After Leaving the Mennonite World: Heartbreak, Isolation, and Learning to Overcome Depression (Part 2 of 4)

#7: In Part 2 of this powerful four-part series, Ruthie opens up about the painful realities she faced after walking away from the Mennonite community. Cut off from her family, with no money, no ID, and almost no life skills for the outside world, she had to figure out how to survive on her own.

She shares the heartbreaking story of what she thought was love — only to discover how vulnerable she was after years of isolation and control. Ruthie speaks honestly about the deep loneliness, the struggle to earn money and build a life from scratch, and the crushing depression that followed.

This episode dives into the long, messy aftermath of leaving a high-control religion: the identity crisis, the grief of lost family, romantic heartbreak, and how she has slowly learned to manage and overcome depression.

Raw, vulnerable, and ultimately hopeful, this conversation shines a light on the hidden challenges ex-Plain community members face when stepping into freedom. Listener discretion is advised due to themes of depression, emotional abuse, and suicidal ideation.

Part 2 of 4 — Subscribe now so you don’t miss the rest of Ruthie’s journey toward healing and freedom.

Suggested Hashtags:

#ExMennonite #LeavingMennonite #ReligiousTrauma #FaithDeconstruction #ExAmish #HighControlReligion #CultSurvivor #DepressionRecovery #HeartbreakAfterCult #SurvivorStory #SpiritualAbuse #ShakenUnfiltered

To watch the show click here

To connect on TikTok click here

To connect on Instagram click here

To email Shaken & Unfiltered hosts, send messages to shaken@unfilteredpod.com

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

Shaken and Unfiltered. Welcome to Shaken and Unfiltered, a cocktailed conversation where two longtime girlfriends, one Gen X and one millennial, sip, swear, and spill the kind of midlife truths that you only hear after two martinis. Slightly stirred, but always serve straight up. Well, we're excited to share that our next guest was so fascinating that we had to extend this beyond just one episode. So Lindsay and I are proud to share that we are dropping our very first mini-series, a four-part interview with our guest Ruthie Gale, author of Call Me Before You Go. Welcome back to part two with our ongoing series with our friend Ruthie Gale. That's a lot of information for the first chapter of your life, which is just the first chapter, right? So childhood, your experiences, transition from being part of the Amish community, then to Mennonite, and then Nicole, yes, and then trying to venture out beyond that. So then you were saying that um being a waitress and trying to like embark in a professional world. And so, like, what were those next steps for you as you kind of like ventured out on your own?

SPEAKER_02 1:14

Um, I ended up working as a waitress for a few years, and then I actually got a call from a a cousin of mine uh back in the Carolinas. She was in South Carolina, and she invited me, she was Mennonite, she was in a in a different Mennonite um church. Well, actually, this one probably was not as it was a pretty liberal Mennonite church. Nevertheless, I had completely ditched that way of life, and she invited me to come and do some work for them as a nanny. She was like, We need a songwriter. I've heard you do music, and so this just sounded like the perfect job uh for me where I was going with my life. I had said I would move to Nashville and pursue my songwriting. And you're how old at this age? Um, I think I was 21, 22, maybe.

SPEAKER_00 2:03

Um, and you're back with family and stuff.

SPEAKER_02 2:06

Yes. So it did sound appealing because it was like, I think we talked about that a little bit in the Amish culture, how that even when they sow their wild oats, there's such a strange burger. Yeah, Rumspringer. Rumspring, Rome Spring. You were close. You were close, Rumsburger. Um Rumsburger. I love it. Um so there is this aspect of community that I had been longing for. And, you know, my family kind of, you know, they just didn't talk to me during time. Yeah, they they really did. Um, you know, later I found out that they were my dad had told my sisters they can't talk to me. Like they didn't want my bad influence. Um so it was appealing, and I said yes. So I move moved into South Carolina. We um I was a part of their traveling band, we went to prisons, and I mostly ended up just babysitting. Like it was a full, full-blown babysitting job. Um, while and this that's where I met my husband. And um he would drive the bus and we'd be out on the road. And I mean, literally nine or ten months of of that. And he was Mennonite as part of this church always. Always Mennonite, yes. Um, he had just left the Mennonite church in Kentucky where he was from. So he was kind of fresh out of that culture. Had that maybe that bonding connection, right? Yeah, and he just took an interest in me, and I thought, oh my gosh, I'm on my way to Nashville. Like, I cannot be bothered with type of a Mennonite boy who is just fresh out of the Mennonites, too. Like he was not cultured right at all yet.

