Go Pluck Yourself: The Actor’s Pursuit
Go Pluck Yourself! Because the Hollywood cavalry is not on its way to pluck you from obscurity like the proverbial claws of a claw machine. Only you are responsible for your little dent in this industry. No one is coming to pluck you out of the crowd — You have to pluck yourself.
Join actor Chris Gun as he chats to his creative pals about life as an actor navigating this wonderful industry.
These are the conversations that actors and filmmakers have between takes, between shoot dates, whilst waiting for their next gig. An insight into what life is really like for a creative on their way “up”.
This is Go Pluck Yourself - The Actor’s Pursuit
Presented by Chris Gun
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Go Pluck Yourself: The Actor’s Pursuit
Ep 5: Building an Acting Career on Your Own Terms with Lauren Koopowitz
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▶️ Watch on YouTube: youtube.com/@gopluckyourselfpod
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Check out her IMDb: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm6664826/
This week I’m joined by the phenomenal Lauren Koopowitz. One of the most versatile and exciting actors I know.
Lauren's path into acting has been anything but traditional. From psych training gigs to music videos, voiceover work, short films AND feature films, Lauren has built an acting career on pure talent, curiosity, and soaking up whatever she can learn from every opportunity..
We talk about carving your own pathway into the industry, pushing through imposter syndrome, and finding your flow as an actor. Lauren’s story is proof that there’s no single “right” way into this craft, only the path you make for yourself.
If you’re an actor chasing inspiration and looking for permission to back yourself, this conversation is a masterclass in creating your own opportunities.
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Thanks for listening. Let me know what you think.
🎵 Theme music by Nick Gun: soundcloud.com/nickgun
My name is Lauren Koopwitz and this is Chris Gunn, and you should go pluck yourself.
Speaker 2:Hello, welcome to Go Pluck Yourself the Actor's Pursuit. My name is Chris Gunn. Welcome back to the show. Thank you so much for being here. I'm sorry that I had to take a week off last week. As you can hear, I'm clearly still recovering from that damn flu, but also I've spent the last 12 days cruising around New Zealand in a camper van with my amazing girlfriend. So there was no episode last week, but it was totally worth it because we had the best time and we did some skiing. We had the best time and we did some skiing and we climbed a couple of mountains and we just enjoyed the amazing scenery of the South Island. It was O for awesome. But I'm back and I'm so excited to share this episode with you this week.
Speaker 2:This week's guest is an absolute gem in this industry. She's one of the most talented, versatile and committed actors that I know. An actor that cares so deeply about this industry and her fellow actor and is so in touch with her craft Guys it's the phenomenal. Lauren Kuperwitz, if you're an actor that's feeling insecure about your pathway into this industry maybe you're new to this game or you don't know where to start. You are going to get so much out of this episode. What I love about this chat is that Lauren and I are both actors that forged our own pathways. We both kind of wedged ourselves into the acting world in our own ways, not to say that we cut corners or anything. We both worked our asses off to find opportunities and create opportunities to learn and grow and connect with other actors and filmmakers. But more than that, it seems that we both fell into this industry in similar ways, by embracing whatever passions and interests popped up throughout our lives and following them with curiosity. Neither of us took the traditional road and I think that shows in our open-minded approaches.
Speaker 2:I'm a huge fan of Laurence and if you haven't heard of her, it's an honour to introduce her to you. I strongly encourage that you go and check out some of her work. Go give her a follow on Instagram at Lauren underscore Coop, that's K-O-O-P. I'll put some links to some of her work, if I can find it, and to her socials and everything in the description below. Please give her a follow, check her out. All right, I won't go on because it's a longer episode, but honestly, there wasn't anything that I could cut out of it because it was all gold. So get your pens ready, get ready to take some notes and let me know what sticks. I'd love to hear from you guys. So make sure you leave a comment if you're watching on YouTube, or comment on one of the Instagram Reels, or leave a positive review if you're listening on Apple Podcasts. All right, please enjoy my very insightful chat with the wonderful Lauren Kuperwitz.
Speaker 4:Thanks for coming.
Speaker 1:Oh, my God. No, thank you so much for having me. It's so lovely that you're doing this, oh.
Speaker 4:I'm doing it for me. What do you mean?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, no no, I'm loving this.
Speaker 3:I'm doing it for me. What do you mean?
Speaker 4:No, no, no, I'm loving this. I get to see all my friends.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I don't know why I didn't do this sooner.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally. I mean you get to just like chat with people you would actually chat with, just for fun, yeah, but then it becomes a little piece of something.
Speaker 4:I know and we can share it with the world, because people want to hear from us, right. They want to hear me ramble and you ramble. Yeah, he doesn't want to hear. I love a good ramble. Yeah, how's your day been?
Speaker 1:Oh my God, you know it started off so beautifully. I went for a lovely little boulder I loved a boulder.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was very fun.
Speaker 1:Yes, and I was very, very happy. Yeah, it was really nice. What about your day?
Speaker 4:My day, I cleaned a house. Yeah yeah, nice. And then I came and set this up, made sure everything was good to go. Love that, because I've been a bit unorganized.
Speaker 1:It's hard to be organized when it's just you.
Speaker 4:There's a lot to think about.
Speaker 1:There's so much to think about, and particularly when because, like you, I also work multiple jobs, because you know how it is when you're working multiple jobs and you're organizing things that you are running yourself and you are the person driving it. It's hard. It's hard to be like on top of everything all the time. I think with most people, so long as they're on top of things like 80% of the time, people think that you're on top of it 100% of the time. It's all about perception. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:So you just need to have like on average. I mean, I'm pretty, I'm very on top of it, yeah, but I just like I've got to calm myself down and be like it's fine, you've done it. Yeah, you've checked all the boxes. It's all good and we're here. We're here, everything's working, and people have been so giving and excited to come along and hang out with me in my little room, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's a nice little room. Thanks, it's lovely.
Speaker 4:It looks like a boy's bedroom hey.
Speaker 1:It does. But a boy who also like has some taste.
Speaker 4:Well, this is kind of what my. You know what I mean. Oh, thanks, man.
Speaker 1:It's very mask, but in a nice way, you know.
Speaker 4:That's me Mask in a nice way. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, my studio sums me up yeah, he's masked, but he's nice, but he's nice you know you've got taste.
Speaker 1:I see the little, you know, the little bulb there for some mood lighting. You've got plants.
Speaker 4:Some Ikea business going on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know it's proof that you consider things.
Speaker 4:Propagation.
Speaker 1:Yes, you can keep things alive, you're reliable.
Speaker 4:Oh well, no, that's my girlfriend's work. I did have other plants in here. I stole that from the kitchen. But I did have other plants in here and they died.
Speaker 1:Do you know what? I've had two long-running plants. Every other plant I've had has died.
Speaker 4:So I'm with you. Do you know that you can take dead plants back to Bunnings and get a full refund?
Speaker 1:They could pay my rent with all the plants I've killed, yeah, or, like I don't know, maybe exchange, I don't know.
Speaker 4:But either way, you don't have to water them, I guess. Oh look, I'm not going to water them, I'm just going to take them back.
Speaker 1:That's so mean Just buy a plant to kill it and get it replaced.
Speaker 4:I don't know about the morals of that, yeah, but anyway, I wish I knew that, because I mean, here's a pot of dirt, there was a plant in here. Can I have my money back?
Speaker 1:That's the wildest hustle. Just bring a receipt and a pot with dirt in it. Yeah, you could scam. I know you thought of it. There's a loophole, there's a loophole, yeah.
Speaker 3:Genius yeah, genius yeah.
Speaker 1:Is this what you brought me in here to talk about?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah To talk about cooling down cameras and how to scam bunnings.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, no, this is good, I love it. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:Why did I bring you in here? Look great question. I know why? Because you're a great Adelaide actor. Oh, and we keep bumping into each other, I know yeah. Which means it's all working.
Speaker 1:Yes, and it means hopefully we'll keep on bumping into each other. It's really cool, actually, because for so long I feel like we've seen each other around and then we did that read together a table read, and that was really really wonderful. And then it was kind of the first time we actually got to work together was just like a couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 4:Yeah, on a little shoot, on a stills shoot, yeah, which was really fun yeah.
Speaker 1:So we actually still haven't properly acted in a scene together.
Speaker 4:I know, but we will, yeah, I'm sure we will, it'll happen, yeah, yeah. I think, so that was really fun. It was Out in Kaipo Forest.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, you actually you were brilliant in that. It was so interesting because we only it was just stills and I feel like you only had a few moments to like make, to convey all of the emotion of the scene that the still was trying to convey, and you did such a great job.
Speaker 4:So did you? You just like they just say all right, it's your turn, lauren, and you just like tears.
Speaker 1:Oh, I feel that about you. I think that that's actually one of my. I think one of my superpowers as an actor is I'm really unhinged as a human being, so I often have a lot of emotions that I can access.
Speaker 4:Right, okay, that's interesting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so I think that that's a skill set of mine.
Speaker 4:They're just all bubbling away at the surface all the time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that one of learning curves for me was to learn how to embrace stillness more, because I could always access the feelings and the things and sometimes it was learning to just sit in it and like be in it, and you don't have to, you can just be there in it and that's actually really compelling to watch. You don't have to do loads.
