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Service Through Music ft. POTM Military Band Alumni

• Pride of the Mountains Marching Band • Season 1 • Episode 8

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In this episode of Showtime, we connect with Pride of the Mountains alumni who have taken their talents from the marching field to military bands across the U.S. Armed Forces. They share what inspired them to pursue a career of service through music, reflect on their experiences at Western Carolina University, and discuss how Pride of the Mountains helped prepare them for the challenges and opportunities of military musicianship. It's a compelling conversation about leadership, dedication, and the lasting impact of band beyond college.

The official podcast of the Pride of the Mountains Marching Band.

SPEAKER_03

Hey, I'm Matt Henley, and I'm Rain Woods, and welcome to the Showtime Podcast for the Proud of the Mountains Marching Band. Whether you're a current member, one of our incredible alumni from the Long Purple Line, or a proud supporter of the band, we're so glad you've joined us today. I'm Matt Henley, director of the Proud of the Mountains Marching Band here at Western Carolina University. And with me is former chief student archivist Rain Woods. How are you doing today, Rain?

SPEAKER_04

Great. I'm doing so fantastic. Happy Fourth of July.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, no kidding. Very exciting day.

SPEAKER_04

So exciting. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_03

Um today is a very special episode indeed. Um, as this podcast is being released on the 4th of July, our nation is celebrating 250 years of American independence, a remarkable milestone in our country's history for sure. Throughout those 250 years, music has played an important role in bringing Americans together. From military ceremonies and patriotic celebrations to moments of remembrance and reflection, musicians have helped tell the story of our nation. So today, uh, we are very honored to have uh four members of the Long Purple line who have continued that tradition through their service in military bands. These former Proud of the Mountains members now serve our country through music, representing the very best of Western Carolina University, the Proud of the Mountains, and the United States Armed Forces. So uh let's let's meet our guests. Uh let's begin with Cameron.

SPEAKER_06

Hey, good afternoon, everyone. My name is Cameron Murray. I'm a gunnery sergeant in the United States Marine Corps. Um, originally from Selma, North Carolina. I marched in the Pride of the Mountains from 2006 to 2010. Uh I played mellophone, French horn, uh, majors at Western uh Carolina. Um, that's where things get kind of convoluted. I left Western to join the Marine Corps band before I graduated. I originally was studying music, left, joined the Marine Corps, uh, ended up going back and finishing my degree in disaster management. Um like I said, currently in the Marine Corps, uh currently with the Paris Island Marine Band stationed in uh Paris Island, South Carolina.

SPEAKER_03

Awesome. How about you, Bum?

SPEAKER_02

Hey Matt. Um so my name's Brian Bumgarner. Um from Maiden, North Carolina, and I was in the Pride of the Mountains from 2011 to 2015. So I actually got to do an extra year. Um my major was music education, but a lot like Cameron, I actually switched majors and then pursued music in the military. So I finished with a general music degree. Um currently I'm in the Marine Corps and in the Commandant Zone.

SPEAKER_01

Excellent. All right, Seth. Hey everybody. Uh my name is Seth Estes. I'm from Denver, North Carolina. Uh I was in the pride of the mountains from 2010 to 2014. I am a gunnery sergeant in the Marine Corps in the Commandant Zone. Uh let's see. Oh, my major was uh music education. And uh I just stayed with that major the whole time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

All right, Roy.

SPEAKER_00

Hey, my name is Fortland Barbosa. I'm from the great state of North Carolina, small town uh in Hickory, and I've did five years with Pride of the Mountains from 2013 to 2017. Um, my primary instrument's euphonium. I play baritone here at the Commandant Zone. Um, I was a general music major by the end of my time at uh Western Carolina, but I started off as uh performance major. I jumped around each major until I landed with general music. And uh I'm in the United States Marine, I'm a sergeant, and um I'm in the Commandant Zone.

SPEAKER_06

Fantastic.

SPEAKER_04

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_06

All right, all these D guys, I feel left out. I feel banged up on.

SPEAKER_02

It's okay.

SPEAKER_04

Well, with this episode being released on the 250th anniversary of our nation's founding, let's start with uh questions about service. So I just want to know what does serving this country through music mean for you personally?

SPEAKER_06

So for me, uh it's it's such a huge thing. Um it combines the two things that really shaped my life over over time, um, music and service, right? As a military musician, um, for us, it it's one of those things where uh it's not just playing the music on the page, you're really helping mark important moments for people's lives, whether as service members, families, veterans, uh, the public, international partners, stuff like that. You are helping mark um just important moments. They could be celebratory, um, they could be solemn. I've done so many commitments and gigs in my life that were so solemn. Um and it just it meant so much to the families that the band and the music was there. Um, so it really gives the people something to connect to, the public to connect to, right? Whether that's creating pride, um, reflection on service of others, uh, respect. Um, it's just something that's been a part of my life for so long now that it's just such a privilege to be able to do. And so that's that's really what serving the my country and serving the US through music for me personally means.

SPEAKER_04

So that's wonderful. Thanks so much, Cameron. And uh, Brian, how about you?

SPEAKER_02

A lot like what Cameron was saying, being able to not only bring the joy of music to the American public, but even like so being a trumpet player in the Command's home, I've been able to go to Arlington National Cemetery and play taps for fallen Marines well over a hundred times at this point, and that's retired Marines who may have been 70 to 80 years old, all the way down to a Marine in one of my first years that was only 19 years old. Just being able to do that for the families and for the community around that Marine, that's what really brings me joy and how I can share music to other people.

SPEAKER_04

How about you, sir?

SPEAKER_01

I'll add to that. Uh Cameron put that really, really well. Um when I auditioned uh and I got told that I, you know, they accepted me uh and I had a position. The one of the first things the recruiter told me uh we had like an interview, and he was like, I need you to want to be a Marine more than you want to be a musician. And um I had no idea what that meant uh at the time. And I really just you know tried to bowl over that and think about it. And um, you know, through my first couple of years here, it it became very apparent that at how important that was. Um it's not just that, you know, I'm playing music for a job, uh being in the military. Uh, just like Cameron said, it's it's there's so many important things that you're doing. Um and uh it's really hard to kind of see that when you're a young, early 20-year-old. Uh, but as I'm getting a couple more gray hairs here, it it's it's really kind of um driven home like how important it is what we're doing. Um yeah, that's all I have.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, I bet seeing Matt today makes you feel a little better about that.

