From Faith to Action | Cameron Garner | vEP.12

In this episode of Founder Fumbles, host Damari Taplin sits down with Cameron Garner, founder of Holy Spirit Fire Schools and Cameron Garner Ministries, to talk about faith, identity in Christ, and the real struggles behind building a ministry. Cameron shares his journey from North Carolina to Puerto Rico, why he believes many Christians struggle in their walk with God, and how understanding your identity in Christ can completely transform your life. If you're a founder, leader, pastor, or believer looking for deeper purpose, this conversation will challenge how you think about faith, calling, and obedience.

Cameron also explains his mission to train and equip believers for real-world ministry, his experiences seeing healing and miracles, and the lessons he's learned while building ministry schools around the world.

Connect with Cameron Garner:
🌐 http://www.holyspiritfireschools.com

🌐 http://www.camerongarnerministries.com

📚 The Kingdom Perspective: Out of Adam and Into Christ – Available on Amazon

About Founder Fumbles:
Founder Fumbles is a podcast where we talk about real startup struggles and comeback strategies from founders, leaders, and creators building something meaningful.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:46

All right, he's back. We'll get it going. All right, Cameron, you ready to do this? Yeah, brother. All right, let's get it. So we're gonna get to going in three to one. Welcome back to another episode of Found and Family's where we talk about real lifestyle struggles and comeback strategies. I'm your host, Damari Taplin, and today we have the founder and CEO of Holy Spirit Fire Schools, uh, founder of Cameron Gardner Ministries, author of The Kingdom Perspective, and now a traveling minister training the body and identity in Christ. Ladies and gentlemen, we have Cameron Gardner.

SPEAKER_00 1:36

Awesome. Glad to have uh thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_03 1:39

Well, thanks for being here, man. Um, so where are you from? Um, you know, being married, getting kids, what's going on? Who are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:47

Yeah, so I'm from North Carolina originally, lived there most of my life, uh, lived in South Carolina for a brief period of time, uh, you know, working in children's homes with my wife. Um, but here in the last actually almost a year ago, uh, my wife and my kids, uh, we moved to Puerto Rico. And so we moved out here, just following the Lord. We came out here for a mission trip, and it was it was incredible, and we were like, we really like we all were feeling like, man, are we supposed to move here? Because we were going to be moving anyways, and we were going to be starting a like a permanent physical location for a ministry school. Um, and but we didn't know where we were really seeking the Lord, and it just became very clear. So within less than two months, uh, we were living in Puerto Rico, sold or gave away almost everything we had and moved on.

SPEAKER_03 2:49

Wow. Okay, yeah, I've been to uh Puerto Rico uh a couple times, maybe think three times. My mom got married out there. Um I was out in San Juan. So um, yeah, but I love Puerto Rico. The weather is fantastic out there, the food's great, and it's uh it's a nice place to be.

SPEAKER_00 3:07

Oh, we love it.

SPEAKER_03 3:08

Yeah. So uh you so you're the founder CEO of uh Cameron Gardner Ministries. Uh tell me a little bit about that.

SPEAKER_00 3:17

So Holy Spirit Fire Schools is under Cameron Gardner Ministry. So Cameron Gardener Ministries is the original name of the of the ministry.

SPEAKER_03 3:25

And so Holy Spirit Fire Schools, what's that?

SPEAKER_00 3:29

So Holy Spirit Fire Schools, that's a couple different ministry schools that I that I equip the saints to uh live out or to walk in. And so really uh it's not your standard ministry school. Okay. It's not your, you know, I'm gonna go somewhere for a couple years and get you know a degree, you know. Um obviously there are some some capability for some people to become ordained, you know, get to see their life, get to know them, uh, you know, see what their what their heart is for God, what direction they're going in, kind of thing. And there's options for that. But um the ministry schools that I offer are more hands-on, it's equipping the saints. Here's the problem we're all called to preach the gospel, but we're called to equip the saints for the work of the ministry, and a lot of times what we see is a lot of people being preached at instead of being trained, right? Because we're all called to ministry, whether we want to be or not, there's different uh levels, different capacities, different things that we can walk in, right? Like not everybody's called to be a pastor, but we're all called to certain things as a believer, and but the question is is do you know how to live from the Christ within you? Do you know how to walk in the things that God has called you to walk in? And the reality is most Christians do not, you know, most Christians, uh, even a lot of pastors and leaders, it's sad to say, but it's true. Uh, you know, it's it's it's almost like it's such a struggle to move forward with God. When we look at our life, we're like, why is our life going in circles? Why are we doing all these things trying to become something, and it just seems like it's not working, right?

