Hanna Bauer: The Power of The Heart in Business Economics

In this episode of the Coherent Business Podcast, host Aram DiGennaro sits down with Hannah Bauer, founder and CEO of Heartnomics, a leadership and organizational transformation firm. Drawing on her remarkable journey as a childhood heart disease survivor, Hannah explores the profound connections between love, systems thinking, and sustainable business performance.

Hannah shares how decades of navigating medical uncertainty — from heart episodes unpredictable as a sneeze to hospitalization and heart attacks — forged her core leadership philosophy: that uncertainty is not an obstacle but a teacher, and that the greatest opportunities are often wrapped inside it. This lived experience became the heartbeat of Heartnomics, where she blends human-centered leadership with rigorous process frameworks like Six Sigma and the Baldrige Excellence Model.

The conversation challenges the common assumption that "love" is too soft for the boardroom, reframing it instead as the force behind empathy, conflict resolution, and the kind of loyalty that turns employees and customers alike into raving fans. Hannah and Aram also explore the tension between relational warmth and operational rigor — and how the best leaders, from SWAT teams to submarine crews, build deep human bonds precisely so they can perform at the highest levels when it counts.

From individual "pulse check" assessments to organizational diagnostics, Hannah offers practical tools for leaders ready to align internal culture with external results — and to stop sacrificing families and fulfillment on the altar of productivity.

Resources:

Heartnomics Website: https://heartnomics.com/ Coaching for Clarity In Under An Hour. Know Your Rhythm. Understand Your Code Before Burnout Sets In. 

Coherent Business Project Website https://coherentbusinessproject.com/ For leaders, thinkers, and builders who believe business can be more than just efficient — it can be whole, human, and meaningful.

Hanna's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bauerhanna/ 

Aram's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aram-digennaro/

Key Topics: Heart-based leadership, organizational transformation, uncertainty and resilience, love as a business principle, Six Sigma, Baldrige Excellence, internal alignment, burnout prevention, community investment, and post-pandemic culture shifts.

Key Takeaways:

• Uncertainty Is a Teacher: Hannah's childhood experience with unpredictable heart crises taught her to find signals within chaos — a skill directly applicable to entrepreneurship and organizational change.
• Love Is Not Soft: Empathy, conflict resolution, and genuine care for people are not luxuries — they are the engine of loyalty, performance, and customer devotion.
• Systems Require Heart: Rigorous processes and human-centered leadership are not opposites; they reinforce each other. You need the warmth to build trust and the structure to sustain results.
• Internal Alignment Drives External Execution: Organizations cannot expect loyal customers without first cultivating loyalty among their own people.
• Pulse Checks Are Essential: Just as Hannah monitored her own heart health, leaders need regular diagnostics to detect when their organizations are being strained before crisis hits.
• Breathe and Reflect: It takes as much courage to stop as to start. Pausing to reflect — not just pushing forward — is where the deepest leadership lessons are found.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:03

Today's guest is Hannah Bauer. Hannah is the founder and CEO of Heartnomics, a leadership and organizational transformation firm helping leaders rebuild trust, alignment, and resilience in times of pressure and change. She is a Maxwell Leadership Faculty member, a lean Six Sigma Blackfeld, and a Baldridge examiner. Hannah blends human-centered leadership with practical systems to help organizations eliminate burnout and unlock their full potential. A childhood heart disease survivor and pioneering medical patient, Hannah's story inspires her signature message of love and excellence. Leadership has a rhythm, and when leaders regain it, teams and organizations transform. So I'd actually like to start at the beginning. Your early years were very challenging physically. Can you tell us the story of what kept you alive and how that shapes your current first of all?

