Becoming Saiyans-A Dragon Ball re-watch podcast
Join Trueman as he shows Jessie the world of Dragon Ball, two episodes at a time. New episodes every Thursday at 6am EST. Artwork by Tenshiart. Email us at becomingsaiyans@gmail.com
Becoming Saiyans-A Dragon Ball re-watch podcast
Yamcha's Vengence Episodes 88-89
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Welcome to Becoming Saiyans, a Dragon Ball Rewatch podcast. And we're back. I'm Truman. And I'm Jesse. And this is Becoming Saiyans Dragon Ball Rewatch Podcast. On today's episode, we watched episodes 88 and 89 titled Yamcha's Big Break and Full Moon Vengeance. Yamcha's Big Break aired in Japan on November 18th, 1987, and December 11th, 2002, while Full Moon Vengeance aired in November 25th, 1987, and December 12th, 2002. Looking forward to some of the differences from the manga and the trivia, in the first episode, Yamcha's display of the neo-wolfing fist is more impressive in the anime, where he's able to make, you know, a few scratches on Tien. It isn't until Yamcha uses three times too many that Tien can properly counter. And the manga, Tien's able to easily counter from the first time.
SPEAKER_03Gotcha.
SPEAKER_00The scenes were in the audience where Bullman Ulong, you know, shows all them, not in the manga, when Yamcha's leg gets broken, the announcer comments that Yamcha's leg is bent in a weird angle. Uh and the manga, this was said by Ulon. In the manga, the tournament's events and happenings all occur the same day. Four days. We talked about this last episode.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um in the manga, as Tien is leaving the ring after mocking Goku, he says they should not leave the ring so as to not be rude to the next contestants. The anime does not say this for the above reason. Uh the announcer's line about the next match starting up is changed to the sponsor, telling everyone the fight is finished for the day. Um anime has a scene where Manwolf proclaiming to Jackie that he'll kill him, followed by Krillin wondering why uh why he seems to hate Jackie. The group confronts Yamcha for his loss with Goku saying he'll avenge the former. And they go back to eat at the same restaurant. All that's, you know, all exclusive to the anime. The next day shows, you know, Roshi with his Jackie Chung disguise, which I don't understand what that's talking about here. Because like all we saw was Roshi go into the bushes and wake up his cousin Jackie and then stay there to watch over Jackie's stuff. Um that's our that's our headband. But then Jackie meets up with Goku and Krillin, and they have another episode with Mamwolf. Uh trivia, um, one of the characters from Dr. Slump can be seen in the audience. Um Delicious is the only restaurant they ever go to in these tournaments. Umcha shouting, this one's for Nam, was only the English, because in Japanese Nam is never mentioned in this arc again after his defeat. Yeah. None of the group seems to wonder why Jackie Chung is at the hospital even. Because, you know, I mean, I I can understand it. He's a concerned patron of this tournament. Wants to make sure that, you know, someone's gonna be a good thing.
SPEAKER_02Well, they're they're they seem to be pretty good friends already, because like, I mean, Goku and Krillin and Yamsa and them all hung out in the last tournament.
SPEAKER_00So of course yeah, they're like they know each other. They're they're kind of like a thing. They were all excited to see each other. They're a squad, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's like uh it's like how you go to you know Pokemon tournaments and you have like your squad of people. You you have friends. Yeah. Everyone has a group of friends when they if they're competing competitively or something.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And then Goku with the the excusing himself from the the the confrontation, to wash his hands is the Japanese dub and or the English dub. The Japanese dub is that he's going to go to the restroom to pee.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, he's gonna go pissed.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um jumping down to the differences from the manga, the spectators was all filler, the girls trying to get the autographs is all filler. Tien discovering the reason Mamwolf's grudged via an article is filler. Bulma sneaking Yamcha out of the hospital is filler. Um in the manga, Manwolf straight up told Jackie how the former destroyed the moon. In the anime, we he tries to get Jackie to remember it while only telling him after. In the manga, Goku and Krillin observing the crane student's flight ability happens after Manwolf reveals his reasons. This changed to the before due to the above change. Yeah. In the Manwolf's flashback, he's shown being a spectator, no um, watching the finals, but that was never made before that was never wasn't shown in the manga at all. He is just saying that he knows Jackie destroyed the moon. Manwolf's flashback to his training is not in the manga, which we kind of you can kind of assume that. At the end of the episode for the trivia, Tien is seen without his third eye when Chiatsu leaves to enter the ring. Which is kind of crazy. They just like forgot to color it on there, you know.
SPEAKER_02Got to patch it on.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Uh the Japanese version, uh, or in the Japanese version, Jackie asks Manwolf why he doesn't just take female wolves. Uh Manwolf snacks b uh snaps back that he hates hairy girls. This wasn't carried over. Um, it just changed Jackie's line to him asking Mamwolf to finish talking so they could fight. Uh the latter gets uh gets onto him for treating him treating the situation so casually. As far as trivia and differences, that's all we got. So, previously on Dragon Ball. The second stanza of our Tien vs. Yamcha fight takes part, where Yamcha gets goes a little bit harder in the paint, uses his Wolfang fist again, and along with the Wolfing kick, eventually Tien is able to outlast and outwit him, forcing Yamcha into his third stanza, his last strongest move, the Kamehameha Blast. Where Tien's able to redirect it right back at him, almost knock it, almost kill him. Kameya Mea Wave, by the way. Yeah. You said blast. Sorry, sorry. Um they will the fans will complain if you do it wrong. Um but Tien's able to redirect it back at Yamcha, almost killing him, and then Yamcha and Tien fight a little bit more before Yamcha eventually is defeated, and then Tien drops down and breaks his leg like at the knee.
