Beyond Saint Podcast
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Beyond Saint Podcast
From Homelessness to Hope: Jessica Echeberry’s Inspiring Journey
In this heartfelt episode, Jessica Echeberry shares her powerful journey from a traumatic childhood marked by abuse and homelessness to becoming a dedicated family and homeless advocate. Growing up in a broken home with little faith influence, Jessica faced unimaginable challenges, including sexual assault and running away from home at a young age. Despite the pain and rebellion, she found strength through faith and resilience. Listen as Jessica opens up about survival on the streets, the complexities of trauma, and how sharing her story has given her life new purpose. This episode is a moving reminder of the strength of the human spirit and the importance of compassion and understanding in healing. Perfect for those interested in social issues, faith, and personal transformation.
I get pregnant. That changes everything. I didn't know at the time that my family was for abortions. You know, if you want to stay here, you have to go get the abortion. I was talking with some woman on the bus one night and she was like, oh, I have a room that I can rent you. And so we went there and ended up being a room in a crack and prostitution house. So I just started learning how to live on the streets. What I tell people is that the street itself has its own economy, right? There are things that homeless people do in order to survive and live. It's just to take what you do in your normal life and just flip it upside down. There's income, there's work, there's family, there's all of that stuff on the street. It's just, it's all bad.
SPEAKER_02:We're here today, Beyond Saint, with Jessica Echeberry. Did I say that right? Yes, you did. Okay, I think you have a really, really interesting and inspiring story. It's like... from the bottom of, like, I think the worst condition someone could be in to, like, I think the best someone could be in. But before that, before we get into that, I think we have to brag a little about you. You are a family advocate, advocate for the homeless. You are a mother, devout Catholic wife, and lots of other things. So... Why don't we talk a little bit about your background, and do you feel comfortable sharing your story with us?
SPEAKER_00:Yes, yeah. I mean, I feel like whenever I have an opportunity to share my story, that it gives purpose to the things that have happened. Otherwise, it's just these really painful things that I experienced that... we're just there and can just stay painful. So yes, I'm not sure, like start from.
SPEAKER_02:I would start from the very beginning. I mean, how was your upbringing?
SPEAKER_00:Growing up, I categorized the home I lived in as a broken home. So my parents divorced before I was a year old. And so, and they both had divorces and remarriages, about three total. And so it created an environment for me where there were like step parents and there was a step sister at one point and then she was gone. And so in that kind of environment, unfortunately, even statistics say that the greater chances are there for abuse situations. And that's a part of my story is that at 10 years old, I suffered sexual abuse. And yeah, and then at 12 years old, I suffered sexual assault, rape. And in those circumstances, at the times that those were happening, it was kind of like because my parents were in their own woundedness, right? couldn't really be there for me and I didn't share with them what I had experienced right so there's that division and disconnection I ended up just kind of what I call packing it into boxes and just shoving it down into my being into my soul and that's how I just kind of kept going but it was after my sexual assault at 12 that I realized yeah yeah 12 is
SPEAKER_02:was it somebody your age or adult
SPEAKER_00:no um it was it was the in-between age so it was like I'm 12 it wasn't necessarily an adult but it was um you know a senior in high school that had come over to the middle school at an event um and so it was somebody that I knew and it was somebody that I was familiar with and it was somebody that in a sense I trusted um which put me in a situation where he could then isolate me and have that opportunity. So it was shocking. And life-changing. Of course. It's so traumatic. Life-changing. And then, of course, the feeling. And I think a lot of sexual abuse victims and survivors start to then take that on as they've done something wrong. And so... They've done something wrong, like to invite it? Either to invite it, or they made the wrong decision, or somehow, some way, this is their fault. Because it happened. Because you don't really know, especially at that age, when you're a child and that happens, you... I didn't understand what all that was. I mean, you see on TV and rated R movies that you sneak to watch and you get a little peek sometimes and it's like, oh, but you don't understand what that really is and what that feels like and all of that. So, yeah, I disassociated. I immediately disassociated from my experience.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And I mean, really all I remember about it was just staring at the cracks in the concrete in the building that I was looking up at. And so, yeah, and then it was done. And it was like, okay, what do I do with this again? I don't have a home life where I can bring this to. And so I kept it inside and just said, you know what, Jess, this is now the second thing like this that has happened to you. You know, I just, I just told him that you're on your own. Like you've got to just do for yourself. You've got to like you in a sense, harden up and just.
SPEAKER_02:Because you didn't feel protected. No. By like the person you knew or your parents or like. Or the world just did not protect you.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no. And look, and that was a time where, you know, kids can jump on their bikes and be gone all day at their friends' houses and all around the neighborhood. And, you know, when the sun was going down and the street lights came on was when you had to be home.
SPEAKER_02:The world was relatively innocent.
SPEAKER_00:It was. It was. But it was also that environment allows for people with ill will to... Have opportunities and take advantage. And unfortunately, that's what happened with my situation. And that created... you know, like a rebellion in me. I was angry at the world now. I didn't know how to process the trauma that I'd been through. I was blaming it on myself. And I didn't know what to do with all that. And that turned into just this interior kind of rage and reaction to the world where I was tough. Nobody was going to do anything to me. And I'm making my own decisions and not listening to anybody. And so I became, you know, the rebellious teenager at home And your parents had no clue why? No.
SPEAKER_02:No, they didn't. And was there faith in your home growing up?
SPEAKER_00:No. No. So... It's funny because when I learned about my parents, more about my own parents' story, which has kind of like unraveled and I've learned more throughout the years, especially now that I'm getting older, is that my parents, when they first met one another, were like hardcore Christians. Really? Yes. Yeah. They were like hardcore Christians, you know? Yeah. But, and I can't speak on their story, but it didn't last, and the house that, you know, my parents divorced, and then the remarriage happened, and I was with my mom and her husband at the time, and And either of visiting my dad, there was no prayer. There was no we're going to church. There was no, like, don't worry, God's got you. There was none of that dialogue. It was very secular dialogue. It was very worldly. We lived in the world. And I honestly didn't think anything of it. My biggest religious influence growing up was my nana, my dad's mom. My dad was raised Catholic all the way up to his confirmation, but ended up leaving the church and going into... Happens a lot. Yeah, yeah. Going into that, you know, leaving the church and just living kind of in the world, but then falling into what's Protestant Christianity. Yeah. And to this day, he's an amazing Protestant Christian, right? He never returned back to the Catholic Church. And he did end up finding his way back. But no, growing up, there was none of that. My nana, I used to watch her pray the rosary at her kitchen table and read her Bible. She had in her little trailer, she didn't have a lot of money. She lived in a trailer in a trailer park, 55 plus. And I remember going through the hall in her trailer and just kind of, you know, as a little kid, you run your hand along stuff. And I ran my hand along her wall and it hit this picture. And it was Jesus. And it was like the 70s, like velvet. I can
SPEAKER_02:visualize
SPEAKER_00:it already. Picture, you know, like it's like the Jesus part was like all velvety and soft. And then his heart was like puffy and came out. So it was the sacred heart of Jesus picture.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_00:70s style. And I remember like running my hand across. and my hand hitting that heart and just looking up at him just in that moment. Just being like, huh. And then just keeping going, right? And then when I eventually... It stuck with you. Yeah, it stuck with me when I became a Catholic. I was like, oh. And I refer to that moment as there was a moment when I was a child where I put my hand on the velvety heart of Jesus, right? So there's little moments like that. Yeah,
SPEAKER_02:but... And then, okay, so you go through your rebellious stage and then... I remember you said you experienced homelessness.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so I became a really big problem at home. Okay. Really big problem. And my mom and her husband at the time had had a baby together, my half-sister. And so their focus was on, you know, her. And so they were afraid of my influence on her. And so I started running away. I didn't want to be at home anymore. At 12? At 14. 14, okay. So now I'm 14. I'm in high school. I start running away. I start sleeping in my friend's closet so that their parents don't know that I'm there. I crawl in their window at night and just go sleep in their closets. And your mom has no clue about the rape? No. My family didn't know about that for a very, very long time. A very, very long time. But that's how it started. And then... my parents would find out that I wasn't there and that I had run away and then the police would bring me back. And then sometimes the police wouldn't bring me back that I'd end up getting put in a group home. So then I lived in a few group homes until finally it got to the point where, um, my mom said, there's a family member that you can live with, right? So it's, you're not in this hostile household. You're not creating this, all this drama here for us. Um, and hopefully you'll be happy over here. So I went to go live with that family member. Um, And just went back to my old high school. So in the moment, I was really happy. Can I interrupt for one second? Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Was there anything that your parents could have done that could have helped you at that point? Like any sort of intervention? Like you feel that could have worked? Or were you just like a runaway train headed for this?
