Space To Support Health Professional Survivors of Domestic Abuse

In support of #NHSDAAD – NHS Domestic Abuse Awareness Day on 10 December 2025

 Domestic abuse is an issue that affects people across every part of society – including those who work in healthcare. Many clinicians quietly carry experiences of fear, control or unpredictability while still showing up to care for others. Rates of domestic abuse are thought to be around three times higher in health professionals than in the general population, yet it can remain hidden and hard to talk about. 

In this episode, Dr Lee David speaks with Dr Anoushka George – Manchester GP and member of a national advisory group improving domestic abuse awareness in healthcare – about the realities facing clinicians who are surviving abuse. Together they talk about why recognising what’s happening can be so difficult, how subtle patterns can build over time and the pressures that make it harder for clinicians to reach out for support. 

They explore the role of shame, fears around judgement or professional reputation, worries about confidentiality and the internal pressure many clinicians feel to cope alone. They also discuss what can help: noticing early signs, keeping factual records, speaking with trusted people, accessing safe and confidential support and offering gentle conversations when we’re concerned about a colleague. 

This is a compassionate, practical conversation about understanding the realities faced by health professionals living with domestic abuse – and about creating space for recognition, care and safer choices when someone feels ready. 

About the guest

Dr Anoushka George is a GP in Manchester with a strong commitment to improving awareness and education around domestic abuse in healthcare. Since 2022, she has been part of a national advisory group working to highlight abuse within the healthcare workforce, and build collaboration across key organisations, including RCGP, NHS Practitioner Health, BMA, GMC, RMBF and IRISi. You can connect with her on LinkedIn.

Support and information about domestic abuse

Doctors Association UK: NHS Domestic Abuse Resources

Women’s aid

NHS Practitioner Health

Refuge 

National Domestic Abuse Helpline 

SafeLives  

Bright Sky app  

Phrida study

About the host

Dr Lee David is a GP, CBT therapist and author specialising in mental health and wellbeing. Lee has written many books on CBT, mindfulness and teen wellbeing, and speaks regularly at conferences and in the media. Away from work she enjoys running, hiking, singing in a choir and spending time outdoors with her family. You can find Lee through her website and on Instagram, TikTok (@dr.lee.david), Facebook and LinkedIn.  You can find more about her books, wellbeing courses and therapy here:  https://linktr.ee/dr.lee.david 

Transcript

Anoushka George (00:01)
confiding in a trusted person, up to them, someone who you feel safe with, who you know can be there for you to listen to you and support a really vital step is just making that small disclosure so that there is someone aware who can help you if needed 
There are so many healthcare professionals affected by domestic abuse. So if you do notice a colleague or a friend who seems to be struggling, just reach out to give them that space to talk and be there to listen to them.

Lee (00:38)
Welcome to the Choice Space podcast. I'm Dr. Lee David, GP, CBT therapist and author.

Today, we're talking about a sensitive and often hidden issue within healthcare, domestic abuse. Everyone deserves to feel safe and in their relationships. Yet many health professionals carry experiences of fear or control, often while continuing to care for others. Rates of domestic abuse are around three times higher in clinicians than in the general population.

before we begin, the conversation may bring up difficult feelings. Please check in with and make sure that you're in a space that feels steady enough to listen. And give yourself permission to pause, step away, look after yourself in any way that you need to.

Domestic abuse can touch every part of life, including mood, sleep, confidence, our ability to concentrate. And yet shame, fear about judgment, and the pressure to appear endlessly capable make it hard to recognise what's happening or to feel able to talk about it. Today, in support of NHS Domestic Abuse Awareness Day, we're creating space to reduce stigma, and bring greater and care to this conversation.

I'm joined today by Dr Anushka George, a GP in Manchester who works to improve awareness and education around domestic abuse in healthcare. And since 2022, she's contributed to a national advisory on supporting health professionals affected by abuse. We'll be exploring can make it so difficult for clinicians to name or understand what they're living how compassionate awareness of these barriers can support people to notice their needs and consider small steps towards safety when they're ready. 

Anushka, welcome. Could you start by introducing and sharing why it's so important for us to be talking about domestic abuse in health professionals and why we need an NHS Domestic Abuse Awareness Day?

