One Last Flight: The P-38 Legend Who Refused to Quit! Winged Victory Ep 36

Rob and Scott sit down with a very special guest with strong ties to the museum, Randy Royal and they talk about his dad, Frank Royal, and his heroics during the war in the South Pacific, his amazing tie to The National Museum of WWII Aviation and many things in between.  You are going to LOVE this story!!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:13

Hello everyone and welcome to Winged Victory with Rob and Scott, a podcast by the National Museum of World War II Aviation here in Colorado Springs, Colorado.

SPEAKER_05 0:23

Hello and welcome to another episode. I'm Scott Clares, and I'm here with my undeniable co-host, Rob Gale. I've been called first. Yes, you have. By me, even recently. Recently. Recently. So today we're with a very special guest. We got a gentleman here who's got a very strong tie to this museum. Um, well, I'll actually just kind of let him go through that. I won't really spoil anything for it, but you couldn't you could say his name. I will say his name. Okay. But it was it's it's an amazing story. It really has I don't know, brought this place. It just kind of gave this place a amazing story, and I just can't wait to get it from him. So no further ado, Mr. Randy Royal.

SPEAKER_02 1:07

Hey, I'm Randy, and uh it's honored to be here with you all. It's uh uh been a great connection to be tied to the museum and the Westpac and and uh um the impact that it had on our family as well, and particularly my dad was was great.

SPEAKER_05 1:23

So before we actually get to your dad, like when did when did you guys discover or start coming around here? I don't remember exactly when we were.

SPEAKER_02 1:29

So 2011, uh I was thinking about it this morning because my dad was 96. Yeah. And so sometime in 2011 is where we made the connection. And um the so I work for the fire department, I'm the fire chief here locally, and uh one of our inspectors who knew about my dad uh and uh was also a veteran, came by here and and talked to the mechanics and the guys working on the plane and went, huh, would it be alright if you know this guy came down here? So he taught told me about it, and I brought my dad down here and we were welcomed in and actually just on the other side of this wall, uh sat down on a table and uh Y33 rusty, covered in coral and coral and dirt and stuff was kind of sitting over there, but you could still see the the number on it, right? Yeah, and um and I might the mechanics stopped working, they came over and we were talking with him, and my dad's talking with them, and and he's looking at it and he's going like, you know what? I I think I might have flown that plane. And uh so that was that was the beginning, that was the connection, and and um from that day on, and it was it was uh uh we know that he flew that plane and and uh in um Australia and then over into New Guinea.

SPEAKER_05 2:46

And by that plane we're talking about White 33, the P thirty eight F model that came out of New Guinea. Yes that uh we restored here at Westpac.

SPEAKER_02 2:55

Right.

SPEAKER_05 2:55

And then uh who is your dad?

SPEAKER_02 2:57

So uh Frank Royal, he was uh uh at the time the with the connection to White 33, he was the squadron commander for the 39th Fighter Squadron in New Guinea. And um uh his squadron had a number of aces in it. In fact, at the time, and I I don't know if it stands today, but they had the most aces in any squadron in the in the Army Air Force, last Air Force. And um so he he flew with uh Buzz Wagner uh well Buzz Wagner's another story. Um he flew with uh uh Tommy Lynch and um Kirby. Uh maybe Kirby. Um who was the number one ace? I just lost Bong. Bong Bong. Uh flew with Bong there. And um so they so he was the squadron commander, he's 26 years old. He's the old guy, yeah. And the reason he's the squadron commander is all his pilots are 19, 20, 21 year olds, you know. And so uh he just had a little more experience and expertise than they did, but you know, you think about that nowadays, and that's you know it's that's kind of amazing, yeah, considering the talent that's coming out of there. So go ahead. Go ahead, I'm sorry. No, I was just gonna say, so he uh kind of the story behind the P-38s coming to the 39th, because they were the first in the Pacific to get them.

SPEAKER_05 4:20

So yeah, what were they flying before?

SPEAKER_02 4:22

P-39s. Uh P-39s. Which is this is a piece of. Yes. And um so uh they were flying the P-39s, which he told me were dogs against the uh Zeros and the other Japanese aircraft, they just were too armored and slow and not as good at high altitude and those type of things. And so uh they had about 50% losses. But the 50% losses were better than any other squadron in the Pacific, and so that's why they got the P-38s. So so but he's he said that's quite a win-o-wing.

SPEAKER_05 4:56

Yeah, yeah, but I mean early in the war like that, that was it was a survival right time. It wasn't hey, we were on the offensive, it was just we need to survive this. Yeah, absolutely. Like you said, with inferior equipment, but then comes in P-38s, right, and that totally changed the war.

SPEAKER_02 5:11

And he said they they shot in at one time, and I don't, you know, I'll say this as he shared it to me, but I don't know what the facts behind it. Uh he said over their next run they ended up shooting over a hundred enemy aircraft down and only lost four. So you go for 50. That's a great ratio. Yeah, 50% down to that ratio, and uh it was uh pretty amazing.

SPEAKER_05 5:32

What was really kind of cool about that whole transition is he goes over to Australia, right? And then you had to actually kind of watch the airplanes, which one of which was White 33, because it was one of the first four that showed up. Right. And then he had to like self-teach himself to fly.

