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The Flourish Feed Podcast
A series of curiosity driven deep dives into the nature of flourishing through wealth.
The Flourish Feed Podcast
#24 - The Art of Money Episode
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In this insightful interview, Gillian hosts Carl Richards, a world-renowned financial philosopher and sketch artist. They explore the emotional and narrative aspects of money, the power of visual storytelling, and how understanding these elements can transform financial decision-making. This is a truly powerful episode about how stories shape our relationship with money, the role of simplicity in complex financial concepts, and the potential of artificial intelligence to enhance human connection – and depth - in finance and in life.
Enjoy more of Carl Richards' Sketches and Books by visiting https://behaviorgap.com/ and be sure to check out Your Money: Reimagining Wealth in 101 Simple Sketches here:
Takeaways
🎨Visual stories help bypass fear and shame around money.
💸Storytelling and sketches can externalize financial problems.
🎨Money is deeply tied to emotions and personal experiences.
💸Simplifying complex financial concepts through sketches is an iterative process.
🎨Stories shape financial markets and cultural perceptions.
💸AI and automation can enhance human conversations and creativity.
🎨Authenticity and depth are crucial in financial advice.
Quotes
“Money really is nothing but a collective story that we’ve all agreed to.”
“You’re taught that money is math, and then you’re surprised when two plus two equals envy or greed.”
“This is not math here. This is feelings.”
“I didn’t know the dollar symbol was a provocative symbol — that it actually provokes feeling.”
“What I was after was clarity — the simplicity that lives on the other side of complexity.”
“The market for feeling productive is orders of magnitude larger than the market for being productive.”
“The specific investment decisions are downstream artifacts of getting clear about what you really want.”
“When your circle of concern is bigger than your circle of influence, you become paralyzed.”
“The art of money is about connection… and depth.”
Chapters
00:00 The Power of Story in Finance
03:00 Emotions and Money: A Complex Relationship
05:54 The Impact of Personal Experiences on Financial Perception
08:36 The Art of Simplifying Complex Financial Concepts
11:52 Cultural Influences on Money Perception
14:40 The Role of Media in Financial Decision-Making
17:44 Crafting Meaningful Financial Conversations
20:29 The Future of Money: Self-Driving Finances
23:17 The Art of Money: Connection and Depth
26:29 Moments of Bliss and Personal Reflections
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Connect with Gillian:
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https://flourishfamilywealth.com/
The Flourish Feed Podcast, a series of curiosity-driven deep dives into the nature of flourishing through wealth. I'm your host, Gillian Stoville Rivers, M A C F P C E A, Senior Wealth Advisor at CIA Sante Wealth Management.
SPEAKER_00The allocation and investment, specific investment decisions, are downstream artifacts of getting clear about what you really want. And it's not the other way around. If you try, and and this is most people, the way they invest money, is it's not linked to what their values and goals, it's linked to what somebody in some investment policy person said in London, what they read on CNBC. The really smart people will say it in hushed tones that they read it in The Economist, like nobody else had. And man, things don't move as much there.
