Smart Freight Conversations
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Smart Freight Conversations
Episode 33 | Fueling the Future – Airbus on Scaling Sustainable Aviation Fuel and Book and Claim
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Scaling SAF takes more than one company at the table.
In the latest episode of Smart Freight Conversations, Andy Golding, Director Strategic Services at SFC, sits down with Cécile Calvet Fabre and Andrea Caderon, SAF Program Managers at Airbus, to talk about what it takes to turn aircraft manufacturer ambition into real CO2 emissions reductions across air transport.
Key highlights:
- Airbus has committed to reducing its Scope 3 CO2 emissions by 46% by 2035, and Scope 1&2 emissions by 63% by 2030.
- SAF can reduce carbon emissions by up to 80% over its lifecycle, but currently makes up less than 1% of the global jet fuel mix actual production.
- The Airbus Book and Claim Demonstrator is helping the industry learn by doing in developing the voluntary SAF certificates market
- Regulatory recognition of book and claim could be a powerful lever to unlock voluntary SAF demand.
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Hello and welcome to another episode of Smart Freight Conversations, where we share interesting and important updates on freight decarbonization and the drive towards a zero emissions logistics industry. I'm Andy Golding, Director of Strategic Services here at Smart Freight Center, or SFC, as you'll hear us call it, and I'll be your host for today. This is a very exciting episode because today we're talking about something adjacent and as important to our normal subject matter. Today we're exploring how collaboration between fuel producers and airlines is helping to scale sustainable aviation fuel and what it takes to turn these solutions into real emissions reductions across air freight. Whether you're working in aviation, fuel supply, or logistics, this conversation will offer practical perspectives on how partnerships, market demand, and collaboration are driving the adoption of lower emission solutions. Joining me for this conversation are Cecile Calver Fabre and Andrea Calderon, both of whom are staff program managers from Airbus. Cecile, Andrea, it is great to have you on the couch today. To start us off, Cecile, could you tell us a bit about Airbus, your role within the organization, and how Airbus is contributing to decarbonization within the broader aviation ecosystem?
SPEAKER_00Absolutely. First of all, thanks for having us. It's a pleasure to be here. So Airbus is a global aerospace pioneer. We are serving the commercial aircraft, helicopters, defense and space segments. We have a large number of products and services, meaning that we can address passengers, governments, and also freight sectors. Just to give you also a glimpse of sense of the size of AirDOS, we have uh factory lines for commercial aircraft located in the USA, Canada, Europe, and China. And in 2025, solely we successfully delivered 783 aircraft. Um, so huge company. Uh within this company, uh, sustainability is very visible and very strategic. We have a chief sustainability officer uh that reports to the CEO, the executive committee, and to board of directors. And uh Andrea and I, we are both uh in the sustainability organization working on the development of SAF and CDR for the aerospace sector. And uh part of the job is to establish uh global and national roadmaps on SAF, uh, knowledge sharing also on SAF and um yes, uh participating to um organizations like the Smart Freight Center. So we are very happy to be contributing to conversation on SAF ecosystem and SAF challenges in general. And uh we do recognize that uh the freight sector is the backbone of the economy, and uh at Airbus we provide fuel efficient aircraft and we we want to advocate for also SAF programs, uh SAF uh options uh available for freight actors, and that's also why uh we are here today.
SPEAKER_01Well, thank you both for being here. It's really interesting to have the aerospace manufacturer perspective joining this conversation because whilst the role that you play may not sit in the spotlight, it is actually critical to driving action, driving decarbonization. So, really important voices in the conversation. Andrea, coming to you, Airbus joined the Smart Freight Center and the clean air transport community at the beginning of 2026. What triggered your interest in joining and how does this connect to your broader decarbonization ambitions?
SPEAKER_00Thank you for the question, Indian. Very excited to be here, and thank you for the invite. Um, so joining the Smart Freight Center felt like uh the next logical step uh in our SAF roadmap. Uh, especially uh since you invited us uh in 2025 for Smart Freight Week. Uh, I was with our manager, Julien Manès, uh head of SAF and CDO development for Airbus, and he gave a presentation on our decarbonization roadmap with a focus on what it means for freighters. Um, and uh since then uh we continued our journey uh and we continued in our ambition to act as a catalyst, uh do our best to act as a catalyst on the SAF ecosystem. And we recognize that we cannot do this alone. And as Cecil uh just mentioned before, we are willing to partner uh with industry stakeholders uh to help our customers in their own decarbonization journey. And this covers airlines, passenger airlines, and freighters uh as well. And the the Smart Friend Center community is uh very relevant uh for us in addressing the specifics uh of the logistics sector. And what we are willing to explore uh with you guys uh is um how we can share uh the the burden or I would say the cost burden of SAF. We know that SAF is very expensive uh compared to conventional aviation fuel. And we would like to explore with you and the members of your community how we can share uh this cost, looking at book and claim, for instance, but potentially other mechanisms.