Speaker 4:I wonder why. That is why stillness is so powerful. I mean obviously there's sort of the technical elements to that, in which you know where you're, like you know, jumping around a frame and distracting the audience with all your movements and stuff. But also just kind of containing that energy, yeah, instead of like exerting it through your body and all this movement just containing that into something internal.
Speaker 1:I think we love to watch people. You know, it's like the most fascinating thing to people often is other people.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So then, when you can actually have a person just exist and feel something that's relatable and, yeah, you don't have to do a lot. I think people are just kind of fascinated by watching the inner tics of a person existing.
Speaker 4:Yeah, for sure. And also you don't want to be giving too much away as well because you want it to be up to the audience to decide what they're feeling and what you're feeling, I guess, it's interesting, it's like that.
Speaker 1:You know, there was this study that they did. Where they took it was a psychology study, where they had a person's face, a person's image, and they would just superimpose it with different music underneath and they'd have different people. Yeah, they'd have different, and it would be exactly the same facial expression. Yeah, interesting and they'd have people read what they think the emotion is and the answers were entirely, entirely swayed by the music.
Speaker 4:It's context, isn't it? Yeah, the context of it, so it's interesting. I was talking about this with Nick Launchby in the first episode.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, context, and I kind of realised with this whole like doing nothing thing, that something that really set me free from trying to control the emotions or trying to control the scene too much is just relying on the fact that there is context built around this moment, that we're, that we're shooting right now like this one shot, yeah, like I could be showing nothing and just you know, just maintaining that stillness and internalizing everything and trusting that they're going to cut to another shot which is going to answer all the questions, or the audience is already going to know what's happened up until that point yeah so they can already put the pieces together.
Speaker 4:So in in the moment I'm not worrying about I need to tell all of this story in this one one shot one, look, you know. So yeah, context is so. It's so reassuring, you know, to know that it's going to free me up to just exist in that moment.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think that was a big learning curve for me too, I think when I was a baby actor. You know you want to like show everything.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But the audience isn't dumb. Like they, and also like you trust in the directors and the editors and things like they they will write it to be the story that they want it to be.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it might all change. Yeah, in the edit. Yeah, well, in the edit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, you know, there's the whole thing that a story is written three times once when it's being written, once when you're shooting and once in the edit.
Speaker 4:Yeah, absolutely, and we have no control over that, I know, and nor should we.
Speaker 1:Yeah. How do you feel about that? Does it make you nervous? Does it make you excited? Not at all.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it takes all the pressure off. Yeah is going. I couldn't possibly try to get this right, because there is no right, because it's all going to change. It might all change, but I'm going to trust the director and trust the writing and trust that they're going to communicate with me all the different options that they need so that they can change it if they need to. So that's why we're doing all these takes, and so when they come at me with direction, instead of being like, well, am I not doing it right?
Speaker 4:I'm going yeah, cool, we'll finish that version. Let's try this other angle.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:You know, and that frees me up, yeah.
Speaker 1:I love that Takes the pressure off. Exactly which is out of my control and we'll just you know.
Speaker 4:Hell yeah.
Speaker 1:See the vibe.
Speaker 4:So did you study?
Speaker 1:No, I didn't, I didn't. Well, I did, but not in the traditional like three year drama course or anything. Yeah, I've sort of I did weekly courses for a long time. Ah okay yeah, when I was a teenager.
Speaker 4:Where is?
Speaker 1:that At Essay Casting. Okay, and I did that for quite a few years every week, religiously. I've always loved to perform. Yep, I adore it. Terrible, terrible stage fright.
Speaker 4:Really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, terrible stage fright.
Speaker 3:And.
Speaker 1:I remember I used to, before every single class, there was like a staircase of you know stairs to go up. You could take the elevator or the stairs. I'd have to take the stairs to just calm myself down every time walking into my class because I was so nervous.
Speaker 4:Get rid of some of the energy and exert yourself. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:I think, I'm a very naturally anxious person who's drawn to things that provoke my anxiety. Bouldering is an example of that. I went bouldering this morning yeah like I said, um, and that scares the shit out of me, but I do it all the time.
Speaker 4:Yeah, because everyone's everyone's watching you. Yeah, it's actually not stage five.
Speaker 1:It's more fear of heights okay, yeah so I tend to have a personality type that, like I think, I like to torch myself a little bit okay, you know, yeah, well, it's working for you yeah, well, you know, I gotta do some things that I really enjoy yeah. To answer your question. No, I did not study a traditional three-year course. I did a bunch of classes and I fucking loved acting.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I was like, wow, this is amazing. And then I went off to uni and did something else and I was like I didn't really know or see it as a possibility.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so how old were you when you went to uni?
Speaker 1:I went straight out of school, so I was like 18.
Speaker 4:So you were doing acting classes at the end of high school? Yeah, so from when I was like 14.
Speaker 1:Up until I was you know what, up until I was maybe 20, I was doing these classes but not thinking it was a viable career. It's funny too, because I was actually also technically acting, working in acting, but I guess I didn't. Really I didn't really see it as that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I worked as a standardized patient for a long time, yeah, but specifically with psychiatry. So I did it in psychiatry and in pediatric psychiatry. So I would take on these cases where I would be patients going off and I would be the patient in a crisis.
Speaker 4:So this is simulated medical scenarios? Yeah, like training for yes for medical professionals.
Speaker 1:So, for example, sometimes it would be like I would be a young girl with body dysmorphing disorder who thought she needed a nose job, but it was so drastic that she couldn't leave the house. She was not functioning as a person. There were times where I was playing characters that were going through psychotic episodes, were times I played characters that were it was de-escalation scenario. So I would be, you know, maybe a a patient that had bipolar mood disorder and was essentially having just completely overstimulated and having a bit of a meltdown, like not knowing how to handle things but throwing tables around a room and things. And then the doctors yeah, or often it would be we worked with nurses, doctors, students.
Speaker 1:Sometimes it would be like, for example, I worked a lot with psychiatrists that were from overseas and needed to requalify in Australia, and then it's like either it would be a test so they'd be monitored and they'd see how they deal with the situation or it would be training for them to learn to get comfortable with, say, breaking bad news to a patient or dealing with difficult history taking, and I loved it, but I didn't value it, or rather, I just thought it was something that I loved, and I didn't think of myself as a professional by any means, I just knew that I loved acting.
Speaker 4:Did you realise that you were acting?
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely Like I saw it as an acting job, but this was at the same time that I was. I did that throughout high school and then I did it when I was at uni and I was working an office job and it was just something that I got to do every now and again and I loved. But, I didn't think that it was possible for me to ever work in acting. I didn't really think there was a space for me in the industry.
Speaker 4:So when did you like get an agent?
Speaker 1:So well, I was actually with my agent for a long time. So when I was doing classes at Essay Casting, I was with them, with Ann Peters, but I didn't really work a whole lot, so I didn't. I just I did bits and pieces.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like I did some double work on a feature film, I did quite a bit of extra work and featured extra work I did. It wasn't really until my early twenties when I started hunting for work myself.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That I was like oh, I can actually work in this, so I started, I got up a Star Now profile. Yeah, nice.
Speaker 1:And I did a bunch of music videos and then I got contacts from those music videos and I made friends with the people because they're all lovely, awesome humans, and then some of them wanted me to work on their shorts. Or I got auditions for shorts and then I did a bunch of shorts, which is like the best way to. It's such a good way to hone your craft. Yeah, it is so good because you get roles you would never, ever get, or rather, it's far less likely that you're going to get such complex or like screen time, heavy or interesting roles, often in a bigger production.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:So you just get a chance to really like play. It's lower stakes, yeah yeah, you get bigger roles in a sense, you know, and I just did like a bunch of them and then I started booking more, booking bigger jobs through my agency and through my own contacts.
Speaker 4:I love that. I love that whole journey, because I was talking to Poppy me. I love. Poppy, she's great.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I didn't talk much. She had questions for me. I love Poppy, she's great. Yeah, I didn't talk much. She had questions for me. Yeah, but she was curious about this concept of like because she studied in a lot of you know this kind of you know, there's two parties here. There's people that went to uni and the people that, like, somehow did it without it, yeah. Even though we both found ways to study.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 4:But she kind of was talking about this concept of like asking for permission and she was curious, like how did you find the whatever it is in yourself to just do it, without waiting to be told you can do it? Yeah?
Speaker 1:it's scary. How did you?
Speaker 4:Well, I feel like you and I have a similar story?
Speaker 1:I think so too.
Speaker 4:Because I was doing classes. You know at Actors Inc. Yeah, when I was doing classes. You know at Actors Inc. Yeah, when.
Speaker 1:I was 13.
Speaker 4:Yeah, up until I don't know, 16 maybe, but I was always like performing, like I was doing clowning with my dad when I was a kid. Oh, that's cool you know riding unicycles in the pageant Really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:That's sick and like we would. There was a movie. There was a Johnny Depp film called Benny and June. Have you seen that? No, well, he plays this character who's like obsessed with Buster Keaton. Yeah, and there's this really nice routine in that film where he does all these tricks with his hanky and he's like flipping and he's playing with the crowd.
