Lessons from Hamilton for the Ortho PA

In this special episode, we're taking a trip to the room where it happens and exploring what one Broadway phenomenon can teach us about life in medicine. From My Shot and early-career ambition to Wait For It and learning that not every opportunity needs to be chased, we break down the themes from Hamilton that hit a little differently when you're an orthopedic PA.

We talk about burnout and the temptation to be Non-Stop, the importance of finding your role as someone's Right Hand Man (or Woman), and what it means to build a career—and a life—that you're actually proud of.

Whether you're a Hamilton superfan or have never seen the show, this episode is about ambition, patience, purpose, and remembering that your story doesn't have to look like anyone else's.

Because in medicine, as in life, sometimes the biggest lessons come from learning when to take your shot—and when to wait for it.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Joint Effort PAs, where two orthopedic surgery PAs get real about life in medicine. From tips and tricks to professional growth, work-life balance, and everything in between. We're here to share what we've learned and what we're still figuring out. Let's get into it. Um, okay, I feel like we are leveling up in work and in life or in our work-life balance because we have been doing things outside of work that are fun things. Yes. And I then in usual fashion relate those things back to my work life. Um, but yeah, we've uh I've gone to a lot of concerts recently. You're going to a concert today. Who are you seeing?

SPEAKER_02 0:46

Megan Moroney. Megan Moroni. It's my 11 almost 12-year-old who is in heaven right now. Or will be in a few hours.

SPEAKER_00 0:53

Yeah. I saw Pitbull a couple weeks ago. I'm seeing Kesha this week. Yeah. Just like all of the things for work-life balance.

SPEAKER_02 0:59

Yeah, we're doing Morgan Wallen in two weeks.

SPEAKER_00 1:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02

And then Noah Khan a little bit after that.

SPEAKER_00 1:04

Noah Khan.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

I've been decided if I'm gonna give my ticket to my daughter's friend or not. What's the alternative? Two tickets. You go with her. She definitely wants to go with her friend. This was definitely for her. When I saw how much the tickets were, I was like, ooh, we'll just get two instead of three. Yeah. Um her um graduation party. I mean, this would be a nice graduation gift for her friend. So that's kind of what I was thinking. Um I love that. I and I also don't think my daughter will be like, oh my god, you're not going. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:32

She'll be like, okay, cool, fine. Yeah. But you gotta want to go. I would want to go anyway.

SPEAKER_02 1:36

But yeah, no, we are um I I mean some would say burning the candle at both ends. I would say just thriving.

SPEAKER_00 1:43

Thriving, yes. And we both saw not on the same day, but in the same week, we saw Hamilton. Yes, like a week ago. Yeah. Um I love Hamilton mostly because of the music. Yeah, it's great. You know, yeah. The play itself is great too. It's just fun. Um, and all I could think about during and after were how we can relate these songs back to our life and our careers.

SPEAKER_02 2:08

So, so brief synopsis for those that um I mean, again, it's on Disney Plus, right? It's a movie, but it's not a movie. You should have all seen it by now. It's a movie of the play, okay. Um, but Hamilton tells the story of Alexander Hamilton, an immigrant who rises from poverty to become one of the most influential people in the history of the United States through ambition, intellect, relentless work ethic, political conflict, personal triumphs, and devastating mistakes. He builds a nation while struggling with legacy relationships and the inability to slow down.

SPEAKER_00 2:42

And that is exactly what Beth and I are doing on a daily basis.

SPEAKER_02 2:45

We are doing that on a daily basis.

SPEAKER_00 2:46

And so I was like, I am him and he is I.

SPEAKER_02 2:49

So what yeah, yeah, you you are Hamilton. So uh again, what do you do with the time you've been given and what legacy do you leave behind? And how are we gonna relate this to orthopedics with him?

SPEAKER_00 3:01

Yeah, yeah. Do you think I'll leave the same legacy just by my private practice and hand surgery?