SPEAKER_01Fantastic. Thank you for sharing. And I do think that you you can play a really important role as a catalyst for action in this space, which um brings me, Cecile, to the next question around leadership motivation. Why? You know, um, beyond regulation, beyond compliance, beyond okay, we have a box to tick, let's do the thing. What motivates Airbus to take a leadership role in freight decarbonization? And you said that uh sustainability is a very big part of the business already. How do you integrate that into your day-to-day decision making across the organization?
SPEAKER_00So uh Airbus is a purpose-driven company, and the purpose is we pioneer a sustainable aerospace for a safe and united work. And behind these words, there are also uh commitments that we uh endorse and we support, uh, just like the IATA, AKO ATA commitment to uh reach net zero by 2050 for the aerospace industry. We are big supporters of such ambitions. Uh, and our CEO, uh Guillaume Forey, often says you cannot improve what you cannot measure. And with that in mind, uh, back in 2023, uh we took also uh the initiative to uh have some CO2 reduction targets validated by the SBTI on our scope one and two. And for instance, we are using SAF to reach uh partially these uh CO2 uh objectives. Uh but more uh crucially or more in a more challenging way, we also took some commitments on our scope three, meaning the use of our salt products, hence the fact that we are very uh active on uh decarbonization, uh of course through uh the fleet renewal, but uh also on SAF. And um we uh try to uh track progress on uh SBTI commitments through reporting to the board of directors, to the XCOM, but also incorporate sustainability in the products and services that we propose today. So sustainability is uh embedded in our products, services, in our reports, and it's uh a key element that our customers, our shareholders, and to be honest, from our employees it's a key expectation from all of these uh stakeholders.
SPEAKER_01It's it's so true that decarbonization, it's not just external pressure. We get a lot of internal pressure as well. This is important, especially to the younger people coming into the organization, coming into the working world. This matters. This is our future, this is our planet. Um, so making it a top-down priority, but also embedding it in the bottom-up ways of working in the organization is mission critical because also that's what drives action. You've spoken about your uh SBTI targets and the fact that this is a very serious commitment from Airbus. Uh, Andreas, a question to you around innovation, because to decarbonize, we may have to do some things differently and try some new things. So Airbus is investing heavily in next generation aircraft and technologies. Which innovations do you believe are going to have the biggest impact on reducing these aviation emissions over the next decades?
SPEAKER_00Um, so we know there are no single solutions to decarbonize. Um, however, as an aircraft uh OEM, our uh first and most impactful contribution comes from fleet renewal. Uh so I brought up some facts and figures about uh uh our products. Um so we know that replacing all aircraft with new uh generation aircraft uh is really what will help us uh decarbonize um and reduce the CO2 emissions. Um and our new A350 freighter uh actually is uh 40% more efficient uh than uh previous generation large freighters. Uh and uh it's the only new generation freighter that is already ready for the new IKO CO2 uh emission uh standard. Uh we are also pushing the the boundaries, uh I would say, uh looking at disruptive uh technologies, for instance, open fan engines uh and morphing wings. Um, so all of this is very exciting. Um, and looking further ahead, we are also investigating uh hydrogen-powered aircraft. Uh and for this, you can find plenty of resources uh on the airbus.com uh website. So I truly uh invite our speakers, uh our listeners, uh, sorry, to have a look at that. Uh I mean, I as an aviation enthusiast uh myself, uh I'm very proud uh of what we are doing. Um, but I mean it's only part of the picture. Um, and we're also looking at SAF because we believe that SAF and hydrogen uh actually are complementary, and that's why we are working on those two fronts. Um so we know that SAF is the most suitable solution to reduce CO2 uh uh emissions from the legacy the legacy fleet, the aircraft that are already flying today, uh, as SAF can reduce emissions by up to 80% uh on the lifecycle of emissions. Um we are strongly advocating for SAF deployment uh worldwide, um, onboarding our customers in using more and more SAF. Uh and on the technology side, we are also looking at how we can um, I would say, um reduce uh or delete the uh barrier that we have currently, which is the 50% blend limit that we currently have. And on top of this, as I as I mentioned, we are also looking very closely uh at hydrogen supporting the market, the ecosystem. Uh and once uh this technology will be mature and the ecosystem that goes with it, we are aiming at uh putting on the market the first uh new uh uh hydrogen-powered aircraft uh to the market. So again, very, very exciting to be working on this.
