Imposter Syndrome Isn’t About Confidence: The Hidden Patterns Keeping Women Playing Small

What if imposter syndrome has nothing to do with confidence?

In this powerful episode of Beyond My Diagnosis, Michele Weston sits down with licensed psychotherapist, certified hypnotherapist, and coach Shelley Martinez to unpack what’s really happening beneath the surface of imposter syndrome—especially for high-achieving women in midlife and those living with chronic or invisible conditions.

This is not a surface-level conversation about “just believe in yourself.”

Shelley brings nearly 30 years of experience to explain why imposter syndrome is rooted in identity, subconscious patterns, and nervous system conditioning—not a lack of capability.

“It’s that sense of feeling like a fraud… and waiting for someone to find out you’re not as capable as they think.”

Together, Michele and Shelley explore how brilliant, accomplished women can appear confident on the outside while internally struggling with self-doubt, overthinking, and the fear of being “found out.”

Inside this episode, you’ll learn:

• Why imposter syndrome is not actually a confidence issue
• The connection between high-functioning anxiety and self-doubt
• How invisible illness can intensify identity struggles
• Why women discount their success and attribute it to luck
• How early experiences shape lifelong patterns of self-perception
• The role of the nervous system in keeping you in survival mode
• Why perfectionism and “superwoman” expectations keep women stuck
• The difference between coaching and therapy in addressing these patterns
• Why group support can accelerate healing and awareness
• A powerful 3-step framework: Reframe, Regulate, Rewire

Shelley explains that imposter syndrome becomes a learned habit—a default mental pattern that keeps your brain scanning for mistakes and reinforcing self-doubt.

“Whatever you do the most becomes your default. Imposter syndrome is a habit—and any habit can be changed.”

Michele also shares her own experience navigating imposter syndrome in her career and how she consciously shifted her mindset to step into her expertise and own her success.

This episode is a reminder that you are not broken.

You’ve been conditioned.

And you have the power to change that.

🔗 Connect with Shelley Martinez

https://www.shelleymartinez.com/

Shelley Martinez is a licensed psychotherapist, certified hypnotherapist, and coach with nearly 30 years of experience. She combines neuroscience, subconscious tools, and practical techniques to help women create lasting change at the root, not just manage symptoms on the surface.

Her work focuses on helping high-achieving midlife women, both corporate professionals and entrepreneurs, move from secretly feeling like a fraud to trusting their decisions, owning their voice, and showing up with confidence that feels real, not performed.

