Ep 22: Obedience Without The Full Plan

We talk about why we crave a full plan, and why God often asks for obedience before He gives clarity. We lean into Scripture, real-life stories, and practical next steps that help us trust God when we still have questions. 
• our need for control as men and the pressure to have it all figured out 
• what obedience means when we want an explanation 
• faith as trust that grows over time through action 
• Abraham, Isaac, Noah, and Joshua as models of obedience 
• consequences of ignoring clear instruction and what that teaches us 
• Proverbs 3:5-6 and the call to lean not on our own understanding 
• prayer as communication, plus the discipline of stopping to listen 
• taking “the next step” in work, relationships, and calling 
• building confidence by doing the hard thing before you feel ready 
we just ask that you share that with others that um it might encourage and challenge 

Transcript

Welcome And Why We’re Here

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to The Road Travel, a Christian podcast for men, where real faith meets real life. Through honest conversations and personal stories, we help you apply God's word to your everyday journey by sharing the road we've traveled. Whether you're walking through challenge, change, or calling, this is your road. And you don't have to travel it alone. Now, let's take the next step with your hosts, Aaron Degler and Alan Hugator.

SPEAKER_02 0:31

Welcome back to the Road Travel. Thanks for taking a little time to join us on the Road Travel. I'm your host, Aaron Degler, along with your host, Alan Hugator. We just want to come to you each time as we find you on the whatever road you may be traveling as we share a little scripture, a little thoughts behind that, some experiences that we've had, some try to explain a little bit more. And really, how does that be applicable in our everyday walk on the road that we're on? So it's our hope that each time we have a conversation and you join us on our conversation, that we share a little bit about that. Sometimes it's to share a lesson, sometimes it's to share a challenge, to challenge each of you and sometimes challenge ourselves on how we can be better men. How can we be better husbands, sons? Just how can we be better in life? Because I think no matter how um good we are, there's always room for better, always room for a little incremental improvement.

Why Men Crave The Full Plan

SPEAKER_02 1:30

Today we're gonna talk a little bit about, you know, how many times, as men, especially, we like to have a full plan. What's the full plan ahead? You know, I I know when I take the family on vacation, we'd always say, okay, we're gonna stop here. This is where we're gonna stay, this is what we're gonna do, kind of an itinerary, the whole list of things. And sometimes when with God, he doesn't like to give us the whole plan. He sometimes just wants us to be obedient before we understand the whole plan. And and I think back over my life and how my life has played out up to this point at almost 51 years old. And at 18, I could have never seen all the things that would have happened that have happened. I'm sure you probably say the same thing that you know, and and sometimes if we know the knew the whole plan, would we still go forward? And I think for me, the chance probably be no. If I knew the whole plan up to this point, there's points I'd say, nah, I don't think I want to do that plan. That's not good for me. And so maybe I wouldn't. So we're gonna talk a little bit about what that looks like, and we're gonna talk a little bit about some just different stories in the Bible that that God really asked for some obedience before understanding that doesn't look always like, huh?

Obedience Before Understanding

SPEAKER_02 3:02

I don't get it. Like Abraham. What is obedience? Good. What is it? It it is doing what is asked of you. I I think we ask our kids to be obedient. Say, will you do this? And what do we say sometimes when they go, why?

SPEAKER_01 3:23

It don't matter why, just do it. Just do it. Yeah. Well, that's a good point that we're that you're talking about today. You know, do we have to have an explanation from God as to why we need to do certain things? Yeah, we we feel like we do. Mm-hmm. Okay. He may not really think we need to. We just need to obey what he says, keep us out of trouble or whatever reason, and and to do what he's asked. I don't like to say God's has got a set of rules, but he asks us not to do these things because they're sinful, and that will lead us down the wrong path. So being obedient to him, he's trying to guide us. We're his children, just like you mentioned children. We're trying to, and sometimes we don't need to ask why, and sometimes when we dig why, we don't always get the answer that we want, or that we think that we that it should be why, this or why that. Being obedient without asking why is what? It's been you have faith that your child, you're asking that child to have faith, like we have faith in God, or we're developing faith every day, we're growing our faith in Him, that His way is the right way. Just like as a father of my children or my grandchildren, whenever they my grandchildren right now, they're three, two to four, along in there. And well, why this? Well, why that? Well, why? Don't ask why, just do it. But have faith in me is what we really would like. Have faith in me that I'm telling you to do this because I know that's the way to do it. All right, it's keeping you out of trouble when I say, Don't touch that snake. Well, why? Well, I know it's dangerous, so believe me. And God is telling us lots of times to be obedient because He knows the danger, the pit we can fall into.

