More to Life
More to Life is made for the listener that enjoys learning new things, and seeing how they can improve their life. With a diverse list of guests, there is much to be learned about personal development and looking at ideas through a new lens.
More to Life
#010- Jack Brzenk- Where Does Creativity Come From?
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Welcome back everyone! Today I am joined by a singer/songwriter by the name of Jack Brzenk. Jack and I got in contact through TikTok and I really wanted to get an inside perspective on the art of creating music. I learned so much this episode as we talked about his creative writing process, what makes a song great, and how we can all use music to relate to each other. I hope you enjoy this episode half as much as I enjoyed recording it. Thanks again to Jack, and his Youtube and TikTok handle are both @JackBrzenk if you would like to check out his music!
What up, everybody? Welcome back to the Mortal Life Podcast. This is episode 10. Today we have someone completely different. I've never talked to this gentleman before. I reached to I reached out to him via TikTok DMs. Funny enough, I find him on my for you page. He writes music, sounds like a good guy. We had a terrific conversation about music, college, you know, following your dreams, all that good stuff. If you've been enjoying the podcast, go ahead and give the Spotify a rating, give Apple Music a rating, subscribe to the YouTube channel, all the stuff. It really helps me. Leave a like, it'll promote this podcast so that other people can listen to it. Without further ado, this is episode 10 of the Mortal Eye Podcast featuring Jack Berzink. Hope you enjoy. What are you studying in school?
SPEAKER_00I'm studying communications in TV, film, and broadcasting. Oh, also it's like so my big thing, music and like video production are my two like big things.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Awesome. What do you what do you want to like do you want to like tie the two kind of together after college or like you looking for like what are you looking to do?
SPEAKER_00Like like kind of, yeah. Like my dream, I think, job ever would be to just be a musician, like singer, songer, singer, songwriter, like touring artist kind of thing. But um like for to have like a steady, like stable job, I would love to like work in like news production or like uh TV production, something like that. Okay, gotcha. So like they're kind of like separate things, but I do like stuff that like combines. Like I'd love to like work like live events as like a camera operator, like for concerts and shit. Like that'd be really fun.
SPEAKER_01Oh, okay. Do you do a lot of like uh photography, videography, and stuff on your own?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Awesome. Yeah, yeah. I do um I have an internship at school, like I help out with like university marketing stuff. So like I edit together like advertisements for them, or I'll go out and like shoot events that they have. Um and I've been like doing a job at a local like cable station in my town for the past couple summers, which has been pretty fun. So a lot of stuff like that. More like not like after like like packaging like video like projects for like different companies or like different events kind of thing. Okay. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01That sounds cool. Yeah, I have a I have a couple friends that are pretty interested, pretty like big into like photography and stuff, but not so much like what you're talking about. It's more of just like like scenic photography and stuff like that. But no, that's super cool. That's cool. What are you studying? I'm studying exercise science. So yeah, so the the goal right now is um I have one more semester of undergrad after this semester gets out in May, and then uh I'd be looking to go to PT school for physical therapy. That's awesome. So yeah, I still have a little ways to go, but it's alright. I'm having fun.
SPEAKER_00Nice, man. Um, do you want to like go to grad school at all or are you just like taking the uh I think I'll see like what opportunities come up in my senior year and like what I can apply for and that kind of thing and go from there. I'm not planning on it, but I'm definitely open to it if like I need to like get like a higher level of education to like get where I want to go.
SPEAKER_01Gotcha. And then are you are you looking to like move away after college? Like, is that something that you kind of envision yourself doing or like kind of.
SPEAKER_00Um, I'd probably stay East Coast, but I'd love to live in like a city like out out of college, like living in like New York or Boston or Providence, like something like that. Just like live in a city and work at like a local, like a product like a what's it called? Like a news company, like a WBZ or like a CBS station, like local in that area. Okay.
unknownCool.
SPEAKER_01That would be the same. That's awesome. Okay. Um, I got a couple questions for you, man. All right. Uh um, the the the first question I got for you is just kind of broad. You can kind of do what you want with it, but it's just it would just be like, what got you into music?
SPEAKER_00Oh, that's a good one. Um, so I've always been like a musical person, I'd say like as like growing up as a kid, I always loved to sing and stuff, and I was always like interested in learning instruments. But um, so I was in my like elementary and like middle school choir. Um I was in all these like high school plays, like local high school plays, they like reached out to the elementary school and the middle school to like get kids as like the kid roles in their shows. And but like instead of being like in the ensemble, I'd have like a named character in the show. Like I'd be like one of like the lead kids, which was really fun. I did that for a couple of years, and so I was just really big into music. And then um when I was about 10 years old, I think, so it was like 2017, um, my grandma my grandma passed away unexpectedly, which was really tough. And then not even a couple weeks later, my grand my grandpa on the same side was diagnosed with cancer, and that was a really tough journey to like watch them go through. And it was like just like I was in a really weird spot in my life there. And so I started writing music to kind of like help me through that. And um, like I would like write like happy songs, kind of like motivate myself, and then like it helped me feel a lot better. So I started like using that as a tool to like help myself whenever I'm having a bad day. Like it's like, oh, I can take this and like write something that I'm proud of that makes me happy, that like I can kind of like embody this feeling and like overcome it in this way by like internalizing it and making it my own. Yeah, but that's kind of a long-winded answer, but that's that's how I got into music. That's cool.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I think I think a lot of people can relate to um like how like how you said, like the reason you started, like you know, you get this like sort of like bad news, and like you said, you find a way to internalize it and kind of express yourself and like I guess kind of put your story out there so that you can try to you know bring in people that have also experienced like the same kind of thing. No, exactly. Yeah, yeah. Um yeah, man, that's really cool. I've I I've always been super like into music, I've never like pursued it like that kind of way, but um I like I always listen to music. I'm always listening to some sort of music. Um I took guitar lessons when I was in like middle school and stuff.