SPEAKER_02 3:07

You are the answer. No, you are trailblazing. I don't think, at least at our you are you are too. They're niche. But at least at our practice, I don't think that we have had a career of a career. I don't think we've had a history of PAs that are doing as much. Like I fear if I have to ever replace you, just discussing your job title. Like I like it won't be the same. No, I know it won't be the same, but like when they'll be basic. They'll be so basic. It's like when you wipe your phone, you're like, what the hell is this?

SPEAKER_00 3:38

This is just like this is just like the construct. Yeah, yeah. It'll just be the shell of the shell of what it was.

SPEAKER_02 3:44

Yeah, no, no, but um I mean I think uh no, yeah, I think you and I are doing a lot.

SPEAKER_00 3:49

I think that if you ever had to be replaced, it just wouldn't happen, and instead your doc would just stop working. He would be like, It's time. It's time for retirement. If you're gone, I'm gone.

SPEAKER_02 4:00

I'm gone, it's time for retirement or death. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 4:03

Oh one of the two. Yeah. Um, but yeah, so I think each song and like portion of this play embodies a part of our life and medicine. Yeah. Um, so I had Chat GPT drill down some of the most popular songs and what this means and how it relates for us. So personal favorite, nonstop. I feel this. Yeah. Do you feel this? Yeah. Or nonstop. Did you wait nonstop?

SPEAKER_02 4:32

So it is it is in the morning right now when we're recording. Did you pop over on your computer and do anything relating to work for the week already? Oh, yes.

SPEAKER_00 4:40

I sent out my weekly email. So every week on Saturday morning, I send a weekly email to my team and I go back and I count how many patients we saw that week collectively, how many surgeries we did, and then I predict for the week to come. I count how many patients we are scheduled to see and how many surgeries we were predicted to do, any issues from the last week, and then things that we need to like address early on in the week as potential issues for the coming week.

SPEAKER_02 5:03

What time of day was that?

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Um, well, I drafted it at 9 45 last night. I started counting and then I finished it this morning around like seven or so.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

Yeah, I sent out some stuff at seven this morning too.

SPEAKER_00 5:14

Yeah, does it ever make you wonder? Do you think you people get it and they're like, it's fucking Hannah again? Like, God, just shut up.

SPEAKER_02 5:20

Um, yeah, I yeah, I do. I do. I definitely do.

SPEAKER_00 5:24

Stop.

SPEAKER_02 5:24

Yeah, no, I think I think some people do because I don't think everybody is built like that. I don't think people think of Saturday. I think when people leave work on a Friday, they will not think about it until Monday morning.

SPEAKER_00 5:35

Yeah, I don't mean to be annoying. I just I do mean to be annoying a little bit, I guess. But it's closure. It's closure for the week.

SPEAKER_02 5:41

If I don't send my weekly synopsis, like what did I do this week?

SPEAKER_00 5:44

I did like I failed at my job. Oh well. Um, so yes, do we write like we're running out of time?

SPEAKER_02 5:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:51

Do we do things like we're running out of time? Because we are. Well, okay. That's the same.

SPEAKER_02 5:55

So again, Hamilton themes through the lens of orthopedics. Why do we write like we're running out of time? Translation. Why do you see patients like you're running out of time?

SPEAKER_00 6:04

Uh, because I am running out of time.

SPEAKER_02 6:06

Do you think that that translates to the visit? Like, do you think people are like, I felt rushed.

SPEAKER_00 6:12

I hope not. Yeah, no, I'm not sure. I mean, that's that is part of the art of it. Like, I am running out of time, but I need to make these 10 minutes count and feel very calmed down. Okay. So I have to like insert, you know, oh my God, how was your cruise? Yeah, yeah. And I'm like, my heart rateability inside, and I'm like jittering and I have tremors, but I'm like, was your cruise to the Bahamas fun? Tell me about it. Tell me about it.

SPEAKER_02 6:38

But do it in 10 seconds.

SPEAKER_00 6:39

What book are you reading right now? Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_02 6:42

But um, yeah, the charting um projects, writing your emails, your synopsis, our podcasting.

SPEAKER_00 6:49

Podcasting. What other projects do you have brewing?

