What Does the Bible Say About Disrupted Family Relationships?

It’s common for older children to have rocky relationships with their parents. So how can you work at restoring these – especially when the gap seems to widen every time you talk? Kevin and Joshua discuss what makes the biggest difference…the place of the church…a few things that make things worse rather than better, and how to proactively prevent conflict. What does lived experience reveal…and what does the Bible say?

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:06

Welcome friends to Generations Kevin Swanson, your host with you, and Josh Esquiso in studio for another segment of What Does the Bible Say About That? Danny Craig and Nolan Glazer are in studio. It's our studio audience. So rah-rah. No, today we want to throw a question on the table, which is so important. We want to come back to this question because how many times are we dealing with these kinds of issues? And uh the question is what does the Bible say about disrupted family relationships? Parents of children in their late teens, early to mid-20s, leaving the house, not happy, relationships disrupted, this kind of thing, very common. And it happens with conservative households, pro-life households, homeschooling households, Christian church, you know, attending households. This is extremely common. And I think partly because God's revealing something here. Right? No trial wasted. But these are hard trials, Josh. What does the Bible say about disrupted family relationships, especially with adult children or you know, the older teens? So in homeschool relationships, um, we tend to be very close in the sense that you know we live together, 724s. Relationships can be super tough. They require love. And where love is absent, where you have these close relationships where we all decide we're gonna live in the same house and uh we're not going to send our kids off to boarding school. Uh we're gonna take the plastic off the sofas and bring everybody into the same house, and we're gonna live together, and we're gonna offend each other, and it's gonna be really, really hard. Um, but where love is absent, where there's the spirit of control, a pride of self-centeredness, fighting, unforgiveness, competitions, anger, uh, self-centeredness, uh, hidden sin, hypocrisy, holding standards to your kids you would not hold to yourself. I mean, what happens is these relationships, these relationships that are in a close, confined area are gonna go kaboom. Relational life and living without Jesus and without true redemption, without true faith, without self-sacrificing love, without God's grace goes kaboom. And uh so this is the the the challenge we live with in the modern world where you know you have the institutionalized approach in which children can be marched off into boarding schools or what have you, and you don't need to see them very often, that that has you know given some relief to family relationships because there's you know very shallow family relationships. But when you bring your children home, then oftentimes these relationships grow sour. And and they're disrupted, and then they leave the house, and we have ongoing relational tension and brokenness. So, what does the Bible say about this? Well, there is a slight difference between believers and unbelievers. Um, and whether the child is emancipated or whether they're still in the house. Say emancipated, I mean they're you've left the home, you're no longer responsible for your kids because they're off on their own. So whether the children are emancipated or whether they're not emancipated, the answer is somewhat different. Whether they happen to be believers or unbelievers, or whether the family happens to be believers or unbelievers, um, makes a pretty significant difference because the Bible speaks to the question of disrupted relationships. In fact, Jesus spends a fair amount of time of his ministry dealing with this. He says you ought to forgive your brother 490 times. Matthew 18, if you have something against your brother, go speak to him. You and him alone, resolve the matter. If if the matter is not resolved, then we go to uh another brother and we bring another brother with us, two or three come together. And uh and then if that isn't resolved the issue, take it to the whole church. Uh also in Matthew chapter 5, if if you know that your brother or sister has something against you, you live, leave your gift at the altar and go uh ask forgiveness of your brother or sister for the fault. So these are really critical issues and they should be the day-to-day thing. If if you haven't been doing this on a day-to-day basis, you're probably going to wind up with a pretty disrupted relationship.

SPEAKER_02 4:32

Yeah, Kevin, and this whole topic about disrupted relationships, it's such a prevalent challenge, right? Every one of us, we can think of relationships that might have struggled in the past or are presently struggling, whether it's with immediate family or extended family. And uh, if we were ever wondering whether sin is a horrific evil that destroys things, we can clearly see it in the context of relationships. That's confirmed. It's confirmed, so nobody should doubt that. But then we need to be reminded that the gospel is all about reconciliation, right? Reconciliation with God, and it's supposed to then flow into reconciliation with others, especially in a Christian family where we live under the cross, where the uh redeeming work of Christ is received by all and lived out by all. So this is very essential for Christian.