SPEAKER_01Sounds like there are some really exciting things happening. Um, not just not only SAF, we've got way more efficient aircraft in development, hydrogen-powered aircrafts. Uh I look forward to seeing what the future looks like from Airbus. But you mentioned SAF and blend limits and the importance of SAF and that there's barriers that we need to break down. So um, Cecile, if we talk a bit more on renewable fuels in practice, how or maybe you can share a concrete example of how Airbus is collaborating with different airlines or fuel providers to really accelerate the use and the adoption of SAF and what makes these partnerships effective?
SPEAKER_00Great question. So um at Airbus, we have uh a unique possibility, unique position on the ecosystem that allows us to make partnerships with fuel suppliers, uh, airlines, uh, technology uh providers and so on. And it could be on innovation, 100% SAF, as uh Andra uh mentioned, but over more innovative uh format, let's say. And uh to answer to your questions, um I think one good example um is the fact that uh we use our own commitments on uh SBTI on the scope one uh to explore what it means for scope three, and I will illustrate on that. Um so uh we are using SAF in our own interman operations, as I mentioned earlier, to um uh comply with our SBTI commitments, but also we are using it as our own laboratory. So we walk the talk, and we are actually one of the biggest SAF users in the world in in terms of percentage, not in terms of volumes. Of course, the freight actors are very much uh aware of that. Uh, but yeah, we are starting to use uh we have been starting to use SAF in uh our Beluga uh aircraft, so uh the aircraft that it delivers uh parts of the aircraft to different sites uh since 2019, and then we have been using it also for uh uh flight tests, uh um delivery of aircraft for our customers, and also uh for internal shuttles operating uh between Airbus sites. So uh we use it to comply with our SBTI commitments on scope one, but we are also exploring what it means for our scope three, uh part six on business travels, and we are partnering with um uh airlines like uh EAG, uh Air France, EasyJet, uh Vizère, Luftanza. I hope I'm not forgetting anyone. Uh but we are also uh have partnership with such companies to explore how our own business travel, uh the business travel from Airbus employees can support uh and send demand signals to these airlines and support a voluntary uh self-demand as well. And explore also what it means in terms of um uh claiming on our scope free. Um, all of these aspects is something that we can further explore uh because we have partnerships with this type of uh actors, and uh that's part also of uh one success story we believe uh use our own operations and our own demand as a laboratory and learn by doing experience. Um we are facing the same questions that any actors might face when come to buy SAF. So, what is the right price? What is the offer I can find in a given country? What chain of custody am I choosing? Uh, do I need to get certified and so on and so forth. So we were really on a journey on SAF since a few years. Uh, we gained some maturity and knowledge, eager to share it also with the uh Smart Freight Center community. And it's really a learning by doing experience for us.
SPEAKER_01Allah also really appreciate and respect that you are in the arena with the rest of us. You know, you said you are you walk the talk, you practice what you preach. You're you're not just saying this is what should be done, you're saying this is what we know needs to be done and this is how we're doing it, and we're navigating this complexity with it with all the rest of you, because we know that decarbonization, SAF, book and claim, all of these are developing stories, and we can't wait until we've figured it out to take action. We have to take action whilst we're figuring it out and whilst we're resolving these things as well. On the subject of book and claim, Andrea, coming to you, SAF and book and claim work hand in hand. There is a lot of complementarity between them because SAF is not always physically available where it is needed. So, what is Airbus's perspective on book and claim systems as a way to scale the SAF adoption, remove these barriers that we've been talking about, and what needs to be in place to really ensure credibility and trust?