SPEAKER_00:That's a great question. I don't think anybody's ever asked me that. I would say, and to give my parents grace because they were in their own woundedness, that there was definitely things that if they had worked on themselves in a sense would have recognized when I was younger. By this time where I'm running away and doing all this, no, I would say I was that runaway train. But even still 14, even 16 years old, you're still young. Your
SPEAKER_02:brain's not even developed.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's a hard question. I'm sure that the answer to that question is yes, but my final answer would be, but it's okay.
UNKNOWN:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. No, no, yeah. I'm not saying like a blame thing. I'm just saying for other people out there, what do you think your parents could have said or done that maybe would be like, hey, maybe I'm not on the right path? You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no, that's a great question. When I share with parents who have rebellious teenagers, the stuff that I share with them is like a child is acting out. because they're in some type of woundedness and trauma. It's not because they're bad, right? And so instead of seeing behaviors, and again, I think this goes with the time in which we grew up. At that time, all the mental health awareness wasn't there. So at that time, it's as if you were acting out at home, you were just being bad.
SPEAKER_02:Exactly.
SPEAKER_00:So they were a victim to what we were doing as a society at that time as well, where now we're just so much more aware. And I think parents have that awareness now that, oh, if my child is screaming and yelling at me and throwing things across the room, something here has happened.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Not, oh, they hate me and you need to get out. Right? Right. So I think we just,
SPEAKER_02:honestly, our parents didn't know any better and we didn't even know how to communicate ourselves.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:That was your way of communicating your pain. We didn't have all these TikTok videos about attachment style and about even praying. We didn't have. Our only resource was our goofy friends. Getting on my bike and riding to my friend's house. Exactly. Cosping about how awful our parents were. Right,
SPEAKER_00:right. Playing, you know, like an album we weren't allowed to listen to on the record player is a way to rebel. Yes, totally.
SPEAKER_02:Gosh, we kind of got ripped off. We really did. We did. My daughter, like, has, all of our kids, they have access to everything. Yeah.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, sorry.
SPEAKER_00:Keep going. Yeah, no, I love that. I love that. And it's true. And it also helps me to think deeper about that time because sometimes, and this is what woundedness and trauma does, especially because we have an enemy that wants to use it against us, is we can stay stuck in just that part of it and not look at the fullness of it. And
SPEAKER_02:sometimes being stuck is very satisfying. Yes. And it keeps us in some... Sort of an addiction cycle to being the victim.
SPEAKER_00:Yes. Yeah. There was a lot of, this is definitely my victimhood age was here. I was definitely acting out as the victim and in rebellion to that. Yeah, definitely. And so now I'm 16 and I'm living at my family member's house and I have a high school sweetheart and So I'm dating a guy in high school and I get pregnant. And so that changes everything. I didn't know at the time that my family was for abortion. and not keeping the child. Honestly, all of it was just so new to me. But I didn't have that support. My family was, you know, if you wanna stay here, you have to go get the abortion. And for me, it was like, okay. Okay, I'll go get that. Obviously, I want somewhere to live. And so I tried. I went into the abortion facility three times total. My friend on our lunch break in high school, she drove me there. And the first time I went in, I was so nervous, and I put a fake name down and filled out the paper, and I was sitting waiting to be called, and I just... Wait, I have to interrupt again. Yeah.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:An adult said you have to get the abortion and who's pro-choice and didn't even take you, like, just to support you in that?
SPEAKER_00:No, no. Wow. Look, there's a lot that I don't remember. It's really, like,
SPEAKER_02:a lot of abandonment.
SPEAKER_00:Yes. Yeah.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and I think, again, with that age, right, that season, that society was in, I think that was, like, the biggest thing. Yeah. What looked like independence and freedom was really just neglect and abandonment for the most part. That's what I think, yeah. So it's like, yeah, so, yeah, one of my closest friends at lunch break, and I went in, and I was sitting there, and I was just petrified. I didn't know what it was. I didn't know. I was just there just to do it so that I would have a place to live, but I got like a hot flash come over me and I got really nauseated and I was like I can't do this and I and I chickened out and I left and then I told my friend to take me back and so she took me back and I got further I got into the triage nurse where they take your blood pressure and they ask you about your cycles and all that stuff but then it happened again I had a hot flash and got nauseated and I was like no no no I can't and I left And then my friend was like, are you sure you want to do this? I was like, I have to do this. And so she took me back the third time and I got all the way in. I was on the gurney. I was in the gown. The nurse came in. She was about to put the Twilight medicine in my arm and I got nauseated and hot again. And I was just like, I, no, I can't do this. And I left. And my friend actually got kind of frustrated with me when she saw me back in the car. She's like, okay, done. I was like, no. She's like, And then she's the one who said, I know where to take you. And so she drove me to a pregnancy center, like a life pregnancy center. She's like, you're going there and talk to those ladies in there. And so I remember everything was like mirrored. It was just like, you know, the shape of the pregnant woman on the outside with the phone number. And I walked in and probably the sweetest woman in the world that I've ever met walked up to me and was like, hi, you know, how can I help you? And she took me into this room. I have like a loveseat couch and a big TV and a VCR. And she's like, we're just going to show you some videos and then we'll talk about how you feel. And I was like, okay. So she put the video and there's all these videos of these girls, my age. talking bouncing babies on their knees or like really pregnant talking about their baby and I was like and that's when it hit me for the first time like a baby it's a baby and Like I have a baby inside of me right now. And so considering, you know, I didn't have a good relationship with my parents. I had lots of people in and out of my life. I suffered trauma with male-female relationships with my abuse and assaults. The first thing that I went to was it's my own person.
SPEAKER_01:Right.
SPEAKER_00:Like I'm going to have my own person. And so that means that this person's like going to love me and like love me the way I want to be loved. Right. And I get to love it the way I want it. So I was like, oh, yeah, I'm totally down for this. Like, let's have a baby. Wow. Yeah. Wow. My parents, my family wasn't budging. It was, yeah, the abortion or nothing.
SPEAKER_02:You decided to keep the baby.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, I decided to keep the baby. And my boyfriend at the time was like, yeah, okay, great. But then I needed to find a place to live.