SPEAKER_01Money problems are rarely solved by information. They're resolved when people see themselves differently. Story, especially visual story, bypasses fear, shame, and defensiveness and moves people into flow, where better decisions about money, time, energy, and attention become possible. In this episode, I talked to the New York Times money artist himself, the sketch guy, Carl Richards, to discuss when this happens, why this is, and how it's worked for him. But then we expand the discussion to include what might be possible through other forms of storytelling. One of the most powerful psychological tools we have is something called externalizing the problem. The idea that we are not the problem, the problem is the problem. When we give our challenges a story, a character, or a shape, we create just enough distance to see clearly, to reduce shame, and to regain agency. Money might be the area of life where we need this the most. So many of us don't struggle with money because we're bad at math, but because money lives inside a story about fear, success, scarcity or worth that we've never paused to examine. This episode is called The Art of Money, because today we're exploring how story, and in Carl's case, visual story, moves us into flow with money and with the deeper forms of wealth that matter most our time, our energy, our attention, and our lives. But first, let's get to know Carl a bit. Carl Richards started the sketch guy column in the New York Times from the hills of Utah, crafting clear, relatable insights about money with just cardstock and a Sharpie. The column ran weekly for a decade. This journey began when Carl applied for what he thought was a job as a security guard, only to find out the ad actually said securities. And that slight misstep sparked a lifelong dedication to reshaping how we think about money. Since then, Carl has become a certified financial planner, built and sold a successful investment firm, and spoken at financial and investment events worldwide, from Australia to South Africa, the UK, and major economic centers across Europe, Canada, and the United States. His bestsellers, The Behavior Gap and the One Page Financial Plan, have been translated into over 10 languages and continue to resonate globally. His latest book, Your Money, Reimagining Wealth, in 101 Simple Sketches, came out in October of 2025. It's a collection of 101 sketches and essays designed to spark real conversations about money. Through his daily podcast, Behavior Gap Radio, which now has over 1,300 episodes, 1,300 episodes and over 1 million downloads. Carl shares new perspectives on aligning our resources with what truly matters. His latest audio project, 50 Fires, backed by executive producers Chip and Joanna Gaines, explored the intersections of money and meaning with guests like Pete Holmes, David White, Krista Tippett, and his favorite guest by far, his wife Corey. Carl founded the Society of Advice, of which I am a member, a community of financial planners dedicated to the craft of advice. They gather for a monthly online workshop and frequent retreats in Park City, Utah. When he's not exploring ideas about money, Carl is a wilderness first responder, and he can be found navigating Utah's high mountain ridges on foot, skis, or a bike. Married to Corey since 1995, they have four kids whom they consider their best friends. Honestly, sir, when your office said yes to this podcast, I knew I was on to something big. Right up front, thank you so much. Carl Richards, welcome to the Flourish Feed Podcast.
SPEAKER_00I've been so what the right word is gratified, humbled by the conversations that we've been having lately. This book has been generating. So thank you for having me.
SPEAKER_01Fantastic. I mean, as a number of my favorite authors have written about, amongst them you, you know, humans are the only species we know of that can cooperate at scale because we believe in story. Stories about money and value and meaning and who we are. And this has really always stuck with me because I believe practically I've seen that most people don't struggle with money because they don't know enough. They struggle because money lives in an emotional part of the brain, a narrative part of the brain, which is exactly what you're the master of. So when did you realize that story and images were reaching people in a way that spreadsheets couldn't?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, wow, that's such a great question. Because money really is nothing but a collective story that we've all agreed to. Like money itself, right? Like all you have to do is be someplace where a currency gets devalued or something changes to realize like, wow, this was this is this is just a collective story, a very useful collective story in terms of the collective story. But on an individual level, it's so funny to me because it took me for a long time to figure out why this was. Because money, if if if you're taught anything about it growing up, you're normally taught that in the math department or maybe the or maybe accounting class. And so you expect money to be this rational experience, you know, that two plus two will, you know, it always equals four.
SPEAKER_01Right. There's a rule to it.
SPEAKER_00And then you're yeah, it doesn't matter how you feel about it. Two plus two equals four. And then you're surprised when with money, two plus two can equal envy or or or greed. And so I I think I first noticed that early on in my because I got I got started in the financial sort of business quite by mistake. Um, I just applied for a job that I didn't understand what it was and ended up at Fidelity Investments Big National Call Center. And that was right before uh Netscape went public. And I remember walking onto the trading floor to answer phone calls that day when Netscape, and most of your, I mean, some of your audience will remember Netscape, but I think a lot of them will.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. So short version of the story is Nets when Netscape IPO'd, they originally priced at$12 a share and delayed opening because there was so much demand and repriced at 24, closed that day at 76. And that was my first day on the phones on the sort of trading floor. And I remember walking onto that floor, and you know, out of like the training room where everything made sense and it was spreadsheet and math, you walk on the trading floor, and there's I just remember being unmoored. I didn't make a grand conclusion. I just remember thinking, this is not pandemonium. Yeah, this is not this is not math here. So it was that kind of experience that kept me, despite getting into the profession by accident, that that kept me there because I had to figure out like what is this thing that's supposed to be math but is really feelings.
