When Grief Creates Purpose | Michelle Valiukenas on Pregnancy Loss, NICU Life & Hope

This week on Hope Comes to Visit, I’m joined by Michelle Valiukenas — founder of the The Colette Louise Tisdahl Foundation and mother to Sweet Pea, Colette, and Elliott.

Michelle’s story begins with what she believed would be a typical pregnancy. Instead, at just 21 weeks pregnant, she was diagnosed with severe preeclampsia and hospitalized immediately. Three weeks later, her daughter Colette was born at 24 weeks and 5 days and spent nine days in the NICU before Michelle and her husband lost her.

What Michelle created in the aftermath of that loss is extraordinary.

On Colette’s due date, Michelle launched a nonprofit dedicated to helping families facing high-risk pregnancies, NICU stays, and pregnancy and infant loss — particularly the financial realities that exist outside the walls of the hospital. Since then, the organization has provided more than $2 million in direct assistance to thousands of families nationwide.

But this conversation is about more than grief.

It’s about what happens when women finally begin sharing the stories they were taught to whisper about.

It’s about how common pregnancy complications and loss truly are — and how isolating silence can become.

It’s about motherhood, advocacy, survival, healthcare, and the powerful reminder that telling the truth about our experiences helps other people feel less alone.

Michelle’s honesty, compassion, and strength moved me deeply, and I’m so grateful she trusted me with this conversation.

Listen now wherever you get your podcasts.

The Colette Louise Tisdahl Foundation

YouTube Chapter Markers

00:00 Introduction
 02:08 Michelle’s nonprofit background
 03:20 A normal pregnancy until everything changed
 06:26 Severe preeclampsia diagnosis at 21 weeks
 08:50 The financial realities families face
 13:31 Delivering Colette at 24 weeks
 15:18 Hearing Colette cry for the first time
 16:08 Losing Colette after 9 days in the NICU
 17:25 Turning grief into purpose
 21:23 “Director of Hugs” and family healing
 25:47 Why sharing our stories matters
 27:12 How the foundation helps families
 32:30 Financial crisis and medical trauma
 35:59 Pregnancy loss statistics and isolation
 37:37 Reproductive healthcare and Roe v. Wade
 46:41 How Michelle defines hope
 47:52 Where to find the foundation
 48:45 The power of storytelling

I couldn’t agree more.

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I’m so grateful you spent this time with us today.

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Until next time, take good care of yourself. And remember—your story matters.

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For more stories, reflections, and ways to connect, visit www.DanielleElliottSmith.com or follow along on Instagram @daniellesmithtv and @HopeComestoVisit

Transcript

A Mother Refuses To Stay Silent

Michelle Valiukenus 0:00

I just remember thinking, this is my daughter. I mean, I'm not gonna put her away in some mental box in my head and not talk about her. Um, and people are just gonna have to deal with that, right? And that was very much my position was this is my daughter. And the same way I would have had she lived, I'm going to continue talking about her.

Sponsor Message

Danielle Elliott Smith 0:32

Let's take a quick moment to thank the people that support and sponsor the podcast. When life takes an unexpected turn, you deserve someone who will stand beside you. St. Louis attorney Chris Duly offers experienced one-on-one legal defense. Call 314-384-4000 or 314-DUI Help. Or you can visit Dulilawfirm.com. That's D-U-L-L-E Law Firm.com for a free consultation. Hi

Welcome And Guest Introduction

Danielle Elliott Smith 1:01

there, friends. If this is your first time joining us, welcome. If you're coming back, welcome home. I'm Danielle Elliott Smith, and this is Hope Comes to Visit, a place where we name the hard things and notice how we grow around them. A place where we like to share real stories and recognize how we hopefully can embrace how it makes us feel a little bit less alone. And I'm so grateful you're here. Today I'm honored to be joined by Michelle Valuquenis, founder and executive director of the Colette Louise Tisdale Foundation, a national nonprofit supporting families who are navigating high-risk and complicated pregnancies, NICU stays, and unimaginable loss. After losing her daughter Colette at just nine days, Michelle found herself facing not only profound grief, but also the overwhelming realities that happen outside the walls of the hospital. The financial strain, the emotional exhaustion, and the isolation so many families quietly carry while trying to survive the unimaginable. Instead of allowing that grief to be the end of her story, Michelle transformed it into purpose. She launched the Louise, the Colette Louise Tisdale Foundation on Colette's due date, creating an organization dedicated to helping families feel seen, supported, and less alone during some of the hardest moments of their lives. Since then, the foundation has provided more than $2 million in direct assistance to over 3,800 families across the country. Michelle is also a published author in Unmuted, where she shares how Lost became a catalyst for leadership, advocacy, and impact. Today she is a powerful voice working to improve maternal and infant health while continuing to honor the lives of her daughters, Sweet P and Colette, and alongside her husband, her son Elliot, lovingly known as the Foundation's director of hugs, this conversation is tender, honest, deeply human, and such a beautiful reminder that even in the wake of devastating loss, love can still create extraordinary things. Michelle, I'm so grateful you're here. Thank you for taking time with me today.