SPEAKER_03

Hey man, ganging up on the old guy already. Jeez. Military musicians are often uh the public face of the armed forces. And this is something I'm I personally am always been very interested in. And um, you know, at you know, you you perform for celebrations, memorial ceremonies, and community events that bring people together. But you know, as America celebrates 250 years, what role do you think military music plays in preserving our traditions and connecting Americans to our history? Because there's such parallels with that um through all these 250 years. So what are your thoughts in regard to to music and connecting Americans to our history?

SPEAKER_06

So, you know, uh military involvement and music, um as long as those two things have been around, they're they're the same side of the same side of the same coin, right? Um music really carries that tradition in a way that people can immediately feel, right? They hear music and they instantly know what it's about, they can feel it in their soul. Um if it's a ceremony we do, if it's a parade out in town, like I know we do parades all the time in just uh uh areas of the country that there's just not a lot of you know, people. There's not a lot of public, but we still go out there and we do it just to kind of get our face out there and provide a service to the people. Um, if it's a memorial, if it's some kind of patriotic event, like Fourth of July we got coming up. I mean, all of us, I'm assuming, are probably gonna be involved in some way or fashion in some kind of July 4th concert or something like that. Um these events they feel different when live, right? When you have live music at these things and you have a band that is there, it just it feels different. Um it really allows people to uh connect to the history of the service, whether whatever service you're in, um, to the country and really to those who came before us as Marines, sailors, airmen, soldiers. It helps uh the public kind of connect to those who serve before us, right?

SPEAKER_05

Right.

SPEAKER_06

Um so when you have an anniversary, uh America's 250, this is huge. I mean, there's all kinds of events going on this year. Um, it kind of the military music aspect, it reminds people that service isn't just about what we do on the battlefield, if that makes sense. It's it's not always about going out and getting some, right? Where you deploying. I mean, and that's a big side of it, right? That's that's the first mission of our armed forces, but it reminds people that the service of what you're doing is not only that part, it's about community, it's about remembrance, which is huge, you know, honor to others, um, and really kind of uh representing something larger than yourself, right? And music and military music really it nails that stuff home, like, and that's why it's so important.

SPEAKER_03

Oh, I I agree with that a hundred percent. So, yeah, Seth, what do you think military music plays in our preserving our traditions?

SPEAKER_01

Uh I'll just say that you know, uh every year we'll kind of come out and and put out some different music for a concert just to like, you know, get the crowd going and whatever. Uh, but as far as like ceremonies go, those have not changed at all over the years. Like the from like the beginning of the ceremony to the end, like the music is the exact same as it was however many years ago. Um, I mean, you think about like taps, everybody knows what that is. Um, and the bugle players play it the exact same way that they would have done in 1775. I mean, that's just my thoughts on that.

SPEAKER_03

Absolutely. Bum, what what are your thoughts about traditions in the military?

SPEAKER_02

So something Seth, Roy, and I actually get to deep dive deeper into is drums and field musics. So drums and buglers used to be used on the battlefields in the 1700s to signal the troops. That's what we are still creating today in 2026 in the drum and bucle corps in the Commandant's home. Um so simple rudiments that Matt, you've been teaching for how many years now were used way back when. Right. And it's just bringing that tradition of music not only to signal people, but also using that music to uplift people and set like Seth was saying about taps to calm people at the end of someone's time here, and just being able to use that and continue to use music like that.

SPEAKER_03

Right. I I completely agree with all that. Freud, we're we're talking about obviously, you know, how how you think maybe military music uh plays in the role that it plays in preserving traditions, but especially connecting Americans to our history. What are your thoughts about that?

SPEAKER_00

Uh, one of my favorite things that we do is march on the troops every Tuesday and Friday when we do our performances. We play this music and they march on to it. It really reminds me of what um Brian was talking about in regards to the field music. Uh, because back then, obviously, the field musicians would play music and the um riflemen would get into formation and different calls meant different things. Uh, so I love that sort of um marching on the troops to music. Um, and as far as what it does for the American people, I love there's just something beautiful about playing, like turn like doing a company front and just playing America the beautiful. That just instills a lot of pride and patriotism into people. Um, and that's I just I love doing it.

SPEAKER_03

So absolutely. I love hearing it.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's like a lot of that music is is uh it's simple and like compared to like uh it's 2026, like what kind of music are we playing now? Um, and it's traditional. However, like you you get this certain sense of like uh when when you're playing it, you're the person performing it and you know connecting back to you know the the the nation's founding, it's like, man, I know that this piece is only five strokes, but I better play these perfectly. Right.

SPEAKER_03

Right. There's a certain level of responsibility there, not not to let that lie, not to let that fail.

SPEAKER_04

Now I can't tell you guys how many times, like after we've done a show on the field with Pride of the Mountains, and like the crowd is just like the the reception is so good, like the the cutoff was perfect, and you just get that feeling of like, God, this is exactly where I want to be. This is the best feeling ever in the world. And I just want to know if there has been any particular patriotic performances or ceremonies that you guys have participated in uh in your work that really made you stop and appreciate the significance of what you do.

SPEAKER_06

You know, it's so hard um to kind of pinpoint that that kind of answer, right? You know, I've I've now been in the Marine Corps over almost 16 years. It it's really hard for for me as um with that much time to kind of pinpoint a performance. I'd say it's kind of a combination of things. I remember when I first joined in 2010 and uh the first um 9-11 remembrance ceremony I did, I will never forget it. It was uh the opening of a new um kind of remembrance area in outside of Camp Lejeune. And um, and this was 2011. So this was the 10th year anniversary of 9-11. I just remember doing the ceremony and how impactful it was for the community and the the area that they had roped off and they created for this memorial. They had a big chunk of the World Trade Center, and it was just um very impactful, like just having music there. And I just remember thinking, wow, this is this is really important. Like, regardless of what I'm doing and being part of that ceremony, I'm there, you know, remembering those who came before us, those that passed away in uh during 9-11. And it was just such a meaningful experience for me. Um, and then the other end of that spectrum, you know, that's very solemn, that's a very solemn event, you know, right. But the other end of that spectrum is I've I've had the opportunity and the privilege of most of my career serving overseas. Like I I spent almost seven years in Japan, right? Um between there and then also some time in Europe. I I remember one of the best events I did was the uh horse guards parade in the UK for uh the Queen's birthday at the time. I'm not sure what they're doing now, but um, that was just such a huge event being able to go and perform with the Royal Marines and um put on these events around the UK in honor of you know the Queen's birthday and all the you know horse guards parade. That was such a big thing for me. And then also that third one, um my time over in Japan was just such a great time. Uh my wife and I love Japan. I would go back.