SPEAKER_00Oh, that's sick, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but then like yeah, like I've I've always went been a person to like saying when I'm alone or like in a car and stuff, and it's just like I don't know, I feel like it's the most perfect and like healthy way that someone can like express themselves in like any emotion.
SPEAKER_00No, it's a it's a great like outlet just to have, you know, even if you're not pursuing it professionally, even if you're not writing something, like just music in general is just such a powerful tool.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I just I just feel like it's it's so diverse and like even the most like niche situation, like you can think of a thousand songs that you can relate to. Yeah. No matter what you're in. Um, who do you who do you kind of take inspiration from?
SPEAKER_00Um I take inspiration from I think a lot of people, mainly like the like my favorite artists and stuff. Um I'd say Noah Khan, especially recently, has been like a big inspiration of mine. Uh he's just like a really like he's just like the kind of guy that I want to be, or like the kind of guy that I try to like exemplify already. And I started listening to him and I was like, wow, this is just like so like me. And that's like it's kind of funny because it's like it's like very much like the point of his music. Like he writes about these things he goes through, but presents them in a way where anyone can listen and be like, oh, I've felt something like this before. That's really neat. So it's like it's like I started writing music before I started listening to him. And so like it was, I was already kind of doing that like thing where it's like, oh, I'm gonna write a song about how I feel, and hopefully it helps someone else. And it's just like seeing like someone like have that big of a reach and like it become that popular by doing that, it's just like so inspiring where it's like, oh wow, like you can really write something powerful.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. No, I was it was actually funny. Like I I was about to say, like, if there would be one person that I like immediately, you sounded like when I first started listening to your music was Noah Khan.
SPEAKER_00Like, thanks, man.
SPEAKER_01Like, dude, like for real. Like, I was I was almost gonna put that in my notes. Like, was Noah Khan an inspiration of yours?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_01It's like that's like the kind of it's like the kind of uh like in terms of like the tone and uh like the chords and the tune and stuff, yeah. It it feels very, very like like warm and urban. Yeah. If that makes any sense, kind of like it's definitely my favorite sound. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And it's definitely like it's definitely my sound. Like even if like, and I can't even like choose it. That's just like how my voice sounds, it's how I sing, it's how I play guitar, that kind of thing. And it's just so like it like lines up like perfectly in a way. It's like, oh wow, like this is really just like like not like a like he like almost like a role model where it's like, oh, this is like he's another like Massachusetts New England guy that struggles with depression and his like self-image and like his like um like body dysmorphia and stuff. And it's like wow, like I see a lot of myself in that, and it's like it's cool that like I'm not weird for like how I feel and like needing to be able to write music to help myself feel better. It's like cool to see other people do that and like succeed from it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Do you see anybody else in that kind of picture, or was is that just like the big one?
SPEAKER_00Oh, totally, yeah. Um, I grew up listening to AJR. I know like they don't they get a lot of from people online, but like I I grew up being a big fan of them and I still am. Um and I just look like they're it's a very similar thing, which is like the songwriting and how they write their songs. Like they write it in this very weird way that like talks about a specific thing, but like doesn't actually talk about the specific thing. It like talks about more the feeling of it and how it affected them or like like their outlook on something, and that's just like so like relatable. But definitely like their like musicality and like aspects of their production I find really inspiring because they do all these different unique things that like you wouldn't think about when writing a song. And so I've definitely like, especially in my earlier days of like when I started learning how to produce music, I took a lot from that or was like, oh wow, like I really like how they use strings like that, or like how they use like horns and like take in these like big theatrical elements and make it into a pop song. Like I that's pretty cool. So I definitely like leaned a lot towards that. Um, I'm trying to think who else. A lot of indie folk artists. There's this guy, Slim Dan. I think he's like based out of California, but he's a really like neat guy. He has a really good album called Second Dinner that I found a couple summers ago, and I like listened to it all summer. It's just like a really like sick sound of like this like very acoustic, very like laid-back kind of vocal. Like it's just it was really cool. Um trying to think of who else. Um, let me go through my Spotify while um we do this, but they definitely definitely a lot of inspiration from different artists.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um, like do you find yourself kind of like genre surfing um a lot, or do you just you just kind of like stick to one or two different kinds of things?
SPEAKER_00Oh, it definitely changes a lot, but it's more of like not changing for the sake of oh, I'm gonna write this kind of song now. It's just kind of been like how I've grown up almost. Whereas like when I started out, it was very like pop, like rock kind of thing, like alternative kind of like out of like bubblegum pop almost. And then like as I like grew and matured, it kind of turned into this more like acoustic folk alternative kind of thing, where it's like this more like unique sound compared to like these like big grand ideas that I like initially had.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I think you I think you really do get to see that evolution like with a lot of artists, um, in terms of like their earlier music, how it it might sound not necessarily like they're trying to do too much, but they're trying to like put themselves in a box because of whatever it's like if they take inspiration from somebody or the kind of music that they just listen to a lot, but then it slowly like morphs into this like personal sort of sound that like doesn't get recreated, and I think that's just so cool. And I I actually like I've I've observed it with you. Like I walk I listened to like a couple your like uh older songs, and then I like compared and contrasted, and it was like yeah, like like looking back, I know you you just cringed as I said that, but I was like, Yeah, there's some old stuff in there, but it's like looking back, and it's like when you know when you were making that, that was because like you wanted to make music, like yeah, like there's there's this this like poetic sense of like growth, and you can like you can really see that in someone's music, like yeah, even like the I mean the top level people, like they sound nothing like they used to when they first started making music. Yeah, but I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.
