Dune Part 12 - Time to Meet Your Maker

Paul rides the worm, turning a rite of passage into another future legend. Old friends return and trust must be reestablished. What happens when one drinks the Water of Life who was never meant to?

Transcript

Worm Riding Trial & Desert Lore

Michael Kentris 0:06

Hello and welcome back to Brothers Reading Books, your sci-fi fantasy literature podcast book club thing. So, we as ever are your hosts. I am Michael Kentris, and I'm joined by my lovely brother. Will Kentris. How are you doing, Will? I'm doing very well. How about you, Michael? I'm also well. And, you know, we're just moving right along in this book. You know, it's funny. I remember the last time I read this book, especially during like kind of the trippy acid, you know, let's just call it desert acid trip, like getting bogged down a little bit and just like losing motivation. But going through it this time with you, it's really helped keep my attention tight and focused. And uh I hope our listeners feel the same way. I'm glad to have added a new benefit to your reading experience. Yeah, it's one of those things where I just sometimes you can really feel that you're reading a certain era of science fiction. You know, like if you're reading something from like the 60s or 50s or even earlier, like Jules Burns type stuff, right? It's got that kind of Victor Victorian flair for like the time machine or some such. Sure. But uh but this very much has like a sixties flavor at some points. Um and I would say that uh that whole scene with the water of life is is one of those for me. But uh it seemed to flow a little a little more easily this time. Yeah, I know whenever I get to scenes like that, just in general, where I know I personally I have a hard time visualizing things in general with books. So when it comes to things that even to people who may not struggle with those things who struggle to visualize what's happening, it's like, all right, we're reading the words and we're continuing on. We're not gonna allow ourselves to be halted by trying to process 100% what is going on. Right. It's it's a vibe, as the kids might say. We we accept it and go on. Just let it marinate in in your hindbrain. That's right. That's right. Today we are doing chapters or sections, since there's not chapters proper. And that that is the one thing that drives me crazy about this book is that we're referencing chapters that don't exist. But uh sections 42 through 44 today. And as always, spoilers incoming. So, Will, give us our hot take summary of this section of the book. Absolutely. So previously we had left Paul in trepidation for his, you know, trial, the right of the maker, writing, sandwriters, whatever you want to call it. But uh that chapter is uh Paul and Silbar go for a ride, and then we get a point of view shift to Gurney. Gurney and the smugglers get ambushed, and then we end things up with Paul convincing everybody to just get along. There you go. That's it. That's the end of the show. That's all you need to know. Everything else is just fat. It's window dressing. But as we have uh considerably more time to fill here, so so yes, right, this is the the thing that's been hinted at for several things, right? Both in Paul's Visions, where he has the vision of a Freeman riding on a maker, and then like, you know, I think there's been hints in some of the reports the Harkinans got, or maybe it was Thufer, I can't recall exactly. But uh, you know, of perhaps seeing something, you know, playing tricks on their eyes in the desert. But uh here we are, up close and personal with uh riding the worm.

SPEAKER_00 3:39

That's right.

Michael Kentris 3:40

So it's exactly what it sounds like. So as we always start off, we have a quote here from the Princess of Rulin's many works. You cannot avoid the interplay of politics within an Orthodox religion. This power struggle permeates the training, educating, and disciplining of the Orthodox community. Because of this pressure, the leaders of such a community inevitably must face the ultimate internal question to succumb to complete opportunism as the price of maintaining the rule or risk sacrificing themselves for the sake of the Orthodox ethic from Mu'adib, the religious issues. So, as always, some this is one that I think ties in well, not necessarily to this chapter specifically, although there are hints of it, but especially kind of towards the end of this reading section for today, where uh so we have an Orthodox religion, right? So, as as I may have mentioned before, right, I'm an Orthodox Christian, you know, there's Orthodox sects of Judaism, other religions. Basically, what like it roughly translates to is like you know, right seeming. So kind of the people tend to be a little more strictly adherent to traditions in a broad sense. So it's it's kind of interesting here that we have this tension, right? Paul is bringing in things that are new, but he is also the fulfillment of all these prophecies, which a lot of times in kind of these messianic type belief systems is what happens. And so they have to struggle against sometimes the people which they are leading, which you know is, I think, some pretty heavy foreshadowing. Absolutely. No, like you said, particularly in this third chapter we're covering today, that 100% does seem to be kind of, yeah, trying to again work against the tides of the people as opposed to the time nexus that he's usually been trying to struggle against. Oh man, I got at the end, I got thoughts about the time nexus. Time nexus. Anyway, so Paul is waiting, or lying in wait, I should say, for the worm. So so he he's kind of having like little flashbacks here to the instruction that Stilgar had given him here. Like, how far outside the radius must you stand in the peace and you know, and uh to avoid the vortex, blah, blah, blah, right? So kind of like all these things, like you must do this, you must do that. So he's kind of getting all of the like little flashback instructions in his memory here. Right, yeah. It sounds like he has had experience riding worms previously, but those are just smaller, quote unquote tame ones that they have to, you know, not go drastically from no worm riding experience to, as they call it, summon a wild maker, an old man of the desert. So much, much bigger. And again, I think I think this is another parallel in language here, the the old man of the desert. So in a lot of uh classic mythology, you know, Greek-Roman in particular, uh, they refer to the old man of the sea, which is uh Nereus, so kind of like a predating sea deity, like preceding like you know, Neptune, Poseidon. Okay. And um so I again, right, it's just these little parallels that they keep doing with the desert and the ocean. Which I can't believe I haven't referenced it yet in this entire conversation. But for those who are fans of the band America and the song The Horse with No Name, I believe there's a lyric that goes uh the ocean is a desert with its life underground and the perfect disguise above. So anyway, I believe this was written before America had published their pop folk country songs, which I'm quite fond of. But uh But anyway, I just thought it was an interesting parallel there. One one quick tangent also while we're talking about America. I remember seeing we had like a CD growing up where it's like America's greatest hits, and I was unfamiliar with the fact that this group's name was America, so I just thought it was a broad classification of America, the country's greatest hits. This is all they all sound very similar to one another. Where's the John Phillips Seusa? Oh my goodness, that's great. So the worm approaches, and as they go here, so I remember reading this part here that he he has this thought that they know the hooks, right? That they position their hooks, they bring those irritant barbs as high as possible away from the sand that threaten the soft interlapping of its ring segment. And so I had uh a thought here. So, like, who was the first guy to like figure this out, right? You can't imagine that it went smoothly the first time or the second time, or the third time. Like, our food is getting drunk on like spice beer and like jumping on these worms. It it definitely kind of makes me think also kind of similarly to, you know, how do we discover which certain types of foods are edible, you know, certain mushrooms versus others? Like, you know, not everybody got to experience the fruits of this collective made Steve turn purple and die in like two hours. Tony Thess one. But this one tastes really good. Right. So so yeah, anyway, I that was just like a a random thought I had while I was reading this. I'm like, hold on a second. That's this sounds like a very specific sp skill set, and how how did that come about?