SPEAKER_02 5:19

And just as kids, as your grandkids, and think about your own kids, as they get older, they ask why less and less and less. Because, hopefully, that time over time, you have led them in the right direction. That is the hope. That doesn't always happen.

SPEAKER_01 5:38

How old were your children when you were the dumbest? It was about 13. Yeah. And you was about the dumbest cat alive, Dad, you don't know. You don't know. And then sometimes we treat God, well, God, you don't know. You're not living right here and putting up with all this I'm done. And I'm being precisious here, but still at the same time. At 13, my daughter thought I was the dumbest guy going, and she pretty well right. But you know, but as she got older, she started mellowing on some of that. And understanding because she got to experience and see some things, well, dad wasn't quite so dumb in that spot. He wasn't quite so dumb over here, you know, you know, or against the mom either. I mean, you know, the mom you don't know, you don't know, you live in a different time period. I mean, yeah, it was ancient back then. But but faith in the person that tells you not to do something is trying to guide you. You gotta have faith in them to follow them or do what they ask.

SPEAKER_02 6:41

And because when God says go or trust or let go, we respond with questions like why, how, what if? Because again, all those we we we which is are understanding questions. I need to understand why. I need to understand how does that work. I need to understand what if this doesn't work out.

Abraham Noah Joshua And Trust

SPEAKER_02 7:03

That Abraham, when he was gonna sacrifice Isaac, did is Isaac cracked? Yeah. Yes. Did he question? Abraham did not. He took his son up the mountain.

SPEAKER_01 7:18

He was I bet he had a dilemma for a little while. Oh, I'm sure. Saying, Lord, I don't see how this is gonna work. Are you you know are you sure? But I've got faith in you. I mean, that's unbelievable faith that Abraham had. I I can't even fathom that at all. With a knife. So you know that he had to question it just a little, but he had so much in faith in what God told him to do that he was gonna go do what God had asked.

SPEAKER_02 7:47

He took action, he went. He st he was obedient in what God asked. And he might have still had questions. He might have said, I don't understand this, I don't know how it's gonna work, I don't know what in the world's going on, I don't know what you're thinking, God, but you told me to do it, so I'm gonna do it. And and if you hadn't heard the story of Abraham, Abraham and Isaac takes him up the mountain, he's he raises the knife to kill his own son after he puts him on the altar. And a lamb, a ram, ram is in the thicket. God tells him to stop, and that is what he's to sacrifice. But again, he didn't know that plan going up the mountain. And and it wasn't a quick trip either. It took some time for you know up the mountain for him to be thinking about it. Isaac even carried his own wood that he was gonna be, you know, build the altar with. It's just but but he again didn't question. He didn't question.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

And then whenever God commanded him to pull up stakes and leave and travel that long distance to establish a new nation, how much did that take faith in God? We're going that far? Mm-hmm. That far? I mean, they were walking. They wouldn't they didn't catch a bus, they didn't take a plane. Why am I gonna do that? Yeah, why? Don't ask why, just do.

SPEAKER_02 9:11

Just do. Um same thing with Joshua and Jericho walking around the walls. I don't get it, God. Why are we walking around the walls? That's a I don't understand. But uh again, it it it shows time and time again what about Noah? Noah, I need you to build an ark. There's no rain. I mean, there's no rain, but I need you to build this big ark. I need you to go get all these animals, I need you to do all these things. There's no rain, I need you to build on dry ground. And you've never seen any rain that to the amount that would think you would need in a boat this big.