SPEAKER_02 5:47

Well, he uh he actually had training in P-38s before he got over there. Oh, okay. So yeah, he and he he flew almost every fighter that was out there before going over to the Pacific and and actually was a test pilot and almost died in one. And I I think that was a P-47, but I'm not sure which one that was. But um so he knew how to uh fly the P-38s, and it was him and one other man uh there that knew how to fly 'em. So they were in New Guinea, they were flying the P-39s, they got the word that they're gonna get the P-38s, so they uh him and this other pilot went down to uh Brisbane where they shipped them in parts, and then they put them together, and then they flew all of them to make sure they were ready to go and uh uh roadworthy or airworthy and then good test pilot work. And then uh and then they trained the other uh uh 39th Fighter Squadron pilots in how to fly them.

SPEAKER_05 6:41

So he's already got all this experience going on, he's the older guy. So when did he actually enter the service?

SPEAKER_02 6:47

So uh I think it was 1939.

SPEAKER_05 6:49

Okay, so he was well before the war for us started.

SPEAKER_02 6:52

Yeah, yeah, and there was the the threat of war was there, right? And um he was a college student up in Boulder at University of Colorado. He was going to become a doctor. He was a starving uh college student because his his dad was a rancher farmer down in Rocky Ford, couldn't afford to pay for his college, so my dad was eking out what he could do, wasn't eating, and he said that one day he was he was in a lobby of one of the the uh buildings there, and he looked down and there was a little flyer sitting there and said, You too could be an Army Air Corps fighter fight or pilot, you know? And he went, Well, this would be better than starving to death. Yeah, they'd probably pick them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 7:33

Well, yeah, this has come right out of the depression, too. So I mean it was like a lot of people were starving. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 7:38

And so he hitchhiked from Boulder down to Fort Logan in Denver, and that's where he entered the the Army Air Corps. Uh what's interesting about that is that where that's where he inter is interred. So he there's uh uh veterans uh cemetery there now, and that's where he's at. Yeah, so he started his career there and ended it there. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 8:00

So then he goes on, like you said, he's he joins the service, he learns to fly airplanes, he becomes a test pilot. So he gets to pretty much fly everything.

SPEAKER_02 8:08

He did. He get he uh he flew before the war, he flew all the different um US aircraft fighters. Uh during the war, he actually flew a lot of the uh uh uh both Japanese and uh German knew it. Yeah, after he came back from uh the Pacific, uh they used him uh to test out the So would he consider himself a good pilot?

SPEAKER_05 8:30

Because a lot of these guys I know you know they're over there and they're like okay. Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_02 8:37

I think he he felt like he was a pretty good pilot. Uh he he actually wished he had uh been able to fly in combat longer, but again, being the older guy and and having experience with the squadron, he was pulled out uh after um a while and put into a higher command position.

SPEAKER_03 8:56

You need those guys to train and lead the the kids coming up. Right. Yeah and the fact that he survived that 50% automatically marked him as somebody that you want to learn from.

SPEAKER_05 9:09

I mean the fact that he was over there so early in the war and then flying something like a P-39 and able to survive that, right? I mean it was amazing, which I mean kind of brings us to this. This is what the only artifact that he actually brought back from the war, I believe.

SPEAKER_02 9:22

Yeah, as far as yeah, a hard artifact like that. He had a lot of things. So there's a pretty good story behind this. Absolutely. So let's hear it. Okay, so uh this uh July 4th of actually 1942. Um he we've got a picture of him and the other, there's probably five or six other pilots, including his uh wingman, which is a guy named Frank Angier. Um they took this picture because it was morning up July 4th, and um his statement was we were gonna go up and give the Japanese some good old American fireworks. Yep. So they jump in their planes, they take off from their base in New Guinea, and almost immediately when they're up in the air, this band of uh Japanese fighters came down because they had the same plan. Yeah, same plan and uh started uh shooting at them. And uh Angier's plane got shot pretty quickly and he he bailed out. And um so my dad, and at the time there was two or three Japanese um fighters that were actually trying to shoot Angier on his strings, on his parachute. Yeah, and there's um there's a picture of that, a hand-drawn picture, by another pilot who used to draw uh basically, I'd say cartoons, but they're drawings of certain uh battles that they had. Well, this one he has Angier coming down above the jungle, uh Japanese plane trying to shoot him, and then my dad's plane coming in from the side. And uh so my dad stayed after these uh these planes and trying to keep them off. Angier was crawling up and up and down on the screen. He'd crawl up and drop himself, drop himself, uh trying to dodge bullets. And um and my dad kept after it until he saw Angier get uh shoot get down to the jungle, and then that's when he took off because he he knew he had been shot shot up pretty pretty good.

SPEAKER_03 11:13

Well, and he's low level in a P39. That's a bad place to be with the Japanese.

SPEAKER_02 11:19

Right, right. Well, and well, the and it's kind of good news, bad news. He was shot up. He knew he need he needed to get out of there, and what he what he had told me is that if you got down to the treetops, you could outrun the zero.

SPEAKER_03 11:31

There you go. Yeah, okay. So that's such a bad thing.

SPEAKER_02 11:33

Yeah, so at high altitude, it was not a good place to be. Um he had taken, he knew he had taken a bunch of shots, and um one of them uh came came through his cockpit across his his coat but not his arm. And this is the one that went through here. This is one.

SPEAKER_05 11:49

Yeah, and it went out the front of the uh the uh windshield, the cockpit glass, and that was like a 20 millimeter cannon shot that didn't go off. It just went through and he didn't know.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 12:00

So that that had to be a heck of a vibrating.

SPEAKER_02 12:03

Well, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_05 12:04

I'm sure it was going off pretty bad.