Transcript

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(Music Playing) Hello, this is Michele Wesson with Beyond My Diagnosis, a podcast about living your best life with a chronic condition. Now, that means a lot of things. And you know, after all this time, I have some very interesting guests. Today, I have Shelley Martinez, who's coming from the West in New Mexico. And we met through a friend of ours for a women's group to work with people who are entrepreneurs. And we love working with Julie. And Shelley and I hit it off. She's a therapist. And she's going to talk about a very interesting conversation and way of thinking about oneself, especially midlife for women. And I'm going to let her talk about it. But we're going to talk about imposter syndrome. No, not just imposter syndrome like you read. I have imposter syndrome at a job for a minute. I'm talking about seriously having imposter syndrome. And that correlates with having a chronic condition, which we were talking about. Those of us who you can't always see our condition, our illness, we sometimes feel like a quote for some snowflake or that we have an invisible illness. Imposter syndrome is very real. So Shelley, when we talked about doing this interview, and we've talked a little bit, you explained to me what imposter syndrome really means, not just that first layer of believing, oh, I'm an imposter at my job. And I'm not as good. So let's talk about really going deeper for women in midlife. Oh, absolutely. And thank you so much for having me today. I'm really looking forward to our conversation. I love talking to people. I'm very particular in some people. I think you will be one of those who I just love having numerous conversations with because there's always something new to learn about. So you'll be a source for me because you're not just covering-- you've been a therapist for decades. So there's lots of things that people think and feel. And it's important to talk about that. But imposter syndrome really just hooked me on exploring for people to think about. Oh, absolutely. And that's so common. It's been estimated 72% of women struggle with imposter syndrome, which, like you said, is more than just doubting myself or lacking confidence. We tend to think of it in terms of, oh, well, just get a little more confident and then I'll be fine. But it doesn't work because that doesn't go deep enough. Feeling like a fraud is really about-- I feel like I'm not being myself out in the world, whether that's at work or in our personal lives, with our body, through our health, that we were talking about. And that sense of being separated from who we really are and having to present something different, to be accepted, to feel safe, to be able to maintain our place in our social life, in our family, in our community, in our job. Yeah. And it's different for different things. And it just around us. I mean, it's different for work and for play and for relationship and being with your friends. Feeling like you're an imposter can be a lot of different hats. Absolutely. Absolutely. But the common theme through it all is feeling like you're a fraud and you're going to get found out in this sense of just holding your breath and walking on eggshells and waiting for someone to realize that you're not who they thought you were, that you're not as smart, as talent, as capable, as whatever, fill in the blank. And it really has a lot to do with how we define success. What does success look like? So it's not really a confidence issue. It looks like it is. But that's misleading because it's so much there on the surface. And it's about these different kinds of distortions that we have about what competence looks like in any area of our life. Oftentimes, feeling like we have to be absolutely perfect or it's nothing or like we have to know everything or it's not good enough. We've got to be the ultimate expert in whatever that is. Otherwise, it's nothing. Or I had to do it all by myself with no help. That's another one. The superwoman cape that we put on or Superman because it impacts men as well. We're primarily with women. It's amazing that you said over 70%. I mean, that's a lot of women. That number is a three-quarter. I mean, that's a lot of women who have that feeling as that I'm not really who I am and you don't know and you're going to find out. Yeah, and when you find out bad things are going to happen, it's that you're going to be disappointed, disapprove of me. Maybe I'll get fired, lose my job, I'll get called out in a really humiliating public way. It's just this terrible fear hanging over you all the time that you're just really not as good as people think and you're one mistake away from them figuring it out. That's amazing. It really is that we just... So how do women get there? Is it since you were a kid, can an event happen? What would lead a woman to feel that way? Well, there's so many different causes that come into play, but typically there's almost, I've never discovered anyone who didn't have anxiety. A little bit of anxiety going on. Yeah, usually really high functioning anxiety. That's good to say, because think of it, a woman who is a CEO could believe that she has, she is an imposter, which is amazing because she's a CEO or a CFO. It's like... Well, exactly. And there's this habit of discounting the positive and with women in particular feeling like, if I do look successful on the outside, because they look... Typically these women look fantastic on paper. When you meet them, you would never know that they weren't a hundred percent confident because they do amazing things. They have these great positions and great