A Life In Service And Nonprofits

Danielle Elliott Smith 3:10

This story is it pulls at us, pulls at my heart in so many ways. I want to start, if you're okay with it, at the beginning. So giving of this nature is your heart work to begin with.

Michelle Valiukenus 3:36

I think, you know, for me, I feel like part of just being a human, being in this world, being a citizen of the world, is to use our privileges to help others. And so that was just very much always has been on my mind, always has been my catalyst for all of my decisions. And so that was where I and my career path led me. And what I found was just I absolutely love nonprofit work. It's it's its own beast, it's its own um great, you know, kind of situation. And so I've always just loved that giving of it and being able to use my skills, my talents, my experience in that way.

When Pregnancy Changes On A Dime

Danielle Elliott Smith 4:18

So when you find yourself pregnant with Colette, did you know that there was any danger of it not being the healthy, happy pregnancy that you hoped it would be?

Michelle Valiukenus 4:31

No. I mean, we had gone through infertility, we had gone through um one loss already, and um, you know, really just expected a pretty normal pregnancy. And for the most part, that's what it was. Um, you know, I still joke about one day I was gonna write a book that says, Where the hell is my glow? Um, because that I didn't understand, you know, it was a typical pregnancy in terms of um just, you know, morning sickness, the biggest misnomer. Um, but otherwise, it was a pretty standard pregnancy until it wasn't. And so um I think that's one of the things that really just hit me was how quickly things can turn on a dime. And just without morning, without anything, they can just completely turn. If you're comfortable with it, would you share with us what happened?

Severe Preeclampsia And The Unknowns

Michelle Valiukenus 5:20

Sure. Um, so when I was 21 weeks pregnant, um, something, some intuition inside me said that I needed to go to the OB. And I did, and my blood pressure was 188 over 110. Um, and so just like as reference, since people don't always know, um, standard kind of one is 120 over 80. So I was definitely um really high on this. And you know, they did repeat tests, you know, it was first it was like, well, walking from, you know, the waiting room to the room, maybe perhaps that's just triggered it to be a little bit high, things like that.

Danielle Elliott Smith 5:59

And it just you're just anxious and you're you're worried about the pregnancy. There's something in your gut saying something's wrong, and that alone is is making it patent.

Michelle Valiukenus 6:07

And um, and it never went down. And so my OB said, I need you to go to open to labor and delivery um so that they can take a look at you and they can monitor you. And she was very calm about it. Um, definitely indicated she was concerned, but you know, very calm. And so my husband and I went over to labor and delivery, um, joked on the way that, you know, what you just said, right? I was nervous, I was worried, we had heard a heartbeat. Um, and so we were gonna show up at the labor and delivery, and we were gonna be like the joke of the hospital of like, well, why are you here? Exactly, you know, then head on home. Right. And um, and so you know, that was kind of our joke when we got over there. And quite the opposite happened. In fact, my blood pressure had risen a little bit more. Um, and so, you know, it became at some point in the chaos, I heard we were being, I was being admitted. Um, and I also was hearing about a 24-hour urine test. And so in my mind, I thought, oh, that's why they're admitting me. They're going to do this 24-hour urine test. Um, oh, I'll be out tomorrow, maybe the day after.

Danielle Elliott Smith 7:20

Do you know what they were looking for? Did did you know or did you have any idea?

Michelle Valiukenus 7:24

I had no idea what was going on. I had no idea really what was going on. And um, and that was really what I thought it was was they're gonna do this test, and then, you know, maybe they're gonna release me on medicines for my blood pressure or something of that nature. And um, so it was after midnight uh that we were there. My husband went home to let out our poor dog who hadn't been out all day. And that was finally when my obese partner, who was on call, was able to come in. And she said to me, Has anyone explained this to you? And explained to you what's going on. And I said, Of course not. He said, No, I have no idea. And she said, You have severe preeclampsia, and you are going to be admitted and you will be here until you deliver. And this is at 21 weeks.

Danielle Elliott Smith 8:11

This is at 21 weeks, and so I think you think, okay, all right, I got 19 weeks.

Michelle Valiukenus 8:16

Right. Um, and you know, I still remember messaging my husband and saying, uh, so the doctor came in and this is what's going on, and him saying, Are you serious? And it was like, how could I have, you know, I always joke afterwards, I'm like, how could I have been creative enough to come up with anything like that? Right, didn't have occurred to me. Um, and at the time, the only thing I knew about preeclampsia was an old DR episode where a woman in the emergency room dies of preeclampsia, and Dr. Green gets that's all I knew about it. So it was like that's your only point of reference. Exactly. So I was like, wait, hold on, what happened? Um, and so it was just this complete, this was not wasn't planning, right? I was working, I was supervising a team. It was, you know, it's 21 weeks prior, you know, 21 weeks. I I didn't have a plan for um anything really at that point.

Danielle Elliott Smith 9:19

This this changes everything. You don't have the room right, you don't there were so many things you were planning to do. Exactly.

