The Tenuous State of Homeschooling Freedoms – Interview with Kevin Boden

For the first time, Brazilian parents are getting prison time for homeschooling…families in the Netherlands are receiving “return to school” orders…and homeschool freedoms are unraveling in CT and NE with new restrictions being rolled out. Kevin speaks with Kevin Boden, attorney for the Home School Legal Defense Association, about the national and international situation, what it means, and what homeschoolers must do to keep the freedom to teach their kids.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:06

Welcome to Generations, Kevin Swanson here, and I can recall sitting in an education committee meeting at the Denver Capitol a few years ago. We were battling down another attempt to increase the compulsory attendance law requirement from 716 to 6 to 18 in the state. Of course, it was the homeschoolers protesting the law. Nobody else showed up as usual. But we believe parents should have the right to determine whether their six-year-old son should be bolted to a desk for six hours a day, especially if he's got ADD ABD, American boy disease. So we believe parents should make that choice. Well, this judge from Pueblo, Colorado, is testifying to the increase in the severity of the oppressive law, and he looked at the homeschooling parents in the audience and he says, All of Colorado's children belong to us. To which we said, No, they don't. No, they don't. No, uh-uh. Uh-uh. No. No. Our children belong to God. And He's given them to us as stewards, and the state has no business interfering in this field of education. None. Zero zip zilch. None. None. What would give the state the right to control our children? To control their education, to control our children's health, or to control their diet, or to control their socialization? Would it be Karl Marx and John-Jacques Rousseau that would give the state the right to do this? Well, who are they? Who's Rousseau? Who's Marx? They're just two of the most evil men who ever lived in human history. You can read about that and apostate the men who destroyed the Christian West, a book I wrote a few years ago. But again, who gives the state the right to kidnap our kids? To legislate standards for sex education, to legislate standards for what they will read and what they will view in terms of what their take of education will be or the origins of this world? What gives the state the right to do all of that? The will of the legislature? The will of judges? The will of the Supreme Court? The will of the people? What would give the state the right to kill all the Jews in death camps? The will of the people? The will of judges? The will of the supreme dictator voted for by the people? What gives the state the right to all of this? Folks, you need to remember all governments are under God. That's why my recent book is called Under God. And God has not given the state the right to fund and control the education of our children. A government that kidnaps our children and determines their economy and their education is an oppressive and tyrannical state. 1 Samuel 8 speaks of the state taking your sons and your daughters, and you will cry out to the Lord your God in that day. At the very least, we should be crying out to God over all of this just about now. This would be the right time to do that. Nehemiah also severely rebuked a system that kidnapped sons and daughters and put them into an alternate economic power. Now, we absolutely must abolish the compulsory tennis law. That's an imposition of the Prussian Marxist French Revolution-based idea, in which children were turned over to the state. In the Western world, children used to belong to the family, and they participated in the family economy. As time progressed, children were handed over to the capitalist corporate workhouses, at least for a short time between 1750 and 1850. With Karl Marx and the Communist Manifesto, then the children were transferred from the capitalist corporations to the state via the composture tennis laws and the government-funded schools. Just read your Communist Manifesto and you'll learn about the process. They moved from the family economy to the corporate economy, and then they were sold off to the state. Okay, so that's what happened. Beginning in the 1970s, however, a small minority stood up and said, we're going back to a family economy. We're going back to a family-directed education via homeschooling. My mom and dad were at the forefront of this way back in the late 60s. They never contacted the state about it. They never asked for permission from the state. They never registered us with the state. They just discipled us at home and raised six children in the nurture and the admonition of the Lord. And by God's grace, homeschooling has been legalized in all 50 states. And by God's grace, men like Chris Clickham, Mike Ferris, and others fought the good fight and won successive battles in legislatures and courtrooms across America between 1980 and 2000. Now we have enjoyed about 35 years of regained freedom and restoring some liberty in these areas of life. God has gone before us in all of this. I'll testify to that myself. We've never lost a parental rights battle in 27 years. I've worked as director with Christian home educators of Colorado, and we live in a blue state. We lose almost every other battle in the state. We lose the gun battles, we lose the life battles, we lose the pro-family battles, we lose the public school battles against the four-year-old transgendered program. If parents would sign up for their God-given responsibilities, you know, God will provide the Red Sea opening up for us, and He will provide for our liberties to enable these responsibilities. You've just got to have a will to fight for it. You've got to have a love for that liberty. You've got to get your toes into the Red Sea. You got to realize the future of freedom is at stake. Right at this point, you've got to commit that you will not leave your children in gulags and prison camps. You've got to love liberty. You've got to love your kids. You've got to love God. Or you won't have the will to fight this. And you've got to unite to fight. Homeschoolers are a broad and diverse group across denominations, but they've got to unite to fight. They've got to set their differences aside to fight for this. Now, sadly, in this the second year of Trump, homeschoolers have lost more ground than ever before in the history of the movement. And you heard me right. We might have lost serious ground here. We have lost liberties in Connecticut and Nebraska. And for the first time that I can remember, homeschooling parents have been sentenced to prison in Brazil. So today, our good friend and compatriot in the battle for family freedoms, Kevin Bowden, attorney with HSLDA, joins me on this segment of the Generations Broadcast. And now Kevin Bowden, attorney for HSLDA, Homeschool Legal Defense Association, joins me on this edition of the program. Welcome back, Kevin. Always good to see you.