SPEAKER_01 5:15

We say this all the time that we need to be living under the cross of Jesus Christ, where we realize the blood of the Son of God is falling all over us and all around us for one reason, and that is to redeem, to forgive, to reconcile. It took the blood of the Son of God to accomplish that first with God and then with each other.

SPEAKER_02 5:38

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 5:38

And now we got the first thing you got to do is to be a Christian and actually believe this stuff.

SPEAKER_02 5:42

Amen. Yeah, and you know you pointed out Matthew 18, Kevin, in terms of the body of Christ. The assumption of Matthew 18 is if you go through all those processes, all those steps to try to be reconciled to your brother and work through an issue, if they won't repent and they won't reconcile, they're to be treated as a non-Christian. Yeah. And what that teaches us is repentance and reconciliation are basic to the Christian life. We can't get away from it.

SPEAKER_01 6:05

Well, and the sad fact of the matter is this country is swamped in unreconciled relationships, broken church relationships. And I'm sorry, but people who have just plain old fashioned left the church and left the faith. And when relationship with church members or with the relationship with the church is in tatters, I wonder if restoring relationship with the church would be a good first step for these folks that are dealing with family matters. So much of these church relationships are shot to pieces. Now they may be lost in megachurches or they don't have to deal with anybody. They fly under the radar until something comes up and then they leave the church. So there's a lot of that that characterizes this sort of fake church relationship stuff that happens. But I do think the church can be helpful. So this is a first step. Let's restore relationship with the church. Let's be walking with the brothers and sisters in the church. Whether you're on one side or the other, let's at least, you know, be reconciled with the church itself, be a member in good standing, in which you have already learned how to forgive one another within the context of the local church, and you're submitting to elders and you're submitting to one another in the fear of God. I think in Ephesians chapter five. Yes. And then they can point out your sin because you remember your weak spots in your blind spot. And this is one thing about conflicts you're going to find out. Have you ever been in a conflict? Yep. And what's interesting is when I'm in a conflict, I think to myself, boy, they're messed up. Boy, the other side is so messed up in this. Right. It's very clear to us who's messed up. That's very clear. I can see their sins so clear. And maybe that's why Jesus said, maybe you should take the log out of your own eye first so you can see the speck in your neighbor's eye. Right.

SPEAKER_02 7:44

That log could be very harmful for being able to discern things. The problem is your weak spots in your blind spot. And others can see it.

SPEAKER_01 7:52

And you can't. So to be in a humble relationship with brothers and sisters in a church and just walk up to your pastor and say, Okay, what's wrong with me? Wouldn't there be someone come, brother Josh? What's wrong with me? I know I'm messed up. I have one data point. I'm messed up. However, I'm just not sure how I messed up. Can you help me to understand how I messed up? I think this would be a good start in restoring church relationship and family relationships.

SPEAKER_02 8:24

Amen. Yeah, it's a good place to test out can we do the love that suffers long? Can we do the love that bears all things? And then we can take that into family relationships that need to be restored as well.

SPEAKER_01 8:33

Yeah. Now, I think Romans 12, 17 through 21 helps. And here's why. Because oftentimes, I'm sorry to say this, but oftentimes uh we're dealing with unbelievers. I mean, just dealing with unbelievers. People who are not members of churches, they're just kind of floating around and they, you know, they just kind of think they're Christians or they say they're Christians, but they're not really Christians. Um and so they have no sense of an obligation that they have to work through anything. The Christian believes this. I follow Jesus. I can't just let my relationships with my brothers and sisters in the church go. Yeah. I have to restore relationships. Real Christians do that. Yeah, they do that. They forgive their brother 490 times, quite a few times.

SPEAKER_02 9:21

Yeah. And Jesus taught them when they pray to say, forgive us our debts as we forgive our debtors. And so they're constantly being reminded as they pray in light of that. I've got to forgive my brother. I've got to pursue peace. I've got to have reconciliation.

SPEAKER_01 9:33

But that's but that's the way we do it in the godly biblical church. But I'm talking about the rest of the population, where there's no sense of an obligation. There's no sense that there are really believers in following Jesus in this at all. They may call themselves Christians, but they're not following Jesus in any of this. So in Romans 12, 17, I think this does kick in for unbelieving relationships in our lives. And uh why don't why don't you read that? You've got it right there. Read verse 17 down to 21, because I think this whole section ties into these broken relationships.