SPEAKER_02:It's so mean to say you could only stay if you get an abortion.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Yeah, what I've learned throughout the years going through my own trauma and in walking other people through theirs now is that we can heal from it And help where we can stay in it and just continue to be a slave to it. And my parents were slaves to their own woundedness. My family was still living in their woundedness. So, but yeah, no, it was definitely life changing. The only place we could find, my boyfriend at the time, was a room for rent in This woman he befriended riding the city bus home from work. He was a grocery bagger at a grocery store. And he was talking with some woman on the bus one night and she was like, oh, I have a room that I can rent you for your pregnant girlfriend. And he was like, okay, great. And so we went there and ended up being a room in a crack and prostitution house. Yeah, so. That's
SPEAKER_02:so awful.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no. So sorry, that just sucks. Yes, it did. I don't
SPEAKER_02:know how other words, choice of words to use other than it sucks.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no, and I appreciate that because that's like the genuine reaction to that statement that I made. And a lot of times that I share with people is a part of healing from your woundedness is when people don't respond properly really appropriately to what you're sharing right because it makes them uncomfortable so i i thank you for that like it did suck
SPEAKER_02:and it feels predatory like
SPEAKER_00:yeah
SPEAKER_02:she didn't it feels when you said that it felt to me like her intention was not to rent you a room but like get you somehow dialed into her nasty lifestyle yes
SPEAKER_00:yes because that is the woundedness she's living in yes and that she's experiencing and trying to live in and stay in the stuff that she doesn't want to change.
SPEAKER_02:And you see mine, I'm coming from a place of, and now I'm getting angry. Right. Because now like, I can't like, I can't empathize with her pain because I can't like, Even if you're in pain, don't draw others into it. That's right. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I'm sorry. It's getting me mad. You're getting me worked up.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. All right.
SPEAKER_02:Sorry.
SPEAKER_00:No, no. Okay, so she lives in a crack house. Yes. She basically ran that house, her and her husband. Oh, it's a family affair. Yes, because there were children there as well. Yeah. This was, I will say that this was one of the hardest experiences I lived through was... Sorry. Just witnessing the depravity.
SPEAKER_02:I'm so sorry.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Yeah, that lives in that. Can you grab your mama tissue? Yeah, thanks. It's like the bathroom's
SPEAKER_02:right there. Sorry.
SPEAKER_00:No, it's okay. I mean, this is... The actions are all there, right? And so whenever I share them, it's like they're present. Just like if I remember my wedding day and I smile because it was a great memory, right? So yeah, because there were children there and that was the part that was the hardest for me. Sorry. Thank you. Toilet paper. It's okay. Yes. And it was filthy. I mean, cockroaches everywhere, just filth. It was literally filth. My room, obviously, I locked the door and I was there and stayed just out of everything as much as I could. But it was horrific. It's hell. The lack of light and holiness and God, it's literally evil where evil lives. And that's what I was experiencing. Now, I did call my mom one night after a few months that I was there and I couldn't take it anymore. And I told her some of the things that I had experienced and seen. And she drove immediately and came and got me out of there. But the concern was, again, I had a younger sister that they didn't want to know that I was pregnant. And so... They had to get me somewhere. So my mom actually found a Christian home for unwed mothers to put me in. Um, and it was really nice. It was, you know, like a really, it's a big, beautiful home. Like back then I'd call that, it was like a mansion to me. Um, it just had lots of rooms and it was run by a Protestant church as kind of a family style environment. So it had a house mom and a house dad. And then there was just us girls, you know, who were pregnant and in our situation. But what I didn't know is that in order to stay there, you had to promise to give your baby up for adoption. Yeah. Oh, gosh. Yeah. The hits
SPEAKER_02:just keep coming.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, we just started. Okay. Yeah, so I enjoyed my time there. I lied through my teeth that I was going to give my baby up for adoption, but I wasn't planning on it at all. I wanted to keep my child. I'm not mad at those lies. Yeah. yeah so and my boyfriend and i broke up we just we couldn't survive what i was going through um so we were no longer together and somehow somewhere in that time where i'm pregnant he decides that it's best that i do give the baby up for adoption and so now everybody around me is encouraging me just to give the baby up for adoption And so that's what I decided to do. Because I had no place to live afterwards. If I didn't give him up for adoption, I couldn't bring him back to the maternity home. I couldn't bring him home to my parents. And now my boyfriend's telling me that they weren't going to take us either. My ex-boyfriend. So I agreed to it. And he was due on Christmas Day, actually. But he was two weeks late. So he came January 7th. And it was hard. I was in there by myself.
SPEAKER_02:Your mom wasn't with
SPEAKER_00:you? My mom was at the hospital with my ex-boyfriend. So they were in the waiting room.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:But they were in the waiting room the whole time. I was there by myself. And, unfortunate for me, I got nurses that were so disgusted by the fact that there was such a young girl having a baby. And they didn't hold back their feelings. I remember being on the delivery table and giving up pushing because I didn't... Again, I've never experienced this before. Nobody told me what it was going to feel like. And I'm in the worst pain of my life about to push out a baby that they're going to take from me. So... So much
SPEAKER_02:trauma.
SPEAKER_00:I gave up. I just stopped pushing. Oh. And the nurse was very upset at me. And I'll never forget what she said. She looked at the doctor. And she said, see, this is why babies shouldn't be having babies. And you know what? In a way, it's true. There's truth in what she said. She
SPEAKER_02:could have whispered it to him rather than tell you, like make you feel uncomfortable. You're already.
SPEAKER_00:Right. But it's like bad timing on her part, really, I would think. And she got up over me and she finished pushing him out by pushing on the top of my stomach. Yeah. So in it. And that was very painful. So it was a painful birth. And, yeah, they brought him to me. And I got to spend an hour with him, my new son. His name is Brandon. And I just remember just crying. Yeah, like, I want to take my baby home. Oh, wait, I don't have a home to go to. That's so
SPEAKER_02:sad.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I can't cry. I have another interview after this. Sorry. I'm not trying to make light of the situation and make stupid jokes about my
SPEAKER_00:stupid makeup. No, it's fine. It's fine. I
SPEAKER_02:have to get it together. All right. Yeah. Okay, so Brandon's born.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. I spend an hour with him in the hospital. I beg everybody, even my ex-boyfriend, please, let's just figure it out. Nope. They get shut down, and I leave. I leave the hospital and go back to the maternity home. without them and just fall into a seriously deep depression. I mean, I'm 16. You know, I'm 16 years old. I don't think a
SPEAKER_02:40-year-old could process
SPEAKER_00:that. Right? I mean, they just took my kid from me against my will. You know what I mean? So it's like, hello, I'm going to be depressed and not want to talk and eat and do those things. For good reason. Yes. And then a couple days afterwards, my ex-boyfriend called and said, my family has been praying about it, and we want you to get the baby back.
UNKNOWN:Oh.
SPEAKER_00:And so now it's like-
SPEAKER_02:Emotional rollercoaster.
SPEAKER_00:Right, it's like, of course, I'm like, yes, right? And so now he went into foster care. He didn't go into an adoptive family. So there was nothing done through the courts. So all I had to do was just nullify the papers I signed and they would bring them back. And so they brought them back to us. And so I was in my ex-boyfriend's living room, his family's house, with my two-week-old new baby I'm two weeks postpartum. And I spent the whole day there just being a mom to him. And then at about 11.30 at night, you know, he comes in and he's like, okay, you got to go. Like my parents said, you can't stay. What is going on? I know. I know. People and their woundedness. Yes. This is why healing your woundedness is so important, people.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, your woundedness affects others. It does. I mean,
SPEAKER_02:you can be wounded and still have empathy for someone.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. You can.
SPEAKER_02:You know, we all carry around wounds, but also, like, maybe know how to do unto others, too.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:You know, I know lots of people who've been... under like yourself, even unresolved trauma,
SPEAKER_00:you know? That's
SPEAKER_02:still, for the most part, know how to behave.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, sorry, keep going.