SPEAKER_00 0:50

Thank you so much for having me, Aram. It's a true, true pleasure to be here. For keeping me alive, I would say one is learning to breathe. And it is really hard. I know it sounds simple, it's something that we don't think about, but for me, it became honestly a challenge, especially when it was painful. It was painful to breathe. It was painful for even my heart to beat. So I think even just overcoming that desire as a kid, not understanding what's going on, right? I mean, I started when I was four years old. So if you think as a five-year-old, six-year-old, you don't really get like, oh, there's something wrong with my heart. So, you know, we will just go through that. But the early childhood is learning to cope in essence with dysfunction and really try to operate and having a normal life. Basically, me and Uncertainty became very good friends. There was nothing I could do to forecast when suddenly a heart episode would happen. It could be from a sneeze to where I was outside sitting in the classroom or I was asleep. So the uncertainty of sudden crises or sudden like from even a heart flutter to nowadays, and now I have to be hospitalized, and now I had two heart attacks at that one point, you know, heart failure. It was just you don't you didn't know. But that's the same thing. That's that philosophy, honestly, that shaped a lot of the work that I do. Because that's it, honestly, in certain ways, it's it's life, right? When we so even in in work and entrepreneurships and the disruptions that we go through, a lot of times the biggest opportunities are also there wrapped in uncertainty. So I learned to start finding the symptoms of some of the signals that came from uncertainty and also the basic things. When when your heart's not functioning well, you're not worried about how your hair looks and all this stuff, you know. So some things become really not as important. Also, as a kid, it brought me into leadership on what became vital, making sure that I did have a pulse on identifying what the vital parts to living a fulfilled life meant for me, my team, and the organizations I was able to serve.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Yeah. Yeah. Well, it seems like, you know, even with the name of your business, Heart and Omics, you're kind of making a bold claim about what is vital. And maybe an even bolder claim that like heart and economics can go together. What's the what's the hardest thing about getting people to integrate those two?

SPEAKER_00 3:06

They think love is soft. Well, we don't have there's no space for that in corporate. You know, there's there's no love. And I'm thinking, like, okay, well, first of all, we're asking our leaders to be passionate, right? I mean, we want even from our customers, we want them to be raving fans. We don't just want them to like our stuff. We want them to be loving our stuff. We want them to be, you know, just completely in for what we have. So that that's another expression of love. Essentially, we're talking about love. We're talking about empathy, having leaders that that show empathy, leaders that even that know the room, people able to do conflict resolution and do conflict resolution well. Well, in order for you to want to solve conflict, you have to care to solve the conflict. That's again another part of love. There's nothing soft about it. I mean, love doesn't mean that you're letting things pass. Love means that you have a standard and you uphold the standard because you love what you do. So understanding that they go together. My background, again, you mentioned Six Sigma in Baldrich, absolutely. That what is that systematic view of things? Is that having the system, having the processes? And people think that in order for me to do that, I have to be very rigid and the position, and it's all about the demographic, the the top-down kind of thing. And some institutions are traditional like that, but also understand that even the way that we do work is no longer necessarily the top-down. And actually, it's more of that project-based. And we see that we see great organizations that are more of that matrix where we are accountable to one another and we're looking for that, but that doesn't work if I don't even know the person I'm doing the work with. And for that, it takes love.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

Yeah. I I don't know if I've said this publicly before, but I have a deep personal conviction that love is kind of the foundation of everything. And that sounds kind of hippie, but I honestly don't see how you do business without that. Without, you know, really wanting to move yourself to a better place, move your employees into the kind of life that they should be in, not the one that you want for them necessarily, but the one that they should be in. And then also doing something that's truly valuable. If you're not going to do that, first of all, what are you doing? But also, how are you gonna be successful in a world where we don't have monopolies and we don't have slaves? We have to get people voluntarily to come to work and put first their best effort, or to voluntarily send us checks so that we have their money. And so, how do you do that without love? You could say, being at the foundation of everything. Yeah, I'm on board. I'm on board. But I agree it's hard to get that. And in order to get that across, you really do also need to be very, very good and very, very explicit about how this is driving your systems, how we are also pursuing excellence, how we're also pushing up performance. And it sounds like that's also something that you spent a lot of your work pursuing.

SPEAKER_00 5:41

Yeah, and actually, I mean, I learned the the hard way because I think at the beginning of my leadership journey, that because I set out to be a leader, I just didn't know what to do next. I had lived in the hospital for about five years, and suddenly I get this like, hey, everything's good, Car, like, well, what do I do now? So I essentially went back to the the beginning, right? I went back to the hospital and did four other people what have been done for me for years volunteering. And then I realized that in that service was where leadership came in and I'm very much heart-based leader, right? Like, hey, I understood like the what it meant for somebody to come to you and serve you in one of your most vulnerable times. So when I approached my leadership and organization, I started doing that and I realized, well, this doesn't just work. You can't just love yourself into profits necessarily, unless I also had a pathway to be able to do that. And that's where the whole processes and systems came into play for me.