Anoushka George (02:41)
Thank you. I'm a GP in Manchester. I'm an advocate for raising awareness around domestic abuse, particularly in healthcare professionals. As you've mentioned, I've been working as part of an advisory group  looking collaborate organisations such Royal College of GPs, Practitioner Health Programme, Royal College of Nursing, British Medical Association Domestic abuse has a huge impact on a survivor's and it's really important that by with key healthcare organisations that we help to minimise that impact on doctors and nurses.

Lee (03:24)
Absolutely. It's a hugely important topic and it's important that we start to have these conversations more widely, I think, so that it becomes an area that people are more to discuss and maybe it will help support in people who are affected by it. 

Let's start with language. I think the language you in this is a really important starting And you use the word survivor there. What kind of language feels supportive when we're talking about the issue of domestic abuse?

Anoushka George (03:54)
I think that's a really important point the right language around supporting people who are affected by domestic abuse. someone as a victim can make it seem like it's a weakness that they may have suffered something or done something wrong and it can be much more empowering and helpful to speak about people who affected by domestic abuse as survivors because everyone who is subject to domestic abuse is travelling through it simply trying to survive and it takes a huge amount of to deal with that.

Lee (04:28)
so that really honours that strength think the word victim can be very disempowering, can't it? And in fact, the experience of living through an abusive relationship can also be extremely disempowering. So it feels so important to ways to create that sense of power and strength, which recognising the people are already.

the health professionals that we work with, that we see, are incredibly good at supporting others. They're incredibly caring, professional. Why can it be so hard for us as health professionals to when there may be domestic abuse in our own relationships?

Anoushka George (05:08)
So I think it can be hard for anyone who's suffering domestic abuse to identify that it's happening and often there won't be any obvious signs that it is happening in the first instance. So again it's really important that people don't blame for in a situation that is abusive. As doctors and nurses we are naturally very empathetic and caring people by nature that can extend not only to our work but also into people's personal lives as well. So that can make it harder to recognise. often doctors and nurses will want to fix or help other people and that desire can extend into their as well.

Lee (05:50)
Yeah, so what I'm hearing there is firstly, there may not be signs in terms of early signs, which sometimes is a self blame, I should have spotted this. How did I let this happen? And I've certainly worked with people where there has been that sense how did I let this happen when actually, often there are not signs early on in a relationship and a perpetrator of abuse may not disclose a lot of those signs that be true from your experience?

Anoushka George (06:17)
That's right, many survivors will find that the perpetrator doesn't display any obvious signs when they meet them. They can often present themselves as a very caring, attentive person and that's the survivor to them. And often the time the survivor starts to see some early signs they may be quite invested in that relationship.

Often the signs can be very subtle because domestic abuse is very insidious, particularly coercive and controlling behaviour that can be very difficult to even identify. would say the signs to look for early on are perhaps the signs that we should look for when we form any relationship including friendships and those that start in early identifying if someone is being unkind and are they being repeatedly unkind? Are they being you, your interests? Are they being disrespectful of you, your time, your work? Do they prioritize themselves over you?

Are they there for you when you need them, when you're unwell, when you're distressed? Do they become critical of you and your interests, your friends? So it's looking for those subtle signs that keep occurring repeatedly and they're often maybe spells of good in between so it can become very for a survivor to identify what's going on and to unpick it all.

Lee (07:44)
So it's about noticing you think it's around looking for patterns behaviour that actually occurs repeatedly? So it's not just a one-off event, it's something that happens more frequently.

Anoushka George (07:57)
That's right, it's identifying those patterns, repeated unkind or inappropriate behaviour. Looking at the cycle of abuse really which is often there in relationships but it might not be recognised and that looks at where they can be a period of tension building, then an explosion, is followed by the perpetrator remorseful, apologising, and there's then that period of calm, and then of course everything builds up again. So trying to identify if that's what's happening can be helpful.

Lee (08:31)
Right, so noticing patterns and recognising that within those patterns there may be periods where is a positive the other person may be very may be very kind in those periods, but then there are other periods where it then deteriorates again and it can repeat between, sometimes swinging between aspects.

