🎙️ S2 E10: Fifty Episodes, One Podcast Show & We’re Just Getting Started

We went to the London Podcast Show expecting to feel like the newbies who’d been getting it all wrong, and we came home with the opposite feeling: we’ve already built a lot of the foundations, and now we know exactly which levers to pull next. If you’re building a podcast, a personal brand, or a content engine for your business, this chat is our honest download of what actually stuck from the biggest podcasting event in the UK and how we’re applying it to Awesomely Off Topic.

One idea flips our old journalism instincts on their head: start with the thumbnail. Not the story first, not the edit first, but the scroll-stopping image and the promise. From there we get into headlines and hooks, including a surprisingly helpful method of drafting the biggest, brashest claim you’d never publish, then dialling it down until it lands in your integrity. It’s a fast way to generate stronger titles, sharper social media copy, and clearer episode angles without drifting into clickbait.

We also unpack the trust piece: the EAT framework (expertise, authenticity, trust) and our own REAL version (relatability, expertise, authenticity, loyalty). That leads into a big question for podcasters: do you really need guests to grow, or can “pure podcasting” build a stronger host identity and community? We talk formats that are working right now, why consistency matters more than most people admit, and the stats that prove word of mouth and social media are still doing the heavy lifting for podcast discovery.

If you enjoy this one, subscribe so you don’t miss what we’re testing next, share it with a podcaster friend, and leave us a quick review so more people can find the show.

Transcript

Episode 50 And Show Highlights

SPEAKER_01 0:00

You're listening to Awesomely Off Topic. Books, Brands, Business and everything else we're not supposed to say out loud. I'm Taz and Asher. Now let's get into it. We walked into the podcast show expecting to feel like the newbies who'd been getting it all wrong. But we actually walked out thinking, actually, we're doing a lot more right than we realised, didn't we?

SPEAKER_00 0:22

We certainly did. I'm so excited for what's coming next, Taz.

SPEAKER_01 0:25

Totally. We are now absolutely buzzing with ideas for how we can keep moving forward with Awesomely Off Topic. This is episode 50, that's one hell of a milestone. Yay, Fu, go us. Hurrah! And it's feeling like just the beginning. So if you weren't there at the biggest podcasting event in the UK, it was in London at the Business Design Centre last week on Wednesday and Thursday. We only got to go to one day because our diaries were already full on the Thursday. But next year we're already planning to let's try and do both days.

SPEAKER_00 0:57

Two days, we've got to go to base. There's so much to see, so many people to talk to, so much to learn, so much to kind of check in with.

SPEAKER_01 1:04

So much amazing networking. And not only that, but we're already setting our sights on being on one of those stages. Yeah. So watch this space. But we figured that whether you were there or not, we'd we'd take you through some of the things we learned, some of the realisations that we had, and do as much as we can to make it feel like maybe you were there too.

SPEAKER_00 1:22

It was a great day, wasn't it? It really went so quickly. For me, that's always a sign of a good day, Taz.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Yeah, totally. I think one of the great things about a show like the London Podcast Show is there are so many relatables. There's so many things that you can take from podcast into social media, into your marketing, into your visibility, into your brand. Because of course, all of those things are important. And with the way tech's going, of course, it's not just audio. Now we started out as an audio only show with occasional video. We're still there, but we're certainly looking to do more and more video, particularly now we know that Apple Podcasts is bringing in video and our amazing podcast hosts. Big shout out to BuzzSprout. Yay, go Buzz Sprout, thank you. Yeah, they're brilliant. Are working with that video now. They're not paying us, promise. You could do if you're listening, BuzzSprout. Always happy to be paid. Please do come sponsor us. I think some of the revelations where we were sitting in some of those talks and go, that's a great idea, that's a great idea. I've heard that one it's actually related to this, I've heard that one it's related to this. And oh wow, people aren't doing that. We've been doing that automatically.