SPEAKER_00 6:17

Likewise, Kevin, it's good to see you. Good to be back.

SPEAKER_01 6:19

Yeah, so we're going to talk about homeschool liberties and the ongoing battle. And by the way, I think it's hotter than ever, not just here in the States, but uh various countries around the world. The enemy is never quiet. That's that's truth, I guess, isn't it? I mean, the enemy is out there. He's uh he doesn't take a nap.

SPEAKER_00 6:37

Yeah, 100%. And uh particularly when I think liberty is at stake. You know, I think as Christians, we're liberty-minded people, it's kind of built into our heart. And so when people advocate and fight for that in one, and I think um there is an opposition that we all sense to that kind of general thing that we want, even if we can't articulate it, you know, as clearly as we might want to.

SPEAKER_01 6:56

And Kevin, I want to start with gratitude because praise God that uh HSLDA and other organizations, of course, but uh wow, the fight for homeschool freedom has been waged in one so many times over the last 50 years. I think of Chris Klika, I think of Mike Ferris, um, Mike Smith, obviously. Uh, some of these guys, they were in the thick of it in the 1980s, 1990s, on into the early 2000s. Praise God. Talk to us how it happened. How did we get there?

SPEAKER_00 7:27

Well, you you got there by people who first and foremost believed in God. I mean, I was privileged to hear Mike Ferris speak at an event here just a few months ago in Montana. And um, no doubt about it, the favor of the Lord in these actions, but the favor of the Lord works through people who take action. You know, you read through the book of Ezra or Nehemiah, those kind of books where, yeah, we need to get the temple rebuilt, we need to get the wall rebuilt, and the favor of the Lord is there, but it's working through human hack actors who are willing to roll their sleeves up, as it were, and get to work. And so when you look at Ferris and Smith joining forces in the early 80s, forming HSLDA, the Chris Klickas that come along, and the many that have come since then, you know, those are people that are willing to get to work, to do the hard work, and then ask for the favor of the Lord and to bless the efforts that they're engaged in. And so when those two things come together, you not just in HSLDA's history, but throughout church history, you've got a pretty powerful combination there.

SPEAKER_01 8:21

And yet they they show up in the midst of a rising socialism, Marxism, and really government is on the increase, not just you know, other countries around the world, but uh here in the United States, we we began to see the the the the increase in the purview of government in every area of life. And it seemed to me that this you know exception for homeschoolers was an extraordinary exception. It seemed to me that God was going before us. I I give this example all the time. Wherever I go, I say, Well, I live in a blue state. And when you live in a blue state, you sing the blues, okay? Because you lose almost all the battles for any kind of meaningful liberty. It's just what happens, okay? Big government, lots of taxation, we lose the gun battles, we lose the life battles, we lose the profanity, we we just lose everything. But, but, but over the 27 years that I've worked as executive director for Christian home educators at Colorado and for generations, we have never lost a single battle in this state. It's extraordinary. I mean, somehow, by God's grace, now, you know, we have a very active organization. You know, we're down at the Capitol. We have somebody who is assigned to uh to believe lobbying for homeschooling interests and family freedoms. Uh, but we we're winning. We've won so many battles for liberty. And you you've been with us on this. I think, haven't you been one of our attorneys working with us here in the state of Colorado?

