Hope Comes to Visit

Against All Odds: Fatherhood, Loss, and Hope with Richie Treadway

• Danielle Elliott Smith • Season 1 • Episode 27

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Content note: pregnancy loss and medical trauma.

Entrepreneur and dad Richie Treadway joins me to talk about becoming a parent later in life, the moment everything fell apart—and the choice to keep going. 

We don’t relive every detail; we sit with what it took to advocate, to grieve, and to try again. 

Richie names the kind of love that “changes the way your heart works,” and defines hope as the resilience to not quit against all odds. 

If you’re somewhere between heartbreak and possibility, this one’s for you.

Connect with Richie here on his own website.

Thank you for listening to Hope Comes to Visit. If this conversation helps, follow the show, share it with someone who needs hope today, and leave a review - it helps others find their way to these conversations.

New episodes drop every Monday, so you can begin your week with a little light and a lot of hope.

For more stories, reflections, and ways to connect, visit www.DanielleElliottSmith.com or follow along on Instagram @daniellesmithtv and @HopeComestoVisit



SPEAKER_02:

All of her movements start to slow, and her smile starts to go away.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, Richie. And there's no heartbeat.

SPEAKER_04:

I'm Danielle Elliott Smith, and this is Hope Comes to Visit, where we celebrate conversations about hope, healing, and light. And of course, the power of story. Today's guest is husband, father, and entrepreneur Richie Treadway. Let's take a quick moment to thank the people that support and sponsor the podcast. When life takes an unexpected turn, you deserve someone who will stand beside you. St. Louis attorney Chris Duly offers experienced one-on-one legal defense. Call 314-384-4000 or 314-DUI help. Or you can visit Dulilawfirm.com. That's D-U-L-L-E lawfirm.com for a free consultation. Richie, thank you so much for being here with me today. It is wonderful to sit down with you. Good morning. How are you doing today?

SPEAKER_02:

I'm doing all right. Today is a nice, beautiful day where I live.

SPEAKER_04:

And you mentioned that you are in the Harrisburg area, yes?

SPEAKER_02:

Yes.

SPEAKER_04:

I was fascinated by the email you sent me talking about the power of hope and storytelling. And by nature, you said you are a writer, yes?

SPEAKER_02:

Yes.

SPEAKER_04:

And there is a specific experience you and your family, you and your wife had that traumatic. And yet while your wife wants you to write about it because you are a writer and a lot of it she doesn't remember, you have found yourself in a bit of a block.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, even just thinking about it right now, I'm already starting to swell up.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh okay. Well, we'll go slow and we'll be easy. And this is just a conversation between a couple of friends because I am honored and grateful that you're willing to have this conversation with me, right? Because I'm there is beauty and light in this story. And through the hard things, you and your wife have been able to do something miraculous, right? So why don't we start wherever you are wanting to start with with your story? Tell me a little bit about you and your wife.

SPEAKER_02:

Um we met much later in life. So we have only been married for three years. I'm already almost 50.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay, what's your wife's name?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh her name is Rebecca.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. So Richie, Rebecca. How did you guys meet?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh we worked in the same place.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. And so she is your love.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, it did turn out to be that way.

SPEAKER_04:

Tell me about Rebecca.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh, she's a very strong woman. She's a government contractor. She runs a large crew of people, and working as a contractor for the government, you know, she tends to catch a lot of flack. One for being a woman, two for being a contractor. So she's been doing this for almost 15 years now, and she's really good at her job.

SPEAKER_04:

So the two of you meet and and meeting and finding your love a little later in life, you decided that you wanted to start a family.

SPEAKER_02:

We both wanted to have children, but we never, it just never worked out for us up until this point.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. But you found each other. And so when you decide to start in that process, um, you were thinking that it might be a little more challenging knowing that you were starting a little bit later. Were you talking to doctors about it initially?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh yes. Um, she has PCOS, so we knew that it was going to take some work, especially being older. So we she went on medications, we had to do the schedule. We were going to doctors in Hershey every other week.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. And what happened?