Michelle Valiukenus 9:25

And you know, and I really um, you know, things are moving, and the next day they're telling us, you know, um numbers and and survival rates and viability and getting it to 24 weeks. And if you know, if you have to deliver before 24 weeks, we don't intervene medically, and you can just hold baby until um baby dies, and you know, all of this stuff is happening and all of the worries are happening, you know, everything from the extreme of like, am I gonna survive this? Is my baby gonna survive this? To, you know, I still have a job and I have like, you know, responsibilities there to we don't have a crib, we don't have a car seat, we don't have anything, right? Um and all of those worries were all floating around, right? And once I was in the hospital about a day or two, one of the things that really dawned on me was in all of this, right? All the different worries, all the different whatnot, the financial piece was not worry of mine, right? We were going to be okay. We were gonna be okay ourselves, but also we had family and friends around who could support if we needed it, right? And what occurred to me is, you know, having had a background in nonprofit work, having worked with so many families who were living paycheck to paycheck, but barely getting by, um, it just dawned on me like this is an extreme privilege, right? And if I'm talking about using my privileges, this is a privilege that I just naturally am lucky enough and blessed enough to have, and one that so many don't have. And that really just became sort of my impetus of everything.

Danielle Elliott Smith 11:10

It's extraordinary to me that in the midst of this, the the way your brain is operating, right? Like your first thought is I could die from this, the baby could die. You're being hit with all of these numbers and all of this stress and all of the we don't have a crib, we don't have a car seat, uh, can I keep my job? And there is a piece of you that recognizes your privilege in all of it. Because you that blows me away. Because when you started to say, one of the things that starts to come to me, and I instantly think, wow, this is going to be expensive. You start to think about how expensive this is going to be. And instead, you think we're going to be okay, which is amazing. And I am chills, how beautiful that is. So there is a piece of you that is at peace, if you will, knowing you guys are going to be okay, but knowing there are other people who are not. Right. Right.

Michelle Valiukenus 12:07

And so many people, right? You know, I mean, my first thought was to people who are, you know, living paycheck to paycheck. And right. And um, one of the things that happened to me very quickly was I didn't have that kind of leave time. I was lucky enough I could do some work from the hospital. Um, but I did a lot of unpaid time. You know, that wasn't um, that wasn't my part of my plan. And I was eligible for short-term disability, but I decided to wait until baby was born, you know, and um and so that was, you know, something that in that I was just thinking of all the unpaid, and what a detriment that would be. But then as things went on, as you know, friends would text me or visit or call, I would think about each friend. And, you know, my friends were all fairly financially stable. And I would think about what would that do to you? Right? Like, how long could you survive in this before you would be in a financial crisis yourself? Right. And so if that's happening to friends of mine who are doing pretty well for the most part, then who is like nobody is immune to this like struggle, right? Right. But what is it?

Danielle Elliott Smith 13:24

Or barely getting by.

Michelle Valiukenus 13:27

Right.

Danielle Elliott Smith 13:27

Or who don't have health insurance.

Michelle Valiukenus 13:29

Right. I mean, it's a gamut of like so many things that, you know, one of the things, right, and we could probably do a whole other episode on on just these issues, but right um, you know, we're in a country that really just doesn't support parents. And um, you know, in a healthcare system that is overrun with problems, right? And many, you know, we're doing this, and then there's all the other stuff that exists outside of that medical area, right? Um, bills still need to be paid, and you know, things still are happening, and that is all happening outside of just what's in the four walls of the hospital or a medical office or anything like that. Um, and yeah.

Danielle Elliott Smith 14:15

So your brain somehow recognizes your privilege, but at this moment you're still pregnant. Yes.

Michelle Valiukenus 14:23

Yes.

Danielle Elliott Smith 14:24

How

Emergency Delivery And Nine Days In NICU

Danielle Elliott Smith 14:25

long did you stay pregnant with Colette?

Michelle Valiukenus 14:29

So I was in the hospital a little over three weeks. Um, when I was admitted, they did an ultrasound. Doctors reported um she's measuring two weeks behind. Um, at one week, we don't really worry because not every baby grows at exactly, you know, the markers. Um, at two weeks we get concerned because then that's showing that there's not the right growth. Um, they said what our hope is is that now that we know we have you on blood pressure medicines, we can regulate you and monitor you, there will be a catch-up of growth. And the idea was like, unless we cannot control your blood pressure anymore, um, which we will have to deliver if there were some other factors that they would have to deliver, or there's distress too, maybe. And three weeks later, they did a repeat ultrasound. And in those three weeks, there had been no growth. Um, and so at that point, the doctors came and they said, at this point, there are more interventions we can do on the outside than we can do currently. Um, and they said, our recommendation is to deliver. So by that point, it was 24 weeks and five days. Um, and so it was an emergency C section. Um, and she came out and was, you know, everyone had warned us she would not make any noise. Um, you know, they said be prepared, like anything that you think of, like what a standard baby coming out and making noise is gonna happen is not gonna happen because she's not developed enough, she's not anything. And um, and she came out and we had waited to find out sex of the baby until, although I knew inherently this was a girl. Um uh so we waited and and then they said there was a girl, and you know, that kind of thing. And they took her and they're dealing with her and and you know, getting me back sewed up. And all of a sudden I heard this like really tiny, very powerful squeak. And um, I remember saying, Is that her? And they said yes. And then I could hear the doctors and nurses sort of saying, like, that shouldn't happen. She doesn't have the right, you know, her lungs are not developed enough. You know, um, and like in that moment, it was just sort of like, okay, well, see, this is my badass daughter. So you guys can tell me all this stuff, but like my badass daughter's gonna like totally rock this. Um, and this is gonna be a funny footnote on our story, right? Is like, hey, remember when? And, you know, doing all that thing. And um, and so she went straight to the NICU and spent nine days in the NICU, you know, with all of the ups and downs, um, before eventually her body gave out and um and we lost her. Thank you.