SPEAKER_04

Could I ask where in Japan you were at?

SPEAKER_06

Okinawa. Oh, that's so cool. It it's it's a little slice of heaven, like it's the greatest place on earth. Um but being over there, I had so many opportunities to do to do joint performances with the JSDF. That's the uh Japanese self-defense force bands. And they're just such a humble people, great musicians, and it was just so meaningful for me to be able to go and participate and uh uh interact with international partners on that level, right? When you're going and they do an event, uh tattoo, similar event in Tokyo called um the Buddha Khan, and it's a huge thing. You're paying, you're playing in like the Emperor's Palace, it's this huge military tattoo, and they they invite all these different bands in, and you're playing for uh hundreds of thousands of people throughout the week, and it's just so meaningful to be able to connect um with people outside of the US.

SPEAKER_04

So that's so cool. I almost minored in Japan or in Japanese while I was here at Western. So I'm like so fascinated by like Japan's like marching stuff. Oh my gosh, it's so cool. We could do a whole episode just on that, but that's for another day.

SPEAKER_03

Seth, what are your thoughts about that, man?

SPEAKER_01

Uh wow. I mean, Cameron said it quite well. Uh I would say meaningful performances. Um you literally like you brought one right back to my brain of we performed at the 9-11 memorial. That was super somber. Um that was uh yeah, in New York City. Um uh I will say that uh my original answer to this question was uh going to the international tattoos. Um I've been to the Norwegian military tattoo, uh, and I've we did recently just this past um February, we were in Australia and New Zealand for the Royal Edinburgh Military Tattoo, which was doing a tour down there. And um just when you're performing for these international audiences as the United States representative, um, it's it just feels different. It's like you're like an Olympian or something. You're like, oh man, I gotta represent the United States of America right now. Like I am the American here representing America. And it's it's a different feeling. Uh uh, it's like a different responsibility. I mean, it it in some ways you should always feel like like that, but it it really gets highlighted when you're when you're like abroad.

SPEAKER_03

Um, it's heavy, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

That's definitely it hits heavier for sure.

SPEAKER_03

Bum bum, what's an experience you've had?

SPEAKER_02

Like the other two have said, it's it's really hard to pinpoint that one performance over a decade of service at this point.

SPEAKER_01

It's a lot of shows.

SPEAKER_02

Right. We're doing uh what 120 to 150 performances a year, wow, at least. Wow. And like Seth was saying though, the Edinburgh Royal Military Tattoo in Australia and New Zealand, that was interesting not only because of the place we were, but the interactions we had with the other countries and how much they enjoyed what we were bringing to the table at this big event because it was so much different than any other country that showed up.

SPEAKER_03

Right, right. Freud is one you know the one that stands out to you.

SPEAKER_00

Uh, you know, they took the words out of my mouth with the whole tattoo because that was mine. Royal, the Royal Edinburgh military tattoo. That I'm even wearing the shirt. Um But I think what the reason that it stood out to me, the whole experience, was um the connections and the networking that you make with musicians from different countries, um, and just solidifying those ties with our allies, I think is something uniquely special to um these military tattoos. Um getting like connecting with people from Japan, Norway, um, Tonga, like all these different countries. It's it's amazing. And uh it stood out to me. I loved it.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it makes me re think about the old saying, you know, the music is uh the ultimate language. Because it it's the language that speaks to the entire world. You know, we all speak it. So I think that's that's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_01

I would say just to add to that, sorry. Sorry if I interrupt you. Okay, go ahead. Um it it is truly amazing when you travel internationally. It just seems like um other countries, uh they just like really appreciate music uh and our form of music like a lot more than the average American does. Um they were they were incredibly thankful and they were super into what we were doing. It was it was really cool. That is cool.

SPEAKER_06

I love that how we sorry, go around. Sorry, no, I was gonna say to kind of add to that, um and might this might be a question for for later, but like um talking about how appreciative other countries are of music and having that ability to cross network and and work with our allied partners, not even allied partners, but even like just other countries in general, the militaries, their public. It's really one of those things where military bands can be that soft power, if that makes any sense. Nice to get into other countries that the US might not have the best relationship with.

SPEAKER_03

Interesting.

SPEAKER_06

Not to get into like the politics of stuff, right?

SPEAKER_03

Sure.

SPEAKER_06

But my time in Japan really taught me a lot about how meaningful music can be to other countries and to getting your foot in the door to other things. Sure. Right, whether that's the Philippines, whether that's Nepal, just any of these countries that typically the US wouldn't have kind of a footprint in. Um, it's really one of those things where we can really kind of push music and really kind of show other countries what the US is about, what we offer. And um, it's really one of it's a soft power, right? It's it's super important to be able to have that ability. And so um it's just it's such a amazing thing to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_03

That's a really cool perspective. I've not ever thought of it like that. I have thought about the common language thing, but I haven't thought of it like that.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, music being a universal language.

SPEAKER_02

Matt, one thing you were saying, that common language that music can be no matter what you're actually speaking, it it ties back into what Cameron was saying with the international relationships or the soft connections between countries. And that's really what we're doing, even here in the small community, if we're performing at a small event somewhere. You're just making that connection from one thing to another through a common language.

SPEAKER_06

Yeah. And it's it is so much tolerable to other countries to say when you arrive in country and you you pull out a French horn, you pull out a clarinet, you play music, and you play a universal language that they understand, versus you show up for a parade with guys with you know military weaponry and stuff like that. It it is such an important thing to be able to have that kind of soft power to show our allies and our partners and our other countries just who we are. It's so important. I love that.

