Ep 24: We Cannot Love Our Neighbor While We Measure Them

We wrestle with how easily we judge, gossip, and point out someone else’s speck while ignoring the plank in our own eye. We challenge ourselves to look in the mirror, choose love over criticism, and walk with people who are trying to get closer to Christ. 
• reading Matthew 7:1-5 and taking “do not judge” seriously 
• naming gossip and church talk that tears people down 
• asking whether we pray for people or use their failures as entertainment 
• reflecting on a church moment that humiliates a visitor instead of welcoming her 
• focusing on the “plank” and letting slow change become lasting change 
• remembering we are not perfect and we are never in a place to judge 
• supporting new Christians after baptism through discipleship and community 
• treating Bible study and church as a support group that builds strong faith 

As always, if you find value in an episode, we just encourage you to share it with others. Maybe you text it to them, maybe you tell them about it, just so you can help us meet others on the road they’re traveling. 

Transcript

Welcome To The Road Traveled

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to The Road Travel, a Christian podcast for men, where real faith meets real life. Through honest conversations and personal stories, we help you apply God's word to your everyday journey by sharing the road we've traveled. Whether you're walking through challenge, change, or calling, this is your road. And you don't have to travel it alone. Now, let's take the next step with your hosts, Aaron Degler and Alan Hugator.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

Welcome back to the Road Travel. Thanks for taking a little time to join us. We are your host. I'm Aaron Degler, along with Alan Hugator. Each time we just come to you to share a little bit about our experiences, the good, the bad, and the ugly, and how we have gone through them. Hopefully, um a lot of them we overcome, some we still struggle with on a on a regular basis. But we just share each week a little bit of scripture with you, something that's helped us and the topic we're discussing for the show. And we hope that it finds you where it needs to, and that that our challenges, our struggles, our successes can help you along your road. So we'll kind of get started. I think Alan's gonna kind of kick it off today.

Matthew 7 And The Trap Of Judging

SPEAKER_02 1:17

Yeah, we always start with a little scripture. So if you all will, I'm reading out of Matthew and the NIV, Matthew chapter chapter seven. I'm gonna read verses one through five and want to give you a pretty big text to just one verse today. We begin with uh verse one, do not judge, or you two will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own? How can you say to your brother, let me take the speck out of your eye when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will be you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brothers. You know, that really does hit home in a lot of ways with what I've seen and what I've done and been guilty myself of judging others real easily. I don't think there's a person alive that hadn't judged someone and maybe even spoke of it. We've heard the word gossip before, and we're always trying to point out other people's weaknesses to make ourselves feel better about ourselves, and and man, that's uh that's a real weak way to get to feeling better, is that you have to run down someone else or pick out someone else's weakness to make you feel better about your own weaknesses or your own, you know, self. And I mean we could be sitting in church and someone look over there and say, Well, look at what she's wearing today. Or, well, look how he I heard, did you hear about old Aaron and what he done? You know, and and it's like I said, I mean, it's it's terrible. It's it's so easy to do because you know, Aaron, we're both Christian men. Yeah, we hadn't killed nobody. We hadn't done this, we hadn't done that, you know, and and we fall away down, but then we we gossip about what happened, oh so-and-so here, or whatever happened here, or we find someone's weakness, and it's so easy to fall into that trap. I call

Gossip Disguised As Helpful Talk

SPEAKER_02 4:01

it you know, trying to make yourself feel better, but it's not really well, it's just news. I'm just letting you know we justify that real easily, and there's no true justification to to degrading someone else. It says to help the the weak and help someone that's in trouble, and we don't we pick at it from our own entertainment at times. I say entertainment because some guys chuckle or people chuckle about so-and-so, look at what they've done, or look at what they're doing. But do we stop and pray for them? Do we stop and offer any kind of assistance or help if they're going through a trying time, or if they are messing up a little bit? Do we go over as a brother and and see what might be troubling that causes them to be that way?

SPEAKER_01 4:58

And and kind of, you know, our hope is here as as on the road travel is to share some of those things that maybe you've been judged on and things we talk about, and it's to offer that guidance or support of you know, we may not know the person that's listening, but maybe our words is a form of going over and saying, Can we help you? Can we walk with you? But I think so many times judgment doesn't do that.

