20 Secrets to Maximising Your BNI Membership - Secret 7

In this episode, special guest Phil Cutcliffe joins hosts Chris Mutimer and Jeremy Dart, and explores why success in BNI isn't about luck—it's about consistently playing the numbers game. Learn how mastering the key performance indicators, staying disciplined, and trusting the proven BNI system can create predictable referral growth and long-term business success.

📝 Key Topics Covered

•  📈 The Power of the Numbers Game — why consistent activity always outperforms occasional brilliance. 
•  🎯 Mastering the BNI KPIs — attendance, 1-to-1s, referrals, visitors and education all working together. 
•  🤝 Helping Others Succeed First — how generosity and accountability drive reciprocal business growth. 
•  🔄 Building Momentum Through Consistency — developing habits that compound into long-term results. 
•  🚀 Trusting the BNI System — why members who commit fully to the process achieve the greatest return.

🎧 Listen now and take your BNI networking to another level.

If you haven't got the book yet, you can order at:

www.bni20secrets.com

And if you want to join the 20 Secrets Community:

https://www.facebook.com/BNI20Secrets/ 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:19

You're listening to the 20 secrets to maximize your BNI membership podcast, where we meet the book's contributors, delve deeper, discuss, explore the strategies and tactics behind each of the 20 secrets. If you're a BNI member, prepare to meet some of the most effective BNI members in Australia. And here are your hosts, Chris Mutimer and Jeremy Dart.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Welcome back, listeners, to the 20 Secrets to Maximising Your B I Membership Podcast. My co-host, I was going to introduce him as the awesome Jeremy Dart, but he's woohooed very early.

SPEAKER_06 0:54

Hey, listen, I was just trying to add some energy, you know.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

No, I do like the energy, but the woo-hoo, that was way out of uh out of sync there.

SPEAKER_06 1:02

Good morning, good evening, and good night to everybody.

SPEAKER_01 1:04

Very good, very good. All right, so today's podcast is a is a good one. So it's all about Secret Seven. So for many B9 members, the numbers can feel overwhelming, especially those uh first-year members um trying to get their uh head around the Go for Green reports. But um what we want to do is get into a little bit um a little bit of detail here, and we've got a we've got a great guest today.

SPEAKER_06 1:27

Awesome guest.

SPEAKER_01 1:29

Great, awesome. All together. So today we are joined by the author of Secret Seven, Phil Cutcliffe. And his secret is uh the hidden power of playing the numbers game, why mastering the metrics leads to massive success. Now I'm gonna sorry, I cut you off. Please let me finish the introduction. Phil Phil's a Phil's a great guest and he does deserve a due introduction. So in Phil's chapter, Phil explains why the most successful BI members don't leave their results to chance. Instead, they understand the activities, habits, and metrics that consistently generate referrals, relationships, and business growth. So today we're going to explore how tracking the right numbers can transform your BI experience, why consistency beats intensity, and how a better understanding of your metrics can help you unlock greater success both inside and outside your chapter. So, Phil, welcome to the podcast. Welcome, Phil.

SPEAKER_03 2:28

Oh, it's great to be here and thank you for putting the pressure on me with such a great introduction. I hope I can live up to it.

SPEAKER_01 2:34

Thank thank you, Phil, for that for the for the comment on the great introduction that Jeremy so rudely interrupted.

SPEAKER_06 2:39

We took all of that from your chapter, Phil. So, you know, like we're just just repeating back to what you said. Um Phil, I want to ask, I actually want to say many many members often in B and I they often focus on the results, but they're often overlooking the activities that create those results. And what I got from your chapter was that that it challenges us to think differently about the B and I numbers or the numbers inside B and I, the why and the how. So, my biggest question for you firstly, I actually I will sort of point out the elephant in the room. You actually wrote the chapter with um sort of co-wrote it with uh with Nathan Bill. Um it was um uh very different from some of the other chapters that we've got because you've got a it's it's almost like a um uh a to and fro, I think it's I think you'd call it. So we've you've got your side and then Nathan's side, and it's really, really powerful. So, you know, kudos to you for coming up with that concept. What do you think inspired you to write that chapter about about playing the numbers?

SPEAKER_03 3:43

Uh well, I you know, I just the thought came to me that you know a picture is worth a thousand words, and uh but yeah, numbers can really tell a story as well, and then it can really keep something make something really simple that um you know you take time to explain. But yeah, if you look at the numbers, I'm I'm used to be a maths teacher myself. No numbers uh better than English. Uh so yeah, uh probably lots of reasons, but yeah, I think the uh all the KPIs come down to a number in the end, and uh and if we can keep those KPIs and be consistent at them, it does actually lead to some great results.

