Black History Month (Part 1) - Where Are We

As we enter Black History Month we embark on a journey of discovery, discuss the state of black culture, the history behind the struggle and a vision for the future. Shean asks his Dads questions to compare the society he arrived in, compared to the environment he grew up in.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:23

Hello everybody and welcome to Yo Pops podcast with me, Sean Williams and my dad. And good morning. We'd like to wish everybody a happy Black History Month. Um it should be way more than a month, but we'll see. That's what I'm thinking.

SPEAKER_00 0:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 0:39

Um, we hope that you've had an amazing week so far. Also, please don't forget to like, subscribe, share um Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, Facebook. Dad, we're absolutely everywhere. Um, my dad's URL Bishop LA Williams, mine at Sean Williams World, at Yo Pop's Pody. How are you feeling, Mr. Morning Dad? I am wonderfully I'm feeling great.

SPEAKER_01 1:02

Yeah, I was you you look like you're feeling great.

SPEAKER_02 1:04

Yeah, yeah, mate. I quite enjoyed your Bible study online last night. You did? Well, there were some funny things that happened whilst there was also some very deep, insightful things being said. I'll tell you guys about it next time. Um, that, if possible, I really want to jump into some questions that I have. Um obviously, Black History Month. I've always known it to be a much bigger thing in America. Yes. Um, I think it started to kind of catch on here more so. Um, obviously, we have Notting Hill Carnival. Um, I know that different cities have different expressions to honour black history and black heritage. Um, but in terms of what I see now as a media push and drive, it has a much more prevalent place. Um it's quite a good question to ask. When you first came to England, was Black History Month a big thing or was it even a thing? Um I don't think it was even uh recognized. Okay. So then you can even see just in that kind of space of time how it's kind of developed.

SPEAKER_00 2:17

Yes, it has evolved.

SPEAKER_02 2:19

Yeah, that's a good word.

SPEAKER_00 2:20

It's definitely evolved. Thank you. Yes, it has indeed. Um, of course, I think a lot more could be done. Oh, for sure. Um and perhaps in our discussion, then I would highlight some of those that I think some of those things that I think could be implemented to make it more um acceptable, more realistic, and uh more important, um, plays a more um vital role in the lives of individuals and communities. Okay. Are you talking about um black individuals and black communities or are you talking about yeah, yeah, yeah, both, because if if you impact the the black individual and the community, it's gonna enrich the com the general community anyhow? That's very true.

SPEAKER_02 3:18

Very true. Um, all right, and dad, on that basis, let's jump into it. Um first question: what do you think um Black History Month would look like, or even Black History? Forget Black History Month. What do you think Black history would look like if it was truly integrated into our everyday society and culture?

SPEAKER_00 3:42

I think it would be really powerful. Okay. Um, and as uh mentioned earlier on, I think it would greatly enrich um individuals as well as um the community per se, and which I think would lead to a richer and greater cultural um collaboration, um, where everyone would feel that they have their input in a meaningful way rather than just sporadic representation or sporadic, you know, mention or involvement, yeah, which can leave some feeling like, you know, disconnected, yeah, really.

SPEAKER_01 4:29

Dad, can I ask you a question?

SPEAKER_02 4:32

Um the shadow prime minister Kemi Badenot made a statement based on the fatwa that Rob Jennerick had created. Had you heard about what Mr. Jennerick had done?

SPEAKER_00 4:49

No.

SPEAKER_02 4:50

So there was a focus group that he, I believe, was speaking to in Birmingham. He'd gone to some form of kind of meeting or whatnot. Um, and when the visual cameras had turned off, he kept talking.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Right.

SPEAKER_02 5:05

Yeah. Um and potentially didn't realize that he was still being recorded. And the statement that he made was that he was shocked that whilst walking down the road of this particular constituency area, that he didn't see another white face. Right. And obviously, as as media does, it was picked up, it was put to him, he was very combative in terms of his stance. Um, now, me looking at it objectively and personally, I don't think if the current climate politically, especially where ethnicity and race is concerned, if it wasn't at the temperature it was now, that I think his climb down is way quicker and far faster. Um, but I do think that there is a certain level of emboldenment in certain political places that allow people to maybe feel freer to say what they think that they didn't maybe think it would be politically correct or justifiable to say, let's say even maybe five years ago. And Kemi Badenot came out and defended him, and she said, which is the question I want to ask, that she doesn't want Britain to be multicultural, but she wants it to be multiracial. To which me personally, I don't see the division, Dad, because you can't have a multiracial society and then not absorb those cultural differences. Right. And I say that on the basis of that even from your birth home when colonial powers went in there, they did not go in there to become or to make Jamaica multi-creational. Right. They bought certain protocols and standards and said this is how it's going to be.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:17

So that kind of it frazzled my brain because I was just like, okay, it sounds good, but to anybody that has half a brain to go, well, they're one and the same. So I wanted to ask someone that was a little bit older than me, a little bit more wisdom, a little more wisdom, a lot more wisdom. A little bit. Oh.