Speaker 4:It's all silent and dad and I learnt the whole routine when I was a kid, so that was just, and dad taught us how to ride unicycles and juggle and stuff and do magic and stuff. And I was always playing music and I was playing piano when I was four and I played all through my life and taught myself guitar and would sing for years and I'd do high school plays and stuff. So that was just life. It wasn't like I want to be an actor or a performer, it was like in my spare time I play by doing this kind of stuff and entertaining people and I just got used to making people smile or laugh by doing these kind of things you know, and then you got the bug.
Speaker 4:Well, I didn't even realise I had it. I think we had the bug our whole life. I think so too, yeah.
Speaker 1:Because it was similar for me in that it was my hobbies Exactly. I sang for years.
Speaker 4:I still do sing yeah, nice Years and years and I loved it.
Speaker 1:Had horrific stage fright but loved it so much that I just wanted to keep on doing it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Same with acting Horrific stage fright, but just loved and enjoyed the creative process of it so much, yeah, that I just found ways to be doing it um. It's funny because my parents aren't in it at all. Yeah, yeah, my dad actually, when he was younger, he's he's not in it at all, he's, he's a doctor. He's not in um acting at all, but when he was in um matric in in high school, he loved acting. He played Hamlet, he adored it no way.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he loved it.
Speaker 1:He actually. He grew up in a little small town and they even wrote a little news article about him. He got a feature because, he did so well as Hamlet yeah, cool. So he always loved it, so he always exposed me to a lot of film. I think that's actually a big thing. Yeah, I grew up watching so much film and like film I should not have been watching at tender young ages. Yeah, but it was like dark and like horror and like all sorts.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And I just kept on being drawn to it. I think it's similar to yeah, it was like. I would do other things. I studied.
Speaker 4:I feel like we had the same life.
Speaker 1:man, yeah, I know I studied something else, but then, just like any of my free time, was like I would love to sing and I would love to like act and like this is so fun and this is so amazing and I think it is hard not being given permission you know, like I always felt like I was never quite doing the right thing.
Speaker 4:Yeah, because you're kind of expecting an objective view of someone on the outside, just to be like this is right this is what you're doing. But you don't know what you don't know, you don't know what you don't know, you don't know what you're missing and because we didn't go to uni, yeah, you go to a set or something and you might feel like, is this okay? All these people studied. But then people are like no good job. And you're like, oh, I guess it's not that deep.
Speaker 1:Honestly, though, you asked me because you gave me some really good thought-provoking questions, and this is actually a much better answer. You said what is the advice you'd give yourself, or your younger self, or something? It's not that deep.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's not that deep.
Speaker 1:And I've seen that time and time again so many of the actors that I admire and their careers, that they've just done these incredible things. They don't know shit while they start, no, and either they don't overthink it it's not that deep or they do overthink it, but they do it anyway. Yeah, you know what I mean, yeah yeah, Like recently at the end of last year, I was being a stand-in and a double for Sally Hawkins.
Speaker 4:No way, I'm bringing her back. Yeah, it was so amazing, so amazing.
Speaker 1:I would come home every single night and just like write notes and notes and notes about her process, because I think she's so amazing, oh man front row seats. I know how cool, but the biggest takeaway that I got was she was unsure of herself.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And she did it anyway. Yeah, like she, and it's like I was like you know she would be like, not that she was unsure of herself, in that she was an unconfident actor, but I was talking to her and I was like you know, your performance was so amazing today, sort of thing. And she was like I don't know, I never know, I don't know if they like it. I, you know, she didn't know, and I was like and she's like a world class, incredible actor with a career that one can only dream of. And even she was like I'm just making it up, what am I doing? Well, you, are.
Speaker 4:You're doing something, you're creating something out of nothing and you've got a script to work in, but you're creating a character out of nothing. But, yeah, I think that was something for me as well, like witnessing, or, you know, even listening to interviews of these big Hollywood superstars that are still saying, I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. Yeah, and I'm terrified every single time. Yes, or, you know, we might move on from a scene and be like but we didn't get the coverage Awful yeah. And they might win an Oscar for it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I saw Julianne Anderson, but just be, like maybe that is just what it feels like. Yeah, it just always feels like that, and you just have to accept that. Okay, trust, trust the other creatives in the room that are that are going to make it work. They won't make you look dumb.
Speaker 1:What were?
Speaker 4:you going to say you?
Speaker 1:saw her. I was going to say Gillian Anderson. I saw a video of her saying the same thing.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:She said every single time, even to this day, I walk on set. I think I'm going to get fired for the first week. Oh yeah, I think I've seen that.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:But I agree, I agree. I think it is like life Put that on a t-shirt.
Speaker 4:We've got so many t-shirts to make in this podcast already.
Speaker 1:I love this, I'm ready for the merch, but I think when you're less experienced, you assume that there is a right and a wrong way. But the more experience, you get, the more you realize everybody's just winging it Because there's a million ways to do it right, Like it's the age old thing of like you think as a adults understand what they're doing, and then you become an adult and you're like, oh shit. Yeah, I know, it's me, I'm the responsible adult. I feel like that as an actor.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Where it's just like shit. I don't know. I just really like to do this thing. I think it's really fascinating and interesting and I'm really drawn to it. I don't know, I'm just making it up, yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah, Because there is no point. I don't think there's a point for anyone where they go. Now I know what it is. Now I know how to do it. Maybe that point is I'll never know what it feels like. Yeah, Maybe when you realize that you can be like now. I can give myself permission.
Speaker 1:It's a level of acceptance, but it is only you that can give yourself permission.
Speaker 4:No, that can give yourself permission. No one else is actually going to do it, because no one knows what you're going through. No one knows you know where you are at in your head or in your, like learning you know how confident do you feel when you walk onto a set. These days. Yeah, I'm fine mate, but no, that's pretty new that feeling yeah. But I've got things in my head that I tick off you know, that are. You know all these sort of mantras.
Speaker 1:What are your mantras, please? Oh, like what we've been talking about.
Speaker 4:You know, like everybody's terrified.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4:Everyone's here to make something together.
Speaker 1:We're all collaborating, yeah.
Speaker 4:Right, it's okay to not know what the fuck I'm doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for me it's feel the fear and do it anyway which is I know it's corny, but I like it. The other one is I don't know if I've told you this. I feel like I tell everybody this. I have this mantra or this little reminder to myself, where that I say teapots to myself because it's based on this, because you're mad I am, because I'm fucking insane. No, it's based on this story that I heard about this art school, I think in California. I think this is a real story by the way, not just like some modern folklore.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but there was this very prestigious art school where they were doing pottery and they had a very famous, you know, pottery teacher and he divided the class into two groups and he said we're making teapots and the one half of the group I want you to make one teapot in the semester. You're going to spend all your time designing it and crafting it and making the best teapot that's special to you or whatever it is. Put all of your effort in this one teapot. And then to the other half he said I want you to make teapots as fast as you can Make as many as you can Make them every week, make them every day. And by the end of the semester the group that had made a lot of teapots were making better teapots than the ones who spent all the time planning to make the one teapot.
Speaker 1:So that's my thing, I tell myself teapots, because when I get too nervous I'm like you know what if this is not perfect. Like this is another step in the journey. This is teapots.
Speaker 4:Yeah, because we we're not good at anything when we first started.
Speaker 1:No Right, no terrible.
Speaker 4:And it's all about reps.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:And just starting, yeah, and trying it, and that's why you know student films, yeah, amateur theatre.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally.
Speaker 4:Whatever, whatever way you can build reps in a low stakes environment, yeah, Even just taping with friends. Yeah, self tapes, yeah, self tapes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think some of the best things for my performance growth definitely. Yeah, short films huge. What a wonderful experience to play Even music videos again, just being on set experience. The standardized patient work that I did Performing in a band was actually really really good for me.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Really good for me because that helped me to get over stage fright. Yeah, I think any creative thing helps other creative things in a sense. So it's not direct acting training, but it is training creative focus.
Speaker 4:Oh, there's so many elements that you're picking up from those other creative outlets.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you would have it too, I'm sure.
Speaker 4:Yeah, well, I think with every experience that I've collected over the years, and you too it sounds like it's all come in handy for this thing that I've collected over the years, and you too. It sounds like it's all come in handy for this thing that we've chosen to do now.
Speaker 4:Yeah, totally, totally, and it feels like this thing, this acting thing. Not that this is the only creative outlet I have, but this acting thing is like I know that this thing is where I can utilise all of those skills that I have to use because I'm so. There's something in me that's like I need to get this energy out of me.
Speaker 3:I need to do it here.
Speaker 4:And this is the avenue I can do it because, there's just so many good things about it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree, but yeah, it's all reps, it's all reps, yeah, all of those things really, really I think were like so helpful to me in learning to just be present and just get into it when it's time when it's a more high stakes environment.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so how do you go with higher stakes environments?
Speaker 1:I think one of the biggest things has been learning to just tune out the noise, to focus on the creative process, you know, and that's where all the reps come in right, because it's like the creative muscle that you're growing.
Speaker 1:So then it's just whenever I try and prepare as much as I can, you know, but there's only so much that you can yeah, and then just arrive and just try and provide myself with all of the circumstances that I need to be performing at my best, yeah, to be on my game. And again I'm going to talk about her again because I I love her, but, but, sally, yeah, well, I mean, she was obviously a pivotal moment in your learning.