careers, but women are really prone to attributing that to luck or to, oh, well, they just liked me, or somehow I magically fooled them, even though I wasn't trying to fool them. Somehow I did. This is how I became CFO, is I just fooled everyone and they just really liked me. That's not gonna fly. That's not actually true. Do you think that's something that you start with young or it could be if you were young, but it could also be something that happens later in life that suddenly you feel that you're an imposter? Most often it comes when we're young and it may not bloom until later on, but things like going to school, being a student are a big contributor to this because we literally are judged every day on what we're doing and determined if we're good or bad, even to kindergarten, you've got a red light, a yellow light, a green light maybe, but you've got graded on things. It's also growing up human and having parents who either didn't praise you or praised you too much, there's all these different variations on it. It's certainly feeling like you're a minority, which is one of the things we were talking about, people who are minorities, which is women and then we go on the list from there. Yeah, yeah. That being a minority can really, really contribute to that and I think that's where the health conditions really can come in in a big way because you may be a minority in additional ways to that, but that certainly puts you in the minority category. Yeah, you come down to, my neurologist said, don't ever fill in that you have a disability when you're filling out those things online because you're immediately marked and they don't know you, they don't know that you're high functioning and that it doesn't look like anything to the world. So people get an image of what they think a illness, a condition looks like. Well, she has to have a walker, she has to have a cane, she has to have this. No, I've never really, I mean, I've had a cane when I broke my toes, but it's not something I used after the first number of years and then I just didn't really use it because I got better at exercising and figuring out how to get through and around the drop foot. But if they can't see it, then it's better not to just put that on an application because why, even though we never just, yeah, they do, you do. Yeah, absolutely. And this symptom sounds like that, I'm an imposter, but nobody knows I'm an imposter. Well, what if they find out that I'm an imposter? I could lose my job, I could, you know. But here, that could be a person, as we were discussing, who's very, you know, they've gone to school, they have a master's degree, they've won awards, whatever. Isn't it crazy that even with all of those accolades, they feel I'm still an imposter? It's still not good enough and I will never be good enough, it's kind of the rub of it, that no matter how far I go, no matter how much I'm recognized, no matter how many trainings or degrees or, you know, fill in the blanks, it's never gonna be enough because of this baseline distortion about how we're processing information, how we're perceiving stuff, how we're categorizing it, when it comes to ourselves. Because if you traded resumes between, you know, and I've had sometimes my clients do this, look at someone else's resume and see what they think when they look at, oh, well actually this is you on paper. You know? Yeah, surprise. That reversal, surprise, exactly, afterwards. It's like, oh wait, this is actually you. And you thought this was an amazing, talented, awesome person that you would love to work with and that's not how you feel about yourself. So how did you decide you were gonna take it farther, different, that's a different work in the road, coaching people with imposter syndrome as opposed to therapy? Because you and I know there's, you know, it's very clear the differences because it sounds like you want to expand that coaching people through it, not just laying on a sofa or talking in a chair and listening to the past. I always think to myself from what I learned in ethics for coaching is we're not looking at the past, we're looking forward, we're looking at now, this minute as opposed to when I was. Doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It just means that we're here together because I want to move forward and get through this or learn how to work with it. Do you find groups help women with imposter syndrome? What have you found that coaching is different? Yeah, that's such a good question and I see coaching and therapy a little differently. To me, it's more about the scope of how much this is disturbing your life. Okay. You know, and so if this is really causing all of the dysfunction, this being fill in the blank, this could be anxiety or depression or, you know, an imposter syndrome is a manifestation of anxiety. Got it. So if it's really causing significant problems in your life on a day-to-day basis, that's probably a therapy issue. Okay. Because it's taken over. Whereas I see coping differently with my coaching clients because they have a lot of skills already and they do function very well, but they want to be able to expand and to grow and move forward. And not that my therapy clients don't, but they're coming from a very different place, where they don't have a lot of skills oftentimes to cope they're barely getting through their day. So that's where I see the difference in the two things. And really my mission all across the board is to help as many women as possible to reclaim their personal power. Love it. Yeah, it's so important to me. I really do agree with the Dalai Lama when he said that women will heal and change the