SPEAKER_02Um absolutely snaps it unnecessarily.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it was the fight was already over, and Yamcha, or and then Tien drops out of the sky, drops a knee on the knee.
SPEAKER_02It's like, oh, this man just hates being a nice person.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um jumping, and then we we follow that through where Yamcha's back at the the uh hospital. They and Goku vows to avenge his former his partner. Um meanwhile, Jackie wakes up in the bushes to Roshi yelling at him and telling him to get out there and fight. So Roshi is like, but I'll stay back and watch all your watch your sleeping bag. We don't want anybody to come steal this. And so Jackie goes on to fight in the second episode against the man wolf. Um we find out, like we talked about in the last episode, he has a vendetta against Roshi for blowing up the moon. So he spent the entire three years training for this moment to fight um Jackie. But unfortunately, Jackie's just a little too strong and is able to easily feet defeat him, but then does the good thing of transforming him back into a human who who's to tell if that's a upgrade or not? And the episode ends with uh Chiatsu and Krillin facing each other as their match is about to start. And that's what you missed on Dragon Ball, Jesse. Go for.
SPEAKER_02Some great, some great fighting. Even even though it's like pretty one-sided, all things considered, especially it sounds like in the manga, they do they are not apologetic by how one-sided probably both of these fights are in the manga.
SPEAKER_00I mean, and like to be fair, Yamcha is not on this level, you know.
SPEAKER_02Um it's really a sneak peek of the fact of Yamcha is never on anyone's level.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I do, I do love like skipping around, skipping to it real quick, it's like because it's just fresh in my mind how arrogant Tien is. Where it's just like, he's like, I defeated the best fighter Roshi has. Like, no, you defeated the worst fighter Roshi has.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I wrote that down here, all this talk about Yamcha's skills, and he's the newest member to the team. He's the newest, and almost certainly like it's we already know that Goku's stronger.
SPEAKER_02If he's stronger than anybody, he's maybe a tiny bit stronger than Krillin. But I would argue because Krillin has was able to train with Roshi before the last tournament, and Yamsha did not. Krillin is is like it's probably Yamsha, Krillin, and then Jackie slash Roshi, because they're probably not the same level, and then Goku, I think, is risen above everybody at this point. Yeah. But we don't we can't confirm it until we get further into the tournament saga, but that's the thought process. Yeah, is Goku's probably the best fighter on the planet right now.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, you know, at least like top two.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. There might be there might be someone out there that we don't know of, but it's of the people we have seen in the show, Goku is by far the strongest person we know of on the planet. That we can confirm exists.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and these these two episodes are really fun. Because the first episode is this action-packed, like crazy fun, like fighting matchup. And then the second episode is just Jackie Chung dog walking, pun intended, uh, on manual. Because he he just puts he puts belt to at on that guy, you know? Like he's giving him belt. About his, you know, it's crazy what he does to this guy. It's like downright disrespectful at moments. Like straight up.
SPEAKER_02Not even down, it's just it's straight up just disrespectful.
SPEAKER_00He turns his back on him, and man wolf's like, how dare you turn your back on me? Goes to punch him, and he's not even there. It was one of the after images.
SPEAKER_02Yep, it's an afterimage, he's just laying on the floor behind him.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. It is so disrespectful. We're not there yet. Uh, we're still on the first episode. But we get to start the first episode with a Tien or with a Yamcha Wolf Thank Fist. No one could ever stop that. And Tien is stopped that. Tien stopped that. And they, you know, they have we have a good like these they seem evenly matched, at least at this point. Because Yamcha and Tien are both like blocking each other.
SPEAKER_02They both they both cut each other in the middle of this like combo they're going at each other with.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Like Yamcha is holding his own. I think even Jackie says at this point in the episode, he's like, oh, Yamsha's actually like improved drastically. Like Yamcha's really good.
SPEAKER_00I mean, it makes sense for uh for Jackie to have that, you know, because Jackie has all hasn't seen Yamsha in three years now. So of course, like he's like, man, I remember watching that guy last episode.
SPEAKER_02Oh man, my cousin's really done a good job with this one.
SPEAKER_00My cousin's a great teacher.
SPEAKER_02I love our little bit of Jackie being.
SPEAKER_00I don't know what you're talking about. This isn't a bit. This is straight up factual.