SPEAKER_00 9:02

Mm-hmm.

Michael Kentris 9:02

Anyway. It's uh it's just amusing to me. So he he gets up on the worm, right? He gets his hooks locked in, and you don't get this word very often in science fiction. He suppressed a sudden urge to covort there. You know, covorting isn't something we normally associate with science fiction writing, but uh perhaps we should. Perhaps there should be more covorting in our lives. More covorting. But yes, uh, he talks about he has a memory, he suddenly understood why Stilgar had warned him once about brash young men who danced and played with these monsters, doing handstands on their backs, removing both hooks and replanting them before the worm could spill them. Which sounds like it would be deadly, essentially, like the worm kind of do a dive and then they'd get sucked under the vortex, much like our old friend Dr. Kynes. I mean, uh, but I do understand, obviously, you know, people do seek out those adrenaline lush adrenaline rushes. So Right, right. Rightly, rightly warned. So yeah. Uh Paul brings the worm around, picks up his buds, the Fatakin and Stilgar. Mm-hmm. And uh Stilgar is like doing his his checks here as the the band leader, and he checks the position of Paul so glanced up at Paul's smiling face. It's like, isn't he wearing mask? I guess it can see the eyes. He's smizing. But but we get a little a little chastisement here from Stilgar. And uh this is just this is nice here. You did it. And uh basically Paul's like, I s I saw the drum sand, uh is how it feels. Right. And he's like, Well, why didn't you signal for backup? You know, that's what you should have done. That's like the safe way to do it. Right. Even in a test. Right. So anyway, Paul's like, Yeah, yeah, you're right. You know, he he suppresses his anger and basically says, Remember, we work together. And then Paul's like, we work together. So they kind of like uh you know, do their worm calls, worm directions, right? This traditional call, the left-sided steersman opened a ring segment and he turns to protect it, right? So and we get to this uh Gay rat, which is uh this is a real word, this one. Oh uh roughly. It's traced back to Persian, roughly meaning honor, dignity, protection of family and self-respect. Uh but in this context it just means straight ahead. Which I guess makes sense if you're thinking of like honor and dignity. It's like kind of a straight ahead sort of thing.

SPEAKER_00 11:31

Mm-hmm.

Ambush Setup And Smuggler Bait

Michael Kentris 11:32

Anyway. So Yeah, uh this is it w it's it's kind of one of those ecologic type chapters at this point where we get like, oh, there's uh the goaters pounding the tail segments to make the worm go faster. So it's basically like um how do we how do we make the worm go? How long go? Desert power. Uh let's see here. So right, you are a sandwider this day. Hal yom. Finally, at last. Or now at last, I think is what that translates to, which is related to kind of an Arabic phrase al Yam, which means today. So it's interesting, like like we said before, and multiple times since then, that uh some of these words are rooted in real-world languages, others less so. And it's just it's one of those things where you're never quite sure, which it's I suppose a credit to the author here that I can't always tell. Absolutely. Yeah. No, it's it's definitely been a reoccurring thing. It's like, is this real? Is this a dune thing? Mm-hmm. And it seems to be kind of fifty-fifty. Yes. Or they're changed just slightly, like an extra letter or an extra syllable, where it's like, it's kind of similar to this other thing. Mm-hmm. So yeah, it sounds like as part of the tradition of passing this warm writing test, that he gets to choose their destination. And Paul is definitely wanting to go south into the deep desert. He wants to go 20 thumpers deep. He wants to see the land that they would make, this land that I've only seen through the eyes of others. He also wants to go see Chani and his son, who are yeah, in some sort of seat in the deep south. And yeah, it sounds like unless you are, you know, kind of carded along as kind of like this invalid- I think we talked about this before as like an invalid or other sort of, you know, less than a capable adult, you kind of like get this disrespected role of like, here, ride this palinquin on the worm as we travel. Right, right. So now that he's a fully fledged sandwider, now he's like now I want to go. Yes. But uh Stillgar is like, oh, the men are eager to raid with you in the Harkin and Sinks, and the sinks are only a thumper away. And he's like fit, like, well, they'll raid with me again. It's uh there's kind of like this silence between them, and he's like, like we keep getting this hint, like, you know, he's gonna call me out, right? Take the leadership, which in the Freeman culture means like a uh combat trial to de to the death. Yeah, kind of like Jameis. Exactly. And so we get this uh this thing here where he asks uh do you wish a gathering of the leaders, right? So with implication, the unspoken thing, like, do you want to do this thing? And uh Chani's here with them, obviously, and we get a look of unrest, and we have Stilgar here, who is her uncle, which I did not realize before, and Paul Muadib, her mate. And we get this phrase again, you are the Moodyer of the Sandrai this day, how do you use this power? Moodyer boss, right? And Paul's like, we need time to relax, time for cool reflection he thinks, and we'll go south. And so as they're kind of doing this, right, there'll be a gathering, I'll send the messages. He thinks I'll call him out, Paul thought, and he knows he cannot stand against me. Which, you know, we get again, this is part of some of the speech making that comes later in our section for today. But he he is focused on trying to still prevent the jihad, his terrible purpose. Um that doesn't get mentioned till later, but he he's still focused on preventing this jihadic war. I guess is that that's redundant to say. But so as they're going here, uh they talk about stopping for the evening meal and prayer at the cave of birds beneath Habanyah Ridge, and he's like, Does my decision suit Muaddib? Only the faintest touch of sarcasm tinged his voice. So it's kind of interesting, right? We we have this duality of Paul as not the leader of the tribe, but Paul as the kind of prophesied figure. Mm-hmm. Yeah, there definitely seems to be kind of this, like you said, kind of reoccurring tension between them. Kind of this indecision of who is actually leading here, and kind of also why all these young men are like, hey, call out Stilgar. We want you to be the leader now. Right. And we get this, I guess it's stated explicitly here. Stilgar heard me swear my loyalty to him when we consecrated the Fedakian. And then Stilgar says, Usul, the companion of my siege, him I would never doubt, but you are Paul Muaddib, the Atreatis Duke, and you are the Lisan al-Ghaib, the voice from the outer world. These men I don't even know. So again, right, all these identities and titles that that Paul carries here. So it uh it's one of those situations where, you know, which which face are you presenting in different situations here? And I think a lot of this segment is fusing these different aspects of Paul together so that he is no longer this person in that situation, but another person in a different situation. So we kind of have this fusion of identities as we go forward here. Right, yeah. It does it does seem like Stilgar has this lurking suspicion that Paul is going to try and call him out. He even kind of references this anecdote of the one who led Tabor's siege before me. He was my friend, we shared dangers, he owed me his life many a time, and I owed him mine. And again, Paul's trying to assuage him, dissuade any doubts about, you know, his loyalty. He's like, I'm your friend, Stilgar, and it's like, no man doubts it. And he's like, it's the way. Again, it's the tradition of things. Right. Now I wondered. You know, for for our Star Wars fans out there, did the Mandalorian take their their notorious phrase, it is the way from from this. I mean, granted, it's a fairly ubiquitous phrase, but you know, we get you know, desert honor culture here, Mandalorian kind of like a space honor culture. Sure. There's parallels. Absolutely. I know. I mean, the Mandalorian people, yeah. Especially like renowned as warriors, and so are the Fremen. So I wouldn't I wouldn't put it past George Lucas or whoever wrote. Yeah, whoever's writing these days. Whoever's writing. But but yes, right, we have this explicitly said, right? Here a leader took the reins from the dead hands of his predecessor or slew among the strongest of his tribe if a leader died in the desert. Stilgar had risen to be a naive in that way. The lieutenant, the naive. So anyway. So as they're kind of going back and forth about going south, all of a sudden, Paul World. The spice blue overcast on his eyes made the sky appear dark, a richly filtered azure against which a distant rhythmic flashing stood out in sharp contrast.