SPEAKER_01So it's it becomes this place where if it is a feeling, and oftentimes, you know, you can have a positive or a negative feeling. You can feel fear, you can feel love, you can feel moving towards a goal or moving away from a threat. Why do you think it's such a tough topic for people to stay open and curious about? It causes retreat more than it causes forward motion until it does, and then there's definitely a flow to money. But why do you think it's got that polarizing effect on people?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I I think it's I mean, I'll give you an interesting experience I've had lately. I've been traveling in the country um speaking to small and large groups, and one of the exercises I've been doing is just having everybody like pause for and we could even do it here with your listeners. Like if you just sort of settle in for a minute, and then I'm gonna I'm gonna here I'm gonna describe something. I'm gonna like describe me drawing an image up on the up on your the board in front of you. So as you're listening, we used to do this all the time with MPR, like art on the radio. So imagine you're in a big room, imagine it's just actually just Jillian, you and I, and we have a piece of paper, and I say, look, I'm gonna draw something on this piece of paper, and I want you to notice the first feeling you have. And then, and I've done this in groups of over a thousand people, and then you know, groups of one, and we just settle in for a minute, right? Remember what a feeling is, right? Like and I draw a dollar sign, just the US dollar symbol. And it has been, and and you know, maybe people listening can just sort of settle in for a second. Like, what's what is the first feeling you notice? It has been unbelievable to hear the stories because these feelings are like sometimes they're happy. Like I had one person write down love with 17 exclamation marks. But Jillian, even that's problematic. It is because we don't know, we don't know how to like are we allowed to feel positive about money? There's some wisdom. I mean, I remember reading in a very specific wisdom tradition that the love of money is the root of all evil. And so we've got like you'll talk to people who inherit a bunch of money and feel feel tremendous shame.
SPEAKER_01Interesting.
SPEAKER_00Right? And so, but then you have other people who are like fear, anxiety, worry, you know, excitement. I didn't know the dollar symbol was a provocative symbol, right? That it provokes feeling. And I think to your question, like why, is I think it was wrapped up in this undercurrent of unspoken anxiety that most of us grew up with. I mean, what was money like in your house? What do you remember? What's the first feeling you have when you see a dollar symbol?
SPEAKER_01Definitely. I uh wow, I don't even know if I can identify that feeling because there's so many feelings around that. But it money in my house was I grew up in an entrepreneurial family. So it was it was a symbol of it was a symbol of love. Like it was a symbol of being taken care of, but it was also something where we experienced highs and lows. And so sometimes there was excessive amounts of love, and sometimes there was the the sort of everyone kind of clamping down and feeling a little bit like things weren't right. Like there is a volatility feeling for me when it comes to money that I I think probably drew me to the industry because I want to take that volatility out of the human experience for people. But your question, or I suppose your observation that it comes with a feeling and it's something that we don't necessarily know how to talk about. I had a guest on the podcast earlier this week where death is kind of the same thing, right? It's like it's another taboo situation where either your experiences with it make it more real and give you a language, or you kind of go through life not really knowing how to talk about it. And I think that exercise you do where you draw the dollar symbol is super powerful. So can you take me back to maybe the first soodle that you did? What were you trying to express? I mean, that's a that is a brilliant, mature, evolved experiment with the dollar symbol, but let's go back. What were you trying to get out of that moment and and what were the words not doing to serve you?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I I'm always hesitant to make up stories about the past because we we we're so good at like making it all sound like it makes sense. So I've been really careful about this one. I I believe I rem I do remember the first time I did this because I wasn't a doodler in high school. I don't have no art background, as should be obvious to everybody who sees my work. But I remember the meeting with clients, and I think I remember who it was, but I don't exactly remember what I drew. But I remember trying to explain a concept. And these were smart, intelligent, successful clients. And I was just I was trying to explain a concept that I thought was really important to them. Sorry, it was important that they understand this so we could make this decision. And I was just getting blank stares. As I recall, it was my clients and the their names are Dave and Diane, and Dave's an emergency room doctor, and Diane was a technology sales engineer, like super smart people. And I was just getting blank stares back. And I remember that feeling of just like, oh no. And this was, I had had the blank stares before, but it had never dawned on me that it was my fault, right? In this case, I was like, wait, they're really smart. It must be me. And so it was purely out of out of an act of desperation. I was in a borrowed conference room and there happened to be a whiteboard. And I, out of an act of desperation, I stood up, I was like, no, like this. And I think it had to do with accumulation of money, saving into a 401k, saving into IRA. And then at some point we hit decumulation stage where we just reverse those arrows. So I think it was just boxes and arrows. But to answer your question, what