Launching A Foundation From Raw Grief

Danielle Elliott Smith 17:27

How did you manage? Because part of your story is that you launched this foundation on her actual due date, which would have been in the neighborhood of 15 weeks later. So just a handful of months after losing your girl, you hear this this squeak, which must have been a roar for you. Right? Your badass girl wanted you to know that you could keep going. And I know that there are stories of turning loss into motivation and power and leadership and and purpose, but you did it really quickly.

Michelle Valiukenus 18:20

Yeah. Um, so my flippant answer is always I'm a little crazy and um I can be a little obsessive. And I think, you know, it was a couple things. I think um I survived something that I could have very well have lost my life over. And I and I recognize that very truly. And um my birth after Clot was out um was very traumatic. They uh couldn't get me sewed back in and everything, and um they ended up having to put me under general anesthesia to finish. And we had been warned that general anesthesia for postpartum or excuse me, for pre-eclampsia can be very dangerous. And I remember as they were doing this, you know, all very emergency, you know, quick, quick, quick, quick, um, thinking I won't wake up from this, and that's okay. Right. Um and so I woke up from it, right? And and that's something to do. And I think for me, there was a reason why, right? I had to like for as difficult as that idea is, is like, why did you know I not lose my life for her, right? That I think that's just a mental way I was in, but I think most moms would probably say the same thing. And so I think there was very much of an awareness of that, and that was a big motivation. I think there was a motivation because one thing that shocked me was how many people after we lost came out of the woodwork to share their own losses. And these are people I had known, you know, ages, right? Um, people I had known my whole life, who I had never known about a loss. And to me, I just remember thinking, this is my daughter. I mean, I'm not gonna put her away in some mental box in my head and not talk about her. Um, and people are just gonna have to deal with that, right? And that was very much my position was this is my daughter. And the same way I would have had she lived, I'm going to continue talking about her. Um, and so I think that was some of the motivation was let's do something so that people have to keep sharing about Claire. Um, and then I think it was making meaning of a due date that I knew was going to be a difficult day. Um and I really wanted to change the narrative on that and change what that really meant. And for me, I think that was all of the energy I had, all of the, you know, I had given birth, I had had a baby, and I didn't have a baby to mother. I think I really took all of that and I just poured it into starting this. Um and you know, in retrospect, right, um almost eight years later, there is a part of me that thinks maybe that wasn't the healthiest choice. And then there's a part of me that thinks, like, I think that was the best way for me to do it. I think that's just my personality is to turn it into doing something that I feel like I'm getting I'm giving back in the world. And I think that that was very much uh just part of my healing that I needed to do. Um and so and When her due day came and when it's come every year, right? Yes, there's still a bittersweetness of September 7th, but it was not just the due date. It was the due date and the launch of something else. And now it's the anniversary of something else. And that was powerful. And that I'm so grateful that we had.

Danielle Elliott Smith 22:22

It's a birthday. I mean, this is in a way, like it's you are a mother of many things, right? So you are mom of Sweet P and of Colette and of Elliot and of this foundation, right? And I I love in in your introduction, getting to say you're the director of hugs, right? Um, and and I I love that. Talk to me about that. Talk

Director Of Hugs And Breaking Taboos

Danielle Elliott Smith 22:46

to me about being the director of hugs.

Michelle Valiukenus 22:48

Oh, well, my son is the director of hugs.

Danielle Elliott Smith 22:50

Oh, your son is the director of hugs of hugs. Oh, I love that. That I misunderstood.

Michelle Valiukenus 22:55

No, no problem. My son is um five and about a year and a half, two years ago. Um, you know, he's very aware of, he has a very good relationship with his sister. Um, he he talks to her. He, I mean, it's amazing to think, you know, as far as we know, right? Um he has never met her in in the sort of traditional sense. Right. Um, but how he has a really great relationship with her. And one day he turned to me and he said, Mommy, what's my job with the foundation? And I was, you know, sort of thrown off. I was like, oh, I wasn't thinking about you having a job here. Um, and I said, Well, you know, give me a second, let me think about it. And so I came to him and I said, What if you're our director of hugs? Um, at a you know, three and a half year old or so um level. And he said, Okay, mommy. And he has just really embraced that role so much. And it's it's so beautiful to see, right? And um, it has been everything from, you know, he talks to the foundation, he's always doing this, to um, you know, funnily enough, he my parents took him, um, had him, and they they went to dinner with an uncle with my uncle. And um at the end of dinner, my uncle said, Um, you know, hey, can I get a hug? And he said, I only give hugs to people who donate to the foundation. Um, so which time my my mother called me and said, 'Are you teaching this?' And I said, I've never said that before. I was like, that's all him, you know.

