Industry Conversations: Oliver NIvaud w/ United Cigars

You are listening to the Cigar Rebel podcast. Join the conversation as we take the time to enjoy one of life’s luxuries on this quirky journey we call life.

TODAY'S CIGAR: Gold Star Rubusto

Thanks for joining us. Don't forget to subscribe to stay up to date on all things Cigar Rebel!

Like and follow us on YouTube, Facebook and Instagram, and join the conversation on the Cigar Rebel Community on Facebook.

Transcript

0:13

Welcome to the Cigar Rebel community, where indulgence meets authenticity. This is more than a podcast. It's a gathering place for those who savor life's luxuries with unapologetic passion. Here we celebrate the fine art of living through rich flavors, bold spirits, exquisite cigars, and unforgettable experiences. Welcome, Cigar Rebels, to the podcast. I'm Mel. And I'm Kevin, and we're coming to you live tonight outside of Salem, New Hampshire, for an episode that I'm excited about, Mel. Me too. So on Friday afternoon, we were able to sit down with Oliver from United Cigars, which was an amazing time. We had great conversations and we can't wait to share it with you rebels. Yeah, but first we're going to go live with you guys tonight and make sure that we're on here. You guys are watching. We're going to be sharing comments throughout the night. So keep the conversation going in the chat. We'll be in the chat with you. But here in a moment, we're going to share that conversation with you that was fantastic. Yes, 100%. All right, Rebels, let's cut light and settle in. And so, Mel, what are we smoking tonight on the podcast? So tonight we are smoking the Gold Star by United Cigar. It has an Ecuador Habano 2000 wrapper, Indonesian Sumatra binder, and then Dominican Lajero Criola 98, Corojo uh 98, and Connecticut Broadleaf Filler. So if you have not had this cigar, it is in your Rebel pack. Hopefully you're lighting along with us. And um, if you did not get our Rebel Pack and are not smoking this with us, we highly recommend you go to your local brick and mortar and get it because it is an amazing cigar. Absolutely. And so on the episode here in a few minutes, you'll see that we're actually smoking something a little different with Oliver because he surprised us. Um, but we wanted to light this with you guys tonight. Um, as we started the cold draw, Mel, before we lit the cigar, um, there was a sweet aroma. There was this very pleasant, I kind of wrote down this almost soft pretzel kind of breadiness that was really enjoyable. Um, and we're not doing our cut and light commercial with Big Sky tonight because we want to get to this content with Oliver. Um, but now that we've lit it and just had a couple of draws, Mel, what do you think about this cigar? So the smoke right off the bat to me is very creamy. Um, it has some notes maybe of some cedar in there. Um it's a little dense. Yeah, there's a dense smoke. There's um almost a toasted kind of flavor to it. Um not like a toasted nut or almond, but just kind of there a little bit um with a little bit of sweetness at the finish. But so far it's been really, really good. And Tomel, what are some things that we wanted to cover real quick before we jump to this interview with Oliver? Yeah, so a couple of things. So, first off, tomorrow night is our ladies' cigar night at Two Guys in Salem, New Hampshire. If you are in the area and have not gotten tickets yet, I believe there were still a few available, not many, but some. Uh ladies' tickets are $10, come with two cigars. Uh, gentlemen are $20, it comes with one cigar. I think there's gonna be some drinks there, some snacks. I will be wrapping some cigars that evening. Um absolutely, and if you want to come early at four o'clock Eastern time, you're gonna be shooting the actuals live in studio above two guys' cigars. I was gonna say you can come pregame at four o'clock or even earlier. Uh, we'll be there. Yeah, we'll be there from 11 o'clock on. Our cigars will be for sale. It's gonna be great. Um, you had mentioned drinks, and so this is the drink that's gonna be there, the ladybug drink. Um, the bartender that night is the kilt man. So we're excited to be with John and the guys. Um, it's gonna be a great night. Agnes, Sarah, Dave's gonna be there. We're gonna be there. It's gonna be a great evening in Salem, New Hampshire. You can grab tickets at Two Guys Cigars on their website. Um, you can go to the Elevated Humidor website and click a link that'll take you to theirs to find the tickets if that's a little bit easier for you. Um, but man, we are super excited and there's a few tickets left for that event. Um, another great event that's coming up here in just a few days, or really it's a podcast, it's the duel. Um, June 15th, make sure you go out there and click the notify me button because we're gonna be going live with six panelists. We're gonna be smoking an under $13 cigar and an over $28 cigar. It's really over 32 at most lounges that we've seen it at, um, but you can find it for 28 occasionally. So we don't want to overhype the the number. But we are gonna be smoking both of those cigars live. We'll actually start the first cigar about 30 minutes ahead of time, get that smoked and gone through so we can score them live. And there's gonna be a single winner that night. Um, anyway, I don't know exactly what it is. I have some thoughts. Um, what could happen, what the conversation could be. Um, we're gonna have two panelists live with us in studio at Stories, and then we're gonna have two virtual here on the podcast with us, Leslie and Dwayne Corn. I'm really excited to have Leslie of the Corn and Popcorn with us. It's gonna be a great night. Um, so go ahead and make sure you click that notify button there on YouTube. You can also follow us anywhere you grab your streaming podcast, Apple, Spotify, Amazon, and it will be available for you to listen to. Yeah, it's gonna be great. I'm super excited about that. Uh so now, Rebels, you guys have waited long enough, and we will be in the chat with you as we are playing our amazing uh time with Oliver. Um, and we'll share some of the thoughts and comments on screen if we're able to. And yeah, here's our sit down with Oliver. You're in Red Anger Lounge. With us today is Oliver Naveau with United Cigars to talk about his journey in the cigar world, where the cigar industry is headed, and of course, smoking United Cigars. Welcome to the show, Oliver. Oh, thank you. Thank you for having me. Uh, you guys making the trip from uh from Texas, you know, coming in last night to sunny New Hampshire, so welcome. Yeah, it's been a beautiful trip so far. We've been here about 24 hours. Uh y'all have perfect weather. We left low 90s to get here to high 60s. So uh and everything's turning green and starting to bloom. So it's a good timing. Tell you Salem, New Hampshire area, Nashua, this whole area, May and November, maybe mid-October are the prime times to be here. Yeah, the fall when leaves start to change. It's beautiful just to take a ride through the through the mountains and uh absolutely gorgeous. And the weather's still nice, jeans and uh t-shirt, which is uh kind of my my wear. That's where I'm I'm comfortable. That's the perfect time of year. Yeah, absolutely. So um, we're sitting right now at the Red Anchor Lounge. Yes. Um, beautiful space. You guys can see it back behind us. We're set at one of the bigger tables. There's a kind of the stage space up top, which is where we were originally going to shoot, but uh the lighting wasn't all that great today. And so uh this has been a beautiful space. So tell us about Red Anchor Cigar Lounge and how it connects to United Cigars. Yeah, so we're in Nashville, New Hampshire, and this is uh this is a two guys' location. This was the actually the the first Red Anchor Lounge when it was all remodeled. So the beauty beauty of this uh lounge area is that there are so many different sections. So where we were seated, um, you know, great lighting, you know, if you need to sit and work on computers, but for us to do a podcast with the light coming down, like it was casting some crazy shadows. Yeah, absolutely. And then and