CRC Benefits Podcast
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CRC Benefits Podcast
Pretty Easy Opportunity - Why to consider PEOs
Payroll tangles, patchwork compliance, and vendor sprawl can quietly drain a growing company. We sit down with CRC’s PEO leaders, Rob Schlossberg and Ari Wind, to map out when a professional employer organization unlocks simpler operations, stronger benefits, and fewer risks—and when it doesn’t. If your clients have multi-state teams, rising admin load, or employees asking for richer plans like IVF and modern voluntary benefits, this is a practical guide to the trade-offs that matter.
We break down what a PEO really delivers: integrated payroll, HR, workers’ comp, and compliance inside a single tech platform that cleans up onboarding, recordkeeping, and reporting. Rob and Ari explain why interest has surged, how to spot genuine fit signals across industries like private equity, nonprofits, logistics, and tech, and the common red flags that suggest the open market might be smarter. You’ll also learn how to protect clients with CPEO status and ESAC accreditation—critical safeguards that prevent tax restarts, ensure financial oversight, and backstop payroll and benefits through surety bonding.
What truly differentiates our approach is process. We start with a focused discovery call, run a consolidated RFP that works across multiple PEOs, guide demos and implementation, and deliver renewal strategies 90 days in advance. That solution-agnostic stance means we recommend PEO, open market, or hybrid based on real needs, not hype—sometimes even talking clients out of a PEO when it won’t serve them. As the market consolidates and matures, brokers who claim the PEO conversation early protect their relationships and win more often.
Ready to sharpen your edge? Listen now, subscribe for future conversations, and leave a review telling us your biggest PEO question or success story.
Welcome back to the CRC Benefit Check Podcast. I'm Michelle McCott. And I'm Amanda Knight. Thanks for joining us for our newest episode. We're so glad you're here.
SPEAKER_03:Let's dive right in. This is the CRC Benefits Podcast from CRC Group.
SPEAKER_02:This podcast features news and insights from those working with our vast network of 20,000 brokers to deliver employee benefits to more than 200,000 small and medium-sized businesses. Plus, we give you the latest information on what is happening at CRC.
SPEAKER_03:This is the CRC Benefits Podcast. And now the hosts of the podcast, Michelle McCall and Amanda Knight.
SPEAKER_04:Think about your own clients for a second. How often do you hear them mention payroll stress, HR challenges, or keeping up with compliance? Probably more often than they'd like. So the question becomes when do those issues stop being background noise and start holding the business back?
SPEAKER_02:For many clients, that pain point, Michelle, really becomes a powerful pivot when a PEO enters the picture. PEOs are professional employer organizations that can actually lift a huge weight off their shoulders, giving clients the support to focus on running and growing the business. Of course, it isn't a perfect fit for every group, which is why brokers play such a key role in spotting it when it really does make sense. Exactly.
SPEAKER_04:And that's why we're bringing in two of our best in the PEO space today. First, Rob Schlossberg, director of the National PEO Division. Rob has been leading CRC Benefits National PEO strategy and has years of experience helping brokers decide when and how to bring a PEO solution to their clients.
SPEAKER_02:And alongside him today is Ari Wind, one of our PEO sales executives. Ari works directly with brokers and their groups, showing how a PEO can streamline HR and compliance while also recognizing when another path might actually be better. Rob and Ari, welcome to the podcast.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you. Glad to be here.
SPEAKER_02:So let's start sort of with the broad picture. Interest in PEOs has really picked up lately. What is driving that? And what are you both seeing in the market right now?
SPEAKER_01:Okay. Great question. You know, what we're seeing in the marketplace is not unusual. You know, we're we're in a situation where people are looking for solutions. And, you know, as we get into the conversation, what you'll find is that PEO is not always the solution. It's a good solution, and when it's a good solution, it's great. And when it's not, our goal is to make sure our broker wins 100% of the time. Right. So whether we're talking about PEO, we're talking about open market solutions, we have the right solution for the broker and the client.
SPEAKER_04:Ari, did you want to add anything to that?
SPEAKER_00:Sure. I mean, PEOs have really started to gain traction. I mean, they've been around for 30 plus years, but over the last five, six years, we've seen tremendous growth in many markets. And that's because companies are more national with employees in multiple states. So the compliance is really a big driver. But it's also the quality of the medical plans. You know, in a PEO, we're able to find solutions that have richer benefits in a lot of cases than open market, cover things like IVF, where you can't get it in every market. So there are certain things, whether it's the benefits, the technology, the level of service for the compliance, the HR support, more and more companies are relying on the PEO to be a solution for their organization.