SPEAKER_00 7:33

Yeah, I'm glad you correct yourself.

SPEAKER_02 7:35

Yeah, but I'm glad to see what's really in your heart. Dad, do you believe that you can be multiracial and not multicultural?

SPEAKER_00 7:47

Yeah, I think given who it's coming from, is clearly um feeding into a certain narrative. Oh, 100%. And highly political. Uh, I believe that given the extent of her intelligence, I really don't think that's coming from the heart. Right. I think it is, as I said, at the top of the head to appease the environment in which she is functioning presently. Um, because clearly the the beauty about multiculturalism is that it acknowledges and recognize everyone's input and everyone's ability to impact society, no matter who it is, no matter what race, creed or color, you know, we are we are we are connected um in so many ways. And I think that enriches people more than just a culture. As you take, for example, cricket. I mean, cricket is predominantly a European um, in fact, English, you know, but yet it is being played globally, you know, and impacting people at incredible um levels. And so who would deny that that is just about race? Rather than see it as a culture that everyone can um aspire to. And it was introduced to the colonies, if one would call it that, um, and was adapted. And what did it do? It enriches um the culture, yeah, you know what I mean, rather than stinks, hey, I tell you what, only certain people can play uh cricket. It doesn't um ring ring true. So I think that's really a bit of a cup out, if you ask me.

SPEAKER_02 9:56

No, I hear it. I love when you say that. That what does representation really mean? And is visibility enough to create lasting change?

SPEAKER_00 10:07

I think again, representation um it's it's something that are being tried. And so, but it I think it leans more to visibility rather than having it as as actual integration within society.

SPEAKER_01 10:30

What do you mean?

SPEAKER_00 10:31

So, for example, you may give a token, a bit like Black History Month, you know what I mean? Why one month out of 12? So that for me is a basic representation to project a certain visibility that, okay, we are doing something to acknowledge a difference. But real integration would mean it's every month. Uh uh once once per week in every month. Yeah. You know what I mean? And you you then push it further rather than just in some things like like football, like um certain musical uh display, it would be part of everyday curriculum. It would be part of the educational system, it would be, you know, it would be integrated in all of these things.

SPEAKER_02 11:26

It's so funny you say that because as you know that I after I did my A-levels, I got signed and I moved to America. Now, up until that point, I had done 18 years of schooling.

SPEAKER_00 11:47

Right.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

When I got to the part of my education where I was allowed to choose what I did completely, because with your GCSEs, they gave you certain options, so there was the fundamental subjects you had to do maths, science, English, um, and then you can kind of pick the other ones that you want to do between humanities or physical education or um like the technical kind of things, like IT or business studies were starting to come in at that point, Dad. At no point through history, in turn in terms of teaching history, right? I think the only person I had briefly been introduced to was Martin Luther King. Right. Briefly, and that's only because he got assassinated in the way that he did and what his output was to the world, right? Yeah. Dad, it wasn't until I left mandatory schooling and went into what we call at that point it was six-form education. I'm not sure what it is for the kids now. I think it's like A1 and A2 levels. When I took history, the teacher I had, Mr. Kinlock, heaven rest his soul. He he made black history a part of the curriculum. Right. And he absolutely, dad, to say that he reprimanded me would be an understatement. Mr. Kinlock took me to town because he, at the time I didn't realise it, he saw that I was given an opportunity that I wasn't maximizing. And looking back now, I understand that his frustration with me was almost like you don't know what I had to go through to just be able to sit here, put this information on that board so that you hopefully will take it in and learn something. Dad, for as um what's the word I'm looking for? For as important as the curriculum is, right, somebody, very important somewhere, decided that that part of history was not either relevant, yeah, important, or they were just like, they don't need to know about it. And then you look at some of what we see now, and you you well, I asked myself, Dad, is it the plan of people in places of absolute influence and power to almost funnel information and education to a place where people are going to learn what they want so that when we have these massive marches and we see people coming from situations of um economic inadequacy, right? So they don't have money or they're struggling and whatnot, and then they lean into what I call these toxic colonial views. Right. That, and obviously at any point, you know, be like, well, I'm not sure here, because I wish I want us to debate this. Dad, I can't judge a person that is acting based off of a lack of information. I mean, I can judge you, but I'm not gonna deal with you as harshly as I would a person that knew, right? So when we were younger, you'd be like, I don't mind what you do, just never lie to you. Do you remember? Because you were just like, at the point of you lying to me, this now turns into a proper affair where it is punishable. You were like, There is nothing that I won't seek to understand, even if I've got to discipline you, but I won't do it from a place of being angry because you gave me all of the information. Yeah, dad. I look at so many of these people, right, that are joining themselves to political ideologies and parties and movements, and they have only the information those with more information are choosing to give them.