SPEAKER_00No, no, yeah. No, that's kind of like I have so many old songs up that like I don't think I like I don't plan on taking down. Like I it's like even though like it embarrasses me or like it makes me cringe listening to it, but it's just like I like being able to show like this is how I started in 2021 and this is how it sounded then versus like this is where I am now. So I think it's just pretty cool. So I think a lot of the times you only see an artist when they have the big budget that they have to afford like a studio and like a producer and all that stuff, but like I just like having it like like putting it all on the table, kind of just like showing like this is who I am, this is who I was, kind of thing.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And that's another thing too, like you know, there could be one day where you're like playing a show, someone comes up to you and they're like, Oh, I looked at your Spotify, you've been making music for three years, that's awesome. And you're like, Well, actually, I've been making music for nine years, and I just wanted to take all my earlier stuff down. Um, in your opinion, what what makes a song great?
SPEAKER_00I think there's a lot of stuff that goes into that, but I think it really like for me it's more of like the writing and like the lyricism and the meaning behind it and like how it makes you feel. Um I'm trying to see if I have like an example of one of my songs I really like. Like I use like allergy pills as an example is a song I put out last year, and it's the one that like everyone that I know that like knows me for playing music, like they know me for the song. Every time I see them, they're like, Oh, you're gonna play allergy pills at this? I'm like, yeah. And so it's like kind of like my one-hit wonder, even though it's not a big song or like anything close to it. But um, the reason I really like it, and I think the reason a lot of people gravitate towards it, is because it like the way it's written and because it's just like this really it's called allergy pills, and like the whole like me, like message in the song, it's like you're like taking like this allergy medication that doesn't do anything to help you feel better, but you still take it every day because that's like what you were told to do. And so like people listen to that song, and like I've had people ask me, like, is this about like anxiety medication or like is this about like drug abuse? And it's like all these different things where it's like that's so cool that like you're able to like listen to this and take that away from it. But it was literally just about allergy pills. It was because like um I like growing up, I would like get a stuffy nose in like the spring or like the fall because of like pollen allergy. And so my mom would say, like, take your allergy pills, and so I would take like my allergy pill and it wouldn't do anything to like clear my sinuses or help me feel better. And so it's like kind of taking like the song is like taking that like moment of frustration and applying it to like not being able to grow in your life and not being able to like progress how you want to be progressing. So it's like it's really just about that frustration, but like it's written in this more like vague, like um what's it called? Like like abstract way where people can listen to it and be like, oh, this makes me think about this. And I think that's what makes a good song. I think it's really about what people interpret out of it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, for sure. Um, I think one of the things that a lot of people think about when they're thinking about like a perfect song is like some big grandiose moment or like some some huge story that's like completely never been told before, but like in reality, it's like the complete opposite of that. It's just like these these simple things where it's like past experiences that people might not even think twice about.
SPEAKER_00Oh, definitely. Yeah, I think it's like a lot of like the best songs are about these really little moments or these like really little feelings, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um, do you do you do any uh like shows by you or anything?
SPEAKER_00Um, I do a lot of open mics and I do a lot of on-campus performances. Like there's like a radio station on campus that invites me to a bunch of their events, which has been really like awesome to do. Um, and like I've opened for like little bands that come to perform on campus. Um, but I'm like trying to like um I'm funding myself to like get like equipment, I'm saving up money to buy like a speaker and a mixer and stuff. So hopefully I'll be able to just actually go out and start like playing my own shows at like little coffee shops, like little restaurants, and kind of start like building it up because like I love playing live music and it doesn't matter where it is or like how many people are there. Like I would play for a room of three people. Like it I just like love to just perform. And um, I actually I started out, I think I was in like freshman or sophomore year at high school uh over the summer. Every like I think it was Thursday, like every Thursday or Friday, I would go like I would play live music at a Chick-fil-A in my hometown. It was like this, like they they like reached out to me and like I would just go every week and I would I had a little tip jar and I didn't even know guitar yet. I was playing ukulele, just standing there in the corner of the restaurant playing ukulele, and people would come and tip me, and I would get free Chick-fil-A. It was all it was a great gig. But I like I think about that a lot where it's like I was just like it was such a weird like environment to be performing in, but I was just really happy to do it. Like it was just fun. How how did that like come about? Like how uh like it my mom is like my agent, I swear. Like she keeps finding like it's all through Facebook. Like she like scrolls Facebook and she'll like go through like the Facebook groups of like our town or like the neighboring towns, and like just to look, and like someone would be like, Oh, I need a musician for this thing. Like, does someone want to play live music at this? And so she'll just sign me up for it and let me know. And so that that's how that started. Like, she got me in contact with this Chick-fil-a manager, and like we coordinated, and so every week I was just at this Chick-fil-a playing like my original songs and some covers, and then I would get my nuggets and my lemonade, and it was awesome.
SPEAKER_01That's awesome, yeah. Um, how how how how big is that like to have uh like people close to you that are supportive of music?
SPEAKER_00Oh, it's awesome. Like um, like we were talking about earlier, like um inspirations, like outside of music, like my parents are usually my biggest like inspirations. Like I have a song about it on the album I just put out. It's called The Man, and it's all about my dad. And because like my parents have been like the most supportive about this whole journey, like whenever I need something or whatever I like whenever I play a show, they're there. Like they drive all the way to like my school to like watch me play a few songs on stage, and like they don't have to, and like I don't expect them to be there, but they like make an effort to go to these things and to like show up, and like it's just like like I love like how much it makes them happy to see me like make something or like to see me like do something, and like I I couldn't be more grateful, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Because that's something too that like I mean a very small percentage of people even think about doing, and then the even smaller percentage of people take action to like actually make music because like I mean there's a very small amount of musicians in the world, but the ones that are are usually cover bands or yeah, like stuff like that, like it it takes that that extra bit of like willingness to put yourself out there to sing like your own lyrics instead of lyrics that have already been validated by society.