I was after was clarity. Like what I was after was the feeling of the simplicity that lives on the other side of complexity. Not simplistic, but the simplicity that lives after you've thought of everything you think you've thought of everything. You've you've the new and I I think the reason these have resonated so much with people is money, it's not tangible. It's even more less so now, right? Like it's literally like I think it's digital. Yes, now it's like I almost don't even take my wallet with me except for my driver's license because I just do it all on my phone. So, and you add to it the feelings of fear and worry and concern to your earlier question. You know, your parents, most people listening to this, it was the same for them in their household, where it was a thing, but I could feel it, but I was never sure what it was, and nobody ever talked. And I don't think that's anybody's fault. I think we didn't, we weren't taught how to talk about it. And then even when we were taught how to talk about it, we weren't taught what to talk. It's like it's an electric fence that we didn't know was electric. Like when you touch an electric fence that you know is electric, it's like that's one thing. But when you touch a fence, an electric fence, and you didn't know it was electric, it's a completely different experience.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think that's interesting because I mean it lends itself to the conversation that we had earlier about it being a collective invention. It's a, it's a, it's something we believe in as a collective. And the fact that you are able to bring it down to boxes and arrows in order to define something that is mythological, something that is not really visible. I wonder when you look at the drawings you do now and the complexity of this world for this thing that is still quite invisible, how many iterations does it take for you to get to that simplicity, or does it come out simple the first time?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, no, there's plenty, I mean, anytime you make an attempt to, and I'm sure all your listeners will relate to this, you're like, it starts out very like, I just need to open a new bank account. Or even better, I need a new credit card. It's like such a simple, if I was drawing this on a piece of paper, it would be this line coming from the left-hand side of the paper about in the middle horizontally. It's just a simple question. Like, I need to buy, I need to get a new credit card. And then you start, you're like, oh, well, which like which rewards thing? And which and that now you get this line starts curving around, and after a while, you're like, which rewards? And do I this and how where do I where can I use it? And do I need travel and do I need to get into the the lounge at the airport? And suddenly you're in this giant ball of yarn, you know, and that's the complexity of it all. And anytime I kind of like understanding the nuance and the edge cases, and but I get frustrated in the middle of that, as we all do. Like, have you ever tried to buy a pair of a new pair of running shoes by reading the reviews on Amazon? You don't leave with clarity. But that's maybe an important part of the research. And then there's a moment where you're like, I gotta get out of here. I gotta decide. Like, what's the stuff that matters? And you go to the other side of that ball of yarn. Whenever you do that, you're required to curate and distill and edit. And often I get that wrong, right? I I'll leave out the I'll leave out the nuance or the edge case that actually does matter. And I'll get feedback. Some of these sketches I've been working on for 20 years. Like I changed one in the writing of this book. I removed a word in one sketch that had been there for 12 years and had been bothering me. And I didn't know why. It felt like a it felt like a sliver just under the skin that you didn't know was there. Like, that's that, what's that? And and I so I changed it. So I keep getting sometimes sometimes I nail it on the first try, but most of the time it takes some revisions. And then I get the notes from people like myself. I don't get it. My seven-year-old could do this. I'm like, I you're totally right. Your seven-year-old could draw that image. But the nuance and consideration that went into getting to this other spot is maybe the result of having thousands and thousands of these kind of conversations.
SPEAKER_01Aaron Powell 100%. Because otherwise, most people would be able to choose the credit card without getting into the ball of yarn. And I think there's so many things that come at our face when we're in that state of trying to make a choice amongst a billion options. The number one of which I would say is probably that our attention span is kind of shortened up a little bit and there's a lot of things flashing in our face a lot of time, which brings me to maybe the the broader picture of cultural influence when it comes to money. I'm curious, what does the sketch guy think about other representations of money? Like when you look, when you watch, you know, a television series or a movie where you can tell that the underlying current is a discussion about the values a family has or the money a family has, what do you see? What do you think are like are there ones that stand out that are doing a great job the way that Carl Richards does a great job telling people how to relate to money?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's such a nice question. I what I mostly see is financial pornography, right? Just this hand-wavy conversations about things that absolutely don't matter and are largely just a place to hide from the stuff that does matter. You know, like if I can just watch one more video about how to deadlift, I don't have to go to the gym and actually deadlift. And so there's a lot of in fact I read this great quote the other day that the that applies here. The the market for feeling productive is orders of magnitude larger than the market for being productive.