SPEAKER_00 3:31

At this point, were you like drinking alcohol? Were you thinking? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:36

You're watching all the TV shows, like I was full-on in the world, so to speak, by this point. So I don't even know what possessed me to say yes, because when I went to this, when I joined this group, um, they she my cousin sat me down after I got there and she was like, no, you're gonna need to wear skirts, you know, these are the rules of the so they were under this umbrella of um their ministry was under a larger organization and that was their rules. Yeah, um, and I didn't know that. I had to put a covering back on on my head, and I had completely not I mean, I had left that whole thing. Right. Was that so I was coming in.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

Was that kind of triggering or did you come to the other side of the colour?

SPEAKER_02 4:15

I wouldn't say triggering rolled into it. It felt, it felt in some ways a little bit like I was going back, but it was such a different Mennonite culture that I was like, it's liberal, it's like you just have to wear this little thing on your head, it's really not a big deal. But there were other things then that showed up that like they didn't allow my husband and I at the time, they didn't allow us to see each other. Like we were not supposed to date, so of course we were the rebels that were like, we love each other. And so yeah, I just there were many times that I thought, you know, I'm either gonna fall in love with this boy or I'm gonna hate him by the end of this because we're literally like in the front of the bus. I would be sitting in the what did they call that seat in the front? Bitch.

SPEAKER_01 4:59

Oh, isn't it like a jump seat? That's probably not the jump seat.

SPEAKER_02 5:02

Is it like one of your listeners will reveal like they will know what I'm talking about. But anyway, I would sit up front, the rest of everybody would go to bed or whatever, and we just have these long conversations into the night, and he'd take an interest in me and where had where I had come from and all that. So we fell in love.

unknown 5:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:21

So as people do when they're on a bus together. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 5:24

So if you weren't supposed to connect or date, then what did dating or what did meeting like a potential partner, husband, wife look like it was in that church?

SPEAKER_02 5:32

Well, it wasn't really just the church, it was the organization. Organization. So because we were part of this ministry, they didn't want us to be distracted, I guess. I mean, it kind of makes sense now, but they were just very, they did not work with us at all. And we were we were so honest with them. We went to them and we were like, hey, you know, we're having feelings for each other. Like you did what you're doing. It's an innocent thing. Like, yeah, but and so they just cracked down and were like, you can't do that while you're with this. So I quit the ministry. And I ended up quitting before my time was up. Did they view this as kind of like a mission?

SPEAKER_01 6:04

Like you're you if you're on this path, you're on a mission. So your mission is this, it's not to be distracted from.

SPEAKER_00 6:08

Right. It was a distraction. Okay, if you were gonna date norm, like in the normal um Mennonite culture, it was okay to date. Yes. Okay, in that culture for sure. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 6:17

They were definitely okay with dating. Okay. It was just this organization. They didn't want two people that were on the same ministry together to have that um conflict of interest, maybe. Yeah. Um, which I understand now, but so we got married in the Carolinas. By that point, we had moved to North Carolina, which it wasn't far, you know, we were right on that state line. And we um we lived there for a while and then we moved to Nashville, Tennessee for me to be able to pursue my songwriting career. So fun. And the funny thing is, I was always so dead set on this path to Nashville. Like, even when I lived in in Colorado still, um, I I would always just kind of use that on men. Like, I'm this is what I'm don't even get attached because I'm going to Nashville. And I remember when I first said that to my my to be husband, husband to be. Yeah. Um, he was like, Well, I'm from there. And I was like, wait, I thought you were from Kentucky. And he's like, Well, Nashville is like our town. I mean, we're in Kentucky, but we go to Nashville and I work in Nashville. And I'm like, What? Okay. Serendipitous. My little my little attempt at wording him off would did not work. So yeah, we got married um in June of 2004, I believe it was. That seems like so long ago.

SPEAKER_00 7:31

Is Nashville like this? Is shocking to me. I did not know this about you, but like you're such a mix of like Dolly and Megan Moroney.

SPEAKER_02 7:38

You know, like you're like those together. Dolly, Dolly is one of my favorite people on the planet. So thank you. That's a compliment. Um, yeah, so we moved there um, I think three years after we we got married and we were living in North Carolina, and then we moved to Nashville, and I um didn't really pursue my songwriting. I that's when I first found out about the cheating.

SPEAKER_03 8:01

Oh.

SPEAKER_02 8:02

And those first years, and my dad died right before we moved. Um, so it was just such big life a big, such a big life change in trauma that I was in for a long time. Did you get a reconnect with your dad before he died? I did. Oh god. I did. Um I think I said in the last episode, um, we talked about, you know, just how I did have a chance to talk to him about some of the things that had really been um hurtful, you know, in my childhood and growing up. And he was really sweet and he made those things right. And I actually got to go to Mexico to be his caretaker when he was down there. So they he went to this alternative medicine place down there, and they would always uh require that a caretaker comes and is there for the duration of the treatment. So I went down there I think two or three times, and I was the one in the family that could do it pretty easily. I didn't have a full-time job. I was, I didn't have kids yet, and my mom needed to stay home with the two my two siblings that were still living at home. So it worked out great, and we really bonded during that time. I would say that's when I really felt like I got close to him, right before he died, which that's kind of the the sad part of that story.