Something that I've seen and I'm wondering if work you have noticed is that I think we can be very good at trying to predict the other person's behaviour and so sometimes a sign to look out for having to work very hard to compensate, to try and predict, constantly I should do this otherwise there's going to be a negative going to react negatively. And so it actually can keep the peace in a lot of ways, because people put a lot of energy and effort into trying that. But actually, internally, there's a lot of of our own needs, or perhaps it's a coercive pattern of behaviour that we're responding to avoid a negative response, perhaps an outburst from the other person. I just wondered if that's that you also recognized as a pattern that sometimes happens.

Anoushka George (09:37)
That's right, think initially survivors will behave as they normally would do and then as they're increasingly exposed to abuse they may start to modify their behaviour and it may be in very ways that they don't even notice themselves they may find themselves withdrawing, becoming quite passive.

or they may be submissive or indeed some do fight back and become quite defensive and all of those behaviours are survival strategies everybody does react differently it's an attempt to try and survive that abuse that they're suffering.

Lee (10:16)
Yes, that idea about needing to and actually how we respond is a survival tactic. Is that something that you see? Because it feels a really key aspect to what happens in the relationship is that survivors adapt behaviour in order to cope in a really challenging, threatening situation.

Anoushka George (10:38)
That's right, often people around the survivor may wonder why they aren't leaving why are they tolerating that behaviour and living in that situation when the reality is the survivor is actually the person who's best placed to to deal with the perpetrator and they are in essence the expert in their own case and behave in the manner that they do in order to try and keep themselves as safe as possible. So it's really important that that survivor is supported around how they feel acknowledging that they know their perpetrator best. By taking all that on board, we can help that survivor to find the best way forward for them and at the right time.

Lee (11:25)
Yeah, so it's really listening and trying to work out using the resources of the individual and recognising that they are the expert in their own life and really supporting their autonomy to have choice about how to respond in a way that works for them as an individual.

Anoushka George (11:42)
That's right, they do need to be supported in ensuring that they are ready to leave, they have a plan in place and that they are ready and willing to seek help and support.

Lee (11:54)
I think this is probably true for everybody, but in particular in health professionals, can be a lot of being a survivor, about living in a relationship where domestic abuse part of that. you think there are any characteristics that make it particularly challenging acknowledge that for clinicians?

Anoushka George (12:15)
domestic abuse it still has huge stigma and taboo around it. think a lot of people including professionals are quite uncomfortable talking about domestic abuse and that can create a huge barrier because if someone is wanting to disclose domestic abuse it's really important that that person is comfortable to talk about it whether it's a professional, an employer, a friend, the GP, whoever it is needs to be in dealing with talking about it and being open about it. So I think that present a lot of barriers for people accessing and disclosing domestic abuse because they're worried about the ramifications of it and the discomfort of the other person.

Doctors certainly worry a lot about the consequences for them on their reputation, their jobs, their professionalism, doctors as well, are  people who naturally don't like to fail at anything and disclosing domestic abuse, separation, the end of the relationship may feel like a huge failure to them. They may feel that they need to do everything in their power to work at it. So I think healthcare professionals can really struggle with those aspects and they can often face barriers in accessing themselves because they may be worried about their own confidentiality, who can access their records.

If they're a GP, do they have GP colleagues who work in the practice who can access the records? If they're in a hospital trust, could colleagues access their So there's a lot of fears around that as well and that's why it's really important to have specific resources for healthcare professionals available.

Lee (13:57)
So if somebody is worried about confidentiality, and I think it's a really valid concern want to have that choice about who has access to information personal lives. That feels really, really important. And certainly protecting that from people who might know us professionally, overlap can feel really challenging. I think that's one of the reasons practitioner was created as a service for mental health for healthcare professionals was because it can be harder to access mental health in a way that feels truly we work within that system already. I guess I'd start by saying if your mental health is being the experience of domestic abuse, then services like NHS Practitioner we can self-refer as health professionals there is support there.

It's not a service that specialises in domestic but it can support people with their own mental health and wellbeing whilst navigating 

Are there sources of support that you'd like to highlight might also safer people to lean into?

Anoushka George (14:59)
Yes, there are many organisations available who can provide confidential support for survivors. So for example, the National Domestic Abuse Helpline, your local women's aid organisation, they will all deal with domestic abuse in a confidential manner, none of that will be documented in GP records. So there are safe spaces there and practitioner health is obviously a great one as well that so many doctors don't seem to be aware of that is free, confidential that's really important as well
survivors can access free support so they're not being financially drained that can become a big issue for them when they are seeking separation domestic abuse, that they may not have the financial resources to seek counselling for example.

