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Foolish Fish Returns Magic, Tarot, and the Living Craft
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Mystery Channel – Denis Poisson (Foolish Fish) Return Interview
Welcome back to the Mystery Channel. Today we continue our conversation with Denis Poisson of Foolish Fish so if you haven’t heard our first interview yet, go listen to that one as well. It’s packed with brilliant discussions, insights, and Denis’ unmistakable blend of clarity, curiosity, and magic.
In this second chapter, we pick up right where we left off: exploring magic, tarot, his readings, his classes, and the living craft behind his work. Denis has been teaching some extraordinary masterclasses, and I recently attended his latest one, and it was genuinely transformational. I can’t recommend his teachings enough.
Visit his website, join a class, book a reading, and follow the link in the show notes to read my article about my experience. And don’t miss his next big class on May 23rd, taught together with another Mystery Channel guest, María Alvis Hernando.
Settle in and listen in as we continue the conversation.
foolishfish.net
Themysterychannel.org
You're doing a lot of new things. I've been watching your um your YouTube a lot more with like symbolism and like how you're approaching it. You know, because you're moving away from like more less of the book thing.
SPEAKER_00Well, yes, yes, I'm I'm doing a bit less of the book thing, a bit more of the teaching thing. And it's true that a lot of the teaching is now no longer on YouTube. I'm I'm doing lessons with uh small groups, which is a little bit more interactive, it's a little bit more rewarding for everyone involved. There's a paywall, unfortunately, you know, um I I a body of flesh that needs sustaining. So, and so yes, that that there is a there's a price attached to that. And I hope that my service to the community by my YouTube, my free YouTube videos, um, you know, is is um is a good start. You know, I I hope that it it's it's given something to the community. Um but uh but yes, now I'm I'm moving on to you know engaging the people who've really enjoyed those videos and who want more, and we're diving a little bit deeper in um in in in live lessons. In what do you call them webinars? No, they're they're they're they're actually workshops because people get to do stuff, right? It's there's there's quite a lot of guided visualization, a lot of um, you know, people are creating talismans live there and then during the class, and uh it's quite nice. Just I can I can engage with them individually, they can ask me questions directly, just in a way that's not possible with a YouTube video, right? You can put a comment, of course, but uh, but then you know there's so many people commenting and uh it's so nice little controlled environment, uh, and it's it's just so lovely. It's just so lovely. I'm enjoying like teaching's my passion, right? I I I love doing it so much, and it's uh it's it's just bringing some light back into my life, and I I love it so much, and it's great. And what what what can they learn, Dennis? Who who uh is seeking you out or right, right, right. There are various types of uh workshop, but one series that I've been doing has been the magic and mysteries of the classical planets. Um so we've done what have we done so far? We've done Saturn, we've done um Venus, we've done we've done uh the Sun, right? Uh Apollo uh and cohort, and we are currently uh doing Mars at the time of recording this, right? So I'm gonna be giving the second and final class on that tomorrow. Um so yeah, to give you an idea, we're we're we're digging into some of the mythology around the deities that represent that planet in various um traditions with a heavy focus on the Greek, and we're learning some lessons from those uh myths, right? We're learning some lessons on how we can apply that into our lives, how we can fix certain areas of our lives because the seven planets. I think of the seven planets a little bit in the same way as I think about the 72 angels of the Shem Hamephurash, uh, in the same way as I think about the four elements. It's a way of taking the whole and dividing it into studyable parts, right? So it's like taking divinity. You can go, okay, it's just God, or you can say, okay, well, it's this aspect of divinity, or it's that aspect of divinity, this and that aspect of divinity. And I like that way of breaking it down into manageable chunks, um, so that if there's an area of your life that is going wrong, you know, I I strongly believe uh believe in being able to apply uh our spirituality in a material way. Right? It's not the only aspect of spirituality, of course, but it is an important aspect of spirituality that gets missed. I think that if we can work out what area of our life is being affected and which area of divinity it relates to, then we can get a better idea of how we can fix this area of our life. Uh and it it it works really surprisingly well. So, yeah, that's uh that that's that's the magic and mysteries of the of the planets. Yes, Bjorn, sorry.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, no, I I can imagine that uh you know what what I find where yeah, you're you're so talented, but what I find especially uh real strength of you that you can explain something so complex, so I'm I'm also into esoteric stuff and all that, so it's it's complexity, but you can explain it in a way that is manageable.
SPEAKER_00That means a lot, Dion.
SPEAKER_02Thank you. Yes, yes no, I I I so so I can imagine if you if you can take people in such a project and and learn something like yeah, like personal development stuff like things, yeah. I think you are the most suitable person to do that. Oh, thank you.
SPEAKER_00I really like that. I certainly I certainly enjoy the process very much, and it seems like a lot of the people who are um uh attending the classes are enjoying it as well. They're returning. I'm very grateful to them, of course. Um and it's uh it's it's actually a lot of fun. Um it's it's not the only um uh type of class that we do. I mean there's I try to intersperse these uh uh planet classes with some just uh just very straight-up practical, practical magic classes. Um uh we've done the the gods and spirits of money, uh, and we've done uh finding your life purpose, and we've done just a a a magician's toolbox looking at various magical technologies and things like that. I think that the next one may, I don't uh I I haven't a hundred percent decided yet, but I think that the next one may be about thought forms, tulpas, and uh servitors and so on, and equigores and things like this, and um, but uh yeah, that may be the one that I do next month for can you maybe give a small example, not maybe particularly out of your work, but some someone people can of some something to relate to in in that regard, uh, of mythology and how how you can apply that in real life, for instance. How to apply the mythology into our real life. Yeah, I mean, um recently we did the magic and mysteries of Venus, and uh there's um there are three goddesses who are impervious to Venus's to Aphrodite's powers. Literally all of the other gods are powerless in front of Aphrodite. She she she has power over every single one of the gods except for three, and they are three goddesses, and um they are Athena and Artemis and Hestia. And um yeah, we we we dug into a little bit of um what those three goddesses represent. And uh, for example, Athena is very cerebral, right? She's very much in her head, and um, and and so this is something that you can use, of course, to overcome the powers of uh of Venus if you're very uh affected by them. Uh but it's also something that you can do to work out why Venus isn't working very well in your life. So so we approach it from two different perspectives. You know, if you want to overcome um uh a venereal attack, I mean that sounds really bad, but venereal just meaning of the quality of Venus, right? Uh so uh you you I don't know, you you're madly in love and it's a problem for whatever reason. You know, there could be many reasons why you might not want to be in love with a particular person. Well, the way to overcome that might be to go it get into the energy of Athena. So really thinking about it intellectually. Um uh Hestia is all about um all about well, Hestia is is the goddess of the home, she's the goddess of the hearth, and so yeah, yes, you know, staying at home isn't great for your your dating chances, right? Um, you know, keeping yourself hidden, keeping yourself uh, you know, um uh in in your day-to-day and not kind of pushing yourself out of your um comfort zone and things like this, and uh and so so you know, we do various um uh guided visualizations, uh various processes of um embodying various deities, various energies, and so on. And uh who is the third one? Um uh Artemis, of course, who is wildly independent. Uh uh so so yeah, she she's uh she's a third one. So so yeah, so for for each of those three goddesses, we we looked into how we can harness it when it's useful for us, and how to also overcome it when it's getting in our way. Um little example, uh just uh little little bird's eye view.