SPEAKER_00:No, no, I love your comments. You're making me think so much deeper about all this too. I really appreciate that.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you.
SPEAKER_00:So I left. And I went to the beach. Now this was in Fort Lauderdale, Florida, because that's where all this was occurring. That's where I'm from originally. And I went to the beach. It was the only place I knew. I always loved the sound of the ocean waves. And so I'm sure that had something to do with it. But I also, the sand was more comfortable than an alley or a concrete something or a bench or something. And so I went to the beach. And I just thought, okay, just one eye open. You've been through worse, Jess. Just once you see that sun come up out of the water, you got this. Like, you could totally do this. And so I hyped myself up into, like, just getting through that first night. And sure enough, the sun came up out of the ocean. And I was just like, I felt like, honestly, now that I think about it, I felt pretty powerful. Like, you just lived through this. Conquered. Yeah. It makes you tough overnight. Right. And immediately I was like, oh, yeah, let's go. Like, let's do this. But I was hungry. Now I remember because I'm like two weeks postpartum, 16 years old. So bad. Right? On the beach. Now I'm like hungry, you know.
SPEAKER_02:Wait a second. You didn't go back to your boyfriends? No. Like they were just taking the baby and not like... And you can't, you're not gonna be a part of it? Like, that was the vibe?
SPEAKER_00:Well, the vibe was he's gonna stay here, but you're not.
SPEAKER_02:So you get to go back every single day and hang out with the baby? Yes. That was kind of the assumption?
SPEAKER_00:I don't think they wanted me every single day. No, it was kind of, you can come visit. Yeah. Got it. Yeah. So, and I was hungry, so I started going through the garbages in front of the McDonald's there. And, um... Yep, and... you know long story short is that there were a group of other homeless youth my age older up to like early 20s that ran Fort Lauderdale Beach that ran the streets that were homeless and lived out there and that was their culture and way of life for whatever reason whatever reason put them out there and they immediately identified me like immediately out of the gate they're like You're brand new, you know? And approached me and started talking to me. And yeah, so that's 16. So I just started learning how to live on the streets through them. We would work the system, right? We'd go into, one of us would go into like a shelter and get all the stuff and then leave at a certain time before, you know, like child protective services would be called or we'd be snatched up and put into like the system. Um... And we just bring out resources for all of us. We do that. What I tell people is that the street itself has its own economy. There are things that homeless people do in order to survive and live. And the best way that I've... learned how to explain is just to take what you do in your normal life and just flip it upside down, right? So it's like, there's income, there's work, there's family, there's all of that stuff on the street. It's just, it's all, bad. It's all not coming from good, but coming from evil in a sense, right? Or your employment, right? What do we do in order to make money? We prostitute, we steal, we burglarize, we fraud, right? All of that stuff is the work that you get up and you go do in order to get the resources that you need.
SPEAKER_02:Interesting.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And that's your family. Who is watching your back? Who is helping you get that next resource becomes your family and your kin so to speak so you have family you have relationship you have work right and then it's just all about surviving like there's not a single homeless person that you will probably ever meet that will tell you that they want to die you know they they wake up to live really right we have this innate part of ourselves it's just who we are as human beings especially you know as when we become christians and learn to whom we belong belong and who created us, right? We were made for life. We have this desire, this, you know, this desire to live, right? No matter what your circumstances are, like, and that's what I felt. And that's what we all felt. That's what we were doing. But it was, you know, it was depravity. I mean, I was doing things that were not just wrong against other people, but just wrong against myself, you know, not really caring for myself. Because I didn't know. But that lifestyle requires you. You have to commit to it. There's no in between. Have you seen your baby at all in this time? Not really. Here and there. Every once in a while I will. But... And I don't know why. I don't remember. But I would say that I think it was too difficult to not have him. And so... it was easier for me to pretend like he didn't exist. And so I didn't, I didn't go over much. I didn't, and I was a street kid pretty much. So I was living that life and those two lives. And that's what I'm saying. It's like, you can't have one foot in one and one foot in the other. The street requires you to fully commit or you'll literally die or just lose your mind. And so I ended up just fully committing into that way of life. Very rare connections with my family every once in a while, maybe going in and being a part of something for my family, but not really. I was in and out of my nana's trailer. She wanted me to move in with her, but I didn't do that because she would have been thrown out because it was a 55 plus place. So I would go there for reprieve and just spend time, spend a night there and be with her. She was my closest. person, my nana. But no, I was all in. I was all in. I was fully good. I mean, I'd always been super intelligent in school. I was tested for the gifted program in kindergarten. I was very artistic and creative, kind of like just all across the board excelled in school and learned things very quickly. put my mind to things and got them done, like executed and accomplished it. So that was just a part of my personality just as a person. So when I hit the streets, that requirement to put all that into motion really benefited me. You have to be smart. Yeah. To live on the streets. Yes. Yes. And I didn't use drugs or alcohol. And that shocks a lot of people because a lot of people who end up on the streets turn to drugs and alcohol as a way to kind of numb what your experiences are in coping yes I didn't and the reason why I didn't is because I needed to be have full autonomy over my mind and my person because of my sexual assault and rape so the crazy thing is you're opening up the
SPEAKER_02:door for that if you're into
SPEAKER_00:alcohol exactly so those incidences kept me from falling into drugs and alcohol on the streets and so I know it sounds crazy No, it does not. But it's like, I thank God for that because my life would have been completely different.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe you wouldn't be here right now.
SPEAKER_00:I wouldn't. I wouldn't. I definitely wouldn't be here right now. So yeah, I went all in. And then at 18, I got pregnant again.
SPEAKER_01:Well,
SPEAKER_00:yep, I got pregnant again. And at that time, it was dark. Everything was dark. Everything I was doing was dark. It was wrong. It was sinful. There was no good in anything I was doing. And that was the voice that I listened to. And the voice that spoke to me was, the best thing you can do for this baby is to have an abortion, is to get rid of it. And that sounded like truth. straight up truth to me because of where I was at in my life and it was like yeah and that voice was constant it was like you know what happens to kids out here you see what happens to children in those houses like you what are you going to do with a kid out here you know what's going to happen to it what kind of mother are you right
SPEAKER_02:I mean it's normal questions anybody would ask themselves
SPEAKER_00:yeah and so that was the voice that I that I listened to and so I did um I went in at 18 and to the abortion clinic and had that abortion. And it was... It was hard. I remember going in just numb. Just feeling completely numb about the whole thing. Because that's just how my life was at the time. You're just numb to everything. You're just like barreling through everything. And I went in there barreling through this. And... And I remember when it's done, I don't remember when it happened because they gave me the Twilight, but I remember waking up in a big recliner in a dimmed room, like a darkened room. There was a TV in the corner blasting whatever daytime show was on. It was just so loud. And just the room was circled in recliners, big, comfortable recliners. And in all of the recliners, there were girls sitting in them. like coming out of this drug. And I remember looking at that and just being like, what have I done? What have I done here? There's just something so wrong about how I felt when I came to in that room. And I started to regret what I was doing. And I got into the car and the person that had taken me just looked at me and I started sharing that regret. They just looked at me and they said, this didn't happen. Don't ever speak of it again. They said, you have to have that mindset. And I was like, okay. And that was it. I literally took that and put it in a box and shoved it deeper than any other wound I had experienced and forgotten about it. Just completely forgotten about it. But I go back to that wanting to live because after I had that abortion, I didn't want to live anymore. That was gone. That desire to survive and live was just zapped from me. Um, and I wasn't interested in any of it. And so I attempted suicide for the first time.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, sorry. Gosh.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. So sad. Yeah. Um, luckily I'm here. Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Luckily you failed.