SPEAKER_00Oh, totally, yeah. I agree. It's weird because like I'm almost like desensitized to it in a way since I've been doing it since like I've been doing it for I think nine years now, like writing and just like performing the stuff I write. But it is very like when I think about it, sometimes I'll be playing a show and like a lot of my songs like are pretty sad in a way where I just talk about these like bad feelings that I have, but there's always like this kind of hopeful like undertone to it that gives me like a reason to write it. But I'll be like playing like at like a restaurant and there'll be all these people like like locked in, like listening. I'll be like, oh my god, like I'm singing like the most like the pressing line right now, but I have you all like paying attention to me, like this is insane. And it's like leaving your heart out on the table. It's like it's very like it's very like you have to be very vulnerable. For sure.
SPEAKER_01Um, do you do you get much um like sense of like people actually like singing along? Or is that something that like you you you don't get like quite yet?
SPEAKER_00Oh no, definitely not. Like it didn't like my like a lot of my friends and like a lot of the people that know me at my school that go to my shows, like know like the the chorus to allergy pills, so like they'd sing along to something like that, but definitely not like playing like nowhere near that level yet, and I don't know if I ever will be, but like it's definitely like something where like oh that would be so cool, like if like a room full of people like sang like the song, or like could I like like hearing people sing something back to me. Like it's definitely like it's like a bucket list item in a way, or like that would be so cool, yeah.
SPEAKER_01That's that's kind of something that I I think about too because it's like you have to be vulnerable to even do something like sing a song at a karaoke night, but it's like like I said earlier, like a song that you sing karaoke, people will probably know, and that's like half the point of the reason you sing it. So you kind of like bring up the the morale in the room and you get people singing along, and they they even like sometimes kind of drown out your voice so it doesn't feel like you're putting yourself as far out there, yeah. But like what you do is like like I'm I I'm gonna be way out in the open and like it's just me, and you might not know this song, but I'm gonna sing it to you, and that's yeah, I think that's just so cool.
SPEAKER_00No, it's it it's like a like it's always a really great feeling because you like I play a lot of like public places where people have no reason to stop and listen or like pay attention where they could just like talk. So it's really interesting when I play like something like a busy bar, and like I start playing like a pretty like slow ballad where it's this song about like this like really weird insecurity that I have, and all of a sudden like everyone is like turning. and just like listening. And so like it's it's it's a very like cool feeling where it's like, oh like it's cool that people care about this even though they don't know who I am or like what the song is.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um do you is there any sort of like creative headspace that you get into for songwriting?
SPEAKER_00Um as of recent I've like felt this kind of like weird writer's block that takes a it take it's been taking me a long time to like bang out a song or like to like figure out what I want to write about. But it it happens once in a while where I fall into these like little dry spots where it's like I'm just like not focusing on it as much. But definitely last year I got into this like really like quick flow where I just kept churning out like song after song after song and it ended up like leading into the album. Like my original plan like this album I put out Divine Intervention it started as an idea for an EP with like four songs on it. And then I wrote another one I was like oh I can have five songs on it. And then I wrote another I was like okay maybe six. And then there's so many more that came I was like okay I just want to make an album like I have so many songs I just want to share. So I think it definitely is like my mood and like things that have happened recently because like I think for a lot of people that I've talked to or like a lot of artists that I've listened like to interviews of like to be able to like write a good song they really have to kind of just like experience life and like let things happen to them that like it strikes in like it strikes inspiration or it like they're feeling some sort of way because of something that happened to them that they're able to like create a piece of art based off of it. So I think it's been like a lot of that where it's just like something happens and I know when it like I get into this kind of sort of mood and I'll usually just write one line of like a lyric into my phone and I'll just leave it and then another day like when like I another idea hits my head I'll go back and I'll look and I'll like add a melody to it or I'll write another line and then all of a sudden I'm into this flow and then half an hour later the song's done. So it's a lot of like writing something down and coming back to it like a few days later, weeks later, months later sometimes years later and being like, oh this was a cool line like what is this song about so it's like a mix of waiting for things to happen and then actually sitting down and like trying to do it. But it's it it definitely changes a lot for me. I don't have like a specific process that I need to get into like I don't have like a routine or like ritual surrounding it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um that's kind of similar to uh what I heard recently I I listened to a podcast with Hardy. It's like a really popular um mostly country music but he does sing and then he also songwrites for like other artists so he'll sell songs to other people and stuff. But um like on the podcast he opened his notes app on his phone and it was just singular lines that he had thought of and he's just like scrolling and he's scrolling and he's like I can't show you this because this is like 15 years worth of lyrics and I haven't even used half of them yet.
SPEAKER_00Yeah like yeah it it just kind of lives there for a little bit.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. But that's that's one thing um that I I think of like when I first started this podcast I did the first few episodes by myself before realizing that I feel like my mission with this is to talk to people. So I think yeah and and it was just like I didn't really want to like white knuckle ideas. Like I didn't want to sit down at a desk and just like all right think of something to talk about for 25 minutes. And then it's just like like I had a few things that I really wanted to talk about that were like on my mind at the time but then um after that it was just like I would be um I would just like be on a walk or something and I would think about it. Like something would just pop into my head whether I'm listening to music or not or whatever. And I would just write it down and then I would just start going off of it and going off of it and going off of it and like expanding and stuff. Because I feel like even the most like niche of topics or like you know you can make a a 30 minute podcast based off a quote you heard. Yeah. In a song or like something like that and just how it relates to you and like there's there's so much to talk about. So I just but I felt like my personal like mission with this was to get stories from other people and kind of like bounce ideas off them. Yeah. But yeah I I I can definitely see what you mean uh that that kind of idea of you know you're like in the setting where you feel like you should be productive and it's just nothing's just nothing's happening.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And it that's like when that happens like if I try to sit down and just like force out a whole song without like any real like feeling behind it like it just it turns into a dud and I like I don't like it and it's just kind of like it it falls away into like the back of my notes app forever. But like there's also other times where it's like there's like a little piece of it that had something. And so like I go back to that and I use it in something else that like I end up actually liking. So it's like back and forth of like okay like is this usable or is this just no good at all? And it's it's it's like I know too and it's like okay this this took like a long time but this just isn't it like it's not there yet. So you have to kind of keep working it. But earlier when you're talking about the the interview you listened to about the notes app, I have a similar thing with my like voice notes. I have like hundreds of just like untitled voice notes. I think I'm in like the 700s right now. And it's just there's there's just a bunch of them and that's how I like kind of that's my songwriting process. I'll just like when I come up with the melody for the verse I'll record it on my phone without lyrics like I'll just like be like singing like DAS and like Laws and like singing into my phone and then I'll like sit with that and I'll listen to it back and I'll play guitar and I'll be like okay like what are the lyrics to this and I kind of like figure it out that way.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Um do you have like a similar writing process to all your songs in terms of like do you think of a title first or do you think of a lyric and like reverse engineer it?