SPEAKER_00 9:48

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, and it and and it's frankly, it's a pleasure to do so. But yeah, you know, there has been kind of an unusually high level of protection of this homeschool liberty that was fought and obtained in the early 80s. Now, it's it it's a bit tragic, honestly, that as a country we even had to regain that freedom. The fact that we lost it and there was all of those compulsory attendance laws, and you can't homeschool your children, you have to send them to school on threat of truancy charges or removal of your children, the fact that we even had to go through that period of time in our nation's history um is is not ideal. But I do think and when you reference blue states, obviously, you know, the threats in Colorado have not been have not been insignificant. I mean, they they have come and they have been defeated. And that is through the labor of the work, it's through the favor of the you know, it's through the goodness of the Lord that that we have that. Um But you know, we're we're seeing we're seeing threats, frankly, in blue states, in swing states, in red states. This is not as much of a clear political line issue as as one might kind of suspect at the outset.

SPEAKER_01 10:51

And let's talk. I mean, here we are in the year 2026, some oh 40, 45 years into the homeschool movement, and you know, we've we've won some battles. We've done well. I don't remember anything as intense as what we've been facing this year, the unraveling of homeschool freedoms in Connecticut, Nebraska. Very bad. Very bad. What is what is the worst case interpretation of these legal developments, Kevin? I want you to start right there.

SPEAKER_00 11:21

The worst case interpretation, uh, I mean, I don't know that I can give you a worst case. I mean, the worst case for me is that these would just spread and take over, that these that are now isolation in the country would become the norm across the country. Um, that this regression of freedom that parents have in various states would become more common than it is uncommon. I mean, that's a worst case scenario. And I I don't think that will occur, but I do think that there will be constant vigilance and lots of activity that's going to be required uh moving forward. So but it it has always been a mixed bag. If you look back even at last year, you know, the Virginia religious exemption bill to remove that, um, the Illinois legislation that we were dealing with this year, Connecticut and Nebraska, as you reference, those have been ongoing in the pockets or in the midst of positive legislation. Okay. So it's very much a mixed bag of yes, we fight and defend over here the attack, but over on this side, we advance homeschool liberty in a positive direction. And so we've seen that both that this year and last as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:20

So what happened in Connecticut? And what what's what's the deal? How did homeschooling freedoms get abridged in the latest legislative attack?

SPEAKER_00 12:29

Well, uh, you know, the very simple of course is you know, they passed a bill and it got signed into law, and and and you know, there there it goes. Um what you had in Connecticut was, you know, not a this and this is not a new effort in the state. It's not like this stuff just comes out of nowhere and you have no idea that it's going on. Um, but you have a legislature that um was looking heavily at what type of regulation is required, most of it under the auspices of we need to safeguard children or protect children or give them a safety net, right? Who are the mandatory reporters? This was, of course, and perhaps not surprisingly to your audience, you know, not um not you know insulated from you know high-profile news stories of tragic cases um that occur. And you know, when sin entered the world, it entered everywhere in the world. It didn't enter parts of it and leave other parts untouched. I mean, so we see the effects of this, you know, all throughout um our country, uh, even into the homeschool community, all throughout the world. And so you had hope high-profile media cases, gets the attention of representatives, they say we have to do something, they look at something, and um, you know, they they pass that through.

SPEAKER_01 13:40

So, how much would this affect newbie homeschoolers in the state of Connecticut?

SPEAKER_00 13:45

Well, you know, most of the provisions have to do with with with uh withdrawal provisions. Okay. So a family who is you know just looking at starting homeschooling and not withdrawing from school, there's no waiting period, there's no check uh on that um individual. So existing homeschoolers may not see much uh change. But those that want to change that educational modality, and you know, the the studies show that there's lots of movement in and out of different educational models. So excuse me, the idea that a parent, you know, that the majority of people go with homeschooling and homeschool from K through 12 without any change is is not really consistent with what we see in the data. There's lots of in and out of different education things. So um those that are pulling out of the public school will will be the ones that are um influenced by this particular new legislation. And and of course, you know, people should know in full disclosure, the first provision of this takes effect next year, the second provision takes effect in 2028. So we don't have an immediate um we don't have an immediate issue with respect to this affecting families currently. There is an implemented um implementation timeline. And so, you know, we're we're tracking that, of course, and taking steps that we think we need to take uh to challenge this. One of those, we sent out a uh an uh press release today actually about a um FERPA complaint that we filed with Department of Education to look into this. So there's lots of angles that we're trying to challenge it um before it actually goes into effect next year.