SPEAKER_03 5:39

Right. Why do you think there is a struggle uh with people trying to walk with God?

SPEAKER_00 5:45

Because the problem is is that they're functioning from the wrong place. See, the Bible tells us to walk by faith and not by sight. It teaches us to walk according to the spirit and not according to the flesh. And there's a lot of things that we think that we're doing right and we're really not, you know, because our life is supposed to be looking similar to the life of Jesus. You know, really, he's the goal, he's the way, he's the truth, he's the example. And oftentimes, you know, that's why there's so much cessationalism because people are looking at their life to determine what's true. But see, that's not what faith is. Faith is never living from the flesh towards the spirit. You know, we can do all the right things, read our Bible, pray, fast, do all these things, and with a right heart, with great intentions, with a love for God and for people, but actually be doing them from the flesh towards the spirit, right? Because here's the thing we're not becoming something in Christ, we're not becoming anything. That happened when you gave your life to Jesus. You became something new in the spirit, but the question is how do you live from that new reality? You know, I'll put it this way you're not becoming a new creation, you became one. But how often as a Christian are we doing things to try to become? We hear it a lot, you know, becoming this, becoming that, becoming this. And the reality is that you're already everything you desire to be in Christ.

SPEAKER_03 7:38

So is this is this uh kind of like what your book is about? Because you're also an author.

SPEAKER_00 7:43

Yeah, yeah. No, no, yeah, my book is about that's the kingdom perspective, so it's a different perspective, it's out of Adam and into Christ. Why? Because everybody was born into Adam, so they grew up thinking like Adam, living like Adam, getting their truth from the natural, getting their truth from the flesh, and when you give your life to Jesus, you become something new in the spirit. But are you are you living from Adam still? Okay, you see, so so are you identifying with Adam or are you identifying with Christ? Because the reality is that you're not be the process is not becoming something, the process is realizing and renewing your mind to the fact of who you already became. You see, because completely different.

SPEAKER_03 8:40

So um, so you were also um uh a co-host on on a TV show, right?

SPEAKER_00 8:47

Yeah, so yeah, it's called the the Kingdom Talk Show, and talk show is you know two words. Um, there are there is someone else out there that has it with uh you know talk show is one word, so we're on different podcasts, you know, platforms and things like that. I don't I don't do a lot of updating on that now. Um we just leave it out there because it's still you know attracting listeners and we and it was some really good stuff that we put on there. Uh me and a friend of mine. Um so yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:15

So I got a question. Um, have you ever heard of like those uh those like mega churches or or like mega pastors? You you heard of that?

SPEAKER_01 9:24

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:24

What do you what are your what are your thoughts? I want to know your thoughts from um I want to get your opinion on that. What do you think about you like mega church?