SPEAKER_01 9:14

In the book, it sounded like um you were able to have that moment of closure too, of like reconnection, reconciliation, but also like a closing piece too. So it it at least from what you wrote, it didn't sound like there was anything that you were like woulda, coulda, shoulda, like you it was addressed and um yeah, it almost came like came to it's like full chapter close in a sense, right? Didn't you feel that way?

SPEAKER_02 9:35

It still felt unfinished a little bit, just because I I think there was still a lot left unsaid about the years that, for instance, that I was living next door, I was living in the town that they were closest to, yeah, and they just completely my family just completely disowned me during that time, didn't check on me, didn't nothing, you know. And so there were things that were still kind of like they hurt they hurt a little bit. So and I think I was looking forward though, it was I was on the the trajectory to in my mind, we were healing. We were healing, and then he died. So it's like it did feel unfinished in that way. Okay, because there was still so much that I wanted to talk about and ask him and just he like can we just give this off?

SPEAKER_01 10:17

It's in different stages of your life, and so yeah, that's that's a lot to go through, even just through therapy, right? I mean, that's years of therapy. Oh right.

SPEAKER_02 10:25

And then so much of the attention had to be on him and him getting better, and so I was just so much of my energy was like caring for him by that point. So it wasn't the time to be like, hey dad. Right, you know, like there's this other thing, right? You know, I don't know. It was just so intense, and his his um cancer was so it was so fast. He died three, I want to say three or four months after he was diagnosed. So it just was so aggressive. Everything was just like sped up. We were going to Mexico all the time, and it just felt like it wasn't and I was banking on him getting better. I mean, he was a healthy guy, otherwise, we were all banking on him getting better. So I think I just didn't think in my mind that this was it. I thought he's gonna be fine and we're gonna have this amazing relationship now. Like we've bonded, we've talked about some things, things are moving in the right direction for healing.

unknown 11:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:11

So yeah, and then it's definitely still some things that felt unfinished at that time. Um, but yeah, we lived in Nashville and I was there was a point in our marriage where I was like, something is wrong. Like, I why do I feel like I'm I mean, I would go to bed and just cry, you know, and and I thought for a while it was because of my dad. You know, his death was affecting me. But then there just came a point where I was like, why do I feel like I'm not the priority to do that?

SPEAKER_01 11:41

You just have this intuition, right?

SPEAKER_02 11:44

It just didn't feel like he was really just all mine.

SPEAKER_01 11:47

Like, oh, yeah. There was a lot of things. Something just fell off. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

And so I would question him and I would be like, Something is wrong. What is what's going on? And he wouldn't tell me. And then finally he did confess one night. We were coming home from his parents' house, and he confessed to me that there was other women. While you were taking care of your dad? Um, yeah. Oh yeah. There were parts that it overlapped. Did he travel for work? I mean, was it one? He did some. Yeah. And I was always intuitively, I hated it. Yeah. And I didn't know why. I would always be like, Ruthie, get it together. Like you need to-win yourself. Yeah, you need to be okay with this. Like women, I was surrounded by women who were had their husbands on the road all the time who were touring for like big name artists. And I was like, get it together. He just leaves like every two, three months. It's fine. But we, yeah, I just kept pushing it and like something just for good reason. So then, of course, when that all came out, it was like my world completely shattered. And I just thought, I can't even trust anybody to have my back. Another betrayal. I can't trust anyone to have my back. My dad never did. Now my husband is like doing this, and I don't know what to believe. I don't know who to trust. But he was my only person at that time. I I had no friends in Nashville yet. We had not, I mean, I might have made one or two by then. But I really just was so in a just in a place of confusion at that time. In isolation. Yeah. And I was like, but I'm here to like do music, but not a bone in me could even I couldn't even scrape myself up off the floor most days. Right. And then I got pregnant with my first child. And it was just it just went from bad to worse during that time. And uh this whole time, his parents live 45 minutes away. So we we did see them quite a bit, and they would come to visit, and and there were just times that I I would be crushed and in agony, but I would still be saving face. Yeah. I would still be like a smile on and over for dinner. And well, I'm like trying to act like their son didn't just break their heart, tear the rug out from underneath me, crash my world into a million pieces. But you know, it didn't feel safe to tell his mom. I know, just was like, this is so out of there. And also, I had tried to talk about it a few times. Um, in that process, I talked to my mom, and uh I know she meant well, but she couldn't be there for me. She was like, Well, just pray for him. And that was the culture coming out in her, like that was how she was raised. And she would just encourage me to pray for him, and I'm like, Mom, he literally just cheated on me. Again. Yes, like I can't I can't just pray for him. Are you kidding me? And she'd be like, bless him and just honor him and all this stuff. And it was growing up, it made me realize this. Growing up, there is sort of this idea that if a man steps out or if a man does anything, it's probably the woman's fault. Probably. And I don't know, I mean, maybe that's not just a Mennonite thing or an audience. I don't think so.