world. I really believe that, but I also know we can't do it when we're weighed down with emotional baggage and old stories and things that hold us back and keep us playing small. And so as someone who had lots of anxiety from childhood, myself, Got it. You know, I've been there done that, got the t-shirt, you know, kind of everything. It's part of why I became a therapist actually. Yeah, and also if you go through divorce, I also think that's another layer of, you know, as a kid to watch your parents get divorced, there's lots of kids who blame themselves. And it's like, this isn't about you. Yes, it is. I'm here and I'm causing all this stress. Like, no, no, this is separate from you. And to make sure that's clear is a whole nother conversation. True, absolutely. Although kids, because of where their brain is at, I'm glad you brought up the nervous system piece. They don't have the ability to really take in this isn't my fault. They live with a subconscious brain, basically. Your subconscious forms between birth through teenage years, give or take. Why was like that 21 when you're really like, especially for guys, until you're 21, you know, especially with guys, you just, don't make huge, huge decisions. You know, that's where this whole conversation about wanting to be the her instead of the him. I want you to really, really have time to walk through this and think about what that means. Cause that's a big, big transition. And you have to be fully present, fully here. That does not mean the kids can't feel like they do, but to make physical changes, I think it's important to really be an adult to a certain point in your life. I don't want kids to just, oh, I'm going to start doing hormone therapy and doing this and doing that. It's like, you're young. I want you to really do this with great intention and knowing why and what you're doing. And that's like, that's a whole nother conversation, but I'm just saying that people, you know, as a kid, you know, divorce affects things. You watch things and parents fight that affects and they don't get divorced, you know? All of those things affect how you do. Well, everything is cumulative. Although I don't know about your state. Your state is probably different than mine, just to flow back to transgender services here. We do have children's clinics as well as teenage and adults clinics. We do too. To be part of that, you have to have gone through a lot of assessment and a lot of work and your parents would have to too, you know, before big measures. We're not as strict. And I just think it's, I think it's important. I think I never not feel that if that is, in the end, what you want, it's a very hard row. It's a very hard road to take. And I want people to make that decision by themselves, not get there, do all these things. And then suddenly go, oh my God, what did I do? Because that's not the way to live. With anything, I think, you know, I mean, with anything, you would hate to go down a road and do all these things and not really be clear that this is what I want to do. And this is how I want to live, you know? Yeah, well, and I mean, I don't do any coaching related to transgender folks, but I work with a lot in therapy. Yeah. And, you know, it's a life-saving treatment. Absolutely, and I totally agree with you, you know? But it has its, I think today, because you and I are older, everything gets so blown up. I mean, the minute, you know, I think social media, fortunately or unfortunately has created its own monster. So, you know, they read and that's it. It's like, no, it's a lot of things before you just read what it is, you know, people using it to just diagnose themselves. No, it's a tool to say, I feel this way, and then look at it and then go see people who you can say, I think, what do you think? No, absolutely, and I think what you're describing overall is, I don't know, it was called medical students disease when I went to college. Where, you know, you read about something and you have everything and that happens, you know, in my grad program, we were warned about it when we started school. You're gonna read about all these disorders and you're gonna think you have 75% of them, 90% of them. Before you get too worried about it, go in and talk to a professional. Because we do, you know, we start to read things, but that sounds like me, that sounds like me. The other big phrase that I still am working on is people who, what's the word? Gaslight. Did we always use that word? Like in the way that we use gaslight now? No, not really, it's become much more common, a word. It wasn't really a big thing until recently and that's one of those things like, it's become a popular word. And do people, like I read things and somebody will say something and I'll go, I don't think I gaslight or I don't think they gaslight. It's a very strange choice of words. Because I don't still think, as I just said to you, I'm not dumb, I love words, I've always, like I used to get paid in grade school for remembering a really hard word, I'd get a quarter, you know, during the week. But gaslighting somebody, it's like, I don't know what that, I still don't know what it is, I read it and I'm just like, all right, okay. How would somebody like, but I guess people do. When you read gaslight. Well, there are certain groups of people who do. On the whole, I don't think, you know, everyone is doing this and it has been-- Of any intention, right? Widely, yeah, well, and that's the whole point is it has to be really intentional. That I'm trying to deny and manipulate your sense of reality to undermine everything you think and feel so that you're easier for me to maneuver. Got