SPEAKER_01Wow.
SPEAKER_00So I think it's really applicable to money. The the market for like which budgeting app, you know, endless or which stock or which hot investment to buy now, that market is infinitely orders of magnitude larger than the market for, you know, why don't you save a hundred bucks a month into a Vanguard S ⁇ P 500 fund or or something?
SPEAKER_01Something that's practical.
SPEAKER_00Why don't you why don't you take a note card with you every day and just write down what you spend and notice that? And so I don't see I'm not paying attention enough to popular culture around money to see, but I am gratified at the number of finance professional professionals in and even some of the personal finance thinkers that are asking these kind of questions. Like what's it really for? Why does it really matter?
SPEAKER_01And what's the system doing to us? Because when you think about it, the system is part of the problem because it is full of constant hapticks and distractions to get you to trade, because the system is going to make money on that. So there's there's definitely a systems problem. But why I asked this question is because when I attended the Society of Advice session where you had Morgan Housel on, one or both of you, I can't remember which, I think it was you though. You mentioned something about people returning to wanting to ranch, like physical work, hard work, the satisfaction of a job well done. And that really triggered my mind around shows like, I don't know if you're familiar with them, but shows like Landman or Yellowstone, where there's there's literally like a an ethos to Taylor Sheridan that is very much about Americans doing hard things. What do you recommend that we do with that as investors? Because there's definitely a lot of influences through influencers. There's influences through popular culture television shows that are either positive or negative. But then there's also the story around these market events that obviously your sketches are really designed to tackle. But how do we listen to the news or do we?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's it's interesting. I think what you're pointing to with the the the ranching comment, even is just like I I think I think there's a growing awareness of the value of craft. And I I think there's a I think people are starting. I mean, look, a huge chunk of the population is just plugged into a phone at this point, and and it's like WALL-E style, right? Like feeding tubes. What I mean, how far, how far different is Doritos and a Coke in front of your phone than a feeding tube? But there's among the other group, there's this deeper, like human connections becoming a a luxury good. You know, people wanting to spend time together, people like, can we just go to the coffee shop and chat? I think there's a there's a growing awareness of the value of that stuff. And that to me is really, I think really important. I almost feel like it's something we're fighting for, like continuing to remind us of what it feels like to feel deeply human. And I think when you get to the markets, the economy, the the news, there's just I don't think we're wi in fact, I know we're not wired for this level of our our circle of concern needs to match to some degree our circle of influence. When our circle of concern is so much bigger. Right. Then our circle of influence, we become paralyzed, and then we just decide to scroll endlessly. And so I've found myself increasingly trying to like can I volunteer at literally, you know, the the the the county jail that's two blocks away.
SPEAKER_01To have human contact, to do something.
SPEAKER_00To have human contact, also to try and make it different. Like instead of reading the news and being worried, and as far as markets go, it's like I think it's more important than ever to be really clear about why you're investing the money in the first place, why you're saving in the first place. Get really clear about that because that will drive the rest of the allocation and investment, specific investment decisions are downstream artifacts of getting clear about what you really want. And it's not the other way around. If you try, and and this is most people, the way they invest money, is it's not linked to what their values and goals, it's linked to what somebody in some investment policy person said in London, what they read on CNBC. The really smart people will say it in hushed tones that they read it in The Economist, like nobody else had. Like every time the wind blows, you're way out on the branches. And what getting clear about why you're doing it gets you really close to the trunk, maybe even close to the roots. And man, things don't move as much there.
SPEAKER_01100%.
SPEAKER_00I think getting clear about that, rather than trying to keep up with the news, I'd be like, what if I ignored the news? I got clear about why I'm doing things, and then I built my portfolio to match that.