unknown 18:44

Ornithopter.

Michael Kentris 18:45

So something here that I think you can almost miss if you don't think about it. The spice blue overcast on his eyes made the sky appear dark. It's almost the same way like um like people in the northern climates have like snow goggles, right? Just to keep them from going snow blind. Is this what happens with the spice during the day? Like, is this like an adaptation? I don't know. Like all of a sudden I'm like, it changes their vision too, because if it's only affecting like blue within blue eyes, normally normal human, you know, physiology, the sclera color doesn't really affect your vision that much. Right. The iris color, there is maybe some association with light sensitivity, but it's the opposite of what we're seeing in Dune here, where lighter colored eyes tend to be more sensitive to brightness than darker colored eyes. Just a I mean, not like a huge spectrum, but it's like a slight variation, uh, which would make sense if they were primarily nocturnal, that they would need the light. But um but during the day it would be potentially a disadvantage. So anyway, I just thought this was a weird thing. It's like, is he like going around with like you know colored lenses over them? Is it involving the lenses as well as just the cornea and the sclera? Or the iris and the sclera, I should say. So anyway, just a weird medical question I had. I did have a similar thought because yeah, I didn't realize that the change in color of their eyes, yeah, was also potentially impacting the color of their vision as well. Yeah. Like it does say I have some interesting Introduces some interesting questions. Yes. Anyway. Just a strange thing. Caught my caught my eye. Anyway. Alright, so they see the Ornithopter and it's like, could it be a scout? Could it be smugglers? What do we do? And so they make a decision. We gotta let the worm go, right? We can't be seen writing the worm. This is one of their big society secrets. So, first up, last off, Paul says, and so everyone kind of starts exiting stage right. Right. And then they get the idea to go ahead and lay a trap, since they do verify it as a smuggler craft. And so they go ahead and bait a patch of sand and kind of just secrete themselves into the sand as well to lay an ambush for for these smugglers. Right, so they do like a thin dusting of spice over the sand to make them think that it's a pocket worth mining. And so And I should say, like, we kind of skipped over a little bit, but the uh the part here where Paul exits the worm, or gets off the worm, it talks about this is a tricky moment with a worm not completely exhausted. So it began burrowing into the sand, Paul ran lightly back along its broad surface, judged his moment carefully, and leaped off. I thought that was that was pretty cinematic sounding here, right? So it's I don't know, it's pretty cool. Absolutely. So, so yes, smuggler craft, and they bait the sand and catches some smugglers. They should be taught that this is our land and our men need practice with the new weapons. So he's like, now Usal speaks. Usal thinks Freeman. But Usal must give way to decisions that match a terrible purpose. Terrible purpose. And the storm was gathering. End chapter 42. Uh so yeah. Uh so this is a nice transition here. We get we don't get much in the way of a worm ride here. Uh you know, we kind of build it up as this giant worm that could go for days. And it's like, well, well, guess we gotta let it go. That's right. Gotta keep our secrets secret. Yes. So this is uh again, another so chapter 43 here, another passage. Muaddib, the ninety-nine wonders of the universe by the Princess of Ruin. When law and duty are one, united by religion, you never become fully conscious, fully aware of yourself. You are always a little less than an individual. Which that's kind of like to us, perhaps that sounds like a negative thing. But in in many cultures that would have been like an aspirational state of being. So I thought it was very interesting. So law, duty, religion. Uh like basically you have a belief in the law and the duty, or maybe the law and the duty are mandated by religion.

SPEAKER_00 23:11

I don't know.

Michael Kentris 23:12

There's a lot of different ways to kind of mull that phrase around there.

SPEAKER_00 23:15

Mm-hmm.

Gurney’s Return And Identities Collide

Michael Kentris 23:16

Right, yeah, definitely kind of this idea that you don't necessarily have to make decisions, perhaps. Like it's it's the things that you need to do and follow have already been dictated to you, and you're following this like framework. Right. Yeah, I could see that. So shift POV to smugglership. Uh so we like as you said, we have Gurney Halleck now.

SPEAKER_00 23:43

Mm-hmm.