SPEAKER_01 15:13

And it would be that these uh folks pulling their kids out of public schools would be subjected to investigations on the part of local uh bureaucracies, I'm taking it.

SPEAKER_00 15:21

Yeah, it it's it's just sharing of information from the for, for example, the parent that wants to withdraw their child to home educate, sharing that with Department of Children and Families, I believe, in Connecticut, and doing a cross-check, and if there's anyone on the reg central registry, then they're barred from home education. And so there's a sharing of information between those agencies, um, and it would act as a bar. You you can't do it. You know, and it's and it's not just a parent or guardian, right? Or one or the other, it's any adult who lives in the home. And so it's uh it's it's truly remarkable in its scope and its limitation. Um you know, and we could talk about of course how to get on the central registry and how hard is that. I mean, I don't know the ins and outs of all of that. Um but suffice it to say, you know, as believers, you have to ask yourself, does it allow for meaningful redemption? You know, uh uh you know, take a take a mom who has a child, you know, in their teens, and there's some neglect finding when they're 18 years old, and 20 years later, 15 years later, they've their life have changed and they're still on the central registry for a child abuse allegation. And that's that there's no real opportunity um for redemption in this bill for that parent to then be able to decide, hey, my life has changed. It's 15 years later, I'd like to homeschool my children. Sorry, you know, um, this this could this could preclude that.

SPEAKER_01 16:36

Would it be possible that a parent uh who spanked their child uh might be prosecuted on that basis at some point in the future and therefore find themselves on the registry?

SPEAKER_00 17:32

Uh, you know, I don't know the the ins and outs of the laws in Connecticut honestly well enough to know whether that would lead to a finding of abuse uh or neglect, it would put somebody on the central registry. I don't I don't have the level of knowledge on you know what the corporal punishment laws are in the state of Connecticut. Now, it would be possible, just speaking broadly, that if if something like that was considered neglect or abuse under state law that would land them on the registry, then it would have the same effect as any other reason that they may have got on it. So it doesn't really categorize why somebody is on that registry as I understand it. Um just the fact that they are on the registry uh is sufficient um to act to to to to bring up this bar to home education.

SPEAKER_01 18:17

It is interesting that a number of Western countries have just over the last 15 or 20 years brought some rather stringent laws against uh spanking or smacking as it's sometimes called in the British colonies. Um so I mean I to me it's it's it's certainly something that we're going to have to uh look at in the future, uh perhaps defend families uh on that basis.

SPEAKER_00 18:39

Yeah, you know, we you know we we we stay pretty laser focused on the homeschool front of this. You know, there's lots of parental rights type issues that are are, I don't want to call them tangential, but they're not kind of core HSLDA focused missions. So, you know, we're very hopeful that organizations that focus on more broadly on parental rights um will look at defending those rights um as they need to be defended wherever they happen to come up. You know, I I don't know whether that's the case in Connecticut or any other state. Um, you know, from where I sit, because we just don't deal with it that often. We're we're concerned with the fact that if you're on the registry, then there's a correlation between you can't now homeschool, regardless of why you're why you're on it, how long ago you got off it, whether you should be on it or not. Um and of course, this is just based on a finding. You know, one of our concerns is that this is not based on a judicial determination. It's not based on a finding of guilt, it's not based on what we would consider to be a certain level of evidence that would give you some sufficient guarantees uh with respect to the finding. It's it's literally within the government agency outside of the judicial process, which should give all people some cause, I think. You know, we have due process requirements for a reason. And so to restrict the fundamental liberty of a parent to educate their child because of a finding non-judicial of an agency, you know, flies in the face of what most people think of as a level of liberty or due process that they think they should be entitled to.

SPEAKER_01 20:04

You know, Kevin, I'm wondering if we're falling asleep on defending these rights, these liberties that are so key. I thought I don't think there's anything more fundamental, I mean, than parental rights, uh, family freedoms, you know, even like gun rights and right to life, and all those are important, absolutely important. But uh but when the government has a right to determine the medical situation for your child, or determine the educational situation for your child, uh, or perhaps take your child to kidnap your child, uh, that to me is a pretty serious issue. That's that's that's about one of the most significant rights slash liberties that exist. And I think back in the 1990s and 2000s, when I was involved in uh in home education leadership, uh people were concerned about that kind of thing. People packed out these seminars that we talked about the importance of defending homeschool freedoms, parental rights, et cetera, is a major concern for the movement. I'm wondering if people are falling asleep. I'm wondering if maybe even subconsciously people are saying, well, Trump's president, we don't have to worry about this anymore. And then you get Connecticut and Nebraska in cinching up homeschool freedoms.