SPEAKER_01 10:09

We can't, even today. We can't do that at all. And I've seen the replica, and I still can't phantom how that ever came to be. But has there been some that did not follow God's instructions? And what did what was their demise? Mm-hmm. Uh that Solomon Gore when she when Lot's wife looked back. God said, Don't look back. What happened the minute a second? Well, you she found out she turned into a pillar of salt. You know, and that's just one that pops in my head real quick. But there's plenty others in there also that did not. Not everybody in the Bible followed God's instructions, and there was repercussions. Or he knew what was going to happen, or he told them what was going to happen if they didn't. What about right from the beginning? Garden of Eden. Well, what did he tell them? Don't eat from that tree. Don't eat the fruit of that tree. It's that simple. You have everything else. And Eve said, Don't eat. Why? And we all know the rest of that story. So it is full of consequences. I guess on either side. What you do do what God says and the reward or you do see, sometimes we do ask, I ask why. And then later I say, There was why. Or when I didn't do it, I go, Oh boy, now I can tell why I should have. But I still I even, you know, I ask God, well, why do you want me to do this? Or why should I why do we have to live this way, or why do we need to think this way? Or and that's the human nature part of us at times. Then you bring in the biggest word of all, faith. I guess there's no bigger than love, but that's a big word of faith right there.

SPEAKER_02 11:56

And and because in Proverbs 3, 5 through 6, it does talk about trust in the Lord. Lean not on your own understanding. Because again, Noah couldn't, that's not something he could even fathom. And there's things going on that God is orchestrating all around us that we can't even fathom how all that works together. We can't even comprehend how that would work together. So even if he were to tell us, we go like, ah, that can't happen.

SPEAKER_01 12:25

Nobody's like, there is no way everything's gonna be covered in water. What is one of the hardest things for people to fathom and get an understanding is the resurrection of Christ. Mm-hmm. They you they can't get a handle because nobody else has ever risen from the dead. That one thing to prove up that he is God, but they can't get a handle on that.

SPEAKER_02 12:50

And and it's and we can't. I mean, we're just not able to do that. So he he doesn't give us the full explanation, he just gives us instructions. What

Focus On The Next Right Step

SPEAKER_02 13:01

is and and sometimes really the challenge is sometimes you don't know how the all the plan works. And as men, we like to be in control, we like to have a plan, we like to take care of things. But sometimes to be obedient and follow faith is to say, God, don't show me the whole plan. Maybe I can't handle the whole plan. I'm not prepared to handle the whole plan. But just show me what the next step of instructions is. Because maybe it's a big, huge plan that he has. And I can't understand, but I can understand this next step that I'm supposed to take. Maybe that next step looks like, okay, I know, you know, I don't know what my plan for my family is, but I know I maybe I need to take this job as the next step. Or maybe I need to leave this job and get another job. Maybe that's the next step. Or maybe I need to leave this friendship and find another friendship that is gonna help me build my faith, build my walk with God. Maybe this one is is pulling me away. But what I don't understand, but what's the next step? What what can I do to be obedient?

SPEAKER_01 14:12

So often we've been advised to turn it over to the Lord, let him guide our ways. And we can only through faith. Love for him, studying the word. But yeah, it letting him lead our life, and we're trying to be in charge and control things. It's just our nature to try to control. But they say turn it over to the Lord, and and that don't mean to not go in there and get you something to eat or go to work and make some money to where you can feed your family. That don't mean all of that. It it it has a meaning of in everything you do, go to him. And and and prayer is the main way that you will communicate. And then again, when you do pray, stop and listen for a few moments. He may not tell you right then, but he's going to show you in time and have faith and obedience.

SPEAKER_02 15:09

And a lot of times he'll show you through other people, through other people's words, of their actions.