SPEAKER_02That's something really powerful because feelings or thoughts or concepts really get a face and get tangible. Absolutely. That sounds that that's maybe something small, but that's so big. That's really big. Because then you can comprehend it.
SPEAKER_00People relate to people, and the gods are a personification of an aspect of life, right? They're a personification of an aspect of divinity, of an aspect of what it's all about, and uh and we can relate to people and we can understand people, and when we learn about Aphrodite and all her um, you know, her her her gifts, her difficulties also, you know, uh all the the it helps us to think about a particular area of our life in a in a maybe in a more relatable way, in a way that can be managed, in a way that can be contained. And you can um it also gives us a sense of agency, maybe, when we can appeal to an aspect of divinity that is personified because you're speaking to a person and there's something that people can relate to. Yeah, you know, when you're doing divination over a particular aspect, you can ask that divinity and feel like you're having a conversation, you know. And are you just feeling like you're having a conversation? Are you actually having a conversation? It doesn't matter. The end result is that you know it's it's useful and it uh and it and it works. That's that's yeah, that's that's great. Incredibly um offensive to some people, but but it's the way I I approach it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, if it works, it's yeah, yeah, but that definitely works. I'm pretty mature on that. You know, I can relate to many other concepts. You know, uh sorry chaos magic approach, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I like that. I like it. Hopefully not too disrespectful, but um uh again, chaos magic isn't about being disrespectful, it's about precisely being respectful, um but but also being open to the idea of um one way not necessarily being the only way, which is uh which is as you know, dear to me.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, yeah. And if you explain it that way, I'm thinking like a a Swiss pocket knife, you know, it's it's more than just one function. So it's you you can just uh see it uh as as uh philosophy as well. You probably uh know that better than I do, but there is also this concept like the higher Venus, the lower Venus, like back in the days. So that people think about a certain concept about love, and then yeah, it's almost that they somehow think about okay, but but what what what is the the impact uh on the spectrum? So love is is something good, but too much love, uh less love, you know, and and how does that uh so yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00It gives you gives you um it it gets us out of uh the the the idea of a pure concept, right? Because people are fallible, people are you know people make mistakes, but people are also complex. And so it's it's not just this is like this, it's like this is like this, yes, as long as these conditions are like this or like that, and yeah, everything it kind of interplays like it does with with people. So yeah, I I like I like sounds like a constellation. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yes, exactly. Exactly. Oh goodness. Um yeah, now you're getting onto astrology.
SPEAKER_03Exactly, no, more complicated.
SPEAKER_00Astrology is quite big on my mind at the moment. Um it's it's something that I'm you know, when you have ADHD, you kind of latch on to whatever your brain's latching on to. You don't get a choice what latches onto, and you kind of go, oh, okay, it's astrology now. But yeah, it's it's a difficult one because astrology is one of those things that takes a lifetime to master, right? I don't can you master astrology? Can you master astrology? It's too complex, yeah. I'm not sure. Morgan, you into you're into astrology?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I read charts as I do, um, especially lately, um, the fixed stars, you know. So like I the Yeah, that's exactly like um recently I was read uh reading about Capella, you know, and that con the chariot constellation, and then how it's in your chart, but how they saw ancient times because it's one of the Bohemian stars, you know. Like you said, it's too complicated. It's like there's so many layers upon layers, but it's fascinating because you know that one brings you fortune, but then other stars in the constellation bring sudden death.
SPEAKER_00So it's like, you know, they're all always there, aren't they?
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, what's your what's your take on astrology?
SPEAKER_02Well, I'm not uh as an expert as Morgan and as you are, but I I'm not an expert, but definitely not. Yeah. Uh but you know, my overall weakness uh if I compare it to other things in this uh yeah uh era, it's it's it's not much. Yeah, but I know classical things, you know, like these seven uh planets and all that, and how this maps out and mystery traditions and all that. But what I especially find interesting, so it was never my first go-to, but it's always on the fringes, you know. If you uh read like Vitruvius, for example, you know, and how he made like he built like a city, but then he made it, and this is the this hermetic idea as above and uh so below, and he made like the city like the constellation of the planets, you know, where the artillery the artillery should be in that uh place where put Mars is, you know, and such things.
SPEAKER_00Uh it's fascinating, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you're completely right. I mean, uh until now I I I've known about just enough to be able to do magic, right? Um and to do magic you need to know the seven planets. It's classical planet, you need it's helpful if you know your uh your your 12 zodiacal signs. It's probably a good idea to know what a house is, um, although I don't even think it's necessary um for for most magic. Uh and that's that's yeah, uh aspects of course, right? What's the the difference between uh between a trine and a and a square and things like this, right? That's that's all you really need. Um but um recently I I had a a Vedic astrology reading, um, which is why I'm wearing this silly thing. I'm saying silly things. I don't I don't think it's silly. It's uh pearls. Quite difficult to find something vaguely masculine looking with pearls. Um but uh but the the um astrologer um Avi is oh this is it's embarrassing. I don't remember his surname. Um, but um uh uh he was a fantastic guy that I met in Glastonbury and he availed reading for me. And I don't know, some some people listening to this might know that I'm a big fan of sphere and sundry also. Uh sphere and sundry make uh talismanic uh materia. So I I I know that the the the proper word, the proper word is talismatic uh to talk about talismans. They use the word talismanic for uh they use Vedic and Western astrology in ways that I don't understand. Right? Austin Kropok is like one of the big, big leaders in in in the field of uh of astrology. But what I do know is that their material feel very powerful, right? I've been using them myself. Uh I'm not trying to make a big advertisement for sphere and sundry or anything, but it's uh it's it's surprising how powerful these um and they they make bath salts, they make uh colonias that you can just cleanse yourself with and stuff. You can they've got waters and things like this. So you apply these products um and you enjoy the energies of that moment in time, right? So they they they create these items and they ask for the blessings of various entities at a very, very, very specific time called an election, and they they elect the moment in which they're they're going to create these items, and then this item is born, basically, with a birth chart, right? The birth chart of that place and time, right? And then you receive this item, and it's like you know, when you've got a friend who's really good at finances and just talks about finances from time to time, and suddenly you realize that you're learning just by being close to them, uh, you know, you see how they're living their lives, and it kind of rubs off a little bit on you. It's it's like that. So it's an it's a some material that you're applying onto yourself that gives you a little bit of that astrological condition. Happens to be particularly good for healing, or it happens to be particularly good for um becoming more authentic, or it might be very good for showing yourself, or it might be very good for love or for money, or for the other mundane things that people might be looking for. So there's mundane stuff and more theurgic stuff as well. But I'm very, very interested in that stuff at the moment. There we go. That's fascinating.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Just uh it's just I I'm I'm a little intimidated at how much there is to learn.