SPEAKER_00Or is it just kind of It's happened both ways before like sometimes I'll think of like like I think allergy pills started with just allergy pills and it was like okay like what is that and then it's working backwards. But then like there's songs where like I'll write the whole song and I don't know what the name is and so I like see like okay is there a line in this that makes a cool title or is there like an other cool title that has nothing to do with like a word in the song but like encapsulates what the song is about. So the process definitely changes a lot but it definitely starts with a phrase or like an interesting melody that I end up putting a phrase over and then like kind of focusing on the words first and then the music.
SPEAKER_01So it's just kind of like whatever comes to you first kind of thing.
SPEAKER_00And then it's very natural thing. It's like it's very much not like okay I need to write the guitar part now it's time for like the lyrics and now it's like it's it's very like back and forth all over the place.
SPEAKER_01Okay. I I plucked a lyric from one of your songs um I will say it to you and then I want you to I I'm assuming you'll be able to but tell me what song it's from okay that was just like a fun thing I thought we could um and then after I'm gonna have you expand on it because I listened to about 20 to 30 minutes of your music at the gym earlier. I wanted to find like one thing like one lyric from one song that like really hit me differently okay and this was like one of the ones that really did. So the line is too focused on my future but not enough on my goal.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah it's old soul. Yeah of course yeah yeah yeah I love that one. Yeah I would really like to know uh where that came from uh like kind of expand upon that if there's any deeper thing to it um because that whole song is very much about the idea of like me feeling a lot older than I really am like I present myself in like a more mature way than I feel like a lot of people that are my age and I like try really hard to be like this mini adult that I'm very much not a lot of the time. And so that's kind of what like started Old Soul but that line at the end was very much about like it's honestly about like me wanting like this music career and like spending so much time on like trying to like put myself out there and like post on TikTok and like try to get this attention. And then so like I'm too focused like on my feel like this possible future but like not like the actual goal at hand like not my like I'll like put school like on the back burner to like work on a song sometimes or like I'll like I won't think about like an actual like viable future that I could like have with like with a career and kind of like like focus on music instead.
SPEAKER_01So that's where that kind of came from but it's just that idea of like focus like daydreaming over reality you know yeah I I I think a lot of people can relate to that like I I myself personally can relate to that like just being able to like this is like exhibit A like I have homework due tomorrow night bro like but it's what you love doing. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And so like it's it's not a bad thing at all. It's like like it's your passion it makes you happy like it deserves your attention and your time.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I also think that it's just like these these years of our lives like especially like in college like there's we're gonna be exposed to like the most stimulus that we've ever been exposed to and so it's like I think if you if you have a dream even if it fizzles out after you graduate from college like at least you tried at least you like did something that you wanted to do regardless of what other people thought.
SPEAKER_00Yeah yeah it's important to have like that outlet to get you through it. Yeah yeah um do you do you have like a little like group on campus that that you like produce songs with I I saw a couple people in like one of your videos on Sky um no I I do all of my writing and my production by myself but um at my school um I'm in this co-ed premier a cappella group called the bottom line um and there's like it's just like a really great place of like all these like like minded people who are passionate about music and singing. And so it like my time in the group has definitely helped me a lot like with my songwriting, my production and just like learning more about music theory and like oh this is like how I can produce like a large gang vocal and like make all these cool harmonies and like it just helped me a lot with that. But like I got like some people in that like some of my friends in the group to sing like backup vocals on stuff. And so like I definitely I go to them a lot for and I want to go to them a lot for my next album and like my next set of music that I want to record to like get back like backing vocals and like all these other stuff because there's so many talented people that I've met through that program.
SPEAKER_01Yeah for sure it really does take a village like with things like this and um something that I've noticed especially with podcasting is that like shows that include guests like are very guest heavy and I think being able to like have meaningful conversations with people is like what makes a podcast really great. Because like anybody can sit down and have an interview with somebody and um you know it just can kind of be this sort of like vanilla it just kind of feels like unnatural un like very structured um and so like when I you know have an episode coming up like I'll think of a few questions a few topics that I want to talk about but I really try to like bring it into conversation as much as possible but like that really does take people like I I I like to employ like if I want to talk to one of my friends like I'll be like hey will you will you come on the podcast I want to talk about a couple things with you um or just you know just anything I I feel like one of the things that people need to see more is that like asking people for help and like recruiting the help of people does not make you less of anything. Like oh yeah it doesn't mean you're less validated at all.
SPEAKER_00Yeah yeah and like I'm used to doing like this whole process by myself but looking into the future my best friend Thomas is a music major and he's like trying to learn production so I think we're gonna co-produce my next project together which we're super excited about because it like helps him learn more and then like I get to like do something I love with my best friend. And so I'm ri I'm very excited to like make this more of a collaboration thing rather than just me like working away by myself and like it should you I have a like a little like setup in my bedroom at home. But when I'm at school I usually go to like a random classroom in the middle of the night and I'll just set up my laptop and like my little microphone setup and like I'll just like produce for a couple hours like late into the night but it's it's it's it's a fun process regardless of with if it's with people or without people but I definitely get what you mean where it's like it takes a village and it's like okay to like have people help you get to where you need to go with it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um do you have a favorite song you've written oh that's tough.