it. So it's a very nefarious kind of thing, which is different than me having a different opinion and trying to convince you my opinions, right? Yeah, yeah. This is much more underhanded and subtle. Right, yeah, but with imposter syndrome, that's more a solo individual experience. You're around, you know, you could be in a group and feel that imposter syndrome. You could be by yourself and feel that you're an imposter. Yeah, imposter syndrome is really more about how I as a person think about things, about myself in particular, about what it means to be competent in any area of my life. Got it. That's really what it's about. And well, you know, any kind of mental health thing, we all give or take back to the medical student thing. We all kind of sometimes recognize ourselves in some of those things. Everyone's been a little depressed, everyone's, you know, been a little anxious. Everyone thinks the glasses go one way or the other in the cabinet. I mean, but if it's not causing a big problem in your life, then it really isn't a problem. Isn't that a funny thing? Glasses in the cabinet. So those occasional thoughts. Right, yes, in the cabinet. Yeah, it's one of those. I don't, I believe that glasses, are stacked upon each other. So the bottom is on the bottom and the, I mean, the top is on the bottom and the vice versa. But with mugs, I put them in just as a mug, like you grab your mug. And my husband has been flipping the mugs and you think to yourself, do I really care? No, I really don't care.(Laughs) But you think-- If you were gonna go to the downside with him, then I would go, okay, Michele. No, no, but like, is it exactly like-- Some people do. But yeah, what is it worth? You have to pick your fights very carefully. But with imposterous system, that isn't a fight. That is a feeling, that is-- Yes. Yeah. Well, it's a nervous system. And it's how your nervous system has been wired in part. And that's why I work with the nervous system. And we're with individuals and groups. And a big part of it is rewiring those habits of our nervous system towards feeling fearful, towards survival mode, even when there are no tigers around. So that sense of, I've gotta be overthinking and overworking and process everything all the time because I've gotta be perfect or I'm gonna be kicked out or whatever. All of those pieces are about your nervous system being on high alert all the time. And they perpetuate it. So you start out on high alert and then those beliefs and those behaviors keep you on high alert. Because if you're behaving as though this is dire, this report you're gonna prepare for your boss or this birthday party you're throwing for your kid or whatever, if you're behaving as though it's dire, your nervous system doesn't know the difference. And so it goes, oh, this is dire. Oh, okay. Then I guess it's gotta be perfect. Yeah, then it's gotta be perfect. Yeah, and so working with those things, working with our nervous system. So we started with, I have a three-step process, which is reframe, regulate and rewire. We have to reframe, we have to understand it differently and start to look at this is something that has developed over habit. Little kids don't have imposter syndrome. That's the whole thing where they like, the whole dance like a toddler thing. They don't have imposter syndrome. They don't do it. It doesn't exist for them. They do what they do. They do what they do at that moment. They do what they do. Because that's what they wanna do. Exactly, exactly. A great example, yes, it was so cute on Saturday. My friend Brooke has, she's probably like two and a half, three. And her son, Jagger, they were in the elevator and Brooke and I had been talking because her and Jagger came in from the park and he had his scooter with her. And we were talking about fabrics. I have fabrics for sofa that I was looking at. And the point of this is we were talking for a bit and you could see Jagger just like, but not really, because the adults are talking. So you'll just have to wait for a minute. That's very boring when you're a kid and the adults are talking. So we go to the-- And talk all the time. I know, so we go to the elevator and I get up on my floor, I get up before she does. And I went to say something and Jagger literally went, "Get off." And of course Brooke was just like,"Jagger, don't be rude." I said, and I knew, he's a kid. I used to do children's theater. So we do read books like Dr. Seuss and stuff. So I actually like to ask kids questions. I said, "What are you gonna do when you get upstairs "that you're running for?" Because I knew there was something that he already had in his mind. Brooke goes, "No, it's not." I said, "No, let him answer me."What are you gonna do when you get upstairs?" And he goes, "I have walkie talkies "and I wanna use them right now." I said, "You know what?"I'm gonna let this elevator close."Jagger, have a good afternoon and I'll see you later." Because that's what was imperative to him at that second. I can hear Brooke going, "I'm sorry." I said, "No, you're not sorry."It's fine, it's fine, it's fine." Because he wasn't being rude. He was being impatient. But he's a kid. So didn't we discuss this when you came in and you're still talking about this? Because the adults are still talking? I need to go upstairs and do my next thing. Because you're thinking, why I asked him was, he just came from the park with his scooter. Didn't you do a bunch of things? Didn't you like a little worn out? Wouldn't it be nice to sort of kick back for a minute when you get upstairs? Oh no, he had things planned. So like you said, kids just do what kids do. They do their thing. They're