SPEAKER_02 10:07

It says, Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all. If possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. Beloved, never avenge yourselves, but leave it to the wrath of God, for it is written, Vengeance is mine, I will repay, says the Lord. To the contrary, if your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink, for by so doing you will heap burning coals on his head. Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

SPEAKER_01 10:37

How does it apply to a disrupted family relationship with, you know, your parents, who apparently are acting as unbelievers, or your children who are living and acting as unbelievers? How would you apply that to these broken relationships?

SPEAKER_02 10:54

Yeah, well, verse 18, of course, is important here where it says, So far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all. So Paul is acknowledging you might have situations where you don't attain peace. You might have conflict that you do everything you can to prevent, but you're not able to resolve it any further. But it also would mean then that you've done everything you can to pursue peace. You've asked for forgiveness for the wrongs that you know you've done, you've sought to do good, you've sought to express willingness to reconcile, you've done all those things, and then once you've you've exhausted all of those things, then you leave it to God to handle the matter either as a matter of vengeance, should God disdeem to judge in terms of a punishment for unbelievers, or we hope more desirably that that God would be merciful and would restore that relationship.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

I think there are points at which you have to engineer some distance, and and I think Yeah, sadly, you wind up with some superficial relationships. You know, the world is about superficial relationships anyway. Does that make sense? I mean, you're not you're not really that close to people who are opposed to God.

SPEAKER_02 11:59

Yeah. As a Christian, you're not able to have that level of communion or fellowship with unbelievers, though you want to love others, you want to do good, you want to be forgiving and reconciling as much as you can.

SPEAKER_01 12:09

And so you wind up asking about the weather and you know, about you know, sports teams and things of this nature, but it's sometimes hard to get into subjects that are near and dear to your heart.

SPEAKER_02 12:19

Yeah. And you can't exercise, you can't have that kind of mutual humility, where as a Christian, you want to confess sin, you want to acknowledge the ways in which the Lord is saving you, helping you, but the other side's not gonna reciprocate that.

SPEAKER_01 12:31

Yeah, that conversation is probably gonna go to a dead end pretty, pretty quick. Um, I think the the key biblical principles tie into this is that you know, when you say distance, I think what you're saying is some people don't really want you to be close. And so to to kind of wolf in on them, say, here, I insist on being close with you. That's just rude. You're being overbearing and maybe even over controlling. You're not to be that way. Um also realizing that jurisdictions sometimes have change, people leave the house, you're not responsible for making their decisions for them. Um still, I think we're to honor God in all these relationships. If you're a child and your relationship is rough with your parents, the child still has an obligation to the fifth commandment. Now there's an adult child talk about adult child. And uh, you know, we had some differences with an in-law, a father-in-law, and you know, he was uh he was not a believer. And yet we found ways to honor him. And we pray about it, and we found ways to honor him, and he accepted that honor, he appreciated that.

SPEAKER_02 13:39

Yeah, yeah, and I think that the fifth commandment really needs to be an important operative principle for a Christian child. Let's say their parents are believers, but even if they were unbelievers, as your example gave, they still have this obligation, and it's it's very much contrary to the therapeutic mindset that has been so promoted, where you just cut people off, you never talk to them again, you're estranged permanently from them. And I'm thinking, how are you gonna fulfill your obligation to honor your parents if you've completely cut off all communication, all interaction, all opportunity for exercising that?

SPEAKER_01 14:14

You've you've heard you know people say, you know, relationships turn toxic and unsafe. What do you say about that? Relationships, unsafe, toxic, get away from them. Don't ever talk to them again. What would you say? How would you counsel that kind of person?

SPEAKER_02 14:30

Yeah, it's not that I would deny the fact that there are going to be people and kinds of relationships that are not wise. They're not good to have a certain level of intimate fellowship. So I wouldn't deny that as a reality. My concern is that usually this is all something that people self-diagnose. Safety is what I feel comfortable with, and toxic is determined by what I determine to be behavior that is inappropriate to me. And I've noticed that whenever this terminology is brought up, especially by non-Christian counselors, they don't have the log and spec principle operating. And they often give advice based upon one side of the story. So if I come to you and you're a counselor or therapist and I say, Let me tell you about how bad my mom or dad is and why I don't want to talk to them anymore, and you pair it off all these things, and they say, Well, that sounds really bad. You shouldn't talk to that person anymore. Well, they've only heard one side of the story. It's not a biblical model for understanding the situation anyway.