SPEAKER_00 2:31

Yeah, it's amazing, isn't it? It was like, well, we might actually be getting some of this right. Yeah. Who would have known? Where do you think that comes from, though, Ash? I think the base the basics of it is some of the good practice that we've got from our journalistic days, without a doubt. And it's talking about things like we talk about hooks, but for me, verbal intros, you know, we've spent our careers as journalists writing great intros to stories to catch the audience, to bring you in, and I think that's what we're really good at. We've learned some things about some of the tricks of the trade to help do more of that, and we've talked about that already, haven't we, in the last couple of days? I think that's part of it. The training that we've got journalistically helps us. We're great at chatting with people, we can keep the conversation going. Yes, we do go off topic, but that's the point of it. I think our topic, I think our title is absolutely right for our ADHD brains, yeah, because we do meander a bit, we just need to bring in some of

Thumbnails First And Title Thinking

SPEAKER_00 3:25

that journalistic training to bring the hook in earlier to get people interested early on in the show.

SPEAKER_01 3:30

I think one of the biggest kind of mind-blowing note moments for me, and it's so simple because it's it's it's what we've learned to do with features and headlines and press releases and all the stuff we've done over the years. But one of the first talks we were in, we were listening to Callum McIntyre, who's the founder of Velocity, started off doing loads of Formula One stuff, and his business has grown from there. But when it comes to YouTube, he was talking about starting from the thumbnail.

SPEAKER_00 3:58

This really blew your mind, didn't it?

SPEAKER_01 3:59

It did, because in terms of content, as journalists and as creators and as PRs in the day as well. Yeah, writers. It would be yeah, writers, it would be the story, and then what's the best headline to go with that? And effectively, starting with the thumbnail is actually what's the headline and how do we make the story fit?

SPEAKER_00 4:18

Yeah, so we're reversing it, aren't we? Reverse engineering it in a way.

SPEAKER_01 4:21

As a journalist, I had that happen to me when the editor had unbenanced to me come up with a cracking headline that he wanted to put on the front page for the story I was writing. Yeah. But my story that I wrote, which was a bloody cracking story, even if I say so myself, didn't fit his headline. So he's still rewriting my story to fit the headline. Yeah. So I was a bit pissy, but I can still tell you what it was. Can you go on there? Yeah. It was about this town where to celebrate the Christmas festivities, they'd got chitty chitty bang bang coming through the town. But it I think the timings were out where a lot of the kids couldn't get to it and couldn't see it or something or other because they were in school. Yeah. I think that was the premise. But I did what I didn't know is that he'd already written the headline in like 140, 200 point or something, including the colour brown, and his headline was shitty chitty bang bang. So of course the story didn't quite fit because it didn't quite go the way he wanted it to go. Yeah, so so when Callum was talking about start with the thumbnail and make the thumbnail as kind of big as well.

SPEAKER_00 5:28

It was a really wasn't it for you?

SPEAKER_01 5:29

Yeah, wow. You know, in in terms of digital content, yeah, that makes so much sense, but it so goes against the grave. Alien to what we how we were trained. Of journalism. Yeah. But when we then think about the time we spent running a PR and digital media agency, yeah, so much of the stuff we were working with on with clients was that. What's the headline you want to get across?

SPEAKER_00 5:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:52

What is that scroll stopper?

SPEAKER_00 5:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 5:55

So why didn't I think of that in terms of video?

SPEAKER_00 5:57

Well, I can see why you went there because it's you know, old habits, etc., and that was your training. But when you give it some more thought afterwards, as we came away from that event, and we had a good old chat over a coffee afterwards, didn't we? And that was one of the things that came up for us, and we both went, ah, okay, yeah. And we started to look at the possibilities of how that impacts how we approach things from now on.