SPEAKER_03It's yeah, yeah, there's just so much that's just like picking one area and running with it because there's too many areas if you're gonna try and learn them all. You just gotta, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Which is a gold mine for someone with ADHD like me. I'm like, I can never learn it all. Yes, that's good, that's good.
SPEAKER_02So you said can you ever grasp uh astrology you said as as a whole, you know, but that is the question: can we ever grasp life as a whole? I I don't think so, but it's like maybe if we like seek, and you know, and and seeking is like the path or or the the the aim uh of life.
SPEAKER_00And I think that this is uh just the same as any other area of magic where if you search hard enough, you'll find an opinion that is the opposite of the opinion that you've been studying, studying. Whatever it is that you think that you've learnt, there's gonna be an opinion out there that says that that thing, just do the opposite, because that thing will never work, or that thing is just wrong, or this, you know, this other way is the best way to do it. And and it's every single aspect of magic. The way I think about it is that, and this is something that I say regularly, so it's something that maybe people who watch what I do they they they will know that I think this, but um, we are the main ingredient in any magic that we do. I think this is quite visible in, for example, a birth chart, right? If we're on the topic of astrology, it doesn't matter, you know, from the perspective of the sun, it doesn't matter from the perspective of planet Earth, it matters from where you were born, right? So if you were born somewhere and someone else was born somewhere else at exactly the same moment, you will both have different birth charts because where you were born matters, and it's not the location that matters, it's you that matter. Because you are the main ingredient, not a main ingredient, the main ingredient in any magic that you do. The magic that works for you is not going to be the same as the magic that works for someone else, and so we have to develop our own magic, we have to make our our own our own our own way, our own, our own magic. I we did the first part of our interview quite a while ago. I don't remember if this is something that we got into last time.
SPEAKER_03No, no, I recently re-listened to it. Yeah.
unknownSorry.
SPEAKER_02It would be a surprise if we dive two times in the same rabbit hole. But now now I'm curious. Now I'm curious, what is magic for you?
SPEAKER_00Oh, um let me bring up my usual it this is a this is a a definition that I came up with in in my courses, um, which I which I'm happy with as a working definition. So magic is making use of immaterial resources, sometimes with the help of material tools to appeal to those immaterial resources, to reach a desired end. I like that. I think that covers everything. I think it covers that. Like I can't think of anything that it doesn't cover.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03That lens.
SPEAKER_02But if that's the case, if that's the case, then there's there are a lot more magic than we even realize.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah. No, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 100%. I think that communication, you know, talking. Is putting information from one brain into another person's bra. I that's magic. That is indeed. Indeed. Yes. Yes, I create as I speak. That's right. Definitely.
SPEAKER_03Just ideas. Especially what you're gonna spark in someone else.
SPEAKER_00That's right, that's right. I mean we call it magic because because why not? But uh but but also, you know, it's it's just not an area of uh of study that has been particularly appreciated in the West. Yeah, right. And so it's not very well understood. I think that once it is understood, why not continue calling it magic? Because that's you know, it's a perfect, it's a great name for it. It's fine, you know, that there's nothing wrong with it. We don't have to think of magic as something that doesn't exist that might exist, right?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02I I must say this at this same moment. So if we call it magic, then we say it's something separate from ordinary day. Like is that the case? Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And and this is this is my contention. I I ob obviously I obviously I believe it's not. I believe that magic is very much a part of a part of it all. It's just that the West hasn't decided to study it very much for reasons that we all know, right? Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02There is also a counter magic with words because when we name something that we cannot grasp, we maybe cringe it or we maybe do harm to it.
SPEAKER_00Oh yes, yes, yes, you're quite right. You're quite right. Um and I I I I'm thinking now back to the beginning of our conversation about the uh about the gods and goddesses representing various aspects. Of course, it's very easy to get dogmatic about that. Yeah, this thing has happened to me, but it's not possible if you think about the gods that represent this area of life, right? No, no, we we we do have to keep an eye on what's real. These are symbols. Oh yeah, this is a another big thing, isn't it? The the danger of falling prey to um the dogma of symbols. Symbols are very useful, but they remain symbols. We need to remember that the finger pointing at the moon, it's not the point, the the the moon that the finger is pointing to, which is which matters. If the finger becomes the point of uh of fascination, you know, and the point of study, well that's fine, but let's not forget that that's what we're studying. We're not studying what it's pointing at. That that happens a lot with just with spirituality in general, doesn't it? Because spirituality is so intangible, well it can be very, very intangible, and so people latch on to the tangible thing, the words, the metaphors, and getting really, really into the detail of the metaphor. No, no, the metaphor was never supposed to go that deep, just it's supposed to be a general director, yeah.
SPEAKER_02And there's another thing to it I always find. If you know it, then the mystery is gone. And we need that mystery.
SPEAKER_00I find you're right, you're right. It is important uh to remember that it is unknowable. Right, so the moment we think that we know it, we should that should be a clue for us. Uh we're maybe knowing the system. That that might be the thing that we know, but the thing that the system is pointing to. That is unknowable. That is on well, it's it's experienceable. Yes, aspects of it is experienceable, but uh, but but not knowable in the sense of you can't ever have studied it all. Yes, have have observed it all, even.
SPEAKER_03We're talking about not enough time.
SPEAKER_02No, it's never enough time. But if I'm now the devil's advocate and I would ask for you, and I say, okay, uh Dallas, I want to to be a student with you, but I cannot learn at all. Why should I then study it anyway? Because I won't at all. Because most people, I I know why it's not so important. But yeah, what what would you say?
SPEAKER_00If you can never learn at all, why why learn anything at all? I think that um I think that we're all trying to live the best life that we can, uh, regardless of what it can look like in the case of some people. I think that every single one of us is trying to live the best life that we can given the choices that we can see. Um and sometimes those choices aren't very helpful, aren't very um aren't very useful. Um, and I think that magic gives us more choices, gives us more options. Uh Starbucks telling me that I've gotten reward points, that's great.
SPEAKER_03Um magical coffee. Yeah, right.
SPEAKER_02I would like to have a coffee.
SPEAKER_03Me too, yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's still early in the morning.
SPEAKER_033 a.m.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, yeah, right, right, right, right. I think that it's important to remember that a little knowledge can be a dangerous thing, right? I think that uh people just getting started on this journey can very often get carried away. I've learned this thing, I put it into practice, it is the way, right? That that very often happens, doesn't it? Uh you should do it, and uh you should do it the way I did it, and you know, if you do it any other way, then it's not gonna work because it worked for me in this particular way. But then I think so I do think that you should go a little bit further than a little bit of knowledge, um but but also realize that you can never know it all, which is by the way, one of the reasons why my channel is called Foolish Fish. It's uh it's very, very important to remember that we always remain beginners at magic, right? People have have been very offended by this idea. But but why but why?