Danielle Elliott Smith 24:25

Um, and you know, he's a solid ambassador as well.

Michelle Valiukenus 24:30

Love it. Um, and so it's been really interesting to sort of see how this has become um a family organization. And, you know, I use family very loosely, right? We have there's so many people in the world, right? So people who never got to meet Clint, um, people who uh met her or or didn't necessarily meet her physically, but you know, were around when it happened. But people we've met afterwards who just have jumped on board and said, like, I'm part of this and like I feel something for this, right? And it's been so fascinating and so healing to see that, right? Um, to see people show up over and over again and say, I believe in this and I want to help families like this too. Um, and then I think we've provided a platform for a lot of families that um, you know, need help in the media see, but I think, you know, families who that went through this years ago, right? And who maybe didn't have the chance to really talk about it, um, that we've given them a chance to share at various levels, right? And so, you know, people tell me stories all the time, right? And I um and I'm always very appreciate that people sh feel the need to share and like share it with me. Um I think it's terrible that we're so it's such a taboo thing that we kind of talk about it in whispers and and sigh things and you know, please don't say anything and and that kind of thing. Um, but I'm always honored that people share it with me and um and I will take it and I will hold it to myself or share whatever you know people want to do. Um, but I think like that's the other thing that I think one of most one of the most impactful things for me is we're telling people it's okay, right? We're giving people the avenue. Um, we're saying, yeah, these things happen. And they happen to more people than we ever realized. And that is okay. And there's nothing wrong with sharing it. Um, and in fact, actually, I mean, my feeling is always is that we're not gonna move the, we're not gonna make any change, we're not gonna move the needle unless we're talking about it, right? Um, and so I think that's the other thing is we're really bringing this up to the surface and saying you can talk about it and it's okay.

Danielle Elliott Smith 26:51

Um, what you are saying is the heartbeat of this podcast, right? It is the the more we talk about, like I believe that everyone has a story of hope that can inspire someone else, right? And the and the reason that exists is because there is something so incredibly powerful about hearing your story coming out of someone else's mouth. It makes us feel less alone. And you have found that in experiencing your grief and turning your pain into this level of purpose and having all of these people, people you knew and people you didn't know, come out and say, Me too. Right. And we recognize that in so many variations of me too, across all the spectrums of pain and grief and inspiration. And this is how you have been experiencing it through your story and the ways you're helping.

How Financial Assistance Really Works

Danielle Elliott Smith 27:48

I would love for you to, for us to dig a bit deeper, for you to explain exactly how the foundation works, who it helps, and how anyone who might be listening may apply for assistance, or they might be able to forward the podcast on to someone they know who could be going through something and how this might benefit them in their particular challenges at the moment. Sure, absolutely.

Michelle Valiukenus 28:12

Yeah. Um, so I mean, really at the core was this financial assistance piece, right? Um, and it was thinking of things. Um, my sister, who is four years younger than me, was a NICU baby. And um, one of the things that you know I remember a lot from her stay, but um, one of the things I remember was my great-grandmother got on a flight and came and watched me, right? And at one point I turned to my mom and I said, Who paid for her flight? And my mom said, I have no idea. Like, could have been me, could have been anybody else. I have no idea. All I know was that I in all the chaos, and I and I understood this on a much deeper level by that point, um, I could sort of just not have to worry about you, right? And so it could just be, hey, take Michelle, and there's one less thing that I'm worried about constantly. And so, you know, it was things like that where it was like, oh, well, okay, an airline ticket or a bus ticket or something like that. Is there things like that that we could do? Um, so we do financial assistance um in sort of three categories. And so it's the high risk or complicated pregnancy. So basically a pregnancy that has some limit some sort of limitation um or ending of income or and or going to be in the hospital for 21 weeks. Right. You know, um, or you know, expenses, right? So, you know, I always use the example of like a stay-at-home mom who's all of a sudden put on bed rest, right? Stay-at-home mom is not going to be on bed rest without any sort of help, right? So there's that expense, you know, that kind of thing. So um that's one category, having a baby in the NICU, um, and then a loss. And loss we do from the earliest pregnancy loss up to about one year of age. Uh our the bulk of those are stillbirths um through the one year of age. But we do have earlier losses who apply. Um, and so people apply on our website. Um, it's a pretty straightforward application. We really try to um get the information we need, but like keep it as basic so families in crisis can fill it out. Um, we require verification um from a healthcare provider. Um, the majority of them are done by social workers. And um and then, and that can also be supplemented with if the verification is not coming from an actual individual, it could be um paperwork that is coming, so official paperwork from um most likely those are things like the death certificate, um, but they could be also anything in in the meantime. And then um, if they are in by Wednesday at 5 p.m. Central, um, they're reviewed that weekend and the decision letter is given to the family by the end of the day Tuesday. If they're not in, the pieces are not in by that point, then we hold it over and it's held over until the next time that um everything is together. And, you know, we try to help as many families as we possibly can and really trying to remove some barriers, right? So, what is it that is going to allow you to focus on your health, your family's health, um and not impede your ability to just live life and be able to handle this as well.