SPEAKER_02 12:07

So um so he he knows he he shot up, but he's he's looking and his fuel gauge is shh going down like this, so he knows he's got a bullet through his his fuel tank. So he what he said is on that P-39 they had side doors rather than a slide-back canopy. He got down on top of the trees and he actually was starting to turn it over and it was just gonna fall out because he was too low to parachute out. Yeah. And um to fall out. He figured he'd had a better chance of surviving.

SPEAKER_03 12:37

Oh, geez, the little options. Your options are that is that is the bad approach, not good or bad.

SPEAKER_02 12:45

Yeah, it's one or the other. Well, and then he goes, Oh, crap. He forgot he had a in the midst of everything going on, he forgot he had another tank. He took the switch and the motor is actually sputtering when he hit the hit the the uh reserve tank and the engine caught and and kept going and he he took it there. Uh got made it back to his um his uh base. We have uh we had a letter, and um the mechanic that was there at the time, the head mechanic was a guy that was in his 50s, and he was the first guy to get to my dad as he rolled up. And he said uh that my dad looked like a man who had been to the very edge and come back. He said he was pale, he was shaken, and I couldn't even imagine. Said the uh the wing of the plane was about to fall off. There was um bullets to the hydraulics. There was between 60 and 80 bullet holes in this plane. Yeah. And uh, you know, the fuel tank.

SPEAKER_04 13:38

The prop.

SPEAKER_02 13:39

Yeah, at least one blade. Yeah. So that plane never flew again. Uh, there's a picture in the museum of him, my dad, actually looking at the plane, he can see some of the damage under the wing. So it never flew again, and to use it for parts. And at some point, you know, in 1943, they cut this off and presented it to him. And I'm guessing that's probably when he was uh leave the squadron, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:01

Um that's that's when you get all the cool stuff.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

Yeah, yeah. And so, and then Angier, um, he made it successfully uh uninjured into the jungle. Uh took him two weeks to get back to his base, but he survived. He actually got shot down another time and survived, so he was a pretty lucky guy. Um later, uh, probably in the 90s, um, at one of their reunions, the 39th Fighter Squad reunions, we brought both my dad and the other Frank together in one room, and they shared their story from each other's perspective. So Andrew, from being on the parachute watching my dad doing what he's doing, and you know, trying to make it, and my dad doing his.

SPEAKER_03 14:43

I hope somebody recorded that.

SPEAKER_02 14:44

You know, there's lots of pictures, and I don't know that we actually got verbal recording of it. Of course not, yeah. Yeah, but um so many of those. But yeah, but uh in that room there was about 40 folks, so both Frank's uh kids, grandkids, and some great great-grandkids.

SPEAKER_05 15:06

And none of them would have been a very good thing. Yeah, that would have changed. I mean that I mean so many different things could have happened that day that that entire room does just disappears.

SPEAKER_02 15:16

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_05 15:17

Yeah, that's that's amazing. Yeah, that is quite the story.

SPEAKER_02 15:20

It's pretty pretty cool. So he survived and and uh uh made it back.

SPEAKER_03 15:25

So it sounds like he stayed in the Air Force for a full career.

SPEAKER_02 15:29

He did, he he made a career out of it. Um he threw uh he uh flew um jets his whole whole career, uh, ended up in the Pentagon a couple times and and repentance. Yeah. And uh, you know, obviously was stationed all over the place, uh, but in Okinawa and Japan uh a couple different times and then uh uh yeah, made it 30 years in the in the Air Force.

SPEAKER_03 15:52

Well, and so you're a school kid on Okinawa taking this for show and tell. I never got anything that cool for show and tell.

SPEAKER_05 16:00

I did get to take my mom once, who was a firefighter actually. She let me wear my uh or wear her fire fan. And then she was taking an off turnout. I had chicken pox, so I hadn't gotten to go home, but that's good. That's my show and tell story.

SPEAKER_02 16:13

Yeah, we uh yeah, I used to, and I think of my other uh siblings uh times took that to show and tell, and then also some things that we my older brothers found in Okinawa that now would be get me thrown in jail. Uh so I used to take a I remember taking paper bag that had a submachine gun in it, uh a uh hand grenade, a mort mortar, a buoy trap, and then had a Japanese rifle. That wasn't in the bag, but I remember going through because uh uh North Carolina is one of my memories, and that's when I was in late stages of elementary school. Um, and uh there were a couple security guards there where all the kids would funnel through the fence to get off base to the school because it was right there.

SPEAKER_03 16:53

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 16:54

And here's my bag and it's starting to rip and there's stuff in there. And they they can come over and look at that and they go, It's this for your own tail. Oh, okay. Nowadays I'd be on my face, you know, with handcuffs behind the bag.

SPEAKER_03 17:05

I mean, the teacher would have to be behind as an old guy. I'm sure the teacher was just fine with my own. Yeah, they were passing around all the kids.

SPEAKER_02 17:14

It was a different era. It was a different era. And in the yeah, and obviously all the my classmates loved it. It was, you know, sure. Oh yeah. It was uh you were the coolest. Yeah, it was. It was a great, a great way to do show and tell. But uh yeah, today I would be uh I'd probably be in jail.

SPEAKER_03 17:28

So yeah, you'd you'd cause a lockdown for about a 40 mile radius. Right, absolutely.

SPEAKER_05 17:34

Uh so I guess we could fast forward, I guess, back to where we were we began when we first met. Um so you guys come into the museum and you see this wreck of an airplane and realize that, oh, you know, I I think I your dad flew that. Right. So I mean, what was that for him?