SPEAKER_02But why? I know if you can embrace uncertainty because there's a lot of uncertainty in our life, then you stand much stronger than you always want to be certain.
SPEAKER_00We agree, we agree, that's right, that's right. How can you progress if you feel like you already have it all? If you'll you know, if your cup is how can you fill a f a full cup? That's it's a paradox, it's a real paradox, yeah. Completely, completely. So it's important to remain foolish. Um, it's important to to um to keep that big Zen beginner's mind, right?
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, and and the fool and initiation, the fool is like the first and the last stage as well. So you adjust to turn around and he's already there, whilst he's also even like a fool.
SPEAKER_00Completely, yeah. I I see the fool as uh far wiser than the wise man. Yeah, yeah, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. The fool is a wise man. By the way, very convenient for me since I can't learn anything to save my life. Uh I'm just going around in the dark going, This feels good. Yeah. So yeah, it's it's a very convenient philosophy for me.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but by the way, also like with with the fool and the uh symbology of the fool, also and like medieval times and all that, often I lose to Mercury.
SPEAKER_00Uh sorry Bion, uh often or what to Mercury? Uh Mercury.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's also why they have like the rooster and all that. That's like an alchemy, but that's like a different take on that, where you have like the the feet of a rooster.
SPEAKER_00Nice, nice. Okay, I didn't know about that. That's interesting. Um I know I know the colour. The Mercury figure and and because it's like uh at the spot of the of the rooster and all that. Yeah. I know that uh in the Thoth Tarot, the um the fool card has got very strong Dionysian energy, and uh Dionysus is god of madness um and of uh genius, chaotic genius, right? It's not organized. Um and uh and I think that you need to remember how to be in that energy in order to be able to go forward, yeah. Despite their despite the obvious cliff edge in front of you. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Denny, you know that you'll never learn all of astrology. Yeah, go ahead anyway. Good good job. Good job.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, you but you bring you bring a great a great concept. Uh yeah, that's that's really uh really something great.
SPEAKER_00Sorry, Morgan, you were you were saying something, I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_03No, that's uh no, that's okay. I didn't want to interrupt.
SPEAKER_00I think we interrupted you, I apologize.
SPEAKER_03That's fine. I know, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes, yes. So, so yeah, yeah. I think yeah, stay staying foolish, life goals. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yes, no, I like that. And that's the thing about learning too, though, because as you're learning it, you're utilizing it yourself, because what works for one person won't work for another. So there's so many ways to dive into astrology, so many ways to utilize it, especially when you're putting in aspects of the mythology. Oh, yeah. Like in the festivals too, because they were so strong in the festivals around those things on what represented Mars, what represented Venus, and that's how you would utilize it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So Morgan, um, I I I'm guessing that you might have come from a from a more uh uh Wiccan background.
SPEAKER_03Um no, actually, well, actually, funnily enough, I grew up Mormon, like the strictest Mormon you could possibly imagine. Like I mean, not necessarily from your family, clearly. But then so I everything I did, I like starting like with teenagers, I branched out on my own with, you know, you know, lots of research, lots of reading, lots of and that's where I did start with was like the mythologies of it, like Mars Day, you know, it's Mars Day, they're blessing the armies, they send the scapegoat out, you know, like because they want to put it all on him and kick him out of the city. So we don't have anything bad here, you know, those kind of things. But then how do you put that in astrology? How do you use that in a magical aspect of your life? So that's kind of how I, you know, stumbled through it until I started learning, had money to learn classes because I had to pay for everything myself. So, you know.
SPEAKER_00The festivals are teenagers. The the reason why I was saying Wicca is because the festivals are so so important in in I don't know very much about the festivals, uh uh but but clearly, clearly a powerful aspect to tap into.
SPEAKER_03Oh yeah. Well, I started reading not the Wiccan thing, but through Ovid, you know, all of his tea all of his books and all of his teachings, you know, with how he because he recorded at the time, you know, he recorded how they did those things and what it would represent. So I was more of a historical one than a magical at first.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, I think a lot of people get into magic because they like history.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. No, I definitely, yeah.
SPEAKER_00I I think I think that if you're if if you don't have your shelf giving in to the weight of of your your Homer and uh and Ovid and and and the rest.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, then you're probably just getting started.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03Oh yeah, no, those are all yeah, leaping off points to like everything.
SPEAKER_00You know, me by the way. I I spent a little bit of time last year learning about the Arthurian myths also, so coming a little bit more more towards the West. Morgan, listen.
SPEAKER_03Yes, I'm just talking, like, yes, we're just talking about this. It's my favorite, yeah.
SPEAKER_00All right, if it's your favorite, then I've definitely got nothing to tell you, but uh I was just in in Glastonbury for the Glastonbury Festival, and uh uh Caitlin Matthews was uh was speaking there, and uh uh her husband John Matthews was there also advertising his latest book and um World Authorities on Arthur and Magic. They have this wonderful Arthurian magic book that they wrote, of course, uh absolutely found fascinating stuff. Um but yes, a lot of these these books over here, uh I think these three tomes, they it might be these three tomes here, which are the the um the grail the grail myths, but like the the So I've got the Chrétien de Troie, the uh which is which is yeah, quite influential, let's say, on the in the Grail tales. Uh, but then the the further medieval writings, French medieval writings on on the Grail. Just fascinating, very, very weird, very weird. Um, but uh reading them I'm realizing what uh tune in next week for more kind of uh you know, hook hook kind of thing it is. These stories were. I mean they clearly were written as uh as a way of getting people to come back for more, right? Uh weren't designed to be read in a in a single sitting, extremely long sagas, and nothing really ever happens. A lot gets threatened to happen. He almost almost found oh no, he didn't find it, wasn't there, gets sent to another castle. Yeah, but find out next week if he's gonna get there in the end.
SPEAKER_03It's true, so it's a TV show.
SPEAKER_02There is so much so much wisdom in those Arthurian legends, also if you uh see like the symbol structure, and there is always this thing, you know, the this fixed concept back in the days, like an imitatio dei, where you do as the hero in the mid or do like your gods in order to become those gods, you know, and there is always this process of evolution, you know, going from a beggar from a wild man to the king. That's also the uh the concept in there. Besides that, there's also a lot of hidden astrology in those Austurian legends, because the wounded fisherman king that alludes to uh Sedder, and there is there are so many things, and you you can read French, which uh there is also this uh figure like tristoise, so and this alludes to like Morder Earth, who is like uh a widow, because that what is uh holy has left that's also an item, you know, like the the earthly temple and the heavenly temple, and and the temple that uh fell down. So these are all symbols about the same concept but different, different layouts. That is what's so interesting.