SPEAKER_00 21:13

Well, you know, it's an interesting idea. You know, I wonder if part of it also maybe, you know, those as I understand it, you know, now I'm I'm not as old as as some, right, in terms of the movement. Um, but my sense is in the 80s and 90s, right, as you were going through this movement, people sensed the real threat because it was so near.

SPEAKER_01 21:33

Right.

SPEAKER_00 21:33

And you have a generation of homeschoolers now that the whole their whole time of home educating, it's been free, it's been legal. So perhaps it's a sense of, well, we think there's a political component to it, but I think there's also a real sense potentially that, you know, they just don't maybe even have any knowledge that it has ever been illegal or that there was ever a significant battle for the rights that they now exercise and take for granted. And and I'm and frankly, I'm grateful that I have not known a time in my life as a homeschooler, as a homeschooling parent for 18 years where it hasn't been legal. But I can imagine if it was 20 years ago and I had that acute memory of what those battles were like, and I talked to people at conventions who dealt with CPS or were threatened with truancy or had allegations of, you know, educational neglect or child abuse because they wouldn't send their children to school. I can imagine that that would shape my psyche in a certain way. And the history and the longevity of the institution now is such that I don't think that's in the s immediate psyche of those that are currently starting or new. relatively new in the home education space. So whether it's whether it's a Trump issue, whether it's a political at the sleep issue, you know, the reality is is, you know, I think as as as many smarter people have talked about, if you don't remember the battle that you have been through, you're likely to forget that there was ever a battle and those liberties can more easily be lost just because of you don't know it and you haven't learned the history of what that battle was like.

SPEAKER_01 23:06

Yeah. And I also hope there's a decent organization happening in in our present situation where, you know, if the state organization is not engaged or the state organization has not uh brought together the troops and uh communicated the issues to their constituents well enough. I don't know what's happening in Nebraska per se. I don't know what's happening in Connecticut per se. But it seems to me that those who are interested in liberty are going to have to connect with the committees of correspondence. I'm thinking of the Samuel Adams Committees of Correspondence, you know, during our war for independence. But but to connect with HSLDA, to connect with a state organization to get organized, to get the info, to maintain unity. You know, I joined Christian home educators at Colorado 27 years ago, Kevin. There was disunity in the state among the homeschoolers. And I met with some of the competing organizations, some of the leaders. And uh I, you know, I'd do lunch and I'd say hey I'm you know covering for lunch. Let's do lunch. Let's talk about this. And I was able to pull together a unified front as quickly as I possibly could. This was in 1999. And my basic line that I would use was guys if we don't hang together, we're gonna hang separately. So what do you want to do? Hang together? You want to hang separately? You know, which one? Which one do you prefer? You know and and everybody would say well I think we better hang together on this. And I do think it's it's incredibly important that states uh state organizations pull together the troops and uh and we retain a degree of unity. I realize we're hurting cats with homeschoolers do we have a very broad standard deviation, right? It's a huge bell curve, you know, it goes that way and this way, but we should at least unify on the fact that we need this liberty for the sake of our families, for our children and for our grandchildren.

SPEAKER_00 24:55

Yeah, 100%. I mean I have I have beat the unity drum everywhere I go and mention it because I think there is a risk. And particularly in a in in a culture we live in where it's very easy and it's almost kind of in vogue to just dismiss people who don't agree with you on everything. It's like oh you you made this theological comment that I don't like with so I don't read any of your books. I don't listen to you anymore as if everything you say is now tainted with some massive problem or oh you you have a difference a slight difference of opinion on this issue over here so I'm just gonna dismiss you the school choice movement of course is a big thing um in the in in the debate at this point but even in that I say look at the end of the day I think what you and I can agree on is that we hope that our children have the freedom to homeschool as we do now and if possible let's expand it for them. So if you agree with me on that issue then let's hold hands on this so that we can defeat it, right? Because it turns out when these bills pass in Connecticut, when it passed in Nebraska, if it would have passed in Illinois, it doesn't matter whether you homeschool because you're a believer because you're a Muslim because you're a Jew because you're an atheist because you just don't like the public school because you have pedagogical reasons. None of that actually matters at the end of the day when the restrictions come as you say we all deal with it whatever those repercussions are respective of your faith or la or or lack thereof background. And so for that reason when it comes to the basic liberty issue it's critical totally critical that we be united on this front and say you know what let's have let's save this other discussion on this other issue for a different day but let's not let us divide what's right in front of us which is the threat um because it because it is the threat and I think there has been a threat of division um which is really really unhelpful uh for the community and for all of us that are that are engaging in this work.