SPEAKER_02 17:50

I mean uh it it was a really neat, uh neat time. Um you know, as we started really verifying the history and and you know, everybody when he said that, everybody's like, you know, really? Yeah, and uh but once we made the connection and and it was verified, I mean it was and I remember every time I brought him in here, the mechanics would all stop what they were doing, just come over and talk to dad. Oh yeah, no, that was a big deal, yeah, about you know, his insights and stuff on it, and and uh we as a family believe it kept him alive. So uh because he at 96 he said, I'm gonna stay around to see this fly, you know, and so it gave him a purpose to keep on living.

SPEAKER_05 18:30

Well, and it gave us a purpose too, like, hey, let's get our get our butts and gear on this thing, and that was like the most complicated airplane we've ever built. Ever. And I think it'll be the most complicated we ever build. I mean, it's likely it was but it was an amazing time capsule. I mean, because it came right out of the ground, and we found so much stuff in that thing that was just right out of World War II and you know, off the assembly line writings, and it was really cool about that airplane is that all that stuff's back in it. You know, we found it, we documented it, I you know, traced paper over it and everything, and then put it right back in its spot after we restored it.

SPEAKER_02 19:05

So good.

SPEAKER_05 19:06

I mean, it just just to try to keep that, and I think part of that, you know, because a lot of that we weren't getting paid for, but it was just knowing that there was, you know, your dad was here to see it. You weren't you weren't getting paid monetarily, but you were getting rewarded. Man, I mean just because it was just it was just like that extra added, like you're already doing something really cool, but now you got a guy that actually flew that airplane who's like watching you, and like hey, we wanted we just wanted to make that thing uh you know as as perfect as we could for him.

SPEAKER_02 19:36

Well, it was such a blessing to us and our family, because it it really it really was a good deal. And he so we'd bring him out here regularly and and he'd get to see the progress. And then um when uh the day that it had its first flight, so Steve Hinton comes out to fly it, and um I remember my dad sitting out on the tarmac out here in a chair.

SPEAKER_05 19:57

And how old is he at this point?

SPEAKER_02 19:58

He's uh uh route a over a hundred, yeah, between a hundred and a hundred and one. Actually, I think he's a hundred and one at that point. Um we actually got him in the cockpit when he was a hundred. Yeah. That's a great photo. Yeah, it wasn't flying yet, but I can remember he him grabbing the controls and just you know looking all around. You can see the memories coming back and all that. So uh so he got in it at his 100, and 101 is when the test flight was, and he's sitting out there and Steve takes it up and flies around, does the things, and then he lands and he rolls right up in front of my dad. I mean, maybe 15, 20 feet away. He comes out, comes over to my dad and goes, Hey, when it did, you know, did it did it do this when you did that? I'm like, Oh yeah, if you do this and then you know that pilot. Yeah, it's two two little pilots, you know, two pilots there just you know, talking away, and and uh so that was great. And then shortly after there, I think a month or two after there is when it did its public showing.

SPEAKER_04 20:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:49

And during that time, uh you all set up uh an opportunity for my dad to be, and I was with him, but we were in a small plane and we flew above it. So we flew above White 33 and the bomber flying around collar springs, and it was such a cool view of it, and and uh my dad loved loved that. And then um about a month or so after that is when he passed away.

SPEAKER_05 21:09

So he he lived uh to see it, and he Yeah, I kind of remember I in, you know, this is my memory maybe, but he got off the airplane, and I mean he was walking and fully functional. I mean, the guy was sharp, yeah. And he just he just kind of had a smile on his face, but he looked around and he was like, Okay, I'm gonna go see my wife, you know.

SPEAKER_02 21:27

Yeah, yeah, exactly. That's what he is. So his my mom passed away a few years before him, and yeah, they had a great relationship. There's another side story to that I can share at some point. But um uh yeah, he he he had met his mission, you know, and and uh I don't know if shared this part with you, but but um I'm he had a him and my mom had a place over in center part of town, but they were on the eighth story facing Pike's Peak, right? And so um when you know he decided, okay, I'm not taking my meds anymore, I'm ready to go. And so it was a process, but we had his bed pointed where he could just look right out the windows, right at Pike's Peak. And I was standing there when he took his last breath. And so he takes his last breath. And they said bye. And I look out the window and there's a contrail shooting over the top of Pike's Peak. And I went, there he goes. There he goes. It was so cool. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:23

Yeah, that's amazing. That's great. I mean, just yeah, go ahead. Well, it's just because this airplane was an early model, when it was finally worn out, there weren't all that, all those parts in common with the later J's and stuff like that. So I is that one of the reasons she didn't just get torn apart for salvage?

SPEAKER_05 22:47

Yeah, it was definitely. I mean, of all the airplanes we pulled out of the out of New Guinea, that was definitely the most intact airplane. And it was never crashed either. So I mean it had a mid-air. Yeah, mid-air with a zero. That's a victory. Yeah. And they fixed that. They replaced the wing. We actually found writing on the inside of that. We think when they did that wing replacement, one of the guys with pencil, you know, wrote a little inscription in there, which is in the museum now. But uh it never had a, you know, like a lot of the Jandina that came out of there had a belly up. Yeah, you know, and so and it was a J model, so yeah, they scrapped a bunch of that stuff. But uh, no, it was definitely not the most intact airplane. But as you could tell from your story, you know, you guys came in at like 90, he was 95 and he was 101 before he got to see it fly. Yeah, yeah, you know, it was a long time, and we knew we were up against it, you know. Like we wanted to get the thing, but I mean, so you do that, you know, for your dad. And you know, and I mean I I can't even imagine, you know, maybe what he felt and what your family felt to get to be a part of all that and see uh part of history that a lot of people don't get to share with their their dads or grandparents that that were in the war, you know. I mean, they hear stories and it's a long, long, far, far away. This was actually you got you guys could actually come up and touch it.