SPEAKER_02:

Um eventually we were, it took some work, but we were able to conceive.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. So realizing that you could conceive, obviously that's a beautiful thing, and you're relieved. And how did the pregnancy go?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh we were relieved and we were also terrified, knowing that again, our age being a factor, the PCOS being a factor, she ended up with gestational diabetes, preoclampsia. So the the the whole thing was rough for her. She didn't have morning sickness, she had all the time sickness.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh.

SPEAKER_02:

She couldn't eat anything.

SPEAKER_04:

It just Are you and Rebecca the same age?

SPEAKER_02:

No, she is three years younger than I am.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. So in her 40s as well.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes. So going through this at this time, she was 41.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. Were the doctors concerned from the beginning as well?

SPEAKER_02:

They didn't seem to be. To them, it just seemed like another everyday thing. They know in this day and age pregnancies, women are getting are able to conceive at a later rate, later ages. It didn't seem to them like it was going to be a big deal.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

But we are the kind of people that look everything up on the internet, so everything we saw was terrifying.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh, you guys Google MD'd yourself into fear.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. So you're worried she's sick, which certainly doesn't help the situation. And so what happens? So how far into the pregnancy do you guys go with her being sick?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh she was sick every day, right up until about a week before we were going for the I think it was the 12-week ultrasound, the one where we get to find out the gender of the baby.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

And all of a sudden she just wasn't sick anymore.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. So then what happens? You go in for the ultrasound.

SPEAKER_02:

Well, during that week, something just didn't seem right. She was sure that something was wrong.

SPEAKER_04:

Really?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, so going into the appointment, we were terrified. And this was all during COVID. So all through all of our appointments, I had to wait in the car. And she would just, I would be on the phone during all the appointments with the doctor while I was in the car.

SPEAKER_04:

You weren't allowed to go into the ultrasound appointment with her, Richie?

SPEAKER_02:

No, none of them. This one was the very first appointment they were allowing guests in. So she went in by herself. She was getting ready for the appointment, and she mentioned to the technician that I was out there. And there were and she told them that I could come in. So she called me right away and I ran in as fast as I could.

SPEAKER_04:

Of course you did. I'm so glad you were able to be there with her. Okay. So you're getting ready to see your baby for the first time because you haven't been allowed to be into the appointments. Okay. So well, tell me about that appointment.

SPEAKER_02:

Uh we were we had a Adula. We decided that was the way to go. And she was doing the first. I don't know what the tool is called. It's kind of like an ultrasound, I suppose, but it's a tool that she was able to carry in her pocket.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. I'm not I'm not familiar with that.

SPEAKER_02:

I don't think it showed a video. She was just trying to find the heartbeat.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

And she would she wanted to practice with this particular tool. And even though we were concerned and we voiced our concerns, Becca was very scared. And she said, you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna find the heartbeat, it's gonna be fine. I'm gonna do it this way because I just I just want to play around. She used those words, I want to play around.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. So and this is the doula.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes.

SPEAKER_04:

Was this someone you trusted?

SPEAKER_02:

This is actually the first time we had met her. Going through this office, we had to decide if we wanted to go with a doctor or a nurse technician or a doula to, you know, proceed with the rest of the pregnancy. And we had decided on a doula, and we were meeting her for the very first time today.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. Well, let me ask you this: what made you guys decide doula versus nurse practitioner versus doctor for this part of the process?

SPEAKER_02:

I think Becca was more she liked the more spiritual side of working with the doula versus the technical side of being with the doctor.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay, that's fair. And with as fearful as she was, I think that she probably was hoping for as much positive and good and natural energy as she could, as she could garner in this process. Yes.

SPEAKER_02:

So this woman was definitely very, very bright.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. So she's bright and she is playing around, she has told you. And what happens next?

SPEAKER_02:

All of her movements start to slow, and her smile starts to go away.

SPEAKER_01:

Oh, Richie. And there's no heartbeat.

SPEAKER_04:

Knowing that she was using a tool that she was quote unquote playing around with, was there any chance that she was wrong?

SPEAKER_02:

Yes, so then they went to she just said, you know, I'll go get a doctor. I'll be right back. And she just fled the room.

unknown:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

We didn't see her again for like an hour. Uh a nurse came to get us, and they led us through the office, through some back hallways. The whole time we're we're breaking down.