Speaker 4:Yeah, to witness her at work.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it was actually affirming because she made sure she always had everything that she needed with her. She had her big bag of everything, her notes, her anything always with her and around her. She asked to take a moment if she needed. She asked around her. She asked to take a moment if she needed. She asked for the things she needed and I have been doing that on set already.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I felt so unsure about it yeah, you know, again waiting for permission but seeing her do it was so validating, being like, oh great, so I, because I am that person, I bring my whole bag of shit onto set and yeah I've got all of my notes if I, if I want to go back and reread my thoughts on something, to get myself into a headspace or like have like a snack or something like anything. My little bag of safety blankets.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, it's just security and things that you know you can rely on.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when you need to take a moment to recenter. Yeah, and takes you out of your head, yeah and seeing that she did that too, I was like oh nice, that's great, I haven't thought of that.
Speaker 4:I bring nothing to set Really. Yeah, I was like, oh nice, that's great, I haven't thought of that.
Speaker 1:I bring nothing to set. Really, yeah, really. No, I'm such an over-preparer in that way. I bring so much. I'm such an under-preparer Really. I admire actors like that. I want to be that.
Speaker 4:I feel like I give other actors anxiety because my scripts will have no notes on them. Dude, I'm.
Speaker 1:I admire that. I love that so much Okay.
Speaker 4:I feel like that's what makes me unprofessional. But I don't usually show people my script, Like if I do a play. People are like scribbling notes and I'm just like the word's already there, We'll see what happens. Man, that's so good.
Speaker 1:No, I have come in with so many notes. I remember I used to feel really self-conscious about it. I remember doing this short with another actor who I adore and he's amazing, um, stanley browning. Um, if you're watching this listening, I guess, no, but he's incredible. But I remember we did a short called downpour together. Um, we've done a few together actually now, but I remember on that one he was one of those wonderful actors that, like yourself, he just rocked up and he just did the thing yeah and I remember I had my, my script and it was just like covered in notes and thoughts and timelines and everything.
Speaker 1:And I remember looking at his and being so self-conscious yeah right.
Speaker 4:But I look at someone with lots of notes and I'm like, oh fuck, I'm going to blow this out of the water.
Speaker 1:But you know that's comparison, though you can't.
Speaker 4:Everyone's process is different.
Speaker 1:So different. I think. The more that I learn, the more I realize there are a billion ways to do it and all of them are correct, yeah absolutely, you know, yeah, clip that. Put that on a t-shirt.
Speaker 4:You got my merch yeah, absolutely, that's so true. Yeah, okay, fuck it, I ruined it, that was good Shit.
Speaker 1:Nah, do you know what, if this was a rolling, take you? You haven't ruined it, it just means send yourself, take a breath and go into it again. I feel like that's actually a big thing for me as well yeah is seeing that, seeing professionals who I really respect do that on sets in high stakes environments where they, they flub a take and then they just take a moment, they take a breath and then they keep on going.
Speaker 4:Yeah, amazing, yeah, amazing, yeah. I think that's important, like I've started doing that too, and I think it's. I think that's another one of those things that you feel like you can't do.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, but there's no rules.
Speaker 4:No, there are no rules.
Speaker 1:The reality is, every single person on a set is so highly qualified and there is so much running money often on bigger sets that is being spent every moment that you're on a set. So it's easy to feel really, really scared to take time.
Speaker 4:Yeah, there's a lot of pressure, yeah.
Speaker 1:But that actually means the opposite. It means take the time that you need, because there is so much riding on those moments that if you need an extra five minutes to centre yourself, but it means you get the perfect take. That's worth it. Absolutely Everybody wants you to succeed.
Speaker 3:Do you know what I mean Like?
Speaker 1:everybody, nobody wants you to fail. Everybody wants you to fucking crush that line or you know, really be present and really be in the moment. So I think it's like just being courageous enough to ask for what you need and do what you need, Absolutely man. God, I'm so corny.
Speaker 4:No, you need absolutely man. God, I'm so corny, no, this is so good. I mean, it just blows my mind that. Or I mean how much, how much insight you've, you've sort of collected over over your life doesn't feel like that no, but I mean, I I feel the same, like I feel like I've just I don't know how this happened yeah, do you know?
Speaker 1:do you know what I mean?
Speaker 4:like I feel like I've just absorbed so much information from like I started this because I learned how to act from listening to podcasts. Really, yeah, I mean. No, I mean obviously I've got all the practical experience that I had throughout my whole life, but all this sort of stuff that we're talking about and hearing from actors that are really successful, that you know say things like we're still really terrified you know all those kind of things which gave me reassurance to be like I could give this a go.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I learned it all from interviews and podcasts and stuff you know like I listened to. There's a podcast called In the Envelope and I've listened to like a thousand episodes of that and I used to clean. That's some hours, yeah well, I used to clean windows for this company, and then I started my own cleaning business yeah, no so I just have my headphones in all the time and I would just I'll listen to like seven episodes a day yeah of all these different podcasts and that's how I sort of absorbed all this stuff yeah and then I would be like dying to get on a film set or on a stage to try it and do it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know Totally, but where did you, where did all this come from?
Speaker 1:I really feel like my acting journey has been really scrappy for lack of a better term and really like I, it's not been traditional Scrap is the answer, though, yeah.
Speaker 1:And I think that you learn a lot and I think for me it's doing a lot of non-conventional things and then talking about it, a lot chatting about it. I think, my partner, the love of my life, human angel just hears all of my anxious rants, and I think that's where I learn things. I talk about it. I'm like, wow, I had this really crazy day and I did all of these things, but I just blab on until all of a sudden, I'm like, oh, that's the takeaway.
Speaker 4:I think it's really important to talk about it. Yeah, because I find myself in these conversations all the time. Yeah, I love it, and I don't know. I've heard a few times people say, like you know, I don't think there's any point in talking about the craft Disagree. I think, like Cillian Murphy said that, and I'm like all right, man, that works for you.
Speaker 1:Hard, disagree hard disagree Again.
Speaker 4:It's like what works for you, it's so personal there's no, right or wrong, no exactly. But I get so much out of talking about this with other actors and other filmmakers. Or just like my mum, who's an actor, but totally yeah. Or just like my mum, yeah, who's an actor, but you know, but totally.
Speaker 1:I feel like it's often where I get clarity.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Because it's like you have all of these experiences, for me at least. Like I said, I'm a highly emotional person, part of, I guess, why I'm drawn to acting.
Speaker 1:But, I think also. First of all, I have a very good exterior, Just in my personality. Generally, I feel a lot of emotions. Not loads of people in my life would read me and say, wow, you're a super emotional person. But because I'm highly emotional, sometimes I think I go around in circles with thoughts and feelings without coming to conclusions. But when I speak it out loud and I hear it, it's much more easy for me to draw conclusions and get takeaways. You know, I don't know. I know.
Speaker 4:No, I'm with you. Yeah, come to a lot of realisations like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but I think also because I've not been given a framework. Like we said, I didn't do a traditional three-year course. I didn't even get into it. A lot of people go into it and they do a lot of theatre. I didn't do that. I did a lot of really short form things and did all sorts of random projects, like I did this incredible ARG, this augmented reality game, years ago. That was amazing and went kind of viral and that was really really awesome. But again, it was one of these things that was like this is not the traditional route that an actor is supposed to take, so you just sort of you do a thing and then you talk about it and then you're like that's what I learned, I guess.
Speaker 4:Yeah, but it all accumulates, I think.
Speaker 1:It does.
Speaker 4:And even experiences that don't have anything to do with acting. Yeah, you know living your life, going through hell. You know hitting rock bottom, having a breakup.
Speaker 1:Yeah, living in the real world is one of the best tools for being an actor. I think sometimes, if you're too acting centric and you don't spend enough time living in the real or living experiences, having breakups, having like friends falling out, or working a job that you hate, or working a job that you love or like you know, like actors are playing real people. So, like you kind of need to be, the more of a fleshed out worldly real person you are often, the more of a pool of experiences you have to draw from, absolutely, you know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, spot on, I totally agree yeah.
Speaker 4:Because I didn't act for like years, like from 21 to my late 20s. Really yeah, I mean, I did a couple, maybe a couple of little things.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:But, I spent those years just going through it going through whatever life happened.
Speaker 3:We don't need to go into that.
Speaker 4:But you know I came out of that with all this insight. But also I needed to go through that to discover who I was and some really good experiences, some really horrible, scary experiences, but they've made me the person that I am, with all these insights that I can bring to different characters. Not that I draw from all of those experiences, because I don't think that's necessarily very healthy, but just the ability to empathize with with a character's story yeah and be like well, I went through this, so I can imagine what this might feel like for this person who's gone through this journey.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I totally think so. I think it's a really interesting balance of imagination and drawing from personal experience. But I think that, whether you're drawing from your personal experience or not, having a larger library of life experience is always an advantage. Yeah, you know, that's kind of like one of the beautiful things about acting is that anytime something happens, I'm like, oh, that was kind of shit or that hurt or that sucked it's. There's something kind of beautiful in like oh, that can be a part of a creative process one day. Yeah, honestly, the older I get, the more I think that there's so much like mindfulness and creativity.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean Like. So much of it are those moments where you're like you know, well, this could be a really shit thing or it could become a really awesome song. You know what I mean Like one of my favourite songs I've ever written. When I was younger was over like a really sad experience of like a friendship breakup. That was really, really sad, and then I wrote a song that I fucking loved and I was like well, you know what Sometimes it's.