SPEAKER_00:Someone failed. Someone found me. Um, I, I took a whole bunch of just bottles and bottles of prescription drugs and downed it with a half a bottle of whiskey and, um, yeah, and ended up hitting the floor and apparently when I hit the floor, that sound got somebody else's attention and brought them into the room. And there's one memory I have where I'm laying on the floor I remember doing that, but then I remember waking up and seeing a person over me literally smacking me across the face, trying to get me conscious. I have a flash of that, and then I'm out. I don't remember anything else again, but I do remember that. Wow. And then I wake up in the hospital, and I was pissed. I was so mad. I was so mad. I yelled at the doctors. I yelled at the person who saved my life. I was like, how could you bring me back to this? That was the state that I was in. And I went back out there. I was back out there, pretty much. In abusive situations, domestic violence, suffering in those relationships. Living with this roommate here and that roommate there, but then back out on the street or living in the car here. It was just very random. And then my Nana passed. Can't catch a break, Jessica. You just cannot catch a break. Nope, my Nana passed. And that crushed me. That just crushed me. And I was like, you know what? I'm done. I'm so done. I'm going to do it to where nobody can find me this time. Where nobody has a chance to save me. And so the car that I had at the time was a Monte Carlo. It was super fast. And I took this road. We're still in Florida here in this part of my life. And I took this road. It was like 3 o'clock in the morning. I didn't put my seatbelt on. I got in my car. And I took this road that leads out to the swamps. And I thought, I'm just, and it's a long road, like 441 all the way out to the end at that time. It's all built up now at that time. I knew that by the time I got to the end, I would have gone so fast in that car that even if I changed my mind, it would still put me in the swamp, right? And I'd die. And so I just put my, Pedals to the metal, as they say it. And I'm just driving, and there's nobody out on the road, so it's like a straight shot, and I'm crying. I'm trying to work up enough nerve to just keep my foot on the pedal because I don't want to experience this life anymore. And I'm driving, and I'm driving, and I'm driving, and I am going fast. And all of a sudden, I hear... I hear my Nana's voice. Oh. Gosh. And she was like... All she said was... No, it's going to be okay. And I stopped. And I share with people, like, God knew that I wasn't going to listen to him. I didn't even know him.
SPEAKER_02:Well, yeah, that makes
SPEAKER_00:sense. You know, so it's like he allowed me to hear the only voice at that time in my life that I trusted.
SPEAKER_02:You heard it like audibly? Audibly.
SPEAKER_00:Like she was there in the car with me.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, wow. That's kind of cool.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. She's like, no.
SPEAKER_02:I always wonder when people say, oh, God spoke to me. Is that a thought you had in your head? Or you actually heard a sound?
SPEAKER_00:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:Wow.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. Like she was there.
SPEAKER_02:That's pretty cool.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. And it's not even just a sound. It's a feeling of their...
SPEAKER_02:Presence. Presence. Sure, sure.
SPEAKER_00:You know, and so, and I, I just, I just bawled my eyes out and I didn't know what was going to happen next, but I just knew that it wasn't going to be that.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. So your next trick.
SPEAKER_00:Yep. And that's what I did. I went back into it. I ended up in a, um, in a relationship with someone that, um, was very abusive. Um, it was kind of an arranged relationship. There's, it's hard to get into, but there's kind of trafficking relationships on the street. And this ended up, I ended up being in one of those that I couldn't get out of. And, but I had a roof over my head and I had, you know, food and a place to live, even though it was a shack. But I was in this relationship and at 21, I got pregnant again. Wow. But this time, this time, I'm like, nah, I got a roof over my head. I got a place to bring my child home.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, Brandon.
SPEAKER_00:Nope, Brandon I already had. No,
SPEAKER_02:the baby. Oh, I thought you
SPEAKER_00:were saying. No, no, no, no. I had already given up on him. They weren't letting me see him because of my. Oh,
SPEAKER_02:you mean like getting pregnant
SPEAKER_00:again. Yeah, so now I'm pregnant. Okay, got it. Right? And so now it's like, ooh, I get my own person again. Oh,
SPEAKER_02:gosh.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. And now I actually have a roof over my head. Got it. So now I actually have a place to bring this baby home to.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:So I'm planning on having this baby, bringing it home. And then at five months pregnant, he abuses me. It's an incident of abuse that's like really bad. He ends up throwing me through a plate glass window. Oh gosh, I'm so sorry. I know, but here's the good thing about that, right? Is that abusers, especially domestic violence abusers, they know how far to go so that their victim doesn't have to go seek medical care. They pull back and stop before it gets to the point where they know their victim needs help. And it's kind of this very sick, kind of sustained process pattern of abuse where you abuse them enough, but not enough to where now the outside world knows it needs to come in and intervene. And by putting me through that play glass window, as terrible as that experience was, I am now sitting in a hospital. You see what I'm saying? So it's like, I'm at a hospital and this nurse is looking at me and she knows what this looks like. And so she's like, you have to let me help you. And I was like, no, that's okay. Because now remember I'm thinking I can't change anything about my situation because I have a roof and I need to bring this baby home to it. So I'm not, I don't want her help, right? And she tells me, well, he's going to kill you if you don't let me help you. I'm like, I don't care about that. I've already tried that twice and I've been unsuccessful. Like that doesn't mean anything to me. Gosh. And then she said something that changed everything. She said, he's going to hurt your baby. Yeah. That was very smart of her. Yep. And when she said that, everything just clicked. And I was like, what do I got to do? And that was the start of my freedom, really, from that entire life that I was living on the streets was accepting that help from her. Wow. And... He went to jail. The apartment got turned over to me. And there I was. There I was, not getting abused anymore. That's awesome. And had a roof over my head and about to give birth to my third child. But was 0 for 3 so far. And then I went into labor. I was dirt poor. Just dirt poor. I took a taxi to the hospital. And I gave birth to my daughter, Vanessa. And it was amazing. It was awesome. I was on cloud nine because I was in the hospital and I wasn't leaving without her. Aw. And you finally had somebody to love you. And I finally had somebody that I could love and that I knew was going to love me, you know. And I took her home in a donated car seat from the Women's Guild at the hospital, because I didn't have one, and in a taxi cab. Yep. And welfare was paying my rent, and food stamps was putting food on the table. Works. Yep. And I was just, I tell you, if you would have knocked on my door at that time in my life and been like, hey, Jess, how's your life? I would have told you I had the best life ever. Like, I was living the dream, right? But you were. To me, I was. But the reality was that I wasn't.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, but I mean, considering you're not homeless and you're not being beaten up every day, getting put through glass doors, and that
SPEAKER_00:is
SPEAKER_02:the dream.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, but was I living the best version of myself? Right, and I didn't know that yet. So, and I tell people that that's why it's super important not to leave people where they are. You can meet them where they are, but like to, Tell them the truth about how beautiful their life is and how much more God has in store for you. For sure. Yeah, and I did what, again, just personality-wise, I take everything to the max, whatever I'm doing and I'm focusing on, and I did that. I took advantage of free childcare, of friends who would watch my baby at night so I'd go bartend. I'd bartend all night long and then put her in childcare and then go to an office job and then go to another job in the afternoon and then go bartend again. So by the time she was two, I had even had my own business. That's awesome. Yeah. I was running permits for construction companies and had people working for me. So I'd pulled myself out of homelessness and social services. I was off. social services, had my own new beautiful apartment now. I love it. And had her in. So materially and physically, I was much better. But I was still living the wrong way and not doing the right things for myself. And then... I was working as an office manager and our copy machine broke down. And they sent out a repair guy to fix it. And he looked at me and he was like, I'm sorry, we can't fix it. Do you want me to send a sales guy out so that you could buy a new one? And I was like, okay, sure. So the sales guy came out and was showing me like all the copiers. And then I was like, okay, yeah, I gotta think about it. And then he left. And then when he left, I had a hot flash. And I was like, this was in Florida. So I was like, oh my gosh, did the air conditioner stop working? And then it went away and I didn't think about it. And then the copier guy came back And showed me more magazines and copiers and trying to sell me. And I was like, okay, yeah, I need some more time. I'm not ready to commit to it. And he left. And I had another hot flash. Didn't put two and two together. He left. And then the third time he came, he came with another sales guy. Showed it to me. And I was like, yeah, okay, thank you. And that was kind of the last round. I was like, you know what, I'll reach out to you. Don't worry about it. And then he walked out. And when I went to go sit back at my desk, I had another hot flash and was complaining about it. And the woman behind me was like, you like him. And I was like, like who? She was like, the copier guy. I was like, I don't even remember his face. I honestly didn't. That's so funny. And she was like, well, he's probably still there putting his stuff in his car. You might want to go look and see what he looks like. And so I went and I peeked out and he was standing there, like the back of him, putting stuff in the trunk of his car. I was like, man, I can't see his face. I was like, hey. And he like turns around like all handsome, you know. And when he turned, his like body moved over and I saw it was a BMW. So I was like, ooh, that's nice. That's attractive. And then he turned and I saw his face for the first time and I was like, wow, you're like really handsome. I think I got like really embarrassed and I pulled myself back and went back in. And then I wouldn't take his call. Because he knew something happened there, and he was trying to call, and then the secretary called in sick, so I had to answer the phones one day, and he got me on the phone. He was like, let me just take you to lunch, and we'll just put this whole copier thing to rest, right? If you decide you don't want to move forward, I promise I'll never bother you again. And I was like, okay. So we went to lunch, and I walk in, and he's already sitting at the table. smiling, like greeting me. And I'm like, oh my gosh, he's so handsome. And so I walk up, I have my little copier folder and I put it on the table and he just looks up at me and he slides the copier folder over. And he just looks at me and he's like, do you really want to talk about copiers?