then now we're sitting at more of a communal table. So people that want to sit down, do some work, there are uh some chargers, and um you can sit and and do some some great work without interrupting the people that are sitting in the in the different areas, and and during events, uh sometimes this is this stage two, our left is converted into um uh like a stage area where people are playing instruments and uh you know live band can come in. So it's uh yeah, really nice, really nice setup here. It's awesome. Yeah, and y'all serve drinks here, um, kind of on they have a small, yeah, small little cocktail cart with a kind of like a flight attendant uh you know type type cart. And it's uh uh you can get uh get some cocktails and um have some refreshments uh during the afternoon. Yeah, so it was about 18 months ago, was the first time we were here, maybe a little about two years ago, and we sat right over there on the high tops, and uh John served us uh whiskey, I think whistle pig is what we had that day. And uh smoked uh red anchor cigars, which we're smoking again today. So why don't you tell us about red anchor cigars? Yeah, so we're uh we're enjoying the red anchor cigar today. We're smoking the captain, which is the Robusto size. Uh that's a five by 50. Within the red anchor line, there are four different uh Vitolas. So we have the the Captain, as I mentioned. The Cooper is our event-only cigar, which I believe we we may have had when we did the event um uh at Stories. And the Cooper is a four and a half by uh 43, so nice little uh sampling of the of the cigar. And then a little bit longer, six and a half by 43 is the gunner, and then the admiral is a six by 52 uh Toro, and then we have the Commodore uh 7x55. Awesome. So nice nice range in uh in the cigar, and it's a um it's an Ecuadorian Habano wrapper. Um little higher primings on this. So you have a little darker, you know, darker leaf. The the binder and the components inside, we use Yamasa tobacco uh inside from the Dominican Republic. Uh, there's some um PA broadleaf and some other Dominican fillers to kind of round the whole thing out. So it's a nice, I I put it in the category of a nice medium body, not overpowering on the palate, um, but some very nice uh flavors that will kind of waken, you know, get the get the palate uh to to waken up and uh and the retro is is beautiful. Yeah. So red anchor is one of my favorite. I think we brought several with us to smoke. I think the gunner. Thank you. Yeah, gunner. That's my favorite size personally. I mean, I remember the first time I had the red anchor cigar, it was right before we opened officially um at Stories, it was during one of our sneak peeks. Yeah, and I will say that you know, you have those like I don't want to say life-changing cigars, but I mean for me it was like, oh my gosh, and I smoked a lot of them the first month we were opening. Yeah, so I think the first box we sold at Stories was probably Mel and I smoking them or giving them out to people, right? You know, because we wanted that's not how to run a business, but yeah, exactly. It's probably not the best decision, right? Right. Uh, but it was made. Yeah, and it's it's funny in that, like if we just said, and you go to um, you know, a lounge and or a retailer, you say, Hey, I have a lawnsdale, I really want you to buy it, over a Toro, right? It wouldn't be the one that they would lean towards. But in this blend, that Gunner, which is a Lonsdale size, I believe is uh is just fantastic. It it really represents the blend well, and uh, but then the other the other sizes just uh are are a nice complement to the whole portfolio. Yeah, and I actually have one of the event size, and I don't remember the name of that one. I apologize. The Cooper, yeah. The Cooper. Um, I have one of those in my humidor back at the Airbnb as well. Oh, nice. Um, just because we had gotten one when we were with you guys at PCA. Um, Agnes had given a couple out to try as we were uh working on the Nelson Alfonso area, what we were gonna buy. She was like, Well, here, try one of these. And so that's great. I lit one up, and I don't actually know how I ended up with a second one, other than maybe being a mooch. Okay, but it is in my so I thought uh setting in the hot tub tonight is kind of the goal, or tomorrow night will be uh nice little cigar. And that's humbling. So thank you because I know you know traveling, you have a and having a humidor and your own cigars, you can travel uh with you almost any any cigar, right? Yeah, but to choose that, thank you. That's uh yeah, it's humbling. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You're welcome. Well, it's an honor to do that. So, Mel, I think we're gonna get a little bit into a topic and kind of set the stage for a little bit further conversation if that's okay. But I feel like being at Red Anchor, it made sense to highlight just for a moment. Yeah, we got Red Anchor plastered all over the screen. I love it. Yep. Um, so being a little bit more on our topic today, so when we started to begin developing story cigars and lounge in East Texas, um, the first contract we actually set up was with United Cigars. And um, Kevin and I knew right away that was we knew one of the first things we're like we want to carry United blinds in our lounge. Yeah, and I was sitting, I think I told you this story a little bit earlier today. We were walking through the warehouse, but I was sitting at a conference, I just got done speaking, and I was going up to be a panel. We had about an hour and 15-minute window, and I texted Mel and I said, Hey, I'm gonna just call United to see if we can get somebody. Yeah, and so I called and Agnes had picked up the phone. Um, she'd only been with the company a few days, weeks, I mean, real really early on. And she was really excited because she had said, Hey, I've not made a lot of sales, uh, you know, because she was new and getting into it. Um, and I said, Well, I've not bought a lot of cigars, so let's figure this out together. Right. Um, and so we got through the phone call um and we had an opening order with um Red Anchor, Montosa, Terra Nova, United, I think Yaw Yaw, and um Firecrackers No Firecrackers at the beginning. Yeah, at the beginning. Okay. Um Dose Sombres. Dose Sombres, yeah. And so that was kind of our our process, which really was just so unique to have that opportunity to kind of explore. Because there was a couple of times she had to go ask questions. Right. Because I had I didn't know enough to know what to ask either. Right. And she was she was just brand new. So if it was, yeah, right at the beginning, because when you know when she was starting, it was a new this was a new career path for her. She had 20 years in um in in retail, uh, high-end luxury uh cosmetics. And um really at the beginning, it was like, okay, well, here's a list of all of our accounts. Just start start calling just to say hello and touch and uh see how they're doing, and also that's part of the experience of learning how to, you know, as simple as it sounds, pick up the phone, dial, and have a you know, friendly voice, confidence in the in the portfolio, and just kind of working through things. So um, yeah, your call in uh was was very exciting for her. And uh, you know, she had to work through some kinks because there were some questions that she wasn't wasn't ready for, but she's uh she's been fantastic, two two and a half years with us now. Yeah, so yeah, and she's become what I would say a friend, you know. So um yeah, and just one of those things that every now and she'll shoot me a text or melletext with a picture of her smoking something or doing something, like I've got to try this. Oh, yeah. Uh, when y'all first got, I think we'll talk about it in a little bit, but the new Firecracker, uh, when that first box came in, uh, she sought us a text and was like, You have got to make sure you order this. Yeah, you know, but I didn't feel like it was as a salesman, I feel like it was as Agnes going, Y'all are gonna love this. And there's different relationships in the industry. Yeah, it's it's funny, and you've been in the industry for a while, but you started because it was a passion, right? It was uh it was a hobby. You smoked them, and even now being in the industry as long as as you guys have, you still revert back to that, you know, the cigar geek is what you know we call ourselves. But sometimes it's just yeah, I even geek out about our portfolio, other things that are coming out in the industry. Um, you know, if I go back to smoking in Atabay, which you know, I don't smoke very often, um, I then revert back to kind of those first days of coming into uh just the hobby and fall in love with it all over again. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah. I remember you texted me and you were so excited after you had talked to Agnes and talked about how we had gotten that account open. And you know, really since then we've worked with you guys a lot over the last couple of years, and it's been great. And we've had the honor of having you at Stories to do events with us. Beautiful location, too. Um, we're really honored to have you here tonight with us as well. No, thank you for keeping me on the radar. Yeah, and so when we knew we were gonna make this trip up, I had to come up to Boston. We could make an opportunity to run up here for a couple of days. Um, was really excited to come to Red Anchor and be able to do this just because it's another lounge, it's beautiful in here, the space is great. Um, and so thank you for telling us about the lounge a little bit earlier, kind of moving forward a little bit. I want to take a moment and maybe take a few steps back. Can you tell us about how you got into cigars um that really kind of led you to this career? But like you said, it becomes a hobby and a passion first before it really becomes a career. Yeah, um, so it's um it's I guess started in 88, which is a long time ago. Um 88 I started smoking cigars. I was, you know, I think I was 16, and I just grabbed uh a cigar from my father's humidor without him knowing. Uh but you know, cigars have been in my family, and um my my folks are and my entire um extended family are all in France. Uh still my parents are live in Connecticut now, uh, and they've been in the States for since 73. But anyway, I uh I I grabbed a Fuente and I bel from what I remember it was the uh just the chateau because I remember the cedar, it was just a short cigar. And then from there I just uh you know jumped into learning about cigars because it was just you know interesting to me that you know my uncles were smoking, my my father was smoking, and um wanted to learn about cigars, and then I started smoking uh more and more and just enjoying them. My first premium box that I'll call it of cigars, I was in uh I was in college and I bought a box of 10. It was uh the box of 10 Teamos. And then then fast forward I graduated, I was working in in Boston and I moved out to Las Vegas in '97. Oh wow, uh, November 97. And in by April of 98, I started working for a cigar company in Las Vegas, and um that was Fry Boy Tobacco. We we had um, well, while I was there, we ended up opening um about 10, 12 retail locations, satellite locations within the casinos, and we had our local office. So I worked at the MGM location uh for about six months, and then I was transferred over to the Caesars location to manage that store. And then um, you know, within I think the within the first year, then they brought me into the office to do some of the marketing because that was my background. Uh, do more of the marketing that turned into you know a little bit more manufacturing, and we had wholesale, we had cigarette hostess programs. Um Fry Boy Tobacco had partnered with Ashton Fuente to open up Casa Fuente, okay, um, which just recently closed. And then um devastated by that. Yeah, yeah, that was a staple. That was uh favorite place to smoke in Vegas. Yeah, I mean that that was a pin in the map uh for Las Vegas for lounges, and then uh we opened up Rumbar at the Mirage, and um, but after 14 years with them, uh I moved I moved and uh we went to Utah for a year and then uh moved back east uh because that's where you know my parents were and that's where I'd kind of grown up in my you know uh high school years. And then 2016 is when I started with United Cigars, and um and just took it from um you know we were small, we're still you know, well, we uh you know what's the definition of boutique? I think David talked about boutique on the on the cigar authority recently, but um, you know, we're still a smaller, smaller company, but um our portfolio is so vast that it's really trying to you know grow and and share all of these lines with people. When I started, I I really then said, well, we just need to focus on on one and then we can start growing. And that one that I chose was Atabay, because to me, smoking that cigar was not necessarily life-changing. I think you said it earlier, but it was one of those moments I was like, wait a second, what what is this? And I learned about the process, the aging process, five years post-roll, learning about Nelson Alfonso, and then from there, uh, I just felt like that was that was the cigar I wanted to focus on, and and outside of that, then people can learn about the portfolio afterwards. So um, you know, we have an extensive portfolio from um, you know, sub-ten dollar cigars with our United and Firecracker and and Montosa, uh, which we distribute for our laundry, and then going up to Gold Star and Red Acre. So it's um yeah, it's a beautiful portfolio. Yeah, I mean that's I agree. There's lots of great cigars for sure. Yeah, you have a great value cigar that somebody can come in, even like Love Mez-Calcamana. Love this six dollar cigar, move up in the United, which is a very I want to talk about that specifically in a few minutes, so I don't want to go too deep into it here, um, because I think it deserves its own spotlight. Um, but then you get into Montosa, Terra Nova, and then you can go all the way to the other into the luxury of Atabay environment. And Alfonso, yeah, yeah, beautiful. In the new Nelson line. In the new Nelson line, which yeah, it's slowly trickling out to the the market in uh uh sample uh sets. So yeah, no, it's a it's an expensive. Yeah, it's wonderful. Yeah, I agree. So what is your favorite cigar in the uh United lines? You know, we talk about there's a lot of really good ones. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can only choose one to smoke forever. Oh, well, if it if it's just the smoke of forever, or which one's your favorite in the Yeah, it's it's all because they all kind of hit uh you know the palate differently. But um, you know, it's like saying you know, what would be your favorite wine? And you know it's not it's almost it's not even fair because I look at Atabay and I'm like, well, look, it's aged, minimum of five years post-roll. It's delicate, it can kind of hit the palate at any time of the day. So you know, if it was one, that you know, that might be that might be one. And the spirit is for me, the Lancero, in that has a little more palate forward strength to it. Yeah, um, so I'd I'd I lean towards that. I really like it. And the the Ritos is a beautiful size that is more toro, so it it softens and has more delicate, you know, um floral, sweeter notes. But um, you know, I'd say uh if I can pick a couple, the United Connecticut, I think is a brilliant Connecticut using Dominican broadleaf, and it's just you know approachable $8 uh price point. And then uh gold star is is one that I've been smoking a lot of, even though we're smoking the red anchor in the red anchor lounge, the gunner we were talking about earlier. I love the gunner. So it's it's yeah, it's hard. I didn't answer the question. I think you answered a little bit, you answered you put a Vam out there. And you mentioned the Gold Star. So uh the gold star I have right here. Um, it is one of my favorite go-tos. If I'm in our shop and go, what do I want to smoke? And I don't want to think about it. The gold star Robusto is what I grab. And please don't hear that as oh, I don't know if it, but it's it's gonna perform, it's enjoyable, and I know it. So I don't have to think about what I'm tasting, what it's the flavor