SPEAKER_02 6:52

What what do I have projects should I have brewing right now? I mean, right now it's hiring. I have to, I well, so that is a big project. On my non-clinic and OR days, I'm looking at resumes, I'm calling people, I'm emailing candidates. Um, that I mean, that's a very big project I have to do on right now. Yeah. But I have uh some family and friends that want to experiment with peptide stuff. So I'm kind of like diving into that world a little bit in a non-provider way, just in a personal way. So that's kind of a weird little project.

SPEAKER_00 7:21

We wanted to touch on that a little bit more at one point, but it's still such a gray area. Yeah. So weird. Yeah. I want to um, so I'm trying to do a study comparing post-op pain outcomes for two procedures that we do. Um, and then yesterday was thinking through some other ideas, and I want to try to create an app. I don't know even how to go about starting to do this that helps to track outcomes, not just for these procedures, but it could be in general. Um, I want that to exist. I'm gonna speak it into existence or create it myself. Um, so that's on my list of like five to ten things as of current that I'm excited about. That's great. Yeah. Yeah. I'm where that goes.

SPEAKER_02 8:08

Oh well, I'm yeah, and I'm currently redoing in the midst of researching and redoing our pay bans for the company. So that's also a project. That is a project. It's not going to serve me at all. It'll serve everybody else that comes in. Those are the disappointing projects. Yeah. But those are things that I wish, you know, again, why why do I wake up and want to do these things, or why can't I think about other things? Because these are undone things. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

Like these are things that how Hamilton felt, like he didn't really necessarily benefit from like we're all benefiting from a lot of the things that happened, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:41

Um, but again, okay, here's here's a little deep dive. Are we productive because we enjoy it or because we don't know anything else? Um, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 8:50

Both both. I'm not really sure. Has it become part of our identity? Yes, it is my identity.

SPEAKER_02 8:58

Um I've been told I think I'm very difficult to vacation with because I just can't Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:03

Like, why would you want to? I know I I thought the other day I was like, maybe I should take a long weekend for myself and just like go somewhere and like go to the beach and sit there. I'm like, oh no.

SPEAKER_02 9:11

I know, but I normally relax. But I normally plan like my beach trips or whatever, like there's gotta be a 5K. Like there's gotta be like hiking adventure or something like that.

SPEAKER_00 9:19

Yeah, I have to do something productive. I can only like if there was gonna be a concert I wanted to go to and was gonna go to anyway, like I'll do it out of town or plan that as a trip or yeah, run a 5K or something. I don't know. Yeah, but there has to be a reason for me to do that. I can't just like sit on a balcony and like read for days.

SPEAKER_02 9:38

Yeah. So is being busy actually the same thing as being fulfilled? Like, are you not fulfilled if you're not busy?

SPEAKER_00 9:44

Um, yes.

SPEAKER_02 9:45

Yeah, me too. That's like a no-brainer. Yeah, no-brainer.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

Yeah. Um, yeah. So I think this can be there, there's pluses and minuses to this. It makes for very successful uh people sometimes. Um, does it cause burnout? I don't know. I wouldn't know. I've never been burnout.

SPEAKER_02 10:03

Well, burn well, here's the downside, right? If you're doing stuff like you're running out of time, like everything has to be done immediately and now and fast, and let's do it. One, I think it it paves the way for more things to get done. Like, and now I knock this off my list. Let's tackle the next thing. Like, I think higher productivity people are legacy people. Yes. They are they're tra they'll trail trail blazers. But burnout, yeah, that's a risk. It is a risk. Strain strained relationships, yeah. That's a risk.

SPEAKER_00 10:30

But wrestling, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's a risk. Without great risk, there is no great reward.

SPEAKER_02 10:36

I know, but do you think your identity this is such a dumb question. Is your identity tied to your your achievements? Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. What if you went on a week vacation? I was like, what did you do? You would make something up. If you read three books, you'd lie and tell me that you did something amazing, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:54

You'd have to lie. Yeah. Oh, I don't even want to think about that.

SPEAKER_02 10:57

Is there a point? And again, this is a Hamilton question and but you question. Is there a point where productivity stops serving your cause and starts consuming you?