SPEAKER_00Um, here again, I think book and claim is a great example on of how learning by doing is the way to go. Um, we started to look at book and claim a couple of years ago, um, and now we are looking at um and we are developing a solution called the Airbus Book and Claim Demonstrator, uh collaborating with several uh stakeholders and customers. Uh, and this is the opportunity for us to understand what is book and claim, understand what it means to uh uh purchase uh environmental attributes of SAF and have someone else using the fuel itself, uh, looking at how a book and claim registry works, uh, and then how we can help our customers in using this solution uh and uh creating value from using book and claim. Um so it's been a long and very useful journey for us uh on SAF. Uh what we are currently advocating for today is uh more regulatory recognition because we believe that book and claim, when recognized, will be a very powerful tool to upscale the market. So we need more clarity uh from the regulators on this point. Um we also need to work uh under uh common uh practices and uh um a common methodology principles uh and that's where the Smart Fred Center and the Book and Claim community uh is very relevant here for us. So we are looking forward to collaborating with you on those aspects as well. So yeah, we need more uh regulatory and clear regulatory uh frameworks. We need uh clear recognition in the accounting standards, uh, so recognition from SBTI uh again here would be uh very significant. Um and uh yeah, I would say that that's it. So looking forward to continuing in learning by doing uh on this aspect as well.
SPEAKER_01Fantastic. And I I agree, and I think the the book and claim community exists to help on you know how do we get this clarity around these common principles that we can work on. In order for book and claim to really unlock its true potential and its true power, we need that common ground, we need that alignment, we need this more structure in the system. But as we started with, it's a developing story, so we're figuring it out, we're learning by doing, as is in Airbus's nature nonetheless. So we're just rolling with it as we go. Um, what about scaling SAF? So we've spoken about removing the barriers. How do we do that? How firstly, what do you see as some of the biggest barriers to scaling SAF adoption globally? And what needs to change across production, across infrastructure, and what do we need to shift in order to really unlock demand and the full potential of SAF? And I'm gonna leave that as an open question, whichever of you wants to jump in, and maybe both of you want to.
SPEAKER_00So I think both of us will try answer to that lovely but complex question. Uh so um basically uh we believe that we should uh look at the staff challenges from three different perspectives so supply, demand, and regulation. When it comes to supply, the interesting uh observation that we have is that from a purely uh supply capacity point of view, it looks like um there is already enough supply capacity and by 2035 to uh meet uh SAF uh demand. Uh uh if we are uh talking about uh SAF capacity again, uh that's what we observe uh when we look at um EKO, IATA, Sky Energy um um um data modeling. Uh behind that means that uh a lot of projects. Are not reaching FID at some point, probably due to lack of uh demand or of tech signals. And also some um have the capacity to produce both renewable diesel and SAF. And when there is not enough SAF demand signals, they choose to produce more renewable diesel. So um it's safer for their bottom line, it's safer for their profit and loss, uh but it leads aviation on the runway. And that's where stimulating demand uh comes into the picture. Um and we need to keep in mind that uh fuel represents roughly 30% uh of an air operator operating cost. So when we acknowledge that SAF is three to five times more expensive than conventional aviation fuel, um and even uh 11 times more expensive when we look at um ESAF, for instance, um the price of TAF is for sure uh an obstacle. Um linked to this, uh if we look at figures again, uh we see that demand uh currently represents less than 1% of the global uh jet fuel mix. Uh so there is a lot to do uh to stimulate this demand for SAF. Yeah, and maybe for the 99%, if we want to dream, uh, we do need some strong regulation signals. Uh and we believe that AKO has a strong role to roll uh to play on that, uh basically like AKO is doing for aviation safety. Uh at Airbus, we support the AKO uh CAF3 targets to uh reduce the CO2 uh uh footprint of international uh flights uh by 5% by 2030. We need this type of commitments, this type of strong uh regulatory demand signals to um to meet the societal expectations to decarbonize also uh aviation. And it would take a great deal of effort to align, to implement uh the right combination of policies, of incentives uh at global and local levels. Um, so again, an exciting pass uh for us, I would say. We need to uh have uh the right conditions for the market to scale up, uh, looking at demand, supply uh, and policy all together, acknowledging that what might work in one country or one region of the world might not work in another. Um, so that's what we are also looking at uh and willing to collaborate with the regulators, the air operators, and the suppliers on those fronts.