SPEAKER_00 15:56

Right. Yeah, I think one of the interesting things when we talk about um representation is the is the fact that again it is it has what for me a political spin um that's going on. You know, in other words, people are not ignorant of the truth, both historical and other and other means. Otherwise, you could never go to say some somewhere like AI and ask about black history, and it will give you reams of information, of people. It's there in the library somewhere, but it's who and how a person chooses to present it. Like the like the the uh minister you make mentioned of, right, if he thought the camera was still on, he would have never exactly expressed what is really in his heart. Uh now it came out because he was unaware that um the camera was on, yeah, and those around him he felt were in his corner with a certain level of um would have would have certainly appreciated his viewpoint. So he did that, and I think is what you're looking at. Now, at an early stage, being in Cambridge, is one of the things that I've always advocated that a city like this that has so much people from all aspects of um black culture, etc., should have somewhere that they can identify with. Not only a community center where people can come to feel a sense of belonging, feel connected to, I mean, away from home. So it's like a home-to-home situation. But most important to me was to create a library.

unknown 18:05

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 18:06

It was one of the things I advocate, and you may remember Mill Road Library. Now, I wanted that building because I felt that alongside community development and activities, it was important to have history for the younger generation that was coming up to know that we are not just hangers-on, but we have a major contribution to world history, from wars to um to the continent, which, of course, everyone knows plays such a crucial role in world development, um, in every sense of the word. And so we felt that if people were aware of it, um you could even excuse um the horribleness of slavery. You know, you could even excuse that as a as a as a drop in the proverbial ocean, because that not that doesn't become the only thing that defines us, it's which is where I think the problem is today, in that most situations seems to be apologizing for that. So therefore you have very limited representation, and that is where I think um it leaves one feeling disillusioned.

SPEAKER_02 19:37

Can I present you with uh an idea? The idea I want to present you with. Right. If I if I present you a picture and I cover 95% of the picture, am I showing you the whole picture? No. For a long time I believed that the obsession and the over exposure of slavery and what happened during that period is the part of our history that we have been encouraged and funneled to overinvest in. Because what it leans into, and especially because of our especially where we are, dad, in in human development. The scary part is with all the technological advancement, we are becoming more visual than we ever have been. Indeed. Which means we are becoming desensitized to far more powerful parts of our creative dimension than we would have. So if all I see is degradation, oppression, never having enough, never being recognized, never being validated, then the whole basis and anchoring of my existence comes from the worst part of me. Indeed. Which is why Nicholas Kinlock will always be a catalyst of uh of how do I put it, of more dad in my life. Because in my coursework, he was annoyed that the only person I wrote about was Martin Luther King. And Daddy, when I say this man cussed me, he was just like, So you're telling me Martin Luther King is the only person that did anything for black people. And I was like, he goes, and this book on Martin Luther King is the only book. Daddy starts going to tell me about Marcus Garvey and W.B. Dubois and Malcolm X and Black Wall Street and Harry at Talk and I was like, I forgot I had courtwork.

SPEAKER_01 21:54

The book worked.

SPEAKER_02 21:56

Dad, he didn't want to hear it because as far as he was concerned, And he and he this was one of the most powerful things he said to me. He said, He said, Mr. Williams, he says, I know you're invested in this version of yourself where you think you're gonna go off and be this thing in this space. And no lie, that he picked up the book and he threw it down on the desk and he said, Did you ever consider this might be in your destiny? That it was the first time, right, that I'd ever sat there and I said, What am I beyond my talent?

SPEAKER_00 22:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:30

Do you understand what I'm saying, Dad?

SPEAKER_00 22:32

Indeed.

SPEAKER_02 22:33

And the what it broke my thinking out of this box. You've never ever encouraged any of your sons to think in a narrow-minded way because you've you've traveled and you've always wanted to expose us to the different elements of what the world is and getting a great understanding of it. Dad, that was the first time that someone outside of potentially you had ever gone to me and said, You're walking this like it's a tightrope. And it's not. Yeah. There is so much more open road for you to. And Dad, I sometimes think that some of our thinking as a people is rooted in so much trauma that we never look beyond what we couldn't become.