Speaker 1:You know, I'm not saying that you have to have shit experiences to make cool things, by no means, but also it's, it's a nice way to process hard times.
Speaker 4:Yeah, well, I mean, that's what we do, though. Yeah, is we? We turn it into art, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:Isn't that the point?
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, I was actually just saying this the other day to my partner. That I think is actually one of my favorite things about human beings is the weird inclination that we have to make art.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean. Like there are so many things that you can really chalk up to different parts of behavioral science, like I can understand religion and different like, obviously, like jobs, like so many different societal structures. It makes sense because it's about propagation of the species or it's about self-preservation, you know it's about personal, you know sense of, you know, uh, ego or importance in the world and, to be fair, maybe art is that. But I think it's a really interesting inclination that we like to use abstract mediums to evoke feelings in others, whether it's like a drawing or a song, or like a movie or a play and so many. You know what other creatures do that?
Speaker 1:Like that's kind of that's such a beautiful way to connect. What a roundabout way to connect.
Speaker 4:I know, I know that is really interesting. And the other thing is some people, some people way to connect. I know, I know that is really interesting. And the other thing is some people don't make art.
Speaker 1:No, I know, and like that's fine, yeah, but they have art, yes. They consume art. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you know.
Speaker 4:Yeah, but how do they cope?
Speaker 1:I think people consume more art and I'm including everything I'm including, like tiktoks content creation books plays films, music, whatever it is. People consume more art than ever, yeah, but they don't realize that they are like they have no idea, like podcasts, like whatever you know people, it's, it's. We're all just fascinated by expressions of experience, emotion and human yeah human connection.
Speaker 1:Yeah god, this is so wanky, but I people we're on a podcast but people are so drawn to that and it's so funny that by the same token that people are consuming more, yeah, art than ever before and at the same time, art is often so devalued as a commercial viability or like as a people, I think people don't understand how much work often goes into so many different art forms yeah, yeah and like it's funny, because when I'm, I'm often around people who are like not in the arts at all and there's a a weird mixture of them loving and revering the art and being so excited by it but also being like, oh yeah, you can just like shoot that on an iphone right.
Speaker 1:or like like, oh yeah, and it's easy, you're just like you're an actor, so you just have big feelings and you just get up there and do the thing.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean, where it's like it's a weird duality, I think.
Speaker 4:Thank God we don't have to make art anymore because we have AI. How lucky are we.
Speaker 1:Yeah, shit.
Speaker 4:Because I'm only doing this because we need more, not because I get something out of it. No, no, no, no yeah.
Speaker 1:It's actually weird. I really did not think out of any of the forms that I thought AI was going to impact society. I really never thought it was going to be up first no one's fucking asked for this.
Speaker 4:No one's asked for this.
Speaker 1:So sad Like automate accounting. Please, yes, no of this. So sad like automate accounting. Yes, no one wants to do that shit. But maybe that's selfish of me, because there are accountants who love accounting and I'm being really selfish and saying don't take my job. Can?
Speaker 3:I.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Oh, no I was going to say. Can I pause for one second by? The way and say I hope that this is coherent enough for you, because I feel like I'm just bouncing from random thing to random thing.
Speaker 4:No, this is awesome, this is so good.
Speaker 1:What.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I'm loving this.
Speaker 1:I feel like it's a really good example of me being insecure or anxious and not understanding or being unsure of is this right, you know, like in acting, yeah, yeah, yeah, do you do that? On set when I was younger, when I was in my earlier days. I think I would ask for more validation.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And that would often be like going to the director and did we get enough coverage? Is that okay?
Speaker 3:Yeah, are you sure yeah?
Speaker 1:And now I'm realizing that is soothing my own anxiety. Often directors are anxious themselves.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know they have so many pressures, They've got so much stuff going on. Yeah, I think I used to get the most anxious on sets when I was working with a director who I could also sense was anxious and of course they all are, because it's a high-stakes environment and they're making art and you know what I mean, or like so many of them are All eyes on them too.
Speaker 4:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:And so I have learnt to stop, yeah, and now my approach is okay. So now I'm just going to focus on really really hitting like kind of a flow state, like kind of hitting being in my element as much as I can and just trusting that they'll tell me. You know, which is much scarier.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I've talked about this already on the podcast, but with a film I did a couple of years ago, with or Without you, and, yeah, kelly was great, but she didn't give you much, she left you alone, which is fine, but I just wasn't used to it. But I was searching for validation.
Speaker 1:I just needed one.
Speaker 4:I need it once you know just be like Kelly is this the guy? Yeah? And she's like, yeah, that's him. I'm like cool, let's go and it was fine. But yeah, when you talk about flow state, that's interesting because I've described it as like acting, as like it can feel like a meditative state.
Speaker 4:But I think flow state is a really good word for it because it is when you go through all those steps to allow yourself to just connect to the moment and connect to the character and you forget that, you're anxious and you forget what's going on in in around around you or in in the world, and you just, you're just there with your scene, partner in that environment yeah, that's the best feeling ever kind of this tunnel vision. You get the blinkers on you know, yeah, that's my favorite.
Speaker 1:That is my favorite and I often I think I chase realistically like my hobbies and all sorts of things. I often chase that flow state yeah, I feel like I've got. I'll clarify two sets of hobbies the one that's really, really intellectualised.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And then the ones that are flow state intuitively based. Yeah, and I like having both.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But I think why I love and pursue acting so much is it is the most rewarding and satisfying flow state of any. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, like there is something. Films, I think. For me, film and tv are like some of the most holistic art forms that I love the most, because it hits so many creative ideals that I have. Yeah, and being able to be a part of that as an actor, it it when you're in your flow state. It's just so rewarding to me.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Like it is so lovely and so like filling.
Speaker 4:Like you feel so like oh. That's when it feels like you're actually doing it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally, yeah, totally. But I think for a lot of actors they will say things like and I respect this, I love this, where they're like I couldn't do anything else.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Or it's like this is my one love, and I think for me that's actually not the case. I think I am someone who falls in love with things so hard and so often.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I fall in love with shit all the time. Yeah, yeah, I'm bouldering all the time. I love it. I love D&D, I love to like learn to build PCs and different things and like like all of my hobbies are so random and eclectic. But the beauty about acting, I think, is it's one of the few things where you get a bit of everything. Yeah, like you can pull from all of these things. You get a fall in love with a new character.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and it's, and their world, yes, exactly.
Speaker 1:And because I fall in love with things so easily. I think you get to live another life for a moment, Exactly exactly, and I think the part of me that just like loves novelty, loves that in acting where it's like I think, I am greedy and I love the idea of living so many different lives. There are so many lives I could see myself living and loving and experiencing. Yeah, and in acting you get to live as many lives as as many parts you're doing.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know, and that's really cool yeah it's so cool, you know, speaking of using love as sort of a driving motive. Like I realised at some point that, like I, I realized that I feel connected to a character or ready to play a character when I love that character. Like I have more trouble sympathizing with myself. Like I feel like there's this idea that when you're playing a character, you trick yourself into becoming that person and sure, sure, that's fine. That might be right, I don't know, but I find that really difficult because I don't have as much sympathy for myself I do love myself.
Speaker 1:No, I get that.
Speaker 4:It's taken me a long time to feel that, but it's something that I did struggle with through a lot of my life, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, same.
Speaker 4:Right, so to play another character. I had this sort of epiphany that if I can talk about that character as if they're a real person in my life, someone like a sibling or a relative or a really good friend or someone that I just know about, someone external to me, and if I can get to the point where I can talk about that person like oh, there's this guy and he had this like really horrific thing happen to him, but I can talk to you like he's a real person in the world and I can sympathize him and empathize with him in that way, then I feel like I have to do him justice and that's how I feel connected to the character, but I have to love that character. And when I realized that I love that character, then I'm like okay, now I can play him.
Speaker 1:That's really cool.
Speaker 4:Right. So I'm curious, like how do you, are you able to intellectualize, like what makes you feel ready to play a character? Have you has that, has that sort of crossed your mind before? I'm just curious.
Speaker 1:I think often I find little hooks in a character.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That I'm a huge mix of being an over-intellectualiser and a really intuitive person. It's funny because in my family, I think I'm like known as the intuitive one. They were like academic and really you know. Yeah, yeah, and so I was always known as like, the creative one, which is wonderful, but also like I definitely had a chip on my shoulder about that being like I'm smart too, but I'm also like a big intellectual, I think. Sometimes I rely on my instinct at first.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Where it's like there's like a hook or there's something. There are lines. I feel like there's always like these little lines where you're like, wow, that's something.
Speaker 1:It's like it's a map and it's full of treasure right when it's like that's something that's a part of this personality and I then will go with a gut feeling and then I will break down more of an intellectualized like here is a timeline, here are their experiences, why do I think they might do this and that? And then I just go with the gut flow of it. But I think, like I said, I think I fall in love with things easy. So I think I fall in love with characters easy. When you said that, I had a realization that it's like I've never thought about that before, because every single character I've ever played, I, I love them.
Speaker 1:I guess yeah, right I guess I never really thought about that, you know.