SPEAKER_02:Oh, sassy.
SPEAKER_00:And I looked at him and I was like, no, I don't. And we talk for like hours, just sharing each other's lives. And, um, Yeah, long story short, you know, he's now my husband of 23 years. Deacon
SPEAKER_02:Charlie.
SPEAKER_00:Deacon Charlie. Aw. Yeah, and, like, he was just so different. Like, he comes from a different background than I do. You know, intact parents and, you know, grow up in the faith, a very strong Catholic faith background and unity together as a family. Sure,
SPEAKER_02:and that's what you needed.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah, and God knew. God knew that... I wasn't gonna go directly to him. And so he had to come through somebody else to get to me. And it was definitely Charlie. I mean,
SPEAKER_02:Just from Charlie's perspective, I'm just thinking, okay, here I come from this... Isn't he Latino? Yes. Come from this
SPEAKER_00:religious... I love how you ask that as a question. He gets that so much, too.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I can't remember. He comes from this Latino, intact family, and here's this spicy girl, self-made, but with lots of trauma. It's kind of combustible. He had a lot to take on. And you had a baby. Yeah. Yes. Did
SPEAKER_00:he have a child at that point? No. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Yeah, no. It's funny because I lied to him for probably the first six months of our relationship about who I was and where I came from. I totally lied to him. It's
SPEAKER_02:on brand for your...
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. I mean, look, you got to do what you got to do when you're going after what you want. Right, right, right. So I totally lied to him. And, like, I even put myself in debt. to take him out and do weekend trips on motorcycles with him. I did not let him know at all. like any of my history. Only that I was in a relationship, it didn't work out, and I have a child from it. Like, that's it. He didn't even know about my other child or anything. Like, I told him nothing in the beginning. Well, I mean, honestly, he didn't need to know. That's the way I see it, too, so. I
SPEAKER_02:mean, why do you need to tell a guy everything day one? Like,
SPEAKER_00:hey, I told him this and that. He would have totally walked away. Yeah, exactly. You don't need to freak him out. He would have totally walked away. Yes. So then, within the first year... I just, I fall so head over heels in love with him. And he feels the same way about me that my conscience starts to kick in. I'm like, I haven't been honest with him. And so I think it was like about seven months in, I tell him like, I have stuff to share with you. And I didn't share all of it at once. I just shared like the big stuff. Like I have another kid and here's kind of like where I come from and here's about my family. And he was shell-shocked. Just shell shocked. And we broke up. We broke up. Oh gosh, that's
SPEAKER_02:traumatizing.
SPEAKER_00:Yep, we broke up. And it was the worst. I don't even know how long we were broken up. But I went to his house and I went to his bedroom window and was just like knocking on his bedroom window crying. Like, please just listen to me, right? And I remember like petitioning him. Like... But do you love me? Why does that matter? Give me a chance to show you that if you really do love me, you should stay with me. And he did. And he did. And then I had gotten myself in such a financial mess trying to impress him and win him over that I was getting evicted from my place. um yeah um and i i was barely now able to take care of my own child because of it so again like materially i was doing well but i was making the wrong decisions with my life um and i ended up having to move away um up to upstate new york with my daughter just to kind of get regrounded and sure and kind of put my life back together. And so we had a long distance relationship during that time. And it was during that absence, I think, from me that he realized.
SPEAKER_02:That he loved you so much.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, like I want this person in my life. Like, yeah, I do. I needed that absence. And so he told me, he's like, he went to his best friend at the time and was like sharing with him all this stuff about what I shared with him. And his best friend looked at him and he said, But if she didn't have all that stuff, would you be with her? And he was like,
SPEAKER_03:yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And then his best friend was like, well, that seems like a really wrong reason not to be with someone. It's basically a past that they can't change. Right. And then he said, it sounds like she's hauntingly necessary to you. That's what he called me. Hauntingly necessary. I like that. And my husband liked it too. He was like, at the time he was like, yeah, I guess she is. Hauntingly necessary. Hauntingly necessary at that time. And so, yeah. And so then after that, he moved me back down. He got an apartment and moved my daughter and I, you know, back down to Florida with him. And that's when we kind of started our household together. And then he got a... a job transfer to Los Angeles. And that's when we came out here. Oh, wow. And started our lives together out here. That was in 1999.
SPEAKER_02:Wow. Yeah. And I read that you had explored other religions. Yes.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And him being Catholic. Yeah. Yes. And extremely patient. I know. Patience is one of his strong points. Yes, definitely. So
SPEAKER_02:what were your, I'm not laughing about the, I'm laughing at poor Charlie. What did I get myself into in the most loving way? I mean it in the most loving way. I feel like my husband has those moments too, you know? Um, Well, that's what you get with authentic people, you know? We land where we land. We don't just follow like sheep. That is very true. Right? We don't. But when we do something, we mean it.
SPEAKER_00:And we give every ounce of ourselves to it. Exactly, right? Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, so tell me quickly about what other religions you explored and then how you ended up in Catholicism.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no, I was searching for... I'd gone through like secular therapy for seven years. So being in the relationship with him kind of held a mirror up to like the truth about what I'd experienced. Because when you're in trauma, you tend to surround yourself with other people in trauma. A
SPEAKER_02:hundred percent.
SPEAKER_00:So you don't really know what you're really in until the kind of opposite comes along and shines that truth mirror on you. And it feels...
SPEAKER_02:a little boring too when you're not around other trauma people.