SPEAKER_00 23:29

Right.

SPEAKER_02 23:31

Which almost stunts where we can get to. I remember when the George Floyd situation happened, and Lucas and I was on the phone, and I said, Lucas, I'm not gonna talk to anybody. Like, just give me three days. And then I shut down my phone, and I remember after three days, I basically put this manifesto together. I was like, well, if slavery was 400 years, then the least I've got to do is create a 400-year plan. Because I've got to cover the time that it took to get us to where we were, right? Yeah. And then I built this manifesto called Project My Braining, which was the four principles upon which we should we can grow and become as a people, which was God, family, finance, education. Dad Wall Street is a massive financial power. Not only just in America, but to the world. Dad. I couldn't believe there was a black Wall Street. And the crazy thing is, some of this and some of the new information I found came from some of the inflammatory things that Charlie Kirk fella was saying. Yeah. And the thing that got me more so was it's like, Sean, how has this man, who is not necessarily promoting uh positive welfare within the black community, he has more knowledge about your history, and he's wielding it. Yeah. And I'm sitting here, Dad, and I look at some of my peers, and we're so obsessed with validation and houses and holidays and cars and women that we can't lead, conversate with, or build, and we're missing the whole point of some of the what's the word I'm looking for? The brilliance that God has put within us. So that whole 10-minute sermon I just gave you is for this question, right? Do you think that our inability to be shown more than the struggle we went through is stunting our growth as a people?

SPEAKER_00 25:54

No, I think I think um you have a few people that has um take it upon themselves.

SPEAKER_02 26:05

It's like heaven just decided to shine. There you go.

SPEAKER_00 26:08

There you go. I think it's a sermon you preach. I mean, yeah, I think a few people take it upon themselves to impact the world in um in a way to give leverage to who they consider themselves to be. You know what I mean? Um let's take, for instance, one of the great one of the great um emperor of history, um the Greek Alexander the Great.

SPEAKER_02 26:42

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 26:43

Okay. Now, this one, this man, within a few years, conquered the then known world. Yeah. That's me. Yeah. One man. So you put a few of that same spirit of Alexander the Great together and decide, okay, well, we are going to give whether it's our particular race, our particular culture, a particular um geographic location, we're gonna give that, give them the power and the leverage that they will never ever feel a sense of inferiority in any way, shape, or form. And they went about it. It does not, a lot of things does not reflect the majority of people on the earth. And this is one of the things that I really believe that the lack of proper representation, you know what I mean, mislead people thinking that this is a whole, you know, this is the whole no, right? You think in terms of even the word white, when did it come about? Before in the 18, whatever, people did not even mention that word. Because the world didn't see themselves as black and white. You see what I mean? The world understood where we come from, how we evolved, and how important we were to each other because of true historical information. Whether it is being Ethiopia that's never been colonized or conquered, um, Rome, and the list goes on.

SPEAKER_02 28:27

Um so Dad, just to back up your point, we see it now. There are five companies in a in a global market where there are probably in this country, Dad, how would you how many businesses or companies would you estimate that we have in this country, roughly?

SPEAKER_00 28:45

Rather, it runs into thousands, I would say. But in terms of real influence, perhaps of about 10. Right.

SPEAKER_02 28:55

So, and I say that to say this. If that is in a territory as small as England, and England can can fit into the state of Florida that I think it's some nearly 25 plus times, right? Then if you add all of the amounts of Benzes that we have on the globe, the number becomes innumerable. If you look at the handful of companies that are controlling everything, exactly. Exactly. And that's why I said what I want to say lends itself into your point because it is the pyramid upon which a couple at the top go, well, it'll be this, this, this, and this. Yeah. Dad, when President Trump came here for his state deal the other day, he came with five business like supremo business techs. And if you're smart, you'd sit there and go, I tell you what, if they're rolling around with him and getting invited to royal dinners, I might want to invest in those companies because you've you've got a seat next to power. Indeed. Which means that power is access. If you have access, you have influence because you can get your agenda over. So, Dad, why has it been the why has it been the agenda and the um the desire of a few to eradicate such important information to a group of people whose imprint on the world, in my opinion, cannot be measured.

SPEAKER_00 30:29

Yeah, it can't. And it's a very, very good question. And it it it may seem even simplistic, but the word that comes to mind is fear. You see. Now, when you become fearful of something that you are of the opinion you can't control, then you can devise mechanism. Is that to control that? You know, it isn't now. Why did say a lot of the European countries conquered what they call conquer so many countries? Because of one thing called the gun.

unknown 31:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:09

Now, so when you see a person in, you know, you got to look at bow and arrow, whatever it is, and suddenly a guy.