Seeing God’s Faithfulness Over Time

SPEAKER_02 15:15

My parents are in their mid-80s now, and they'll share with me many times about God's faithfulness. It's it's, you know, they get to look back over their last sixty years of being Christians, and they can see God's faithfulness. You know, they can point it out, here's this, and they share that with me. Here's his faithfulness here. And we didn't understand why we were coming to move here, or we met this person, but then we saw why later down the road, his faithfulness kept showing up. I lost this job, we had to move here, we didn't have any money here. But they they say they can look back and see his faithfulness. And I think as we the more we're obedient and take the step, we'll begin to see that faithfulness that he has, that he's he's continually showing up. And that and that helps build our faith. But we can't build our faith until we take the step. It's kind of like confidence. I I just don't want to do that until I feel confident. I man just until I feel confident.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

You're scared of failure.

SPEAKER_02 16:14

And how do you get confident? You go do that thing. And you fail at it.

SPEAKER_01 16:20

So I had prayed for a number of years about God. What would you what is my purpose? Use me, you know, I'm your vessel, use me as you as you need, and and he's had me do some various things along the way. I never would have dreamed of doing this. You know, again, if it reaches one person and helps him get to know him, it's well worth our time. But then we've talked about it for a year and before kind of set aside, didn't even talk to each other six months, probably, and then come back and we started it, and I feel like that it's where he led us. You know, it's his plan. I feel like this is his plan. Because I never would have planned on doing this. So he let it fall in his time, his place. When he told me and and you to do this, we took hold and we went and done it. Now, there was a pause there for about a year that when he first gave us the idea, I'd say, and it we kind of hesitated and we thought about it, and then we got back together, and I I truly believe he told us to do this.

SPEAKER_02 17:28

And you look at that, and he put on your heart years before. He put on mine to start doing podcasts to figure out how to, you know, record them, how to put them out there, you know. So he he's already working in our lives separately on the plan before we're ever had the idea to, you know, you had the idea and said, Hey, can we do that? You've been doing this, and you know, let's get together, let's talk about it. And um, so he's working separately in our lives that that we would never see. And it ain't over. He's right.

SPEAKER_01 17:59

And it may not be this podcast, but he has plans for me and you both. He has plans for every child of his. And so many are not listening, so many is not doing, so many is not being obedient, but he has a plan for each one of us. And I'm still looking and trying to identify his plan, but also just letting it kind of happen.

SPEAKER_02 18:28

And and and and when we do that, we just go, okay, what's the next thing I need to do? Where's the next place I need to go? Who's the next person I need to talk to?

Real-Life Obedience In Work And Calling

SPEAKER_02 18:37

You know, there's a lot of things that I mean I I've I felt it was it was put on my heart to to start a nonprofit for women and children of by by showing them the love of Christ through serving them and serving them for lasting healing. And I felt like that was put on my heart a number of years ago, but I didn't didn't know how. I don't know how. And so beginning this year, I thought that I'm gonna start it this year. And so we've just gotten it underway and gotten it started, and I have no idea how any of that works. But I said, okay, what's what's one step I can take? Okay. Call my son, you know, hey, what's the legal stuff we need to do? He started saying, Well, Dad, you need to do this and this, okay. So little checkbox, little checkbox. And, you know, we're slowly, you know, about you know, four months in, and we we're we're about to have a fundraiser start to doing some things. We're gonna start helping some people. But beginning of the year, I knew nothing. But I knew that's something that God had called me to do. So I said, okay, what's the what's the one box I can check? Got it. Okay, I did that. What's next? Okay, I can check that. And and and I I kind of when we met with our board, I kind of shared the the big vision. And they were like, they weren't, it's kind of like God, they weren't ready to hear that whole the whole vision. And so I think it sometimes we can't see it all, but I said, okay, let me let me let me you know take it down really small. Here's what we need to do next. Got it. They were all on board, we can do that. But sometimes I showed them the big picture and like, whew, that's a lot. I don't know if we can do that. Sure. So I said, okay, look, here's here's the next thing we're gonna do. We got it. We're gonna do that.