A Church Visit That Turned Cruel

SPEAKER_01 5:27

I was listening to a preacher a couple weeks ago, he told us a great story. He worked at a he was youth minister, and he uh, you know, youth minister get paid all these big bucks, not really. So he had to have a second job. And so he worked at a gym. And he said, just so happened this gym was right across the street from a strip club. Perfect. And he said the owner was smart. He said the owner would tell these girls they could have free memberships. They just come in and work out. And he said, you know, they'd come in and work out between 10 and 11 o'clock in the morning, and membership started getting a little that grew a little bit because one of the guys can come work out because you got all these women from across the street coming over to work out at the gym. And he said, so our membership rose and he said we had this little smoothie bar, and he said, I worked it too. And he said, So after the girls got done working out, they'd come, you know, have a smoothie, have a snack. He said, I he said, I'd be there at the desk working on my sermon for the week. And they said, Well, what are you working on? He said, Well, I'm working on my sermon. He said, kind of need some. Would you just mind sit there and listen to me and so I can share it with you and just tell me what you think? And they said, Oh, sure. He said, So, you know, I tried to get him to come to church, tried to get him to come to church, and he said, You know, no, you know, yeah, they never came. He said, Finally, one week, a young lady that was a stripper from across the street, she said, I'll go with you. He she said, But I'm driving. So he said, she pulls up in this, you know, fancy car, and she's wearing probably, he said, her best dress that she's got. She and so they go into church and they get done church, and after church, the pastor and the deacons go, can we talk to you in the pastor's office for a minute? And yeah. And so she says, Well, I'll just meet you out the car. And he goes, he goes, Yeah, what what's up? He said, the pastors and the deacons said, We can't believe you brought her in here. He said, What do you mean? He said, We try to keep our kids and our people from things like that, out there dressed like that, looking like that. And he said, I wish I could have a better story and said I stood up for her. He said I was a a young youth pastor, and he said, I just bowed, ducked my head, and said, Yes, sir. Said I go out to the car and he said she's crying, and she said, That was about me, wasn't it? He said, Yeah. She said, You know, I'm I take off my clothes for a living. And she said, I've never been so humiliated as I was walking in that church having them look at me like that. And I think that happens a lot. Sure. And

The Plank, The Mirror, And Real Change

SPEAKER_01 8:06

sometimes in our own churches. That just like you said, when they're looking across the congregation, well, look at what she's wearing. Look at what how she's acting. Look at that. I th don't we sometimes even judge if somebody raises a hand up to praise a little bit? Or they sway a little bit too much to the good worship music? And I mean, and then if we're guilty of it in in church, what are we doing outside of church? And and just as you said, a speck in your brother's eye, that means we're looking pretty hard for a speck. I mean, if you ever try to find a speck, you're looking really hard for it. Sometimes I think you probably even have to get a magnifying glass out to see a speck. When all the while we have, as it said in the scripture, a plank. And our it's not hard to miss a plank. A speck's pretty hard to miss. So I think sometimes, just like you said, when judgment, we go looking for it. There's not a lot to talk about. What can we find to talk about?

SPEAKER_02 9:15

Ourselves. Because we got the big plank, right?

SPEAKER_00 9:20

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 9:21

And we can see if we just look at the plank and how much that we fall short with our walk with God. That's what makes this big plank. Because we're coming up short, correct?

SPEAKER_01 9:35

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_02 9:37

And so there you know, we're always gonna come up short, but we can shrink that plank down. We can shrink it down. First off by not looking for a speck in no one else's eye, but just look at ourselves in the mirror. As I've said many a times by looking in the mirror. If you want to change this world, you start with that person in the mirror, and look that person in the eye, and look down into their soul right there, because you're looking right straight into them, and that's yourself, and you search yourself and you see how big a plank you got, and you start shrinking that plank with your walk with God, and you turn into a better person, and as we know, as they say, uh, you know, but as we walk through life, the people we touch will see that we have Christ in us. That's what changes this world. You know, maybe that man had Christ. Maybe he didn't, you know, he took her along with the right intentions to church, right? He didn't take her to put him on his arm like, you know, candy or, you know, here's my little prize I won, you know, nothing like that. He took her there with good intentions for her to become closer to God and her to listen to, you know, some preaching and and all of that's what he took her for. He didn't take her there for everybody to be criticism of her. Mm-hmm. But if they'd have taken out their little makeup mirrors and her husbands had looked in their glasses or alone there with her wives that was doing all the pointing and grunting at their makeup mirror, and they changed themselves and say, Hey, I'm glad he brought her in. Maybe we can help change her life. Maybe we can somebody might have a job that she can get out of taking her clothes off for money. Maybe, you know, someone gives her an opportunity, she might be wanting to change her life and financially unable. I believe there's some stories like that in the Bible. You know, most prostitutes don't want to be a prostitute. I'm sure there's some that maybe they they like it. I don't know. But most people are wanting to improve their selves in some way in this world. We're trying to improve ourselves as Christians with our walk with God, and that will rub off on others.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

And I think we as as as you talk about shrinking the plank, making it smaller, it never goes away. Because none of us are perfect. Exactly. There's only one perfect person that walked the earth, and that was Jesus. None of us, so we always there's always something, so but realize what that's saying is that we are never at a place where we can judge. Ever.