Lee (15:45)
Do you think it's also remember don't only have to seek support at the point that you're planning to leave an abusive relationship, that actually you can seek support at any point in the journey that's completely valid shouldn't prevent people from accessing support because actually that process with sources of support over time rather than thinking I have rush somehow to make a change that I don't feel ready for.

Anoushka George (16:14)
That's right, sometimes simply information with who is a trusted friend can help you to feel better supported. Speaking to professionals such as your GP, if you want to just gauge some clarity on your situation, if you're not sure, again, like practitioner health or women's aid such as the Freedom Programme because often even sure what kind of situation they're in so sometimes sharing it with a friend or family member but also someone who's a neutral person, who's a professional who can totally different perspective both angles can help and it that survivor to understand what they're going through and start to come to terms with it and plans if they feel they need to.

Lee (17:02)
I would always encourage all clinicians to undergo training in domestic abuse so that we develop the skills to be able to respond if somebody discloses or we suspect somebody may be vulnerable or at risk. We respond in helpful that are supportive for that individual. if we focus today on conversations that we might have more informally, so maybe a colleague, we're worried about a colleague or
a friend or a family member, what advice would you give to somebody wants to offer support to somebody else they're concerned may be experiencing domestic abuse, who may be a survivor?

Anoushka George (17:42)
The best thing someone can do to support a survivor is to offer that listening ear, allow that person that space to speak, to make their disclosures and to be able to empathize with that person and offer them support if that's what they're wanting. space to stay if they... are planning to leave or just letting them know that you're there and you're available if they ever need to pack a bag or leave of the night but that you're always there to listen just simply being compassionate and understanding rather than trying to always give specific advice or telling the person to leave because that needs to be handled really carefully. If someone is wanting to leave then there do need to be risk assessments and safety plans put in place because by simply advising someone to leave you could actually put someone in quite a risky position so it needs to be really carefully and that's where...as a GP, things like IRIS-i come into place. If you're a friend, signposting to women's help so that that person actually has that place. 

And the other thing I think important for survivors to do is to clear and contemporaneous notes of what is happening them as That's to remind the survivor of incidents that may have occurred because trauma things can be forgotten and having that record can help that survivor have a clear and accurate memory of what's happened. Particularly later on they may find the perpetrator trying to distort their view of what has happened. So again, it can help with their memory and their sanity to have that clear record and it can help them later on when they leave if they do need a record of what's happened to disclose that to someone. So that can be really important. doing that in a way that's safe. If they don't feel comfortable recording on their phone or in a diary, there are apps which record the information securely, such as the Bright Sky app

Lee (19:42)
That's really important. So there's a few things I'm going to try and pick up on there. So firstly, there's around how we respond to a colleague or a friend or a family member. And it sounds like it's really key there to compassionate supporter, but not to try and encourage people to leave when it may not have been risk And that's something that a specialist service would be much more appropriate to take that role to support the person deciding how to do that safely. But what we can do is signpost to support. We can encourage people to seek support. We can be a listening we can just be a place that can come here if you ever need to in the middle of the night. If you ever need it, if it's an emergency, just call me or just turn You're always welcome. So it might be just offering support so that they feel a bit more held.

But no judgment, you know, I'm not here to tell you what you should or shouldn't do. I'm just here to support you in whatever way feels best for you right now. So we really kind of validate their autonomy

Anoushka George (20:40)
Yes, that's right. think sometimes survivors, may need and encouragement to leave, it's just making sure that it is done safely and in a controlled way and survivor is able to reach out to people so they do have that support mechanism in

Lee (20:56)
Definitely. And I it's something about reducing the pressure on the listener. We're not there as a counsellor. We're not as a specialist domestic abuse advisor. We're there as a compassionate friend or And so can let ourselves off the pressure in order to have to hold that responsibility. We're there to hold the our relationship and be a supportive space. And I think it helps to just take away that sense of
expectation of I should fix this for them as much as I'm here to be alongside them and I'll offer whatever support it feels helpful I want listen and so listening feels really really key.

Anoushka George (21:34)
That's right, think everybody around the survivor needs to be support them a way that works for that individual and just simply being there for them and helping signpost them to the organisations that they need to is often the best option.