SPEAKER_02 24:06

Yeah, it was it was so special and and just the opportunity to to be part of it, and and you're right, not just his kids, but the grandkids and the great grandkids. And um, you know, before um the last time we saw it, we we had I don't know, it was 25 or 30 of us from the family, you know, having a chance to really look at it up close and and have those memories. And and so it is a legacy, you know. Yeah, uh legacy project, and you know, the the all the all the folks that worked on it, including you, you know, well, you know, and I think it's just divine intervention at some point because I mean we were based out of out of Rialto, California when we started that project, right?

SPEAKER_05 24:46

You know, and if it wasn't for I don't know greed or whatever you want to call it that forced us to find a new home, and we tried to stay in California, but California being what it is wouldn't wouldn't allow it. Yep. And then the fact that you know we had a customer here that he was actually the owner of that airplane at the time, and we were building it for him, and we decided, you know, we had a we couldn't have gone anywhere in the country.

SPEAKER_03 25:09

Right.

SPEAKER_05 25:09

Anywhere. And we ended up right here.

SPEAKER_03 25:12

You were supposed to be here.

SPEAKER_05 25:13

Yeah, and you know, and that's just that was an affirmation that you'll you know, very rarely in life do you get a real solid affirmation that the decision you made was the right one, right? And that was it. I mean, that was like, okay, if every if everything else around here goes to poop, fine, but at least we had that. Yeah. Because that was one of the coolest defining moments of the I think of this company and for us personally.

SPEAKER_02 25:38

Well, it was such a such a great connection, and and uh man, we were just so thankful and and to have that extra time with our dad, you know, and knowing that he was he was very happy. And and like you said, he was I mean, I I think he could have probably lived another five or six years, yeah. Uh because he was still healthy, he was still you know, just taking care of himself and living.

SPEAKER_04 25:58

I guess it he walked on to the airplane and walked off the airplane, you know.

SPEAKER_05 26:02

I mean, we've gotten people into the airplane in their 80s where we had to use a bucklift or something, you know. I mean, yeah it's not an it's not an easy deal for for him to be that spry. And I I don't know, just I I think it's great to give somebody like that something to want to do. Like he I'm sure he wanted to come out here quite a bit and see the progress of it. Man, like you said, we loved it. I mean, every time that every time you guys brought him out, it was just like, okay, whatever's going on, just stop. We're gonna talk, and you know, and it was just fantastic.

SPEAKER_03 26:34

Well, we benefited too from the the things he brought. I mean, some of those photos over in the pavilion are are different.

SPEAKER_05 26:45

Well, that whole section for me personally is like my favorite section of the museum because it just well, and it's a personal connection that I actually have to it too.

SPEAKER_03 26:54

I love that photo of your dad on the phone. Yep, but you can tell he's a combat guy because he's his knife is inside the holster for his 45. It's just like that guy knows what he's doing. And it it's just a super photo.

SPEAKER_01 27:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:12

Um, and all that stuff adds so much to the disp to the display power of this museum. Yeah, it's great.

SPEAKER_02 27:21

So the one the one picture where he where the general's putting uh a medal on his uh chest is for this. Oh, really? Yeah. For that, well, saving his wingman. Yeah, don't quote me on this. I think it was a silver star, but whatever it was, it was tied to tied to this. That's silver star level. Yeah, okay. Yeah. I mean I think that's what it was.

SPEAKER_03 27:44

Yeah, yeah. That that one has not has not even been cheapened by time. That's great. But in those days, that's the kind of stuff people did to to earn those. Yeah, that's awesome. It's really, really something.

SPEAKER_05 28:00

So what kind of impact do you think that that had on your on your kids and your grandkids? Oh, they're so proud of it. I mean, is it something that they talk about even to this day? You know, so I mean it's it's now that's an amazing way to continue his legacy in their minds. Because it's you know, it's like my kids they never really got to hang out with my my grandparents, you know, and get the stories that they they had. And so for them, that's kind of lost a little bit because they never actually got to like really touch them. But for them to come out and see this part of history and that your dad, you know, is a part of.

SPEAKER_02 28:36

Yeah, yeah, it's it's been great. And my so my grandkids, so it would be my dad's great-grandkids, they know the story, they know you know the story of Y 33, they know the story of the P39, they they and you know, they're gonna be able to pass those on and and uh you know sh and share those, you know, down the road. And they're and it's definitely uh ties into that history and and keeps it alive.

SPEAKER_03 28:58

Well, and uh again, not having any any skills here other than being a storyteller, the stories are what really matter. And it's the the personal connection to them. But even for people who you know didn't know your dad, I mean for your grandkids, that's that's really special. I mean, my grandkids got to got to know my dad a little bit, and that was that was great. But for the rest of the people who come into the museum, telling your dad's story is is what we like to do. Um I was talking to another docent, he said, yeah, they wanted me to be a lead, but I want to give tours, I want to tell stories. That's nice, yeah. That's great. That's what that's what draws a lot of us here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:50

Um well we're we're proud to be part of the museum and and and and the docent have been so great over the years with us too, and just having that opportunity to spend time with them. But I know it's it's more than just my dad, you know, what you provide our community. In fact, I I was just at an event last night uh talking to a lady that's works up at the Air Force Academy who hadn't been here. I said, I said, you need to go over there, and you need to make sure uh cadets get over there and hear the stories of not just my dad's aircraft, but the other ones, and and uh it's such a valued um part of our community, but not just here locally, but nationally, you know.