SPEAKER_04

I love that too. All right. Well, the history nerd here got to talk a little bit about the journey and what brought you guys to the work that you do. Uh, whether this started while you were in Cullowie or before or after. I just want to know what first sparked your interest in pursuing a military music career, and when did you realize that that was a possibility for you?

SPEAKER_06

All right, so I had no interest. Straight up, like legit, I had no interest. Matt to tell you, I my college career when I first got there was probably um less than great. It was not the greatest. I was a decent horn player, but as a college student, nah, it was not that great. Um, so for me, I think I was doing my junior qualifying recital and a recruiter and what's referred to as an MTA. They're the ones that audition people for the Marine Corps bandfield. They just happened to be there. And um, I learned later, I think it was Travis, it was Dr. Bennett. Like, I guess I guess the recruiter had come through and was asking about who who would be good fits for this or something like that. And apparently he said, Hey, I got Cameron, he might be interested, you know, whatever. They showed up, they're like, Hey, I didn't even really audition. My audition was my junior qualifying recital. They were just like, Hey, do you want to do this to be part of the Marine Corps band? And I'm like, Well, I never really thought about that. Uh, that wasn't in my uh horoscope, right? I wasn't thinking about doing that kind of stuff. Um, I was like, well, give me give me like a week and I'll get back to you. And I think I went back that night um and talked to my girlfriend, now wife at the time, Rachel, and I'm like, hey, this opportunity come up. And I'm like, what do you think about this? And she's like, well, uh, she's like, I mean, it's an opportunity, you know. Um you know, it's really up to you. And so I right there, I I think I thought about it a little more, and I'm like, well, college isn't really working for me. I might as well try try something new and adventurous, and so that's what I did. Um, yeah, and then over time, I at first it was one of those things where I'm like, I'm just gonna do my four years and jump ship and be done, done with this. It's just it's just an opportunity for me to do something. But I think over time I just realized uh how much there was being offered to me in in in terms of like opportunities, right?

SPEAKER_05

Sure.

SPEAKER_06

And so I I just turned it into something and made it my own and just stayed. Like they were like, hey, you want to stay in? Sure. Every every four, every three, four years, they were like, hey, you want to stay in? Sure. I'll keep going until I can find something new.

SPEAKER_03

There you go. Froy, what about you? What got you going?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so I started off my freshman year at Western Carolina as a euphonium performance major. And I was like, All right, I know I can really only join the military bands as a euphonium player. I wanna, I wanted, I want to shoot, shoot high. I wanted to go for the president zone. I was like, I think I can do it. Well, a year into that major, I was like, that's gonna be really hard. It's so competitive. I'm not gonna, I was like, I did a lot of self-doubt. And then I switched over to commercial electronic music, uh, then music education, and then I landed on general music. Uh during that fifth year that I was at Western, that's when I found out about the fleet bands and the coming on zone through Estes, uh Seth. And I auditioned for both the fleet bands and the common on zone. I got accepted into both, and I was like, wow, maybe I maybe this is something that I could do. It might not be the president's own, but the common on zone is right next to them, the president's on, I mean. And so I was like, this is sweet. Uh so one, but it was contingent on whether or not there was gonna be boat space for me to actually join the commandant zone. So um I didn't think I was gonna join until a month before I shipped out to boot camp. I get a call from Master Gunnery Sergeant Rulepal, who was then our recruiter, and he says, Hey, we have a spot available for you. Do you wanna do you wanna join? And I was like, I thought I already signed the other contract. I should, I thought I was going to be in the fleet bands, and you're telling me now that I could be in the commandant zone. And that's when I was like, sweet, I guess I'm I'm going off to Paris Island and then to Washington, DC. And here I am.

SPEAKER_03

That's wild. That's wild.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Hey Bum, what sparked your interest? What got you going?

SPEAKER_02

So I actually saw the Commandant Zone at DCI Finals in 2014. Um, and I believe it's the same time Seth really started looking into it, if I'm not mistaken. But it just took me a few more years. I I just couldn't get away from Cullowie. Um, but after after that DCI finals, I really started looking into it. I contacted Master Gunnery Sergeant Rule Paul and asked him about the process of getting to the unit and all that. And two years later, I auditioned. I actually didn't make it the first time, so I had to audition a second time and ended up making it and shipping to boot camp four four months later.

SPEAKER_03

Wow. Cool. Seth, tell everybody how you got started with this thing.

SPEAKER_01

Yep, yep. Same sort of story. Uh I was at DCI uh and same guy, master gunner, Sergeant Rulepa. He got all of us. Uh yeah, right? He hooked you up. Uh yeah, I was a music ed major uh at Western and I was approaching my fifth year, as a lot of uh music ed majors do, a little extra lap, uh victory lap, as I like to call it.

SPEAKER_04

No shame in the no shame.

SPEAKER_01

And uh I I mean, I was I'm right there at my fifth year in college, and I was like, man, I don't really know if I want to be a band director, but at this point, I just have to get a degree. And you know, maybe I'll master, I'll gotta I'm gonna get a master's degree in something else or a doctorate or something else, but I I really don't know about the band directing thing, but I'm committed at this point.

SPEAKER_03

Um it's a tough gig, I'll just take that right. It's a tough gig.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah, no, I I realize that. Um and right about the time I was having those feelings that that recruiter uh came into my life. Uh and lo and behold, I auditioned and here I am. And just like Cameron said, they they uh they keep saying, Hey, you want to do another four? I'm like, yeah, let's do it. Hey, let's do it.

SPEAKER_03

Let's keep playing diddles. Uh well, you know, the Proud of the Mountains has always been more than just about performing music. I think that anybody that's been a part of the program or part of any band, really, they they realize that that's a very, very important thing. Um, but that, you know, but what are some things you learned while marching in the Pride of the Mountains that have served you well in the military? You know, what are some things that that you learned while being here that you think you had directly correlate um with your time there?

SPEAKER_06

It's amazing um how similar uh like how similar I would say the Pride of the Mountains marching band and just music in general and and having some of the the fundamentals that go along with it correlate so well with being a service member. Um individual accountability, I would say, is a huge one. Uh being able to take account of yourself and um uh discipline, teamwork, all those things that we really learned being part of the pride of the mountains, it just correlated so well with being a service member and specifically being a Marine musician. Um, knowing how to work under pressure was a huge one, I think. Um, I don't know how many times when when I was at Western and being in the marching band, Matt, you and Bob would just push the hell out of us on the field.