SPEAKER_01 15:26

Beyond that, it does seem to me there's this zero-one. Yeah. Either we're gonna have a close relationship or if it's toxic, zero. Never again. Right. Cut it off. Yeah, no nuance. That doesn't sound like, you know, as much as is in you, live at peace with all men. It doesn't sound like it sounds more like an ultimatum that uh does is not necessary.

SPEAKER_02 16:32

Yeah, I saw this Amazon book title. Uh the highly sensitive person's guide to dealing with toxic people. Now, highly sensitive here means the it's an it's supposed to be a positive thing, like an empath. Like you're a very feeling person. You care about others, but you're dealing with all these toxic people around. And but the whole book title, I'm thinking you've diagnosed yourself to be the right good person because you're a feeling, caring, sensitive person. And all that you're dealing with all these toxic people around you, and again, you you're missing the log and the spec principle. What if you're actually one of the significant sinners in this situation?

SPEAKER_01 17:06

Well, and I think the key thing is that we be open and transparent in the face of God. There's too much horizontal behind it. The question is what is God teaching us and and where are we in relationship with God? Well, let's take the situation where every time you get together uh with this family member, you get into a big fight, everybody's walking on eggshells, conversations turn ugly quick, and there's no resolving it in the context of church and biblical counseling. Okay, we're gonna take that situation because I think it's somewhat common out there. Now, number one, either party might be a follower of Jesus, and I hope there is. If there is one party who is a follower of Jesus, I think there's one thing you can do, and that is to find the log in your own eye. Leave your gift at the altar, confess your own sin. And you know, as as you go back over the years and you think about the relationship, and think about your contributions, and think about how you interacted and how you perceived the other person, probably one of your children, or perhaps your parent, uh, through the years. I'm guessing that if the Holy Spirit is with you and you're praying for this, you're going to identify some areas in which you could have done it better. Yeah. We got to imagine there's at least one thing in 20 years that you did wrong. To be something I did wrong over the last 20 years. Yeah, at least one. I'll just pray over that. Yeah, right. I'll pray over that. Maybe I'll, you know, it's interesting. I had a broken relationship with uh somebody from a different church. This would have been like 25 or 30 years ago. And um actually more than 30 years ago. And and you know what's interesting. I I I continued to think about it, pray about it, and one day I woke up and realized I did something wrong. I got it. I knew what I did wrong. I immediately sat down, wrote a letter, and asked forgiveness. It was something I could do. And you know what's interesting? I began to restore relationships with these folks from this uh previous church. It can be the door opening. It's just it's amazing how how you know what your blind spot, uh, your weak spots in your blind spot. So, you know, realize that may be the only thing you can do for the next three years. You can't fix them. You're not their pastor, you you can't shepherd them anymore if you're a dad or a mom, or you certainly can't shepherd your own parents uh if you say, well, boy, they've got all kinds of spiritual issues. That's not your job. You're incapable of doing Matthew 18, especially if they're separated from the church, but you can from time to time send a gift. Send a gift card. On occasion, hoist the white flag in some way or another. It may not work for three to four years, but just keep on hoisting the white flag once every six months. You know, you can do this kind of thing. And maybe sometime in the future there may be a restoration to the church, to Jesus, to each other, and a willingness to submit to counseling and peacemaking. Um, so I I I think there are certain things you can do. Now, granted, you can't do everything. And you know, there may be something you can do. I used to say, you know, Christians the the the devil blows up bridges. Christians drive concrete trucks. Right. Always seeking to rebuild whatever we can, right? Yeah, the devil blows up a bridge. Now, you blow up a bridge, it takes about a few seconds.

SPEAKER_02 20:17

Four seconds. Yeah, right. Building the bridge is a lot of bridge.

SPEAKER_01 20:21

Yeah, exactly. That's my point. You blow up the bridge in four seconds. Well, let's go get some concrete, go get the white flag, get the white flag up there, and let's start brick by brick, rebuilding the bridge of relationship. And then that's what Christians do, right?