Sardaukar Revealed And Taken Prisoner

Michael Kentris 23:44

And he with the smugglers. Smuggling. He's with the smugglers. And so this is kind of an interesting little detail here. They are maintaining radio silence, and so we get this um elaborate communication between the ships by the way that they waggle their wings or you know, bob and weave and so so forth, so that that way the Harkinins can't pick up on their radio communications. Right. The equivalent, the ornithopter equivalent of hand signs. Right, right. So what's that uh semaphore with the flags, right? Like the naval from the ship back in the day. Yes. So they're kind of flying around, and they found this spice patch, and he likes this spot. The ridge offered some shielding and protection. This was deep in the desert, an unlikely place for an ambush. Still dot dot dot. Right. You still gotta be a little cautious because again, yeah, they're in they're in Fremen territory. He's aware of that. Right. Right. And it's like, oh, it shouldn't, you know, shouldn't run into them. Uh little very very heavy on the foreshadowing here. Um But yes. Freeman, it was Freeman that worried him. They didn't mind trading for all the spice you could afford, but they were devils on the war path if you stepped foot where they forbade you to go, and they were so devilishly cunning of late. So we kind of get this this thing here. Like Thufer had said this, and now we get uh Gurney Halleck saying it as well, that uh it's almost like strategies I would have formulated myself. So as it was a warfare as good as anything he had ever encountered, and he'd been trained by the best fighters in the universe, then seasoned in battles, but only the superior few survived. So, right? He hasn't he has this uh you know this warrior, battle-hardened sense here that's just like he feels uneasy. I love this random description of uh the factory commander, a one-eyed old pirate with full beard, blue eyes, and the milky teeth of a spice diet. Looks like a rich patch, sir. Shall I take her in? So space pirate. Anyway, so in case of trouble, save the factory, we'll lift in the Thopters. So they kind of make their approach here, and as they get out here, he kind of has his men looking around. It's an interesting dichotomy here, right? He talks about leaving the filter mask off his face, losing moisture for the sake of a greater need, the carrying power of his voice if he had to shout commands. So I thought that was that was very interesting that the Freeman, we haven't had any indication that they fight unmasked, filter mask-wise. So how do they organize their larger sorties, if you will? So anyway, some unanswered questions there, but perhaps there are some other secrets. Maybe they have a hand sign language as well. Wouldn't be surprised. So he's kind of looking around, and in that instant, the ridge erupted. Uh and I thought this was quite good. Twelve roaring pass of flames streaked upward to the hovering Thopters and carrier wing. There came a blast in metal from the factory collar, and the rocks around Gurney were full of hooded fighting men. Gurney had time to think. By the horns of the great mother, rockets! They dare to use rockets. Which those must be the new weapons that Paul had alluded to previously. Yeah, it sounds kind of like, yeah, you know, handheld rocket launchers. Oh fun. So, yeah, he gets face to face with a hooded figure, crouched low, Chris knife at the ready. And he's got two other guys who are kind of like giving them a little bit of space, it sounds like, you know, allowing them to do like a 1v1 type duel. And so, again, Gurney still just trying to evaluate the current situation. He's like, all right, well, if they dared to use rockets, they'd have other projectile weapons, and so he goes to get his knife, but then the masked figure in front of him says, Leave the knife in its sheath, Gurney Halleck. Gurney hesitated. That voice sounded oddly familiar, even through a still suit filter. Yes. So I thought this was in there's a nice little description here. Right. So at the beginning, right, he says the eyes are the blue in blue of the deep desert Freeman. Contrast that with the way he described the the old pirate here. Mm-hmm. Where he said, I believe, light blue. Yeah, blue eyes or milky teeth. But but we do get some discussion at some point, it might be later on, about how the darker the blue of the eyes, the more you were thought to be in the spice, as it were. And if you weren't from Arrakis specifically, you were thought to have gone native. Yeah. The darker blue your eyes go. So we get basically here, before we know it's Paul, that it's the deep desert eyes, right? And so he's gone native. As we I mean, we already know this, but he has taken Chani as his mate. Yes. So anyway, tell your men to stop their useless resistance, and he throws back his hood, swung the filter aside, and he thought he was first looking at a ghost image of Duke Vito Atreides. He's like, Paul, is it truly Paul? And so basically he's like, he's in shock. And uh, you know, Gurney bellows, stop the fighting, this is Gurney Halleck, stop the fight. Find friends. These are friends, Gurney says, Fine friends, our people are murdered, one of his one of his people sh shouts. So yes, it is interesting. And we kind of get this little conversation with Gurney and Paul here, which is in some ways quite touching. We start here with a description. A smile touched Paul's mouth, but there was a hardness in the expression that reminded Gurney of the old Duke, Paul's grandfather. Gurney saw then the sinewy harshness in Paul that had never before been seen in an treatise, a leathery look to the skin, a squint to the eyes, and calculation in the glance that seemed to weigh everything in sight. I think he's like, they said you were dead. It seemed best to let them think so. And so he calls him you young pup. You young pup. And uh Paul's like, Gurney man, Gurney man. I guess it's just it sounds like a real like back thumping embrace, you know? Yes, yes. So yes. Anyway, it's nice. It is so and then Gurney realizes at this point, you're why the Freemen have grown so wise in battle tactics. They keep doing things I could have planned myself. If I'd only known. If you'd only got a word to me, lad, nothing would have stopped me. I'd have come running, and Paul gives him a look here, and he's like, sure, and they'd have went those who wondered why Gurney Halleck went running. So anyway. Alright. He kind of immediately pieces it together. He's like, ah, right. Yes. Right, he's like kind of going through the stages, like, uh, I would have come. It's like, oh, but I couldn't have. And yes. So Paul thinks this is a good omen, and he introduces Gurney to Stilgar, and they're, you know, this is like kind of like, you know, two men with abilities and uh let's just say respectable men, hardened men, and they're kind of you know, just say a little standoffish together. And Paul's like, I would, you know, I'd I'd have you be friends essentially. Right? And then yeah, just real quick, but before that, Paul does ask about the smugglers that Gurney is with. Yes. Gurney says, Yeah, they're smugglers all, they stand where the prophet is. And he notes the subtle finger signal that Gurney flashes him, the old hand coat out of their past. There were men to fear and distrust in the smuggler crew. So again, it sounds like, you know, they're smugglers. They work outside the confines of the law. Right. Outlaws. Outlaws. So so yes, as they're going here, you know, we kind of get this little back and forth here. I might have skipped over this a little bit here, right? They're kind of talking about about rabbin. And uh Gurney's like, I thought I had nothing left but revenge, and you know, he Paul says he's too bad we couldn't have saved the carry all, and Gurney's like, your father would have been more concerned over the men he couldn't save. The difference between them. To you they were your friends, to us they were trespassers, you must understand. And they find out right here they take the worm. And so Gurney says there's been stories and rumors, but it's not a thing easy to believe without seeing it. The creature all men on Arachus fear you treat like a riding animal. And Paul says, You heard my father speak of desert hour. There it is. The surface of this planet is ours. No storm nor creature or condition can stop us. So anyway, anyway, you get there. The s the touch of the spice brush, that was the phrase I had forgotten. A man had gone too native, and there was always a hint of distrust in the idea. So they didn't expect the carriers, the vehicles this far out. So they're kind of talking about strategy at this point in time that some of the people uh the graven villages to the point where you cannot harm them, that you only need to sit inside their defenses while you wear yourselves out in feudal attack. So he asked Gurney, do you enlist with me for the finish of this campaign? I do like Gurney's response there, is like, Enlist, my lord, I've never left your service. It's just again, he's always been loyal to the Duke. That's that's basically what he's been trying to do this whole time is get revenge for the Duke in terms of, you know, killing Harkadans, and also as we find out here in a little bit, the person who he believes is the traitor to the Atreides, Lady Jessica. Yes. So I like this, yeah. The as you said, the offworlders, the three men who are to new recruits. They're not like the usual fortune hunting lot, they're tougher. Harkinen spies. I think that they report to no Harkinin. I suspect they're men of the Imperial Service. They have a hint of Seleucus Secundus about them. Sartakar? Could be. So yes. And uh we get someone who calls up. Right, they're going kind of into this cave, the cave of the birds. Or cave of birds, I should say. And uh there's a storm incoming, so they're gonna take cover here. And so they find out, you know, one of their secret stashes here, and they're kind of going in there. And someone says, Mu'adib, and then Gurney again is shocked. It's like, You're Mu'adib, you're the will o' the sand instead of the you know, will o' the wisp. Yes, will-the-sand. Gurney turns away, feeling an impressive sense of foreboding. So, yes, he had heard stories of Mu'adib, the Lisen al-Gayyib, how he had taken the skin off a Harkinan officer to make his drum heads, how he was surrounded by death commanders, Fatakin who leaped into battle with their death chants on their lips. Him. So this is the second time we've had that kind of capitalized H him. Mm-hmm. So they find his ballaset from the uh the crawler here, and so they they uh give still or give Gurney Halleck back his ballaset. Can't have Gurney without a ballaset. He can't. So so yes, they uh they go in there. Oh, yeah, here's the part where I jumped ahead too. My apologies. You or two I'd have be friends. Uh Stilgar the Freeman is a name of renown. Any killer of Harkinins, I'd feel honored to count among my friends. And so they shake hands, basically, and uh say like, meh, we'll we'll see. Right. Yeah, I do like the description. There's an air of challenge about the man, and Gertie wondered if it could be a feeling of jealousy in the Fremen. Right. Right. I he had experiences, he knew Paul before his coming to Arrakis, you know, things that he could never replicate. So yes, we get an alarm symbol, which I know I thought was nice. Interesting touch there. So we get uh we get some some battle here between these men and uh some of the freemen here.