SPEAKER_01 6:35

Yes, yes, yes. That's true. It's not just the sort of alignment at the heart level, it's also the alignment between the heart level and you can say reality or what we normally think of as reality, but more of the external factors that need to be incorporated to succeed.

SPEAKER_00 6:51

Yeah, and I think well, because it can be hard to think how do I keep the the rigidity that we need. I mean, we we need that, like we need that in hospitals. You need that when you're flying a plane, you need you need high-level standards. I mean, I I've trained SWAT teams, and there's no room to really let me just make sure that, you know, have show empathy at the time that we're doing a mission. You know, it's not that, but understanding those moments, there's times where you're performing like that, but there's times where you're building before that performance. So I just as I see in even in the SWAT teams, for example, when they debrief, the other time when they're not out there in a mission, they're bonding. There's other parts to what they're doing so that they can perform better and bonding going back to the human aspect. Even in the tools that you had. I just talked to someone who was in a submarine for months. They had the highest levels of tools, many tools, but at the end of the day, they were drowning, although they're surrounded by safety, if they did not have that human connection. And it was in that human connection that really allowed them to be able to operate in these tools. So it's being able to know which way to be able to have those great teams, that human operating system and also that operational system with all the other parts, the processes, the systems are failures, technology, compliance, all of these things that come into play.

SPEAKER_01 8:14

Kenna, you're talking about the alignment between heart and strategy. I was wondering if you can give some more concrete examples of the financial or operational wins that can generate. If you're working with an organization and you're seeing that alignment start to come into focus, what changes and how does it impact the operational realities of the company?

SPEAKER_00 8:33

One of the things that when we start looking for that alignment, right? We start looking at that, that root cost, even something's breaking down, or even if it we need to look at expenses, and that's a lot of times that that's what the finance department wants to do, right? We need to cut somewhere, we don't know where to cut, and you don't want to cut so much that you're messing up the vital parts. What really starts coming in when we start looking at the alignment process, things that start popping up are, for example, problems with overproduction, where we don't really have a way to track what is being produced. And we're not just talking about four manufacturing facilities, we're talking about overproduction in the things that we develop in our computers. You know, you think about how many times you're producing, or you may have different employees, teammates, or even contractors that may be working on the same thing and not even having a way to manage or see that. Overprocessing outside of overproduction, you have the overprocessing, which is we're collecting basically the same information. The purpose is the same, which is asking it in many different ways that become inefficient to a business. So that's another way, immediate cost savings. There is an ROI to that. One time when we were looking at it, for example, with overproduction, we didn't look at inventory as a waste, but it really was because of the changing of standards. Sudden things like, well, something might change, or you found a mistake in something, and then realizing that now all that money in inventory basically is going to go down to the trash. But here's the deal: one of the costs that may not be as apparent, but your audience really needs to know because it goes unhidden, yet it's literally taking straight from the bottom line. And that is a specific cost called the cost of the loss of human potential. Now, the loss of human potential, what does that look like for companies? It's something that we know it's there. We don't necessarily know how to measure it. So, what are we talking about? Well, you start seeing the loss of human potential when you start looking at the disengagement. For example, companies report to have over 78% of their workforce not being engaged, even self-reporting. We talk about the burnout, right? You brought that up. Well, when you're burnt out, you're just trying to survive. I've been there with my heart problem. That's exactly what happened. When I was barely breathing, I was not thinking about, again, the unimportant things. Same thing when you're in burnout, you're in that survival mode. Your people are not able to bring the best. That is a loss of human potential. Um, the very talent that you may have hired somebody for, like, oh my gosh, uh, this is gonna be a great person. We really need them. And then not being able to capitalize or be able to move the processes and the systems enough to be able to really put them in the position that you had envisioned to be able to have them in already when you hire them. And of course, the talent that walks out the door. People that you knew had amazing, like, oh my gosh, we really need them, and now they're gone because they really didn't see that future or they didn't see themselves valued or how they fit into the big picture. And that is a huge loss, not only in the human side that we lose, but also in the innovation ideas that really we were depending even for this hire and this person to be able to bring.