SPEAKER_01And I think that's a lot of where the magic of Smart Freight Center comes in, actually, because Smart Freight Center is one of the few organizations that can convene the shippers, the carriers, the logistics service providers, the OEMs, the policymakers, the financial institutions, and bring all of the right necessary voices to the table to have a conversation about okay, in order for this to move forward, we all need to be working together. How do we take those steps forward? How do we drive the policy that's required? How do we trigger and stimulate market demand? How do we create availability? How do we manage uh the non-physical supply chain? All of those moving parts coming together to shift gears slightly because we're also talking from a perspective of we are taking action, we're already moving on this, we're already doing the thing. But before people can start to do the work, we have to do some educating and some capacity building. And in order to really unlock decarbonization, we need to teach people why does this matter? What are we talking about? Book and claim is a complex subject in itself. Any a lot of the decarbonization subjects are tricky and complex. So, Cecile, what do you think the role of training and education are in this decarbonization journey, not just within Airbus, but within the fields, the logistics field as a whole?
SPEAKER_00So at Airbus, first of all, we uh build um um digital uh knowledge center platform uh that gathers um market trends and also educational awareness materials uh available for all Airbus employees, but for sure we also target some critical functions in the company, uh the ones that are buying SAF, for instance for Obiluga's, uh um uh colleagues that may face questions from customers as well, and um yeah, fuel fuel uh procurement, uh um every type of functions that are facing SAF producers or questions from the customers. So we have materials, awareness materials, some basic and more specific ones for a dedicated topic like book and claim or channeling custody in general. And we have market trends uh that are following uh gathering intelligence data on SAF uh production projects, uh, SAF demand from airlines, SAF regulations, and so on and so forth. That gives us an overview of what are the market trends in a given uh country or region, uh identify opportunity and risk, and so on and so forth. And of course, there is uh uh plenty of opportunities to uh gather uh uh intelligence and also share intelligence in organizations like the Smart Fred Center and for the various memberships that we have and partnerships that we have with the RSB, the IECC, Iata. Uh so we have some knowledge internally, but we are eager to share it with our customers, with our partners also uh uh in the ecosystem. Fantastic.
SPEAKER_01Thank you, ladies. As we wrap this episode, a lightning round, one-sentence question that I have for each of you. Okay. You're clearly both passionate about the subject. You've dedicated your careers to SAF, to scaling SAF, which means you've dedicated your careers to decarbonisation. What is the one thing that you are most excited about over the next one to three years in decarbonization, in SAF, in anything in that field? What's the one thing that you're most excited about?
SPEAKER_00I mentioned that I was an aviation enthusiast uh and growing on this uh job at Airbus, uh, I also progressively uh became a SAF enthusiast, uh, and I would even say book and claim enthusiast. So, from a personal perspective, uh I'm very excited and curious uh to see where uh the regulation evolutions will lead us. Um I'm very uh optimistic that book and claim will be recognized. Um and hopefully this will help the industry reach its ambitions um because again, book and claim is a key uh lever to upscale the voluntary demand for SAF. And uh personally, the topic that I find most is interesting, um and I hear it at the Smart Fate Week 2026 more and more, is uh beyond the CO2 benefit of SAF, there are plenty of other societal benefits around SAF on economic and uh and socioeconomic benefits on environment benefits. And I hear more and more the fact that uh SAF also allows to reduce our uh reliance on uh fossil fuel. And I find it super interesting to explore. I look forward to the conversation at the Smart Fred Center or any other platforms that explore all the socio-economic benefits of SAF, from reducing uh the reliance on uh fossil fuel, but over uh benefits like uh job creation, improvement of uh air quality, and so on and so forth. And I think it's a topic worth exploring more and more on SAF.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely, the submerged benefits of the submerged value, not necessarily the surface decarbonization level, but what else comes out of these efforts. Cecile, Andrea, thank you so much for joining me for this uh this episode. I've really enjoyed this conversation.
SPEAKER_00Thank you indeed. Thank you so much. Thank you for the invitation.
SPEAKER_01If you enjoyed this episode and you would like to learn more about decarbonization or decarbonization in aviation specifically, head to academy.smartfreightcenter.org where we'd have courses and free educational media resources that can really help you get started or accelerate your journey to decarbonization. If you've enjoyed this episode, if you found it interesting, and if you have a friend, a colleague, or a partner who you think could benefit from the listen, please share. Thank you for listening to this episode of Smart Freight Conversations. Until next time.