SPEAKER_05

I don't know what you're talking about.

SPEAKER_06

I don't know how many times like we'd come back back from a rehearsal and it was just like, God, I'm exhausted. And it wasn't even just like physical exhaustion, it was like mental exhaustion. Um and just being able to perform under pressure, those are those are some of the biggest things I learned that have really helped me as a marine musician.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

What about you, Seth? What are some things you think transfer?

SPEAKER_01

I would say Cameron put it really well, like the accountability piece. Uh Matt, uh when I was when I was uh be gentle, be gentle.

SPEAKER_03

This is a PG 13 show.

SPEAKER_01

Uh there was a morning where you know, maybe it was me uh that was super late to a rehearsal. And uh you made the drum line, played eight on a hand until I got there. That is the most marine core thing. I should have been a marine, I guess. It really is. That is the most marine core thing you could have ever done. No, but seriously, like just the like the team effort of everything, it's like we are in this together. We are only as strong as our weakest link. Um, all of that, it it it everything that you're learning in marching band, like even as simple as like, all right, we're gonna march eight to five in a line together, and oh one person was late, or you know, get back, redo it. Like, that is that sort of mentality uh of like it's not the the I but the we um that is huge for uh like a military mindset. Yeah. Oh, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_03

Freud, what are some things you you took away?

SPEAKER_00

For me, it was the the attention to the smallest minute little details uh in pretty much anything that you do with like such as setting up the arc, laying down your instruments in a certain way, that it's obviously in an orderly fashion, doing all these sort of things that instill discipline and uh it helps a lot going into the military and just knowing already how to pay attention to the small details that most people just don't think about. Um, and as Marines, obviously, we tend to always seek perfection. So it was something very easy to get accustomed to.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, details matter, you know, that that mindset for sure. Bum, what about you, buddy?

SPEAKER_02

Well, first thing I want to say, Seth, it was probably you and Dell that were late. So it wasn't only your fault. Um that's fair. But I I would say honestly, work ethic and being able to prioritize what you're doing in the moment. You may have a lot of other things going on around you and outside of say marching band rehearsal, but being able to be there and be present and be attentive to what's actually going on.

SPEAKER_03

Love that. Yeah, it it is crazy, but you know, the teamwork, the the leadership stuff that our students go through and don't even realize that they're doing at the time. It's been fun, it's fun to watch. It definitely is.

SPEAKER_04

Not only is it fun for the students, but the instructors too to see all that happen. Uh I am curious uh if there was a particular instructor, staff member uh during your experience at Pride of the Mountains that helped you pursue where you are today and don't feel like you have to say Matt just because he's here.

SPEAKER_03

I prefer you didn't.

SPEAKER_06

You know my wife Rachel being a staff coordinator, she held me to account. Right. Yeah, she's she's a rock star, by the way. She is, and she's great. Um she really helped shape me into how who I am now, right? Not only that, but like I know I said earlier, but not to stroke your ego, but Matt and Bob, I mean, you guys just had this expectation of um showing up prepared and working hard and um putting the best product we could on the field, right? And um that's a lot of those things I took with me into the Marine Corps, and it's just it's helped me a lot.

SPEAKER_03

So sure, absolutely. Any any experiences or people that meant I don't know that were uh big for you other guys while you were here?

SPEAKER_01

I would just say that you know, the the people that are surrounded, you you surround yourself with in Kullway as far as like a drumline member. I mean, I was surrounded by people that were so much more talented than I was. And it was like a constant pressure to just like, man, I gotta I gotta practice. I gotta get I gotta get better, I gotta get better at this so that I can I can at least hang with this guy. Um and then of course, um, you know, Matt, Bob, David, all these band directors, um, just holding the standard, like, you know, every single time. It was like, yeah, that's not good enough. And uh I have I've taken that with me until this day. I mean, like, I I still like look in the mirror and I'm like, oh, that that could have been better.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. That that that honesty in the mirror thing is a big deal. And I I really do, just to segue out of what you were just saying, I I think that uh positive peer leadership is a big, big, big deal here. People don't even realize. I think that the section leaders and even just internal members teach our own students more than I do. I mean, it's amazing to me what goes on. The the crazy drum wall out there, for example, in Drumline Land that still exists and they're still out there. I'll guarantee they're probably out there right now as we speak. Uh it's yeah, it's fantastic. It's a it's a crazy cool culture where we kind of push each other. Um but yeah, is there anything else you guys want to talk about in regard to things or people or experiences that that uh impacted you?

SPEAKER_00

You guys probably know him. Matt, I'm pretty sure you remember him, Jamie McDonald. Oh, yeah, who's a visual coordinator in 2013? I came in from a small town, 60-member marching band to now a 400-member uh marching band. And I was really encouraged by him because he just saw something special in me. And I it made me want to just keep marching and keep at it, uh, and then encouraged me to eventually and march DCI, and then we both marched together. And when I was in DCI, that's where I sort of refined a lot of uh the discipline and stuff like that that I've carried into uh military.

SPEAKER_03

So that's very cool. Yeah, we always have we have those people in our lives, you know. Not necessarily always teachers, but they're teaching us in other ways. Bum, what do you think?

SPEAKER_02

Like Seth was saying, Matt, you kept all of us accountable for anything we did while we were there. And we obviously, the four of us, appreciate that.

SPEAKER_03

Well, I appreciate you guys saying that.

SPEAKER_02

Of course. Someone that hasn't been talked about yet, but Victor Sines actually put me on the right path. It's really funny, probably to you, Cameron.

SPEAKER_06

But I've got too many stories about Victor.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, I do too, but he he really put me on the right path to where I needed to go my freshman year, and it set me up.