SPEAKER_01 11:35

No, I mean, you're right, when you point out those sorts of nuts and bolts reality, it's not hard to see just how dramatically trusts and communication, et cetera, can dramatically improve what you're doing. One of the things I've been hearing a lot about the last couple of years that I wanted to ask you about is the idea of psychological safety. And like on the one hand, I would say that's a complete bullshit term. It sounds like something that a psychologist made up that does not exist for one thing in real life, is when it's been actually psychologically safe. On the other hand, there's clearly something real and important there. People feel threatened, they're not going to be creative, for example. So, what's the bullshit part and what's the real part?

SPEAKER_00 12:16

The the first time I actually started learning about that, and I think that's where a lot of this term was coined from, was from the Aristotle project that was done with Google, and it was done in combination of what the top performer and team members, what what did they do? What was their special sauce? And what they realized as they were looking at it, which is what the psychological safety came into, is kind of you think of it like a spinal cord where there is an alignment, but alignment in what? And specifically is talking about support. So, what did the finding say? It said that it wasn't just for performance sake that you had high performers or you had people that really understood what they were doing. And yes, you had cross-functional teams, so you had everybody's perspective, right? You had everybody's point of view. But yet there was this one more key element that made these teams really be the high performance that they needed to be and also sustained that high performance. And that was the support at every level of leadership. So these teams not only needed to be supported by their team leader, but they also needed to know that there was a champion for that project. Even in project management, what we look at, they needed to be like a sponsor of that project. So that is very much needed. What is the reality of it? Think about committees that have been tasked to come up with a solution. And they might spend, you know, they're they're taking time and they're putting together the solutions, and then they do this great work, they turn it in, and then it's crickets after that. Four weeks, perhaps four months. And then you still see the projects like like the well, what happened? But yeah, somebody else is taking a look at it. The reality may even be like, oh, yeah, they tested some other third party that it's not even here, and you'll hear about it when the change has happened. That is a complete break of trust.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

You help me understand why it's a break of trust because you're asked to do something, but then it isn't being valued, or you're not getting feedback on what the value is.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Right. There's no implementation, there's no integration, there's no path on, like, hey, that was a great idea, but didn't quite work for us. Why did it not work? Why is this other solution gonna work? What is not? Because who wants to waste our time, right? We want it to be time that is well spent, and we don't just want, like, yes, the paycheck's nice, but for those people, especially high performing and it's employees, we want our work to matter. We want it to mean something as we're starting to look at that self-actualization, being able to have purpose and have fulfillment in what we do. So when you have a high-performing team, or even uh just a team that's performing that produces a project, and that project is just, you don't hear about it. For example, that impacts the psychological safety directly. And what does that speak to? It means that the line of leadership was not communicating in a way that where they knew how to even be able to provide the right support, the resources, because maybe it's not like, hey, that's an awesome idea, but we don't have the resources to implement. Okay, can we work on that? But having the psychological safety is not just physical security, but it's really talking to how are the ideas, how is the innovation, how is the conflict resolution, how are all those things, how do they move up and down the communication, the leadership line? And that is also part of the psychological safety.

SPEAKER_01 15:11

Yeah, no, that's really interesting. I mean, if I can paraphrase what you're saying, it kind of sounds like in order to function at your best, you need to feel like you're a part of a network, and actually not just a network, but a part of a hierarchy. Your task fits into a larger task, fits into a larger task. And at each level of that hierarchy, there is direction and support. I mean, it is with this weird paradox because on the one hand, it's a hierarchy, so you're being told what to do. On the other hand, you're being told what to do in such a way that you can become most creative and most free and most effective. I haven't heard people talking about that before in the context of psychological safety, but I think you're totally right. Because if I'm a part of this larger thing and this larger thing has my interest in mind, then it's easier for me to have a larger thing's interest in mind.