Speaker 4:But even if you have to play a character that, objectively, you despise, yeah, totally, but they have their reasons, exactly. You have to get to a place where you don't judge them anymore. Yeah, absolutely yeah, so finding that connection through love for that person. I found it really important. It's really helped me.
Speaker 1:I think honestly, generally speaking, like even from when I was young, I would always think of other people's perspectives first. Yeah, and that's not to say like, oh, I'm so selfless. It's not necessarily like that, but I think it's a symptom of the anxiety where it's like I will always think of, like what are the seven things they could be thinking right now, before I think. What am I actually feeling and thinking?
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I think that came in handy with acting, because I would just immediately read a thing and be like I think I'm good at seeing someone else's perspective while reading it.
Speaker 4:But I think of the characters that I play. Well, that's the ability to empathise with someone. Yeah, and that's vital. It's so important, it's so important.
Speaker 1:Also because every person makes choices and sometimes they make a choice and they don't know why they're making that choice, but that's still a part of them. You know what I mean. Like sometimes it's like you. Just if you're like, well, really, why is this line happening? It's like I don't know. I say say that all the time, like that's part of being a person too. Like sometimes it's just surrendering yourself to like whatever is on the page while being that. You know.
Speaker 4:Yeah, maybe your character's just not that self-aware, you know sometimes Like yeah. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:But I think I'm lucky also because the characters that I've played have been really cool and some of them suck, but like it's fun being them you know what I mean, yeah and, um, I think I'm also lucky because I've played a really broad spread and I don't think everybody gets to do that.
Speaker 1:So I'm kind of I feel happy, and I think a big part of that was doing so many short films right, because it's like sometimes if you're doing a, if I'm doing a part in a feature, um, I'm lucky enough that I have had a couple of feature leads, which has been such a wonderful experience, yeah.
Speaker 1:But also I've done a couple of feature leads, which has been such a wonderful experience, yeah, but also I've done a lot of like little bit party you know things, which is wonderful too, Like I love doing that. But I think if you're not doing lower stakes things sometimes I think you get less of an opportunity to play around and do a really wide variety of things, you know.
Speaker 4:Yeah, try things that might be too risky, or yeah. Yeah, I made a film recently and it was really good like it was. It was a feature, it was a student film and I love, I love all these guys that were that were on it? Yeah, no shade on them, because they're all students. Then we're all there learning right yeah but we didn't do many takes right and so we kind of went with like first instinct with everything yeah, with every single take.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and I don't know what the film looks like and I'm intrigued, but I feel like I'm just yelling in every single take.
Speaker 1:Dude, yeah Right.
Speaker 4:I feel like it's just going to be me yelling the whole film because we only got that coverage.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:But I also think that's the exact environment where I should be doing that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, absolutely Trying a thing, yeah.
Speaker 4:And coming away from that being like yeah maybe on the next thing, I will push for more takes and say let's try these different options. That's a big learning as well.
Speaker 1:I had asking for another take if I need it or if I want it and giving variety. I think when I first started I was really nervous, for I'm really conscious that the art that I love, there's always a big emotional journey or there are changes or like it's not all one note.
Speaker 1:So I always try and break down a script or break down a piece or even a scene, and try and map arcs, forget about it on the day and then just do the thing, but I think it helps me as reminders of like you can do it this way, you can do it this way, see how you react in the moment, but like it's cool to get the variation um, but also, on a side note, similar. I had a similar experience last year. I did um.
Speaker 4:I did a film with the guys that make like sharknado and oh yeah, oh yes, yes, yes, which was anthony anthony frith, yeah, yeah, so he's he's um from adelaide.
Speaker 1:Yeah, he's aussie. And yeah, yeah, so he's from Adelaide, he's Aussie, and he's wonderful and so funny. He's really really funny.
Speaker 3:Yeah, he's great yeah.
Speaker 1:And they're making a documentary about the making of it which is really cool.
Speaker 3:It'll be out at AF this year, yeah.
Speaker 1:But the film, the way that they run it, you get like one take and the script like the way that it's written, because the production company, the Asylum, their modus operandi is almost is make as many things as they can while making a profit and that becomes they can make the art and the films that they want to do and make it financially viable through sheer volume rather than through making a return that's big enough from any one given film.
Speaker 1:So they make them really fast and they shoot them even faster and like that was wild getting to work on that and just having one take per each thing you know?
Speaker 4:Were you aware that this might not be your best work?
Speaker 1:and that's what they want. Oh my God, absolutely.
Speaker 4:And I was nervous about that, that's so hard, man, I was nervous, yeah, yeah, because all that pressure that we were talking about before, like the pressure that you take away from yourself, thinking like, oh, we have more than one take, this is, we're going to be fine. It's like, okay, now we've removed all of that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think also, though I knew going into it, that the editors have a very specific lens I talked to so the co-lead I was playing the romantic, like the romantic lead and the the lead of it. He's done a lot of them before yeah jack nemo pearson.
Speaker 1:He's wonderful, he's done a bunch, yeah. And before we got shooting, I was like can you please tell me? Like give me the download? Like how is this gonna be? Yeah, I'm nervous. Um, and he was like, first of all, you know, you just gotta like do your thing and, like the editor, they, they have, they've very stylized choices. They're going to make the choices that the asylum, the production company, wants to make.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you have to like let go of any preconceived notions yeah act in your own interest in that like what you believe the character is going to do and then just like, yeah, you kind of see, wow and it was really fun. It was a great experience like do I think it's my best acting? No, but also did I learn so much?
Speaker 4:absolutely and like also, that's the style.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly that's what it is, yeah you know, it's funny though, I got the script 72 hours before we were shooting for the. There was a table read 48 hours after I had the script oh my god and I was told it was an american character. So I spent a good chunk of the 48 hours learning my lines and focusing on really making sure that I didn't have it like making sure my american accent was really like- yeah ready. Which lesson learned now it's ready at all times yeah I was like it's ready.
Speaker 1:And then when I got into the situation I was like is it ready enough to do 150 pages of dialogue ready? Oh, oh my God. And then a line into the read. They said I had the second line in the read and I delivered it in an American accent. And then they were like wait a minute, did we can the American accents? We canned them. No, it's Aussie. And they went away. They talked, they got on the phone, came back in after speaking to like the producers or whoever like the execs.
Speaker 1:They came back in after speaking to like the producers or whoever like the execs. They're like yeah, no ozzy. And so I was like fuck, I only have another 24 hours before I get on set and we're shooting a 155 page, 150 page script, yeah, filled with dialogue.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know, oh, my god yeah, so that was wild yeah, but it was really fun.
Speaker 1:It was really really fun.
Speaker 4:It sounds awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I would love that I gotta, I gotta kill a t-Rex with a pocket knife. Spoilers, god damn Shit.
Speaker 4:I'm not up to that. I ruined it.
Speaker 1:But no, it was very fun.
Speaker 3:Yeah, nice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think also I have low self-esteem. Shock horror, an actor with low self-esteem yeah, but I think when I was younger I would really devalue my accomplishments. Right, I wouldn't celebrate them because I'd be like, well, I did it, so it can't be that great, right? You know what I mean? It was kind of like the unspoken. It wasn't like cognizant logic, but it was like the unspoken underlying thought process, and because so much of the work that I did earlier on in my career was like really random.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I think I earlier on in my career was like really random. Yeah, I think I didn't celebrate my little wins as much as I looking back on it I'm like that was awesome like I yeah so much.
Speaker 1:I did like a you know, yeah, and I think that's how I went into doing this asylum film and just like loving it, having a wonderful time and knowing full well what it was going to be. Yeah was because I had come to a place where I was like every acting job is a wonderful opportunity to act Like we live this life once. How wonderful am I getting paid to be a silly little character in art?
Speaker 3:You know whether it's good art or bad art. Who cares?
Speaker 1:I'm making art, like I'm doing the thing, and so now as an actor, I think I really try and celebrate all my big and small wins, because you know, it's all, we're lucky.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we're so lucky. It's all really cool.
Speaker 1:It's all really really cool, yeah. But yeah, I think I used to get in my own head about how I think I had this idea of what a proper actor does. You know.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I know what you mean.
Speaker 1:You book your big job and you do this, or like you're working and you know you're doing all these things and it's like I was like I don't know, I was doing cool things, but I didn't really. I hadn't really. I think I always felt like it wasn't enough.
Speaker 4:And then life got easier when I was like, oh, it doesn't matter, did you notice that you just kind of kept chipping away at all these smaller things?
Speaker 1:And then one day you looked back and went look at all the shit I've done Exactly, that's exactly it.
Speaker 4:That's kind of how I feel Exactly, and now people are sort of going. It seems like you came out of nowhere.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but it's just because you've been chipping away at these tiny little projects for so long.
Speaker 4:I think so, and then you're like check it out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, look at all the things I've done. I think also like I enjoy acting so much more when I don't, when I take any of the idea of personal accomplishment out of it.
Speaker 3:Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1:Like there is no one right way to do it.
Speaker 1:Like there is no like when it like. I think now, like as a baby actor, I was like I was just so excited to be in things, but also I was like I, you know, I would love to do like something that I'm like super fucking proud of, but then it would be an imaginary bar of like you know, like I do one thing and it's like oh well, I've, I've, I've, I've done. I remember the first time I got a short film a a music video.