SPEAKER_00:Right. Well, just different. Yeah. Yeah, you're just, you're not like me. So, yeah, you know. So, but... So being in that relationship with him, now I'm like, I'm living in California. I'm like a stay at home mom. I don't have to work. I have a loving husband who's taking care of me. That clashed with, no, Jess, you're just a street kid from Fort Lauderdale. And so those two identities were hit butting heads. They were clashing. I had like an interior chaos. So I started going to therapy. I went to secular therapy for seven years and it helped. I came out of that really processing my, trauma behaviors and what I had experienced but it wasn't like complete so like I was watching Oprah one day legit watching Oprah and she just looked at me like I felt like she was looking at me there it is she was looking you know at the camera and she was like you have the power inside of you go out and get that power it's in you The power is in you. And I remember like just folding laundry and looking at her pointing at me and saying that. And I'm like, yeah. I've got the power. It's the power in me. And that drove me to kind of, I started doing meditation. Right. I started meditating thinking I just reached nirvana and that's where all the power inside of me is because it's an interior thing. Meditation is interior. So I dragged my poor husband into every single meditative session that you can imagine. Yeah. Yep.
SPEAKER_02:I've done stuff like
SPEAKER_00:that before too. I can relate. Yes. Like just, I know I'm going to, I'm going to do it again. That person, personality kicking in. I went to a
SPEAKER_02:mega church for free tortillas. My poor husband came with me. I swear this is a true story. They were like, do you want homemade Mexican food? And I don't mean to interrupt your story. No, are you kidding? It's a conversation. So he was like, I was like, hey, my friend invited me to this gathering. They've got homemade Mexican food, and I love it so much. And we're in St. Louis, and we never get it. And all of a sudden, I'm at this giant megachurch, and we're in the front row, and then before the Mexican food. Yeah. I'm like, everybody, close your eyes. It's like, I think we had 4,000 people in the room. I don't know. They're like, we have some nonbelievers here. If you're ready to accept Jesus into your life, put your hands up. I'm like, my husband's like, where are we? What's going on? Where's the tortillas? We just wanted tortillas. They're like, put your hand up. And I'm not putting my hand up, and neither is he. And then the guy, like, pastor with the microphone's like, I see people not putting their hands up. And then we're both like... He was like, I'm going to kill you when we get out of here with
SPEAKER_00:that. Sorry, I didn't mean to. No, so you did an altar call just to get some tortillas, basically.
SPEAKER_02:And at that point, I was a lapsed Catholic. Right. I mean, sorry. Okay, go ahead.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no. So yeah, so I was meditating and
SPEAKER_02:he's Charlie's a love for the meditation.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Like whenever I drag him somewhere, he'll go, you know, but he's taking the kids to mass. We have two kids together in our marriage. Um, our two bottom sons and, um, he takes the kids to mass. I go meditate and I go to the self-realization, um, temple here in Pacific Palisades. And, um, I just go by the lake, you know, the lake is beautiful. And I was meditating there one day and there was a glare coming through But my eyes were closed. And I was like, what? Something's like so strong that it's glaring through my eyelids. And when I looked up, it was the sun reflecting off the top of their temple building up there. There's like a gold dome or something. And I was like, oh, I've never been in the temple to meditate. Maybe I'll go in the temple to meditate this time. And so I go up there and I open it up. And it's shaped like a hexagon or octagon shape. And then there's like steps down in the middle. But on the back wall, there's these six towers. tapestries, like big, like eight foot tapestries hanging. And I remember looking at all of them and those were like the deities, like the avatars that they worshiped and prayed to. And I was like, oh, and then right in the center is Jesus. Jesus is on one of the tapestries. And I was like, I literally look and when I see him, I was like, asking myself, what are you doing here? Like, what are you doing here? Right? I was shocked. And the moment that I asked myself that, I started what I can only explain as a mystical experience. My entire body just completely Like every molecule of my existence felt like it was at its capacity. I describe it as like a heaviness, but it's not heavy, but it took me to my knees. Like I couldn't stand anymore. It was just the weight of it, in a sense, took me to my knees. And I was just in this awe, like I couldn't believe what I was feeling. And he legit came out of the tapestry like a hologram and looked at me and was like, hi, welcome. I'm glad you're here. He said, I see you've met my friends. And then he looked at me just deep into my soul and was like, you're searching for me. I'm the one you're looking for. And after he said that, gone. And I was just, it changed everything inside of me because it was true. And every part of my existence is who I am, experienced it. And I just, yeah, like that was it. That was it for me. That's
SPEAKER_02:beautiful.
SPEAKER_00:I love that. It was just like, okay, you are the one I'm, you're the one, you're the one I need. And the first voice that I heard in my head after that was actually my mother-in-law, my Hispanic mother-in-law. Because in all of my relationship with her, whenever we drove in the car together and we drove by a Catholic church, she'd be like, Yesica, Yesica, do the sign of the cross, right? And I'm like, it's my mom, right? It's my mother-in-law. So I'm going to do what she says. Of course. You know what I mean? And so I would do the sign of the cross. And I remember one time getting up enough nerve and asking her, well, why? You know? And all she said to me was, because Jesus is in there. That's so cute. I love that. That's all she said. She was like, because Jesus is in there. And even when she said it, I was like, all right. You know, just keep driving. But that's the voice that I heard. Jesus is in there.
SPEAKER_02:You know what's so weird? Like, when you said, like, why? Like, whatever. Like, it's so weird. Like... I would almost, like, when I was lapsed, I would almost think, like, when people would, like, give, like, a Jesus explanation or a, like, a religious explanation, I would just be, like, in my head rolling my eyes. Like, they don't know any better. It's like, why was I so cocky? Like, for what reason?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, no. By
SPEAKER_02:the way, I'm getting that done to me now. It's just desserts. That's what you call just desserts.
SPEAKER_00:Just desserts, right.
SPEAKER_02:You know, I just... It's such a cocky, like, level of, like...
SPEAKER_00:Way of responding. Operating, yeah. Operating, yeah. The only way I know how to explain that is because we lacked, at that time, the encounter.
SPEAKER_02:Right. Of course. Yeah. And we thought
SPEAKER_00:we
SPEAKER_02:knew
SPEAKER_00:better. And we thought we knew better. Like, until you encounter Jesus, you know what I mean? For me, it was the
SPEAKER_02:Virgin. Yes. The Blessed Virgin. Yes. And I just was, like, my life... She's been life-changing for me, so... Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and you know what? Jesus and his mama have a way of humbling us, right?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, they do.
SPEAKER_02:No, my daughter treats me that way.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:She's probably just always, like, when I say something, like, rolling her eyes. Like, my son took, my son, like, was taking the LSATs to get his, like, to go to law school. I'm like, let's say a rosary. Do you want to say a rosary? And he's like, okay, mom, all right, like.
SPEAKER_00:For you, I will. Yeah, exactly. That's what they do.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, for you, I will. And that's how I was with my mother-in-law, too.
SPEAKER_02:That just made me think
SPEAKER_00:of that when you said that. Yeah, no, I rolled my eyes at her so many times. Right? So many. Yeah. And there's not an understanding there of the encounter. That's what I truly believe it is. Right. And that's what I pray for. I pray for the encounter. For all the people that I love that haven't had that encounter yet. I pray that for them. Yeah,
SPEAKER_02:because you can't go back. You don't want to. You don't want to, of course.