SPEAKER_00 15:57

Yeah, so think about this other part. What happens when like even those crickets or it does it wasn't accepted, then this whole feeling of rejection comes in. So now you have a very high-performing team that suddenly feels rejected. And it may not even be because of them, it just may mean that, hey, it got acquired by somebody else and they really nobody even had a chance to take a look at it. But even now you can start seeing a feeling of rejection or not good enough in a team that it had nothing to do with it. And that's part of psychological safety because not being able to incorporate it well raises this very true feelings where, oh, maybe my ideas aren't good enough, or do I need to step it up? And now you you might suddenly try to overcompensate because I was part of the team whose ideas didn't come through.

SPEAKER_01 16:39

You overcompensate, or you withdraw, or you sabotage, or you just have this kind of uncertainty that you might carry with you, which then you sabotage yourself.

SPEAKER_00 16:48

Therefore, psychological safety because now you have created this feeling of uncertainty. If I don't have this feeling of uncertainty, I'm psychologically safe. Like, okay, yeah, it wasn't the best idea for this one. It's okay, we're all good. We can still work together, not a big deal. We'll hit the board again. Not having a sound psychological safety structure will amplify the uncertainty, the feelings of fear, the feelings of rejection that we already battle as human beings.

SPEAKER_01 17:12

Yeah, yeah. Those feelings are often the things that torpedo someone's effectiveness. And you know, and then we kind of work with we have all these different channels. Well, we'll give you coaching, or we'll get put you on a performance improvement plan, or well, maybe you just aren't a good fit. But really, it often comes back to just these small slights or not being a part of this structure where I feel like what I'm doing matters and it's moving the organization forward.

SPEAKER_00 17:38

Yeah, I mean, that's actually one of the results of this engagement. Was like, well, why am I going to spend all my time, my creativity? I'm gonna really challenge myself thinking this through if my ideas are not really implemented, or I don't know what happens to them. I don't know if that was a good idea or a bad idea, or if it was good, why was it good? If it was bad, why was it bad? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:54

So a lot of the leaders that I work with are really sold on the value of alignment and strong culture and that sort of thing. But one of the things I often hear is that even when you believe in it, it's really hard to make it work. Yeah. So you have your retreat, you articulate your core values, you try to improve culture, but there's often a feeling that it still falls short. What's the difference between these culture-building efforts that end up being transformational and those that by anyone's measure, even those of us who are trying to do it, it feels like a waste of time.

SPEAKER_00 18:26

Okay, Ariam, I'm gonna give you my secret sauce. And this is what it is, honestly, is thinking that only the external, which is comes in the lottery three, so we come with a strategic plan, we have our KPIs, we come into a lot of agreements, is in some way isolated from the internal work that we do as people. We're not only balancing work, we're also balancing home. We're balancing kids, we're balancing purpose, we're balancing careers, right? I mean, there's all of these things that may come into the picture, some things that we don't know. So to look at organizational growth isolated of also personal growth, that's where the problem comes in. Because I'm requiring you to operate in values that perhaps you didn't have good examples of those values growing up. You may not have had good examples of even living in your daily community. Everybody's experience is different. So to have programs where we are coming into alignment all together as a team and have that team think and not consider also the personal growth of the individuals is very short-sighted because those strategies will not be sustainable. So the personal, that's something that I consistently do. That's what my beat method is about. It's about individual alignment, which is beat. Me as a leader, I cannot give what I don't have, but also for the core, which is the organizational alignment, internal alignment for external execution. Everything is what we do inside, so we can have outside. Same thing with the organization. We have to have the internal alignment of our processes, our systems, and our people so that we can execute to the customers on the outside. They're the ones that are going to be receiving this, but the customer experience is gonna be in line with my internal customer experience. Again, we cannot give what we don't have.

SPEAKER_01 20:05

Yeah, we can't get the external without also getting the internal. Doesn't that put a lot of pressure on companies? I mean, like you alluded to, traditionally we rely on family and mentors and faith communities and you know, all of these different influences institutions to help people do their own individual work. But is there a sense in which some of that has to come home and be a part of our work as businesses?