SPEAKER_00 9:32

So here's my uh my perspective is that you can't uh conglomerate everything or every church, uh just because it's a large church, you can't say, well, you know what, this is how all of them are, right? Because if we applied that same logic to other things, uh that would be a big problem, you know, and so uh like other countries, other people, other sects of people, like you got to be careful, you know, because the reality is that uh just because you have a few mega pastors that most people chastise and put down, uh, doesn't mean that you know everybody's corrupt and everybody's in the negative and everybody's strong. You know, the reality is that even when Jesus was on the earth, one of the people that was following him was corrupt. You know, even Jesus had a Judas. Okay, and so and so here's the thing what how what do you say about Jesus? Because one of his followers, you know, had a wrong had wrong intentions, wrong heart was money focused. Right so I can't conglomerate everybody because the reality is I don't know them. I know that there's a lot of things that people say just because everybody else is saying it, and they've never actually done their due diligence through research. Right, okay, but you know what I mean? So but my focus is not on my focus, is helping people to fulfill the call of God on their life. You see what I mean? See, I'll put it this way if we want to talk about like different churches and things, I'll tell you one thing that that I don't personally like. Okay, that's this sometimes things can be set up in such a way where it doesn't produce much fruit. And if you think of it like a pyramid, because this is a normal teaching, this is a common understanding in some circles. Um sometimes it's it's the pastor is over the leaders and training the leaders, and the leaders are training the body, and the pastor's over, right? And but think about it if you turn that pyramid upside down and you say, What if it's all about pushing people into their calling? So now I'm pushing leaders into their calling, I'm training and equipping leaders, you know, and then they are training and equipping the body, pushing the body, right? It's like you know, and I'm not saying that you know that if somebody's running their church in that way, that is that is, you know, I'm not gonna condemn them for that, you know. It depends on a lot of things. Like, what are they what's their heart? What are they doing? And here's the thing a lot of people are just doing what they think is right, their heart's right, but they don't know, you know, they don't know any different.

SPEAKER_03 12:42

Right.

SPEAKER_00 12:42

You know, you can there's a lot of pastors out there that used to be in one denomination and did things a certain way, and then now they're in a completely, or maybe they're non-denominational, or they went a different direction, and their whole heart and life and perspective has changed. They were really believing that they were doing what they were supposed to do before, but God got a hold of them and wrecked them, right? And I think we have to show grace where to like grow show grace uh to people because we don't always know where they're at with God.

SPEAKER_03 13:15

So, how did you get in? How did you get into um to this? Like, what's your what's your background?

SPEAKER_00 13:20

Um, can I share one thing real quick? Yeah, yeah, for sure. So sometimes people's sometimes ministries are about fulfilling their specific vision. Now I have a vision from God, but my perspective, the vision itself, is to help other people's vision come to pass. Okay. To me, that's way more productive, way more influential, right? Way more empowering in the body of Christ, and I believe it can have or it will have a much greater effect in the earth, really.

SPEAKER_03 14:02

Okay. So um what what do you think? What would you say has been like your biggest uh your biggest struggle as like a as a minister?

SPEAKER_00 14:12

Oh man, you know, more of my the struggle has changed over time. You know, I was I'm still radical, but I was radical without understanding. And so when I really started pursuing the Lord with everything that is in me, there was a lot that I didn't understand. I was functioning from Adam, the old man, from the flesh towards the spirit. I was leading people to the Lord, you know, I was sharing the gospel with people all the time. Uh, I was very religious. I was my life was a mess. You know, it was mountaintop valley, mountaintop valley, life going in circles, you know, and and I was I would I I word it this way because uh I didn't have understanding, but you know, I would tap into a gift once in a while, is what I worded that way. What I mean by that is like just random, I would operate in a spiritual gift, you know, prophetic or something like that, and I didn't know how it worked. It wasn't I wasn't able to, you know, walk in it consistently, it was just here and there, and I'm like, wow, that was really amazing. That just kind of was random, right? You know, um, but there's been a lot that's changed over the years, and so back then it was uh, you know, because I I break my life up into like I don't know how I don't know the word for it. I mean, there's different seasons in my life where there was a major shift, and my life changed in the Lord, right? And so during after those shifts took place, there was different things that I needed to learn. There was different struggles now. So when I was first, you know, uh ministering, it was like I was struggling with everything because I didn't have wisdom, I didn't have understanding. But after I really began to understand my identity in Christ, that was one of the largest transformations because I began to see the things of God consistently in my life instead of here or there. I began to hear the voice of God, you know, for other people in the prophetic and words of knowledge on a daily basis. I began to see healing on a daily basis. As I would go to Walmart or go to the grocery store or go on the streets, I was going ministering on the streets every weekend. Wow, and yeah, just going out in teams and preaching the gospel and you know, ministering, walking in faith, and so saw a lot of things happen. But during that time of my life, it was a completely different struggle. I was the only person that I knew anywhere near me that was walking in this stuff consistency, consistently, not just in the church, but just as a lifestyle. And so I couldn't relate to other people, but I cared so much and I realized that what I was seeing was was real, it was life-changing, it was powerful, and yet I didn't know how to relate that to anybody else. I didn't know how to make disciples, you know. I didn't know I was I was struggling because I was I tried everything. You know, I tried and and and maybe somebody listening, maybe you haven't come to the understanding of your identity in Christ and walked in these things. But I guarantee you that if you're really on fire for God, you either are or have been struggling in the area that I'm talking about, where you know you want people to know the truth. And so you're you're trying to tell people, you're trying to correct people, you're trying to do all these things. But here's the truth. If you are going to disciple somebody, right, those are people that are gonna come to you, they're gonna value what's in your life, they're gonna see what's in your life, they're gonna humble themselves and want to learn and want to grow. Back then I was trying so hard to make disciples, but I was going about it the wrong way. And now I'm discipling a lot of people. There's a lot of people in my life, you know, that are learning and gleaning ministers and pastors and things. And and it's like I said, so there's a lot that I had to learn. There's a lot. I couldn't even, I mean, I could talk about one thing, but there's so many things that you learn over the years.