Danielle Elliott Smith 31:40

That's incredible. How good is it for your heart to be able to offer this type of assistance?

Michelle Valiukenus 31:48

Yeah. You know, I think I often struggle because I I tend to think of like all the more stuff that we could do, right? We're not helping enough, we're not doing enough. Um but you know, really what I think it is is it's you know, it's the help, right? And we we got people who say, like, this was a huge help and I and allow me to do this, allow me to do that. Um it was just one less stressor. But honestly, the stuff that I really have really helped my heart is hearing from people like somebody got it, right? Somebody understood where I was coming from, or I got to see somebody who went through the stuff I did and and is still surviving, right? Um and is living with it. And you know, I think that that to me is so important because all of these experiences are so isolating, right? Um, the narrative we still have is you get pregnant in Ojoys, and then you have a baby. And that's great for those who who can say that that's their story, but so many people get that's not their story, right? And and even when the end result is, you know, a healthy baby that goes home, um there's a lot of struggle in that and a lot of issues in that. And I think recognizing like, hey, somebody else gets it and somebody else has been there and done it, um, I think is so powerful and is just so helpful and so you know, just takes away that isolation in you know, the smallest form.

The Statistics Behind Quiet Crises

Danielle Elliott Smith 33:28

I was looking at the statistics, hard word for me apparently, statistics on your website, and was a bit blown away by how ignorant I felt at those numbers, just how many women struggle in pregnancy with some type of issue, how many people are living paycheck to paycheck while going through a pregnancy. Uh I I had no idea. I mean, I certainly know that that infant mortality rates increase, right? Uh, but I I didn't know there were that many people who are this close to disaster, and that there were that many people who experience pregnancy loss.

Michelle Valiukenus 34:14

Right. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I think that that's the thing that's scary, you know. Um the statistics have shown across the board, average American lives $400 away from financial crisis. Um $400 is nothing, you know. Um $400 is, you know, could be I hit a pothole, right? I I'm in the Chicago Land area. So um I hit a pothole and you know, I need two tires replaced. That can be $400. Easily um, you know, uh all of those things, right? When a medical context, $400 could be a couple of copies, right? Um, could be a medicine. I mean, all of these things. And it's just like this is so terrible. And I think, you know, people don't realize how, you know, it's not something that's happening to other people, right? It's something that like we're all living on this, right? And I I think of, you know, my mom was always a big one on, you know, um, thereby the grace of God go high was, you know, you just don't know, right? And so I think that that's something that so often we don't realize is that it's not the judgment of other people and that that person wasn't responsible, that person, you know, wasn't good with money, um, that person has this issue. It's also saying, like, there's a lot of us who are living at that point. Um, and you know, one or two things goes wrong. And now you're in financial crisis. And financial crisis means different things for different people and different income levels and all of that. Um but I think that that's really when you look at that, that's really powerful because it really is saying $400 is nothing. And, you know, that is something that I think is really powerful and that it's happening so often. I mean, you know, the loss is happening. I mean, it's one in four pregnancies end in loss. And you know, you're talking about feeling like you didn't know that. You know, I had heard the one in four. I thought that was one in four women, right? And to put into context if it's one in four pregnancies, so that means that, you know, if a woman gets pregnant four times, the likelihood is she's losing one of those, right? Um you know, or I say, like, if you have a group of, you know, two friends, you know, two friends, three friends, four friends, one of them is gonna experience it if they're getting pregnant more than once. Um and I think that that's something that we just don't acknowledge, right? And that it's happening in such secret. Um, and you know, that was something when I lost sweet pee, what I noticed um was how many people just like told me. And and I had an experience where um I ended up, I was in an emergency room, and the next day um I had a meeting with two, you know, high-ups at work, and I had to cancel it because I wasn't at work. And I was very honest and I said, I, you know, I I was in the ER last night, I I had a miscarriage, and you know, this is what's going on. And when I returned to work and I saw them, they both disclosed their own miscarriages to me. And, you know, it's it's that kind of thing, whereas like, you know, talk about I had felt so isolated and like this could only, you know, this only happened to me. Oh and all of a sudden seeing that, and I was like, here are two women that like, you know, are not related to me, are not in the same, you know, have totally different backgrounds. And they just disclosed to me their own losses. Um, and and that was what I was finding over and over and over again was how common it was. And, you know, I I joke often that like I haven't been in a meeting where somebody hasn't either personally experienced it or had somebody close to them who has experienced loss or NICU or a difficult pregnancy. Um, and that's not like I'm not exaggerating that statistics. Like, I'm sure there's one or two meetings here and there that have in eight years. Um, but it's really not. Um, that is the reality we live with, unfortunately. And I think us not talking about it is what's creating even more isolation and what's creating the problems that we see of these resources.