SPEAKER_01 14:45

I think that just natural, like American society right now, it defaults to the woman. Like I have noticed that. Either you you blame the woman, right? That's the the other woman, right? It's her fault for taking your man, or there's questions as far as like you not being enough, or what were the reasons why, right? But it just feels like there's never really a true onus on the man. It's like it's so much easier to to look both ways at the women on either end, right?

SPEAKER_02 15:11

Yeah, the victim blaming. Yes. And so that was kind of the response that I got from my mom and other women that were in that, were raised like that. And they were, you know, by that point, they were some of my good friends. Some of them were also from that background and or had left and but still kind of had that mindset. Mindset, yes. And that was your only outlet, was those people with that mindset. But my my only saving grace is that we started going to this church, this very charismatic church, that I was like, I don't know, it could be demonic, but but I'm kind of feeling the love of God when I go here and I would weep. He and I both would weep when we would walk through the doors and we would get into the auditorium with the music, the worship, and we would just find ourselves weeping.

SPEAKER_03 15:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:56

And I thought, I mean, if this is really so terrible and so evil, because you know, growing up, that's that was oh man, those charismatics like that are rolling around on the floor. And I remember there was one of the first services we went to, they were literally bodysurfing the one of the worship leaders. That's amazing. Worship leaders was literally bodysurfing, and I thought, oh my goodness, we are in trouble. And I think he and I just looked at each other on the way home and we're like, yeah, but it's kind of interesting. It's kind of it's kind of intriguing. Because like we felt God and I felt God's love for in such a tangible way. And thank God for those women because they really were able then to meet me where I was. Um we had been going there probably a year, I don't know, maybe not even that long, but um, when all this was happening, and I started to kind of open up a little bit about what I was going through, and everybody thought I was just dealing with depression. And people didn't know for a long time what I was actually dealing with. And they also just thought, oh, I mean, she lost her dad. And I think I actually kind of used that because it was the obvious thing to do. Right. And it's no and there's no shame with that, right?

SPEAKER_01 17:02

It's no shame. It's it's shame-free guilt because you're not having to then divulge things that are so personal, hurtful, and and then put you in a very vulnerable position.

SPEAKER_02 17:12

Right? If you can just say it was the death of a family member, there is no shame. And it's not the shame of like my husband cheated on me. People can understand. And multiple times he's been cheating on me. And uh yeah, like what kind what kind of woman does that make me? Right. So there's not that with the death. So I think subconsciously I just I just for a long time I used that. Like, oh, it's just so hard on me with my dad, my dad, my dad. Well, it was actually my husband too that was causing a lot of the pain that was unnecessary during that time. I mean, it just it was adding insult to injury. Um, so I finally confided in some of these women from that church, and they would pray over me and they would just be like, Ruthie, this doesn't mean anything about your worth. You are worth, you are worthy, you are loved, and they would just pour into me. And there was this small group within the church that was just this gaggle of stay-at-home moms. And by this point, I had had my baby, and they would bring me groceries, and they would bring me a meal, and they would just sit with me and just pray for me, pray over me, pray over my family, my home, and especially some of the ones that knew what I was dealing with, they would just speak over our marriage, and you know, it was just it was exactly what I needed at that time because it gave me this it was tangible, this love. And I I think I um mentioned that in the book. They were part of the uh my healing process to let people really see me and see the depression that I was in and see the pain. Um, but that was the beginning. And then I think I just got more and more courage as we went along and eventually had the courage to really say the thing, and he also um started talking about it and owning up to it, and that is probably the reason I stayed with him because I did see a true, genuine like desire to do better, and he was willing to do whatever it takes. I'll go to counseling. And he did. He did go to whatever I wanted him to do, he did, and he was really at that time uh very much um trying to repair. So I think that's why we effort, and we feel like okay, we did make it as long as we did. I think that was the big the big thing that kept me, you know, in it. Um how many kids did you guys have together? We had three. Okay. Yes. Um, so yeah, it just ended up being um a very healing, healing experience in Nashville. And then we moved to um Colorado and continued that, and it was like life in Colorado was amazing for the first year or so it was a brand new beginning. And um but then the thoughts crept back in and I became very anxious again in our relationship, and there was also um a few other things that happened in our marriage. I kind of I I was in a I had just had my second child, I think, um, when I met a man that um was he just was telling me all the things that I would love to hear from my husband, and my husband was too busy for me. He was always on his phone, he was always doing things and going, you know, places, and I always felt like I was just one of, you know, in his life. And so it was the perfect storm. I kind of fell for this guy. And I was honest with my husband at that time because I thought, you know, that was one of the things that hurt me so deeply was the the things he had put into meeting up with another woman, uh, the effort and time that he had it had been stolen from me, right? Like that I felt stolen from. But one of the biggest things is just the idea that he had kept all of that from me. Like I wasn't a part of that. He had this whole other thing going on that I was not a part of, seeking out um where he's gonna be and what city, and then like communicating back and forth with this person. And so I just in my mind I thought, okay, I can get through this, we can make it through this, because I'll just be honest with him from the start. So as soon as I had feelings for this man, I told him. I was like, you know, in our marriage, I did. I I remember having that conversation with him, like, you're losing me.