Speaker 1:That was so exciting yeah, and then I had done a music video. So I was like oh, but I want to do the next thing, yeah. And then I was doing short films and I was like oh, but I've never done a feature. And then I had done a feature but I was like oh, but you know what I mean. So it's like it's that like that creep of personal expectation, but the older I got, the more I'm like oh, who cares?
Speaker 1:yeah I'm having fun. I'm making. You know I'm lucky enough to like get to get paid to do an acting thing.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And like who gets to do that in life? Yeah, yeah, and the moment I started, I dropped that expectation for myself. It all got so much more enjoyable.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, I remember. I love looking back on all those things and all the little steps that I took and even doing extras work when I was a 13-year-old and being so excited about being on a film set at 13, like being an extra on a commercial when I was a teenager, same, same.
Speaker 1:I did the same thing and I was like it was the biggest thing ever. It was a huge deal. Yeah, isn't it funny. And then you look back on it and it's so weird that you're like and I would never do that. Yeah, weird that you're like and I would never do that. Yeah, yeah, no, but it's like it's funny where it's like you only really realize your growth after, after it's happened.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know, yeah, is there a lesson in that? I mean, maybe that was it, I think that the lesson?
Speaker 1:yeah, I think the lesson is. Do you know what I think it is? Yeah, I think that the lesson is um action always over inaction because, like, whether you know it, you're going to be growing from it.
Speaker 4:Print that. That's good Shit.
Speaker 1:I don't think that anybody should listen to me, though I'm not qualified to give any life advice.
Speaker 4:No, it's okay, I preface every episode. Disclaimer. Yeah, there is. Like seriously, I say there is going to be advice in this, but just take it or leave it, because it's the internet, you know.
Speaker 1:I love that. No disclaimer I have no idea what I'm doing.
Speaker 4:No one does.
Speaker 1:Nobody does.
Speaker 4:Just try it on, try it on and see if it fits. Yeah, you know, but if not just don't, we don't know what we're talking about. We're not trained, true Untrained untrained.
Speaker 1:But I think there's something kind of nice in that. Like don't get me wrong. There are things where sometimes I meet people who have been trained and I'm like, wow, I would have loved to have learned that. That's really like I just like soak it up. But sometimes I'm like I'm kind of glad there's something unique in like things that you make yourself, you know.
Speaker 4:Well, I feel like you and I have created this approach in our own way, you know, and I think it's sad when people lose their individuality.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:And we are excited about this still, because we've kind of come to these conclusions ourselves and we've shaped the way we want to do it in our own way, and I think there's something in that, you know. Totally, we're still bringing our own uniqueness too.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think so.
Speaker 4:But it's also always cool.
Speaker 1:I will say, though, it is cool. Sometimes when I'm around people who've done the traditional training, I'm just like I'm going to write down every single thing you say, because that's really cool.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah, absolutely. There's so many different tools. Steal from them.
Speaker 1:Do you know what that's actually? Great advice is to steal every. There are so many different tools and they're all different and they all work differently for different people.
Speaker 4:Well, it's like working with Sally on Bring.
Speaker 1:It Back. Yeah, that was really cool.
Speaker 4:Well, I'm going to it yourself, but just observing it and considering that that might be an approach that might work for you. I did a play in 2021. Wait, yeah, what year is it? 2025.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I did a play in 2021, the Laramie Project. I've talked about this on this already as well, but there were so many people on there that were so good and I just latched onto them. Yeah, do it Like my friend. Nadia, she went to NIDA.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:And when I learnt that, I was like cool, let's rehearse together. Yeah, totally, totally, yeah, and I learnt so much from her. She taught me all about stagecraft and script analysis it was like I might as well soak this up, you know, yeah.
Speaker 1:And there's so much to learn in acting because it's a subjective field.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:That means there are infinite ways to do it. Yeah, and there are so many experts in the field. There are so many talented and intelligent people. Yeah, Like there's. I feel like I'm just always learning. Yeah, I Like there's. I feel like I'm just always learning, Like I'm always like any set I go on. I think I said this to you when we were on doing just a stills shoot. I was like Chris, how do you break down a script? What do you do? Well, how do you?
Speaker 4:learn lines, Because I'm always curious. That's why it's important to have these conversations. I think Well for me at least Again that's not advice. You know you don. Everywhere I go, I'm trying to learn what I can from the people that I meet.
Speaker 1:I feel that and that's why I love. I actually really love these days because I didn't go to a traditional like three-year drama school and because I don't take I'm not always doing regular classes, but what I do is I try and go to as many workshops with a really diverse array of really talented and interesting and like just really people I can learn from. You know, because I don't know anything, I just want to learn from other people. But everybody uses different techniques, yeah, and I pull upon so many different ones in different moments.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And the ones that resonate better with me and the ones that don't, but like I learn from them all you know, so I love doing you know courses and things and just like picking people's brains.
Speaker 4:Yeah, me too.
Speaker 1:Reading and watching yeah, interviews and things.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know, yeah. And also workshops are good because you actually get to get feedback.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, invaluable Doing advice, advice to young actors. Go to workshops where you can get feedback, go to ones where you have acting teachers or actors who work in it, but also go to ones that are run by casting directors who will? Cast you in roles. Yes, you will get two different types of advice.
Speaker 1:Often the casting directors also act yeah so like they also have great acting advice, but they can also give you advice on like, the business side of things, and also acting is a weird mix of it's so craft driven, but there are things that are so anti-craft that also make it work.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:You know where. It's like craft driven in, like trying to be, like becoming, you know being a character and being present and being in the moment, but I would say, for example, a lot of stillness. That's not supernatural.
Speaker 1:Like a lot of characters, a lot of people. When you look at them, they don't. There are a lot of things that feel really unnatural, that read really well on camera. Yeah, and you need to learn to keep the essence of like the natural thing while doing the unnatural thing and a casting director will say, hey, man, like you lick your lips a lot, or you like raise your eyebrows a lot, or like you know, there are lots of little things that are like a technical note is like you know, do a little look before you exit the scene, or like there are so many different things that they will pick up on that will improve your skills.
Speaker 4:So I love doing both and that's all important stuff to sort of practice outside of a job, because you can't be learning that stuff on the job. I mean you can, but I feel it's a really good opportunity to make all those mistakes outside of the job when you're like workshops are like to me like a rehearsal you know, Totally.
Speaker 4:Yeah, you know learning things about how you hold yourself If you, you know, lick your lips a lot during a scene or you kind of do this swaying thing on your feet when you're talking or something on your feet when you're talking or something, and those are the environments where you become self-aware of those things and try to eliminate them before you get to a set.
Speaker 1:Yeah, totally.
Speaker 4:Because you can't be learning that stuff on the day.
Speaker 1:No, do you know what? Actually A really big learning curve for me, god, I feel like I've said that so many times. So good luck editing this together, chris. No, that's all right. This is going to be a hot mess, but you know what actually I'm?
Speaker 4:not cutting any of that out, oh shit.
Speaker 1:I think there was a really distinct moment in my career where I changed my approach. At first I was purely like I need to be in the moment, I need to be this character, and that was awesome. But then I would do takes and I would go on set and I would do things and I'd be like, oh, why isn't it reading? I was so heartbroken, I was weeping, why didn't it look right? Why wasn't I? Why did that not read in the way that it felt in the moment? And it's because there are all these little things that get in the way in the way of a visual representation of something. And so I started doing scenes at home and taping them and watching them yeah, great, and being like, oh, I was really feeling it. But also, xyz was happening.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I think, to be fair, that's where a lot of I know that traditional drama school, a lot of it is learning to break down your characteristics, the things like that that get in the way of things, whether it's your tics or whether it's nervous habits that come up or just other things that just get in the way of visual representation, of emotional conversation or whatever it is. Yeah, and then they try and sort of rebuild you as you know, someone who can play anything.
Speaker 3:That's what I've heard Apparently, who knows?
Speaker 4:Apparently that's what goes on in there. That's what I've heard. Who knows, who knows?
Speaker 1:Not me. Yeah, I'm not educated, but I think that was my way of like getting past that was learning to like I was. I feel like I couldn't, I was getting in the way of myself. I was not fully present. And then I'd be like wow, but that looked like I was. What are the commonalities?
Speaker 3:What are the?
Speaker 1:things on both sides that made me made it read better.
Speaker 4:I think that's what I like about self-taping, or since we had to start self-taping. It sort of forced us to get into the habit of filming yourself. Being your own director Suddenly yeah, suddenly you're watching yourself back and going oh, is that what I do? Yeah, I didn't know that, and so you do sort of naturally develop these physical habits to make sure that you're still or something or I don't know, not mouth breathing or something you know, yeah all sorts, or even just being really aware of the camera and where the camera is.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:Jack actually on the Asylum film. He was really wonderful for that because we were shooting under such time pressures Often there are so many. He was like a big piece of advice is always being really, really mindful of all of the little things in terms of like knowing exactly your best angle. He would do things where he'd be like move your face just like a few millimeters this way because the light will catch the further eye and that will like just really little. You know technical things where it's like you're going to look that little bit more engaging, yeah, if you're just a bit more aware of the camera itself. Yeah, and the lighting itself.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And the motion and the movement. Yeah, and that is such a big thing I know a lot of. I saw who was it. It was some actor talking about how amazing Jack Nicholson is with knowing the lens and understanding the lens.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I think that's a big thing that I want to improve in. Well, that's something.
