most people will start with one, and it is very much an addiction to the way that it feels and the way that it functions for you. Well, if I have one here, I need one in the barn, you know. So it becomes this way of thinking and a in a part of your life. Because once you feel good like this, and I think that's what I became addicted to. Like when I realized that I would see people walking and they'd be limping, or I see these animals and they're like, I have to put my horse down. I'm like, wait, or my horse has colic and there's no other thing they can do, and they the surgery, you know, is it's dangerous for this reason or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 47:29

And I'm like, expensive.

SPEAKER_01 47:31

Just try it, just try it. Like it's worth trying, you know, and like give it a shot, talk to somebody else. And when I started realizing that I just need to get the word out and educate people that your life can be better, your animal's life can be better, and uh the right practitioners will work with all of your medical providers to help you understand that and figure out where they fit in your wellness system for you and your animal.

SPEAKER_00 47:54

Yeah, awesome. Yeah, I appreciate you having me on.

SPEAKER_01 47:56

This was great. We could talk anytime you want. Awesome. I love that.

SPEAKER_00 48:00

Right back at you, sister.

SPEAKER_01 48:03

It was just so much fun to give me the platform to talk about it. I I love to do this. Yeah, it's definitely my passion.

SPEAKER_00 48:11

It gets really exciting when, just like you said, people have tried a lot of things, and what you have to offer tends, you know, is is it's possible to help them. And I would say, you know, 70 to 80 percent of horses, if not more, get better. Do they get better enough? You know, it all depends on how crippled they were when you bring them to me. You know how much it can do. But it's just very exciting to have some other options as opposed to medications. That's that's yeah, that's what we need.

SPEAKER_01 48:39

As society and us for everything. Can I can I give you a ticket to MagnaCon for the virtual MagnaCon so that you can watch the videos? I'm gonna have my team send you a free virtual ticket so that wherever you are, you can watch it, and then you you keep the videos for six weeks. So if you can't watch it the weekend in June, you you have the videos to watch for six weeks, and and there's gonna be some like-minded people that I think you're gonna really love learning and and and seeing. And I also would like to just do one shape, one more plug here: MagnaCon.com, M-A-G-N-A-C-O-N. This is our event. It's our 10th at MagnaCon, it's our 20th anniversary as a company for MagnaWave. We are going big. This is a great way to hear from doctors, researchers, NASA scientists. I mean, we brought in everyone. We stream it virtually and you can replay it. And if I could say I put my heart and a soul into this event, I do it every two years. And I think it's a great way for people who are curious and want to learn more about other great people who do great modalities. It's a it's a really good way to learn and just educate yourself, period, on what's out there and what's new.

SPEAKER_00 49:41

Yeah, that's awesome. And we don't learn what's new until we try. You know what I mean? And I love the more gentle therapies because the worst thing that's gonna happen for me with Chinese herbals is they might get diarrhea in 20 years, knockwood.

SPEAKER_01 49:55

Yeah, exactly. They might have a pain in their shoulder, you know, for a minute.

SPEAKER_00 49:59

Not even, not even. Like they might get a little I've never I've had dogs get diarrhea from herbs. Horses are born herbivores, so the worst thing that happens is they don't work.

SPEAKER_01 50:08

Do you run a test to figure out what herbs work, or do you just talk to them and then give them a sample?

SPEAKER_00 50:13

So Chinese medicine looks at the tongue color and feels pulse quality, and that sounds crazy, but like the jugular pulse on a horse can be different from the right side to the left side, and we use three fingers to do that. All three of those fingers have a different organ association. So there's three on the left and three on the right, and so you have six different pulse positions using that diagnosis, putting that together with the tongue color, with the ear temperature, with the coat, you know, with the poop, with what the owner's telling you. So it is a lot more tuned in to the nuances of the individual. So, like for Chinese herbals for diarrhea, there's probably 20 different herbals for diarrhea, depending on those different, it's not just a metronidazole deficiency, which is one of the really popular and very successful drugs that we use for diarrhea. But there are four main ones for arthritic change in horses. Some horses are worse in the heat, some horses' horses are worse in the cold. I think I'm seeing the horses worse in the heat almost exclusively now, and it makes me wonder why. And then I kind of go, well, there's a lot of toxins in our environment. And so I think I'm seeing more and more inflammation. My humble opinion is that stomach ulcers are sort of an epidemic right now, and horses that are retired and on 24-74-7 turnout are getting grade three stomach ulcers. They have no business with stomach ulcers. So I'm wondering about the toxins in our environment.

SPEAKER_01 51:41

Yeah, it's what they're eating in the in the grass. I mean, it's what they're eating out in the in the fields. I mean, it's incredible. People just spray in their grass with stuff. My husband is so funny. He's like, look at them. They're just over there spraying their grass. Like, don't even like pollinators. Like, we could go on and on about all of this. But what I'd like to do is I'm gonna send you a free ticket to MagnaCon, like the virtual, so you can watch it all. And then I'd love to have you on my podcast too. I'd be happy to think that we could have a much further like discussion. I'd love to learn a little bit more about how you work, what you do. And I have so many questions, but I'm not gonna take up all the time. So I think that might be fun.

SPEAKER_00 52:14

Uh I think it'd be great. You just tell me when. I'd be happy to do it.

SPEAKER_01 52:17

I will do that. I appreciate you giving me the time. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 52:21

Thanks so much for for answering a lot of questions for me and for everybody else. So I really appreciate your time. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 52:28

Thank you. Bye-bye.

SPEAKER_00 52:30

Bye.