SPEAKER_00Yes, yeah, yes, I will tell you. Yes, absolutely, absolutely. Yeah, I mean they're clearly uh a way they were and still are, of course, uh clearly a way of of passing on mystery concepts in a Christian context. Um in a very, very staunchly and uh prohibitively Christian concept uh context, excuse me. Um yeah, passing on passing on mystery ideas and realizations, I guess.
SPEAKER_02And there is also a a a big hidden uh understream because they also uh with with like the Indo-European uh Pontifex ID, so the the king at the center of the world symbolism is also in there. So there's also a lot of of uh of Celtic influence in those legends.
SPEAKER_03And yeah, and you yeah.
SPEAKER_00Get a strong um uh just pantheon vibe uh from from the various from the kings, of course, and also from from the knights, like each of them representing a different way might be that might be recognized as um you know the the core self, the shadow self, uh the uh the the various um various antagonists and uh and the way they are overcome and so on. Rich.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, no, it's yeah, they definitely especially need dive deeper into each one because they always talk about Gwen in everything, but then they kind of skip over everybody else. So you gotta really dig deep to find the other ones, yes, you know?
SPEAKER_00Yes, yes, yes, yes. Yeah, my my my deep fascination last year um was with Parsifal. Yes, yes, you think the quintessential fool, right?
SPEAKER_02They they also start like a fool or like the wild man always, so they go like from zero to hero, so they go back in the woods like the wild man, and the wild man and the fool is interchangeable symbolically back in the days, and you often see also the the same emblematic layout, you know, uh wearing a how you call it, uh yeah, I I lost the word, like uh yes, such a like the the pouch, yeah, like the yeah, right, right, yes, yes, yes.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, this yes there is also this this idea from the jesters back in the day, they had like this uh this uh diamond-shaped uh costumes always, and that also alludes to like the green man or the wild man for like it's stylized leaves. You see, and there's a lot of overlap, and that's very interesting. And you see them both in the Arthurian legend. Or they start like a fool that they made a costume of of uh very big pants and all that. It's not uh it's not fashionable, but you start somewhat like a beggar, like a fool, like a wild man in the woods, and then you hear earth like uh angels, like birds, and yeah, and then it starts off.
SPEAKER_00I've just realized that the quintessential green man is Dionysus.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, I like that, yes, so much. Yeah, yeah. Another one who isn't really delved into a lot, but I always found him fascinating. Yeah, they do that in Arthur too. That's how half of their rituals they have the masked ones with the green man coming. Like I know a lot of that. You've delved that deep into the Arthurian books where they actually oh yes, okay, you should. That's when they do the rituals, they're always wearing the green man mask, and then you know, the um the woman whoever represents that role is like the earth, you know. Okay, I'm diving you deeper in there, but it's fascinating. You should read.
SPEAKER_04Yes, that's nice.
SPEAKER_00So you probably have it all circles around. I'll be back on Ethereum stuff in a couple of years' time, you'll see.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, that's fair.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we we will do something, we will do something on that subject. Uh Morgan, isn't it true? Because that's very interesting. And I uh recently uh wrote an essay for those events, you know, and we dived also deep into the idea of the devil and all that, and how they got their uh depiction from heathen gods and all those old concepts. So uh it's it's it's really interesting.
SPEAKER_00I think Dionysus might be just you know, I've been doing the magic and mysteries of the seven of the seven planets. I think Dionysus is gonna be one of like a like a one-off uh, you know, because having having done divination around Dionysus, you know, just I was speaking to an entity and I was like, Who are you? Trying to work it out. And I've been using this method that's shared by Matthew Venus in his book uh Insoling the Effigy. And I think it's a popular method, but it was the first time that I'd read about it. The way you do it is that you you take a tar not a tarot deck, a poker deck, just a regular playing cards, and you shuffle your cards and you're asking a yes-no question, and you then draw three cards. Now, three reds, so reds mean yes and blacks mean no. So three reds mean yes, three blacks mean no. But then if you get two reds and a black, it means yes, but ask more. There's more information. That's not the whole story. And then if you get two blacks and a red, it means the other the other thing, right? So no, uh, not exactly no, just keep asking. Right. So uh I like that. I like that. Yeah, yeah. It's surprising, surprising, like, oh wow. So, you know, I I I was asking for a particular outcome, right? And I was like, okay, I need an entity who can help me with this. And so I was I was shuffling the cards. Okay, no, I'm just a random entity, basically, and but I can put you in touch with someone who can get you the thing done. Okay, please how can I do that? Do you need some offering? Glass of water, yes. Is that good enough? Okay, good. Glass of water, boom. All right, who am I talking to? Is it is it an angel? No. Is it uh you know, a demon? No. Is it a god? Yes. Okay, all right. Is it one of the seven classical gods? Yes, but okay. Alright, what does that mean? I got into it, and so yeah, uh Dionysus, red, red, red. Um, and uh so I spent a little bit of time chatting. Chatting, chatting is uh um so yes, so um Dionysus, yeah, so we spent a little bit of time chatting, and it yeah, it turns out he believes that he is one of the seven. He's not the eighth, because they are the classic seven, right? And he doesn't believe that any of the seven in those seven should not be there. He is just one of the classic seven. There we go. Yeah, so you got the classic seven, and also Dionysus is among them. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I think that makes that makes sense. That makes sense. It does, it does, it does. And so I think I will be doing a magic and mysteries of Dionysus class as well as the seven classes. That sounds like a like a pre
SPEAKER_02A pre-ayyahuaska session.
SPEAKER_00Yes, yes, yes. If you count the classes, there will be eight, but you shouldn't count them. There are seven classes amongst them. Yeah, yeah. There'll be Dionysus. Yes, yes. Oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_03I love that. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I I spoke to Jake Stratton Kent a few months before he had his stroke. I I had the privilege of just having a very brief interaction with him, and um, and I asked him, you know, what what what is your take on Dionysus? The reason I'd asked is because my my name, Denny, literally means adept of Dionysus, right? Um uh and uh and and he said, Well, listen, I don't know very much about Dionysus, which was a lie. Um he said to me that you know, when I was writing Geosophia, the Argo of Magic, his part two of the Goetic Encyclopedia, uh, which is already two volumes, well, that just that middle part is uh is is two volumes. He said, I did a word count for various words that appeared in there, and it turns out that, you know, apart from articles like A, V, you know, we, it, you know, and so on, the most common proper name comes up in these two large volumes is Dionysus. Uh, you know, it's a it's a volume about the origins of magic. So I think that Dionysus is is pretty important, and as we as we know he embodies the full.
SPEAKER_03Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yes, definitely.
SPEAKER_03Going back to festivals, they had festivals for him, they had days to celebrate him. Like, yeah, even though we've kind of forgotten him today, but he will not be forgotten.