SPEAKER_04:Definitely, definitely. Well, and and so for anyone who doesn't work with PEOs every day or don't totally understand it, give us the quick rundown. What exactly is it and why should brokers have this in their toolkit?
SPEAKER_00:The reason a broker wants to have it in their toolkit is it gives them another product and service that's in high demand. You know, when you look at brokers, every broker has the same rate for small group, the same level of service, the same technology tools. But the PEOs do a lot more than just give you benefits, right? It's a very efficient model from payroll to HR to all compliance to workers comp to all the different lines of benefit coverages, and they wrap it in a very robust technology platform. So it's a very simplistic way of doing things where you're not using multiple vendors. It's one vendor to really manage a business. So the company can rely on the services they're getting from the PEO to grow their own business. And more importantly, their employees really value the PEO, not just from the benefits. There's a lot of perks like cell phone discounts, online shopping discounts, car rental hotels, and they're able to get certain coverages they might not be able to get. You know, one of the biggest things that people ask is the pet insurance, right? It's amazing to me how some people like their pets more than their own children.
SPEAKER_02:Sometimes they listen better. I mean, I I understand easier training.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I'll I'll also add that what makes us different is our process, right? So we have a discovery call with the broker and the client. We find out what their needs are. So we make sure that they're number one, first of all, a fit for PEO. And if they are, what PEO fits them? Because it's a wide variety of PEOs that do different things. It's extremely important that we have that discovery call, and then we have a RFP process that is bar none, the easiest and most consolidated process, which means that we have one set of documents that satisfies all of our PEO partners, and that makes the process very, very easy for us.
SPEAKER_02:So, you know, there are apparently some clear signals when a client is ready for a PEO, but also times when it's not the right fit or the right solution. So if I'm a broker, what should I be watching for on both sides of that conversation? When is it a clear green light and when is it time to maybe look elsewhere?
SPEAKER_01:Well, I I I would say to you, and I'll I'll let Ari take this question, but I'll just give you a comment before. You know, I always tease Ari and ask him, when do you ask for a sale? Now take it away, Ari.
SPEAKER_00:Never. Because if it's a fit, it's a fit. And that really goes to our process. We work with our broker partners to consult with their prospects and clients to evaluate multiple PEOs, but really to see if a PEO in general is a fit. And that could be because of carrier benefit design cost, service, and technology. Um, but you know, the reason it's important to have it in your arsenal is you know, everyone else is calling a broker's client. Um, the PEOs themselves, the payroll companies. So if you're not talking about it, and you know, we get comp we get calls every day. I got a great prospect. It's usually one of two things. They got a really high renewal, which by the way will disqualify you from a PEO, or because they're losing it to another PEO directly, and now they're trying to play defense. So our feeling is if we have a conversation with the prospect and we uncover their needs and their goals, let's see if the PO works. We don't know on that initial call, but there are certain things that we know can be a good fit, right? Private equity, probably one of the best prospects, nonprofits, technology companies, but even trucking, warehousing, distribution, they can be very, very good prospects for a PEO based on their needs of efficiency.
SPEAKER_01:We want to make sure that 100% of the time that the broker's communicating to their client prospect that they're a resource for PEO because the worst that happens is when you get that call after servicing the account for 25, 30 years and say, uh, we decide to go in a different direction. And of course, the first response is, Well, what direction did you decide to go? And they say PEO, and you say, Well, as a broker, I can do that. And the answer is, Well, I didn't know that. And at that point, it may be too late.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, that would be a heartbreaker.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:It is. And I've heard you both say it a dozen times. If if you're not talking about it, somebody else is, right?
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. And we're seeing more and more traction in the brokerage community, and that's where a lot of our PO partners are really focused on the brokers now. You know, we've all been here for a very long time, right? We had our doubts about PEOs for many, many years. They were a competition. But you know, when you really understand their value proposition and the fact that they really are broker friendly and support our brokers and their clients, it really can be a win-win for everybody.
SPEAKER_01:And we believe we have the best teams to do that. You know, whether it's on the sales side andor the service side, we have specialized teams with the PEOs. So when it comes to you know troubleshooting issues, we're right on top of it. And you know, it helps you know you as a broker to be able to enjoy the benefits of a PEO.