SPEAKER_00 35:16

Mm-hmm.

Power, Spice, And Who Truly Controls Arrakis

Michael Kentris 35:16

And we see them crouched in trios, backed into triangles were pressed, a trademark of the imperial Sardacar. And so another eye had picked out Paul, a black knife came hurtling toward him. Paul dodged, heard the knife clatter against the stone, and the knife has a hairline yellow coil of imperial color, the golden line crest, multifaceted eyes at the pommel. Sardacar for certain. So this was, I thought, an interesting interchange here. Absolutely. So Paul basically starts taking command of the scene, like, hold the Duke Paul Trades commands you to hold, and eventually everybody stops, including the Sardaukar. And he kind of like goes on this almost disdainful tirade, like, by whose orders do you threaten a ruling duke? And quickly as his men started pressing around the Sardacar, hold I say. And they you know, they do some like, Who says we're Sardacar? It's like, you got a knife with the imperial crest, this says you're Sardakar. They respond like then who says you're a ruling duke? Yeah. Uh your own emperor, Doi. So Yeah. Uh basically he's like, you know, I I am House Atreides. So basically, you know, tells ask how many of these guys there were, ten, and uh how many are casualties, four wounded, two dead. And so he starts interrogating one of these guys. Don't try it. It's obvious to me that you were ordered to seek out and destroy Muaddib. I'll warrant you're the one suggested seeking spice in the deep desert. A gasp from Gurney behind him brought a thin smile to Paul's lips. So seven of you are dead for two of us, three for one, pretty good against Sardakar, eh? And that kind of was the intimation that we've had in the past that uh the freemen enjoy a challenge, and so they they are good warriors for them to practice against. And then he calls up on the salties of the voice. I asked your name, tell me your name and Captain Erosham Imperial Sardacar, the man snapped, his jaw dropped, and he stared at Paul in confusion. The manner about him that had dismissed as cavernous barrian warren melted away. So Paul's voice is getting stronger. Yes, and we do get some conversation about that later on as well, which we'll talk about. So they're kind of going here, uh he keeps using the voice on him, submit, captain. And so the man at the captain's left leaps without warning to where Paul met the flashing impact of his own captain's knife in his chest. Right, so basically, like we're we're we're talking here. I just thought it would best serve his majesty, understood. And so he imprisoned, you know, Paul says, You're my prisoners, you submitted to me. Whether you live or die is of no importance. And so they take them away and essentially says, um, you know, make sure to search them. They often have like a false tooth, uh, fake hair for garrotting with. Like different tricky things secret about their person. So many things. It's a lot of stuff. You know, cut off all their hair, search them, throw all their stuff away. Basically, like right, make sure there's nothing that they have on their persons. Right. And then even when you're thorough, be certain you haven't discovered everything. Like, they're always gonna have something. Don't take it as a personal failure. And I like this part here. So the man he instructed to go and make sure they don't have any way to kill themselves. I was like, maybe it's best we kill them. I was like, no, I want them to escape. And he's like, Gertie, sire. Your man here is right. Kill those prisoners at once, destroy all evidence of them. You've shamed Imperial Sarnakar. When the Emperor learns that, he'll not rest until he has you over a slow fire. To which Paul replies, the emperor is not likely to have that power over me. He spoke slowly, coldly. So it's interesting here that he's like he's making his move. Like this is the beginning of the transition. So the emperor is the imperial agents are here, you know, Paul is making he's making his play, essentially, or getting getting those pieces in place. This is part of it, right, with the information control of information. So now he's starting asking about guild agents. And so they're you know, they're around Robin, they're buying spice, um and it is very important to the guild, which uh, as we know from Paul's experiences is important for you know his his visions and such. And Paul's like, the people who can destroy a thing, they control it. Right, yeah, there's a little bit of back and forth there. It's like to them it's the most precious thing in the universe, and we control it. It's like the Harkinans control it, Garneg protested. It's like, yeah, like you said, the people who can control destroy a thing, they control it. Right. And so we kind of it's like a a little bit of a rapid transition here, right? It almost feels like it's coming out of nowhere. Paul took the Sarakar knife in his left hand, presented to Stilgar. You live for the good of the tribe, Paul said. Could you draw my life's blood with that knife? For the good of the tribe, Stilgar growled. Then use that knife, Paul said. Are you calling me out, Stilgar demanded. If I do, Paul said, I shall stand there without weapon and let you slay me. Stilgar drew in a quick, sharp breath. So this is, I think, the beginning of this, where Paul is saying that I'm not going to kill you. Like that would be dumb of me. Like one, it would be dumb, and two, like you're my friend. But yes. Right, starts off with you are Stilgar a fighting man. When the Sardacar began fighting here, you were not in the front of battle. Your first thought was to protect Chani. It's like, she's my niece. If they're bimmy dead, if you're Fedican handling those scum, it's like, why wasn't your first thought of Chani? Paul demanded. It wasn't. It was of you, Stilgar admitted. And so basically, yeah, just kind of back and forth, like just trying to act in Paul's best interest here, in that capacity of protecting Chani since he knows Chani's important to him. Yeah. And I thought this was a good analogy, right? Do you think I wish to cut off my right arm, Paul said. Or Paul demanded. So it's one of those things, right? Like, if he kills Stilgar, right, Stilgar is competent, he's a good warrior, he's a good tactician, he's a good leader. But right, what is what is it going to do? Kill him, and then what, lose all of those abilities for the good of the tribe? And so we kind of get this repetition throughout these conversations here, that it's stupid for us to weaken ourselves before we go into battle. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. And so, yeah, a lot of it's like, I have to convince these people to change their ways. And Paul uh kind of instructs Johnny then to go south to his mother, ascend her here that her council will be available. And they're kind of confused, like, weren't we going to go south? And he's like, I was wrong. The Harkonens are not there, the war is not there. So instead he's bringing everybody to him at the Cave of Birds. Yes. And also as part of that, Paul's also like you go get her, send her here, but you stay down in the south. I need you to stay safe. Right. I am stronger when you are safe, you will remain in the siege, is what he says. And so Gurney learns, yeah, he hears Lady Jessica's alive still and is like, that she witch alive. And he's like You know, because he's still under the impression that she's a traitor, just like Thufer, and that will be addressed later. But um, but yeah, what do you say here? I must contrive it that Paul learns the truth about her before I slay her. Yes. End scene. So um yeah, well, a lot of stuff happened there, and we kind of get this uh shift in mentality, right? Paul was like, I want to go and rest in the south and see the you know the the large sieges down there, but this all has a uh shifted that, right? With Gurney Halleck coming back into the fold, learning that the Startakar are infiltrating the smugglers, so it kind of is forcing events forward. And then something that I appreciate, just as we kind of jump here, and