SPEAKER_02But I never heard of it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I've never heard of a bit. Unless it's 8-bit, and we're talking about Mario, because in that case, you know, I I played the crap out of that game. Um, and that's I literally had this down here. I was like, well, you haven't seen him in three years, Jackie. That was one of my notes. So of course he improved. What do you think? He was just gonna rest on his laurels, his like, what was it, like fifth place finish last last time?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, give or take somewhere on that. Yeah. Because he was, he was ironically enough, he's improved a lot, but he probably got the second best fighter in this entire tournament. First round, and he goes out first round.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. That that's just tough. Like it's bad luck, which I know it's not even luck, it's purely like they f they made this happen. T and Chatsu purposely like made the matchups exactly what they were. Like Tim was like, I'm gonna put Goku on the other side of the mat. We're gonna give him whatever the heck that guy's name. Pomput. Pompet, yeah, Pomput. Um we barely know his name. Um, Chatsu, you can have Krillin. I know you guys have beef, so you can have him. Uh Roshi or Manwolf seems to really not like uh Jackie Chung, so we better, you know, put those two together. And then we got TN and Yamcha.
SPEAKER_02Because they've been having a grudge match since we showed up for the tournament.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, since they looked at each other, they're like, I don't like that guy.
SPEAKER_02You're my antithesis.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um but you know who is winning their matchup in this fight? Bulma. Yeah. Bulma is winning her fight against Ulong. She is beating the tar out of him.
SPEAKER_02I made I made a joke. I was like, man, she should have entered the tournament. She would have actually held her own pretty well.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Uh but Yamsha, we know one thing about Yamsha, is that he would rather die than give up.
SPEAKER_02I'd rather die.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Bad word, I'd rather die.
SPEAKER_01I'd rather die.
SPEAKER_00Um and then like because he refuses to give up, we then find out that we have our fourth ever on-screen user of the command mailwave. Because our first one, Roshi. Second one, uh, Goku. Third one, Jackie Chung. And fourth one, Yamcha. So that's our four. The four. Our four command mail waves. You can assume probably at least five command waves. Gohan could probably be.
SPEAKER_02Because Gohan probably has it, but he didn't have to use it. He didn't want to nor have to use it in the Goku Gohan fight.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and then probably even Ox King at one point probably could could do it.
SPEAKER_01I I would I would say neither.
SPEAKER_00I think he's retired at this point. Like by the time we've by the time we've reached him, he's retired from fighting, really.
SPEAKER_02My argument for why he can't use it is because it seems like he dropped out of the training before Gohan did. And I feel like the Kamehameha wave seems like something that like Roshi didn't even teach to Yamcha. Yamcha kind of taught himself. Yeah, just kind of seems like it's like. Because it's a late it's a later stage training for like the Turtle Hermit School.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it just kinda seems like, yeah, it's definitely the way that like Jackie reacted to it, and the way that Krillin reacted to it in Goku is like, I don't know how he can do this, but he's doing it, you know.
SPEAKER_02So it also I also argue like Oxking is so focused on just brute strength, he probably just did a lot of strength training. I just I was thinking like he thinks of techniques like that.
SPEAKER_00I was thinking maybe at some point he might have learned it, but that doesn't mean he's like actively he can actively do it.
SPEAKER_02Actively right now, there's maybe five, there's maybe a six that we're forgetting that would know how to use it. Um but there's definitely five.
SPEAKER_00But unfortunately for um for Yamcha, Tien Shinhan also trained at the Wabafet school and was able to use Mirror Coat and reflect that damage right back out of. That's a little bit of a Pokemon joke for you guys. Um Mirror Coat is a move that doubles the damage back if it's a special move like a beam or something, and or a wave attack, you know. And so the wave coming at him, he's like, I'm just gonna redirect that at you with double strength. Because he like blows up that that side of the arena they're on, too.
SPEAKER_02He probably we probably have some uh off-screen kills.
SPEAKER_00Um, Judge, I would like to present uh murderer here. Uh he should be disqualified.
SPEAKER_02Technically, technically, you there's nothing that says you can't accidentally murder.
SPEAKER_00There's no rule that says you can't kill the audience.
SPEAKER_02There's no rule that the audience can't be collateral damage. Because we the only rule we know of is you can't purposely kill your opponent. Yeah. Which is also why he just breaks his leg at the end. He's like, I can get away with breaking the leg, but any anything worse than that I probably get disqualified.
SPEAKER_00And then Jesse, knowing how stuff goes with Yamcha later on, like brought up the fact that this is like when a superstar like night like a Derek Rose situation. Yeah. It's like Yamcha.
SPEAKER_02Yamcha is only as good as he is in this moment for the rest of his life because he he got a devastating knee injury.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um that's why he sucks so bad.
SPEAKER_00And then I love the crap talking between these guys at the restaurant, between Shin and Roshi. And then also, like, to a certain extent, like TM being like, yeah, I took down their best fighter. And we already brought this up, but like Yamsha's not their best fighter. Yamsha does not.
SPEAKER_02Yamsha is almost uh is is certainly the the third. At best, tied for third with Krillin. At worst, he's fourth behind Krillin.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he is he is not their best fighter.
SPEAKER_02Um and but how are they to know that? They think they see more mature man.
SPEAKER_00And because of the last episode, or the the filler episode, like in the anime, the filler episode where they ran into each other, he was able to beat Goku rather easily.
SPEAKER_02By just dropping a tree on him.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And but they all disregard Krillin, which I think no one should ever disregard Krillin. I my wild prediction about what's gonna happen in this tournament is Krillin's gonna win the whole thing. Krillin's gonna beat Goku in the semis and then beat Tien in the finals. That's what's gonna happen, because Krillin, best fighter in the whole show. There ain't no way anything could happen to him. He's so good.