SPEAKER_02 20:40

We're in the ministry of reconciliation. We want, you know, the world to be reconciled to Christ, and we want to be reconciled with others as well.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

So these are some of the most important things we could be talking about today. Um it would be nice to restore relationships, and I think we should do the best we can to do that. The one thing we can do is we can confess our sins and we can forgive their sins. Even if they won't confess their sins, and they won't forgive our sins. And granted, the relationship's pretty much stymied there. But let's do what we can do to get this thing working. Now, if you're in the same household and and you're members of the same church, then you could do Matthew 18. And you can take it to the church and take it to the elders and sit down before the elders. Now, if there's no humility with either side, you're up the creek without a paddle. Right. It just ain't gonna work. Humility or bust, as we say. Yeah, I think it's humility or bust on this one. No other options. Exactly. Uh well, Josh, um, any other thoughts on on this? Uh what what do you do to restore relationships? Uh and maybe the better question to ask is what are the things we can do proactively to set ourselves up to relational success?

SPEAKER_02 21:55

Yeah, absolutely. And of course, you've already talked a bit about confessing our own sins. And that can, of course, be something that you bring in when things have already broken down, right? We need to, of course, bring that in. But proactively, that's something that we do as well. We we live confessional lives. And so it it ought to be the case that as our children are growing up and they're young, they're seeing us demonstrate a pattern of confession because then they know, okay, my parents, my parents are not hypocrites. Or when they fall short of the call of the scriptures that they're exhorting me to, they see, they see us confessing our sins and bringing things out. And so we need to model uh that life of confession.

SPEAKER_01 22:31

Yeah, boy, I've seen some super humble families. And um, okay, I was just thinking about this this morning. Some of the families have done the best, and their kids, their older kids, love them. And they're restored and they're walking together in unity and such. Um, they're humble. They stand to the cross, they've forgiven one another. Um, and I think the other thing is to pray, to trust God, and don't be a control freak. There's something about older children where if you're not careful, you're going to want to control them. You know, you see them starting to waver and starting to scrape the guardrails of life, so to speak, and you're like, now, if I just clamp down and control them, everything's going to be great. And it just backfires on you. Now, if you would trust God on this, it's one of the biggest tests of faith I think parents go through.

SPEAKER_02 23:24

Yeah, that's right. Yeah. And otherwise you can end up provoking your children to anger and frustration. Uh but ultimately if we trust God and we and live live prayerful lives, right? You know, that we as parents are living prayerful lives. We're going to be able to get through these challenges.

SPEAKER_00 23:39

Here's a question uh for you guys specifically on that topic. Uh let me give this to you. I have a very different personality from my son. I'm a go-getter and he's passive or tends to be passive. I've hurt him with anger and pushing him too hard in the past, but I really just want what's best for him, but I'm not sure how to connect with him and help him get to where I think he needs to go.

SPEAKER_01 24:02

I think the principle to confess is important. The personality thing is important. There are actually these four issues that tie into conflict, and we haven't gone through all of this. But the the first issue is personality and communication style. And I do think just stepping back and where we read that love is not rude, what that means is we we do our best to understand the personality type and the communication pattern that is needed in order to reach the other person. And and love does that. Love will do the best to reach out and adjust the means of communication to adjust to the personality of the other person. And I do think, you know, this is a a pretty fundamental thing we need to get over uh in order to have this conversation. I think uh a quiet conversation, uh, you know, a conversation which it's not gonna be loaded into, okay, now you need to confess your sin, but more just coming in saying, you know what, God's been teaching me some things about how I'm relating to you. And I just want to confess this. And I want I want you to pray for me, and and I'm gonna be praying through this because I want to do better with this in the future. I that's the first thing to do. Now, the second thing is to just assess other sinful tendencies. Is has there been sinful anger? Has there been sinful forms of communication where you're just literally being unloving, unkind, and angry in the way that you're approaching another person? You're expressing yourself in unloving ways, sarcasm, uh, you know, casting somebody down, et cetera, uh using wrong kind of words. And I think confessing all of that, saying the way I said that, the words I said, I want to say this was sinful on my part. I want to confess this to you. The the other aspects of relational breakdown involve uh the devil. The devil's very much involved. And remember, the devil will come in and stir it all up. And then I'd also throw in just general misunderstandings. Uh sometimes you have to communicate through misunderstandings uh one with another. So so those are the sorts of things that tie into these conflicts. Uh but wow, what opens up the conversation better than anything else is just a humble, quiet uh confession and a desire to reach the other person by uh crossing over and meeting their personality and communication styles.

SPEAKER_02 26:22

Aaron Powell And Kevin, once that father has done those steps as a preliminary thing, he can get back to sharing what the Word of God says to his son. He might say, These are the things that I'm trying to teach you that are very important, uh, but I need to start with my own confession as well.