notes. I can sit there and work, or I can sit down and have a meeting with somebody at the shop, and it's just easy to smoke. Right. Um then last night we sat down and and Mel said, uh, if we're gonna get in the hot tub, I'm gonna smoke something good. Because I just had some sticks that we had with it. You know what I mean? Just um and we went back and forth. Do we smoke the McAuliffe white or the gold star? Yeah, um, we didn't smoke the McAuliffe white, but only because we we we're gonna be smoking gold star at some point today. And so we're like, oh, we're gonna have it today, so we'll do the McAuliffe. That's fair. The people of McAuliffe are fantastic. Yeah, but that was one of those things though that in we're not saying it just because we're here, we really do smoke a lot of United, which is why it was the first account we set up. Yeah. So yeah, um, you had mentioned United, and I'm gonna kind of jump around. You also mentioned Atabay, which I want to ask a question, but you recently were in Spain looking at this new process, this new you can you tell us much about that? Yeah, so the so that's Nelson Alfonso with Selected Tobacco, the new facility that he's opening up in Madrid, Spain, um, this this October, where we'll we'll have the the grand opening. Um, it's an incredible um facility that will, it's it's really it's almost like a university, uh, because you'll if you know if you're able to go uh and visit you know Madrid at some point and you want to see the the facility and it and it's open uh to the public, then um he'll have his design studio there, um, a whole display area for everything that he's worked on throughout his career. Um there is you'll see the the rollers will be there, the um the the packaging area will be there, the aging rooms, which consists, it's it's two stories, right? And it's the largest cedar-lined humidor in the world. Uh from ceiling to floor, everything is cedar. Uh 24 different aging rooms, but then within those um aging rooms or or outside of those aging rooms, there's there's a whole separate area that when the cigars are ready and they're packed up, they can rest in that area. Then there's the whole warehouse where it'll have you know the the packaging materials, but it'll be fermenting tobacco there, aging tobacco there, uh aging tobacco in in wine barrels. Uh so the wrapper will be aged in barrels that are scraped, and uh the filler and binder leaves will be aged in um in barrels that are unscraped, but old uh old wine barrels. And then um, and then he'll be growing tobacco in the facility as well, so that he can use the seeds uh that that will be sterile, but then plant those. He wants to use that um that final seed in Spain to start growing tobacco there. So really every aspect of uh the cigar uh business will be. It's amazing. Yeah, that's great. I know Mel has a couple questions around United, but before we get to that, um can you talk about how that partnership developed or what that means to United Cigars? Maybe the development part you weren't is involved in, but you know, as it's definitely grown under your stewardship since you've been here. Yeah, thank you. The um so that started so United Cigars started in 2009 with David Garafalo, who brought it back because United Cigars actually started in 1901. Uh they had built it up to over 3,000 retail locations across the country and they were they did distribution and uh yeah, it was a very large company um that they partnered with Whalen Drugs, and um it was it was more of um you know, they they weren't your typical cigar lounges that we know today. They were selling magazines and uh comic books. In fact, they were the same company that ended up purchasing purchasing Marvel Comics, and okay, so then excuse me, in the 60s, that's when it dissolved. So David brought it back in um in 2009 uh to to bring back some of the you know, or to bring introduce some of the lines that he had created over the years. In 2012, uh that's when Nelson Alfonso had approached David about distribution, but um at the time United Cigars wasn't necessarily a distribution company, okay. But uh he wanted to help Nelson uh you know, Nelson he believed in in selected tobacco and at a bay environment, so he wanted to roll that into the the United side, and and Nelson um yeah, had a distributor uh before, but uh he was kind of changing changing over and wanted United Cigars to represent it. So I at the time they they just had the one booth uh for United Cigars and Selective Tobacco at the PCA shows, and then that's evolved over the years. And then I started with the company, as I mentioned earlier in 2016. And um I I think for for myself, as I mentioned, when I tried Atabay for the first time, the cool draw is almost what what captured me at first because I had really not that I had never tried anything like that, but it was just so clean, so smooth, sweet. And then I lit it up and then I started to learn about selected tobacco. And um, I I I felt that there was something very special there that just wasn't shared with everybody, so it was it wasn't understood um outside of just seeing a cigar that was priced at a certain level. But if if there's no explanation behind a price point, then it's the why starts to be stronger than anything else. So for for myself, it was just traveling the the country and and sharing that cigar with people, explaining the story uh behind Atabay and behind Selective Tobacco and what the process is of um aging the cigar post-roll. Uh it's unlike anyone else in the industry. So Nelson will roll the cigars in Costa Rica, but when they're shipped to Madrid, Spain, they go through that aging process, and the process is what I want to focus on and really uh emphasize because a cigar, what I knew as a cigar to be aged was in my humidor, resting at 70%, 70 degrees, and after five years, it's a five-year-old cigar. But that process is very similar to buying a 12-year-old scotch or a 12-year-old bourbon. Once it's out of the barrels, it's not really aging the same way. It's not absorbing the flavors, it's not cleansing itself. So Nelson will take the cigars and put them into a cedar lined humidor, but when I say cedar line, like ceiling, floor, uh, walls, everything, um, and then lower humidity and then raise it back up. So, similar to the different spirits, when they're in the barrels, colder months the wood contracts, and warmer months it expands. So it's it's actually absorbing the liquid, but then um, you know, filtering it as well. Yeah. And they roll the barrels, and you know, it's it's it's a process. So it Nelson's aging process for selected tobacco is what uh really distinguishes his lines and brings that elevated price point as well, because of that extra time uh that the cigars are are aging. Yeah, it's probably one of the few cigars ahead of $20 that I never mind spending the money on. Yeah, you know, you there's a lot of cigars out there, unfortunately, that have been coming out of that $20 plus mark. Right. $40 plus mark. We smoked one, and I'm not gonna say which brand it was, but it's a new one released at PCA, $72.50. I wanted, I bought it at another lounge. It's like, hey, are we gonna buy this for stories? I I've never had it. They didn't have samples at PCA, it was just either you buy blindly or you don't. Right, right. Um, and I could have walked through our humidor and bought any $10 cigar that was better. Right. Yeah, you know, and and that happens, but when you look at the stuff coming from Nelson, everything smokes ahead of its price, even at that $20 plus price point. Yeah, yeah, I I I I share the same feeling on it. It's uh and that's that's what has what drove that passion when I started with the with the company. And um, you know, it's true in in any industry, right? Clothing, yeah. Um, what you know, sometimes it's just the designer label on it, or uh, you know, it's the packaging for a certain drink or or wine or whatever. Yeah. But um, but the product has to has to hold hold up. And and then I want to know, well, what's taking, like, why is why is Gold Star um you know around the $12 price point? Why is United around the $8 price point? Um the