SPEAKER_03 18:44

Yeah. Yeah. Well, what would you say was like the biggest the biggest lesson that you've learned, you know, just this year alone, you know, from you know, from January, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:58

This year is uh trusting God in in a different way. So building building a ministry school, leaving your family, like you know, not my household, but my you know, everything I know. Moving to Puerto Rico is a territory of the United States, but it's a different country, you know, and moving out here, you know, figuring everything out, how things work, everything's slower, everything's different. You got language barriers, you got all this stuff, the system is different here. And and so we really chose to sacrifice a lot because of the vision, what we're going after, what we're building, you know, financial things, you know, provisional things. That's something that you know is is has been needed, right? But here's the thing you know, in ministry, a lot of people tell you certain different things, you know, and really what they want, what they're doing, not everybody, but it's a common thing where people are like, hey, I'm gonna sew into you monthly, I'm gonna do this. And really, what they want is they want a prayer, or they want something else, or they want you to come visit, or they want you to do these things, and really that's either that's not their intention, or they just this, you know, they they put it on the back burner, you know. So there are a lot of people tell you things, and what happens is you start like saying, Okay, well, you're like figuring things out financially, you know, okay, well, God, you know, you know, all right, this is how you know somebody's gonna sew this, somebody's gonna sew that kind of thing, you know, because you're building like it costs a lot of money. Like I didn't never I never realized how much it cost to do the things that I'm doing, you know. And but here's what here just to simplify it, um God is our source. And we know we we're we do everything that we can do, oftentimes. But sometimes along the way, we we our belief system gets a little in the wrong place. True, you know, where we're like, okay, God, and like I'm praying and believing that you're gonna, you know, move this person's heart or you're gonna do this. And and and here's the reality is I've got I don't ask for money. That's another thing, and maybe that's a barrier because a lot of people ask for money. I give people like a um the option, you know, to sew or things like that. Um but I don't, you know, even when I travel, I'm like, I don't do the, you know, I I mean I ask people to cover the cost and things like that and do love offerings, but you know, I just personally don't like to do the you know, where it's a set amount.

SPEAKER_03 21:38

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:39

I don't, you know, because if and I and I and and it's because if David never saw his children begging for bread, and we're under a new covenant, then why should we? So I said all that to say this God has to be our source completely. Sometimes we have to analyze our life and Say, wait a minute, am I believing a little bit wrong? Am I putting faith in in myself in an area, a person in an area, you know, somebody said this, somebody said that, or do I just live free and trust God and move forward regardless? You know, regardless.

SPEAKER_03 22:20

Well, the main thing you gotta do is just you have to first recognize and realize that you know everything is it's working in your in your good, you know, in your benefit, whether it's a whether it's a fall, it's a up, it's a down, um, it's it's uh it's positivity. It's it's you can find the light in any situation, you know. Um if even if you just if you just lost your entire home, you know, um that was a part of God's plan. And it's for you, it could have been for you to get to a better place. Um, it could have been something uh a mold in this out, you know, um that was going to kill you a day later. And God just wants you to live more, you know what I mean? You just have to be able to find those, the, those, the, the positive, the light in all of those situations that you think are negative, you know. Okay, yeah, that's just that's just my way of looking at it. I believe that God is just always working with me in any situation, no matter what that situation is. And I feel like that I'm always able to find that light, you know?