SPEAKER_00Um like I think uh my best song I've written is definitely allergy pills and I think a lot of people um like agree with me on that one a lot of people like a lot of the people I talk to that like listen to my music or like come to the shows I play on campus or like even my friends a lot of them really like my song Shadows um and I like that one a lot too but I don't usually think of that as one of my best ones but a lot of people gravitate towards that. A lot of people gravitate towards Wish I could say which is um one that I was really proud of I think production wise on my last album. I think that one's my favorite in that aspect but I have uh an unreleased song that I want to put out at some time in the future it's called The Sun Will Rise. And I wrote it I think when I was in high school I think I was a junior in high school and I wrote it which is crazy because it's my favorite song I've ever written. And that's why I've waited so long to put it out because I want to be able to do it justice, you know, in a way like I want to be able to like be proud of how it sounds and like be like really happy with it and like be like okay like this is how this should sound when it's released. And so that's definitely something I want to work towards because it's just like a really beautiful song about this like kind of like feeling that I grew up with and that I was raised to have where it's like um like don't like I I'm trying to figure out how to word it. But it's like it's basically the idea of like don't go to bed like mad at someone or like don't go like into the next day like with the same problem as the night before it's like this idea of like it's a new day like let's start over kind of thing. And it's it's just like I it's like the songwriting is like weird and abstract and like I really love the melody and like it's just it's just it's always been my favorite. So whenever I play a show I usually introduce that as my favorite but you like it happens a lot where I'll like I'll introduce any song as my favorite song.
SPEAKER_01For sure. I think that's a big thing is like being being proud of what you write and no matter necessarily like how how you might like you might like you know the melody of one song but it's like well this song has a really cool verse and I think there's a lot of story to be told behind that so I can't necessarily say one is better than the other one.
SPEAKER_00Yeah it's hard to rank them sometimes like I definitely like I think I could be able to rank them like if I really thought about it but it's just it's the thing that's like I wouldn't be singing them or like performing them or really releasing them if I wasn't proud of it. You know like I like I love all of them and like it's because it's like it's genuinely just like my life like written down. It's like it's my experience, my perspective on these all like all these different things. And like I'm just like I'm very happy with how I've learned how to like do it. Cause like my older music is very like surface level which is like perfectly okay for like the age I was when I did it and like the experience I had because it was all I knew how to do but like I like learned as I progressed I kind of learned to have like this nuance or like this like like not be as direct as like I used to be with my songwriting like kind of be more poetic or like like talk where like it's like almost like painting a picture. Like it's like like I like I almost think about it because it is kind of poetry but I'm not a big poetry guy which is funny enough. But as I think I've thought about it more like that where it's like oh like how can I like talk about this using like a weird metaphor or like this weird like association with something that isn't exactly what I'm trying to talk about.
SPEAKER_01Yeah um so kind of like bouncing off that um your your most recent album uh Divine Intervention can you kind of walk me through like like the title and like the theme of that because I I I see it like bringing me two different ways.
SPEAKER_00Mm-hmm I it definitely I think Divine Intervention was just like a thing I had written down in my notes app and it was like um I the first song I wrote for it was Praying Doesn't kill and I I grew up Catholic I'm still Catholic but I have a weird relationship with my faith and it's like almost this like not ironic but it's this very like disjointed like relationship with God where it's like like yes I believe in you but why do you let all of these things happen so it's this kind of like back and forth kind of thing and like I think a lot of people interpret like my music like when I mention God or I mention religion as like oh like he's really really religious. When more it's this kind of like different perspective on it. And so like I see like divine intervention as like because the whole album is talking about all these problems I have in my life, my insecurities like my like poor self-image and like just things that I'm worried about or upset about or mad at like people I'm mad at, people that I'm having trouble forgiving um people in my life getting sick and passing away. It's about all these different things that can't magically be fixed by some divine intervention. So that was the idea behind it where it's like I can have all this hope and I can like want things to change but it's not going to just magically be okay. Like I need to put work into this I need to like figure out how to get to the other side. Like no one's just gonna pull me there. And so it's that that's where the idea of the name came from and then I like I was going through my notes app and I was like that would be a really good name for this album like that is like what I've been writing about in a way and then the the the little album cover of like the the Pope costume kind of just came after I I actually that was my Halloween costume from the year before and I was like this would be like that would be a pretty funny like album cover for it.
SPEAKER_01So that that kind of came after too yeah um I have a I have a friend that actually recently just like blew up on TikTok. He went from Oh really yeah dude he went from That's awesome he went from like he had like a few thousand followers who've been making fitness videos for a long time but he recently just went from I I want to say it was around like five thousand ish to five hundred thousand in like oh my gosh in like four months. That's awesome. Yeah yeah and so it was like hit his his big thing was um he does like car talk videos so he'll say something that can be taken like metaphorically and he'll say like let me cook and then he'll like ex he'll like go into depth with it after um but like one of his uh most popular videos is um if your goal is to catch the bus you better be running and like so he he basically goes into it by saying like if you it like if you're praying for these things like you better also be working towards them.