very authentic. They don't struggle with feeling like an impostor who's gonna judge them. And then one day they do. Yeah. They lose that. And how do we get there? How do you get there? And as I said, I'm curious, does it help? Because I know with bariatrics, being in a support group for bariatrics is very, very valuable. Because if you're losing weight or if you've lost the weight and you are struggling at any of those before surgery, you know, while losing the weight, after a maintenance, hearing others who've gone through this experience is really, really important. And here in New York, we have a couple of programs New York Presbyterian has a support group and Lenox Hill does. But I chose NYU Langone because of the regularity of the group and they don't have you pay. You just drop in when you need to drop in. And it's every month, at least twice a month. So it's very helpful. Do you find that women struggling with things like impostor syndrome and so forth, that being around others who are experiencing that, does that help to sort of mirror it? Yeah, no, absolutely. And that's why I started a group program with this. Cause I think that's the most powerful way to work with it because oftentimes we can see something in someone else or quickly then we recognize it in ourselves. And the added support is really, really valuable. And having just a forum to talk about this because, you know, so many people are affected by this, like I said, and we're running around thinking we're the only one. Wow. You know? Well, being alone in that thought, yeah, is scary. I'm the only one. And why is this happening to me? And, you know, when does it stop? Exactly, what's wrong with me? Yeah. Well, I'm feeling like there's no way to make it soft because so much of the advice out there really works on the surface. Okay. It's, you know, change your thought and it'll magically be better. And some of these things, you know. Yeah, right. And I think of that, okay, yeah. And you have to do a little more work to change those things, to be reframing, to change your old stories. But what happens, unfortunately, is that most people try the standard advice will just be more confident, you know, in this case. And when it doesn't work, they go, "See, I told you I was broken." Oh. Clearly, something's really wrong with me instead of saying something is wrong with this system. It's not really getting at the problem. It only works on the surface. It's like if you had all these weeds growing in your yard, right? And you could either yank them all out or you could read whack them at ground level. What's gonna be more effective at getting rid of the weeds long-term, pulling them out by the root? Yeah, yeah. And so that's why I work at the root. And the root in this case is the nervous system. Let's talk about rewiring because you've got these three steps, but I loved learning in my master's about rewiring the brain because what stays still with me is that whether you're 818 or 80, you can rewire and retrain your brain to think differently than it does, which sounds really woo-woo, like no way. I'd have to have like ECT and have, you know, have to be surgery involved with rewiring my brain. No, there's so many people working with this now. When we say rewiring your brain, how do you describe that to people? Because I think, like you said, it's not just do it. Just go do it. Just go do it. And this is part of the reason that fake it till you make it. Works but doesn't. And so what we don't realize is our brain is growing and changing all the time. So every new experience that you have, you know, you go out and read a new book or you have a different conversation with somebody or whatever that is changing your brain. That's literally rewiring it. And essentially the way your brain works is whatever you do the most, whatever you think the most, that's the easiest to access. I think of it like a grease slide, you know, you get on this path and here you go. You're down at whatever your conclusion is. So when we're talking about rewiring things that are problematic for us, it's kind of like putting peanut butter in the slide. Okay, okay. So that you can kind of start going and then it just gets stuck. And then you have the opportunity to get off and detour that and go somewhere else. And the more you do that, the more you practice it, that becomes your new grease slide. Because your brain essentially works like Google. Whatever you ask of it, it's gonna give you. And if you're used to feeling like a fraud, then you're gonna say, okay, what did I do wrong? What am I gonna do wrong? You know, whatever. And it's gonna give you all those answers. Versus if you come in and say, okay, what am I good at? What do I need to, you know, to polish? What am I proud of? Those kinds of things, that's the result you're gonna get. And that's where-- And so we're changing the default position. Yeah, and that's where, sorry, cut you off. That's where I learned that this is where meditation, no, I'm not talking about like formal meditation, crossing your legs, listening to something. I love that, but that has its place. But if you can get quiet with yourself, which for a number of people is very difficult to just sort of sink into yourself and just spend some time, it could be five minutes, honestly. You know, I always say to people, people go, I can't do meditation. I said, do you take walks? Yeah, I said, do you walk in the park and see the trees? And right now, you know, the flowers coming up for spring. Yeah, I said, that's a meditation. You don't need this to be a formal thing. This means that you're taking the time for you to just sort of sink