SPEAKER_04:

Oh, Richie, I'm so sorry. Oh, sorry. No, do not apologize.

SPEAKER_02:

So we get to another room where they do an internal ultrasound to ensure the results are correct. And she was right, there is no heartbeat.

SPEAKER_04:

I'm so sorry.

SPEAKER_02:

So they walk us back through all those hallways, past all the staff. I mean, the only good thing was that we didn't go through the waiting room.

SPEAKER_03:

Right.

SPEAKER_02:

We get back to the room where we were, and there's already another couple in that room. So now they have to find a new room for us. They just stash us in a random room. The Dula then comes back and says, I'm so sorry, let me give you hugs. And even though we didn't know this woman and we did not want hugs, she forced hugs.

SPEAKER_04:

I'm so sorry.

SPEAKER_02:

She said that somebody will contact us for the next steps. And then she left, and that was it.

SPEAKER_04:

And you guys were just left in a room to figure out what to do next?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, we we left. We walked, we walked out, we left the waiting room, there was nothing else.

SPEAKER_04:

No one told you what happens next, or no, somebody was supposed to call us.

SPEAKER_02:

And nobody ever called.

SPEAKER_04:

No one ever called.

SPEAKER_02:

We waited for weeks with Becca not knowing what was going to happen.

SPEAKER_04:

So you and Becca are left to just wonder, feeling a multiplied sense of loss, but she is currently still physically pregnant.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes.

SPEAKER_04:

And neither of you know what the next step is.

SPEAKER_02:

No.

SPEAKER_04:

And you have no idea what her body is going to do or is supposed to do, or if there is any assistance for her.

unknown:

Not a clue.

SPEAKER_04:

At any point, did you guys reach out to the doctor's office and say, somebody give us some guidance? Like we are floundering here. No, we're and emotionally.

SPEAKER_02:

We took him at their word. We just expected somebody to call. I'm sorry, it sounds like he's coming.

SPEAKER_04:

No, that's okay. He can come.

SPEAKER_02:

What's the matter, buddy? Hey, what's the matter?

SPEAKER_04:

So here's the I'm sorry. No, that is okay. I suspect you probably needed that hug as much as he did. It's helpful. Yeah, it's good. That is good. So you took the doctors at their word that they would call and they didn't call. No. What happened next?

SPEAKER_02:

It was a rough time. I think I took the whole the whole four weeks off work. They wanted me to go back, but I I just I couldn't. And I couldn't leave her.

SPEAKER_04:

So she stayed pregnant for an additional four weeks.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04:

And her poor body and her poor heart and your poor heart. So emotionally both of you are struggling.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, because it wasn't just that we lost the baby. Wow. Anybody that's gone through that, it is devastating.

SPEAKER_04:

Of course.

SPEAKER_02:

But at our age, we felt like we lost our whole future.

SPEAKER_01:

Like this was our only show.

SPEAKER_04:

Thank goodness that was not the case for you as we we just saw young Richie.

SPEAKER_02:

I am so sorry.

SPEAKER_04:

That is okay. You saw young Richie come in to you, so you have not lost the future, which is a beautiful thing. You have you have a family, and we can talk about that more in a minute, but I do want to know how things progressed with Rebecca. And with the doctors never calling her, I know that things did not she did not miscarry peacefully, um, if there is such a thing. I mean, I I I hate to say that in a in a term as though miscarriage is ever a peaceful process, but it was her body did not um it was a devastating experience for her physically in addition to mentally.

SPEAKER_02:

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_04:

What happened?

SPEAKER_02:

Well, it just so happened to be the very first day I had to go back to work. And I'm getting ready to leave the house, and she just jumps up and runs to the bathroom. And I wait as long as I can, and I'm outside the door, and I'm asking her if she's okay, and she tells me just to leave. And I I wish I hadn't, but I did. I went to work.