SPEAKER_03 21:12

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_02 21:12

I'm I'm sorry, I don't know what to tell you. You're losing me. And he was so frustrated, of course. I mean, he's just like, I'm doing everything. And was he shocked that that you shared this with him? I mean, he was shocked when he found some text messages that I had sent back and forth with this man. Um, because I don't think he knew the extent of how deep in I was. I was in deep by this time. Emotionally. Yes. I mean, this was just like, oh my goodness, this man is telling me everything I want to hear, you know, and I feel ugly and fat. I've just had my second kid. Like, I mean, for real. So he was shocked. And I I was like, I'm so sorry, you know. And so we tried to talk through that. And I just thought, I still thought, you know what, we've made it this far. We are like best of friends, we have made it through. His infidelity, like we are gonna be, we're gonna get through this. I just need to be honest. I just need to be really honest with him. My emotions, with my emotions, I need to be honest at all times. And it there were so many times it just about killed me, like legitimately. I was in such a bad place because I was just like, I don't want to leave this what we've built together, but I love this man. Like I'm falling for this man. And so um, yeah, it just got to a point where I thought, okay, I think we're good. I think we're okay. I think we're gonna make it. But my heart never recovered.

SPEAKER_00 22:35

It never did it ever recover from the beginning, like from the yeah, no.

SPEAKER_02 22:39

Looking back, and and this is where I'm not gonna put the blame on him because this is where I had to wake up and rec recognize my own patterns, right? Like my own story was playing out, and that is I can't trust any man to have my back. I can't even trust my husband to have my back. Well, when you uh think like that, that is what is going to be, you are going to experience that, right? We know you know, like so I I know that played of heart in my fears. And so there were times that maybe he wasn't actually doing anything, but uh it it has so uh violated my trust by that point. Yeah, and and because I already had such a story of betrayal and and leaving and abandonment, even from my dad, it was just no there was no way he could have even really. I mean, I've thought about it since since then. I'm like, there's not really any way he could have actually um completely dispelled those fears. What's done in the world? Because I think we tried. Yeah, I really do. I think we both tried so hard to get over those things, but at the end of the day, um, I just felt like I was not ever chosen by him. I really didn't. I never felt chosen by him. Um, I never felt like I was the only one. And so that was the work that I needed to do.

SPEAKER_00 23:54

And all of that fed into your depression, right? And then also having the young babies and probably like um post um postpartum. Postpartum. Yeah. I mean, I I can imagine that was probably a big storm of right of sadness and it feelings and like uh like not knowing what's next, right?

SPEAKER_02 24:12

Like Yeah, and it just all culminated into this uh by the time I had my third child, I I referred to this a little bit in the last um episode. I found myself outside my house and completely losing my mind. Um my baby was literally, oh man, it's gonna make me cry. My baby was probably a few weeks old. And I I don't know if uh you can really know this until you've experienced anything like a psychotic episode, but it it truly felt like my uh brain had like snapped. And I just thought, I can't do this anymore. And I was yelling at him, he was trying to help me, and I was just yelling, like, get away from me. Because I didn't I just didn't know what was going on. I was like, why am I feeling so so sad, so angry, so trapped in this life. And yet you know, he was being good to me at that time. He was being good to me. And he was good to me most of the most of the years. Um but yeah, it did play into the the the idea, the the mindset that I already had, which was just that I will be abandoned in the end. Like nobody's gonna be there for me, really. And yes, and so that played into a lot of the hopelessness. That's when I went finally to see a doctor, was when I had that I I call it a psychotic episode. I was never diagnosed with anything, but it was the closest thing that I could ever think about. It was a breaking point all the way. And I that's when I was like rock bottom. Yeah, I'm either gonna live or I'm gonna die. Right. Like I can't be the mother of three children and and do this. I can't feel like this um for the next, you know, 30 years of my life. 35, whatever it was at that time. I think it was maybe in my early 30s when I had my second child. Um so that kind of was the driving factor for me then to the next few years where like I'm gonna get better. And I thought I was getting better. That's the thing. I thought I was getting better. And that's what I wanna um really highlight with people that struggle with depression is that they can seem like they're doing really well, everything's going good, but they can be it can be this high high, and that's what you see, right? And then you don't see the low, low that happens after that. And so it would always be like after a trip. If I went on a trip with my husband, when we'd come home, it was that was always when it would be like so bad. Yeah. Just the low that nobody would see, and everybody would just see the pictures that we posted, and it was amazing. And yes, it was it was an amazing trip. It was an amazing time. But what they didn't see is me laying on the couch sobbing my eyes out you know, for a day after I come home and just not even be able to do anything.