SPEAKER_01 26:47

Yeah Kevin I want your take on this for just a moment what did Illinois do right? I mean here's Illinois they brought 8,000 people to the Capitol they beat back the tyrants was this last year. Wow they did something right what was it what were they doing right up there in Illinois? I think maybe we the rest of us can learn something here.

SPEAKER_00 27:03

Yeah well they've they've done a couple of things right um now whether these things would have moved the needle in other states it's tough to know you know one of the beauties of our construct is states have you know kind of their own flavor their own culture of their own demographic the you know um urban rural that type of stuff but I think some things stand out in Illinois the first is um you've got a group there that has been engaged in the Capitol with the legislature for many many years leading up to it there's a lot of states that do this well so I'm not saying Illinois is is the only state doing this but you know they're there for Capitol Days they engage with their representatives they were a known figure. The homeschool community was not an unknown entity in in the halls of the Capitol. And so that you know that matters you just being physically present being visible being known is is something it's capital that you can't really buy when the need comes it's like making those deposits into your bank account. If you don't make those deposits leading up to it when you need to make a withdrawal it turns out there's nothing there. If you don't if you make those deposits and then you have to make a withdrawal you have the capital there to do it. The other thing that you know is really um unique about you know Illinois is we we had some you know the groups that we've worked with um you know the butlers there that that we have known we've had at our age facility a national leaders conference um for many years. He's spoken there in fact I think I think Chris is coming back this fall. You know they're black home you know community organizers in Chicago and so they can you know when we get to the unity discussions right that we were just having they were able to be a bridge to a different community. Yeah that's what it hurts is not always is not always synced up in states and I don't always know why that's the case.

SPEAKER_01 28:44

I mean I'm like you you like to run rights, you want to homeschool your kids you like liberty great let's let's latch up but what we had in Illinois was a was a good bridge there from people that you know we deeply care about you know reference them as as I've said we we've had them at our conference and so that was a bridge that was able to build a broad coalition of unity in opposition to the bill that right um was a bit unique in Illinois frankly I don't I don't know that that's I heard that across I think I talked to somebody when I was at the Southern Illinois conference this year he said yeah they broke through ethnic and political boundaries in an unusual way um and wow I mean that made all the difference in Illinois so before we're done Kevin I want to go international I only have a few minutes left with you but uh wow the battle is raging in Brazil and you and I have both been in Brazil we love Brazil we're like I mean we would die for these people right it's like 75,000 homeschool kids in Brazil it could be the second largest homeschool population in the world today.

SPEAKER_00 29:42

And yet and yet and yet there have been this significant uh political judicial pushback against homeschooling now what is it the parents now sentenced to uh days in prison uh you know what's going on down there yeah 50 days in prison the most recent family from what i've from what i've been told they're talking to their lawyer the first criminal conviction with prison sentencing that they can remember man right there have been lots of administrative issues there right lots of fines of families you know we got reports as you know even of last year of frozen bank accounts police parking outside of homeschool families houses that kind of stuff but yeah 50 days in prison for intellectual abandonment even though even though Kevin get this the public prosecutor in the case recommended acquittal oh man the judge still sentenced them I mean it's it's there's a bias there's a bias there yeah there's there's there's clearly a bias it's not a known I mean it it's been fairly well documented um but you want to talk about it you want to talk about people willing to fight willing to put their money where their mouth is willing to stand up and say hey even in the even with the threat of prison time and criminal prosecution I'm gonna stand on this thing that I believe in called parental rights. Absolutely education I mean I've I mean one of the reasons I love Brazil and maybe you do too is because it's so inspiring to go there. These people are fighters I love it.

SPEAKER_01 31:03

Oh yeah oh yeah they're not taking it sitting down the the battle's real that's for sure yeah so how can we help them at this point?