SPEAKER_06 4:20

Okay. So um, given being a maths teacher, you would have probably played with this concept a little bit. Why do you think in BI that so many members either ignore or misunderstand the B and I metrics? What do you think the reason behind because there are a lot of people, let's be honest, there's a lot of people who don't necessarily get it. Why do you think that is?

SPEAKER_03 4:42

Well, I think everybody's got their patterns of ways of doing things. In the end, everybody's got their um, you know, they've got their habits, they've got their, you know, their ways of thinking. But yeah, when we join B and I, we're I suppose we're admitting that hey, we need help with our way of thinking, and um we've got to submit to the process. And uh that takes, you know, just stop and think actually takes a lot of energy. And uh if we think we can uh just continue on as we've been and just add B and I add B and I to our our daily life, then yeah, it's probably not gonna work as well as if we just go back to the beginning and just learn learn those uh it used to be f five KPIs, but now the seven. Yeah. You know, learning those attitudes, those key values that we have, those seven values that we have in B and I, and really try to to you know at least know what they are and then see how they apply to us. And the same with the KPIs as well. Yeah, just um we've obviously they've worked, they've been developing them over 40 years, so it'd be good for us to uh stop and actually uh get on board with them and um put our thinking to the side of it and then see how they can melt meld together by prioritizing them.

SPEAKER_01 5:52

Hmm. Okay. Shall we get into uh specifics? So let's talk about some key metrics members should pay attention to. Um so so Phil, how how do activities like recording one-to-ones, um referrals, visitors, and thank you for closed business contribute to long-term success?

SPEAKER_03 6:13

Well, I really think all those things add to you know the know, like and trust, or the um, which is a famous B and I saying, you know, you get to know people and you like them and trust. So if you're spending time attending, you're spending time doing your visitors, um, you know, um, spending time doing your um one-to-ones and uh inviting visitors, you know, helping people get more business, giving those referrals, you know, it just adds to that credibility. You know, uh you get the visibility, you get the credibility, and then yeah, profitability follows on from that. The no like and trust people start sending you uh, you know, you sow, you're gonna reap eventually, it'll come back around one way or another. And that's the key value of B and I is you know, give us gain. If you just focus on helping, you know, committing to the processes, helping others, eventually it's gonna come back around and people want to jump on board and help what you're doing as well.

SPEAKER_06 7:06

It is really true. There's 40 years of history and and you know, knowledge and understanding and development with B and I. So, you know, the simplest thing is that if we trust that system, because it's it's worked because it's worked. So I I think that's really powerful. And and those numbers. Was there ever a point in your journey where um especially in B and I where you realised I it's but it's a bit of a beautiful mind kind of question when you sort of saw the numbers work in a way, like you've you've sort of explained why it's important, but is there some point at which it triggered? Was it like immediately as soon as we haven't asked actually asked you when you joined B and I, but did you get to a point where you went, ah, the system, you know, where it clicked in your mind for you, given your maths background?

SPEAKER_03 7:53

Yeah, um uh definitely. I joined in 19 oh not 1920.

SPEAKER_06 7:58

Wow, that was good. Oh, that was gonna be excited about that.

SPEAKER_03 8:00

Joined in 2021 and I got the idea right from the start, you know, that you've got to do you know, one one of each of these each thing, either once a month or once a week. And uh I just uh and I thought, well, I'm gonna be a hundred percent member straight away. But there was uh right in those first few months it was coming into Christmas because our chat was started in November, and I hadn't had a one-to-one with someone, and I was uh disappointed right from the start, I wasn't on a hundred points. And I rung up people to try and make a one-to-one, but they were too busy. I didn't realise you can probably do it on Zoom or on the phone or something, but um I didn't um didn't think that way. But anyway, yeah, just meeting that key KPI, uh, I thought, yeah, that'll that'll would be a good thing because I'm uh like you were saying, your life is like a box of chocolates, you know, you you know what I want to do. You never know what you're gonna get. I really need accountability, and I think there's a lot of people that do that. Yeah, they don't learn something unless they're kept accountable to it. And so that right from the start, that accountability was what um was a blessing to me. I've been a chamber of commerce member for uh I don't know, 25 years, but I think I've been less than five, yeah, probably been five times, but uh because there's no accountability, no one misses you, no one's asking you, you know, to perform anything. So anyway, yeah, right from the start I realized hey, this will be helpful for me because it's gonna be it's a big commitment every week, but it'll be I know it's gonna, you know, you wreak what you sow. But anyway, very soon I realized, hey, why settle for one, why settle for the minimum? Because if you're only on the minimum, if you can't get someone at the last minute to do that minimum, then you don't meet the minimum. Why not like go for double? Why not go for four times?