SPEAKER_00Right, right, right. Yeah, he was quite threatening. He was quite threatening to the status quo. They they they didn't necessarily like the uh the the dyads, um, yeah, causing all kind of trouble and wailing in the woods and and so on, and uh and just being being wild, simply being wild, yeah, yeah. Um but uh but yes, I mean what's new, magic is threatening, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but you an archaic society also see this this this concept of ecstatic wage or ecstatic uh trance and all that. These are concepts, and they had regard for that. And once you you've grinded after astrology and maybe back again to the Arcanian legends, I have I have still another chunk for you, and you should not have to do anything, but there is something on uh on Spotify, it's like the book of Vitruvius Architectura, it's like an yeah, but it's very lengthy, it's like maybe 20 25 hours. But listening to and there's this English translation, and there you find so what I was just saying, how the building of the city should be accordingly with with the uh yeah, with the with the planets and all that, but he's also telling about the uh how do you call it the different pillars, the classical pillars, so the uh eonic, uh deolic, and Corinthian, which you also see like a Freemasonry. But he sells he says, okay, but the structure of that, the look of or the outlook has to be accordingly to the gods of those temples. And then he was saying, okay, like the Corinthian uh should be with the modern earth goddesses, or even like the Bacchus temple. So, yeah, so like the Dionysus uh kind of ecstatic uh so this was really embedded back in in those days, you know. What is that? Maybe uh in the first century, even you know, and these are concepts probably very old, older than that. You see how they have that uh hands-on, like those ideas and everything like yeah, no, that then we are living in a poor world nowadays.
SPEAKER_00I think we're working towards a new renaissance. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. The path towards it. I I hope it's an easy one. Let's go with that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah. I like that.
SPEAKER_00But I think sorry, Bjorn. No, go ahead, go ahead. No, no, no, no, I said what I was gonna say.
SPEAKER_02I'd rather hear you talking than myself. Yeah, yeah. So I so I can learn something what I say already. I'm pragmatic. I know I've lost it. A A D mind, I lost it. I'm sorry, I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_04Um I lost it really, I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_00So have I, so have I. I don't even know what we were talking about. That was fun though.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, trivial stuff, of course, trivial stuff. Some some chit chat that isn't going chit chat.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. That's right, that's right. Mercury in retrograde still, huh? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Oh, yeah. Oh, sorry.
SPEAKER_00Go ahead is it is it even still in retrograde? I don't even know.
SPEAKER_03Probably. And you know, normally I'm like, oh, Mercury, it's just kind of how it's going backwards and all these other things, but let me tell you, this has been like the hardest two weeks with communication and technology and YouTube.
SPEAKER_00I don't know if you've been having trouble, but yeah, yeah, just every every bit of technology that could go wrong. It's funny, my father doesn't believe in this stuff at all. Like at all. He's very interested, he's very supportive. Bless him. You know, I tell him that I've just been teaching a class on tarot or whatever, and he goes, Oh, fine, that's that's good for you, good for you.
SPEAKER_02And cut your hair and find a real job. Yeah, right, right.
SPEAKER_00But but no, no, on the contrary, he's he's he's very proud that I've found a way of uh of of being okay in the world despite being useless. Just kidding, by the way, he is actually quite proud of me, which is very sweet. Um but um yeah, he was saying to me, Daniel, I don't know what's been going on this week. This is a conversation I was having last week. Like everything I touch, like I I and all all my emails are being lost, you know, people aren't receiving them. Like my my my computer's breaking down. You know, I I called him and he didn't have his speakers on, so he couldn't hear me. He was trying to work out what was going on. I actually had to call him on the phone to say, listen, turn your speakers on. It's very, very confusing. I said, you know, some people in in some weird communities believe that uh when Mercury can be seen going backwards in the sky, it kind of has an effect. And it's like, ah, that's all rubbish. And it's like, when did it start? Started on this day. Oh well, you know, kind of when Mercury went retrograde, but anyway.
SPEAKER_03That is funny. Oh my gosh, I like that.
SPEAKER_02So now I'm curious if these forces of nature are so pertinent, what can we do about them? And should we do anything about it or should we just go with the flow? And how do we do it?
SPEAKER_00It's one that's quite quite close to my heart. It's a good question. Really good question. Because um, because yes, you know, I I think that a lot of people who get into astrology and into tarot, if if that's their route, you know, they go from being a perfect muggle to getting into magic via astrology or tarot or any kind of divination system, right? And they get really, really good at that divination system, and that becomes their focus and their practice and their speciality. It's very easy to fall into a fatalistic mindset and to decide the cards say this is what's going to happen. You can't mess with what's going to happen. What's going to happen is going to happen. Versus another crowd who might get into uh like thaumaturgy, just uh mundane magic first, right? Um, or thaumaturgy at any point, you know, even if they got into theogy first and then got into thaumaturgy, uh, the the miracle making, right? And then then get into tarot, or then get into astrology. You already know that you can have an effect on your life via certain magical technologies. And so you don't have this fatalistic perspective when you get into the divination system, the way somebody who's only got a divination system uh might develop and then say, well, how can magic work? Because it's all predetermined. We can't fight the fates. Well, we can fight the fates, that's what magic is actually about. And uh and I think that a lot of um a lot of Vedic astrology, uh, and I really like this about Vedic astrology, is that there's this concept of remediation. Um so I have an ascendant in uh cancer, and and that's why I need pearls touching my skin. Um ideally in a ring on my little finger, but I couldn't find a masculine-looking ring. I'm a vein bastard, I'm sorry. Um that would actually touch my skin, right? Uh where the pearl would actually touch my skin. Uh, couldn't find anything like that, so I thought, is this gonna be good enough? Yeah, turns out perfectly fine. Yeah. It's remediation, it's about handling some of the things that might set you off balance, right? Uh, this is actually something that talked about in my recent Magic and Mysteries of Mars class, you know, about uh about finding your centre, about finding your core, your authentic self, and about working out the things that might draw you away from that, right? Set you off balance. And uh, and for me, with a with an ascendant in uh in uh cancer, it tends to be emotions, right? I I get thrown off by very strong emotions, and uh, and so and so pearls are supposed to help me to kind of soften those emotions, make them more manageable, make them less in control. I mean put me a little bit more in control of them, nevertheless, you know, experiencing them, but but uh not repressing them, but also not giving them so much power. And I have to admit, listen, I've been wearing this for two weeks now. Extraordinary. Is it a placebo effect? Does it matter?
SPEAKER_02A placebo is magic. That's a scientific explanation of magic, then they call a placebo. There you go.
SPEAKER_00There you go. It sounds more fancy, but it's the same. That's right. That's right. Yeah, I have no problem with the placebo effect. It sounds very dismissive, so I don't I don't love it, right? I don't love talking about placebo effect in uh in magic, but that's exactly what uh you know what placebo is. Placebo is magic. Um but um but yes, again, whether it is the actual placebo effect at work here or whether the pearls against my skin have an aff an uh an actual immaterial effect. And maybe it's it's magic. It doesn't matter. What did you say, Bjorn? Maybe it's maybe maybe it's both. Maybe it's both, maybe maybe it is.