SPEAKER_04:

You well, you did what you were direct- like she told you. You assumed that she was okay and that she just wasn't feeling well. Um, but what was actually happening?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh, she was actually beginning to miscarrie. I was only at work for half an hour and she called me. She called me from the bathtub. I could hear the water running in the background. And I just rushed home as quickly as I could. By the time I got there, she was lightheaded. She didn't exactly have all of her mental faculties. She had hemorrhaged, and she was losing so much blood. And on top of that, just everything else that happens with the miscarriage. So she had pulled a trash can up next to the tub, and she was just scooping material out of the drain to allow water to run. And I can't imagine something like that. I can't.

SPEAKER_04:

The trauma of the compounded losses that she was experiencing in losing the baby. And then the two of you feeling that this could be potentially a loss of the future that that you had planned, and feeling so uncared for, so discarded by the professionals who were supposed to guide you through this process.

unknown:

I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_04:

I assume you were able to get her to the hospital.

SPEAKER_02:

I could barely get her out of the tub. She'd already lost so much blood that she couldn't stand. So I got her up out of the tub and she immediately fell to her knees. And I helped her down to the floor and I called 911. And I don't know if we don't we don't buy a couple of things. I don't know. I guess laughably, she was concerned with paramedics seeing her naked.

SPEAKER_04:

You know, our modesty is this funny little thing.

SPEAKER_02:

And so I covered her up and I just sat on the floor and held her hand and waited for the paramedics to get there. And they finally showed up. You know, they were talking to her, asking her questions. One of the EMTs put a blood pressure cuff on her arm. And this is when I became the most scared. Is he looked at his partner and he said he can't get a reading. She had lost enough blood that they couldn't get a blood pressure reading.

SPEAKER_03:

Oh, Richie.

SPEAKER_04:

So at that point, you're worried you're gonna lose her too.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

They got her on the backboard as quick as they could, and they just left. I just stood at the end of the driveway watching them drive away. Got my car, followed him in the hospital. Everything there, everybody was scared. A nurse would come into the room about every 10 or 20 minutes. They would lift up the blanket and go, Oh my god, that's a lot of blood. And they would clean her up and anytime that they had to transport her for any tests or x-rays or whatever they were doing, a doctor would ride on the end of her bed with one of those uh the paddle machines that they used to start your heart when it stops. They would take that with her every every time she left the room.

SPEAKER_04:

I assume they stopped the hemorrhaging, did they not?

SPEAKER_02:

It took a while for them to get a surgeon in. They had to do a DNC. And even with the DNC, he still struggled to stop the bleed. She was back in that room for hours. But eventually they were able to stop it.

SPEAKER_04:

How did you handle going through all of this?

SPEAKER_02:

Friends. I spent a lot of time on the phone. I have I have some friends who, you know, had to go through in vitro in order to have a baby, and they lost a couple before they were able to carry the turn.

unknown:

And then they like the shadows.

SPEAKER_02:

I don't know.

SPEAKER_04:

What was Becca's recovery like from this?

SPEAKER_02:

Rough.

unknown:

I'm glad dinosaurs aren't.

SPEAKER_02:

On top of physically, she couldn't do much. As a woman, she felt like a failure. And I don't know how to talk somebody out of that.

unknown:

Or not a friend. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02:

To feel like you failed your whole gender. I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_04:

But you know she's not a failure.

SPEAKER_02:

Absolutely not.

SPEAKER_04:

What is she?

SPEAKER_02:

She's a very strong woman.

SPEAKER_04:

After witnessing her go through all of that, how would you describe her?

SPEAKER_02:

Strong, resilient, and just a little bit broken.

SPEAKER_04:

Did you guys ever communicate with the doctor's office again?

SPEAKER_02:

Eventually, um, after a lot of soul searching and worry and concern, we did end up going back to the same doctor who had helped us conceive in the first place.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

And when he found out what happened, he was livid. I think a lot of people lost their jobs. But he was very supportive, especially of her. Like when we went to see him, she was the only one in the room. He didn't care what I had to say because I didn't go through it. So that was helpful for her.

SPEAKER_04:

She felt heard. Yeah. That's important. So was it that doctor that was able to help you, the two of you, conceive again?

SPEAKER_00:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay, so so tell me about the miracle that is young Richie that we just heard from and saw a few minutes ago.