SPEAKER_00 23:23

Yeah, yeah. No, I understand. I you know, and that's the thing. It's like, so to me, there's like like I understood that already. But when life happens and things become bigger, you have choices. What do you do? Because what I had to do is I had to move forward. See, this is going on a different tangent, but I was I'll I'll share this.

SPEAKER_03 23:48

It's okay. It's all it's good.

SPEAKER_00 23:50

No, it's good though. Yeah, I I because a lot of people need to hear this too. You know, if they're pastors, leaders, ministers, you know, things like that, that's important. Um because oftentimes we do things out of logic and call it wisdom, but it's not kingdom. It's not faith. Okay. Because we're called to walk by faith and not by sight. And sometimes we mix the two together and we call it wisdom, but it's actually called double-mindedness. And so because we're getting our truth from two mindsets the mind of Christ and the mind of the flesh, the carnal mind, the two opposing mindsets. It's double-minded. And so when things sometimes get really big to you, sometimes you it it reveals to you like where are you at right now with God? Have you kind of you know started, you know, because you know, started seeing things from a different lens. Have you started reverting in in certain ways and that in areas that you've learned before? And I'm not talking about sin, I'm not talking about negative, like big deal, big things. I'm talking about, you know, like financially. Right, you know, because I've I've you know, God has blessed me in so many ways, provided supernatural in so many. Well, I got so many testimonies, so many testimonies, you know. Um, but when the numbers get bigger, you know, it should be irrelevant. But sometimes when you're like, hey, I moved all the way out here, I lived with in a with four family members and some dogs and a cat in a little bitty 800 square foot place with two bedrooms, two mini splits for the whole entire house. The power would go out every week, sometimes multiple times, you know, and we're living out here, we don't know anybody, you know. We're we're we're fighting for the things that we're going after, you know. We got denied for our house twice and we got it the third time. We got denied for our our van twice, but then we got it the third time through the same bank for both of these, but we wouldn't give up, we were moving forward anyways, we wouldn't settle for what things look like. And so I've uh and and what I'm basically saying, uh what holds back a lot of ministries is that they look at their bank account to determine what they can do for God. You see, they're looking at their life and they're saying, okay, well, if this person does that, like they said they would, or that person does this, or if somebody does this that I know, or what, and it's like, wait a minute, God can speak to somebody you never met before about you, He's done it to me. God's told me people's names, and I've reached out to them and shared something with them, or this and that, pray for them, whatever the case may be. And I think sometimes we we feel like we're in faith, but we're still limiting God. I guess that would be the right way to say it.

SPEAKER_03 26:59

Okay. So I do have a question. Um, I want to know like what keeps you like motivated on those days where you keep getting rejected by the bank, or you know, um, you keep you you can't close on the house, or you know, if your plans don't seem to be working out, like what really keeps you motivated?

SPEAKER_00 27:19

So I I'll tell you this, and maybe this just sounds like uh uh too simple of an answer, but I believe God. So when I and I so I have experience with God, I have history with God, I've seen the hand of God so many times in my life. You know, I've seen about 15,000 people healed. I've seen two people raised from the dead. God's told me things about people that would be impossible for me to know. And and I've and and so I believe God over my experience. That makes sense. And and yeah, and so what happens is is when we believe God over our experience, right? We exalt the word over our experience. Because God says the Bible says this that he exalts his word above his own name, and most of the time we won't even exalt it over our experience, and so when we believe the word of God over our experience, it becomes our experience. So, you know, the struggle is the flesh, it's always the flesh, it's the lie. The Bible says that the carnal mind is an enmity against God, it is not subject to the laws of God, neither indeed can it be. It's the brain, it's the natural mind, it goes to the dirt, it's not even you.

SPEAKER_03 28:41

I have a question. What is um so what would says success be? Is there a success? What is the the end goal look like for you?