SPEAKER_00 31:10

How can we help Brazil well I think the first thing you can do is pray. I think you can pray um and they they you know they mean that you know we know the leaders down there they are there are praying people um they would love it if you would spread the word of what's going on there so that they can build kind of an international opposition to what's going on. Obviously you and I we can't go to testify in the in the Senate there we we have less effect on the political process but one of the things they're trying to do is um is get an international coalition of people who are just expressing their displeasure and dissatisfaction and condemnation on what is going on with home educators. So I have a press release from Aned uh which is the National Association of Home Educators in Brazil that I'd be happy to share with folks if they reach out to me and HCA be happy to share with you Kevin if you want to post that somewhere if you don't have it already. Yeah please send it to pray and spread the word.

SPEAKER_01 32:01

Yeah please send it to me Kevin yeah absolutely and and by the way I do pray with the leaders like once a month now I have a regular you know once a month get together and pray with because I I just think that's the best way the best thing I can do to support and we have raised money for their legal defense fund in the past and are more than willing to do that again. But uh prayer number one number one also you mentioned the Netherlands I I wasn't aware of this. What is going on in the Netherlands?

SPEAKER_00 32:27

Again the enemy's coming up against this parental rights thing whoa huge he he is you know we actually supported a family in the Netherlands just last year one we you know we won the case through the lawyers there public prosecutors were backing off and then just I think late May I received a notice we started to get all these contacts from the Netherlands I'm like what's going on I thought we settled this last year but turns out many many families who are homeschooling there are getting return to school orders. Oh boy and they're not accepting the exemptions that these families were doing. So in this in the state that I lived in right the heg I I spent six months of my life there one of my kids was born there the article was 102 homeschool kid order kids ordered back to school after the summer break and I've gotten emails from people saying hey we've been homeschooling our kids for years and we just were told that we have to send them to school in this fall and so and they use our curriculum.

SPEAKER_01 33:16

They use our curriculum to translate it into the Dutch language they're using our curriculum out there too. Crazy. So what do we do to help them and what what where do we go from here?

SPEAKER_00 33:23

I I I think the same thing is is um is is prey honestly um I would say become involved too you know there's a lot of just encouragement when these people in these battles know that somebody else is even thinking about them. You know that they're like people know what's going on they care about what's going on you know we do support these folks if you um I don't want to be self-promoting but if you want to give to HSLDA you know we've we've taken up their cause and we've defended families there and supported the work of the lawyers who are challenging these laws um potentially all the way to the European Court of Human Rights.

SPEAKER_01 33:55

How do we how do we do that? How do we support the international outreach for uh for HSLDA?

SPEAKER_00 34:01

Well you can just go to I think it's just hslda.org slash donate and just go okay donate I mean if you give to our freedom fund yeah we utilize that I mean I have a budget that I can utilize for international work. You can even you can you can reference you know we like any nonprofit we honor donor intent so if you put international home education or international freedom we'll we'll put it every penny of that that we can towards international home education. So um and then of course partnering with organizations like yours Kevin that that actually have a passion and care about what's going on internationally. I I love I absolutely love that generations has such a passion for the not just the freedoms in America but that those freedoms would be experienced and lived out by people with different languages and different cultures across the globe. I just think it's it's a it's it's such a biblical way to view the world but it's such a practical way to support people on the ground. So I just think it's wonderful I'm I'm totally behind generations partnership.

SPEAKER_01 34:53

And you know Kevin uh I'm I'm heading for what eight or nine conferences in Brazil and South Africa in September would would lay down my life for these people and they're beautiful people. They need the freedoms they need the liberties they need the vision they need you know what we have and they love their kids and they want the very best for their kids. Okay. It's not just Americans that love their kids okay uh people love their kids all over the world and they're Christians and they want to give their children a education in the nurture and the admonition of Jesus just like us. And uh so so we want to get behind these people as much as we possibly can. So uh Kevin thank you I appreciate you joining us on this edition of Generations. We look forward to seeing it in Brazil. So hopefully God willing September uh we will get a chance to to to meet some of the neatest people in the world um in in Brazil and Sao Paulo at the big conference coming up here in September. And by the way friends if you know anybody in Brazil send them to the home education conference I don't have the website but just do a do a search for it. It's the Brazilian Homeschooling conference Sao Paulo coming up here in September and uh Kevin and the other Kevin me will be there God willing the creek don't rise. Thank you Kevin thanks so much Kevin thanks for having me God bless you better this has been a production of the Generations Media Network. For more information go to generations.org slash media