SPEAKER_02 12:35

No. No, and and well, I lose my train of thought sometimes, but you know, when we're I've judged before, I don't know about everybody else, so I'm gonna speak in first person. And when you're speaking about changing this world, you you can speak in first person because that's the person that has to change. But even lots of times before you can help someone else. Because if you're not real yourself with God, how are you gonna be able to share truly what He is? Truly the love for your neighbor. They should have been loving that lady with love, not with criticism.

SPEAKER_01 13:21

Because we've talked about it before, that's what we're called to do, love thy neighbor.

SPEAKER_02 13:25

Yeah. Second most important commandment that there is. It covers a lot of ground. People have trouble loving thy neighbor, but they have a harder time looking in the mirror. They will duck the mirror. They're so full of self that they put their clone their hair, and I'm not picking man and woman alike, whatever they do in the mirror, whatever I do in the mirror, I don't worry about everybody else. But whatever I do in the mirror to try to make myself, you know, not look so ragged or whatever. But am I looking through into that mirror through into my inner self? I went in there and looked a few times, and I didn't always like what I seen. Not only am I getting older, but I didn't like what I seen on the inner. I didn't like it. I've been changing it slowly, trying to change it, try to look in there every once in a while. Stop and reflect, take a reflection of yourself. But don't look at that outer appearance because that don't matter. The only one that matters is what's on the inside. Mine's changing slowly. It's improving. I don't express it like I should all the time. I do things that are wrong. But it is changing because I do stop and I do look. You know, however much I change and however many times I go across the street and help that gal come to church, however many times I do all that, will still not get me into heaven. But it will show that I am trying following God and what he's asked. Only way I will get into heaven is in third person what he done, what Jesus done, when he died for all of our sins, because we are all sinners and we all come up short, and we all judge others. But if we truly believe in him, and we truly believe in God Himself, Jesus, and what happened there, and what all he's done, the forgiveness is there, only through him. But I can't do nothing but have that faith. And in having that faith, then I will do things to try to share and help others.

SPEAKER_01 15:52

And and the and the hope is that and and probably the challenge is kind of like Alan said, was it it's not always a fast overnight change. And I think you know, I always tell people when it comes to weight loss, you know, two to three pounds a week is a good weight loss that you can sustain over long over time. You can keep it lost. I mean you can keep losing at that rate at a good pace and keep it off. The same thing is true when it comes with our walk and change. Sometimes it is the slow pace that is the lasting pace because you learn along the way, you get to incorporate it, you get to practice it, you get a little bit better at it, and then you learn something new. And so it's a slow change is is not a bad change, it's a good thing because as long as you're changing it, haven't ever seen a timeline in the ta in the Bible that said this is the amount of time you have to change.

Why New Believers Need Support

SPEAKER_02 16:53

All I hear a lot from Christians, man, you gotta get out here and help the law, you gotta help the laws find Jesus, you gotta help the laws find Jesus. I think one of the most important things we can do is help the ones that have accepted Jesus, has been baptized. Oh, everybody's so excited, they won the race. But the race has just begun. And there's the ones we gotta be supporting. Because they're gonna fall. They're gonna trip. I have. Everybody does. Just like a baby when it's born, a baby Christian's the same way. It's a new we just talk about be born again. Mm-hmm. Brand new, be new it. Yeah, and there's the where the support is, but everybody, are you is he saved? Are you are she are you saved? Okay, you're good. No, you're not. Are we called to be disciples? And disciples is teaching. It's teaching. It's not just getting them to have an emotional moment in accepting Lot. I mean, I I'm that's all I don't mean to throw water on that by no means. It's important. But what do we do after that? Well, what you do after that is truly a sign of where your faith is. How strong is your faith? That's what after that is. You got the signal from God, you accepted him, you went through that transition, but now how strong is your faith? It's a it's a you to be built on a rock and to be building with stone is heavy. It takes time to build that. You just throw something up real quick, you throw up that little old stick hut, and it's gonna blow down. There's something to that story also. There's so much I was talking to a man this morning. We was talking about a lot of the parables that Jesus used and how many different meanings can come out of one parable. He might have been saying, you know, build your house upon you know the stone and not upon the sand, and you know, not you know, different ways that we think about it. But it's got a lot of different type thoughts and meaning in there that the Lord's trying to get you to think about. That's true. We can't disagree with what you get out of what I get out of it, because there's a lot of messages within one parable. But the main deal is the new Christian needs support. How many of them fall back out? I was baptized, but then I fell away. I'm one of them. I fell away. Mama tried, like the old Merle Haggard song, Mama tried, but you know, I let myself fall away. Maybe I pushed away, I don't know. But we need to be supporting them because that is the weak one of the weakest links is they think they're good. They've been told say this prayer and you're good. Accept Jesus, say this prayer, and you're good to go. That ain't the whole story.