SPEAKER_02Surely he's not gonna lose in the immediate next episode, he wise.
SPEAKER_00He would never. Krillin, never. Not my goat. Not my shortcut.
SPEAKER_02Surely he's not gonna get ringed out by telekinesis.
SPEAKER_00Not my six-star Dragon Ball King, because he's got the six dots on his forehead.
SPEAKER_02No, uh, but yeah, it's just like it's because he beat Goku, but he doesn't know that Goku, one of Goku's biggest weaknesses is being hungry all hungry. Like, Goku just sucks when he's hungry.
SPEAKER_00My second point on that is like if you're counting the anime exclusive events, like he thinks that if you're just counting the manga, it is what you said, where it's like, yeah, I'm just the biggest and the presumably the strongest, because the other two are children.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and I think this dialogue was written with both with both being available. Yeah, it was both being available because I feel like this is dialogue that was probably existed. It didn't seem like this was manga only. Yeah, or anime only. Yeah, like it just existed the manga in which we don't have the filler moment where he fights Goku. So it was written basically like, oh, I beat the I beat the oldest trainee, obviously I'm gonna win.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he's obviously been with Roshi the longest. I mean, look, he's been look at these small children Roshi's been bringing along.
SPEAKER_02Like he's obviously and they weren't there for the last tournament, aren't they? Yeah. So they so they they might not even know that Goku and Krillin were in the last tournament as Roshi trainees, and Yangsu was not a Roshi trainee. Yeah. So they don't have that backstory. So he's just going off of what makes the most sense.
SPEAKER_00And then if you look at the anime exclusive, it's also he's like, well, Goku's no threat, and if Goku's no threat, there's no way this Goku put up less of a fight last time.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and there's no character there.
SPEAKER_00And Krillin can no way be better than Goku. I mean, look at Goku's hair, he's too strong. But like that's kind of bald. That's that's kind of the thought process. It's like, bro, you're bald, what do you mean? But you know, neither here nor there. Um the whole point is just that it's hilarious that they're they're so confident. And like we talk about like we talked about in the Red Ribbon Army saga, being that confident when going into a fight against this group of people is the worst thing you can do because they will like they will over they you're underestimating them and they will overproduce what you ha what you're thinking.
SPEAKER_02Like, it's so on the nose every time when someone's overconfident, you can just be like, Matt, you're gonna die. Like you're gonna lose.
SPEAKER_00It's the same as like when we were talking about that, you know, him fighting or you know, Goku fighting what can't think of his name, King Choppa or whatever it was. Oh yeah, King Choppa. From like the you know, the pre-P.
SPEAKER_02The very first pre-Limit match.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and it's like everyone's like, oh no, how's Goku gonna do this? This guy is so strong, and it's like you're building him up. There's gonna be like it's gonna be like a wet fart, you know, when Goku, like that's how this fight's gonna go.
SPEAKER_02It's gonna be it's gonna be just a t a tiny little squeak and a whimper, and he's he's gone. And in the in the manga, it was. It was as fast as I claimed it.
SPEAKER_00And I mean it still was like very fast.
SPEAKER_02But we gotta pat we gotta put an extra 30 seconds, or else we really just might as well not even put it in the episode.
SPEAKER_00And they're also you know, allowing like um to show off a little bit of what Goku can do. Yeah. Because, you know, we haven't seen Goku really fight, really. You know, he's fought in all the all the episodes before this, but like he wasn't really fighting, you know. There were no stakes. So um, but that's all I have on the first episode, unless you've got something.
SPEAKER_02Uh I also pointed out I have realized very likely I didn't we didn't look it up, but very likely Pilaf's VA is Shin. Oh yeah, but definitely Shin English VA is Shin.
SPEAKER_00When they were arguing at each other, it sounded like Pilaf screaming about stuff. Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_02So it might be the same voice actor. He's obviously not using the same voice constantly. But like when it's Pilaf snu Pilaf snuck out when he was mad.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, when he was elevated, it came out. It's like um when Commander Red his Scottish came out, or Scottish German, whatever the accent was.
SPEAKER_03It's flying around.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, his his uh, you know, ambiguously European accent came out when he was angry. Um but jumping into the next episode, my first note, my very first note is man, Roshi's such a great cousin. You know, making sure that Jackie wakes up from his troubles and takes care of all the stuff while Jackie goes and fights. No, this is what he's been doing at both tournaments. Why we never we almost never see Roshi. Instead he's taking care of Jackie's stuff. It makes sense. It's perfect. Who would have thought?
SPEAKER_02Like really there's not other explanations for what's going on.
SPEAKER_00Like Roshi being like this perverse character and also like this sage, you know, sensei. And also, you know, completely disregarding his sister, but he loves his cousin so much that he's just the greatest cousin you could ever ask for.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. It makes sense.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, exactly. Um, and then like my next note was like, 'cause I think pretty shortly after that we cut to Yamcha and Bolna in the hospital, and then like the people like giving them a hard time about like No, we ac we actually cut to the fighters walking in. Oh yeah. I like skipped over there.