SPEAKER_01 6:16

And honestly, honestly, vulnerability moment here, it's because I know my YouTube, I am weakest on YouTube. And it's not because I can't geek out over it, it's because you can geek out on pretty much anything, really. Oh god, that's another plate I've got to spin. And for about the past, I don't know, 10, 15 years, maybe. Was that months, Taz? Was that months? Uh days, minutes. I've been thinking I really need to sort my YouTube out. But instead, my YouTube is sitting there and it's essentially a filing system of videos. Oh, I ought to chuck that on there as well.

SPEAKER_00 6:43

At least you've got one. I haven't even got one, Taz. It's a terrible admission, isn't it? I sound like a right old dinosaur now.

SPEAKER_01 6:49

Well, we are going to be setting one up for us when we're off topic. And that was another thing we walked away thinking. Not that anybody suggested that, but we went, hold on. Our podcast has an Insta account, it has a Facebook account. Yeah. It's not as a page on LinkedIn yet, just because we haven't got around to it. Why haven't we thought about giving it a YouTube page?

SPEAKER_00 7:06

Do you know can I make another terrible confession? I did actually realise that when we were setting this up today, was that I said to you, I don't think my podcast our my podcast, our podcast, even gets a mention in my LinkedIn bio.

SPEAKER_01 7:19

Does it not?

SPEAKER_00 7:20

No. Mine does. That's really bad, isn't it? I've got to go and get it.

SPEAKER_01 7:24

Oh no, mine does, because I did it this morning.

SPEAKER_00 7:26

Oh. Oh, you're gonna make you were gonna let me feel that, weren't you, for the rest of this? Talk about it a lot, it just wasn't in my bio. No, I need to change that. That's first. Oh, you won't put it on the headline. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're back to headlines again. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 7:38

But yeah, we're so used, aren't we, to to uploading a reel, for instance. And then going, right, which which is the which is the least gurney image, uh yeah, the the least picture where we're pulling a funny face to stop it on.

SPEAKER_00 7:51

Speak for yourself, darling. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mine's every every other one, I think.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

What's the best freeze frame from that to stop it on before we set it live? Of course, this starts from that.

SPEAKER_00 8:01

Yeah. And works backwards. Yeah. It's so that's been a r for us. So thank you for that, because that's really got us thinking in a best kind of way. So thank you.

SPEAKER_01 8:10

Yeah. And the other thing, and I think this came from Callum as well, and it's a similar concept. And again, it takes what we've always done and spins it on its head on its head. Because as journalists, as PRs, as as marketers back in the day, before we both turned our hand to coaching, which oh, we enjoy so much more, we no longer feel like our souls are about to burn in hell.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

Sorry to any PRs listening. But if there's any disgruntled PRs out there, I think you get what we mean.

SPEAKER_01 8:38

PRs are awesome. It's about having alignment between you and the clients that you serve. And I know that in our day. But it's a tough, but it's even tougher for people now. It is, but I know that in our day we ended up serving a couple of clients where we realised that we had a bit of a clash of values there. And we ended we gradually stepped away from those, but that that's where I'm that's where I wasn't enjoying it much. So applaudits to the PRs that do such a cracking job. Absolutely. So many changes. Hello, Fee, if you're listening. Shout out to Jones. Where was I going with that? Oh, yeah, this idea that when you're coming to promote your podcast or your YouTube clip, you start with the biggest, brashest, most bodacious claim or headline. I love that word, bodacious. Bodacious is good, isn't it? Fabulous. I've already I've already started sharing some of this with one of my coaching groups. Okay. Some of them got it straight away. Yeah. And others were really uncomfortable because that's just not who I am. That's out of my integrity. And that's the point. It's not about moving out, moving you outside of your integrity. It's about if you start with a bigger statement than you would than you would ever say, and then gradually increment down until you find something you're comfortable with, it will help you to just break limiting beliefs

Big Claims Without Losing Integrity

SPEAKER_01 9:50

and just see things from a different perspective.

SPEAKER_00 9:52

So could you give an example, just for anybody who's still unsure about this and how it might work for them?