Post-Roe Barriers And Care Delays

Danielle Elliott Smith 38:37

That your applications have increased since health care has changed with the reversal of Roby Wade because women have different access to healthcare than they used to.

Michelle Valiukenus 38:53

Yes, absolutely. Um I use Texas as the example. Um, we had gotten Texas applications for sure, um, not at a very high rate for whatever reason. And it's, you know, we never know exactly why it is, if it's just the word hasn't gotten out, if it's um families just don't, you know, feel comfortable. In some areas, there are other organizations that help in certain areas. And so sometimes that's what it is, is that there's other organizations kind of doing it. We just don't know. Um, and so that had been kind of the standard with with Texas. We would get, you know, a few here and there, not really anything. And one week, all of a sudden, half of our cases were from Texas. And, you know, um, and I'm a big one, I just like to kind of like see, I'm like, hmm, that's interesting. That's kind of thing. And I was really like, why is that happening? Like, how do we go from one week to the next? And um, I looked it up, and when the Texas abortion bans had started, I kind of counted backwards and we were right in that time frame of when they were in effect to about 20 to 25 weeks later. Cause effect. Right, exactly. And so, you know, that was like to me, was like the the biggest example of it. Um, you know, we are seeing more and more cases and that, you know, either people are disclosing to us that there's been difficulty with getting access, getting care, um, or that, you know, we can kind of read between the lines where there's been issues, um, that we can see, you know, certain states over others that there's been more issues. Um and so, yeah, we're definitely seeing that just complete fear and you know, terror um that I think people aren't getting the care and the access that they need. I think people, when they can seek it out, I think people are delaying um treatment and care because they're terrified of like the other side and what happens on that.

Danielle Elliott Smith 40:55

Um and so it has been in some cases they're being told they can't get the care, like sorry, we can't help you. Exactly.

Michelle Valiukenus 41:04

Um, and you know, and I think that that's something that has been a real problem, is I think what people fail to understand is that, you know, the abortion procedures are the same procedures we use in cases of loss. And so um, you know, an atopic pregnancy, which can kill a pregnant person, um is the procedure for that is a DNC, which is the same exact procedure for an elective abortion. Um and I think people don't realize that. And and it's amazing to me how often I have said that to people, and people go, wait, what? And I'm like, yes. So you can't blanket, you know, all of this because you've decided one version of what you think an abortion is. Um that has been a really huge uh turning point. And I think you know, it's also not taking into, you know, that's that's sort of like clear cut, but but some of the nuances, right? Um of like do you want to be giving birth in this scenario, you know, in this situation? Um, you know, I have a good friend who, you know, she um has had some health issues. She cannot get pregnant. A pregnancy would kill her because of health issues. No, she's doing all the things to prevent a pregnancy, but um, you know, things happen on and you know, unexpected things happen, right? There's no 100%, you know, surety that any of the procedures that we use could happen, right? We hear things all the time. Um and so, you know, in that case, right, are we saying somebody like her has to is required to go through the process and risk her own life? Right. Or are we saying in that case, like, let's give her the access to care that she needs, and the care that she needs is to not be pregnant, right? Yes.

Danielle Elliott Smith 43:10

Um, I'm at the stage in my life and have had procedures that if I was to get pregnant right now and I'm married and my my current husband has had a vasectomy, so like we're good, right? I'm also 53, so it shouldn't happen, but it's not impossible, right? So if God forbid I was to be raped and I got pregnant, I should not go forward with the pregnancy. Right. But in most states, I'm not allowed, right? I I live in Missouri, I'm not allowed to do anything about that. And so that means that in theory, my children should be at risk for not having a mother and thereby a grandparent to their children. And my husband should lose his wife because of a law. That doesn't have the nuances to protect the person who was harmed. Right.

Michelle Valiukenus 44:05

Or even, you know, in your case, like your example, you know, your husband has a vasectomy, that's great. Does it still happen occasionally? Right. Right. The rare stories, but like, do we still occasionally hear that, like, you know, something happens, you still get pregnant, right? Regardless of anything. So, you know, doing all the things to be as responsible as you can, and yet still being in the situation where it's like, this is no longer safe for me. This is not a safe path for me. Right. And also, where's my access to care? Um, and so I think, you know, that's something that is really important that, you know, we're not recognizing is that abortion is a form of health care. And, you know, I think people have these like, oh my god, fears about it. And and the thing is that like we do need these versions. We do need those things, right? There are so many cases in which it is actually used as health care. It is not overwhelmingly, it is not the idea of like that you know, people are just going out and getting pregnant and then getting abortions. That's not what's happening, right? There's so many other things at play.