SPEAKER_03

That that that's very cool. I I hear all the time, seriously. And and it's also neat to watch after the friendships that are made in the Pride of the Mountains and and watching these friendships go on. I mean, look at you guys, you know, here we are 10, 15 years later or whatever. It's it's amazing uh to watch all of that. Um so one of the things that makes me most proud as a director, um, if I'm being honest, is seeing where our students end up. Um we talk a lot about developing musicians, but mo mo more importantly, we're developing leaders and teammates and people who will serve others, which is what we've been talking about right now. And as we celebrate America's 250th birthday uh today, it's especially meaningful to hear how lessons learned here in Kelloway have carried forward into service to our nation. So I really feel like that um um I think as many people continue to understand the military's role in national defense, but may not fully understand the role of military musicians. So, you know, why do you really think that music is important in the military? I mean, I think some people actually do question that, you know? Why do you think it's important?

SPEAKER_06

Uh it's funny you say people question it.

SPEAKER_03

I do.

SPEAKER_06

Uh so many people question it. From the public to, you know, people in higher office. It's amazing how often um you kind of see military bands on the chopping block when it comes to you know, the next FY, the next fiscal year's budget. Um, however, there is it's such an important aspect of the military. I mean, like I said earlier, it's like they are two sides of the same coin. As long as we've had a military, there's been music, right? Right. Um it's important because it gives so much emotional weight to military tradition. That's kind of the best way I can kind of put it. Um, whether that's supporting morale, supporting patriotism in the public, um, and connecting the military like earlier we were talking about connecting the military to the public. That absolutely music is that's the thing that really kind of connects.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, and the word and the word morale comes up all the time with with music. It it is a big deal. And and uh absolutely bum, what do you what do you think about that?

SPEAKER_02

So Seth Roy and I have an interesting um experience on that aspect of this, being that we're right here in DC and get to perform every single Friday for This random congressman, this dignitary from a different country, oh hey, the president's here this week. And just just being able to show what they're doing or what we're doing in the military to promote music.

unknown

Right.

SPEAKER_02

But really we're promoting the military, not the music. We're just using music as the um transport over that bridge.

SPEAKER_03

It's the vehicle. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Correct. And another another thing that all four of us can probably agree on, music in the military is also a recruiting tool. Every single um commercial you see for every single branch of service has music to it. And it's typically a military band playing the music.

SPEAKER_03

Agreed. I agree with all that stuff. We could go on and on and on about that. But um let's shift gears here a little bit. Um let's have a little fun with this one. Um all right, Seth, what is your favorite Pride of the Mountains memory?

SPEAKER_01

Uh I actually thought really hard about this. Um and uh it's not like a single show or you know, a trip that we did or any performance. My favorite memories of Pride of the Mountains is just being on the UC lawn with just the bass drums and just grinding. Like it'd be like it could literally just be me and Taylor Barnes right next to the clock tower, like just chopping out for hours. Um, probably annoying everybody in the process.

SPEAKER_03

Definitely.

SPEAKER_01

But uh just yeah, just those moments where it's like, man, it's kind of late and we're still drumming out here. It's maybe like nine o'clock. We should, I guess we should stop. Um those are those are my my favorite moments.

SPEAKER_03

That that's awesome. Hey Frey what's what would you say is your favorite part of the mountains memory?

SPEAKER_00

It's honestly always been the friendships and camaraderie with the baritone section. We do, I don't know if they still do it. I would be happy to find out if they did, but we would always sing, I forget what it's called, this Aerosmith song, while we were changing into uniform. And I just remember always singing loudly to that belligerently even um in Culture Building. And I and that's just one of those things that stuck to me. Um, it's just being there with my friends and just enjoying their their friendship.

SPEAKER_04

Right. I love that.

SPEAKER_03

Very cool. Um, what what's uh what's your favorite part of the mountains memory?

SPEAKER_02

So it's not just one, it was every single time we actually marched down to the stadium for a game, right? And it's not because of being in the block marching down there, it was seeing the excitement on everybody else's face outside of the band.

SPEAKER_03

That's cool. That's very cool. Cameron, what do you have one?

SPEAKER_06

For me, it was so long ago, right? That was 16 years ago for me. Um I would say it's not necessarily the memories of like the performances, right? It's not the memories, it's the friendships that I made that I still have today. I mean, even 16 years later, I have friends that marched in the band that Rachel and I will go and spend a week with. We'll go to the beach, rent a get a house, and go and spend time together. I mean, these are lifelong friendships that I made at Western that I still have today. I met I met my wife at Western. Right. Like for me, that's what's really important. And those are the memories that I I keep today is um just the friendships.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, I I you know, I talk about that with a band sometimes. And you know, when they're in it and they're in the trenches, they can't really see that clearly yet. Um but I I tell them, and I've from I've lived it, and you've lived it, and you would agree with me probably. And that is that those performances are awesome, but they're really just icing on a big huge cake that you're current constantly working on. They're just moments along the path. You know, the journey is the joy. Um yes, the daily grind, we do that 95 percent of the time to get to do the five percent of performances. So, yeah, of course those performances are great and they're adrenaline rush and and they're traveling and and big moments and stuff. But yeah, it's the people in the trenches that you're with, the your friends beside you that you're doing it with that that that um that can see the value and and you bond with through this uh incredible vehicle known as music. And the patentry arts uh I say it all the time too, and that is it's it's an amazing art form because you have 450 people or whatever um out there, and everybody has a different job. All 450 people have a different job, and that's something I think a lot of the public can't really wrap their mind around. Everybody has a different part musically, they have a different dot to march in the show, different choreography, different whatever. And and yet it all comes together to make this beautiful piece of art together, and it takes ever takes every person doing their their thing, you know. So you have to count on your friends, and those can't friends count on you. And um, it's a beautiful thing. It really is. I I agree with you. I think it's the people that that's what the memories are.

SPEAKER_06

And and getting into like um how how much it affects uh just like the individual efforts that the the students have at the marching band and how much that kind of correlates to like the military, right? You don't realize how much your individual efforts affect the organization as a whole. And um I think back at my time at Western and I'm like, man, I I didn't think I did much. Like I thought I was just a mellowphone player, and that's that's all I did, you know. But then I think back and I'm like, yeah, maybe I did do something, right? And it led me to where I am now. Oh, absolutely. And um, that's something that I think students really need to kind of focus in on is the the little things that they do, it all matters, regardless of what it is. You know, it it affects the entire organization for good or for bad. You know, so thousand percent. Um yeah, thousand percent.

SPEAKER_05

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_04

Well, I uh bouncing off of that, I would love to know if there are any traditions, whether they're uh you know, section in section traditions or things that you did with the full band that you guys miss the most. Seth, what do you what you got?