Lee (21:49)
There's also something actually that strikes me as both health professionals and friends and family is that sometimes we have our own, we bring our own experiences maybe have experienced some form of abuse or trauma that's triggered through some conversations. so self care is also really important. So we want to be supportive and we want to be in hand with that is self co-regulation, looking after our own needs, because actually that's being part of a connected net a web of we all matter, all of our feelings matter, and we can support one another to stay well. And I feel like that's really important as well.

Anoushka George (22:25)
Yes, that's right. It can obviously have a big impact on somebody domestic abuse is disclosed to them. They may feel a huge responsibility and stress along with that. So it's really important that the person on the receiving end is taking care of themselves as well.

Lee (22:42)
This is the choice pause, a short tool you'll hear in every episode, each time with something different to help you pause, Notice and choose your next step.

Today's pause is notice the safety in the present moment.

Now is a three-step brief grounding tool that helps regulate strong emotions.

When our threat system is triggered, amygdala can take over.

Strong emotions rise like fear, panic, shame or overwhelm.

Thinking becomes harder and it's difficult to problem solve or to make decisions.

now offers a simple way

to help the body settle and come back to what's here right now.

Take a slow breath and a longer breath out.

Feel the weight of your body where it rests. Notice the ground beneath your feet or the chair supporting you. Solid, dependable, holding you without effort.

N is for notice. Notice that your threat system is activated. You might feel fear, a racing heart, a tight jaw, or an urge to escape, fight, or shut down. Just acknowledge what's happening. This is threat.

O is observe with your five senses. Look around and name two colours you can see. Maybe a blue water bottle and an orange book.

Listen for one sound in the background. Traffic.

Bird song or the hum of your computer?

Notice what you can touch, feel or smell. Your feet on the ground, the warmth of a mug in your hands, or the stretch as you gently roll your shoulders.

and soften your jaw.

Then take a slow exhale, a long sigh that uses your diaphragm.

and count as far as you comfortably can while breathing out.

Repeat this if it helps.

You're not trying to get rid of anything. You're simply noticing the parts of your experience that are already steady enough to hold you, allowing space for fear without being overwhelmed by it.

W is what do I need right now?

It might be making a drink, giving yourself a hug, phoning a friend, or stepping outside for a few moments to get some fresh air. Something small that meets just one need in this moment.

Take one more slow breath, letting the exhale remind your body that it's allowed to settle even a little.

you can return to the now practice you need to, to steady or ground the day.

Lee (25:45)
then you moved on to something else really important that I'd like to come back which is about documentation. And that feels really key And one of the things that I noticed when I'm working with survivors is that ⁓ obviously the threat system is often very People are feeling under huge pressure. There is high levels of emotion.

There's often intense feelings of fear. There may also be some shame and blame and lots of guilt and personal responsibility all woven together. And it can be very, very overwhelming. And so starting to regulate ourselves find some space through some of those emotions is really key. And I think one of the ways to try to do that is to come back just documenting facts.

and moving away from interpretations or this means about me or this means about them, because I think people can sometimes pulled between, they may well care for the perpetrator, you know, they've had a relationship, it may be quite a long standing may be love, there may be lots of care there. And so it feels moving away from blame shame for anybody and actually just coming back to the fact this happened, that happened on this date, this event occurred. It feels like that might be helpful from the point of view of keeping a record of what's actually happened, but also it takes down some of the emotional content around that experience, which might help create a bit of clarity.

Anoushka George (27:07)
Yes, I think it's really useful to keep that factual log of what's happening and often I'll get patients saying that, I did this or they've done this to me because of my behaviour it was my fault or I've provoked them blaming themselves and I think sometimes keeping a record with dates of what of the perpetrator has done what has been said verbatim if you want to write your own response to what you said as well sometimes having that really clear and factual record can just be really useful to help you start to see those patterns and identify what's going worry a lot information and what's going to happen.

But there are ways of having that disclosed and documented safely without the perpetrator being notified so you can make online reports to the police.

You can ask for officers who are trained in domestic abuse or police officers who are skilled in doing that and who will do risk assessments and you can specify that you don't want the perpetrator to be notified. So you can reach out the police for that because I know there is a lot of fear about what the ramifications could be.