SPEAKER_00 11:07

Mm-hmm. I mean, there is, and I think you just like maybe that's where you teeter on the burnout thing and you like start to go a little crazy. And I did you ever feel those moments happening with you? You're like, I think I'm like verging on emotionally unstable right now, and so I need to like figure out.

SPEAKER_02 11:22

Do you have enough like self-awareness to like step away, like see it and like all right, I gotta reset, I already recalibrate.

SPEAKER_00 11:30

I have the self-awareness to know that it's happening. I don't have the self-control to recalibrate.

SPEAKER_02 11:34

I'll tell you what, I I have trouble apologizing for it.

SPEAKER_00 11:37

For like your insanity? Yeah. Yeah. I I do too. I will, but I don't know that it like probably comes across as sincere because I don't know if it is.

SPEAKER_02 11:45

Well, no, but the thing is, like, I have I have trouble apologizing for because there's two things, right? Like, if I'm if I'm like a hundred percent I'm doing this, I have this plan, this is how I'm gonna do it, and then something messes that up, my annoyance for the fact that there's a wrench comes across as like, why would you do that? Like if you're helping me, right? And I'm like, hey Hannah, I did an outline for today, and you're like, hey, here I sent you one for today, I'd be like, why would you do that? Yeah, why would you then that comes across as like annoying? I'm not annoyed, I'm just kind of like, but why? Like, why? I feel like that that I don't know. I I have trouble apologizing for why I would feel like that. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 12:26

Yeah, I don't think you need to apologize.

SPEAKER_02 12:27

No, whereas I think for someone like you, you'd be like, Yeah, we did this and we're gonna double record today.

SPEAKER_00 12:31

So like Yeah, like duh. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:34

But um, but yeah, I think productivity at some point can stop serving the cause and consume you if you let it. Just don't let it if you let it, just don't let it.

SPEAKER_00 12:44

Yeah, just uh just push that push those thoughts down.

SPEAKER_02 12:48

Yeah, Hamilton though, I think his personal relationships that's what took that's what took the majority of the the hit.

SPEAKER_00 12:55

Yeah, maybe it seems that way, but still successful.

SPEAKER_02 12:59

But not if you chose the other sister, the other sister understood him better. I know, yeah. So she would not she would not have held him responsible for choosing his work like the other like the 'cause she would have done the same. She would have done the same.

SPEAKER_00 13:11

Yeah. But going back into like her decision with it, she had reasons for not choosing him because she was such like a strong personality. And she's like, I don't know, like I feel like a little like I need to pave my oh like I I don't want the risk associated with you and then regretted it. Yeah. Q and satisfied.

SPEAKER_02 13:33

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 13:34

Yes, exactly. Um, which is our achievement trap or our um, yeah, will we ever be satisfied with it is it ever enough? Is anything ever enough in life and in our work? You even asked me this like a week ago if I would be satisfied with things ever. I don't think so. I don't think I have that ability. I'm not sure. Because if I accomplish something, like it's the next thing. If you run, you know, a 10K, you want to do a half.

SPEAKER_02 14:01

Yeah, I know. And but I think that's what keeps you going. Like, dare I say, if you don't, it's you're stale. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, what if every I don't know, I just couldn't work in a role where like every day was just the same. I'd have to change something. I'd have to change like what I did, or can I now start to do this? And maybe I can start to start earlier. And I can, I don't know, I'd have to change something.

SPEAKER_00 14:24

I think you need to be happy and content where you are, but maybe not like completely satisfied. Yeah. Like you always want it to be better, but you're content where you are in that day, knowing that each day you're trying to level the fuck up. Yes. Um, so yeah, this is a this is a huge theme in medicine and in any career probably. Um, you, you know, oh, I'll just be, I'll be happy and satisfied once I get into PA school. You get in, you want to get the grades, you want to be top of your class, not that that matters that much. You want to graduate. Oh, once I graduate, then I'll be like a real person, real PA, happy. No, then you got to find the right job. And then you want to be the best in your job, and then you want to do all these extra projects, and then it never just never ends. Never ends. But it doesn't end, but it's not, I don't think that's a bad thing. It's not a bad thing. No, because then I'd be a bad person. Of course it's not. Of course it's not. No, um, I think it's just a a a common occurrence in people who want to constantly do more and be better.