SPEAKER_01

Ooh Um give me a second here. What do I miss the most?

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, there's a lot of crazy traditions in the in the in any band, really. Or or drum cores or whatever. I mean, it there's some crazy ones, some that you can speak about in public and some that you can't. But uh but uh they're always fun. And yeah, there they're we have a ton of uh full band traditions and definitely a lot of section ones. I we were just curious what you what you might remember.

SPEAKER_01

Uh I don't know if the band still does it, but uh the Halloween party.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Uh oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that's good. That's actually coming back this year.

SPEAKER_04

We oh wait, better.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it's coming back this year. We had we had uh we kind of went through some COVID stuff, but that's coming back this year.

SPEAKER_01

The the bass line always went uh together as something. Uh and I'll just leave it at that.

SPEAKER_03

Thank you. What do you think, Frey? You got a tradition that you remember?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, honestly, the most the one that's most heartfelt is singing the alma mater together. Yeah that that's that's always the best.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, that's still a huge thing here.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think the most fun one, and it's yeah, and I think the most fun one for me would have to be right at before every performance, whenever it says, Hey man, what time is it? Yeah, and everybody screams that that's that was my favorite because I love screaming it. Right.

SPEAKER_03

Well, they do too, trust me. They will rattle your eardrums out there. They they love that. You you got one, Brian?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, so I I would have to agree with Freud, the alma mater, because it not only includes the current students, but it also includes all the alumni that may be at the game or at whatever performance. So it really just brings back into the focus the entire family or the long purple line.

unknown

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01

You're a drummer, we didn't expect much.

SPEAKER_03

No, yeah, that that the alma mater is a very, very big deal, and um it's still very, very strong. And I agree with you. It's really cool at every every performance, really, not just games, where we'll always sing it at the end, and always there are people coming out of the stands to join us and join the current membership.

SPEAKER_04

And when we do that at homecoming, that's always the best of the whole season because of all the alumni that join us on the field.

SPEAKER_03

It's it's pretty amazing. Um, but you know, as we were as we were kind of reflecting on all that, you know, looking back now, I mean, not not the band per se, but like what does Western Carolina University mean to you? How does it make you feel when you think back to your time? How did your experience at WCU shape who you are today, both professionally and personally, do you think?

SPEAKER_06

For me personally, it would be growth. I feel like I grew a lot between the time I arrived at Western and the time that I left and joined the Marine Corps. Um for me personally, I just had I had to grow up a lot, right? Before I I joined. Right. Um, whether that's as a person, as a musician, um, both. I mean, that's for me, that's what it means for me. I just think back on the growth that I made over that time and how much it meant to me.

SPEAKER_03

I I I think that's exactly what colleges and universities do. They're kind of this gateway to adulthood, in my opinion. You're kind of coming out of high school, you haven't really figured things out yet. You there's a lot of growth that happens to try to prepare you for what's really going on out there. Do you do what do you what does Western Carolina University mean to you, Frey? When do you think about it?

SPEAKER_00

Oh man, it means it means so much to me. I that's you it's where I made a lot of my friendships, long-standing friendships. It's where I grew like in terms of my personal life. I made so many mistakes and I learned from them. Um and then professionally, I became such a good player. And I mean, well, at least good enough to join one one of the um bands up here in DC. Yeah, you're you're all right. And um yeah, it just means the world to me. I'm glad that I went that I chose Western Carolina. I'm glad that I was a part of the Pride of Mountains.

SPEAKER_03

That's awesome, Brian?

SPEAKER_02

So to go along with Cameron and Freud's growth, right? Um, I actually showed up at Western when I was 17 years old. So I couldn't even go to the gym without having a waiver from my parents. Um but just actually figuring out how to do things on my own because I had to. But also, like Freud was saying, building those friendships and being able to lean on everybody else in the band if if I needed to to get me through whatever.

SPEAKER_03

Right, right. And Seth, what does West Carolina University mean to you?

SPEAKER_01

Uh growth is such a good word. Uh attending Western Carolina, that was the first time that I experienced the uh the old uh adage of uh big fish, small pond, and then and then now you go to this ocean and you're the little fish, and that that I mean as a young adult, um just like it it was so humbling my freshman year, like coming in and like every player was better than me. I mean, truly, uh, and I I hadn't experienced that um as a young adult yet. Uh all the friendships that I made, and uh Callowe's just such a special place. Uh, I live right outside of Washington, DC now, and I am constantly like, wow, I really wish I was back in the mountains in Cullowae right now.

SPEAKER_04

Bro needs a dose of the wee.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I need that so much. So much so that I was actually there like two months ago. Uh I just had to get in the mountains, do some hiking and a little bit of fishing, um, all stuff that I never got to do as a music major because I was way too busy in the practice room. Right. But uh yeah, uh, it's just such a special place. Um, Western Carolina is just, you know, I work with most of the people that I work with, uh, went to college of some sort, and they're like, Yeah, I went to LSU, uh, I went to Florida State, and um it's just not the same thing. Uh, because Western Carolina is just this remote college, and it's like all you have is little silva and and western, and that's it, and you're just there in the mountains. Um, and I I just truly think that uh our college experience uh was just different in such a special way.

SPEAKER_03

I agree. I think it's it's um an amazing, almost a little mini laboratory uh where you kind of get to come and just focus on the thing and the people around you and just do the thing without a lot of distractions. I think it's pretty, pretty amazing.

SPEAKER_04

All right. Well, before we wrap things up, uh I would love to give the opportunity uh for each of you to speak directly to our current members. Uh what advice would you give today uh to uh current and incoming Pride of the Mountain students as they prepare for their future careers, whether they're in music, military, education, business, healthcare, engineering, art, anything? Um if there's any words of advice or encouragement or whatever you feel they might need to hear right now, what do you think, Cam?