SPEAKER_02:

A lot of that, especially in the beginning, was really rough because of our age. I think we might have rushed it. So I don't think she had a lot of time to recover from what happened before we even started again. And honestly, in the beginning, even after he was born, there was a lot of guilt.

SPEAKER_00:

We kept talking about how he wouldn't be alive if our first baby didn't die.

SPEAKER_04:

Happy the two of you had an opportunity to talk to someone about that, to to go together and talk to someone, to talk to each other about it, to to recognize the miracle in him, and to understand how fully out of your hands all of this was.

SPEAKER_02:

Sometimes it still comes up.

SPEAKER_04:

I understand that. And to know that we now would advocate for ourselves differently. It taught you that if someone isn't going to advocate for you as as you would hope, then you will advocate for yourself, right? Um, you now know that you're allowed to advocate for your wife, and you're allowed to advocate for you, and you are allowed to advocate for your son. So no matter what anyone tells you, moving forward, if you have a question, you're going to get it answered.

SPEAKER_01:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04:

And that knowledge and that commitment to you and to your son and to your wife will do well for you moving forward because it means that you know. Like when we know more, we do more. And a lot of times we have to go through things in order to understand how we have to advocate for ourselves. I hemorrhaged during childbirth, and I had to fight, fight, fight to get doctors to pay attention. Um, because even after I was fixed and packed, I knew something was wrong. And I was hemorrhaging further internally, and everyone just kept saying, Oh, it's fine, you're packed. You're it's just because you're packed. The pain you're feeling is just because you're packed. And my husband at the time got tired of going back out into the hospital and to the nurses and saying, like, I swear, like, she won't, she won't stop complaining. Like, there's something wrong. And they're like, no, no, no, it's just because she's packed. And he finally went down to the chapel to pray, and I just begged them to just look. And when they looked, they were like, Oh, uh, something's wrong, because the internal hemorrhaging was pushing out, and so I ended up in emergency surgery. But if I hadn't continued to say, I swear, I swear, I I would have died overnight. But it's only, I mean, had it been up to other people around me, I would have just continued to take the morphine and just be quiet. So it was after that that my husband at the time said, okay, I will never again doubt when we have to advocate for ourselves because we're trained to believe that their professionals know best. So when they say, we'll call you, we'll tell you what the next steps are. You believed them. And that's okay. No, but you know what? You are healthy. Becca is good and healthy now, and you have Richie.

SPEAKER_02:

That boy's amazing.

SPEAKER_04:

He looks amazing. So how soon after that traumatic experience did you guys find yourself back in the doctor's office saying, you know what? We don't want to waste any time. We would like to try again.

SPEAKER_02:

She wanted to try again as soon as the doctor said that she was physically allowed to. As soon as her body would do it, that we did.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay. And did it work immediately?

SPEAKER_02:

It did.

SPEAKER_04:

Based on the timing, it sounded like I was assuming that it did because Richie's three, and you said this was, you know, three, four years ago. So I assumed that we were on a pretty tight timeline.

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah, right away.

SPEAKER_04:

Was she sick during this pregnancy as well?

SPEAKER_02:

Yeah. Yeah. The whole thing.

SPEAKER_04:

So, in some ways, was she comforted by feeling sick because it meant that things were moving along as they should be?

SPEAKER_02:

Kinda, yeah. Because we expected the reason it didn't bother her as much the first time is because everything we read says, you know, around 12 weeks or so it can go away. And it did.

SPEAKER_04:

Well, I think the the challenging thing is every single pregnancy can be different, right? And no matter how many books you read or how many things you find online, it's you can find a million experiences that mirror yours and a million that don't. So that's the challenge. Uh you can scare yourself to death. Was he full term?

SPEAKER_02:

Yes, actually, he was due on my birthday. His due date was my birthday.

SPEAKER_04:

Which is when?

SPEAKER_02:

April 2nd.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

And he was actually born a week before.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay.

SPEAKER_02:

So, yeah, he went the whole way.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay, so how do you guys feel being parents now?

SPEAKER_02:

It's amazing. It's terrifying. Being well, I don't know, responsible for raising a good person. And unfortunately, he might be smarter than us, so it can be tough.