SPEAKER_02 15:30

Yeah. So I think it is uh healthy to not I think if you're satisfied and you rest, so you rest on your laurels, right? Isn't that saying? Um, then I feel like you're gonna get sideswiped. You know what I mean? Yeah. I think if you become content and you're not looking for the next thing, I think you become stale.

SPEAKER_00 15:48

Yeah. And do you think though that like just personality type wise, and I've said this before, nothing wrong with one versus the other, because some people are happier in that like content, everything the same way. And we talked about this with the personality types. Maybe somebody who's more like the boundary person wants to just be content in they get to this level and that's where they're gonna stay because the personality is. Maybe what but it what are the things in life they're wanting to level up? And maybe for them, the leveling up looks like traveling more and crossing every country off of their bucket list or like monetarily leveling up, making more money and like having this nice house or something. So I think it's a common thing, it's just where you place it.

SPEAKER_02 16:32

Yeah. Yeah, if work, if your goal at work is to just develop consistency, then that's checking that box so that you can do other things outside.

SPEAKER_00 16:40

Yeah, yeah. I want to be as efficient as possible so that I could leave it, you know, four o'clock every day and accomplish, like, I don't know, redoing my house or something, whatever. So everybody has this to a degree, trying to level up things in their life, just depending on what they relate it to. Yeah. Um yes. Another favorite song, my shot. Yes, not throwing away our shot.

SPEAKER_02 17:06

Not throwing away my shot. Now, I have a lot to say about this one because um I think being a new PA in a role, whatever that role is, you've got to be the yes man. Yes. And again, this is the the nature of the song, the nature of what that you know, what that meant in the play is you're not gonna be given a ton of opportunities. And I mean, even going back to um Hannah. So Hannah had started in urgent care, and the goal was eventually for her to go work with the hand surgeon, but a couple other opportunities came up and I was like, hey, I I need you to maybe work with the foot and ankle person for a little bit.

SPEAKER_03 17:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:45

And it was a stepping stone for you. Was it what you wanted no? But I mean, that wasn't me asking everybody here to do that. Yeah. You know, you just don't give away opportunities that come your way. Yeah. And I feel like as a new provider, you have got to be open to that. And I will say that, I will say that to um new providers looking for the perfect job. If you continue to say no to all these stepping stones, like, what are you doing? You know? Now you can argue if you're a yes man to everything, you can't do everything. I mean, you can't be there for every add-on case, you can't be there on every committee, you can't see every patient. I think you should be the yes man, not the no man. Now, once you are established and then life throws 10 other things at you, then you create boundaries. But I think in the beginning, you got to take your shot. You have to do it.

SPEAKER_00 18:34

Yeah, do all the things, and then once you are established, you you then can kind of earn the right to choose, like, this is actually what I want more to do with. Um, but still maintaining, I guess, a little bit of flexibility and yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:46

But again, Hamilton, every opportunity um that he took was an opportunity to prove yourself.

SPEAKER_00 18:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 18:53

So I mean, that's no no one you're not going to build a reputation for yourself just doing mediocre things.

SPEAKER_00 19:00

Yes, very true. Wise words. Um, okay. How about wait for it? Patience, strategizing, which I will tie back to this, yeah, to my shot, because if you are the yes man, uh sometimes you have to be, you know, say yes to the things that aren't perfect for you and waiting for the right opportunity to present itself.

SPEAKER_02 19:27

I think again, different phases of the career. I think in the beginning, say yes, make the mistakes, take the job that maybe wasn't the right job for you, but you gotta try it out. And then once you're in the role that you want to be in, you've got to work on strategizing patience, timing. Um yeah, and patience is is is hard. I mean, that is a really, really hard thing. And I've got a couple of providers right now that I'm trying to teach that to.

SPEAKER_00 19:52

It's a hard thing to teach.

SPEAKER_02 19:53

It's a hard thing to teach, and I think you know, some providers just don't want that. I think everybody, and again, we live in a time right now that everybody wants stuff delivered to them right now. Gratification, and there's something to be said for just waiting, and patience sometimes does you know pay off. Um, forcing something that's not meant to be isn't always the right thing to do.