SPEAKER_03 30:24

So yeah, and it's the heritage, especially you know, for somebody who's going through the academy to become an Air Force officer, they absolutely have to understand guys like your dad who came before. And also it gives them something to measure up to. When if if they get get into whatever we can't call it on the podcast, stories like that should inspire them to to really perform. And it's important, especially to to the young folks.

SPEAKER_05 31:08

Well, and this is you know, I mean you're believe it or not, your dad's story isn't the only one we have like this. Sure. You know, we were actually at the same time working on Neil Melton's Sky Raider in California, and and it was done, but we actually had an engine issue that we had to take the engine back off and send it back to the engine shop, and in the meantime we moved here, and then we had to truck the airplane out here, and then it got ran into some fences on the way out, so we had to do some more repairs on it. Yeah, but by the time we got it out here and got it ready to test flight, we had another gentleman come out, Randy Scott, and and he he actually flew that airplane. That was his airplane in Vietnam. Wow, and he didn't, you know, he just came out just to see the place. Same thing. Maybe somebody told him, I don't know the exact story, and I'd like to get him out here to do that. But you know, and so he got to bring his daughter out and put his daughter in in the airplane that he flew and and everything. So I mean, it was just like this continual like affirmation that this was something special out here that we're we were gonna be a part of.

SPEAKER_03 32:07

Sitting in the back seat of that 1951 bird dog does it for me. Oh yeah. I bet. So it's great. It on so many levels, but even without the personal connection, you can make the connections personal. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_05 32:23

Oh yeah, there's a lot of the stories here that do that.

SPEAKER_03 32:26

So it's it's such a treat to have an opportunity to do that.

SPEAKER_05 32:29

What was his favorite airplane to fly since he got to fly so many airplanes? What did he speak of the highest?

SPEAKER_02 32:33

I think it was a P-38. Yeah, and I and he flew Jets later, you know, the F-100 and those, but um, but he uh yeah, I think he really liked the P-38.

SPEAKER_03 32:44

And uh heard that more than once from people who were in a position to judge.

SPEAKER_05 32:50

Well he wasn't there very long once the P-38 showed up, right? So he never got to get into the later models or no, no. So he was always doing the early. Yeah, so that's pretty remarkable because that's a a lot heavier airplane to fly. A different airplane. Yeah, yeah. Everybody always complains that that the guys these days that fly in both, they complain a little bit about it because it's you know the J's got the hydraulic assist, and it's just a much and everything's automatic cooler doors and everything. Yeah. The F model, you have to do everything is manual, and they're they're really working in there.

SPEAKER_02 33:23

Yeah, well, I'm guessing he blew those newer models later, but not in combat, but but uh yeah, uh yeah, that's pretty good.

SPEAKER_05 33:31

Yeah, I can't imagine like flying that thing in combat, getting shot at, trying to shoot somebody, and like, oh yeah, I wonder if my cooler doors. Am I getting too hot? Yeah. Let me play with that while I'm you know, hey, hey, hold on one second.

SPEAKER_02 33:45

Yeah, I don't know. Have you read the book Race of Race of Aces? I have not. It's it's very good. It's written by the same guy that wrote um uh Of Our Fathers. Uh, what was the Flags of Offathers? Flag of Our Fathers, yeah. It's about that thick. Really good. But my dad's not mentioned it, but at the very beginning, it talks about a lieutenant at a base in New Guinea, and that's my dad.

SPEAKER_04 34:08

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_02 34:08

It's a general coming into that, and and then they start talking about all the different aces, including Tommy Lynch and Bong and Kirby and all those guys. Really interesting. Uh, really gives you, and the way it's written really gives you a feel for what they those pilots were doing. But yeah, um, this kind of a side story is uh Buzz Wagner, who's the first ace of World War II, that was my mom's boyfriend. Oh, yeah, and so Twist. Yeah, but here's the twist. Yeah, so this is kind of that side story I was gonna do. Okay, yeah. So my dad, um, he was based in Indiana. This is before the war, uh probably 1940, 41. And um Selfridge was up in Michigan, and and my mom, who had five sisters, one the oldest never married, the other four and my mom all married fighter pilots because they lived right off the base and they were, you know, I think that was connection.

SPEAKER_04 34:58

That was the thing.

SPEAKER_02 34:59

Well, um, my dad had met my mom on a blind date, and um his his, I think it was his wingman at the time, said, Yeah, hey, I need a you know, I need somebody to go on this. He need a wingman to be double dating. So meets my mom, immediately is infatuated with her, and it was either the first or second date, said her name was Rini. Reeny, you know, I'm gonna I'm gonna marry you someday, and she's like, you know, and and she's she's in love with Buzz Wagner, and so they had been dating. Well, Buzz had been shipped over to the Philippines, and uh um my dad flies up there uh with a wingman to go to a mutual friend's wedding, and and his whole main reason was he knew mom would be there, and they were good dancing partners, so they loved to dance together. We're dating, but love to dance, but but he had intentions she didn't have, right? And so uh so they go up there and dance and do all this. Well, that was uh um let's see, what was the date of Pearl Harbor? September 7th? Or December 7th? December 7th. So that was December 6th, was the wedding. Oh wow. The next morning, the news of Pearl Harbor comes, and they immediately have to get in their planes and fly back to their base. So my mom drives my dad to his plane, and that's at the time you could drive right up to the plane.