SPEAKER_03I'm always gonna lean towards it's magic, it'll always be magic, because I'm always gonna sit with the possibility of always magic.
SPEAKER_00This, exactly this, Morgan, yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Strongly, strongly agree.
SPEAKER_03Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00How much how much more prominent in my picture my kitchen is than my bookcase.
SPEAKER_03Oh no, no.
SPEAKER_00If I move if I move over here.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, there you go. The center thing. Yes.
SPEAKER_00Much better.
SPEAKER_03Well that camera angles, so you can get like the best possible thing, you know. Do that. I yeah, I like that. No. I actually did the uh Vedic astrology through someone named Merlin, actually.
SPEAKER_00Oh nice. Just the right, the right kind of initiation. Nice.
SPEAKER_03Yes, because you did like you did. That was one of the first classes I took with you was making your astrology, like using talismans with the astrology, using them as guardians, like or making something like that. And that's my favorite part of astrology too, is actually like hands-on working with it or making a birthday.
SPEAKER_00Practical.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00Just um, not just going, oh, Saturn's in my second house. No money. Oh well.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. But I I'm I'm learning more and more about leaning into a birth chart as well, about um accepting where things are in your birth chart and making your plans accordingly, right? Okay, I'm gonna have a problem here, so I should make provisions for the fact that I'm going to have a problem here. I I shouldn't embark on a on a project that's going to assume that I'm gonna be great with money. If I've got Saturn in my second house. Um, you know, I I can't look at someone who doesn't have Saturn in their second house and go, why can't I have what they have? No, I should be doing my own thing, my own thing that assumes that I have the bird chart that I have. So it's more like uh forewarned is forearmed, something like that.
SPEAKER_03Absolutely. I Lutero everything, absolutely. It's like that, yes. Especially like you said, it's so individualistic. And I think that's the one thing people forget is that everything you do is how you're going to do it. Very individualistic, and you shouldn't look to another person or look to how somebody else is doing it. Like it's a study of yourself, that throws some people off a lot.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely, completely, completely, Morgan. I think that you can absolutely look at someone else and go, wait, they're doing it like this, and I think that could work for me. Like, that's that's valid. I'll try it out. Oh, yeah, no, turns out it doesn't work for me at all.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00I mean, whatever, right? Or maybe wow, so glad I tried that because that's now part of my toolbox, right?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00So yes, but then to go, yeah, this person is doing it like this, and I can't get it to work for me. What's wrong with me? You know, let me try it more, let me keep pushing. It's not working. Why doesn't magic work for me? Yeah, no, no, it's like, no, no. We we need we need our own stuff. Oh, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02That's also difficult, I think. So we we all teach, you know, and the thing is here, uh I totally agree with what you're saying, but on the other hand, if you look at it in a pragmatic way, people do need some mentorship. So for some kind of reason, that's at least as I think, and and you uh are free to disagree, please say so. But I think it's also important that that that you somehow teach people, okay, do it this way, and when you grasp that, then make your own thing on it because you easily agree with it. Oh, and anything goes, then I'm afraid that a lot of people won't make it and they will be disappointed.
SPEAKER_03No, then yeah, there's always the foundations, learning the foundations, like you said, of what the zodiac is, of what the houses are, of what the signs are, the trines, and that like you're giving them the foundation of exactly what everything means. And then once you've got that basics, taking it in your direction, you know.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so I fully strongly agree. And in fact, to a lot of people who are just getting started, I say to them learn a system, you know, get into a system, fully invest in that system, let that system become your system for a while. Keep in the back of your mind that you will then need to break away from that system and make your own system. Do get into a system and learn that system deeply and um and and let that system completely take over so that you know what it feels like to be in a system, but also do assume that that system is not your system because your system needs to be the system that you create for yourself.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, no, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00Well, that's what but but but a system will give you an idea of what's possible, a system will give you an idea of what does and doesn't work for you, uh, a system will give you an idea what to look out for, to avoid, and so on and so forth. Yeah, sounds sounds like classical mentorship.
SPEAKER_03No, definitely, yeah. You always have to learn what the thing is, like even bicycle riding. What you know, you've got to learn how to ride a bike, but then you're gonna decide if you want the mountain one or just around the neighborhood, or you know, city biking. Same with anything you do, yeah.
SPEAKER_02But it always takes two to tango, you know. It's like like the mentor and the students. Uh yeah, you know, you have to also have to have a good vibe.
SPEAKER_00Um, yeah, not everything goes, maybe. No, I have this um aversion to authority. We too? Yeah, yeah. I think that this quite it's quite common in the magical environment, which is why I very often unfortunately see many um magic groups getting quite toxic. Um yeah, because everyone wants to be their own authority. And a group is precisely about people under the tutelage of a person, and then it becomes, yeah, why are you the favorite? I should be the favorite, and also this person should be in charge, I should be in charge, etc. etc. So I I avoid groups like the plague, um, but I know that a lot of people need groups in order to thrive, right? They they need the support of the support and example of people around them. They need to be able to bounce off other people, right? To bounce off the the environment, uh, you know, uh to have other people help hold them accountable and things like this. So I I I certainly don't discourage people who feel like they need a group from joining a group, but uh but yes, I and this is why I have books. Books is like having a mentor who can't talk back. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02A good sparring round, so now and so a good sparring round now and then does sharpen your abilities.
SPEAKER_00Yes, it does. Yes, it does. So it it's also important to have conversation with other magical practitioners. I guess that's the reason why I set up the the foolish wish discord uh community, which by the way, and every Patreon members get free access to. Um, not free access, it's the price of the Patreon, which starts at $2 a month. There we go. Please subscribe. Um but yes, it gives you access to other practicing magicians so that you can then say, This is what I'm doing, and other magicians can say. They can't say don't do it like this, they can't say you should do it like that, because we've got rules within the community. You can't tell someone what to do, what not to do. But you can say, This is what I would do, right? You can ask for advice and then receive advice. It's if someone's not asking for advice and they you're not allowed to give them advice if they if it's uh if it's unsolicited. Yeah, we've got a very strict rule term, but yes, it's it is important to have some sparring from time to time, just as you say, Bjorn. Yeah, uh be able to bounce your ideas off other people. I think it's in a in a controlled environment, in a in a respectful environment where people aren't being dismissed for having a different kind of magic from someone else, I guess. Definitely, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02You do a great job. You do so such a great job. Also, your YouTube channel and all that. I have to admit, I have not seen all because I I have to be strict and and and what I consume because I have the same brain as you, so I have to make four publications this year, so I'm very restricted. And so once in a while I I watch a um uh yeah an episode of in your YouTube channel, but from the moment that I have my hands free, I will see them all. But I can definitely really, really advise, and not that you are sitting here, but really like genuine, and and I don't say this often. And Morgan knows that from behind the scenes. I really respect your work. So thank you so much, Bionna.