SPEAKER_05 9:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 9:39

And Alisa uh Gill, our director, said to me once, um Great E D. You know, invite a visitor, but why um why invite five visitors? Why don't you ask until you get five no's instead? And I said, Yeah, that's a good point. So um right away I just rang the deputy mayor of our city and said and uh on on Bluetooth while I was driving back to the office and uh and she said, Yeah, she would love to come.

SPEAKER_04 10:03

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_03 10:03

Um and anyway, yeah, and I thought, oh, why not? Um you know, so I think I had uh 68 visitors last year uh come along just from um yeah, not just thinking, oh, what's the minimum KPI?

SPEAKER_02 10:15

Was that was that 68?

SPEAKER_03 10:16

Yes, that's right.

SPEAKER_02 10:18

Chris is nearly falling off his chair. That is that is uh overwhelming.

SPEAKER_06 10:21

I I expected Phil would be at that level, but Chris was clearly, clearly going, what? How is this possible?

SPEAKER_01 10:26

I'm just saying that's impressive.

SPEAKER_06 10:28

It is very impressive.

SPEAKER_03 10:33

I'll take their word. That's it.

SPEAKER_06 10:35

I'll take it, yeah, for sure. 68, that's a lot. That is a that is a lot of it's over one a week. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:40

It's very impressive. I mean, well that's my goal, actually. My goal is one a week, and um if I miss a few weeks, then I know I've got to do you know, I try to do more than one.

SPEAKER_06 10:49

So you you you actually overstretched because you now you need to set two a week because sixty-eight is more than one a week. Yeah, well done. Good work. Hey, I I I love the idea, don't let your your minimums become your maximums, which is what you kind of said, which is really, really powerful.

SPEAKER_03 11:05

So I like the way you said it better, so thank you.

SPEAKER_06 11:07

Yeah, you're welcome. Someone else said it, and I just reminded me, so no, that's that's great. Is there out of out of all of the the seven core values and the um the power of one, is there one metric for you that um is most often overlooked but highly predictive of success, do you think?

SPEAKER_03 11:26

For me, yeah, um uh in mine, I I try to ex exceed in all of them uh myself, but in terms of the chapters, then my observation is yeah, the uh uh people inviting visitors is definitely I look down on the Go for Green coordinator in my chapter and I see most people have got zero, zero, zero you know, right down the list. And um and so that's um one thing that I really try to do myself, but I try to emphasize with others as well.

SPEAKER_06 11:56

It's it's actually probably in some senses it's the easiest but the hardest. A lot of people say, Oh, it's so hard to invite visitors, but it's actually the easiest thing to do because once people see and experience B and I, they're like, Why didn't I know about this earlier? So, you know, it's not you never know.

SPEAKER_03 12:12

You never know. Like, um, it used to be in the KPIs that theoretically that the visitor had to be like a potential member to count as a visitor. A lot of chapters didn't enforce that, but yeah. But um I would just invite anyone as a visitor. People look for work. I've had a lot of people get work, including a lawyer came. She couldn't join because she didn't have any work, so I visited another chapter and they had a family lawyer, and I said, You don't have a spare one that you could send us to you. And he said, No, I want to employ one. And then within a week she was employed by the this guy.

SPEAKER_04 12:42

Oh well.

SPEAKER_03 12:43

And uh and then about three weeks later she was a member of our chapter. So you never know um people looking for work. Um my wife, she would never go to a B and I, so I said, If you ever were to come, when would it be? And she said, have to be daylight. So I said, What about November? Would you come? And she said, Okay. So I booked her in for about four or five months ahead. And she came. Uh that was it. Thought that was done and dusted, but then she's a piano teacher, so she had a student, and the student one day said, Oh, I'm looking at starting, my husband and I are gonna start up a business in any way. Her husband is now a member of one of the B and I chapters, and when she qualifies, when she qualifies as a personal trainer, she wants to join B and I as well. So Julianne, not interested, but yeah, those uh visitors who're always gonna give business to people. Like Julianne knows a lot of my chapter members now and gives them work. Yep. Um, and um, yeah, obviously I do as well. But then uh but then she's been instrumental in having you know sponsoring people. I get the credit for it. But uh it was actually through her. So any visitor we have uh can be a sponsor, you know, will help us sponsor somebody else as well. As they might join themselves, but they might not, and then they might lead to other people joining, uh which then we'll get the credit for ourselves.