Danielle Elliott Smith 45:19

So many ways that women are protected and that healthcare, it's used to take care of the health of the individual.

Michelle Valiukenus 45:27

Right. Right. Um, and you know, and I would argue to go even further, right? Somebody who gets pregnant who cannot afford to have a baby, right? Is that fair to plunge a family into poverty um without resources when there are means that we can do to prevent that? Like, I don't think that that's fair to say that because of that situation that somebody shouldn't. Like, there are so many things that we have vetted every other social resource that would help them.

unknown 46:02

Right.

Michelle Valiukenus 46:03

Or, you know, I come my my background before this was I worked with domestic violence and sexual assault victims. Um, you know, a great way for an abuser to trap somebody in a marriage is to get them pregnant. Um, you know, and so are we putting, you know, another person at risk to be in a relationship that's abusive, and then a child to be born into a relationship that's abusive. Um or are we helping somebody to have another option? Right. And so it's all of these things that I think are so complicated and that you know, there is no one great answer to all of this. And, you know, I think that that's doing this. But we're definitely, yeah, we're definitely seeing on that. And I think, you know, we're talking about reproductive rights, we're talking about reproductive justice, and you know, we we need to follow that through, right? It's not just abortion, it's not just that, it's all the way through, right? It's the fact of like part of reproductive rights and reproductive justice is like women are dying from pregnancy, right? Yeah, and when we talk about black women or native women or you know, um Latino woman, we're talking about their reproductive rights means that a pregnancy can be a death sentence. And what does that mean? And you know, and so I think we need to look at it very holistically of like, it is not just the abortion argument, it is the whole lifespan of it, of what that means and what that ends up um doing for um for a woman.

Defining Hope After Loss

Danielle Elliott Smith 47:39

I completely agree. I've loved this conversation. Michelle, how do you define hope?

Michelle Valiukenus 47:46

I think hope is you of course have to ask this after I've had this whole thing on reproductive rights, and I'm like, what? Um I think hope is knowing that it is not always bad. That there is there is, you know, I hate the light at the end of the tunnel kind of thing, but I think knowing that there is good in everything. Um you know, it it is and it's not in a Pollyanna kind of way, but knowing that there is there is good in everything that is happening, right? We are seeing that over and over again. But there is still that hope. Um and for me, you know, no matter what happens, is having that bit of hope I think is so powerful. And I think that that's that's how we survive things, that's how we go through crises, that's how we do everything, right? Um, and I think that that's really that's what hope is to me.

Danielle Elliott Smith 48:45

So tell

How To Apply Donate And Connect

Danielle Elliott Smith 48:46

me, where can everyone find you and the foundation and get connected?

Michelle Valiukenus 48:50

Yeah, absolutely. Um, we're online, um, clotlouise.com. Um, Clot is one L and two T's. Um, we're on all the social medias. Um, my email is Michelle at ClettLouise.com. I have two L's. My daughter has one L. Um and you know, really just reaching out to us. Um, you know, if you're need if you're in need of assistance, come find your website and apply. Um if you are in a position that you are able to donate, um, we would love it. Uh, you know, our ability to help families is based on what we have to help families. Um, so that is always helpful. And um, and you know, share your story. Do whatever you can. Um, I think it's really important today.

Danielle Elliott Smith 49:36

So Michelle, is there anything I didn't ask you about that you'd like to share?

Michelle Valiukenus 49:43

I think you know, the it's the power of really sharing our stories. I think that's so key and so important is that if we can share our stories. And it does not mean you have to do a big national, you know, platform and and share with everybody in the world. Telling one person your story, it's amazing how often you are going to encounter somebody who needs to hear that story. Um, and you know, doing it anonymously if you have to or or whatever it is. Um, but I think if we're sharing our stories, that's how we're gonna make some changes and merely move that needle.

Danielle Elliott Smith 50:18

I really appreciate you taking time with me. And I'm so grateful to you for trusting me with your story of you and your family and Elliot and Colette and Sweet P. It has been a privilege to listen to you. Well, thank you. I appreciate that. And thank you for having me. Of course.

Final Reflections And Farewell

Danielle Elliott Smith 50:38

And thank you, friends, for spending time with Michelle and I on this episode of Hope Comes to Visit. I so hope that you have felt as inspired and gifted by hearing this story. I hope it inspires you to donate, to share the story, to pass this on to other people you think may need to hear it or who may need to apply for a little bit of assistance through the Colette Louise Tisdal Foundation. Thank you for this time. And as always, until we get to spend time together again, please take very good care of you.

Sponsor Message

Danielle Elliott Smith 51:19

Naturally, it's important to thank the people who support and sponsor the podcast. This episode is supported by Chris Dully, a trusted criminal defense attorney and friend of mine here in St. Louis, who believes in second chances and solid representation. Whether you're facing a DWI, felony, or traffic issue, Chris handles your case personally with clarity, compassion, and over 15 years of experience. When things feel uncertain, it helps to have someone steady in your corner. Call 314 384 4000 or 314 DUI Help, or you can visit doublylawfirm.com to schedule your free consultation.