SPEAKER_00You can't just expect yeah you can't just yeah you can't be asking for it to happen to you. Yeah. Totally yeah no that it's it's a very similar thing where it's like I think a lot of the album it's me being really hard on myself for things that like aren't necessarily my fault or like aren't necessarily within my control. And so it's kind of this like mindset of like okay well I need to do something to make this better. And so a lot a lot of the album is about like trying to figure out how I can change or how I can like do things better for myself. And I like I touch on that at the very end of the album in the epilogue um it's like the epilogue goes through each song in order like kind of touching on it and at the end it I think the line it's like um some divine intervention can't fix what I've mentioned. And so like it's like now I'm still stuck and I need this all to myself because I need the help. And so it's like admitting like okay like I really need someone else's help right now. Like this isn't just going to fix itself. Yeah. Yeah and it's it's like it's honor it's really funny because like I'll write something like this and I'll continue living my life and like like just because I've put this out doesn't mean I've like made the changes I've need to make because like I fell into like uh like a I I was just really down like a couple months ago like last year in the fall I was in a really weird headspace and like I was I was like I I could convince myself like I can get through this on my own. I don't need like anyone to talk to like I can I can get through this. And it just like kept getting worse and worse and worse until finally it's like okay like I need to go talk to someone like I need to get out of this and so it was just funny I was like okay like I like I can write songs about like what I need to be doing but then it's still like I don't even listen to myself or my own advice sometimes. And I I find that pretty funny. Do as I say not as I do. Yeah exactly yeah a lot of me and a lot of my like really close friends fall victim to that a lot of the time because we give each other great advice and we're always like because the answer is always right in front of us and like we're just like helping each other like take it. And so it's it but we can never help ourselves it's really interesting.
SPEAKER_01Yeah um what is your like what is your mission with music like what like what are you hoping to do with all this honestly like it's not even about like getting somewhere with it it's more just about like helping people with it.
SPEAKER_00And it doesn't matter how many to me like um like my favorite thing ever is like posting a snippet of one of my songs on TikTok and like it'll get like 10 likes but one personal comment like this really made my day like this really helped me. And like so just being able to like share my experience and my perspective and like help people feel that they're not alone in some things like it just that it it gives me purpose in a way where like I like know like okay like this thing that helps me helps other people so I want to keep sharing it. So I think that's really neat. So I would say that's definitely my big goal is just like helping people feel just a little less alone even if it's like a song that no one else in the world will ever hear, you know? Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um how how like important has it been um for like social media for promoting your music because like just like not too long ago short form content and stuff like really wasn't a thing. Yeah. And it just seems like it's becoming like the mainstream way that people like like promote things. So how has that helped you?
SPEAKER_00Uh it's definitely like it's the short form content has definitely been big because when I started out it wasn't a th Really a thing at all. And um, like the only way I can really get my music out there is I used to just like post covers on YouTube, and like those would get a couple hundred views, and people would start subscribing to me. And then Shorts came around and I posted, I think, a cover of um the Oliver Tree song, uh, Jerk that had just like turned into like a remix called Miss You that got really popular, but it was just like a sped up version of the song that I already knew. So I did a cover of Jerk and that got like a couple hundred thousand views like out of nowhere, and I got like a like a few thousand followers or subscribers from it, and that was really like, oh wow, like this short form content, like out of nowhere, can just like strike and you'd like get a following from it, which is crazy. Um, it's definitely something I need to get better at, like with this next wave of music I want to put out, because I'm just so bad at like putting myself out there um and like talking about myself. Like I like I hate like promoting my music, I don't know why, but like I just like hate to be the guy like hey, like go listen to my album. Like I'm just like not that kind of person where it's like it's like I'll play it, and if someone like asks, like I'll be like, oh yeah, like this is my Spotify. But like I'm very much much not like assertive when like trying to market myself and like I don't know why. And it's just like it like embarrasses me in a way. Like like I'm I'm not really sure, but um it's it's definitely helped a lot and it's something I need to like look into more because like I'll I'll like post a video of myself singing like a random song, but like I really need to like actually put it more effort into my marketing because I I do think it could help it go somewhere, but it's just like a matter of like putting the time into it and like having the consistency that I really struggle with.
SPEAKER_01I think kind of I can take I mean a lot of that and apply it to myself as well. Um just like like the whole reason I started doing Zoom calls instead of like just like in-person things, is um like so I can be able to like take snippets and post them. Yeah. And I haven't done a whole lot with that yet. Um I I kind of want to make sure it's like it's the right, it's the right way of putting it out there. Yeah. But um I I kind of compare it to like literally buying a lottery ticket for free.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's a really great that's a great comparison.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And it's like the the great thing is like there's no limit to the amount of tickets you can buy.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And it only take advantage of it. But exactly, yeah. And it really only takes one. And I think I think one of the things that inspired me to like start doing it more and you know, buy myself more tickets per se, is um like like seeing one of my friends like blow up on TikTok, yeah, like just talking to himself in his car.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, because then you're like, it's like, wow, this is so achievable. I just need to actually do it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Yeah. And then the other thing too was um it was like shortly after the last like TikTok ban where it was actually banned for like half a day. Yeah, yeah, I remember that. Cause at that point, I mean, I've had TikTok since its conception, so I've had it since I was, I don't know, 15, like you know, eight years or however long it's been since it's been transformed from musically or whatever. But I kind of took that as like a oh, this can like for real just go away at any time. Like I need to take advantage of this. Do you feel kind of some of that similar?
SPEAKER_00Oh, totally, yeah. I was so like, I was so scared of about it just like disappearing. So it's like, oh wow, like that was my ticket that like I really hadn't utilized yet, just about to be gone. And like I like it's the thing, I I'll go, like, I'll be really good at being consistent about like posting TikToks and like I'll like actually start growing an audience and I'll like start gaining more and more followers, and then all of a sudden, like I just kind of stop doing it for some reason. And then like a couple months later, I remember like, oh, like I should post a TikTok, and it gets like a thousand views, and I'm like, why haven't I been doing this? Like, I'm actually just hurting myself by like not putting myself out there.
SPEAKER_01Do you do you find that also that there's this sort of like paradox that videos that you try less do better?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, definitely. Yeah, like um I put like I used to like I made a second account like on TikTok because I wanted to just like have a spam where I could just post whatever like song I wanted without actually having to like worry about editing a video that looked good. And so then I would use my main account for like more edited promos and stuff, and like they would never do well, and so I just started posting like the same content on both, and then like it started doing better on the main account out of nowhere. Like, so I just said been I've been posting there more recently because it like has a stronger pull for whatever reason. It's really strange, it's really weird trying to figure out how it works.