SPEAKER_01 13:58

Yeah, yeah. So we talk about a lot about the numbers and we get our reports every month, but um quite often the numbers are a long game. It's a bit of a strategy. Um why do you think patience is so important with people who are looking at the numbers and then you know you can't get uh too downhearted about it because it is a it is a long game, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 14:23

Yeah. Well if I think if we start with the right attitude, then it's a lot easier. Yeah. If our attitude is about helping other people, uh, which is the give us gain principle, if that if that really is our attitude, then it's more about how many people we've helped and if we're focused on that, there's always opportunities to help people. We can't control how many people use our business or support us, but we can control how many people we help, so we can just invest in that and uh trust that eventually that will come back around. But if our main goal is the helping, then it's not so important that other people will help us because we will be helped, you know, financially and through all the business, but also just through the networking of the relationships. That's what I love most about the B and I is just that support, yeah. Feeling like you've got um people in that same space carrying the same weight, you know, that common ground that we all share together as n of doing something like um I don't actually have a real like people wouldn't call what I do even a business. But it's uh I feel like I carry a common weight with different people in my chapter, which is really you know, really supportive.

SPEAKER_01 15:29

Yeah. Just uh just on that, you're the you said you're the go-for green coordinator. If you if you see someone um struggling with the with the numbers, what does what do you and your chapter do about about helping those people?

SPEAKER_03 15:44

Well, I've got uh I first thing I did was think this is a big job, so I found it's I found the president and the vice president from the year before to be my helpers.

SPEAKER_05 15:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:54

So we meet each month uh before the you know after the report comes out, but before the chapter success meeting.

SPEAKER_05 16:00

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 16:00

And we uh have a chat, we have a look to see who is struggling, and then we will arrange uh one-to-one with those people between the three of us uh so that we can have a chat with them directly about where they're struggling, whether it's entering the stats, which is quite often they are actually performing, but they're not actually making time to to record it. So the chapter's not getting the benefit of the uh you know the feedback coming back through the system.

SPEAKER_05 16:25

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 16:26

Now I have a question that's completely uh off topic. I yeah, in your chapter, as I mentioned, um you've done you you've done it collaboratively with Nathan. My question is what what's the relationship there and and why did you decide to do that sort of structure? I'm just it it's um it's very much about um relationships, but I I'm just curious why Nathan and and why that structure.

SPEAKER_03 16:52

Yeah, well again, the collaborative um approach I think is was gonna be good for me.

SPEAKER_06 16:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:57

But um I just asked our uh Lisa Gill, who's our executive director, I said, if you were writing this chapter, who would you get to help you? You know, I was thinking it would be her, but she said, Oh, you've got to talk to Nathan, you've got to help talk to Nathan Bill. And I'd already had had a one-to-one with Nathan already, and I thought, yeah, that's great, because his story he tells in the chapters, he was all ready to quit. But Lisa said, Have you given this a real go, a real track? Have you, as he would put it? Have you given it 110%? And he had to admit to no, he has he's just sort of been adding it to his calendar rather than uh really stopping and thinking about what he needed to do. So he said, Yeah, I'm gonna um gonna focus for the next period of time on actually doing this, and and uh that's when things started to turn around for him. So he's got a great his story is a great story, so I'm so glad that um Lisa teed us up together.

SPEAKER_06 17:49

And we're looking forward to interviewing him um on the podcast, but also we're gonna compare notes. We're gonna ask him the same question, so hopefully your your recollection is the same as his.

SPEAKER_03 18:00

Yes, well, someone gave me some memory pills once, but I forgot where I put them. So I don't know. Love that. It's not a it's not even a joke, it's actually a truth story. Oh, really? I don't know what there's in those pills. I never got to find out, but it's gold.

SPEAKER_01 18:15

Now I just want to touch on um going back before Jeremy rudely interrupted with his. Hey, it was an important point. It was a very interesting, although off topic. But then no, very good. Um so the the go for green numbers come out, and um quite often, I mean, chapters do do it differently. Some of them put up all of the numbers up on the screen, some of them publish onto their Facebook group, some only put up the people who are in green, actually. But we all do get access to them. So um and they don't because chapters vary in size, they don't people don't necessarily get that um that personal coaching to to um to help them through. I mean, obviously you you touched on how you were doing one-to-ones and and helping some of the people that are really struggling, but there's a lot of people in the middle. Um so if if a member wants to improve their numbers, what where where do you think they should start?