SPEAKER_01 20:18

And that's our hope as the road traveled, is that we find you. Maybe you're on that road somewhere. Maybe you have been saved and asked Jesus to forgive you for your sins and into your heart. And you know, we're here to walk with you. And maybe you haven't gotten there yet. And our our hope is that that you do, and that we can walk with you in that journey.

SPEAKER_02 20:39

This guy of the day is talking about. So, what do you do for a new saved person? Tell them to read that Bible. Have you ever looked at a Bible? How thick it is? And you open, you say, read that thing from stem to stern. I mean, that's huge, really. To be able to stay hooked in to reading that Bible, yes, we need to read it, and yes, we need to study it. But that's what I like about Bible study is that's a support group. I even call ours, it's kind of a support group. I mean, I hadn't been to no AA meetings for a support group or something like that, but there's support groups out there for various things, whether it's for veterans or different things. But that's what to me a Bible study, a Sunday school class, church is, it's about support group. That's your support group. And in the I go to a couple of different Bible studies right now, I'm in going to, and and they're part of my support group. Yes, I'm learning more about the Bible, but it is supporting each other. Pardon me. And it's it's supporting my faith, it's growing my faith, it's keeping me going on the track a lot more than me out there trying to read the Bible and walk it on my own. Just yeah, I know we need to stay in prayer with him also, but that's Part of support, those new ones that here, let's pray together. You know, let's pray together. Let's read the Bible. Let's study together, you know. Well, they already keep coming to church. Well, I agree. But there's ways to, boy, that we got to be supportive of those because I think that's the I ain't real sure that that ain't the most lost in the world of someone that's came and then fell away. And they maybe still come to church and have fell away both at the same time. Yeah, it's possible.

SPEAKER_01 22:32

Very possible.

SPEAKER_02 22:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:35

It might be pointing at somebody else suspecting their eye. Yeah. And just like you mentioned, I mean, that's our big challenge for each of us to look in the mirror and see, to reflect and look inside and see what do we have, what planks do we have that we need to work on?

SPEAKER_02 22:51

But it's so easy to judge because we're trying to feel sometimes we're trying to feel some of our shortcomings as a person. And well, oh Aaron, he's not quite what he says. He is. Again, I say I because it's about self-help. It's about that I need to improve. So I'm speaking first person. I've got Jesus for my help. That's my third person. He's here to help me today. He'll be there for forgiveness if I will keep walking and learning and getting closer to him. One day at a time.

unknown 23:57

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 23:58

It takes it. It's a walk, it says. It's not a run. It's more of a marathon. It's a walking marathon. You gotta walk. You can't just run there and you know. You're done. Yeah. You got it. I'm finished. I'm done. No, it's a walk every day. Walk with him. Yep.

Prayer And A Simple Challenge

SPEAKER_02 24:19

Well, let me go to our Lord in word of prayer. Lord, we come to you as fallen men. You've made us humans. You know our weaknesses, Lord. And how easy it is for us to think of our own shortcomings and and try to cover them up with pointing out someone else's. Lord, I ask for forgiveness for mine and when I've done it. And I ask that you be with everyone that they may see and change their own lives to help change other lives. As we go down this road of life, Lord, there's a lot of stumbling blocks. There's rocks in the road, there's potholes, there's deep ditches on both sides if we get off the path to you. May you help us keep us in line. And we get encouragement from others, and we give encouragement to others, as you do to us. And it's in your Son Jesus Christ's holy name that we ask you these things. Amen. Amen.

SPEAKER_01 25:28

Thank you, EQ, for joining us on The Road Travel. As always, if you find value in an episode, we just encourage you to share it with others. Maybe you text it to them, maybe you tell them about it, just so you can help us meet others on the road they're traveling. And we just hope that find a little value in it, and it just helps you on your road. As always, thank you for joining us today, and we look forward to seeing you on the road.

SPEAKER_00 25:52

You've been listening to The Road Travel, where real faith meets real life. Remember, every step matters, even the hard ones. So keep walking your road with courage, conviction, and Christ leading the way. Until next time, your hosts, Aaron and Allen, say we'll see you down the road.