SPEAKER_00 20:29

I mean, do we as businesses rely on that? Because if we do rely on them, then we gotta make sure we're sponsoring schools, we're donating to our community, we're giving opportunity to team members to have, you know, volunteer work days. So, yes, if that is where we're looking at, hey, we want to carry the weight equally, then we must also support those very things that our teammates value, right? So it's not necessarily even just having a personal development plan, but what do our people value? What are their causes, their issues? We're not a system on our own. We have a collective impact. You know, if we look at it, you know, even more with a community, we have the faith community, we have the business community, we have the government, right? There's different players in community that we also must, as a business, if we're looking again, we're not a system to ourselves. Anything that happens inside is gonna have an impact on the outside. So when we're looking at this, there has to be both. I mean, we can't just say, oh, well, let them deal with it. And unfortunately, that's what a lot of nonprofits are burdened with, in a sense, that's not done corporately. We're just gonna put on a nonprofit, but yet we're not supporting that nonprofit. But the other part is there has got to be an intentionality to personal growth. Companies that invest in the personal growth of their people are not gonna be worse off in any way, shape, or form. Just look at what personal coaching does, look at what even mentorship does, look at what even upskilling your people or reskilling or whatever you want to call it does for any organization. So understanding that yes, the person. Personal focus for growth has got to be just as robust as our organizational growth because that creates healthy teammates that are willing to go to that extra mile, not only for us, but really in a time of change, go to places we haven't been before.

SPEAKER_01 22:17

So it seems like the vision that you're giving for what a business should be and do really stretches the boundary of the modern corporation. I mean, one of the things that is the genius of the modern corporation is that it is focused on delivering a product profitably and it's not focused on all of the other things that are done in society. I think good business leaders understand that you don't actually accomplish this product and profit thing without having in your peripheral vision a whole bunch of other factors. How do you keep those connected, but also stay focused on the core?

SPEAKER_00 22:52

Okay. One thing is that obviously, like you said, yeah, we've been trying that. What does that mean? $322 billion lost annually because of burnout, because of mental health illness, because of the many things that we're unable to do, very severe things. So there is a cost to the way that we're currently doing business right now. It is not working for us. Look at the suicide rates. Look at very, very prominent leaders. Even personal life does not reflect professional life. You're seeing a lot of breakdown in trust. You see the alderman trust, which measures the trust with organizations being at its all-time low with the way that people trust the organizations that they're working for, but not just that, the organizations that they buy from. There's such a level of distrust. Yeah, let's work for the profits and everything else is going to align. It's not the only thing because at the end of the day, money can buy you a house, but it won't buy you a home. Money can buy you companionship, but it won't buy you a friend, right? I mean, there's all these things that money can buy, but we really want things that money cannot buy. So to be in an organization that only looks at the money aspect for its customers externally and internally is an organization that's very short-sighted. That, yes, may reflect in profits, but it's not going to reflect in really being able to amplify the beauty of humanity.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

Yeah. And I would say that a lot of the people that I work with are people that have this vision and that really want to build companies that are going to matter on all the things that actually matter. I think it's up to you and me and the rest of us to support each other and figure out those models and methods and come around the business leaders in such a way that they can build something which really is countercultural, right? It's set to a different pattern from these things that you're talking about.

SPEAKER_00 24:35

Everything comes with a cost. We know that. Leadership has a cost, right? There's also a reward to leadership. We know that everything that we do, even in business, there's risk management, there's impact, right? I mean, we're looking at all those things. So even as a business, if we're looking at customers, we've got to take care of our internal customer first. We can't ask again to have all these loyal customers. If we ourselves don't have loyal internal customers or we are showing what loyalty looks like to our customers, I mean, you do see those organizations that have great cultures. I mean, like you have, for example, like the Chick-fil-A's that we hear about, right? Where there's an internal culture, it multiplies in places. You see that the companies that are known for their culture, people that really invest. I mean, I think, well, at least locally, for example, here, there's very few events I go in the community where I'm not seeing some of the very same brands every time supporting the very things that their employees and the very schools that their kids may go to. So it's an important part of business. It's an important part of the system. And yes, it's gonna require us having these conversations because we've been doing it the other way. I mean, we are where we're at because we have been trying to do it isolated from what the individual part is versus what the organization wants. Sacrifice families. We've sacrificed years. I know I've been guilty of that. I've been like, I have five kids, and I had to sit down. I made a decision, sitting down in one area of my business because I think I don't want to go and change the world when my own kids don't even know me. You know, like they can't say what my favorite color is or my favorite dish, or I can't say that the same. And I didn't want that. That was not gonna bring fulfillment. And I think that's a conversation that does needs to have. We work as part of an expression of what fulfills. We can have both. We can have fulfillment in the work that we do, we can have fulfillment in the change that we see in this world, and it's good.