SPEAKER_02Where the fangirls go and they're like, Oh, like they l they see Pomput and they're like, Oh my goodness, you these look so cool and cute and they see uh Tien and uh Chiatsu walking in. She's like, I love Artist Dark Eyes just gorgeous.
SPEAKER_00All three of them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, all three of them. They're so gorgeous. And then Jackie. Yeah, and then we gotta no, then we see Goku walk in trying to have to piss. Yeah. They're just kind of like, when you gotta go, you gotta go.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, except for they don't even say like that. They're like, well, I I guess when you gotta go, yeah, you just gotta go.
SPEAKER_02And then we flash into the the like the area where the fair girls are walking around, and they walk up to Jack and I'm like, oh such big friends, Jackie. He's like, I love being in touch. This is where we get the Jackie moment, like the Jackie Roman. The Jackie Roshi Perv moment thing. They both they both have the same per view.
SPEAKER_00Well, it seems like it's just a canonical thing that when you hit a certain age in the Dragon Ball universe, you just become a perverse person. You become a murder old man. Dr. Brief.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, everyone has their moments.
SPEAKER_01But like Jackie's like, I can't love being in touch with the tea, with the youth. Let me touch you. He's like, oh hey, who the heck was that coming from?
SPEAKER_00Uh point of order on this. Where the heck is the security? They never let people walk behind the stage at the last one. Meanwhile, they just got like people walking around asking for autographs the whole time.
SPEAKER_02Where is the judges? Where's the security? And then Wolfman, um, sorry, not man, not Wolfman, Man Wolf. Yeah. He gets really he gets really mad if you say Wolfman.
SPEAKER_00He's over there.
SPEAKER_01Like they get scared and like, Jackie, save us, help us, Jackie, oh.
SPEAKER_02And then like Manwolf walks off because like the uh the judge walks over and is like, we can go do something outside or whatever. Let's go give you a manicure. Yeah, let's go check out those nails. Yeah. Or those nails. Yeah. Yeah. And then uh and then we flash to the hospital.
SPEAKER_00And my thing is is that these guys really this couple is really honestly like they make they work together so well. Like, for a character like Bulma, you've gotta have somebody who you gotta have one or two different one of two different types character archetypes if you're gonna have somebody to have them coupled up with. Somebody who um just straight up disregards her disregards her crazy and like takes care of her, but like disregards her crazy moments because she's crazy at times. Yeah. Or you gotta have somebody who tends to her every need. And it feels like Yamcha, for the most part, falls it, like accepts that the cra accepts the crazy and does his best to take care of her in every moment despite it, you know. Instead of just like disregarding it completely, maybe like some other character down the line might do, you know? Um but like there you have one of two, you know, one person who likes you know, they both love her, but one is like, I love you, including your crazy, and the other one's like uh maybe later down the line, the second archetype would be like, I love you despite your crazy, you know? Um, and like I think that they make a really cute couple. And like, you know, the the gag of the people in the hospital being like, Oh, look at the cute little couple, and then Bulma like stepping on his foot or like rolling over his foot or something. But she's she stomped on his foot. Yeah, it's like on his injured leg. Yeah, on the injured leg that's in a cast. Like she like breaks the cast with her foot, like and he's like, ouch! Yeah, and that's just like a fun little like gag, like a burn burn bam, you know. That's what that is, and it's it's great, and they're great, but then they're not even the best part of this episode. The best part of this episode, MVP for this episode is Jackie, because this fight with the manwolf is he's such a savage, and he's so disrespectful the entire time.
SPEAKER_02Because like manwolf comes in trying to like get Jackie to admit what he did wrong.
SPEAKER_01And Jackie's like, I don't remember.
SPEAKER_02I don't even know you. Like, why are you mad at me? Well, maybe you got a mistaken identity, and then he like makes a joke about a party.
SPEAKER_00And he's like, I don't I don't know anything about a party.
SPEAKER_02I look like I got a partners. He gets mad at him for that. Yeah, and uh Jackie just Jackie just keeps touring on him constantly, and it's so funny.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's just it's constant. The entire fight is just like manwolf eventually like tells him everything, and we get this is one of those flashbacks. I'm like, this is a warranted flashback. Like, we need to have this, like, you know, understanding of what it is that happened.
SPEAKER_02I think it I think it serves two purposes. It serves the purpose of Manwolf is telling him in the arena.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and and it's a retcon, which retcons are always fun. I love retcons. Like, if you do them right, retcons are great, and this is definitely like a retcon done right. And in case you guys don't know, that's retroactive continuity. It means that like what we saw wasn't exactly what happened, there was also other things going on in the background. So this that's where manwolf came from. Long story short, it's kind of what we said during the last episode where it's manwolf is mad because Jackie blew up the moon, which like trapped him in his wolf form um permanently. And he used to like enjoy going out as a human during the times where he's able to, but now that he's stuck as a manwolf, he's you know, very angry. So he spent three years training to kick Jackie's butt.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and like, and also I think at the same time, Tien and uh Chiatsu are kind of like reading the newspaper. Yeah, they read the newspaper about and they're reminiscing about like the story as well at the same time. But like, and it's a it's a great time to flash back where it's like, oh yeah, he was at the tournament. He actually watched his life get ruined. Yeah. And air quotes. Yeah. Um, live. You gotta watch it live in person. So he like it wasn't one of those things where like, oh, he just learned about it through the grave final. He was there watching when Jackie blew up the moon.