SPEAKER_00:You don't want to. Once you realize, it's like, nope, there's never, there's no going back. It's like, yeah, he becomes the choice. For good. Yes. Yeah. And then? And that's what happened. And I ran home. And as I was driving home, it was the image of a crucifix. He was like, you'll put this up. Because I had salt crystals. Oh, gosh. I had all kinds of stuff going on in the house, right? You know? And like all kinds of stuff going on. And so it was as I was driving home, it was the instruction, like take all that down and just put the crucifix up of me. He asked me to do a crucifix. And I know now why. I didn't understand at the time, but it was so that I could unite my sufferings that I've experienced and will continue to experience with his. That's the, you know, we hear these words, imago Dei, right? That's the image of God that I have connected to my own personal experiences. My imago Dei is Jesus on the cross. For some, it's Jesus resurrected, right? Or Jesus in the tomb. Or Jesus feeding. Or Christ the King. For Christ the King. Right. Yeah. So it's like, for me, it's Jesus on the cross.
SPEAKER_02:I, so how did, do you think that, I know you went through a lot of secular therapy, but do you think that becoming, so you became Catholic. Mm-hmm. Becoming
SPEAKER_00:a Catholic. It took me three years after that to actually become Catholic.
SPEAKER_02:But I mean like your journey now. Yeah. Did that help you heal more?
SPEAKER_00:Are you kidding me? Yes. I love that. I mean, it is the, yes, it's the, I forgot the word to use, but it is the cornerstone of my healing, right? Even scripture tells us that Jesus is the cornerstone. Like you can do all this building up to get to that part, but without him, you're never going to be complete and full, right? He is that fullness, that completeness to whatever you're working and building on, no matter how good it is. Right. You still need that cornerstone, that piece that pulls it all together and makes it complete. And that's what he did. He completed my healing to the point where he brought me through forgiveness for the people that I used to dream about literally killing for the harm they did to me and loving them and wanting to see them in heaven. So it's like that type of forgiveness, again, Jesus on the cross, Jesus on the crucifix, Father forgive them.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, you know what that made me think of? You have a very similar story to Maria Goretti.
SPEAKER_00:But you didn't die. No, I didn't die.
SPEAKER_02:Right. But yes. That's what she said. I want to see him in heaven with
SPEAKER_00:me. Yes. Yes.
SPEAKER_02:She was a rape victim. For those who don't know Maria Grady's story, she was a rape victim. And I guess when the priests went to go give her her last rites, he said, do you want to send a message to anyone? I can't remember. They had a conversation. And she said, please tell the person who raped me that I forgive him and I get to see him in heaven with me. And he went on to change other people's lives.
SPEAKER_00:He did. He was at her... canonization, I think. And she actually called him by name on her deathbed. She said his name, I forgot, Alejandro or Alessandro. I cannot remember. She said, I want Alessandro or Alejandro to be in heaven with me. Yes. Super powerful. Even Saint Josephine Bikita. Yes, yes. She's the saint of rape victims too. Yes, yes. Sex trafficked people. Yeah, she was sex
SPEAKER_02:trafficked at a young age. She was sold as a slave.
SPEAKER_00:Sold as a slave five times over.
SPEAKER_02:So what, like now her story is like insane it's so cool like these saints can teach us so much
SPEAKER_00:and what have they all done they've taken the love of Christ to the maximum exactly where he asks us to take it to trust him with ourselves fully because the idea of actually loving someone who's harmed us we can stop right what I share people is the secular world is going to bring you through healing and forgiveness up to that level Because they're gonna tell you, just forgive for yourself. Forget about them, right? Just forgive so that you feel better and that you can function and you can go on with your life. Don't worry about them. They don't exist anymore. But that's not Christianity. That's not what Christ calls us to. Christ calls us, he thinks, right? I truly believe that what makes God the most happy is when the wounded actually turns to him and says, I forgive them. and I want you to forgive them too. And I'm gonna pray for their forgiveness. Think about that in just the fact of intercessory prayer. Who would be the most powerful intercessor to pray for that person who raped me? Me. Me. I would be the most powerful person to do that. His grandma can pray for him all she wants. But for me to say to God, no, do not hold this sin against them. That's what Jesus was saying on the cross. That was the example he was setting for us. And that perfect forgiveness only happens with Jesus Christ.
SPEAKER_02:100%. Who's your favorite saint? Saint Josephine Bikita.
SPEAKER_00:Mother Teresa. Mother Teresa. And we
SPEAKER_02:got to dial it back. And I said this to Charlie before. I think he's very Joseph-like.
SPEAKER_00:He is.
SPEAKER_02:You know, like he took a lot on.
SPEAKER_00:Yes. Yeah. Yeah, no, he took on, you know, children that weren't his that he loves. He adopted. A lot like Joseph. My daughter, yes. Saint
SPEAKER_02:Joseph.
SPEAKER_00:He adopted my daughter and raised her, you know, and yes, even foster kids, even in our lives, in our story, we fostered two children. I have to interrupt again. Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Where's Brandon?
SPEAKER_00:Brandon is in Florida. Did you reconnect with him? I did. When he was 14, he found me and reached out and we reconnected. Oh, I love that.
SPEAKER_02:I love that. I want I'm gonna see your picture room so quick. Yeah,
SPEAKER_00:I'm gonna show you. Yeah, I will show you a
SPEAKER_02:picture. And then, Josephine Bikita. Josephine Bikita is your favorite saint.
SPEAKER_00:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:What's your favorite prayer? And why?
SPEAKER_00:My favorite prayer is Probably this new one that's been placed on my heart this Lent that I'm doing the most and that's, Lord, please do not hold this sin against them. Just praying for those that need the prayer to just for their heart to be reconciled with God. I
SPEAKER_02:hope I can get there. I know you can. I'm a work in progress, for sure. I'm way further along than I was three years ago.
SPEAKER_00:And you'll be further along three years from now.
SPEAKER_02:I hope so. And if you had to describe your relationship with God in one word, what would it be?
SPEAKER_00:Mercy.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that's beautiful.
SPEAKER_00:Mercy. Yeah, I had a vision of... me at the foot of the cross. It was like a dream or vision that I had. And I was six years old. So it wasn't me now. It was me as a six-year-old Jessica at the foot of the cross, just kind of looking up at him. And I don't know what it meant, but Jesus on the cross and the mercy that that means, him being up there. He didn't have to be up there. He didn't do anything wrong. He did it for us. He did it so that we can be reconciled to him and to conquer death, right? And so that is the ultimate mercy, right? That love where you lay your life down for someone else.
SPEAKER_02:That's beautiful. I love that. How about your parents? How are you with your parents now, speaking of mercy?
SPEAKER_00:My parents are awesome people because I got to a part in my healing where I stopped blaming them and holding them responsible for my healing and happiness. And that was a big kind of moving point out of my pain with them and in our relationships. I love my parents to death. I think that in some ways they're still stuck in their woundedness. And there's, I pray for them to have that encounter, right? That just really changes everything. But I think they're amazing people who have their own stories to tell if and when they allow God to work in them in that way.
SPEAKER_02:What a great story of survival. I love it. I truly love it. And I think it's inspiring for other people or women or girls that are in your situation, whether they're victims of domestic abuse or homelessness or rape. You're like that girl that has survived it all and come on top and a better person. Maybe if all those things didn't happen to you, You wouldn't be where you are now. Like, you know, maybe you... I
SPEAKER_00:believe that. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:I've been asked in interviews before, like if you can go back and change one thing, right? And it's a very tempting question. For all of us. Very tempting question, right? But no, I wouldn't change anything because God has taken everything, and I mean everything that I've experienced, and he's shown me the beautiful masterpiece he can make out of each and every one of those things.
SPEAKER_02:Right, I agree.
SPEAKER_00:I...
SPEAKER_02:Experiences and people come as a blessing or a teaching experience or something. There's something to be found in everything. Well, thank you so much. Thank
SPEAKER_00:you.
SPEAKER_02:I think this was an amazing interview. I
SPEAKER_00:enjoyed it.