But there are ways of doing it which are safe and controlled. So yeah, I think it's really important that people do try and keep a record early on

Lee (28:29)
Those conversations with the sounds there can be a sense control about what the outcome will be, that it's not going to automatically an increase in risk, that the police will respect the person's feelings about what they would like done with that information. Can it then be used in a helpful way later if needs be?

Anoushka George (28:47)
It can be. for survivors reporting incidents and having them logged, can help to identify a pattern of behaviour or course of conduct.

Police can also do things like place markers on the house to identify that as an at-risk household, ever needs to access help. They do have a flag on the house, they know that they need to attend rapidly. But yes, having that record with police can be really helpful. Often what may happen with survivors and a lot of people, and doctors in particular, reported this, is that when they finally make a disclosure or report or raise a concern that the perpetrator on them and says that actually the survivor is the abuser and that they are the victim. So that's why it's really important to have clear record for yourself and if you can with professionals so that you see what's happened and not suddenly feel that are trying to twist the story because often that is a tactic that is used by perpetrators.

Lee (29:44)
So clear, accurate, over a period of time, documentation of events is just really supportive And I wonder the process doing that is also helpful because it enables the survivor to reflect on their own experiences, to step back a little and perhaps look at those entries notice patterns. So it feels like it would be really supportive, it can be quite difficult sometimes, it can be quite uncomfortable. But if we can try and keep it contained and reduce the shaming, blaming language in those entries to very much more just this is an event that happened, then I think it can help people to start to recognise and to come to terms with some experiences that happening in their lives.

Anoushka George (30:27)
Yes, that's right. And it brings me on to, ⁓ again, a tactic that's used by perpetrators known as the acronym DARVO: deny, attack, reverse the role of the victim and the offender. that can happen the relationship, but it can often really commonly happen post-separation when the survivor starts to make the disclosures that the perpetrator then denies.

every accusation that's been presented, they then start to attack the survivor with many malicious counterclaims and they then start to reverse that role of the victim and the offender. they may present themselves as the victim of domestic abuse that the survivor is the abuser and so those records and disclosures can help just really preserve that survivor's sanity but also help them to identify that actually doing that deny attack and turning themselves into the victim, that survivor can say that is simply yet another tactic of the perpetrator.

they shouldn't feel like they're going crazy. They may feel very frightened, but it is yet again a tactic of perpetrator and simply by increasing awareness around that tactic can actually minimise the impact that DARVO has on survivors.

Lee (31:40)
So you could actually document that behaviour And so we reduce inherent when people say things about us that feels our instinct is. either sometimes to defend ourselves, we may sometimes so overwhelmed that we just shut down and feel incapable of responding so coming back to this is an event, just keep a record of this as an event. It feels like that is something we can hang on to in the midst of whirling emotions.

Anoushka George (32:08)
That's right, I think often the survivors, it would put them into position where they're going to feel completely exhausted and overwhelmed by these tactics and their natural desire will be to defend it and to try and come up with evidence to disprove when the reality is actually they don't need to and surprisingly a lot of organisations such as the police, social services, courts are actually aware.

and have seen this time and time again. So survivors can take some comfort from that, this is a tactic that's used and organisations are becoming increasingly aware of it. So it's not necessarily anything to be fearful of, although it does obviously seem really frightening when it's happening at the time.

Lee (32:51)
could you remind us, that acronym, DARVO, could you just talk us through that? So I just want to emphasize what it is, and what each stage is.

Anoushka George (32:58)
So it's deny, attack, reverse the role of the victim and the offender. So deny is when the perpetrator turns around and denies everything that has been said about They refute all of the accusations and the concerns that have been raised by the survivor. And they then start to turn on the survivor and attack them. So they may... go and tell anybody and everybody who will listen to them many, many negative things about the survivors. So they may go to mutual friends, they may go to colleagues, they may go to employers, they may go to school, anyone and start attacking survivor's character

And they start to reverse that role between the survivor and the perpetrator, stating that actually they are the victim and the survivor is the one who's been abusing them along. So that's really what that tactic is about, it's about changing and trying to falsify that narrative from the survivor and discredit them and their reputation.

Lee (34:03)
Thank you, that's really helpful. One thing that I have noticed when working with survivors is there can be a tendency to suppress or ignore our own needs. And I think that's actually, across the board for a lot of health professionals. And it contributes to why people work really hard, they are very committed to patient care, very committed to family lives.