SPEAKER_00He personally he's maybe the only man wolf in the entire world, the entire race of man wolves in this world, who knows exactly who blew up the moon and wants to. Like why the moon is missing. Yeah. Um, but it doesn't even matter because Jackie does not care one bit. We find out later he does, but as far as the fight goes, he does not give one.
SPEAKER_02Jackie's here to win the fight, and then he'll deal with the manwolf problem later. And that's exactly what happened.
SPEAKER_00And honestly, it's like it almost doesn't even think Jackie is even there to win the fight. It almost feels like Jackie's there to mess around. It's ridiculous what's going on there. Because Jackie, like, is literally just having a case of the F arounds during this fight. He's literally just like laying on the ground after Imogene for no reason.
SPEAKER_01I mean, for yeah, I guess.
SPEAKER_00Well, I mean, it is for no reason. He could win this fight at any moment. It's literally just for no reason.
SPEAKER_02He could literally probably just pick Manwolf up and carry him outside of the arena and drop him.
SPEAKER_00He almost does that later on with the whole knife, you know. He literally like picks he does the um Tao thing where Tal like grabs the spear while uh Bora had Bora was it Borough? It was Bora and he just picks him up by the spear and throws him into the air. Like it's literally just that thing. And Jackie does that to him. Um Jackie, you know, just totally disrespectful this entire fight. And the way he wins is maybe the most disrespectful thing.
SPEAKER_02It's the most disrespectful thing because he's like explaining to Manwolf, like, I feel your plight, like I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_00I totally understand where you're coming from. Uh paw.
SPEAKER_02Put your paw out. Give me your page.
SPEAKER_00And he does he does the shake, and then he's like, What are you doing? That's not that's not funny.
SPEAKER_02You're just you're just messing with me, man. No, no, no.
SPEAKER_00I I totally understand where you're coming from. Now sit.
SPEAKER_02And then Manwolf sits, he's like, Why are you gonna speak to you?
SPEAKER_00And then everybody starts laughing, and like, they're all laughing at me.
SPEAKER_02He's like, I was like, oh, I'm so sorry, man.
SPEAKER_00You want a bone? Bone? Bone, you want a bone? Throws the bone out of the ring. Manwolf jumps, lands on the ground.
SPEAKER_02Manwolf fetches the bone. He's like, he throws the bone and says fetch, and manwolf fetches the bone, realizes what's just happened, and it's just like, I'm gonna kill you, basically. He's like, I'm gonna kill you.
SPEAKER_00And so then Jackie, you know, does some uh you know, Vulcan nerve grab or whatever to like stop him. Um and this is this is another point in the fact that Jackie and Roshi aren't the same character for you guys out there who think they are. Jackie has a completely different skill set. Jackie has telepathy, Jackie is like has the ability to just per uh paralyze people. When have we ever seen Roshi do these kinds of things? Jackie literally hypnotizes this man so that he pretends that Krillin's head is the full moon and turns Manwolf back into a human. And like that's the way he wins. It's just that. Um, like, I mean, he won and then he like saves him. And then we get more Jackie being an absolute savage, where he's like, I mean, what some people think is an upgrade, I will never understand.
SPEAKER_02He basically he uses Krillin's bald head, which is also disrespectful as heck to Krillin. But he uses Krillin's bald head to hypnotize him to be like, Krillin's bald head is the moon. If you look at the moon, you'll turn into a man.
SPEAKER_00And then he's back to a man. And then then Jackie's like, I can't believe what he's just an upgrade.
SPEAKER_02They must not have mirrors where he's from. Because like he turns into to be to be fair, they purposely make like draw him as an ugly man.
SPEAKER_00He looks like an ugly cave person from like a Hannah Barbera cartoon.
SPEAKER_02Well, what I'll tell you, he looks like what bacterion could look like if bacteria kept himself clean.
SPEAKER_00And like the best version of bacteria being clean. The the best potential for bacteria is this is what manwolf looks like. A knuckle dragging cave person.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. So, like, it's it's really funny, like, he's just completely savaging him as he runs off. Yeah. And then that's pretty much where it ends off because you know, Krillin stays in the ring because the the next fight's gonna happen, because all the rest of the the the quarters finals are like taking place. The final eight is taking place.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. They only stopped the last one for the night was because Yamcha broke his leg and the first one.
SPEAKER_02I think I think they stopped it for two reasons. Because they I think they had done all the preliminaries, like first, that like in the beginning. It's kind of like how um um like in a like in Pokemon tournaments, you do a lot of the knockout, you do some of the knockouts, and then you come back for the final day and you have like the like the semis and the final or whatever.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's one of those big ones, like the worlds and stuff.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but that's but yeah, it's like you you do it, you do like a lot you do all the qualifiers and then like maybe one or two knockouts, and then you finish everything else the next day. I gotcha. They're kind of doing something like that, except for I'm sure the final will happen on a separate day, maybe or whatever. Yeah. Um, but like, so now Krill and Shiazu are like it ends with them staring at each other in the ring and them getting ready to ring the dong.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Or hit the dong, I guess I should say.