SPEAKER_01 20:13

Uh lately I've stumbled into a band from West Virginia that I think is really, really good, that has a great Christian message with it. It's kind of the modern type music to a degree that you uh but all of us it's got a wang from West Virginia that all of us can enjoy. And I've mentioned it to a few people and I've been praying on it, and I'm I'm not pushing the issue. Matter of fact, when I talked to them, they said we probably wouldn't come until next January, February, March. And I said, fine. Give it a lot of time for help God to help guide in that way if it's to be. And by praying on it and just kind of letting it flow along, well, he'll open the doors, he'll he'll put it in front of us if it's meant to be, kind of like you're talking. And and you and you made the contact.

SPEAKER_02 20:55

You made what do I need, what what what can I do right now? Yeah. That'll work out, it'll work out. You know, and the next thing I just have to be obedient. What's the next thing we got to do?

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Obedience is really easier than we get it to be. We think it's a set of rules that you've just got to go by and being obedient, well, that's negative because you can't do what I want to do. And we look at it from the wrong side totally.

SPEAKER_02 21:35

And the challenge is really that it's it's maybe it's God been speaking to you. And you don't understand, like I I don't get that. I don't understand that. But maybe it's just and you've been going, I don't want to do that. Why? What if, how? And maybe it's just take the next step and obedient in the next step. And and I do believe the understanding comes later. Um it will come. But what is the next step? I mean, from our podcast to the other couple of other podcasts I do to different classes that I that I have that I teach on a weekly basis, all are because of in some form or fashion I've taken an obedience step. You know, there's places my career is wanting to go that I would have never done, never thought about five years ago. Because some because of some of the obedient steps I've taken, just because I feel it was the right thing to do, it has created, opened up new avenues. Um and I think it in a in a direction God is now leading me.

SPEAKER_01 22:36

You have asked for guidance in every situation. You have prayed on it. You hadn't just said, I think this is the way I need to go. You've asked for guidance. And He will He will He will lead you there. He'll open doors for you, put it that way, where you'll say, Oh, maybe this door instead of this door. Mm-hmm. Yeah. It worked, but you have spent the time in prayer about each one of those moves. And that's one of the first steps.

SPEAKER_02 23:04

And that's how we find obedience. We have to be in communication. Just like we are as parents. Our kids aren't gonna, you know, be obedient unless we're in communication with them.

SPEAKER_01 23:14

Well, back to the Garden of Eden again. Well, we're all we're we have a nature of being rebellious, of going against. I mean, I don't know how fast you drove out here, but are you always obedient at at the speed limit? I'm not. Mm-hmm. Officer, are you listening? But I'm not always obedient to the laws. I'm not always obedient to God. Be the first to admit it. But when I am, and I really put my heart open up and I listen through my heart and my everything, he gives great advice as always, and it's usually the right path. You just have to be willing to listen. Amen. Take the next step.

Prayer And Final Encouragement

SPEAKER_01 23:51

Well, let's go to him and thank him. Our dear gracious Heavenly Father, Lord, we pause here to give you uh all the praise, Lord, for your patience with us when we are not obedient, dear Lord. Because we do do things that offend you, and we don't listen, and we don't go to the path that you've laid out before us, even with the words that you've written, and inspired man to write in the Bible. We don't always go by that, Lord, and we thank you so much for your forgiveness and your patience. But we come to you now as always, just asking for guidance while we're on this earth to do your work. Give us guidance to what pleases you. And we come to you in the name of our Savior Jesus Christ's holy name. Amen. Amen.

SPEAKER_02 24:40

Thank you to each of you for joining us on the road travel. We just hope that when we find um you on the road that you're traveling, and and if if we encourage you, if we challenge you today, we we just ask that you share that with others that um it might encourage and challenge. And again, we just want to share the road that you're traveling, that we can hopefully encourage that road, um, whether it's a paved road, bumpy road, care, curvy road, narrow road, whatever road we find you on. We just want to encourage you and challenge you and just hopefully add value to your life on a each time we have a conversation. So again, thanks for joining us on the road travel and look forward to seeing you on your road.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

You've been listening to The Road Travel, where real faith meets real life. Remember, every step matters, even the hard ones. So keep walking your road with courage, conviction, and Christ leading the way. Until next time, your hosts, Aaron and Allen, say we'll see you down the road.