it's like we do get a bit of a time skip, so we don't have to wait for two weeks. For yeah, for people to come back and do the thing. So, right, right. But I will not jump quite so far into that. I know we have the Princess of Rulin. Well, yes. Uh this was a short one though. How often is it that the angry man rages denial of what his inner self is telling him from the collected sayings of Muadib by the Princess of Rulin? So, yeah, I mean that one's pretty straightforward, I think. Right. And this might be referring perhaps to Gurney Halleck, maybe Stilgar. I don't know. Could be a lot of people. Could be the young men of the tribe. Right. Yeah. Could be applied to a lot of things, probably. Yes. And we have here in like the very first sentence, they're drawing a parallel between right, the crowd in the cavern assembly chamber radiated that pack feeling Jessica had sensed the day Paul killed Jameis. So they are very explicitly drawing a parallel between these, inasmuch as it was a fight to the death, uh like a ritual fight to the death. Yes. And so yeah. Uh we kind of move towards that as the culmination of this chapter. Alright. So yeah, now our point of view is with Lady Jessica. So she is here. She has come north, and she has a little message cylinder beneath her robe, and it's kept secret right now, but it's got some big information that seems relevant here to their plans going forward. And just in general, she is thinking about the state of affairs. So she is kind of like frustrated that Paul's not fully utilizing their resources, particularly with the captured Ornithopters. Mm-hmm. But yeah. It's like we don't have full air control. So I like that he's it's it's showing him to be like again a very tactical thinker, in as much as we're gonna hold all of our material in reserve and also the knowledge that that we have these, and so that we can kind of do it almost feels like kind of like a blitzkrieg kind of move that they're moving towards. Absolutely. Yeah, saving their most of their strength until they can attack at once. And it seems like she's already aware of Gurney Halleck being found and seen. Uh I'm not sure if potentially Chani shared that knowledge with her. I wouldn't be surprised. Yeah, that would make sense. Seems like, you know, she's under the something that it's just something that popped up in my head repeatedly like, why would Paul be surprised by the fact that Lady Jessica does not know about Gurney Halleck? Like she refers to like wondering why he had not yet trotted out his surprise, Gurney Halleck. I I feel like Paul should have mentuited that Lady Jessica would have heard that Gurney was found and has joined them. That's a fair point. Yes. But it's not it's not a big plot point or anything that you know, but it was just a thought that I had. So, yeah, right, Jessica has the same thought that Paul does. We must right, we see Stilgar with his inevitable dignity, uh the way he stood without talking. We must not lose that man, Jessica thought. Paul's plan must work. Anything else would be the highest tragedy. And uh yeah, we get uh Paul kind of coming in, the young man young men draw back from him as she comes up, as he comes up to her. She notices herself being momentarily dismayed by the new deference they paid him. All men beneath your position cover your station, went the Bene Gesserit axiom. But she found no covetousness in these faces. They were held at a distance by the religious ferment around Paul's leadership, and she recalled another Bene Gesserit saying, I mean by violence. Again, I think is another good reference. Uh if we look at like the Old Testament prophets in the Christian tradition, many of them were killed, and in the the Gospels as well, this is referenced. So for example, you know, Isaiah was reportedly sawn in half, Jeremiah was imprisoned into a cistern, Ezekiel was stoned, and so on and so forth. Right? So a lot of Old Testament prophets were were in fact murdered in various fashions, and uh yeah, it's it's one of those things that has a lot of parallels to it, right? You're bringing bringing news of some kind, and whether that news is well received or not, uh you can become a focal point for somebody's ire. Right. I mean, this kind of goes back to what we were talking about earlier in that one Princess of Rulin passage, where you know it's it's kind of going against the tradition of what is expected, these prophets. So by upsetting the current way of things, you know, people aren't going to be too receptive to that unless they are dissatisfied with the way things currently are. Typically the people in power are never those people. Right, right. Or else there wouldn't have been a need for a prophet. Right. She says, It's time and passes the messenger cylinder to him. And I like this part here. One of Paul's companions, bolder than the others, glanced across at Stilgar and said, Are you going to call him out, Muaddeb? Now's the time for sure. They'll think you a coward. And Paul's like, who dares call me a coward? His hand flashed to his kriss knife hilt. It's just funny. It's like, who? Who's calling me a coward? Right. I I do love this whole scene. Like, I love the back and forth between him and the crowd, basically. Yeah, yeah. It's uh definitely an exercise in rhetoric here. Mm-hmm. Like there's words. Do what someone shrieked. Do what? Yeah, I know. It's uh it's a visual picture that is a little discordant with my idea of the Freeman as a as a whole. But um but yeah, he he makes his big speech here. And so he says, uh, you're tired of waiting, Paul said. Again he waited while the cries of response died out. So we get the information in the cylinder here, which is it had been taken from a hearkening courier, and on it it says that Rabin was being abandoned to his own resources here on Arrakis. He could not call for help or reinforcements. Which is exactly what Thufer and the Baron had been talking about the last time we had checked in with them. So he's using Rabin as essentially the fall guy for this whole endeavor right now. So again, Paul raises his voice. You think it's time I called out Stilgar and changed the leadership of the troops? Do you think the Lisa Al Ghaib that's stupid? And then there was stunned silence. He's accepting the religious mantle, Jessica thought. He must not do it. It's the way, someone shouted and uh Paul says, Ways change, and someone else says, We'll say what's to change scattered shouts of agreement through the former. Right. It's like as you witch. And he's like, That is the way too. The voice of any freeman may be heard in council. Paul Muaddeb is a freeman. The good of the tribe, that is the most important thing. Sorry, Stilgar said that first part. So does my mother rule? Stilgar and all the other troop leaders ask her advice in almost every major decision. You know this. But does the Reverend Mother walk the sand or lead a ratia against the Harkinans? No man recognizes leadership without the challenge in the combat. That's the way. So, what is our goal? To unseat Rabin, the Harkinin beast and remake our world into a place where we may raise our families in happiness amidst an abundance of water. Is this our goal? Our tasks need hard ways. Thank you. Do you smash your knife before a battle, Paul demanded? I say this as fact, not meaning it as boast or challenge. There isn't a man here, Stilgar included, who could stand against me in single combat. This is Stilgar's own admission. He knows it, so do you all. Many of you have been with me on the practice floor, you know this isn't idle boast. Basically he's like, you know, I'm the baddest fighter around here. You all know it, I know it, you know it, we all know it. It's right. But uh But yeah, so he's like, Why why would we make our tribe weak? So So basically he tells them all, right, about the message from Rabin. Yes. And basically, you know, he's doing this all as like leading up an argument like of why he's not going to be calling out Stilgar. So he's like, How many of you see what this means indicating the message? Like Stilgar saw it immediately.