SPEAKER_00And I mean that's kind of where it leaves off. But my last note was this is one of the funniest episodes we've had in a while. Like, we have funny moments on most of these episodes. This is the fun this is the most comedy-centered episode in a while. Like this one episode. Because Jackie is just zinger off on top of zinger on top of zinger, on top of just like funny gag. Um, the even the Goku having to go pee thing is funny to a certain extent, you know.
SPEAKER_02There's all like all the other fighters are walking in like all serious and cool, and Goku just comes running up doing the potty dance.
SPEAKER_00But possibly the strongest one in the whole group is like, I have to pee!
SPEAKER_02Let me We're gonna pour each other nearest bathroom.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, all of it is just head to toe. This is like some pretty good comedy here.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so it's exciting. And I'm also just excited for the next couple episodes because I'm just we all love a tournament art.
SPEAKER_00And we're all love our boy Kay Rillin.
SPEAKER_02Yep, it's time is it's time to watch him die. He's not gonna die.
SPEAKER_00He's not gonna die. There's no way Chiyatsu's gonna kill him. There's uh Krillin is gonna win this fight. A hundred percent, hands down. I'm telling you my prediction now. Krillin, he's gonna win the whole tournament, dang it. I'm putting all my money on it. All my whole paycheck is going on Krillin winning this fight.
SPEAKER_02I'll take that. I'll take my entire paycheck on all the time. Alright, deal.
SPEAKER_00We shook on it.
SPEAKER_02That's obviously a joke. We're definitely joking. Do not do not gamble responsibly kids, actually.
SPEAKER_00Well, especially with everything going on nowadays, we need to make sure we say that up front. Yeah. Um, but now, Jesse, you ready to get into our prediction section?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I'm excited to see how many I hit. I think I missed the big break for uh Yonjo and not predict.
SPEAKER_00The only two predictions you had for this episode was TN wins the fight and Manwolf gives him a fight but loses. And one of those is right. Because Manwolf does not give him a fight and the slightest.
SPEAKER_02I was overestimating like the hatred in Manwolf. Yeah, like actually being a little bit.
SPEAKER_00You really thought he was gonna be able to be strong enough to do it with just because like pure rage and vengeance.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I really just thought like Manwolf was gonna be at least a tiny bit of a threat. But no, he just he played with this movie the entire fight.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, literally. Didn't I only didn't I don't think Manwolf landed a touch on him? Like at any point in the thing. Pretty much Roshi just dodged everything.
SPEAKER_02If Manwolf landed a like a touch to Roshi to um Jackie, it would have been because he let him.
SPEAKER_00Alright, so with that, Jesse, you also got your two predictions for the the way the first two fights were going to go, right? You had Tien beating Yamcha and Jackie beating the Manwolf. Yep. Um, but that the we're not done with those. Those are I'm counting that as an all or nothing. Yeah. Like you have to get the entire tournament right or a zero percent.
SPEAKER_02I have to do the NTLA bracket.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. You have to have a perfect bracket on this one. Um, but I'm just letting you know you're you know 50% through the quarterfinals with all of them being right.
SPEAKER_02I feel pretty confident that I picked what Chatsu and then Goku to win, right?
SPEAKER_00Yes.
SPEAKER_02Jatsu is probably the only one that's minor mildly questionable, but I just have a feeling they're gonna do the game. That's gonna be a very even matchup, is my thought process.
SPEAKER_00Okay. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02But one of those someone's gonna have to win it.
SPEAKER_00Alright. Going into the next two episodes, we have the Dodon R wave and counting controversy. What do you think is going to happen in the next two episodes titled The Dodon Ray and Counting Controversy?
SPEAKER_02Well, let me just get over who's gonna win. Um Goku will win his fight, and uh Chiatsu will win his fight, because that's what I predicted on the bracket. So I'll just put that as like an individual episode. Uh, because it was like I might as well stick to my guns on both sides. And then I'm gonna say the Dodon Ray is the special ray that uh Chiatsu knows. And that's how he beats Krillin is by using it. Okay. Or at least part of how he beats Krillin, maybe not the final finishing move.
SPEAKER_00And by the way, point of order is doing on wave, not Ray. In case I said the wrong thing. I think I might have said the wrong thing. But yeah, it's wave. Don't come at us.
SPEAKER_02Um I could have also just misheard it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I just wanted to say it in case, you know.
SPEAKER_02Gotta correct it. People are very serious when it comes to the named things. Yeah. And I can't blame them 100%.
SPEAKER_00Alright, so what you have here is Goku will win his fight, Chiatsu will win his fight, the Donan Wave is Chiatsu's secret weapon. Do you have any guess on what the counting controversy could be?
SPEAKER_02Uh maybe like there's a weird judge count on like Pomput or Goku in that fight that like almost causes. I'm gonna say there's a weird counting error like on the count out for knockout on Goku because Goku like falls asleep or something. Okay. And people like have to wake him up because he's not necessarily unconscious or something.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, kind of uh they did in the last couple of fights where it's literally like like the la like during the last tournament when Goku like fell asleep at one point because he was like put to sleep by Jackie. And then like he gets woken up before the counting can start. Maybe there's maybe Pompa throws a throws a pit about it or something. Yeah. Um, okay, I like that.