SPEAKER_00 26:37

Any thoughts on how a father could begin building some relationship proactively? Sometimes when you have a point of conflict and you sort of both obsess over that point of conflict to try to solve that point of conflict, it doesn't actually make things better. Sometimes you have to go to maybe a more neutral zone in your relationship to start rebuilding something healthy. Any any thoughts on what a father might be able to do to rebuild some trust and and some connection, some joy and love in the relationship?

SPEAKER_01 27:09

I think finding a common interest and spending time, you know, in that interest together, uh something you enjoy doing together. And actually, I think the dad needs to lean in more so than his son. You know, in other words, it may not be a huge interest on his part, but because he knows his son has interest in that area, lean into it and uh and spend time with him doing that kind of thing. The other thing is just spending time together with your son, going off to a hardware store and you know, heading out to a restaurant and uh picking up Chinese food, you know, whatever it is, going to the grocery store. There's something about just, you know, hanging out together and doing stuff together, the everyday stuff together, that's so important. I began to ask myself the question, this wouldn't be when my son was probably 10 or 11 years of age, is there some reason my son cannot be with me right now? It was a good question to ask myself. You know, in other words, if if he could be with me, he should be with me. A friend of mine said one time that uh discipling boys is like duck hunting. You spend about two hours behind the blind for 10 seconds of action.

SPEAKER_02 28:23

A lot of time to spend together.

SPEAKER_01 28:25

Yeah, do you just spend the time together and you know, instead of this idea that we're gonna sit down and have a quality conversation, we'll knock this out in the next three minutes, and there our relationship will be fixed. I think that's what daddy's getting. Yeah, that just doesn't work that way.

SPEAKER_02 28:37

Yeah, and if uh a son ultimately gets the idea that my only relationship with my dad is simply one of correction. Like the only thing that exists is he's always telling me I did something wrong, there's no real other context for love to degenerate both directions. And so your spending time thing is really important.

SPEAKER_00 28:55

And and I think piggybacking off of that, um, Josh, one question here for both of you. What are some common ways parents try to mend relationships or fix the problem that actually make things worse? And maybe you just mentioned, you know, doubling down on correction when there's no relational foundation in place. But any other things that parents need to watch out for that actually uh in their zeal to fix something, they actually make it worse?

SPEAKER_01 29:25

Well, yeah. I mean, I think affirmation or forgetting the affirmation element of it could be very uh uh detrimental. Um not confessing your own sins. There's a tendency on the part of parents to want to, you know, express their authority. And if they were to confess their sins, somehow that's gonna compromise the position of authority before their kids. And and that misconception absolutely needs to be set aside because uh we have responsibility uh to walk in the light, to walk in the vertical sense uh before God and confess these things before God and before others. I think there's an honesty issue that goes on here. Also, uncovering any of our own hypocrisies. Uh when when relationships come to crisis, I think one of the first things God wants us to do is to uncover hypocrisies that have been going on in our lives and just get it on the table, be honest, and bring it out and confess it.

SPEAKER_02 30:23

Yeah, and we we did talk about the need to have other time with our children beyond just the mere corrective issue, and that's important. At the same time, another uh potential pitfall would be just to ignore real issues, right? Like we never talk about them, we never bring sin out, whether our sin or or we never correct. Uh, we could have the we could start to fear our children too, where you say, Okay, I just I fear a bad relationship, so I'm just not gonna deal with this issue.

SPEAKER_01 30:49

Yeah, and that itself could be a bit of a God has not given us a spirit of fear, but love, power, and a sound mind. And the other thing I was gonna say is is that sometimes, and I can I can fall into this trap. We have the come to Jesus meeting. Does that make sense? I mean, the the the big meeting, right? You have the big meeting, and and we get you know through all the issues, we pray afterwards, we hug, we forgive each other, whatever it is, but we never come back to double check to see how things are going.

SPEAKER_02 31:15

Yeah, gotta keep talking about it.

SPEAKER_01 31:16

Not doing the due diligence to come back around and assess how we are actually rebuilding the relationship.

SPEAKER_00 31:25

Another scenario uh for you guys here, uh a daughter has begun dating someone and she's completely uh committed to the relationship. Her parents are hesitant, and she sees that hesitancy as them just not wanting her to leave home, wanting to control her, uh, but they're concerned about this relationship and the person that she's in a relationship with and whether or not she's ready. And so how can they shepherd her when she basically doesn't receive their shepherding or input and just sees them as controlling and self-interested?