SPEAKER_01Traditional wealth management focuses on a few key moments: your first house, sending your kids to university, when you retire, and when you die. Will you have enough? Will you die with too much or too little? These are questions of a very finite nature. Our approach goes above and beyond, with the belief that wealth is not just money, but comes in at least four forms: time, money, energy, and attention. And that wealth is a wave that you can learn to ride to a life well lived, a life where you flourished, where you surpassed the finite game of having enough, to experiencing the infinite game of playing forever. Instead of just focusing on a few of life's moments, we focus on all of the moments between the 1440 minutes of each day, the energy to be harnessed from each and every sunrise, every meal, and every great night's sleep. The power of connection and meaning that all four forms of wealth, time, energy, money, and attention can access. This is what it means to flourish. So the question is, which wealth advisor is right for you? An advisor who helps you open the door to a few of life's moments or to all of them? Consider this. In the next 24 hours, you have 1,440 minutes, and it takes just a few of them to contact me at grivers at asante.com. Doing so could be one of the best investment decisions you ever make. I love that because I think the brain actually operates differently. In fact, I know it operates differently when it's built on what you actually care about instead of what somebody else tells you to care about. I love this topic of excess mediation or excess, you know, access to media, um, especially when it comes to our role as financial advisors, because the role of AI is increasing in what we do, but that could actually also be a good thing. So since compliance and regulation, I think in your country it's probably just as heavy as it is in our country, do you see AI as a potential lever to reduce friction? If it's done the right way, what are the pitfalls? What could be the benefits? Can we be more human with AI than we could without?
SPEAKER_00I think two things about number one, I I'm trying hard to always say artificial intelligence to just remind myself of what it stands for. Although I slip all the time and just use AI because it's so much easier. But I think artificial intelligence is serving as a really incredible pointer to and it's also an it's an I I've heard the term amplifier. But one of the things it's amplifying and pointing to is the value of deep human wisdom. And I I think it's to me it doesn't feel I'm sorry, in my own personal use, it doesn't feel like a threat. I see it being a threat, potentially a threat to me and people around me, in terms of forgetting my own ability to tap into deep wisdom. But I think that um I think it's just reminding us of that split. And I believe there is a split between what a calculator can do, even a really, really sophisticated calculator, and what it means to sit by a fire and share stories. All both of those metaphorically. And so I think it's just accelerating our us remembering. And by the way, like I'm a huge fan of the idea of self-driving money. Like it'll be amazing. I don't think we're that far from it.
SPEAKER_01Self-driving money. Can you define what self-driving money is?
SPEAKER_00My bills are taken care of. My I just put a chunk of money every month in a place. I don't even have to do it, actually. My paycheck comes in, it goes over there, and all this stuff happens. And but I was in a Waymo a little while ago. One of the self-driving driving taxis. I'm telling you, it was it felt far safer than the Uber driver rider right before.
SPEAKER_01I agree. I thought I would freak out, but I didn't at all. It felt safer.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. But here's what's interesting. I still had to tell it where I wanted to go. And maybe even more importantly, if along the journey I said, oh my gosh, I didn't know that museum was on the can hey, pull over, right? And and so I think the metaphor holds for self-driving money. Like I want all that stuff to be taken care of.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. I think it could give us more capacity for the things you're talking about, for the fireside chat, for the volunteering, et cetera.
SPEAKER_00Totally. I still have to tell it where to point me.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no kidding. This leads to another little thesis I have. Maybe it's a passion, it's a thesis, whatever, which is that with all of those self-driving money, self-driving car things in our lives, it would actually free up, like you say, to go deeper human wisdom. In my words, I say deeper creativity. So my curiosity is that I think to this point, advisors like me may not have had the time to practice advice the way you do it because of excessive compliance and of, you know, things that should be automated. But if those things become automated and now we have capacity, we have the space to have deeper conversations, deeper wisdom, more creativity, cool ways of discussing tough stuff. And I'm curious to know if you have seen that shift already start taking place amongst the advisors you work with and even in being accepted by the clients they take care of.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, for sure. I mean, you're so this, you know, I probably for at least 10 years, I've been people used to say, Hey, Carl, can you help us? We need to, like they would say the the head of global advice at the one of the largest wealth management firms in the world that you would definitely recognize said to me once, our people are incredibly technically comp, like the best in the world. They don't know how to talk to humans, was his language. And people used to say to me all the time, can you come do that thing? And they would use their hands. Can you come do that thing? But and now I can see it happening where people are now like, hey, can you come help us with the art of connection, the craft of conversation, you know, like helping us understand emotional intelligence. We're getting, we're it's starting to get that thing that I used to do with my hands now, it starts to have a bunch more form. And we're getting to the point now where we're like, look, we can, like, I can help. So yes, I'm seeing, in fact, it's almost daily now where I'm getting I'm getting requests from advisors, advisory firms saying, hey, we want to help our clients on a deeper level because we can now. And not only we can, we almost feel like it's a it's a a business necessity to help them on a deeper level. And so yes, it's it's it's a it's amazing to me. It's all coming around, which is great.