SPEAKER_06

So so I when you guys sent the questions, I thought about this quite a lot, right? Um and there's such a huge correlation, I think, between young Marines and s and college students. They're about the same age. They go through the same kind of things in their careers and their lives. And I'm thinking, like, what do I tell my young Marines when they check in and they want to pursue this as a career? You know, what what are some things that I can tell them to kind of motivate them and keep them going forward? And like I I think back on my own career a lot, and I'm like, I I tell the Marines just not to let fear get in the way of opportunity. Like there'll be auditions, there'll be things you do that will intimidate you, there'll be leadership positions that you don't think you're ready for, there'll be all these things that you don't think you're ready for. Um there'll be things that you think are beyond your ability and uh experiences that push you outside of your comfort zone. Um a lot of times if you you let fear get in the way of some of that stuff and tell you that you're not good enough, you know, not prepared enough, not talented enough, um, those are some things to not listen to, right? Um I think all of us, when we were in the the marching band there at Western, we all kind of know that growth um it happens when you step into the practice room. It happens when you stepped out on out out on the field and you're out there on the football field. Um those of us that were music majors, it happens when you step out on stage and you're nervous prior and you're slamming bananas to get some potassium to kind of calm down some, right? Right. Um and you do all these things despite being nervous. Um, however, confidence it it doesn't come before opportunity, it becomes because of it. You get you get confidence because you're taking the opportunity to actually kind of do these things.

SPEAKER_03

Um growth happens uh when you're uncomfortable. Yeah, that's usually what happens.

SPEAKER_06

Some of those most uh meaningful moments in your life, whether that's music, career, whatever, um, they all kind of begin with that uncertainty, right? Uh the friendships you make, the performances, whether that's Western, if you go on, those performances that you never forget, um, those accomplishments that you feel proud of, all those kind of things. Uh it's because you made the decision to take those opportunities, even if even though you're afraid to fail, right? Um, so the best advice I can give is just, you know, just not let fear get in the way of some of those opportunities. Take the audition, apply for those leadership roles within the band. Um do the thing. Just travel, say yes to opportunities, regardless if you think you're ready. Um because I I feel like, you know, years from now, like whether or not whatever you're doing, you kind of you rarely regret the chances you took, but you always regret the chances and the opportunities you let go by.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, agree.

SPEAKER_06

That's what I always tell young Marines is like, if regardless of what it is, it could be, hey, I've got an opportunity to go on a deployment. Take it. Is it dangerous? Yeah, potentially. But will you come back better? Yeah. I mean, just take opportunities. Don't let fear of the unknown get in the way of you know, growing.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. Frey, what would you want to say to our current membership?

SPEAKER_00

Um, I guess a little bit more simpler for me. It's just focus, focus, focus on your studies, and just make sure that you're putting in the time and effort to to be a good student, be a good uh in in whatever, not just music, but if you're doing uh engineering, oh I don't think we have engineering. I don't know. Um, yeah, we do healthcare, any anything, anything that is just set your mind to it, see it through to the end, and and um as Cameron was saying about fear, it's okay to make mistakes. This, if anything, this is the opportunity to make them so that you know once you go out in the real world, you're success successful.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um so that's my advice.

SPEAKER_03

I love that. You know, and I think a lot of people out there they don't they don't really realize that uh seven uh this coming year, uh it's kind of been about the same um percentage for several years now, but 76% of this year's marching band are non-music majors. They're just 76% so that's and that's by the way, that's normal. So like it's it's amazing. These are just great people, great band people, students that are everything from accounting to zoology. I always like to say it's it's just wild. Um, but yeah, so obviously there's something to be had here. What do you what do you think, Brian? What do you want to say to our current membership?

SPEAKER_02

The one thing I would actually want to say to them is soak up every moment you can in the band. One thing that the four of us get to look forward to is we have an end of a career that's most of the time shorter than most jobs, right? 20 years or 22 for the two gunnies in here. Um it's gonna end at some point. And it's just like college marching bands. You may get one year, you may get five years like I did, but if you soak up every single moment of it, and you'll you'll be able to reflect and look back on your time at Western and actually have those good friendships and remember the good times, but also remember the bad. And it's good to remember both of those things.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah, that's that's a really good point. Any words of of advice you'd like to give, Seth?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, uh, Cameron put it quite well. Um what doesn't challenge you will not change you. Um and I just try to you know do things that that make you feel uncomfortable. Um I still do that. Uh I mean if I hadn't embraced that sort of uh mantra early on, I wouldn't be here um doing what I'm doing now. Uh and like I said, even even today, it's like I'm becoming an old man slowly. Uh and my speaking my chop, my chops are dwindling. Uh but I still play things that I'm not good at when I'm on a pad or by myself. I I I really try to like lean into those things that aren't fun for me, uh, but I know will make me better. Right.

SPEAKER_03

Um I love that. Those are all great points. And and um, yeah, I really do think the the university experiencing, you know, it's about growth, like we've talked about numerous times now. But yeah, that growth doesn't happen unless you're a little uncomfortable, you know? And sometimes you won't fully believe in yourself until you actually have the guts to jump in there and and do it, whatever it is. So I think that's all fantastic. But you know, as we celebrate 250 years of America, uh, I'm reminded that every generation is called to contribute something larger than itself. For our guests today, that contribution has come through service, leadership, and music. The Pride of the Mountains has always been uh about more than halftime performances. It's about building people who go out into the world and make a difference. Today we've heard from four alumni who have done exactly that. Through their talent, professionalism, and commitment to service, they represent the very best of the Long Purple Line. Um on behalf of everyone associated with Western Carolina University and the Pride of the Mountains, thank you for representing our university, our band, and our country with such distinction. We are just so incredibly proud proud of you, and thank you so much for sharing your time uh with us today. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_04

And I also want to thank you guys so much, the four of y'all, for joining us today. Uh Cam, Seth, Froy, and Baum, thank you so much for your service to our country, and thank you so much for hopping on today to tell your story. We are absolutely honored to have you with us, and we are so proud to call you guys members of the Long Purple Line.

SPEAKER_03

And thank you for tuning in to this episode of the Showtime Podcast. A special thank you to our technical director, Sam Wallace, and to everyone who supports the Proud of the Mountains marching band. Shout out to our friends on the Western Wednesdays podcast for helping keep our alumni connected and engaged. Long Purple Line, we can't wait to see you back in Culloway. Current members, we're ready to rock and roll. We'll see you at Bandcamp for sure, ready to get on that field. And to all those serving our nation today, thank you so much. Happy Independence Day and happy 250th birthday, America. And of course,