tobaccos that are are used are still every cigar on the market, especially today, because there's a more uh educated smoker, um, it's aged tobacco. For the most part, it's quality tobacco. I think we're fermenting tobacco a lot better than than before. Absolutely. Um so they're all they're all quality, but you know, you it just depends on how you want to kind of position it and what you're doing with uh you know a certain packaging, and uh because it all all plays a factor as well. And and the tobaccos that are are used are different grades and different levels. With selected, um, you know, even the wrapper is is double A grade wrapper. Um, so it's going to even start there. You're talking about five to seven-year-old tobacco inside as well. So everything plays a plays a factor in in that price point. And yeah, sometimes you know, there there are cigars that are are higher price point that that don't meet uh that price point, but sometimes there are cigars that are lower price point that smoke higher. Absolutely. So I know Kevin had mentioned PCA, and you know, we saw you very briefly. How did the show go for you there this year? Yeah, the the show. Well, for us for United, it was a great show. Yeah, and I think that was a sentiment, sentiment for the entire PCA from you know, just talking to industry friends, and uh there was just a good feeling, yeah, a good vibe at the show. Um, you know, people were happy, people were energetic, and I think the PCA did a great job uh as well. But um, but it was it was yeah, it was a great show overall. If we're you know, if we're just strictly looking at uh you know at sales for it, uh yeah, it was it was a great show. Yeah, but I think when you're and and that again was uh across the the board from what I understand with with other manufacturers as well. But um, when you tie everything in, uh could have been one of the best shows that uh that I can remember in you know the shortcuts. That's awesome. Yeah, that's great. Um, was there anything that surprised you at PCA this year? Um that's a that's a good question. Surprised me. Um I I think you know being being humbled by it, but more new faces coming in, um saying that they've had requests and people have talked about it and they're they're like, yeah, you were on our list, we wanted to uh you know come see United Cigars. So um, and that's just humbling. That's that's a lot of uh work and dedication on our our team that we have have out there and um you know what uh what we're trying to do to get the name out and and retailers like yourselves that share the the story and believe in the product um you know that that's that's on the shelf that your consumers uh your customers like. And um, so it was yeah, that was that was that was a surprise. It's always it's always surprising to even walk into a lounge or somebody that will recognize the brand that before was you know just an unknown. Yeah. So I mean realistically, 10 years into the distribution, maybe 15 years, um that's not long in the cigar industry. No, no, no, when you look at yeah, when you look at some of the yeah, some of the so young, right? And so to have the reputation that you guys carry is impressive. And we're not saying that because you're on here with us. I mean, we've had that conversation offline previously, um, but just in it's really do think it goes back to the dedication of the team, right? Because you know as well as I do, you've been doing this a long time. Uh, take care of your team really well, they take care of your customers, customers ultimately take care of you, right? Right. And you guys have a really great team here in New Hampshire, and you've got some great partners that are out around the country, it seems like. Yeah, thank you. And it's uh it it was by design in in a in a way, um, because it was it was just myself for for a long time. And you know, with Dave, I would come back from trips and we would talk, and um, we both agreed it's not it's not just the sales. Don't focus on just you know forcing the product or um bending you know in a certain way that would kind of dilute either the you know the the the idea that the drive uh behind the the brand. You'll really just focus on on building the proper foundation and just stay true to your to your word the whole time and then we'll we'll grow from from there. So um you you don't want to build a house with a weaker foundation, put the studs up and you know the snail's crooked, don't worry about it, put the sheetrock up, you know, it'll be it'll be masked and nobody's gonna see it, right? So we wanted to build everything you know with with quality, and it's uh yeah, there are some companies that that uh in the past have done it very well and they're they can um be an overnight success in a way, but uh, but then a lot of those companies sometimes they they just go away and it's not just throwing money at the at the industry either. Um I think as consumers we we see that we see we see through that uh a little bit because there have been some larger companies, uh European or from wherever that come in and try to you know really almost force their way into it. And it uh you know, in the end, they people really have to love the product. Yeah, absolutely. So the last couple of PCAs have almost been hotbeds of new information coming out days before the show, the tariffs last year, right? Uh the definition of a premium cigar in the CAA versus the FDA definition that was defined, I think the Thursday or Friday leading into PCA. Um what is your take on that definition? Kind of finally having a finalized definition, which we've had for over a decade, but we kind of finally have a legal decision on it. Do you feel like that has any impact on the cigar industry or United over the next several years? I think as as we as I guess the government and um as we start looking and understanding premium cigars more, and we're able to because before it was just it was all lumped in, right? If it produces smoke, yeah, then it's like, oh, that's part of the industry, and they have to be you know um responsible for for letting people know that's maybe that's a barbecue, right? You're I'm cooking a hamburger and it's flaming up, uh those, you know, those those flames and that uh that charring of the meat, um, it's carcinogenic and now it's causing cancer, and uh right so for cigars to now have a better definition of what a premium cigar is, all you know, no additives, um, long leaf, pure, pure tobacco. Uh it will, I think it will start to help us in the future to separate us from something that's more manufactured and not by hand. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Right. And so I have one final question before we kind of move on to talk about United specifically that I'd love your thoughts on. Um, last week Kevin and I talked a little bit about CAA released the Q126 import numbers, and Honduras has uh passed the Dominican for the first time. So I'd love your thoughts on if that surprises you at all and uh if you think it means anything for the industry. Um yeah, are there are there surprises anymore? Yeah, yeah. Um because uh yeah, I mean I've been in it long enough where I remember, you know, Mexican tobacco was looked down upon, Nicaraguan cigars were looked down upon. Uh you know, our as cigar smokers, our palates develop differently. Um and we start looking for for new new things. And if if there was a smaller market before, um then that by nature, by human nature, we just kind of search for it's because it's something you don't have, I want it. So and I look, Honduras puts out some great, um, some great products. Yeah. Um, you know, we're fortunate enough to have our abuelo with uh with Jerry. Um but you have the the Aurora family that you know is uh has done some great great things out uh uh you know out there for for a long time. And um, you know, we make our Lagiana uh in Honduras, and yeah, um there's just some some great quality products coming out of Honduras. So it just it takes time to build, right? Just like Nicaragua took a little bit of time to build, but then Nicaragua became uh you know a dominant force, and Honduras was uh you know just