SPEAKER_01 26:26

Yeah. No, I think the the tide is on its way out on this reductionistic, atomized view of existence that you can take one aspect of your life and isolate it from all the other aspects and turn it into a machine. And we we've tried that and it's done some amazing things for us, but we're kind of getting to the end of what it can do for us. And there's really a rapidly growing realization that our vision needs to be bigger. And I think for the really great business leaders, it always has been bigger. That's part of what makes them great. But what I'm trying to do, and I think what you're trying to do, is to amplify those voices and to amplify that understanding so that everybody has not just the philosophy or the worldview for that, but they also have the practical tools for integrating with their business.

SPEAKER_00 27:09

Yeah, there's validation. I mean, it works. I mean, there's actual numbers. I mean, we even look at the stock market, right? I mean, that's an emotional roller coaster. Humans know each other's feelings. We gotta understand the what they call the sentiments. Sentiment is another word for feeling. We're constantly measuring the sentiment. So if we want our people to be able to know the sentiment of our customers, well, it starts with me knowing how I feel. I cannot give what I don't have. And I think it's it's a very key, and I love what you're doing. I love that you're having these conversations because this is a true conversation. I think it really came to the front, especially after the shutdown, after the pandemic, where people started realizing and really deciding like how they wanted to do work and really it put right in the front stage what really does matter for me. What matters not only for me, but what matters for my neighbor, what matters for my community.

SPEAKER_01 27:54

In many ways, for me personally, but for our culture, I think the pandemic was the end of the world in a sense, and that it was sort of the logical culmination and a bunch of things fell apart that had been wanting to fall apart for some time and you know, giving us opportunity for approaching things from a different perspective. I want to give you a chance to say a little bit about practically some of the tools that you offer businesses. You've got a number of resources out there. Help us understand how you can help us in pursuing this vision.

SPEAKER_00 28:23

Well, thanks so much. I mean, like I mentioned during our talk, I do 100% believe in internal alignment for external execution. And for that, I always like to start with an assessment. That must be part of my background. That's part of what I did a lot in education. But is is getting a diagnostic, getting a pulse check. I mean, one of the things that I realized when I was going through heart problems, sometimes I just didn't know when my heart was being strained versus when my heart was well. And I do believe that having those pulse checks are needed in our organizations. And that's what we like to offer your people, your audience, if you just go to my website, there's a couple of pulse checks in there for both individual heart-based leadership and also for that organizational, which is my core. And one of the things I realized even with my medical illness and then eventually the cure that came about, realizing that I had too many notes that were making my heart go super fast or go to arrhythmia. And really, what I needed, what was done in that surgery, was to burn away the additional things that created chaos. And that's how I help people. I help making those pathways, burning away, not in essence taking more, but really identifying those things that we don't need to have so that your strategy and your opportunities become alive in the work that you do.

SPEAKER_01 29:33

I love that. I love that. You've got some assessments. You have a book. We'll definitely link to all of those things in the show notes. Any other parting shots or takeaways that you want the audience to go home with?

SPEAKER_00 29:44

Yes, breathe. It takes out just as much courage to stop many times as to start. I think it's stopping something can be very scary. So I would tell you to breathe and take that stopping time to learn to breathe. Having gone through a lot of crisis, uncertainty, and not only personally, but also in business life, I came to realize also that those were not only my greatest teachers because I went through it, but my greatest teachers because I was able to reflect and review them. And really that's where my lessons came from. So breathe and reflect on that breathing.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

All right. Well, thank you, Hannah, and look forward to many more good conversations. You're welcome. Thanks for having me.