SPEAKER_04:Well, and I know in um in an earlier Tools and Intel article uh that you put out, one point that you both stressed in that article was the importance of certifications like CPEO and ESAC. Why do those matter so much? And how should brokers bring that into the client conversation?
SPEAKER_01:I'll take that from a broad perspective and just say that it's extremely important that we protect our brokers, right? To make sure they never have an issue, should a you know a PEO go insolvent. Now, Ari will go on and explain what those certifications actually mean.
SPEAKER_00:And it is very important because there's over 500 PEOs in this country, and less than 5% of them have certification through the IRS and the ESAC accreditation. And they're two different things, right? So when you talk about the certified PEO status, that's with the IRS, and that's basically saying you're a successor employer, and that means if you move to a PEO mid-year, you don't have to worry about federal tax restarts. So prior wages get credited, and again, you know, that becomes a big expense potentially for an employer. Uh, the other thing it does is it insulates them if the PEO doesn't remit their taxes to the IRS to really have that protection. But the ESAC accreditation really covers a lot more. It's a third party that audits the PEOs every quarter financially and look at certain matrix. And it'll protect the client if the PEO should go out of business from payroll to insurances to taxes. And how they do that is that each PEO is required to buy a very, very large assurity bond. So that really will insulate the PEO, more importantly, the client, the broker in the process.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, Ari, can you share with us how many PEOs are actually certified? About 5% of them.
SPEAKER_00:And our PEOs, are they amongst those 5%? Absolutely. That's one of our biggest requirements. There are times because of we need a PEO in our arsenal that's important to our brokers that might not be accredited or certified. We're making sure on the back end that everybody's protected with the PEO buying in a surety bond to protect everybody. And there are reasons why we have a couple of partners that are not, but generally we're not going to have a conversation with the PEO that's not certified and accredited.
SPEAKER_04:Definitely. That actually leads me into my next point. I mean, you're you're both clearly knowledgeable in this space. Um, talking about it seems to come very naturally to you. Uh, what makes CRC Benefits PEO Practice Group the go-to resource for brokers? So, what makes us different? What makes us better? What makes us special in addition to the to what you just spoke about?
SPEAKER_01:You know, as I have said before, I think our our main strength is our expertise, right? We've been doing this for for quite a while. We understand, you know, the environment, we make sure that we educate our brokers, but at the end of the day, as I said before, it's all about our process. We have a well-defined process. We start with a discovery call, we find out what the needs of the client and and the broker just as importantly are. And you know, once we understand that, it's our goal as CRC to make sure we come up with the right solution. Yes, it may be it may be PEO, it may be an open market solution, and by the way, it may be a combination of both. So extremely important to understand what people's needs are.
SPEAKER_00:And just to add to what Rob just said is, you know, listen, I think we've been doing this longer than other people in this space. But, you know, as CRC, we have five divisions in our company. And what's unique about it is we all run our separate divisions, but we really do that for the sake of the broker. So we work as a team, right? Every broker has their own sales pod to really help them with their different products and services that they offer. And again, we're a piece of that. The piece is definitely growing year over year, but we want to be that help in that solution so the broker retains their client, gets new clients, and give them the right advice to help them build their practice.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, just to support that a little bit, Ari, how many times have you talked somebody out of a PEO?
SPEAKER_00:That number is around 50%. Because just because they hear PO is so great, it doesn't mean it's the right fit for the client. You know, the client has to want to be compliant because the PEO is going to require them to be compliant. Um, it might not be a fit because of participation, it might be because of certain risk scores or demographics. And, you know, that's where that Rob said it multiple times. We want to have that discovery call because the last thing we want to do is give a prospect a ton of forms to fill out and information we need to look at it in two seconds and say it's going to be declined instantaneously. So again, we want to make our brokers look good every step of the way. And by doing so, we have a very defined process. And our PEO team does an amazing job, you know, in every step of the way from that initial discovery call to the sales presentation to demoing the technology, the level of service from our PEO partners, and then implementation, and then finally with the renewal process. You know, we know the broker wants to be involved in the renewals. We're making sure they get the renewals 90 days in advance. We're giving them a game plan, we're working with them very closely in the client to make sure we retain their business and that the clients are happy.