Speaker 4:I've loved about doing self-tapes and like buying a camera with interchangeable lenses and playing with that yeah totally I wonder how this will look or feel if I can play with this lens here and you know move into this angle and, you know, Totally Just getting my head around all that sort of things. I think it's helped me a lot with my performances.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:But also with that, with being on set and understanding you know how your eyes are catching the light, or all those minute little movements and blocking being okay, with sort of having a quiet word to the DOP and saying I mean, the series I did the other day we had two cameras and it was really great because the director would give us all the sort of crafty kind of direction and the character direction and then I'd have these two DOPs that were kind of competing for blocking.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:They were working so well together. You know, he wanted to. One guy wanted me to sort of start moving at this point so that he could sort of track them, the lead actors, and then then end up on me at this at this point. But then the other guy wanted me to end up in this point, um, at this time on this line, and stuff, or move out of the way on this line so that he can, he can, you know pull focus on the, on the person playing.
Speaker 4:I'm playing opposite, so you got all that going through your head as you're taking on all the direction from the director. Yeah, but realising that it's okay to have those little conversations with the DOP as well, or just being curious like, yeah, am I catching the light on this in this spot?
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:And what looks best, and they will tell you as well. Yeah, I think it's a mix of that.
Speaker 1:It's a mix of learning enough that it can be, you can have, so you're not focusing on it, but it's there and you have an understanding and trusting in the team around you to do that for you. Yeah, they'll tell you.
Speaker 4:But also opening up the dynamic in the group to say I am willing to have these conversations. You can tell me this shit, I'll take direction from you, this kind of direction from you, and I'll take this kind of direction from you, but making sure that the conversation is open and you're willing to take that direction.
Speaker 1:Do you want to know a tip that I have for a socially anxious person? If you're too scared to ask, say the DOP is really busy and they look stressed and the director is really stressed and you don't want to say anything.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Best case scenario be Chris Ask. Ask and start a duologue. Second best case scenario have a friend on set not an actual friend like a crew member that you are comfortable talking to, who has a monitor, and have an eyeline with them. Like, say, you have a scripty friend who has a little monitor and you can quickly say like where's the frame?
Speaker 1:And then, they can quickly, you know, give it your way, because I think most of the time you can ask, and it's wonderful, but there are also times where it's like you're running out of time. Yeah, you know, there are also times where it's like you're running out of time. Yeah, you know, they're over budget. Things are stressful, people are stressed and you don't really want to add to that stress.
Speaker 1:No so sometimes it's nice to be able to just like be aware of the people who have monitors. Yeah, Just give a quick like mouth off to the side Like hey, man, like where is?
Speaker 4:That's why it's important to introduce yourself to everyone on set. Yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1:Like they're really cool people. I feel like great, like the best people, yeah, better than actors.
Speaker 4:Yeah, by the end of like, I'll do one day on set and I'll be best friends with everyone, but I've got, I feel comfortable to have that dialogue with everyone yeah and if, if the dp or director is, you know, preoccupied with something else, yeah, you've got the, the ad or the or the scripty, or the or the focus puller just to be like oh yeah, am I in? Where's what's my what's?
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah totally yeah, I think also not to talk about it again. I just had a great time doing it and also it was pretty recent, um, but when I was doing it was the first time I've ever done stand-in work.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And I've never done that before. I've only ever really like acted.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:But it was like first of all I've worked with Danny before on that like ARG thing a million years ago. Oh, right yeah, and he like, he like directed that and like co-created that and he's so awesome to work with and he's so fun and just like wild and cool and creative. Yeah, um, but also it was a.
Speaker 1:I was like this is what an opportunity to like, learn and grow from like a really amazing person yeah but the cool thing was it was actually also a really good lesson and like hitting marks and stuff, because I would come in and run the scene before sally would so the camera could yeah, you know could practice hitting the marks because it was really dynamic camera movements and lots of really crazy rigs and things where they wanted to test out motions.
Speaker 1:Like you know, for those who've seen it, the circle yeah and they had a really cool crazy camera rig that followed the hand and they got me because I have similar proportions to like test out how big a circle should do for their arm and things like that, but it was really, really cool to be able to do that and to focus on like first of all you know it's fun. I would just pretend to be Laura, yeah, and like read, because you get the sides and quickly read the sides in the morning, and then I'd go and like do my best, laura, impersonation and act and run through the scene.
Speaker 1:But also to practice just hitting all of the marks.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:On like technical things where it's like you know, there's a scene where, for example, she has, um, she's locked everybody out of the bedroom and she comes in, she ties up her hair, she walks in, she hits one thing. There's like ollie on the bed. You know she's walking around, she's doing all these things and it was just good practice to be able to like pretend to be laura for a moment and like low stakes yeah, hit all the I think yeah every opportunity is a good opportunity to practice the craft.
Speaker 1:Absolutely you know no matter what, and it's just fun.
Speaker 3:So fun. I just love doing it yeah, me too.
Speaker 4:Yeah, so good.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:So okay. So what's coming up for you?
Speaker 1:Well, this year, so earlier this year, I shot a beautiful little short film with Lily Drummond that's coming out later this year, called the Bear Hunt, and it was so wonderful and it was like the most beautiful wholesome time. Yep, I also am shooting a feature later this year, which is very exciting.
Speaker 3:Hell yeah, exciting, yes, which is a very different vein.
Speaker 1:It's like a horror thriller, psychological thriller. So like the opposite. The other one was more like a heartwarming family comedy Nice Coming of age, beautiful, wholesome piece. This one is like more high stakes. Can you say what it is? Or is this all?
Speaker 4:NDAs Don't say what it? Is. It's something really fun.
Speaker 3:Great.
Speaker 4:But okay. So when we are able to find out what it is, where can we find you on social so we can keep up with everything you're doing?
Speaker 1:You can find me at Lauren Coop on Instagram. Instagram Lauren Coop.
Speaker 4:K-O-O-P.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Lauren underscore Coop, I think Is it. God, I'm shit Did you check? That. Yeah, Lauren underscore Coop. Say that again Lauren underscore Coop. I want to specify for viewers, if you choose to keep this in, Chris, that it has taken me. We've done two takes of me trying to say my Instagram handle and I've had to have multiple goes at getting it out of my mouth.
Speaker 4:You're not the only one.
Speaker 1:No, but what I mean is I'm so bad at socials. This is actually maybe the area I could improve my game the most in acting.
Speaker 4:Plugging yourself, plugging myself on socials.
Speaker 1:I'm so bad at it.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm like horrifically bad at it. So yeah, that's fine, that's follow me.
Speaker 4:Well, it's because you're actually asking, yeah, you're actually asking something from people now, yeah, which I don't like it.
Speaker 3:It goes against everything we believe in about ourselves or if you want, you can follow me, I don't care.
Speaker 1:More importantly, everybody should be listening to Go, Pluck Yourself. Yeah and follow. Is it featuring Chris Gunn?
Speaker 4:Featuring Chris Gunn is my Instagram. Yes, featuring underscore Chris. Underscore Gunn with one N. Thank you very much. Anyone that wants to credit me in anything and give me double Ns yeah bastards, you heard it here first and go pluck yourself pod.
Speaker 1:I love the name very fun, man.
Speaker 4:Thanks so much for having me oh dude, this was amazing oh, it's so fun you've got a great voice, by the way oh, thank you.
Speaker 1:So do you? No, I don't, yeah, no, that's my worst asset?
Speaker 4:what?
Speaker 1:nah, I hate my voice. Nah, I don't want to do this.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, yeah I mean when I sing it's better, but like my speaking voice, you've got a great speaking voice.
Speaker 1:You're so articulate. I love doing voiceover work.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:It is so much fun and I would love to do more of it. It's just, it's the best, it's a good time.
Speaker 4:I feel like we've only just scratched the surface on things to talk about. Yeah, you're coming back, right?
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, hell yeah, love that Cool Anytime you want to hear me ramble.
Speaker 4:Thanks so much, man.
Speaker 1:Thanks. Oh, my God the best.
Speaker 2:How good was that. We had to stop eventually, but I feel like we could have chatted for hours and hopefully she comes back and we can keep chatting. It's, you know, such an intelligent actor. Yeah, I could pick our brains for hours. If you're enjoying the show, the best way you can support it is by hitting follow or subscribe on whatever platform you're listening or watching on. And hey, if you really like what I'm doing here and this podcast fires you up creatively or makes you feel a little less alone in your creative endeavors and you feel like shouting me a pint well, I don't drink, but you can buy me a hypothetical beer by signing up to the patreon. Patreoncom.
Speaker 2:Slash go pluck yourself. Pod. Theme music is by my very talented cousin, nick gunn. You can check him out at soundcloud soundcloudcom slash nick gunn. He's a genius. Thank you so much for listening, guys. I'll be back next week with another excellent episode. If you haven't caught, go check out the other episodes. There's some real gold in there, guys. Okay, guys, happy acting. Break a leg. Break both your legs. I'll see you next week. I hope you land that role. My name is Chris Gunn and hey, go pluck yourself.