SPEAKER_00Um thank you. Really appreciate that. Thank you so much, so so much. Yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_02It's good, and that has to be called out. It's good, it's really good. Nice, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Yes, yes, you yeah, everything you do is always magical, it's amazing. It's and you learn something every time, especially how you see things like that, the magical aspect.
SPEAKER_00Blessed with a lot of excitement in my life.
SPEAKER_01Uh that's a good thing.
SPEAKER_00Yes, yes, it is, yes it is. And and I get to I get to share some of that, and and I enjoy sharing some of that, you know, even if the experiences are sometimes a little bit weird. Uh it's always it's always material for growth, and uh, and I think that's ultimately what it's all about, isn't it? So if I can share a little bit.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm always is there still another thing uh that you want to say to the people that we did not ask or that you want to throw in the world in a magical way now?
SPEAKER_00I think there are two places left on the I'm just gonna do a bit of of self promotion now. Uh I think there are there are two places left on the um um on the South of France retreat uh through um magicalretreats dot com. Uh so that's seven seven days in the south of France, basically eating a lot of luxury foods, going around um uh uh places of mystery and uh and power, uh learning about the divine feminine in the Western magical current. Um uh so I'll be teaching for about an hour every day, and then the rest of the day is just gonna be having a lovely time. Uh so that that's that's yeah, so so there it it yeah, uh it's for six, it's limited to six places, and four places are gone already. As you can imagine, the the there's a price tag that goes along with that. So please don't be too disappointed when you guys look at the uh uh the website. Um uh but if if anyone listening is feeling particularly wealthy and up for a magical experience, that's gonna be pretty cool. Um I'm uh my my main web my website is uh foolishfish.net, uh as in Fishnet, you know. Um and um and there you can find all the stuff like my uh my foolish fish's folk and fairy tale cards of fate and fortune, which I designed.
SPEAKER_04Uh yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there we go. Uh come on. If I come right up close and then perfect. Okay, and these are cards in a little little tiddly cards um uh in a tin featuring just lines from fairy tales.
SPEAKER_03Oh, how fun.
SPEAKER_00There we go. That's great. I use those for divination. There you go, they're pretty fun. Uh so you'll be able to find those there, you'll be able to find my classes there, you'll be able to book a one-to-one conversation with me there. I can uh one-to-one conversations is a lot of fun, actually, where people just call me to tell me about their background. I give them some recommendations for their own magical practice and their path ahead, you know, especially for people who don't who like me, don't like groups, you know, and uh but still would like a little bit of guidance. And I can give them um some book recommendations, I can read their tarot basically, give them an idea of what would be good for them and things like this. It's uh we we spend an hour together and uh and we have some fun. Um yeah, uh uh and um and let me see, and uh and yeah, and and really the best way to support me and my community is uh is by joining the Patreon. Um yeah, membership starts at $2. And if you join at $10, then you get a monthly guided meditation and you uh get mentioned in my daily, I have a daily magical practice of uh asking the planetary spirits and entities of the day to bless me and this and that and this and that and this and that person who has asked for the blessings uh from the ten dollar tier of members. Um and uh and yes, and all of all of uh Patreon members get access to the Discord, which is just the the community where we share everything from pet pictures, but it's mostly it's mostly magic-related stuff. Yeah, there's uh there's there's a there's a various categories. One of the categories is just social sharing memes and stuff, uh, but most of it is um aspects of magic and it's uh it's a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, looks like it. Because on YouTube it gives you little blurbs of what you can do. Um and yeah, I didn't mean to do that because the bright one looked really interesting, you know, where you had to pick a symbol.
SPEAKER_00Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I've been doing that quite a bit uh recently. I've really been enjoying that. So I've been transitioning on my my uh channel from yeah, what I've traditionally been doing, a lot of book reviews in the past, right? I've I made an announcement that I won't be doing any more book reviews, although I do still have one or two books that I still have promo promised that I was going to review, and I will review those. Um but I I need to have the freedom to read whatever I I want in order to be able to continue growing in order to have something to offer, right? If I'm just reading the latest new releases, then I'm constantly reading the new thing because the latest new releases are always naturally about um introductions to magic. Got my introduction to magic. Yeah, so I just I just need to have the freedom to read whatever I want. And so I'm not doing that any anymore so much. Uh I'm doing a lot of tarot reads, so uh kind of difficult to read for a for a large audience, and so what I do is that I pick three symbols and I encourage people to pick a symbol at the beginning just intuitively, and then to to head to this section of the of the the video um where I'm reading for that symbol. And yeah, and people have been responding really, really positively, saying that it's been very helpful for them, and and that's the point, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, just just be be as practical as I can, right?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but that's good, that's a good thing, you know. The more practical that you can make, and I I think that's that's you are the the the real ultimate guy for that to make something complex to make it simple. Thank you, Bjorn. I I appreciate those lovely words. You're very kind. Yeah. There is your task. Here you go. Yeah. Thank you.
SPEAKER_00Thank you very much for this other uh very uh inspiring uh it's been a great, great pleasure. Thank you so much for having me on the show. I uh I I've I've enjoyed both sessions so so much.
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, we too. We too.
SPEAKER_03Yes, definitely us too. It's fun. We'll we will circle back on you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03I mean in future, not now, not future.
SPEAKER_02This is not the last, this is not the last time you are obligated to come back. Now you're not but for now we wish you a lot of uh success. I hope that your uh retreat uh in the south of France will be a big uh yeah. I'm candled, so I I will be looking right away uh to the website. So from the moment, yeah, I I will make sure that I keep updated uh from that because yeah, for me it's not that far. And um from the moment that I have the chance, uh I will be at one at your events. Uh yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Great stuff. Yeah, yeah. As I say, the the it it's not it's not cheap. I I'm not the one organizing, I don't get a say there, but uh, but yes, just to set your expectations. It's um it's it's it's not within the reach of most mortals.
SPEAKER_03So you're you're offering but yeah, but what you're offering is this experience to like dive deep actually at location and learn about all of these things, like have that aspect like from instead of reading the books, now you're like living the history.
SPEAKER_00So that's the big an experience in itself that's worth it. Should be a lot of fun. Should be a lot of fun.
SPEAKER_03Yes, yeah, absolutely. I love that.
SPEAKER_02Okay, have a nice day. Um success. Um yeah, everyone listening, please follow uh uh his socials. Uh go to his uh YouTube, uh Patreon, you know, as for a very reasonable price for such great information you cannot find anywhere else so structured and so yeah within reach and so clear.
SPEAKER_03So yeah, yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_02Thank you. See you next time. Thank you, Morgan.
SPEAKER_03Yes, thank you. It's always good to see you.
SPEAKER_02Have a nice day.
SPEAKER_03Yes, bye.