right behind. Uh it just needed a little bit of time. So do you think Honduras will stay ahead of DR, or do you think there'll be a back and forth shift to any thought? And again, uh if you don't care to say, we don't get that. We're because like you said, a lot of the rebels out there, those who watch the podcast, the consumers, they think of PCA as kind of the Disney World, you know, but really it's all business. I mean, it's for you guys, it is an exhausting seven days, right? I mean, it you get you can sit back and say it was fun, but that was after the work, right? Um you know, for um maybe the retailers that are there, it's a little bit more Disneyland-ish. Yeah. Um, it's a lot of walking for you guys. So I guess it's like Disneyland to walk, right? Exactly. Yeah, but then when you talk about this, about these imports and these legal battles, like you said, are there surprises anymore? It's sometimes tough in your place to say what you think it means. You know, like uh Jonathan Carney, we talked to him at PCA and did a quick interview with him. And you know, his comment was, I think this is really great maturing for the industry. You know, like we really feel like this is good. We weren't talking about the Honduras numbers because that hadn't happened yet. But when we look at that, it feels like all of these steps, including the tariffs, to be honest, and how cigars were kind of dealt with during the tariffs, how it feels as a whole that several decades in the cigar industry is maturing to standalone outside of and away from tobacco. Right. And I think that's a good thing for the industry. Yeah, I think it's definitely for yeah, for our industry because in in the to you know in the tobacco category, we're such a small portion of it. Absolutely, right? So I understand the general sweeping, let's throw a blanket on this. Um, but when you really start to to break it apart, um cigars are very different. It's like ground beef, it's beef, but it's very different from a porter house, right? And then a different, you know, different grade. So I think it's um no, I think it it's a it's positive. We have to, you know, um, there's a lot to battle. Um, you know, I Dave does a lot um here in New in New Hampshire um with the CNAH um organization here. Um they you know they they do a lot with some some of the local local retailers, but um I think overall it uh you know you you you have to growth is never easy or comfortable. Yeah right. So we're going through some growth and it's it's uncomfortable at times. But uh, but in the end, uh I think we'll we'll come out ahead. Yeah, and I've said I think Honduran Tobacco is finally getting the respect that it deserves um for the year. Of work that's happening there in the industry factories that are there that have been producing great cigars for years. Um, it's like I said, it's kind of like when Mexican tobacco became San Andrea, suddenly there was a different level of respect. Yes. I have like Honduras surpassing Dominican is that same tipping point that we'll see in the industry. And I don't know what it'll mean long term, our factory that we own is it in the Dominican. So we want that to keep going. Uh, but there's a lot of interesting things happening. You look new factories opening there, and so it's just uh was curious if you had a take on what you thought it might mean or not mean. So this has been very helpful. I appreciate that. Yeah, no, no, yeah, I think I like Dominican's still still still very strong. It's not that it's going right south, um, but the new or what's different and and where is it easier to to get something produced and Honduras just kind of I think turn that um turn that corner. But uh yeah, I think Dominicans are competitive enough um that uh you know they'll they'll figure out a way to come back ahead. Yeah, plus with you know, Gold Star and Red Anchor are made into Dominican, so it might just start changing some numbers. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 100%. So that's awesome. That's a great insight. Um, I want to kind of refocus back to the United brand. I think you had a couple of yeah, so kind of kicking off. I want to jump to Montosa here in a second, but um, you've mentioned the eight dollar United line. Um, so United is the United Cigar Group or distributor group, um, but you have the United brand of cigars. Um fantastic and I texted about it maybe a week or so ago about the value that's there and the quality. Um, can you tell us about those three wrappers and kind of what that means to your portfolio? Yeah, so um United Cigars, you know, as I mentioned, started in 1911, but they didn't have a brand. And when um when United Cigars started back up in 2009, uh the the brand came out with a um Maduro and a Sundrum and natural and it was box pressed. And we used Brazilian Matafina um in the in the filler, and that just became harder to source, and um maybe it was gaining you know gaining some popularity, so you know we didn't have as much access to it. The United line was was growing a little bit, and we had done some some projects with um turning a round cigar into a box breast, and those were our our cigar bars. Yeah, so then going down to the Dominican, working on different uh different blends to get away from the Brazilian Madafina, um, and then doing a special event cigar. Um we made a uh a Lancero Maduro that was an event only United, but which is spectacular, by the way. We had the pleasure of smoking that with you when you were at Stories. Yeah, thank you. So that was that just I wanted something a little more robust and something for for events, but I was able to try some Dominican broadleaf that um I thought was was fantastic, not you know robust enough, but not overpowering. Yeah, and um, and so that started to turn into the new United blends, and it's a you know, it's a regular Pareo, not not box pressed, and um the natural progression of you know in the industry is uh and it should almost be started with is the Connecticut. Yeah, we didn't have a Connecticut in the in the portfolio, so we rolled in uh the Connecticut and launched that just uh just a couple of years ago, and um so we have now the Ecuadorian Connecticut uh blend with the Dominican broadleaf uh in the filler, and we have the Sun Grown, which is also Ecuadorian, and the Mexican San Andres Maduro. Okay, so the three different three different blends. Yeah, and then the Robusto comes in at what seven, eight dollars. Yeah, seven, seven fifty, uh right around eight, yeah. Yeah, yeah. I mean, spectacular value in a cigar. Um I know uh you'd mentioned Cigar Authority earlier, they often throw out the McAuliffe effect. Yeah. Um and have joked that you guys were kind of doing it before they were. Yeah. Uh but but you know, Dave likes to give credit. Yeah, and yeah, and the United So the United two years ago, we actually lowered the price, and it was it was just before the it was just before the tariffs, yeah, too. Um, so maybe maybe some good timing, but uh we had um yeah, you're you're always looking at the the packaging. So you know we had talked earlier about what makes a cigar a higher price point, and and for us, we were trying to keep that as a valued cigar because that's our flagship brand, that's the name of the company. So um renegotiated and and brought the packaging in-house to the the factory, and that saved us um a few dollars, and we just rolled that you know over to the to the consumer and and let them that let them save. So we try to keep that yeah under under 10 as much as possible. Yeah, also there's so many cigars across Shell's portfolio. Um, and we're getting a little bit long on time. We want to honor your time. Um, I know Mel probably wants to ask about upcoming projects here in a moment, maybe the Firecracker. Um, but let's talk briefly about Montosa, Nacho Maduro, um, Lagiana Gorofalo, maybe one of those that you want to choose, one of those and kind of highlight. Those all sell really well at our lounge. Um, we know other lounges that do really well with them. Wasn't sure if there's one that makes sense to highlight the most, just since we're running a little long on top. Yeah. So