SPEAKER_01 27:06

It feels like that's such a common dynamic, right, for people that are in that place, and a lot of people that we know, even just through um entertainment, you know, actors, whatnot, that have this presence of being such givers, and they're like so full of light and humor. Like you look at Robin Williams, right? And you look at Anthony Bourdain and people like that who are just so dynamic and were able to connect with people on so many levels, and you're just like, that would be the last person I think that would be struggling. And that for me was my sister. My sister was funny, entertaining, like she was taking care of everyone else. She was the the best of friend of like whoever crossed her path. She was like all in on them. And no, I mean, everyone was shocked after she died and we were at her funeral. Like, people were like, I would have never thought it was her. I never thought it was your sister. Like, and also what made it hard for us too, to your point, Ruthie, was that she was living in Norway when everything kind of spiraled down for her. She'd been living there for many years. And so when we would see her on FaceTime, you can put on the face, right? The mask, the right, the mask. And we didn't see the dark side of it, which you exactly described, being on the couch, not being able to get off the couch and just like um in complete despair. So that sort of come out and become more evident, you know, towards the last months of her life. But up to that point, I mean, she was just this light, and everyone like gravitated to her because she was the one that took care of everyone else, right? And usually, not say usually, I think that's a common dynamic for people that are struggling.

SPEAKER_02 28:30

You have to watch the deep feelers because if they are, yes, if they have this capacity to love life, they also have a capacity to feel that pain. One thousand percent at such a deep level. Yes. That the average person who is just kind of like maybe not as deep of a feeler, like maybe you know, just kind of can be a little bit more buoyant through life. Like my mom, my mom is like that, and I love that. But she doesn't really get the like the depth. Yeah, I think she does more now, just watching me go through what I did. But you gotta watch the deep feelers because if they are expressing themselves in this like very big way, very big way. Very wholehearted. Yes, very wholehearted. Just watch for their watch for their dips, their lows when you don't hear anything. Yep. And I I did get to a point where I had a few good friends and I would tell them, check on me after a trip, check on me when I've just had some major event. My family's been here, it's been a holiday, and it's been super fun. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:26

But that's a check on me. Amazing that you had that awareness to say, please check on me. Because I think that some people don't see maybe the pattern or the cycle, and they don't even know what to like anticipate coming up. It's just it's the a flow into like one moment to kind of the next of the high and the lows, right? So it's amazing that you were already conscious of that cycle and can kind of anticipate what was to come, right?

SPEAKER_02 29:46

I did eventually become that aware, but you know, up until the psychotic episode outside my house, I don't think I was that that's why I say that was like the breaking point. Yes, and it was a good one because it really made me realize that this is for real. This this is like my children depend on this for me to get my healing to be better. So I tried everything I could think of to just be keep myself more in check. And especially I had one friend that I just really we confided in each other, and she had struggled with some of the same things, and so we just kept each other accountable, which is where the book that's what the book is all about. It's about that friendship and like walking with people when you know, like really walking in the trenches with them. And that's what saved me ultimately.

SPEAKER_00 30:33

So, how did it end then with your ex and and and now kind of going into current state? Like, where are you at? Well, this is the exciting part.

SPEAKER_02 30:42

All right. Um, and I could not have said that in the beginning, you know, because our divorce was really, really painful. Our separation was extremely painful. Um, I did not expect it. I thought we were still gonna work it out somehow, even though we were like fighting all the time. Did you ask for it? There was no trust in the relationship anymore.

SPEAKER_01 31:00

Right. Did did he ask for the divorce or did you? He did. He did, okay.