SPEAKER_04:

I think that's probably a a fear and a realization all parents come to at some point. But they're also our greatest teachers, right? So it's there's a lot of beauty in there to learn from them. Richie, how would you define hope?

SPEAKER_02:

The resilience to not quit against all odds.

SPEAKER_04:

That's beautiful. What would you say to other parents, other couples who are wanting to start a family in in what are considered to be later years? So even say in your forties.

SPEAKER_02:

I mean, it's terrifying, but it's worth it. There's nothing like it. All my friends, they all had kids much earlier in life, and everybody talks about the first time you hold your baby and how you've never loved like that. And it always seems like hyperbole, but it isn't. It changes the way your heart works. You have literally never loved like that.

SPEAKER_04:

What would you like to say to your wife that you haven't been able to say about this journey you guys have been on together?

SPEAKER_02:

I don't know. I'd like to say I'm sorry I let that happen, even though I know I didn't let it happen. But I am so very sorry.

SPEAKER_04:

Okay, Richie, if we can, if I can somehow give you the grace to remove the guilt or the responsibility you feel. And maybe you can focus on or look at from a bird's eye view that what you guys have now, then what would you say to her? What have you learned about her? What have you learned about the two of you through this journey?

SPEAKER_02:

Well, it's it's cliche, but together we really can do just about anything. Even though she doesn't believe it, she is a wonderful mother. She doesn't realize how well she supports everyone around her.

SPEAKER_04:

I love that. What do you want young Richie to know about how loved and wanted and cherished he is? Because there will be a time at three right now, he won't be able to comprehend any words that you have to say, but someday he'll be able to look at this, listen to this. What do you want him to know about how wanted he is?

SPEAKER_02:

He was the entire reason why we're alive. That's what we wanted. We're here just to love him and raise him and hug him and hold him. The entire reason the universe created us was to create him.

SPEAKER_04:

What do you hope for him?

SPEAKER_02:

Uh, everything. I want him to be free of the guilt and pain that we had when we were children. I want him to see the world through the eyes of love and not fear.

SPEAKER_04:

I'm so grateful to you for trusting me with your story. Thank you for reaching out. Is there anything that you want to share that I did not ask you, Richie?

SPEAKER_02:

I don't think so. I don't. I'm grateful for this opportunity. Uh I hope eventually now I can write this down so that my wife can read it. I hope she will.

SPEAKER_04:

I'm sure she will. She'll watch or she'll listen. She can do either. And uh I know that I mentioned earlier on that you are an entrepreneur. Where can people find you?

SPEAKER_02:

Um, I know it seems kind of vain, but my website is just my name. It's RichieTredway.com. That is because originally I bought the domain to run for school board. And then when that didn't work out, I owned this domain, so I just use the domain for my business.

SPEAKER_04:

You are talking to a girl who owns the domain to her own name. And that's where most of the podcasts live. Um, under Dioniel Elliott Smith and Hope comes to visit. And I purchased the domains for both of my kids' names when they were very little, just so that they eventually had a place to exist if they wanted to. So I don't consider it vain at all. I uh I think it's I think it's smart to have that. So, and it's an easy way for people to find you. Richie, I so appreciate you spending time with me. And thank you for sharing your story, um, for sharing the the hard parts and the light and the grief and the pain and the challenges, but also the the beauty of your wife's strength and the light that you have in your sweet boy now.

SPEAKER_00:

Thank you.

SPEAKER_04:

Thank you. And friends, thank you so much for joining Richie and I in this light-filled conversation. I so hope that you have seen some of the inspiration and some of the heart, and you are willing to share it with the people that you love until we are here and chatting again. Please take care of you and thank you for being here. Naturally, it's important to thank the people who support and sponsor the podcast. This episode is supported by Chris Dulley, a trusted criminal defense attorney and friend of mine here in St. Louis, who believes in second chances and solid representation. Whether you're facing a DWI, felony, or traffic issue, Chris handles your case personally with clarity, compassion, and over 15 years of experience. When things feel uncertain, it helps to have someone steady in your corner. Call 314 384 4000 or 314 DUI Help, or you can visit doublylawfirm.com to schedule your free consultation.