SPEAKER_00 28:50

So what we're doing is we're we're starting ministry schools all over the world. Okay, and so the goal is to to to make earth look like heaven. That's it, to lead people to the Lord and and and see their lives changed and and see them walking in faith, living their life as if the word of God is real. Because you know, there's a lot of people that believe in God, but there's a lot less than people that actually believe him that take him at his word. And and and so like I said, my vision is to see other people's vision come to pass. And so that's what we do in the school. You know, we we teach people their identity in Christ, we teach people the stuff that nobody ever thinks about. That's very important. Like what is God controlling? You know, there's a lot of things that we just say in Christianity that we never even talk about. Is God controlling everything? Is he controlling some things? You know, what are we supposed to be controlling? Are we supposed to be controlling anything? Well, one of the fruits of the spirit is self-control. That means you're controlling yourself. Well, no, God, God controls me. Uh if I look at your life, I I get He ain't controlling you all the time. Right. You know, and so, but really we're not called to have God control us. The Holy Spirit is leading us, not controlling us. Right? And the Bible even says the spirit of the prophet is subject to the prophet. You look at Jesus, he wasn't being controlled by God, he was yielding to God. But he he believed some things about himself that most Christians won't believe about themselves. And and at face value, you might be like, well, wait a minute, that's Jesus. But here's what most people don't understand. Jesus became a man. The Bible calls him the last Adam. Everything that he did, he did as a man, with the Spirit of God in him and upon him. He is God, but he did not function as God in the earth. And the reality is, is that now you have the same spirit in you that was in him, and God hadn't changed. But people don't think like Jesus, they think like Adam. And so they produce Adam instead of producing Jesus.

SPEAKER_03 31:37

Hmm. So what do you mean uh they they think like Adam and not like Jesus?

SPEAKER_00 31:43

So Adam thinks like the flesh. Okay, right? Adam thinks of himself as fallen, as a filthy sinner, as all these horrible things. And and the reason that we see, let me let me share something. This might be a little controversial, but I'm fine with that. So you hear people talk about covered in the blood, covered in the blood, covered in the blood. I just challenge anybody, find that in the word. And I know that just because something isn't in the word doesn't mean it's not true, right? You know, pineapple's not in the word, right? But if there's pineapples are real, okay, computers not in there, right? But see, Jesus didn't die to cover your sin. That's actually a fallacy, and sometimes we don't realize it because we're saying things that sound good. It sounds good, but that's not what happened, right? Jesus died to make you something new. He's not covering your sin. He made you righteous. See, somewhere along the line, we thought that it's okay to think that that you know Jesus is covering us so that God can't see sin. And that's a problem. Because really, what we're saying is that the blood of Jesus is making God believe a lie about you. So who's believing the lie here? God or you? The problem is that you see yourself according to Adam instead of seeing yourself in Christ, and yes, you are, hey, look, you produce sin, you struggle, and all this, but what you have to realize is that that is a a result of living from the wrong nature, but that's no longer your nature. If it is, you're in trouble, right? Right because you're already seated in heaven, you're not in and out, in and out, in and out every time something happens, man. No, you stay in Christ, you remain in him, but you can live from a mindset that's outside of him and let that dictate your life, and you'll produce carnality, you'll produce sin, right? You'll struggle, the promises of God won't even be manifesting in your life. Some we we we teach people sometimes like the promises of God are always just gonna happen. That's not true. No, no, no, no, no. What we believe empowers the lie or it empowers the truth. The truth sets you free when you know it, but before that, you're in bondage. When you know the truth, the truth will make you free. So if truth sets you free, it's lies that keep you in bondage, and so the truth is already true. Where is it true at? It's in the spirit, but it comes into the natural when you believe it, when you know it, which means you're settled.

SPEAKER_03 34:44

Okay, yeah, right.

SPEAKER_00 34:47

The only way to be transformed or changed, so you already got changed on the inside when you gave your life to Jesus, but how do you get what's on the inside on the outside? That's called mind renewal. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_03 35:03

I'm guessing this is something that you you teach in your school as well.

SPEAKER_00 35:06

Yeah, absolutely. It's this is the this and a few other things are the missing links right that people are teaching.