SPEAKER_02 31:04

Um, and he had asked for space. Um, so he was, I think he was trying to let me down slowly or softly, and and I knew I knew he was he was out. By that point, I was just a complete mess because I I thought, you know, I've done all this, I've brought myself back from the brink of like going with this other person. Like I did I pull myself back in from that. I put my whole heart back into the marriage, making it work, and then he just goes, actually, I think I just need space. Actually, I really need space. Actually, I really need to move out that kind of space. A lot of space. And um it just the whole thing was really hurtful because he wasn't honest with me about some of the things during that time, um, like another woman that he was pursuing, and um I knew he was into her, and I knew, I knew that, you know, um, that was the driving force behind him leaving. And next thing you know, a few months later, he she's popping up everywhere, and our friends are seeing them together, and so that was excruciating. I mean, talk about just a wound being ripped wide open, you know, because there's my abandonment wound, there's my wound of like men leaving me vulnerable, like when I'm the most vulnerable, you know. So I had these three kids that were just completely falling apart. I was falling apart, they were so dysregulated, they didn't understand. And you know, yes, there was dysfunction before he left, but I mean, honestly, it still was so, so terrifying for them. It was so devastating. And so yeah, I found myself having to parent them while I was parenting myself, and it was the hardest thing I've ever gone through. Even my dad's death, I would say this was harder in some ways because I had to be the parent to the house.

SPEAKER_01 32:54

And your killing during this period, like they would have been kind of broke loose.

SPEAKER_02 32:57

They would have been, it was like three years ago, actually, almost exactly three years ago when we separated. It was in April. Um, he moved into the basement first, but it was still felt like it just felt like that was the beginning of the end. So um yeah, um, April three years ago. So it my oldest was I think 15. So yeah, it was and that's a hard hard age. Right.

SPEAKER_01 33:20

So you had teenager, you had like high school, middle school, and then elementary school, right?

SPEAKER_02 33:25

Yes, yeah. Well, the middle child, but he was also in elementary, so I had two in elementary and then one in middle, but ink at that.

SPEAKER_01 33:32

Vastly different needs and levels to understand what's happening and what you share, right, at those different ages, too, about what's happening, right?

SPEAKER_02 33:38

Yes. But that that began my real journey into back to myself, like my real self. And I just thought, again, it's do or die. I mean, I didn't come this far to like to play. Yeah. Like, I'm not gonna do this anymore. Around that time, I read the book Um The Power of Awareness. I mentioned last time, but um I also read some other books. Um, one of them, Dr. Joe Dispensa, wrote a book, um, what is it called? The Breaking the Habit of Being Yourself. And it was life-changing for me. Those two books were life-changing because it put the power right back where it always has been, and that's me. I'm the one that has to change. Nobody is coming to save me at this point. Even my husband, he's over there with another woman, laying with another woman, literally across the field from me. Nobody is coming to save me. Yeah, like at that point, it was like, okay, it's me. And it's me for these kids. So the first part of my journey in that was just about being staying here for the kids. Yeah. Now, this is the exciting part is that I get to stay here for me because I get to live the life I always wanted to. I get to live a fulfilling, beautiful, amazing life. I get to see different aspects of the world I've never seen before. I get to eight in my 40s. What is some of that for you?

SPEAKER_01 34:58

So, what are those elements that are like bringing that joy back or joy that you hadn't experienced before? The things you're like, wow, I can't believe I get to enjoy this. Like, what what are some of those for you?

SPEAKER_02 35:07

Oh, I just love being in some ways, it's like I got my teenage years back, but better because I have the confidence now. I can walk in a room, walk into a room, walk into a a bar where we've been where we met and just have confidence and be like, the world is my oyster man. Like, I don't, you know, the good thing about not being able to blame anything on your partner is you also get to just take the credit for the good, right? For the good. And you get to be like, it's me. Yeah, it's me. I'm the light in this room. I'm the thing that lights up my own life. I am the spark plug.

SPEAKER_01 35:37

I know. That's just it's it's so amazing on so many levels. Also, too, your kids see that. They do, they see their mom growing and being happy and experiencing joy, and they benefit from that, right?

SPEAKER_02 35:48

Yes, they do. Yeah, and they've told me, especially our oldest, um, she has told me, and we've cried together, trust me, so many times. We've cried, and in the process of her dad and I separating, you know, there were just so many hard things that I couldn't hide from her. I can kind of hide a little bit from the younger ones. I could for a certain time, but her, no. So she saw everything and she saw the kind of like dynamic that was happening, and and so she's told me since she's like, Mom, I'm just I'm so proud of you. Like she'll write me these notes and saying how proud she is of me, of the work done. And you guys, I never ever, it would have been enough, it would have been enough for me just to be able to enjoy my life again, like truly have joy in my life. But for my kids to say things like that, and knowing that they've seen it all, they've seen me flat on the floor.

SPEAKER_01 36:36

Right. Well, what's what's beautiful about that is not only that she sees you, sees your authentic self, and was able to share how she feels about you and is so proud, but also because you have gone through what you've gone through and you've been vulnerable and open and talked to her honestly about things, this now gives her permission to be honest as an adult with herself and with you when she comes upon challenges in her own life, right? And then you've taught her about being um open, owning your feelings, it's okay to not be okay, right? And so you've given her the gift in return of being able to not be okay, which I think is a tremendous um gift and power we can give to our kids is allow them to have times in their life where it's okay to not be okay. And guess what? Things will change and I'll move from you know, move on from this. I'm here, you can be messy with me, right?