SPEAKER_01 31:18

You caught an automatic thing. It's like smoke comes out. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 31:23

And you can't even look at the person is dead. You know, whether it's the lion or the elephant or the person who feels that he, you know, he has a point to make. So fear drives that narrative. And in like manner, a different culture comes into power, a different time in history, yes, but they never last forever. And it's almost like they get a turn. Well, this is it. And it is during this, is it is that realization that look, whether you whether you are the Roman Empire, you're going to crash. Whether you're the Grecian Empire, you're going to crash. Whether you are the Babylonian or whatever it is. So what we have is when the colonial um uh countries decided we are going to now do what we did to keep our culture, our culture, our people alive. You know what I mean? They went out and they became little, little empires. Yeah. But they know it's not going to last. So it's what you do to keep on top and give you as much leverage as you want. Take America. You see, what people don't quite get, even with America, is that it's an empire that is dying fast, you know, on his feet. It's in a it's almost in a coma. Yeah. So what some of the things you see going on is because they can feel the death, the death, this thing of death coming on.

SPEAKER_02 33:12

It's like a person that's terminal. They go two ways, don't they? Exactly. You get the person that makes peace with, okay, this is where it's going. And then you get the other person that's like, oh, oh no, no, no, no. I'm gonna fight this. Indeed.

SPEAKER_00 33:25

Indeed. So so the fear of losing that power is what's causing some of the crazy stuff that's going on around the world. It's no different in terms of um the both the race and the culture. It's the rain. Um, how do you keep that? Now you have a race uh of people, first and foremost, that has 90% of the world's resources and doesn't own it. Well, I mean, they own it, but but by by by means for what I can't wear your suit, right, and then tell you when I'm going to return your suit, or basically you want to wear your suit, but I'm telling you where you can wear your suit.

SPEAKER_02 34:18

Indeed. And you have to come to me with an application form to say, Hi son. And I'm like, hey dad. Yeah so you know my suit. Yeah, I know your suit, dad. I want to wear it. That's nice. Where do you want to wear it to, Dad? Now, firstly, that's problematic to me. Because I bought that suit. Right. I work so I can buy that suit. And because of the situation we find ourselves in, I'm coming to you. Because if I don't come to you in this way, you're going to force me to walk naked. Right. Right. Dad. In the fundamental foundations, that is unjust.

SPEAKER_00 35:04

Indeed.

SPEAKER_02 35:04

And unrighteous.

SPEAKER_00 35:06

Indeed. Yeah. But when people do these things, they are not thinking in terms of morality. You know what I mean? And that is what is lacking. That's deep, that's deep. Yeah. In in the world's uh up.

SPEAKER_02 35:20

They have totally absconded from the intention through which God wanted us to live. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 35:24

And ignorance. You know what I mean? And that is where I think um one needs to, when, when, when their narrative is adjusted, it must not be in favor of one race above another. And therefore, we all have contribution to make to the to the good of all mankind. So what and he goes back, and let me pull up the George thing, the George Freud um scenario. The people both in history, as well as what happened recently, that brought about significant change was not, say, um, mainly black people who did it. It was um Europeans. Why advocates absolutely, who looked at and said, no, this, yeah, said, look, this is this is not right. And why the charge thing was so impacting, because the generation that experienced it said hello. They said absolutely no. That this is what was going on, and we're gonna fix it. Yeah, isn't it? Because I've been to school with my black brother, I've been to school with my black sister, and you know, this narrative is not what we see. We hug each other, we we play together.

SPEAKER_02 37:00

They haven't yet been overly infected by the toxic structure of what I call class and privilege.

SPEAKER_00 37:09

Indeed. And more access. They have more access to information. You see what I mean? And this is this is where the difference is. So I am very optimistic, and that's one of the things that true and real representation, if it is put in the in the place and the area that it should, it would bring about incredible, wonderful change. And I am I'm convinced that the generation that we are now in, the millennials. I know it's the Gen Z Q R elemental. But I I think that they have the the greater perspective on things. Fearlessness. And and and those up the up the top which trying to hold on to this kind of narrative, I think it's a losing, it's a losing game. Dad, thank you so much.

SPEAKER_02 38:04

We will continue part two with you next week. We hope that you've enjoyed um this episode today. Any questions that you have, please ask away. Also, you can subscribe and share, and also donate and support what we're trying to do. The links will be along the bottom, and they're also in the bio. Um, if you like what we're doing and you appreciate how we do it, then feel free to support. Don't forget my father's URL at Bishop LA Williams, um, mine at Sean Williams World. So from me, take it easy, guys. From my dad, peace. Hi, guys.