SPEAKER_03 36:18

Of course.

SPEAKER_02 36:19

Gets the plane, my dad hops out, she hops out, and he says, That's the first time she gave me a passionate kiss.

SPEAKER_05 36:25

Oh, wow.

SPEAKER_02 36:26

Yeah. So he jumps on the plane, they don't see each other for the next two years. He ends up in Washington and then is sent overseas. And um, but and this she she used to say here, this was more out of duty than desire. She corresponded with him to through letters and and was very uh um good at uh replying and keeping in touch with him through letters. So that's kind of where the relationship grew, was through letters. But my dad was like, No, I want to marry her.

SPEAKER_04 36:58

Yeah, he was there 100%.

SPEAKER_02 36:59

So Buzz Wagner, he's over in the Philippines. Yeah, um, the war starts, he's immediately up in the air and becomes the first ace. Um, and um he also gets a bullet through the glass and puts glass into his eye. So they bring him back because he's wounded and to use to get more recruitments and more bonds and all that kind of stuff. So he comes back and he's a war hero, and um he is down in the southeast. I can't remember if it was Florida or where, but um he actually he calls my mom and says, Hey Rena, I'm flying up to Michigan to see you. Per her sisters, they think he was going to ask her to marry marry him.

SPEAKER_03 37:38

Oh, and he didn't make it.

SPEAKER_02 37:40

He didn't. He he uh he hit bad weather and he crashed in Alabama or Mississippi, I think Alabama somewhere in the south. He crashed and that was the end of it. We have pictures of her at his funeral service, memorial service, and you know, she's very sad and all that. Well, unfortunately for Buzz, that might have been a little Buzz. This might be a whole different game. Yeah, it might be a whole story. But uh uh, you know, unfortunate for Buzz, but opens the opportunity for my dad. So my dad um continues to write. He finally gets uh sent back home and is in San Francisco with some of his buddies, and they're having some some drinks and and he's getting you know liquid courage, and they're going, like, well, you need a caller, you need to call her. So he calls her, but it's like two in the morning, Michigan time. Calls her up and says, Hey Rena, I'm back in I'm back in the States, I'm coming your way, and I'm gonna marry you. And she goes, Marry me? I don't even remember what you look like. But uh, but he uh he gets up there and he woos her, and sure enough, she she marries, and they had you know six to seven decades together, and and uh yeah, so that's a fantastic story.

SPEAKER_03 38:52

Yeah, that is a great story. Yeah, it's very tragic, but fantastic and the same time. Uh not tragic, everything happens like it's supposed to, but it's very much of the time absolutely and uh one of the presentations a couple three years back was on Boyd Wagner. Uh one of the the monthly talks. I don't think it was a fly day because we didn't have anything to fly that he flew, but someday we will.

SPEAKER_02 39:19

During the winter. Well, and he I guess he was kind of the uh the the typical, you know, he had the the the pencil thin mustache, which my dad did too. Good looking guy. Yeah, but uh also from the sounds that I may have had other girlfriends too, you know. Sure, yeah. Yeah, even back then. Yeah, uh, but it it was uh it was a cool, cool connection to you.

SPEAKER_05 39:44

Well, you got any other questions for Mr. Royal here? Because if not, I think that's a fantastic story to end up on.

SPEAKER_03 39:49

That's a great, great place to wrap. And I will have more quick uh questions, but now that we've met, I hope uh we get a chance to to chat more with you.

SPEAKER_02 40:01

Yeah, we're we're we we love the connection uh with the with you all and and uh again it's very important to our family.

SPEAKER_05 40:08

And well, it's very important to our family here as well that you guys are a part of it. I mean it really is. It's great. Like I said, it's always been a cornerstone of of what we do here just since we met you guys. So we really appreciate everything.

SPEAKER_02 40:21

Well, and you know, we talked about this as a family. So when my dad died, obviously this would go to my uh oldest uh brother, and he's he's about to pass away. He's he's kind of on his last couple days here. But um, as a family, we talked about it and go like, you know what? If it ends up in one of our homes, nobody's gonna see it. So uh we wanted to get it to you all because we knew that you would take care of it, and we will.

SPEAKER_05 40:45

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 40:46

Share the history.

SPEAKER_05 40:46

So yeah, we really appreciate it. I mean, it's a it's just a small artifact, but it's it's uh it speaks so much volume. Yeah. It just says so much about what he went through, and you know, I mean, for you guys to give that to the museum and it it's just a huge deal because we know what what it means for all y'all.

SPEAKER_03 41:05

So I gotta reiterate what your dad must have meant to the guys of the squadron because particularly the wrench turners, the guys who would have salvaged that propeller blade, you know, could have just tossed it. But they took the time to make that and that doesn't happen to everybody, right?

SPEAKER_02 41:31

So I'm glad you brought that up because that mechanic who I mentioned was in I think he was like 55 and was a head mechanic in the letter that he wrote, he said, um, my dad's half his age, he's a young, young buck, you know. Yeah, but he said, because of how my dad led and the whole kind of mission first, people always, you know, we've got to get the mission done, but gotta take care of the people my dad wouldn't eat if his guys weren't eating. My dad wore raggy clothes, if his guys was wearing raggy clothes. Yeah. But um that mechanic said he would follow him anywhere, any battle, anyplace.

SPEAKER_05 42:02

Yeah, I have no doubt about that for meeting meeting the man. Yeah, even when he was 96. Well you can tell.