SPEAKER_02Or if I or something with Pompay County.
SPEAKER_00I like that. Um, Jesse, with that all out of the way, what is your worst part?
SPEAKER_02Worst part. I mean, even like the funny, even like the pervy moment with Jackie, like, it isn't terrible, but it's probably the lowest part of the entire these two episodes because there's not really anything else to hate in these episodes. Yeah. And I don't even I don't even necessarily hate it. It's just like it's the only awkward bit of these episodes. I think the only one I mean it's not even a bad joke.
SPEAKER_00It's it's such it's just like an i it's an it's just like it's whatever. Like, you know. Um, but as far as like bad, like it like calling something the worst part when you're talking about like solid eight and a half, like the worst part, unless like the unless that one thing drops a 10 to an eight and a half and one one fell swoop, like we're we're we're just picking straws, you know. Like my my worst part, quote unquote, is just that like it felt a little excessive, the extra talking at the restaurant, like the constant the Goku saying he needs to go wash his hands felt out of place in that moment. Yeah, like they're standing there looking at each other, and then you know, Roshi's like, Don't do this, and then he's and Goku stands up and he's like, I'm gonna go wash my hands. Yeah, I think if I like that would probably be my worst part just because it felt so first of all, feels out of place for Goku. Secondly, he feels out of place in that scene, you know?
SPEAKER_02Like like him excusing himself to go to the bathroom. That would make sense. You know, if he's just like in the washing.
SPEAKER_00I'm gonna go pee now. You know, that that would make more sense and would actually be funnier than and it would also be it was in Goku's character. Yeah, and it would it would almost like him saying he he's gonna go wash his hands almost feels like he's like telling it, it feels like from where I would be at if I like was in the middle of almost fighting somebody and then get told like you don't want to get disqualified, don't do it out in the open. And then you know, being like, I'm gonna go wash my hands. Can you come to the restroom with me too, TN? So that they can like go fight in the bathroom, you know. Like that's what it feels like secret code where it's yeah, but that's what it feels like, but then they just don't, you know.
SPEAKER_02They sit back down and then Roshi and Shin have a little talk-off.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it because it almost you know, it feels like um like you know, going to wash your hands feels like the eighth grade term for me back in the day where it was like, I'm gonna go hit the locker room, you know. And then then I would go in there and get into a fight in the locker room, you know. Like that was what that was my brawl spot. But that's what it feels like. It's like it's like that kind of a code. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I could at least uh win the first preliminary match, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I could do that.
SPEAKER_02As long as I don't get like King Chupa or Chapa or whatever.
SPEAKER_00I ain't scared of his eight-hand technique. Um, but anyway.
SPEAKER_02I gotta I'm South Paul. He doesn't ready for that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, but anyways, yeah. My my worst part is just that like that just feels out of place. Yeah, it's not like terrible, it's nothing close. It's such a nitpick. But it it's just for that one, it was like out of these two episodes, it was one of those I was like, this feels weird, I don't like it.
SPEAKER_02You know, it's just weird, it's just a weird writing.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And so with that, Jesse, what is your best part?
SPEAKER_02So you have two extremes here. You can pick the entire uh Jackie man wolf fight because it's just so funny, and even like the transformation scene and stuff.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Or you can pick like the super hardcore fun action of TN versus John Joe. Yeah. It's like what do you which do you which do we have to do?
SPEAKER_00I think we have to limit ourselves here. You have to pick one specific if you're gonna pick something from the Jackie fight, you have to pick one specific joke from the Jackie fight that really worked for you.
SPEAKER_02And then like maybe one specific like.
SPEAKER_00Or one per second move type thing that from the TN fight. I'm not gonna say like I my best part was the whole second episode.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, even though the second episode's great. Uh, you know what? I'm actually gonna go with because I really like the way it was animated as well. I'm gonna go with him blocking like the jumping wolfing kick or whatever.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, with his like I I almost said that he started using bide, but he didn't like redirect that energy back in.
SPEAKER_02I made it I made it like I wrote it down as like he's using hardened. Yeah, he like hard, he like puts his bicep up, clenches it, and just becomes like beat red. Yeah, and then Yamcha like starts hitting them, and it literally does no damage, and he just laughs it off, and then he just like forehand, four punch comboed him, and Yamcha's on the ground, and then he jumps up and that's where he wins and stuff.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Um, and then my my best part's gonna be from the Jackie fight. Uh, it's it's the bone. The best part, you mean? Yeah, the best part. It it's the bone, like Jackie throwing the bone. Throwing the bone. Like in general, that little bit of the skit where Jackie's like, you know, treating him like a dog is hands down some of the funniest stuff in this entire this entire show so far. Um but with that, thank you guys for listening in. Um you can reach out to us at becoming sayings at gmail.com, or you can follow us at becoming sayanspods on Twitter, on Instagram, on TikTok, and on YouTube. Um we also would like to remind you to download, subscribe, rate, and review. Leave us a five star rating if you're feeling that way. Um, and until next week, I've been Truman. And I've been Jesse. And the journey continues. Bye!