SPEAKER_00 20:14

Yeah, yeah. Um, okay. So moving on to right hand man, right hand man slash woman. Put that in there. This is this is this is the dynamic. This is the dynamic. We are the dynamic duo, or you know, relatively speech PA surgeon dynamic duo. Being the right hand man. Yeah. That is our life that we live every day.

SPEAKER_02 20:41

It is, and I think um, again, going back to identity, it's tied into your identity. I think being in a work relationship where your opinions, thoughts, decisions matter, that's like a really good thing. And I think ultimately what PAs try to work toward is having that trust relationship where it is, it's kind of symbiotic, you know? Yeah. So um are you in that? Are you a right hand man?

SPEAKER_00 21:10

I I strive to be the right hand man every day. Yeah. I think one of the lyrics in this, I need someone like you to lighten the load. Yeah, that's what that's what the job is. Yes. And then Hamilton responds that he is not throwing away his shot to be the one to do this.

SPEAKER_02 21:24

Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 21:25

And that is what we aim for every single day.

SPEAKER_02 21:28

Um, I've got to lighten the load. To lighten the load. And I think you do a good job with that. And take the load if you, if you know, the surgeon needs it lightened.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

You have to, it's a given. It's a balance. It is a wonderful balancing act. That's right. Um, so I think that that one was very, very akin to our life. And then I wanted to touch on the uh um the room where it happens. Oh I left this for last very intentionally because I think, you know, working in a s a private practice. In medicine in general, um, this is something that's very interesting. Yeah. And and you can probably speak more to this being on a more leadership and um managing side of things. So I think a lot of like clinicians struggle with this, I don't want to call it imbalance, but like the the difference between the management side and the clinician side. We are not in the room where it happens where all the big decisions are made to affect the little people.

SPEAKER_02 22:28

But you're just told what those decisions are. And I think it's I don't think a lot of practices, especially larger hospitals, I don't think you have practicing clinicians that are also administrators. I think it's a one or the other.

SPEAKER_00 22:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:40

Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:40

So But that's always a complaint.

SPEAKER_02 22:42

It is a complaint, but one of the biggest challenges I have is I put on my administrative hat, then I have to work as a clinician. And then the conversations that I want to have um with uh my clinicians, I realize I can't because that was happened in the administrative world.

SPEAKER_00 23:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:01

And the, you know, the conversations I have in clinician world, I can't translate to the at the admin because there's a right time and a right venue to do that. Otherwise, I'm kind of bending the ear in the wrong way. Yeah. Like that's a it's a really hard thing. But am I glad I'm in the room where it happens? Yeah, because I feel like I know things, but when something happens and I don't know those things, I'm like, did you guys, did you guys intentionally block me out? Like, why wasn't I why was I not in the loop? Yeah. Like, oh, oh, you didn't know? Like that, that bothers me.

SPEAKER_00 23:29

I yeah, yeah. I think that it's important though for clinicians to be involved in those higher-up decisions because obviously you have the opinions from both sides or the knowledge and you see things from both sides. Yeah. Um, and I think in more practices, people wish that that was the case, that somebody who actually treats patients and sees patients and understands what the day-to-day operations are like is the one that's part of making those decisions.

SPEAKER_02 23:56

Yeah. And I feel like that's like sending your um, you know, the people's voted representative, right? I think that's like, I don't know, it's like the going to the parent, uh, what is it, the PT, PTA, parent teacher system? Like it's your representation. Yeah. Like I'm gonna tell you all myself and I trust you to represent me. Yeah, I mean, that's exactly why I'm doing that. Um, in the room where it happens. Yeah. And how about like also sometimes when something big happens, I don't want uh people to know that I was part of that. You're like, big for for the negative, you know what I mean? Yeah, like oh, I didn't make that decision. No, like I was just there.

SPEAKER_00 24:29

Yeah, you know, they didn't listen to what I had to say, and ignore me. Um, or like, wasn't it Thomas Jefferson? So he wasn't really like around and actually fighting in, you know, yes, Hamilton and George Washington, everybody else. They they were actually a part of like the the battles and everything going on as it happened and not just the uh the oversight of things. We're in battle as the clinicians every day. We're in battle on the front lines, and they're the ones, they're the ones also behind the scenes.