SPEAKER_01:And we also understand that the most important element of this is actually the broker's relationship with the client. And we respect that. You know, we're always transparent about what we do, and we always make sure that you know, when we're making recommendations to the client ultimately, that the broker is on board and we're all on the same page.
SPEAKER_02:Well, before we close, we always like to ask, you know, what's next from your perspective, what's coming up in the world of PEOs that maybe brokers should keep on their radar?
SPEAKER_01:That's a that's a that's a great question because the the market's definitely maturing. But the good news is, although it's you know become a very popular solution to issues, it's not a the majority of the solutions, right? So there's plenty of room for growth. But most importantly, as I stated before, you want to make sure that you as a broker are well positioned and that your client most importantly knows that you're educated in PEOs and can assist them if in fact it's the right fit.
SPEAKER_00:And to add to that, the PEOs are really evolving very rapidly. We've seen over the last 10 years the both the growth of the PEO and changes in the industry, and we expect more to come. You know, when we first started this, Rob and myself 10 years ago, there were about 900 PEOs. Now we're in the 500 range. So we're seeing consolidation, we're seeing more market share growing in many of the regions and the support and the services, but yet as it's maturing, we're gonna see some changes. You know, we're gonna see people exiting a PEO, we're gonna see people changing PEOs. So there really is a lot of opportunity that we see in the forecoming future.
SPEAKER_04:Perfect. Thank you. All right, now, Robinari, before we wrap up, it's time for Amanda and my favorite part of the podcast, our fast three. So it's three quick, totally non-PEO questions so our listeners can just get to know you uh just a little bit better. Um, and I'm really looking forward to this because I've worked with you for a couple years. So I'm very curious uh about these answers. So are you ready for this?
SPEAKER_00:I'm not sure.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. First up, what is the best concert you have ever been to?
SPEAKER_01:Oh, that's definitely an RE question. You're the music person, Rob. This is true. I think you stopped me. No, you I mean, I I could tell you, uh, you gotta remember the generation that I'm from, right? So that would be either yes or renaissance.
SPEAKER_04:Very good.
SPEAKER_01:I'd add queen to that also, to be honest.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yes. Perfect.
SPEAKER_04:All right, we'll let you off on uh from that one. Um, this is a little bit easier, maybe. If you could only eat one type of cuisine for the rest of your life, what would you choose?
SPEAKER_01:I would say pizza.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, pizza. I love it.
SPEAKER_01:I'm gonna go, I'm gonna go along with that. But what type of pizza are you? It doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_02:I don't discriminate either.
SPEAKER_01:Well, we come from they add everything from salad to you know meat on top of a pizza. It's just it's actually amazing.
SPEAKER_02:No one can judge us for eating pizza if there's salad on it, so problem solved.
SPEAKER_01:Problem solved.
SPEAKER_00:My favorite is the mashed potato bacon.
SPEAKER_02:That sounds delicious. I'd have to try that one. Yeah, it does. All right. Last one. Do you have a favorite quote, mantra, or piece of advice that's just stuck with you over the years that you kind of pull out when you meet a someone who's new to the industry or struggling or trying to break into this industry that you like to share?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I can only tell you from experience that you just have to stay in the game, honestly. Uh you know, it's tough uh whether you're you're in the open market or you're in the PEO market. You know, as a broker, you have to be out there constantly hunting. And you know, you want to always make sure you're doing the right thing for your client. And then if you're doing that, you're doing the right thing for the client over the years, it all comes back and pays you big dividends.
SPEAKER_00:My advice is really to work harder than other people. You don't have to be the smartest person in the world. Um, I'll use myself as the example. I wouldn't say I'm the smartest person. I might know a lot about PEO and I work really hard, but you know, for someone new in this business who's looking for new prospects, I would say go PEO because it's a pretty easy opportunity.
SPEAKER_04:I love that you brought that in there, Ari.
SPEAKER_00:You knew I had to.
SPEAKER_01:I knew that was coming.
SPEAKER_04:You need to get that copyrighted, that phrase or try to do it. It's pretty.
SPEAKER_02:We should put that on a t-shirt for him.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_04:Awesome. Thanks so much for playing along you too. That that was really, really fun. And and thank you both uh for spending time with us today.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you. Very welcome, and it was great to be here.
SPEAKER_02:And thanks to everyone listening. Don't forget to subscribe to the CRC Benefit Check podcast on your favorite platform so you never miss a future conversation. We'll see you next time.