yeah, so to keep it uh brief, I guess uh the Montosa and Terra Nova, which comes out of the Arnold Andre factory. Um, because Arnold Andre is a 200-year-old uh German company. They opened up a factory in the Dominican Republic in 2010 and started to lend premium cigars for their European market. Um they had approached us to do distribution uh for their lines, and we've introduced two of their lines uh so far. The, as I mentioned, the Montosa Natural and Maduro, and then the Terra Nova Arparique and Dark Fired Kentucky. Um the the lines are fantastic. The the Montosa is very budget friendly, uh, but a beautiful Dominican. And then the Terra Nova is just an interesting blend. The Ar Parik is the Brazilian tobacco, and the dark-fired Kentucky is a very subtle, smoky cigar. So um Arnold Andres a fantastic uh partner with us. Uh they were um added to Pro Cigar a couple years ago, and I wanted to bring them up too because we just partnered with them to do our Firecracker Independence Day uh for the 250th anniversary. So this is an interesting page packaging as well. It's a collectible uh pack. So we have the 250th uh sleeve that just comes off, but you'll you can see that it has home of the brave on one side, land of the free is printed upside down, but that's the the reason for that is because this becomes an ashtray. Yeah, yes, sir. When you're traveling, I don't know. Oh yeah, yeah, good thinking. So yeah, land Z, land of the free that becomes a little ashtray. And uh these are 12 count 12 count tints. So this is the Independence Day firecracker that uh we'll start shipping out to to retailers June 8th, just in time for uh for St. Patrick or St. Patrick for uh for the uh 4th of July for Independence Day. So uh yeah, it has the obviously the the three and a half by 50 uh Vitola with the the fuse at the end to make it the firecracker. So uh great way to celebrate 250 years with the Independence Uh Day Firecracker from Arnold Audrey. And that band is really nice, the color composition on it with kind of that nice silver and then the blue and the red. Yeah, a little little industrial, right? Yeah, um with the the embossed uh stars um on there and independence uh firecracker with a United um logo on the back. So yeah, it's a beautiful spectacular, yeah. Beautiful cigar, Mexican uh Habano wrapper. Uh you have you have Dominican and Nicaraguan Lijeros uh inside. So it's it it packs a nice little nice little punch. Yeah, yeah. I love that it doubles as an ashtray too. That's so anywhere you are if you thought that would be. I hope we'll see this on on shelves. You know, people love to collect and and hoard a little bit, but uh you know, it's just one of those one of those tins that I think will stand the stand the test of time. Yeah, absolutely. I think it's one of those projects that's beautifully done. Um yeah, I just I could go on. Yeah, very, very well done. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. I feel like we could go on and on, way past even our whatever our normal time is, just to just to talk about all of it. Because you just like you said, the cigar, you know, geek or just wanting all wanting to talk. I talk cigars all day, and some days I do. Yeah, I'm sure you do as well. Yeah, yeah. Well, when you yeah, when you love something like that and you can just sit down and and have a conversation, it's nice. So um before we wrap up today, uh, and really appreciate you being on with us. Such an honor and humble that you took time out of your busy schedule. But are there any other projects that you guys have going on or working on that you're excited about that you can talk about? I know there's probably some you can't talk about because that's always the case. Yeah. But is there any that something coming? Because I know there's this firecracker, there's another one coming, but any other kind of things like that that you know that United's gonna be looking at later this year? Yeah, so we have the the Bandolero Firecracker, which will be the second uh edition uh that'll come out in the fall. Um, you know, we we shared at the show, but we're we're now, I think as I mentioned right before, um, we just got notice that the uh deluxe edition uh collector set uh from Selected Tobacco is coming out. So that's one of each of his lines in the tube with a collector's ashtray inside, plus the uh Adam A Black Delirios in the travel humidor will all be shipping next week as well. So that's amazing. There's a lot, yeah, a lot of shipping out shipping out next week. Yeah, we put an order in for the PCA. We're not we don't get the black just because of our volume and in size we are, but we did get the collectors and really excited about that. It's beautiful for those rebels out there. Uh you need to keep an eye out for that. Ask your local tobacconist about getting it. If for some reason they do not carry it, you can always get it at Two Guys Um Cigars website. Yeah, but uh beautiful packaging. Um, we saw lots of cool stuff at PCA this year, a lot of people trying to do some new unique packaging. Um, but we walked away from that, just blown away about how well of course it's Nelson Alfonso. Was it gonna be anything less than Spectable? Right, right, right. He yeah, he always surprises us. Um, we'll we'll get uh an email with a rendering of something that he's planning on in the future, and and that's where we have the discussion of um you know what can work, what may not work, what we should tweak to, and then he'll he'll redesign it. But when he sends it to us, it looks as if he he took a picture from from his desk of something that's already created, but uh he's able to put things together and his his mind, the way it works artistically is unbelievable. Uh so we're we're we're thrilled to have that partnership uh between uh the two of us, um, you know, with with United Cigars. And um, yeah, outside of that, uh Gold Star and Red Anchor have been doing very well. So we have some you know working on a couple things there for some extension. So uh there'll be some some new things coming out, uh maybe not at the end of this year, but definitely by next year. Awesome. Yeah, and I'm sad we didn't get a chance to talk about Gold Star just because that's you know that first came out as a limited edition, did really well. When y'all came back out with it, um the limited edition was good, but when it came back out into the core line, a little bit different, new blend, if I understand correctly, it's fantastic. Yeah, thank you. So yeah, um I wouldn't have been nearly as excited if you're like, hey, we just extended the limited edition. Not that it was bad, it was a one-time project, and then y'all came back and made it better in that. Like I said, I smoke a lot of it. Yeah, I remember it's the first time we had that the gold star. Um, it was at PCA, and our my expectations were very they weren't high or low, they were just regular, and I feel like that's the best, sometimes the best expectations to have, and it really did blow me away. I mean, I was like, oh, this was I mean, really good, really, really great. Yeah, we we were like we may order a box or two because Agnes had been telling us about it, and I think we ordered 20. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So and they sold pretty quickly. I mean, we're we're on probably turn four or five. And again, we're as you know, we're not a huge shop there in Lufkin, um, but we've been on multiple turns of Gold Star just because it it sells well, right? But you have a dedicated like we did, you know, we did the event, you have a beautiful back uh lounge area, and everyone's just you know hungry for for more knowledge and and but they're very educated on on cigars, and you guys have done a great job kind of cultivating that that crowd. And um, so uh yeah. So I want to hit two more questions, and Mel, I I was trying to think through. I hope Mel asked this question because it's not on our notes, but uh so two quick questions before we wrap up, Oliver. One is for those rebels that are out there that are watching us, and we have between 500 and 2,000 views in a given episode, so we're not huge, but not tiny either. Right, right. Um, what do you want them to know about United Cigars if you're gonna be talking directly to the consumer? What's the one thing you would want them to hear about what y'all are trying to accomplish? So just in the name itself, we always like to say, you know, we're living united. Um and because the you know, smoking a cigar, we sometimes overcomplicate that um that experience. And it's really just kind of going back on thinking, well, what got you into the industry? Why you're not in the industry, what got you into cigars? Like why did you sit down originally? And um, it's great to dig deeper and find out the wrapper, filler, binder, where it came from, this, but then sometimes that that can complicate um things because then we look at it and you smoke something and say, Well, I didn't like the you know, say on United, I didn't like the Dominican broadleaf. I'm not gonna smoke another cigar that has Dominican broadleaf, but it might not be that component, or or maybe it just wasn't used properly in a certain way. So um, you know, it's a it's a beautiful experience to to walk into humidor and start from the left and and go to the right uh and try, you know, try everything. But um, I guess I guess the one you know you know message out there is um you know you're by by smoking our lines, um you're you're supporting something that means something to to the our families. Yeah. We're you know we're we're all in this and uh you know we're we're small and uh growing, but uh you know, just being being true to our word, uh enjoying the culture. Yeah, that's great. Awesome. And so from the standpoint of if retailers or loungers want to get a hold of you, what's the best way to get in contact? So on social media, we're at United Cigars, and um that would be the the quickest way. Our website is unitedcigargroup.com. And um, in fact, on on the website, you can click uh to become a retailer, and that'll just start the start the process. But um, yeah, everyone out there, we have a Discord uh group now that uh we just started up. So if you want to come in and chat, we're on uh um we're at uh it's it's UC 1901, uh right, going back to when United Cigars started. But we're yeah, United Cigars on on Discord, so they can come in and uh and chat, ask questions and do whatever. So if you're a retailer and watching this, which I know we have a few of you guys out there, we've gotten some comments. Um, this is a cigar line that if you do not carry, you want to bring in uh everything from that value six to nine dollar that you can hand off to anybody walking in. Um at the lounge Mel and I own, we put new smokers on Montosa all the time. It is the right price point. And then you have those guys that come in there looking for a Padron or a David Off. And I'm telling you that Nelson Line, the Bandolero Premium, the Atabay, the Byron, dollar for dollar competes with those all day long, and you're gonna get repeat buyers. So just as we're not saying it because Oliver's with us, when we talk to new shops that reach out to us and ask questions, we share our line because we have a cigar line, so you got to talk about that. And then the next one we reference is you need to talk to United. Wow, thank you so much. Because we do truly believe in what you guys are doing. Um, it helps that I think you and the guys in y'all's group believe in us, yeah, and that's what good partners do, right? How do we do things? I mean, we're a 30,000 member city or population city. And uh Oliver came and did a special night with us. We actually, you probably don't remember this because you do there's one of you and hundreds of us, right? But when you came to Lufkin, was we were launching the United Connecticut. Yeah, oh that was the that was the launch. That was the launch for us as we were gonna bring that out, and you came out to do that. Wow, um, and so that was kind of one of those cool opportunities. Um, yeah, they'll do that, they'll come out, they'll be with you. And I think people don't realize how big Texas is. Yeah, that is true. Because a lot of people here, like you can you can cross all of Massachusetts in three hours. Yeah, you were just saying from uh Lufkin to Dallas is three hours, and you're you're nowhere close to even crossing Dallas. So some people uh are crossing Texas, some people here or that I I talked to, like, oh I'm going out to Texas, I'm so excited. I'm like, what part? Yeah, because it's not, it's it's just not one state. Yeah, yeah, that's it's massive. Yeah, I always laugh. You'd mentioned, like, oh, it's only an hour and a half away, you know, from where you're at. And I think in a normal state, people will not make that journey because it's an hour and a half, right? Right in Texas, it's like, oh my gosh, it's only an hour and a half. Right. We we have we have good friends that make an hour and a half to our trip to go to a good restaurant, yeah, right. Yeah, because yeah, uh, so we're an hour and a half north of the Houston metro area, uh, two hours, two and a half into Houston proper. But people do a lot of Friday night date nights in the Houston area from Lufkin because it's just you go down there, make a little bit of an evening of it. Uh, but it's because we're so used to our next door neighbor uh works in Houston. So he makes that commute. And so he's a firefighter, so he's uh 48 on, 48 off. Right. So he drives down, does the 48 there, but he's like, I get to live in the neighborhood that most people go to vacation. Right. Because we're at the middle of the national forest and you know, or see YouTube videos of or you see it in a books. It's just right. Yeah, yeah, it's exactly awesome. Well, we're gonna wrap up here with this time. Oliver, thank you again so much for being with us. Thank you. I agree. I mean, every time I think we have the opportunity to spend a little bit of time with you and uh the team over the last couple of years. I mean, you guys have a lot of wisdom, knowledge in the industry. And so, I mean, I'm excited about everything you guys are doing. And again, like Kevin said, I appreciate in Woober. So it was so awesome that you were available and were willing to sit with us for a little bit today. I think the last thing I'll say in okay, this is not a negative to anybody in the industry. Everybody's great in this industry, it's a lot smaller than people realize. Um, we've gotten to know quite a few people. Um, some of those have been connection through you guys, others, um, but the grace and the kindness that you and your whole team bring is very different. And again, from a retailer perspective, um, that's why you've got to work with these guys. Thank you. Um, it's just different. And it's not that it's a business and everybody has to be making money, everybody has to be making sure they can take care of the people they're responsible for. But you guys take that a step further. As you mentioned earlier, it wasn't just about the price of the cigar, it was about how do we do this? How do we do it right? How do we set the right foundation? And if I was going to define United Cigars in any way, it really is grace and kindness. Oh, thank you. Thank you. It's I I I and when it was just you know, it was just myself, but you know, obviously, you know, Dave's the owner. But um when when I would come back for a trip or we would talk, it was always the money, the money will come. Obviously, we're focused on sales because you know, in any business, but the money will come, build the relationships, be honest, uh, have some integrity in what you do, and everything else will will grow from from there. And um, and that's translated down to to Agnes as well and the entire team. And um, I don't I don't I don't know how other uh you know manufacturers work when you're calling them, but um, yeah, we try not to to make it cold by any means. We like to have the conversations and um it's a very personal industry and a very personal pastime. Yeah, so we want that to translate on our side of the business too, even though it's a business transaction. Yeah, but you know, we like it to be personal. Well, thank you again. Thank you. No, thank you both. Love that you guys made the trip.