SPEAKER_03 19:09

Oh well, I suppose it's looking at the areas where they're not per not get gaining the uh points for their traffic lights, which now it's always been like uh visitors and referrals have been you know big ones to um focus on, but yeah, they're the biggest ones to focus on now, so they're worth 50%. Between those two, they're worth 50%, and you're not gonna get any sponsors, which is a five percent one. You're not gonna sponsor anyone if you haven't been inviting any visitors, so that's right. That's another five percent that you're de you're gonna miss out on. So yeah, the only way to stay in the green even is to well, you can be seventy percent um without a visitor, but um yeah, it's actually easier to get your points for the visitor now than it used to be because you can get you invite the same visitor twice and it will count. And you only need to get like five every six months instead of six every six months.

SPEAKER_06 20:00

So your look, Chris, suggests you didn't know about that.

SPEAKER_03 20:03

Inviting visitors because visitors help you get referrals too, because they come along and they see five people there that they want to give work to, so you just gotta remind them hey, don't keep me in the dark. If you give work to these people, you have to tell me so that yeah, we can keep a record of it so that the chapter gets the benefit of the stats, but then we get the benefit of the stats as well. That's right.

SPEAKER_05 20:23

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:24

Yep. So yeah, inviting visitors will automatically include your potential for referrals as well. So um as long as you can keep track of those people, you know, get them to communicate with you, and then they can help you get other visitors as well. Because you just say, Oh, if you enjoyed it, um do you know anybody else? You know, two is better than one, and uh three is not a crowd, so I always invite my visitors to invite a visitor as well. Say if you like it, or even if you haven't been yet, if you know someone who you like, like to invite along, so you get more than one visitor at the same time.

SPEAKER_06 20:57

And I think um it's also important to recognise that as chapter leaders, Chris and I were talking about this just a little bit uh a little bit um earlier, about having a strategy to help people to invite visitors because it can seem as a bit of an obstacle, but if you create a really, really simple process, Chris has come up with a great idea where he does a little bit of a workshop at the end of his chapter meeting um that helps people to literally put out some invitations, and albeit it is cold calling and it is um a little bit of arm's length, but at the very least it it breaks down that barrier of of how do I do it, what do I say, what's the process. And so I think you were saying, Chris, that you you the uh the every person who attends the workshop walks away with having invited four or five people.

SPEAKER_01 21:44

Yeah, we um we we uh did this it it's sort of been a couple of week process, but it was actually yesterday in our uh in our chapter meeting where we asked everyone to bring their laptops to the meeting. Um and after the meeting was finished and the the visitors were were gone. We said, right, we've we're doing this this activity for 15 minutes. So what we did was we sp split up into power groups. Um the power groups decided um the categories they wanted to invite to get into the room. Every person in the room, every member had a category. So I actually um well it's not really my my um power group but I went and helped the uh the trades um I was allocated a carpenter so um what we did was we went through a little simple process where everyone got out their their uh laptops we put in category carpenters near me we searched we uh brought up the good the map on Google and then we went through a process of just inviting so at the end of the meeting um the the everyone was to invite between three and five um visitors and um it took 15 minutes and I think we sent out 80 invitations in that 15 minutes. Um based on that um one day later we've got six visitors. And that's the thing. And the purpose behind it really was to get people as you uh referred to it um earlier Phil where people a lot of a lot of members don't invite any visitors. Now whether they actually ever do it and it doesn't work, but it actually stepped them through a very simple process to get it get an invitation out there. Whether they get a visitor, but it we're just showing them how easy it was.

SPEAKER_06 23:24

It's a c it's really a way of creating an inactivity looking at the metrics and going, okay, so we know that if we invite visitors they're going to bring more business to the room that as you've pointed out Phil a number of times where people have invited visitor through visitor because then they've joined but but using that uh level of of understanding as a chapter leader to be able to draw people into that process to to make them active and then and then the results will follow. Would you agree with that sort of thing, Phil?