SPEAKER_01I I I really have discovered that myself. Um and then it was just like, yeah, one of the things that I I kind of realized about posting on social media is like, you know, whenever you see people, they're like, if you want to grow your TikTok or Instagram, you need to post whatever three to five times a day or yeah, whatever. And it's it's not so much. This is something I've realized, it's not so much um like being consistent with yourself, but like literally not giving people a choice but to be introduced to your content.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, like it's just it's just putting out so much that it's on someone's free page. Like someone, one of my friends' moms follows me on TikTok, and like she, I guess, like had like TikTok on the friends tab or like the following tab, not knowing she's on the following tab, and every single video is just me. And she was like, It's really good, but why is it only his video on my thing? And then like so it's yeah, it's just like if you just keep putting it out there, like if people are gonna see it, it's gonna it's gonna pop up eventually. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um do you have any kind of like insight as to what the the next like project's gonna look like yet?
SPEAKER_00Or are you still kind of um I have really big plans for like a next actual album, but I want to be able to kind of like grow with my production and like with my like musical skills more before I really like dig my teeth into it. But I have most of the songs written and I know what I want to do with it, but I think before that I want to put out um like a smaller thing, like whether it's a couple singles or like a small EP of a few songs that I've written recently that I'm pretty proud of, like the one that you had reached out to me because of. Um, like just like the like little songs like that that I'd like have written recently, that just that people are like that like they like it right now. So it's like, oh, I should record that and put that out and just kind of like focus on releasing little things to kind of build up more of an audience before I like put out my next big thing. And so I think I like right now, I want to put out a little EP of three songs, I think is my plan. And I want to record that, I think, over the next couple months and have it out before the summer is my um motivation for the next two months.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Um that was that was kind of why the the whole reason like I reached out to you in the first place. Because, you know, when I'm scrolling on TikTok, I find a you know a few of like the videos that you make every day, and they usually have like whatever 10 likes or something, like something pretty insignificant to the blind eye. But like I usually give them a few seconds, and like I I've found myself doing this kind of thing, it's like this psychological thing where if something if something has like not a lot of likes, I'm more inclined to scroll away.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, no, I I do the same thing like every day. It doesn't matter what video it is, if it has no likes, it's like I'm not watching this, it's not worth my time.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so what I've been trying to do more recently, and it's more so with music, because a lot of the videos that I see that have a very little likes are just very like low effort things that are kind of pointless. But every once in a while, like I'll c I'll come across a music video and I'll see like I'll be like, I'm gonna hear this guy or girl out. Like, are they a good singer? Like, are they actually like putting words like with meaning in their song? Or like are they actually like does it look like they're trying? And so like I s I saw that with you and I was like, oh, this like this looks like a full thing, and then I it was a weird thing where I looked over at the likes after I had given you a few seconds to kind of like catch my attention, and there wasn't that many, and I was like, I feel like this isn't fair. Like, I feel like this is one of the videos that I look at and it it looks no different than the ones that get hundreds of thousands. It looks no different like at face value, it's just a matter of the algorithm or the people that it was shown to first or whatever. But I was like, I would really like to get a chance to talk to somebody, especially someone that like is putting up the same level of content as some of these bigger creators, but just hasn't struck it yet.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, thanks, man. That that really means a lot. And that's like it's like that's one of the most like reassuring things that like I hear from people that like really keeps me going, where it's like you really have something here, like just keep going and something will happen. And that's like just kind of what I've learned. Like, I I I've like last summer I had a lot of success on um my other TikTok account, like or like in my eyes, a lot of success. Like I was able to gain a ton of followers to doing a bunch of covers like every day or like showing some of my songs, and like it's really cool. Like, there's just like a few random people that are actually like fans of me, which like I still like it, like it's weird to wrap my head around, like like especially someone my size. Like, I have less than a hundred monthly listeners on Spotify, but there's people that will comment on every single one of my videos, and they're like, I love what you do, and I have no clue who they are. Like, I went to a concert over the summer and I was walking around, I heard someone say my name, like they said my full name. And I turned around, I was expecting to like to see someone I know, and it was like this girl and her dad, and she was like, I like I love your videos on TikTok. Like, I like I'm a big fan. I'm like, What? Like, no way. Like, if we're like this is a joke, like someone like paid you to say this. Like, it's like, do you know someone I know? But they were serious, and like they actually listened to my music, and that was like the it was a surreal experience. And I was with my mom, and like my mom's mind was blown. Like it, like I was like, it it shocked me, but like she was like she texted the whole family about it, and it was this big thing, like, oh my god, like someone like knew who he was, and so that was just like a huge moment, and it's like, wow, like if I I could really get this somewhere if I just like keep doing it, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Well, stay consistent, man. That's that's awesome. I mean, you you I feel like you really do you really do have something. Um thank you. So um that's all I got for you, to be honest. So um I will give you as much time as you want. Go ahead, promote your socials, tell us like where we can find you, stay up to date with what you're doing.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I'm Jack Brzec, um uh singer, songwriter, folk, acoustic musician. Um, I'm on Spotify, Apple Music. Anywhere you listen to music, I just put out Divine Intervention last fall. Um, my last name is spelled B-R-Z-E-N-K. It's a bit of a weird one. Um, but yeah, Jack Brzezink on all socials. Um, new music coming within the next couple months, so keep an eye out for that. I'll probably be promoting a lot out of it. Um maybe TikToks daily, not uh promised. But yeah, um I listen and I hope you like it. That's that's that's all about me. Awesome. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Thanks, Jack. Um, yeah, no problem. Uh you are always welcome. If you need anything, you know, shoot me a message or whatever. Oh, thanks, man. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, of course.
SPEAKER_01Uh all the time. Thank you so much. I'll have this out in uh just a couple of days, so I'll message you when it comes out instead.