SPEAKER_00 51:47

They're cut off! Someone shout.

Michael Kentris 51:49

Right. And basically they're like, Absolutely. So now Paul brings out his ducal signet that he's wearing around his neck. And he's like, This is my father's ducal signet. I swore never to wear it again until I was ready to lead my troops over all of Arrakis and claim it as my rightful fief. And puts it on. Oh shit. That's right. Who rules here? I rule here. I rule on every square inch of Arrakis. This is my ducal fief, whether the emperor says yea or nay, he gave it to my father, and it comes to me through my father. So I thought this was a pretty, pretty powerful scene right there.

SPEAKER_00 52:24

Mm-hmm. No, I agree.

The Cave Assembly And Paul’s Challenge

Paul’s Speech: Strategy Over Tradition

Michael Kentris 52:26

And look, there are men who will hold positions of importance on Arrakis when I claim those imperial rights which are mine. Stillgard is one of those men. Not because I wish to bribe him, not out of gratitude, though I'm one of many here who owe him life for life. No, but because he is wise and strong. And again, we get this phrase Do you think me stupid? Do you think I'll cut off my right arm and leave it bloody on the floor for this cavern just to provide you with a circus? Yeah. It's like, what am I going to do? Kill every leader in the erg? I do love that. Who is there here to say I'm not the rightful ruler on Arrakis? Must I prove it by leaving every Fremen tribe in the erg without a leader? It's like, must I kill every person who would stand against me? Right, right. So I am your ruler, and I say to you that it is time we stopped killing off our best men and started killing our real enemies, the Harkinins. Long live Duke Paul Muadib. Yes. So Stilgar pulls out his Chris knife. Long live the fighters of Muadib, and Stilgar is asked to kneel. Hand me your Chris knife, repeat after me. And so we get this oath from Stilgar to Paul. I, Stilgar, take this knife from the hands of my Duke. Where my Duke commands, there shall I place this blade. I dedicate this blade to the cause of my Duke and the death of his enemies for as long as our blood shall flow. And so they're kind of like doing this, you know, call and repeat. And then Paul has him kiss the blade. And then he sheaths it. So, yeah, very, very powerful. And they they kind of start Stilgar, I want Sandwalkers out this night and Sialagos, right? Our little psychic bat creature messenger birds sent to summon a council gathering. And so and so it goes. Yeah, war plans are beginning. Yes. So he leaves, and then we get this scene with Jessica and Gurney Halleck. Yes. Which is also tense, but after the last scene, it almost feels like anticlimactic in a way. A little bit with how quickly, spoilers, it gets resolved. Yes, yes, yes. So yeah, Paul takes Lady Jessica back to a private chamber and kind of leaves her there for a second. And she she knows he's going to bring Gurney Halleck here. And she's kind of like filled with a strange mingling of emotions, just kind of reminiscing about, you know, her previous life on Kaladin, you know, where life was not nearly as hard. The Duke was there, just things were nice. And even though it's only been three years since then, she had become another person. It was nice, you know. Water, fat, flesh everywhere. Man, all that water. And then she briefly kind of thinks about, you know, Chani, but just in terms of now that Paul has more or less ascended to his rightful ducal stature of the Duke of Arrakis. She's already thinking about political affiliations and uh aligning with strong families. And she's kind of thinking that, you know, what can this desert woman do for a duke except serve him coffee? She asks herself. She brings him no power, no family. Paul has only one major chance to ally himself with a powerful great house, perhaps even with the imperial family. They are marriageable princesses after all, and every one of them Bene Gesserit trained. A good Bene Gesserit wife. Is that a good thing or a bad thing, though? That's probably an okay thing. Sounds like a lot. So yes, draperies were flung aside, and Gurney Halleck bounded into the room. She only had time for a glimpse of his face with its odd grimace at his incivine scar. That's not mentioned here, but I assume that's why he's got an odd grimace. So basically he like grabs her under the chin and pulls her to her feet, and then she feels the touch of a knife at her back. And basically he's like, Paul Cubs is like literally right after that, and he's like, Here he is, and he just like cuts off, taking at the tensions of the scene. Yes. And so so like this right, he's he knows all the tricks of the voice. There's like, you will speak only when I permit it. If you will flex certain muscles, your voice will remain monotone, you know, on and on and on. So he is he's on guard against it. I do appreciate that. Like, I feel like even Thufer was just completely taken unaware and underestimated her in a similar situation. So that was a few years ago. It was a few years ago, but Gurney is like, nah. I've tried to take as many precautions as I can to make sure that she cannot voice her way into slipping by. Get out of my head, Charles. Gurney needs his metal helmet. That's right. So anyway, Gurney is still under this we we all already know this, right? I don't think there's any point in beating a dead horse, right? Gurney thinks that Jessica's the betrayer. We know that she wasn't. Um and so they're kind of going back and forth here, and they're like trying to convince him. And I like this this little part here. It's like, be quiet, Paul said. And the monotone stillness of his words carried more command than Jessica had ever heard in another voice. He has the great control. That's a capital G and a capital C. Right. So I assume it's like we get all these little like breadcrumbs of Benny Jesser's abilities, like uh truth uh treat truth speaker or truthsayer. And then we got great control. I'm sure there's other little skills that uh people have different uh ranks in. So anyway. And we get kind of the story from Paul here about like you haven't heard my mother sobbing in the night over her lost Duke. You have not seen her eyes stab flame when she speaks of killing Harkonens. And he's like, you know, like how could you not see through this treachery? What you've not done is remember the lessons you learned in a Harkonen slave pit. You speak of pride of my father's friendship. Didn't you learn the difference between Harkinin and a treatise that you could smell a Harkinin trick by the stink they left on it? Didn't you learn that a treatise loyalty is bought with love while the Harkinin coin is hate? Couldn't you see through to the very nature of this betrayal? So it's like I was like, but what about Yui? It's like we have correct, because the the whole medical college conditioning thing. It's like uh we have a message in his own hand to us admitting his treachery. So Right. But it's in another siege. So you gotta take our word for it right now. Yeah. Right. We don't I