into yourself and connect to the ground, which I do believe, and I think we're all trees and it's good to remember we're rooted in the right. We're rooted in the earth. I love that. We're all trees. Yeah, I see. It's the same way. Right. We're all trees and we're all rooted and we're all different kinds of trees. So then you're here and sometimes you have to. I mean, when people, when I'm working with somebody who's working on job interviewing and they're young in their 20s, I'll always say, all right, I know you're going to think I'm crazy, but I need you to sit up and I need you to make sure both feet are on the floor and not like, you know, cross legs. I need you to really be rooted. I need you to feel like we've discussed all these things. You're prepared. All of the questions you could be answered. We've discussed, but I need you to feel like you're steady, like a rock that you're here, because if something comes your way and a question comes, I want you to feel secure. And they always, you know, they always look at me. I said, it'll make a difference. It's just a it's the little things that sometimes. Absolutely. So that's a rewiring and say, oh, yeah, rewire is just, oh, I'm going to try this. And then this feels better. That's an opportunity to rewire, to say, OK, how do I feel with this? Is it calmer? Am I. More assured of myself? And that's what I think people could take away from talking about rewiring, because there's a million ways to use that you can. I had to rewire my brain around chronic conditions. You know what? The first thing when you were given a diagnosis and this isn't a terminal diagnosis, it's not doesn't look like that. You don't die from a mess. You die from complications of MS. You never die of MS. And at this point in time, that's you know, that's a long, long, you know, long time ago. Point is, is that first you go, oh, God, I'm really sick. What you know, what will happen to me? And then over time I rewired and went, you're fine. Just fine. You have incontinence, but you know how to handle that. You've done PT. You know how to manage your muscles. You have drop foot. You've learned with PT to walk through. You have, you know, a little bit of cognition stuff. You've used OT skills. You've talked to therapists. You have skills that make sure that you understand. Not only have you had the therapy, but you've learned how to rewire yourself so that you have tools, that you have strategies that are yours, not just, you know, we have tools and strategies, but then there is the ones that with our own rewiring, we can then fall upon and go. I'm having that feeling again. What could I do? I could just sit here, you know, I I talk about Andrew Weil doing the, 479 doing that and nobody sees your hand counting down. You know, there's box breathing, of course, that was, you know, created by somebody who was a Navy SEAL. It gives you a chance to just reconnect, rewire and that, you know, unplug and feel like, oh, my God, oh, my God, oh, my God, oh, my God. You know, yeah. Right. I mean, that's how you feel. Whatever you spend most of your time doing becomes your default. It's a habit. And so imposter syndrome at some point became a habit. Yeah. And any habit can be changed. Yeah. If you want to. You do need the right tools. Well, you do have to desire. You have to desire and you have to have a lot of resilience and tenacity. You know, you have to decide, I am worth figuring this out. I am resilient enough that I want to work on this. I will live through this. Right. I will live through this. But this is really taking a toll on me. So it is worth it to me to learn how to reprogram. But I do like rewiring better than reprogram. You know, we use that. Remember, we use that. We use that reprogram yourself. Now, rewiring makes more sense because you can see that more visually. I'm not a computer, but rewiring feels differently to me, like I said, about the tree and the roots. So to me, that's wires into the earth. That's I just have a different picture in my head, but we're all going to have a little bit of a different experience of that. That's why I mentioned when you were talking that rewiring with some meditation and the opportunity, sometimes it's just breathing, you know, sometimes we hold our breath and when somebody goes, you're holding your breath, you go. Oh, yeah. Right. Yeah. No, absolutely. I'm with you there. I think with, you know, with imposter syndrome, I bet you there's a lot of holding your breath waiting for the other foot to drop. You know, there, you know, wait to drop instantly, constantly. And that's what we're working to change. Yeah. Do you see that mostly in work or it could be work as a mom at home? I mean, I consider that a full time job, you know. Oh, absolutely. It's, you know, people are often more aware of it at work. But I think if you're doing that oftentimes, not always, but usually you're doing it in other places in your life, too. And being a parent or being a partner is a big one or being a daughter. It's like, you know, all these different roles that women typically have. We never seem to be able to do enough or do it right. You know, in many cases. And that's the culture pushing down on us. It's our own expectations of ourselves that we've been handed or grown up with or believed for whatever reason. You know, there's a lot of different aspects to that. Got it. But it limits us. It's the thing I would want to leave everyone with is it's limiting you. It's keeping you playing small. It's literally costing you money. No. And yeah. Yeah. Explain that has a. OK, I'll tell you real quick before we wrap up. So basically. When I struggle with