SPEAKER_01That is. I have a couple questions left. Uh this episode I have entitled The Art of Money. And I wondered if you would give us uh take a stab at finishing this sentence.
SPEAKER_00The art of money is really about the first word that came to mind was connection. But I quickly I want to say connection or conversation. I think really good financial decisions are can only be made in conversation. And I think the the art of money and then I had one more thought, which was depth, and I don't know what that's about, but like the art of money is about depth, like getting getting I I often will rub my fingers together, and it I realized the other day what it was because I was at the beach, and I I for the longest time I've been taking I've been pinching sand and rubbing my fingers together until there was just one grain left. And I realized that's sort of what we're trying to do in these conversations is like get down to the thing.
SPEAKER_01The granular, what this person really oh, it's that, it's that.
SPEAKER_00And you're like, oh, that time when my parents in my entrepreneurial family, it was man, it was highs and lows. And I can I have lots of close friends and even a a a wife that can relate to your story. And you're like, oh, it's it's like that's the thing. So I think and how did that happen? It happened in a conversation.
SPEAKER_01I like depth. I'm going with that. That might be my favorite answer because it speaks to that authenticity of what the money's for for that person. That's the grain of salt. That, you know, maybe where the pain was, where the relationship is, where the feeling is. That is a beautiful, beautiful story, sir. This is the last question. One of the things I ask my guests on every episode of the Flare Speed podcast has to do with something called the moment of bliss. You have 1,440 minutes every single day. You look forward to, you seek out, you notice, one or two that light your heart up, make your heart sing, cause you to feel like the world is a wonderful place. Carl Richards, what is your moment of bliss?
SPEAKER_00Well, at risk of sounding insanely cheesy, it's I noticed this this morning. Like the Yeah, sorry, I the the first time I see this this is ridiculously cheesy. The first time I see my wife walk downstairs after I've been like, and she'd been gone for a couple of days, so maybe it's a little heightened. But I just remember thinking this morning, like, this is the greatest thing. And and and I can apply that to my my kids, my adult kids, but it's there's a a a close second, which is moving outside, moving generally uphill outside. But it's it's not a close, sorry, it's a distant second to that moment when I have that connection with. I remember that experience for the last 30 years of my life. Like every once in a while just being like, I can't believe I get to spend my life with that person. So sorry for being overly sentimental, but that's what it is. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Not at all. It is a a deep reflection of what why you do what you do, right? And why you pursue what you pursue is to is to be the best you you can be for the people that matter the most to you. And and we're extremely grateful for that because it's not just math, it's about building a muscle and it's about building relationships and having conversations and and going to depth, which is remarkable. I am so grateful for this time that we've been able to spend together today.
SPEAKER_00Well, thanks, Julian. That was that was really, really fun. Thanks for asking those questions.
SPEAKER_01Thank you. Join me next week on the Flourish Feed Podcast to keep exploring the infinite game. In the meantime, remember to stay curious, turn your passions into purpose, and play hard. I'm rooting for you. This program was prepared by Gillian Stovell Rivers, who was a senior wealth advisor with CI Asante Wealth Management. This is not an official program of CI Asante Wealth Management, and the statements and opinions expressed during this podcast do not necessarily reflect those of CI Asante Wealth Management. This show is intended for general information only and may not apply to all listeners or investors. Please obtain professional financial advice or contact Gillian to discuss your particular circumstances prior to acting on the information presented.