don't got it on me, man. I don't got it on me, man. I've been traveling on the worm. Yes. So yes. So essentially, right, we get to the end of this tension-filled scene here. At the end of this, this was, I think, almost a little more interesting. So Jessica says, Gurney, release me. Not a special command, just regular words, and he lets it go. And we get this kind of almost impulsive, at least for the Lady Jessica, where she says that, Paul, there are other awakenings in this universe. I suddenly see how I've used you and twisted you and manipulated you to set you on a course of my choosing. A course I had to choose if that's any excuse because of my own training. Paul, I want you to do something for me. Choose the course of happiness. Your desert woman, marry her if that's your wish. Defy everyone and everything to do this, but choose your own course. And uh yes. So and then like all of a sudden she breaks off and Guardias like bared his breast here. Like, put your knife right here. I say kill me and I've done with it. I've dispersed my name, I've betrayed my own Duke. Right. And again, it's I love this too. It's like close that robe and stop acting like a fool. I've had enough foolishness for one day. You know me better than that. How many kinds of an idiot do you think I am? Must I go through this with every man I need? Right. It's like I literally just gave a speech about this. It's like it's like you thought you were doing a thing for Leto, she said, and for this I honor you. Um I like this little line. The Gurney Halleck I knew was a man adept with both blade and ballaset, Jessica said. It was the man of the ballaset I most admired. And so basically she asked him to get it out, and he's like rambling about like, oh, plays like a genuine Vorota. But you know, it's like uh, oh, like this is like a uh a Strativarius. Mm-hmm. It's not a real Strativarius, but it almost is good. So they uh they kind of get everything chilled down a little bit. Paul says, I have things that need my attention, wait here for me. And as as he's gone, Gurney starts playing, and we get this fairly long uh song here. But uh yeah, I don't know that I took any specific meaning to it. I don't know if you did well. I didn't. I did not. But for those who might, orchards and vineyards and full breasted hurrus, and a cup overflowing before me, why do I babble of battles and mountains reduced to dust? Why do I feel these tears? I'm just trying to see like is there any like it's just kind of like a little bit of maybe a contrast. Heavens stand open and scatter the riches, my hands need but gather their wealth. Why do I think of an ambush and poison in molten cup? Why do I feel my years? There's a little free verse here, not really rhyming or love's arms beckon with their naked delights and Eden's promise of ecstasies. Why do I remember the scars, dream of old transgressions, and why do I sleep with fears? Actually, you know what, there is something here. Um it's contrasting uh, you know, kind of the man of war and the man of peace, right? So we've got the orchards and vineyards, right? So these are things that take long time to cultivate. They take years of work and effort, uh, and they're easily destroyed by pestilence. And then we've got this babbling of battles and mountains reduced to dust, right? Kind of destruction. So it almost sounds, if I were to make a bit of a uh extension, we have a a man who is now wealthy in a way, right? He's got crops, riches, love, love and ecstasy here, but he's having all these old things. It almost sounds like a veteran with PTSD. Mm-hmm. Right, which would make sense with with a Gurney Halleck type character. Right. Why do I think I'm gonna ambush and poison in my molten cup? Absolutely, just someone on edge who Yeah has kind of these, like you said, traumatic events still kind of just poisoning his psyche, even though in theory his life should be good. In theory. In theory. So we get uh this sudden transition here, and Paul heads for the place that each such cavern had, a place near its water holding bases where they kept a stunted uh a small shy halud. So this is how they make the water of life. They drown the maker. And so the decision had come to Paul while he faced the tension of danger to his mother. No line of the future he had ever seen carried that moment of peril from Gurney Halleck. The future, the gray cloud future, with a feeling it's feeling that the entire universe rolled toward a boiling nexus, hung around him like a phantom world. I must see it, he thought. So something we haven't talked about extensively, but in past, and I think we've mentioned it, is that the spice is poison, right? It's one of those poisons, if you stop taking it, it will kill you. And so he has developed a tolerance, and so he's had fewer and fewer of these visions. And so it's like, I will drown the maker and see now whether I'm the quiss ass Hatarach who can survive the tests that the Reverend Mothers have survived. So basically, Paul is Jones in for something stronger right now. He needs something a little stronger than Spice. Yes. So he's going for that water of life. And uh yeah, we'll we'll see how that plays out next time. That's right. So, yeah, a lot of things happening, right? This is very much like we're building up to, it feels like another climax, which makes sense because we are we are closing in on the end of this book. Um, what are your thoughts on this section? Oh, this is such a good chapter. This maybe been one of my favorites that we've had so far. The way that he was addressing the crowd and kind of the way he was formulating his argument for like, hey, we're gonna change things up because we don't want to make ourselves weaker by killing off our good and competent leaders. So, no, I I I liked it a lot. I thought this was definitely one of the more engaging chapters that we've read recently, I think. I agree, I agree. A lot of action, a lot of uh a lot of good writing, very, very good stuff. Yeah. So yes. Uh hopefully you found it also interesting, dear listener, and you'll continue to join us through the thrilling conclusion of Dune. Uh we'll see. Maybe we'll be able to wrap it up in one more episode. Maybe. Maybe not. We got those appendixes, not appendices, according to my my edition here. We've we've got well, maybe we'll we'll take a look see at those and do a quick overview. Yeah. I think some of them are about like the ecology and stuff, so if we want to be real, real true nerds, we probably would do it. We'll see. But in the meanwhile, if you haven't already, leave us a five-star review wherever you're listening to this podcast. You can find us on X slash Twitter at brothersreading. You can find our website, brothersreadingbooks.com, and if you have any questions, comments, or show suggestions, you can email us at brothersreadingbooks at gmail.com. Anything to add to that, Will? Nope. We're out there. You can find out there. And we're also here. So um well, looking forward to it. And thank you all for listening again. Talk to you later, Will. Talk to you later, Mike.