And it can, example, increase the risk of burnout because we worked so hard we don't notice how exhausted we are. And I think there's something equivalent that can happen in a relationship setting where a survivor is experiencing domestic abuse, where effort and perhaps just ignoring how we're feeling and just keeping going and keeping going for a really long time contribute to why we don't always pick up on some of the signs it's a real sign of our professionalism as well. I wondered if noticing our needs is you could all on. Do you feel like it's something important?

Anoushka George (34:59)
Yes, think think and nurses very much carry on regardless of what's happening in their personal lives. They this inbuilt ability to function as if the background abuse is not happening and they will get up repeatedly the next day and go into work and be professional and look after the and then go home and face.

whatever trauma or abuse is going on, they simply carry on dealing with almost as if it was something they're expected to just carry on coping think healthcare professionals have it sort of drilled into them about being and continuing to push through even when they're struggling themselves.

Yes, I think we all need to be more aware of our own needs and when we're struggling and when we need a and when we need to confide in someone and when we need time off I think that can be really difficult for health care professionals to handle because of course they don't want to let anyone down. They don't want to let the patients down. So it's just recognising that you do need to put yourself first at times.

Lee (36:04)
Yeah, so maybe there's something about learning to recognise our our day-to-day lives So maybe learning to pause perhaps and just notice really hungry or hours, I haven't had my I just need to have a little pause go outside for a moment at work. And I wonder if those small parts about noticing how am I doing and what can I do to look after myself, I wonder if that could have a ripple effect that would support us to notice in relationships where there are other we may be also pushing through and ignoring.

Anoushka George (36:38)
I think trying to create some space for yourself. example, if a survivor is living in an abusive relationship, there some time they can carve out in the day where they're just on their own, where they can think clearly, where they sit down, have a cup of tea, concentrate on themselves just get some clarity. Yeah, and making just some space and some time for themselves, whether they need to reach out to somebody as well have that safe space where they can get some respite for themselves can be really important.

Lee (37:11)
Anushka, thank you so much an insightful and helpful conversation around a really genuinely that needs to be talked about. It's so important that we start to reduce some of the stigma around these conversations so that we can empower people to seek support and reduce some of the shame that can come up when people are survivors of domestic abuse. To finish, if someone listening recognizes that perhaps they're in a harmful relationship, what would be one small, safe, Choice Space takeaway, one small step that they choose might look after themselves a little bit?

Anoushka George (37:49)
I'd say confiding in a trusted person, up to them, someone who you feel safe with, who you know can be there for you to listen to you and support probably a really vital step is just making that small disclosure so that there is someone aware who can help you if needed and keeping those clear records for yourself, for your own memory, your own sanity, and to help you see that what you've gone through is real and what you have survived.

Lee (38:17)
they're really helpful. And I would add just beginning to notice, so taking micro pauses through the day, just 20, 30 seconds to stop and think, how am I doing? And what's one small thing I could do that would look after me right now? And it might be, I'm gonna make drink, it might be, I'm gonna take myself out for a walk. And all of these things are just looking after ourselves and maybe resourcing us to be able to address other aspects of life may be really challenging.

The other thing that I'd say is I really want to encourage for these conversations to be something that are happening more openly. And so it might be that we notice a colleague or a friend or a family member, we might just have a little worry about them. And it's just to start to raise that, not to pry, but to say, are you OK?
Is there anything you need to talk about? I'm here. I'm a safe space. You can talk to me about anything you want to. And so it's not pressurizing people to disclose if they're not ready, but it's also giving people an awareness that there is somewhere that to have these conversations if and when they feel ready to do so.

Anoushka George (39:26)
Yeah, I totally agree with that. think, as we've said, there are so many healthcare professionals affected by abuse. So if you do notice a colleague or a friend who seems to be struggling, just reach out to them them that to talk and be there to listen to them.

Lee (39:42)
Thank you again Anushka for joining me today. Such an important conversation.

Thanks for listening to the Choice Space podcast. I hope this conversation has offered a little more room to pause, breathe and find your own way forward. We've linked to many sources of support for domestic abuse and how you can connect with Anushka in the show notes. If today's episode has been helpful, please download, follow and share with someone else who might value the space as well. I'd love to have you with me for the next episode. Until then, take care and keep making space for what matters most.