SPEAKER_02 25:02

But I know, but like we're in battle, we're the ones sleeping in like the pitch-up tents, and then you go trenches, yeah, and then you go into like where your generals are, and they're like, Oh, you guys have silverware, and like there's a bed in there.

SPEAKER_00 25:14

And they're like drinking bourbon.

SPEAKER_02 25:16

We're like, Oh, like I showered in three days, but like, oh, my foot fell off this morning. Yes. Um, one other thing though, so I my daughter who I took to the play last week or two weeks ago, whatever that was, she was like, Who's your favorite character? I love Aaron Burr. I love him. I just do. I loved his perspective. I don't, you know, he this is kind of like the maleficent, like he was he was painted as the um the villain. You're right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, but I think if anyone who's seen it, Hamilton and Burr are friends, but then they're not. And I think they competitively like help each other get to that next level. Uh-huh. So like they're frenemies.

SPEAKER_00 25:58

They are frenemies. And I mean, um, spoiler alerts, but like I think at the end with what ultimately happens, right? I think he is saying that he realizes that, like, why why did I need to do this? Like, we were both, you know, great powerful people and we both could have existed in this space. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 26:15

Um but they were competitive at certain times for the same position, right? But um, I think also there was definitely space for both of them. Do you have any frenemies at work?

SPEAKER_00 26:25

Do I have frenemies? Yes. Or do you have a competitive, like I I don't think I have specific frenemies? No, no frenemies, but I do try to keep in contact with everybody so that I know their the whereabouts of things.

SPEAKER_02 26:40

Do you have anyone that professionally motivates you competitively?

SPEAKER_00 26:44

You.

SPEAKER_02 26:44

Oh, okay. Yeah, of course. But we're not frenemies.

SPEAKER_00 26:47

We're not frenemies, I'm not gonna try and out murder you. Yeah. Perfect. Um, just to clear that up. No, I do because we were we were touching on that with the lion thing. Oh my god. Me and Beth aren't gonna go to battle.

SPEAKER_02 27:01

No, we're not gonna go to battle. Um, but no, I do think building a meaningful career, I think it is very important to have someone who paces you. Oh my god, it's like running. It's like running and trying to catch the person in front of you. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:12

So Bird is your favorite character. Who do you think, like from the actors that we saw, like who did the best job? Who was the best?

SPEAKER_02 27:20

George Washington.

SPEAKER_00 27:21

Yeah?

SPEAKER_02 27:22

Yeah. I loved his voice. It was so deep. It like, I don't know, you know, when I don't know, it like hit my ears in such a way that I was like, oh my God.

SPEAKER_00 27:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:29

And also King George.

SPEAKER_00 27:31

Yeah, I mean, like King George is just comical. Yeah, like it's comical and he always does a great job. I think the the actor that um is in like the traveling version that we saw, he like did a really good job emulating the original Broadway actor, um, but like brought a little bit of spice and flavor to it. My favorite character is generally Thomas Jefferson. I just think he's fun.

SPEAKER_02 27:52

Yeah, like yeah, no, he was he was a good character. Um okay, so do you think that you're uh working on leaving a legacy behind?

SPEAKER_00 28:02

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 28:03

I know you are every day.

SPEAKER_00 28:04

Every day I want to leave a legacy. Yeah. You're working on it too. You're gonna be leave a Misha legacy.

SPEAKER_02 28:09

I'm gonna leave some type of legacy, but also setting the standard. I think setting the standard for all providers to come into our practice. I'd love to just raise the bar that our expectation is everybody functions with multiple uh years and ability to do things and ability to say yes.

SPEAKER_00 28:25

One of these days face is gonna be on the wall here. Actually, it already is.

SPEAKER_02 28:31

It is, it is, it is gold plated, damn it.

SPEAKER_00 28:36

Yeah, yes, yeah, belt and all. That's right. Oh my god. All right, all right, until next time.

unknown 28:43

Bye.

SPEAKER_01 28:53

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