SPEAKER_03 42:07

I unfortunately didn't get to meet him, but that that's what that spoke to me. Yeah, that's great. Having having been in those positions at the time to honor especially your skipper. Uh not all skippers are worth honoring.

SPEAKER_05 42:27

I get it. I get it, yeah. Well, Randy, thanks. Thank you very much. We really appreciate you sitting down with us and and continue being a part of the family.

SPEAKER_03 42:36

My honor.

SPEAKER_05 42:37

So thank you. Thank you, Randy.

SPEAKER_03 42:38

Thank you. Well, that was a treat for me, not having met uh Randy, and of course, I missed out on his dad, but I gotta say, you would be the coolest guy in sixth grade bringing this to show and tell.

SPEAKER_05 42:54

Well, not only that, but the other bag of goodies that he brought with him.

SPEAKER_03 42:57

Well, yeah, yeah. Lots of uh lots of stuff. But this probably wouldn't institute a a 40-mile radius lockdown like a bag full of mortars. Mortar rounds and grenades. You know, whatever. Fortunately, demilled. You know, that's the important part. Still.

SPEAKER_04 43:15

You can't even you can't even bring the squirt gun to school these days without getting a quick. That doesn't it doesn't speak But I mean it's a whole different environment.

SPEAKER_03 43:25

It doesn't speak very well for these days, but um I'm glad you uh prevailed on Randy to spare us some time. He's obviously a a busy guy, and uh hopefully he doesn't get too much busier.

SPEAKER_05 43:40

Well, I can't, you know, even begin to really s have the significance of what it meant to have, you know, to meet Frank and have him be a part of the restoration of that airplane. You know, I mean he was he was here quite a bit for a a gentleman of his age. And you know, the only reason he Come out more is because we wouldn't be working on the airplane whenever he came out, yeah. Because it we it would just stop production, you know. I mean, because you just you wanted to absorb the guy, it was sharp and just had these great stories and a great personality, and you know, you could just see that he just had a love for for what he did and for that airplane, and and it just was a very special time for us. I mean, it you know, it wouldn't have happened if we hadn't moved here, and and to be able to to have the museum and to be able to take that, you know, because we weren't just a shop anymore. Before we were just a restoration shop and weren't open to the public. Well, now we could take that story and we could we can make something of it, and then and now the rest of the public for generations to come can hear it.

SPEAKER_03 44:45

Well, and as I say, the you know, there's there are artifacts and the photographs, and we've got video of uh of Frank talking too, and that's splendid. And you know, one of the one of the great parts of the the museum is getting that feedback on TripAdvisor. I tell people in my tours that you know we live and die on those reviews.

SPEAKER_05 45:16

Well, thanks to all those reviews, um, especially coming from all the docents that do such magnificent tours. Well, uh, we actually bumped up from number eight in the country to number five. So we are top five in the country of things to do on TripAdvisor, and that's all based off of reviews, and it's not like a lot of magazines and stuff where you you pay to play. You know, this is just a genuine real deal, you know, review. This is this is where we're at. And it's and it's all in part from, I mean, this is a this isn't a rich man's toy that owns this to put all of his toys in, kind of thing. You know, this is an all-volunteer run, 501c3, and everybody who's here, you know, they want to be here and they want to help with these stories, and they want to to to convey them to the public, and and it shows and that, and then it it shows in the reviews, and then now we're top five in the country.

SPEAKER_03 46:12

And well, that's couldn't be prouder. That's great. I'd I'd be prouder if I'd been mentioned in dispatches uh recently, but I haven't been. Hi. Um but that is we you know, we live for this stuff. Um you know, to to just tell the stories and share, share the airplanes. I mean, they're all just magnificent specimens.

SPEAKER_05 46:39

Yeah, but it's it's all the stories behind it, you know, and it's the stories that everybody else brings that that's here. You know, we've had several of our volunteers on the podcast and to share some of their stories, and you know, so they've lived it, they they know how to convey it, you know, how to convey other people's stories, and it and it just shows. And we're just super lucky and super happy to to be where we are right now.

SPEAKER_03 47:03

Yeah, that's that's a significant jump. But we don't sit still. No, no.

SPEAKER_05 47:10

So we're still building the new building, and it's coming along, the roof's almost completed. Um, they already have all the displays for the inside, it's already done and ready to move in when we get the the go-ahead. And if you'd like to help with any of that, with any sort of donation or anything, we have on our description page. You can go, you know, if you if you shop at a Kroger, it's there's a description there. You just put us in as your beneficiary. You don't pay anything, it just we get a nice little percentage every time you buy groceries. And we know what groceries cost these days, but still at the same time, you know, we all got to eat. So, you know, just doing what you do every day benefits a museum like this, and and we could really appreciate that.

SPEAKER_03 47:56

Some of us could eat a little less, but uh that's all right too. But yeah, as you say, it it's totally invisible to the consumer, and it's it's very nice of Kroger to uh to have a program like that where every little bit counts. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 48:18

Well, it all helps, you know, along with like blazing aviation, Concord batteries, champion spark plugs. I mean, if if it wasn't for you know businesses like this that that support the museum and give us help, you know, we'd be in a a lot worse shape than we are right now.

SPEAKER_03 48:35

Well, I like to think they give us help because we deserve it.

SPEAKER_05 48:40

Well, I'd like to think so too, but you know, here we are. So I guess on that note, I'd like to thank uh Mr. Randy Royal and on behalf of him and behalf of him and his dad Frank and my partner Rob Gale and William Stevenson behind the glass and myself Scott Claire. Stay safe out there.

SPEAKER_03 49:01

Please do.