SPEAKER_03 35:14

So, you know, what it um, so I I just have to know, you know, to to have uh these schools, you know, you have to keep your your mind sharp, you know. Um I just want to know, like, what are some daily routines that you do to keep your your head in the game, you know, to keep your mind sharp. Do you wake straight up? Um just tell me a little bit about your daily routines if you don't mind.

SPEAKER_00 35:37

So here here's I'm gonna word it this way. Because it's not about all the things, you know, and we think that. We think like, okay, I wake up first thing in the morning, I pray, I pray in the spirit, I read the Bible, you know, I go drink my coffee, and I spend time with the Lord, and I, you know, and I do these, and those things are good, right? And I and I do those things, but the the thing that really matters the most is what are you doing internally? You know, mind renewal is not just reading the Bible all the time and confessing scripture and speaking the right things, those things can help absolutely, but it's not what you're doing, it's not what you're saying, it's what you believe. You know, I used to read it.

SPEAKER_03 36:23

Oh, go ahead, go ahead. Sorry.

SPEAKER_00 36:25

Oh, I'll I'll tell you. So, so what I I do is I well, there's a lot to it, but I don't want to get too too much into it because sometimes things are like just too much for people, like in a simple things, right? You know, like what do you mean you just lay hands on people and they'll get healed? I've what about when you shake people's hands? What are you about to do this? What are you about to do that? I've laid hands on people, I prayed, I begged, I fasted, I did all these things and never seen anything happen, you know? And it's like, yeah, but but there's something that's missing, you know, and and really what it is is what do we really believe? And so what what my focus is is being conscious of God and having my mind renewed, you know, and so it's more of like, how do I do that? Okay, so here's the deal, right? You have more than one mind. Like I said, the brain goes to the dirt, you go to heaven. The Bible says you have the mind of Christ. It doesn't say you have a mind like Christ, doesn't say you will get the mind of Christ, it says you have it, right? Second Corinthians, uh, first Corinthians chapter two, verse 16, for we have the mind of Christ. Okay, that's how you can be double-minded, right? Well, so remember I was saying that there's a lot of things that we do, and you know it seems right, and a lot of times it is right, but we're doing it from the wrong perspective. Well, what I tell people is this is you gotta learn to divide between the truth and the lie in your thought life. So many people are trying to get the thoughts to stop. That's not the solution. You know, and then they're trying to combat it all and all this, and I get it, and that can help. But the reality is that you're never gonna get uh the carnal mind to be quiet. Because it is just like the enemy, it's the same nature of the enemy, and it is not subject to the laws of God, neither indeed can it be. So the carnal mind is a voice in your head that sounds like you. It used to be you until you gave your life to Jesus. And if you don't understand that that's not you anymore, then your life will go in circles as a believer. You'll think you'll you'll mistake it for God, you'll mistake it for the devil sometimes, and I'm not saying the devil doesn't speak, but sometimes people think that it's the devil and it's actually carnality. The devil is not your biggest enemy, okay? You are all right, the flesh is that's your biggest enemy, you know. And so I I tell people you gotta divide in your thought life, you gotta learn to recognize the difference between the truth and the lie. And what happens is over time the lie has less and less of a voice in your life. So whenever I'm looking at a situation like we were talking about earlier financially, what's going on in my mind? The lie is there, right? But I don't believe it. I move forward. If my bank account isn't showing, I'm moving forward. I'm gonna do whatever I can, right? That's what I'm gonna do. Listen, if my you know, if my body feels sick, I have a choice. What do I believe? My experience or the word? What do I do? You know, when I go lay hands on someone for healing, you know what goes into my mind? The same thing that goes into your mind. What if it doesn't work? What if you look like a fool? What if this happens? What if that happens? And you know what? That voice is irrelevant unless you believe it is. And so that's a big part of my life, is you know, I I read the word, but I don't read the word to become. I read the word to realize what is already true concerning me. So much of the word of God is past tense, but we're praying for his promises. Isn't that crazy? If we're praying for his promises, is that faith or unbelief? That's unbelief. It's unbelief. You know, but the Bible says we have.