imposter syndrome. I believe that I'm not good enough, so I don't apply for the promotion. I don't market myself well. I don't apply for the job. I don't start the business. I don't do all of these things. That would actually get me ahead. And when I'm interviewing, I tend to downplay the things that I've done or that I'm good at because. You know, I don't want to seem arrogant or I think that I don't really own those accomplishments. Remember, I just got lucky. Those kinds of things. And so I will sabotage and undermine myself in my interviews as well. If I get an interview, if I even applied. So, yeah, it's it's huge. It's absolutely huge. Just the not asking for the promotion or negotiating for higher pay or a better package when we go in. That's estimated to cost women about a million dollars. Wow. Yeah. Unbelievable. It's huge. Yeah, it's huge. Because we're not worth it, you know, or we don't deserve as much. We don't deserve that position or we're going to be paid less because we're a woman, we're not a man. Yeah. You know, yeah. Some of the skills that men have, I love that. You know, I would love a little bit. I love that my husband and my brother, they can let things roll off their back. They don't care. Me, I like him and Hall and run the tape and you're like, it doesn't bother you. No. I mean, literally, does it bother you? Nope. Nope. Different, different wire. Yeah. No, definitely. We're wired more community wise. And I think that tends to create some of that difficulty. So put that into terminology, just to the same community wise. It's like girls communicate so much more than men do. Okay. Right. I can't remember the numbers off the top of my head right now, but basically we talk twice as much as men do. Well, we're not always talking to ourselves. Most of that we're talking to other people. Right. And so we're thinking about that. We're also socialized to be very nurturing and to, you know, care about our community and our group, whatever that is, and take care of people often at the detriment of ourselves. Well, that's a really good point. So if you're, if you're living in this imposter syndrome, you're not taking care of yourself, you're not owning, I need to sit back and remember that I did this or I have this skill or I was able to accomplish this and was asked to speak about that. Those are things that you have to, here we are in community. I give back. Well, this time I want you to flip that and give back to yourself and say, well, yeah, you did all that. You know, you're not an imposter. You, I can show you a whole list. You can write it all and I can hold it up and say to you, this is what you've done. Yeah. This is concrete and you may have had some assistance and you may have had some opportunities and that's okay. It's what you did with it. Not everyone does anything with their, their luck or their opportunity or their doors that opened we've, you know, most of us are fortunate enough. We've had a couple of those experiences that doesn't diminish the fact that you did the work when you got there. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Look, you know, I talk about that when I was hired as a senior accessories editor in Conde Nast for a magazine, I was in the elevator with all these very skinny girls and I was not a skinny girl. And I came from theater, from acting and costume design. And I was just like, what the heck am I doing in this? I don't know how to do journalism. I'm not an editor. And as the floors went up, I went, you know what? This is an acting job for a bit right now. You're going to fake it till you make it because you can, because you know how to do this and then you're going to own it. And I had an great flourishing career and I enjoyed it and I owned it. And yes, were there moments of imposter syndrome? Yeah. And that elevator, that moment, absolutely. And I thought, Oh my God, but I turned it around and said, you're going to use imposter syndrome like this and you're going to then rise to I'm fine. I'm fine. And I own this and I'm doing well. And I'm, I am definitely a senior editor because I have these skills. I think that's a great way to end that people need to maybe sometimes write things down, talk to someone, you know, it could even just be a friend to say, you know, what do you see, uh, you know, in the, cause I see this. Just check in with yourself. Right. And definitely if it's really crazy, go find someone to talk to or look at or look up to look up to the possibility of, um, of doing, uh, joining a group coaching through it because you want to move forward. And that's what I think I love about coaching is that you're helping people move forward. Absolutely. Always a pleasure. Fantastic. I love it. It's been great to meet with you and talk to your group. Thank you for the opportunity. Have a great day, evening, week, and enjoy the flowers. All right. Thanks. Thank you. Thanks for tuning in to this episode of beyond the diagnosis is something we talked about today resonated with you. If you're craving deeper understanding, better support, we just want to know you're not alone on this journey. Make sure to subscribe to my free sub stack and Michele Weston dot sub stack.com M I C H E L E W E S T O N dot sub stack.com. That's where I share personal insights, expert takeaways and extra resources to help you stay informed, empowered, and one step closer to the clarity you deserve. And if you found this episode helpful, leave a review or share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your voice helps this message go further until next time. Keep asking questions, keep trusting yourself and keep going beyond the diagnosis.