SPEAKER_01 32:02

Well, I mean, I think the best thing to do is bring elders, pastors into the equation and just set before them and lay it all out as honestly as you possibly can. And not just the issue itself, but the relationship.

SPEAKER_02 32:14

It's both and because you got there by because certain things have happened over the years, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:18

There's things that have have contributed to a relationship in which there apparently is a lack of trust, et cetera. But I think laying out not just the issue, but but the situation in terms of where the relationship lies. Now, this would not be the first time we've we've we've asked somebody to do this. I've done it myself. I've sat down with my children. Probably you've you've probably been in meetings with three or four of our children at certain times. And it's it's an accountability issue. It's it's a we you know, this is where I think the relationship is. My kids can just say, hey, this is where I think the relationship is, and we can just put it out into the open and have the elders you know give us counsel and pray over us. So I think that would be helpful in this situation. It's obviously hard for us to figure out who who needs more wisdom, which side needs the wisdom here.

SPEAKER_02 33:08

Yeah, and and those parents can, of course, lean upon the direct counsel of their elders who will know that situation, as well as some other wise parents that are in their congregation to say, okay, I've never faced this situation before. Here's the scenario, what should I do? And that can help them check their own passions so that they're not given to anger and frustration that they otherwise would be.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

Yeah. One of the key passages that I've tied in many, many times for myself and for others is Matthew 7, verse 1. And that is, judge not lest you be judged by the same standard by which you are judged, you will be judged. And so what Jesus is saying here is that you know what, be careful. As you're making judgment calls about your own children, would you hold yourself to that standard? And secondly, would you hold yourself to that standard at their age? They're not exactly the most wise, the most developed, the most mature people on the face of the earth, and you're probably not either at this point, but they've got some growing to do. I I I mean, I guess I'm wondering whether or not there's a humility and a willingness to listen on both sides. That would be pretty important to me. That that there's uh the the ability to have a conversation, at least to listen to the counsel of parents as well as the concerns of the children in this scenario.

SPEAKER_02 34:26

Yeah, and the other advantage of having those pastors that you submit to is that it can help your child to see uh that your commitment is not about control. Uh it's really not about just making something happen, it's ultimately about receiving the wisdom of God. And I I want to close with this.

SPEAKER_01 34:42

Um, let's say that the other party, your parents or your children, have sinned against you fairly egregiously, and you don't trust them, and you might even be bitter and angry against them. What do you do? Well, a couple of things. Number one, well, you've got to forgive them. You've got to forgive them. You've got to release the right to revenge. And I think there needs to be a willingness on your part to restore trust as well. Remember that God is sovereign, God is over it, God is the judge, God is gonna work out all of these things. Um, this faith in God, this and this recognition that, you know what, you're a great sinner, but you've got a great savior, and the savior has received you. Yes, he's forgiven you $800,000 or $800 billion, and you got this $80.47 violation on the part of this brother, this sister, this parent, or this child. We need to be willing to forgive and realize how much we've been forgiven, and and therefore, you know, live in the reality of that forgiveness. And then to realize that, you know what, you're not gonna fix it all of this. You it would be nice to think that you could, but God's the sovereign over this, God is the judge in this, and God is the one who will redeem this in in the lives of your children or your parents.

SPEAKER_02 35:57

That's right. You're not gonna get the glory, he will get the glory for restoring these situations.

SPEAKER_01 36:01

That's right. Well, friends, we need to come back to this subject. Danny, Josh, we need to come back to this subject. I think we're just scratching the surface of so many things. And friends, we may not have answered all the questions here, but we we want you to interact on these issues because these are some of the most important things that affect our lives, especially as Christians, as homeschooling parents, as homeschool kids. What does the Bible say about disrupted family relationships? That's been the subject on this edition of the program. Let me encourage you to my little book, Family Life. It just gets you started on some of these subjects. It's called Family Life, available at generations.org. And let's get back to the subject sometime in the future. This is Kevin Swanson, Joshua Suiso, Danny Craig, and Nolan Glazier back in there. And we want to invite you back again next time as we continue to lay down a vision for the next generation. This has been a production of the Generations Media Network. For more information, go to generations.org/slash media.