SPEAKER_03 23:51

Yeah I think yep that's good. It's all um in being very intentional isn't it? Yes. You can have good intentions but uh account and accountability is a really big thing with B and I. And uh actually doing it in the chapter meeting well that keeps everybody accountable. Yeah we didn't we didn't let them get out of the ro leave the room until they divide they lock the doors you've got a couple of uh heavies at the door and exactly yeah and it's not actually that hard but it's just prioritizing the time isn't it and if people just think about it but don't prioritize actually doing it then it's it can you can put off till tomorrow for for months and months and never actually never get any results. So a lot of members never really break the ice with that because it's not doesn't sound like the easiest thing to do so they'll just do something, you know, do something else. I think we're all like that in some way. Yes. So we need to encourage each other forward. So that definitely does encourage them because they have to they're there and uh everybody else is doing it. So yeah and it's great that you had a good result you know I think it's a powerful process to for a visit. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:54

Yeah. All right we're getting uh close to the end Phil. So um what we like to do is m um provide listeners with some practical uh takeaways I think that they can implement. So here's a question for you Phil. If every B and I member listening today focused on just one metric over the next 90 days what do you think that should be and why?

SPEAKER_03 25:18

Oh good question. Well uh I would say well we've been talking a lot about visitors so uh I will say visitors and the reason uh why would they should focus on visitors because there's atrophy everywhere you know outwardly we're wasting away you know eventually we're all getting we're getting older. Yeah you don't invite visitors the group shrinks and all of us probably know groups like that. Um there's no group after a while it's it it's been involved so um a certain percentage leave every year so we always need to be happy new people coming in otherwise that's the there's no future for the group and uh those visitors will bring business straight away those visitors will bring other visitors those visitors make the uh room hum and uh you know everybody's you know you know uh you know some people are really excited when there's new people but if it's the same people every week listening to the same presentation yeah it's uh you know can become pretty dull after a while and discouraging so yeah just having even one visitor will make a difference to that meeting uh room and um and it brings new life and uh those visitors have got lots of different connections uh that can surprise us in lots of lots of different ways as well. Um I've I always think um yeah when you are inviting a visitor just don't think about whether they're gonna come next week just invite them for some time like I did with Julianne when we you know if there was some time I eventually got it to agree and then I just had to nail it down to when that sometime was going to be and it eventually comes around. So um if you don't not to be discouraged but just ask people would you like to come along sometime and think of different reasons. Everyone needs subs at different times so I'm gonna need a substitute for this group uh and I really would like you know I think you do a really good job. Would you like to um be a sub for me like once a year or a couple of times a year. And those people would say oh yeah I could do that and then you say oh well would you like to just come and check the group out first so that I can introduce you to a some people so that you've uh you know I've used that one I've used that one a few times as well. So different motives for getting people there. Yeah and then letting the group persuade them and give them further ideas of who who else could join.

SPEAKER_06 27:27

It's really um I I I love doing these podcasts Chris because there's so many things that we uncover. You know you can read the chapters and you can get something but when you start to unpack with the person who's written it and I I think one of the things that's that's uh there's two standouts that I've got from this this podcast. One of them is um we started off talking about numbers and we ended up talking about how to invite visitors. How crazy is that like the the numbers the numbers are the are the foundation but it's all of the other stuff that's around that that's really really um key and I think that's probably a theme that we found every time we've done this. The other thing that's really and this is a a real um uh um kudos to you Phil I've said kudos a couple of times this this um podcast it's another big word for you but um kudos to you for the fact that consistency is the can you just press that red button cool um the the the consistency of doing that activity like it's about consistency what you've said over and over is you keep doing the same thing. Um they say in some parts of the world you do the same thing over and over and you expect a different result. It's a it's a definition of stupidity but I actually insanity wasn't it stupidity oh well yes you're right actually well I was looking at you that's why no no it's insanity sorry um but in B and I and what Phil has just presented to us is that you keep doing the same thing over and over and consistently you're actually going to get a result that continues to build on foundation and create something really powerful.

SPEAKER_01 28:58

So um yeah it's been really really great to uh to unpack this this chapter yeah well thank you so much for having me that's been awesome Phil so yes let's wrap it up so Phil's uh that that was a really great chat to Phil so really really appreciate it I mean Phil's insights have been um well documented in Secret 7 in the book if you don't have the book then you should get the book and where do we get the book Jeremy? Bnit20secrets.com well done excellent BNI20secrets.com fantastic so thank you very much Phil we really appreciate your time um this is another another episode of our our podcast series we've got another one coming up very soon very soon where imminently I like that word too so thank you very much Phil for joining ever joining us really appreciate it thank you everyone for listening guys for what you're doing and for the opportunity and thank you everyone for listening and we look forward to seeing you in the next podcast. Yes see you soon bye bye bye bye