SPEAKER_00 37:24

It's okay, right? And you'll be stronger because of it. Yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 37:28

And even with friends, too, right? There's friends that can see you be at your worst, and it from my own experience too, it feels like it almost gives them the the permission to not be okay with me too. Like I don't have to keep this front, I don't have to like keep a lot of this, you know, hidden or shoved down. I can actually be seen, right? And that's tremendous. So amazing applause to you, like fantastic. Like, I'm just I can't I can't express enough how wonderful that is to hear, like a full circle for you, and now you're empowering your kids to be their best.

SPEAKER_02 37:59

Yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 38:00

I gotta know, are you dating yes?

SPEAKER_02 38:03

Like, where are we at? Dabbling. Dabbling. I like it. I have um I have gone on and off the dating apps, and I'm like, oh, I don't even need this anymore. It's just riff-ruffing my life. You the thing with online dating is that you have to vet. As a woman, you have to vet so hard from the get-go. Like you don't even have a person in real life that you can kind of size up and be like, oh, this vibe is off, or that you're just going by words on paper and there is nothing else. And so you there's just so much vetting you have to do. And I just detective work, right? I tell my girlfriends, I'm like, I'm not made for this. I there's I don't have time for that. I would rather just meet a guy out wherever in the Whole Foods are.

SPEAKER_01 38:44

I did a few weeks ago in the wild. Yes, in the wild.

SPEAKER_02 38:46

I I met a very nice man in Whole Foods a few weeks ago. All right. Um, but you never know where you're gonna meet somebody. And yes, I have definitely been dating and going out a little bit. Um, I've had mostly good experiences with that.

SPEAKER_03 38:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:00

And I think though, I will say, don't go back in the dating world if you're not ready. If you don't have confidence within yourself, you don't know who you are. Oh girl, don't take yourself through that.

SPEAKER_01 39:11

Just be with you, love yourself of yourself.

SPEAKER_02 39:13

Take time to work on you, to really um appreciate yourself, appreciate you and know who you are before you get into that pool. Like yes. Yeah. Because it is, it is not for the girls who are weak of heart or like don't know who they are. And I think that's why a lot of girls get in trouble with these kind of relationships, these situationships. I don't want a situation ship. I loved being a wife, I love being married, so I won't settle for anything like that. It's it's all or nothing like that.

SPEAKER_01 39:40

So I'm dying to ask. So the man that came into your life years um before, right, when you were married, did is there a chance of that resurfacing? Have you both just fully moved on? And that's like you'll never like maybe come back to that? Because I was just curious, like come back around.

SPEAKER_02 39:54

Maybe I'm open to that, C V D. But but no, we haven't had we haven't really stayed in communication. There was a point where I, for the sake of my marriage, I cut off all communication, and and that's where I I just decided, you know, and I had just put on my my marriage blinders. Blinders again, and I just made it. And I'm I don't regret that.

SPEAKER_01 40:15

Yeah. Um but also you're a different person now, too. You've grown, you're not the same person that you were in that period of your life.

SPEAKER_02 40:21

And I don't even know if I would be attracted to him at that point. You know, like I think it was like I said, it was the perfect storm because I was so depleted within myself. So I was looking for that outside validation. He was giving that to me. So it was like of course, I was just like, Well, this guy is pretty awesome. Yeah, yeah. My husband is too busy for me.

SPEAKER_01 40:40

And yeah, so I think it was a perfect storm at that time, and and that's why and the validation you're getting right now is from yourself, it's not external validation coming from another man, right? Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:50

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 40:51

So we um we have a whole nother episode um where Ricky's gonna dig deeper into some of the um like guid like tips and tricks.

SPEAKER_01 40:59

The guidance, right? The insights and just the awareness, right, of your book, which is just fascinating.

SPEAKER_00 41:04

So, yeah, we'll make sure um to tune into the next episode. Ruthie, thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01 41:11

We're so appreciative for you sharing your your story here. We're also so inspired. Yeah, thank you so much. You're amazing for having me.

SPEAKER_00 41:17

All right. Thanks for hanging out with us today at Shakein' and Unfiltered. Don't forget to follow the podcast wherever you listen so you never miss an episode. We'd love to uh we'd love for you to like, share, and drop a comment on our socials. You can find us at Shake and Unfiltered. And if you want more fun, head over to our YouTube channel for doing demos and extended podcast content. Until next time, keep it shaken and always unfiltered. Cheers, cheers.

SPEAKER_01 41:37

You've been listening to Shakin and Unfiltered with Jen and Lindsey. Catch every episode wherever you get your podcast and join in the conversation on social at Shake and Unfiltered for strong trainings and stronger opinions. We'll see you next round. Cheers.