SPEAKER_01 9:56

Oh god. I'm putting you on the spot now, Taz. I'll give you a couple of- I could I could cut I could give some examples that we had in the coaching call the other day, but they're not particularly nice. Oh, okay. Maybe not then. So somebody somebody was talking about self-love and we were trying to blow that out of the water. Okay. And a particular celebrity who's had an awful lot of plastic surgery done. Yeah. Some may say a bit too far, was mentioned. Right. And we said, well, the great big bodacious you would never go there headline might be. This celebrity only looks looks so plastic because she doesn't love herself.

SPEAKER_00 10:33

You're giving away it's so it's whoever it is female celebrity.

SPEAKER_01 10:37

But of course, that's a claim that you'd never make, and it's it's quite bitchy, it's quite yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But you start with fallacious, if you like.

SPEAKER_00 10:43

Okay. And come and move down. See, that makes me uncomfortable immediately.

SPEAKER_01 10:47

It is really uncomfortable, and you go, well, I wouldn't do that, I wouldn't do that. And then you come through to well, okay, well, where does the if we bring that down an increment, then it might be does a lack of self-love lead to an addiction to plastic surgery?

SPEAKER_00 11:04

Right, okay.

SPEAKER_01 11:05

Does a lack of self-love then lead to an addiction to facials and botox?

SPEAKER_00 11:09

See, immediately the journey to me now is going, oh, that would be a make make an incredible feature. I'd really like to investigate that and work with somebody and write a big piece of it.

SPEAKER_01 11:19

And then that ties into all the PR that's been about the Mar a Lago women.

SPEAKER_00 11:22

Yeah. So all of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:24

And that took it completely away from what from what she was saying.

SPEAKER_00 11:27

And that was you only went down one two, didn't you, with that to say I'm thinking, okay, I could yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:31

Yeah. But even if it wasn't anything to do with somebody's physical appearance, the self-love in terms of how that impacts your confidence, your growth, your levels of success. Yeah. So then you might start your business is failing because you hate yourself. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

Oh, really? Oh, yeah, that's a then bring it down. Do you know what? The worrying thing is then I didn't even do that, I just went, oh, okay. Because actually you've already kind of um eased eased it for me that whole process.

SPEAKER_01 12:01

So then it goes into okay, so I wouldn't necessarily want to tell somebody that the business is shit and they and they hate themselves.

SPEAKER_00 12:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:08

But if you don't love your if you don't love yourself enough, your business will suffer. Yeah. And then you keep coming down from there. You find one that you're okay, you think I can work with this. Yeah. Yeah. But you see, straight away we've just come we've just got two different angles on the same topic that we might not have thought of if we hadn't gone, let's go massive. Yeah. And there was another there was another NLP in in this group. I'm an N NLP, she's an NLP. And and as I said, that's like, for any any NLP is listening, listening, hello, hello Tracy again. It's a bit like bursting the bubble in NLP. So, you know, when somebody comes, everybody hates me. What? Everybody hates you. Yeah. Everybody at work hates me. Everybody at work hates you. What about the the person who comes in and cleans the toilets at night? Oh, I don't really know them, so they don't hate me. What about the the person who delivers the sandwiches? No, they're alright. What about and before you know it, you've you've burst that big bubble of everybody hates me because you found people who don't. Yeah. So it's a bit there, you you deliberately make something bigger than is comfortable and bigger than is necessarily true, in order for you to see the difference and get a different perspective. Brilliant. That's really cool. So yeah, we've already started playing with that in different ways. So yeah, Callum, thank you. You sound thank you.

SPEAKER_00 13:32

We so enjoyed your show.

SPEAKER_01 13:35

Thank you. Buzzing all over the place. Some really good stuff there. So when we do come to move onto YouTube more and onto more video content, because most of our video at the moment is visual sound bites, which are great. Yeah. But we could do more. Every now and then we'll set up set up a camera as well and and film. But that's another thing we walked away thinking actually, yeah, we need to invest in a in a camera that is just for filming our podcasts. Because of course we've been using our phones, yeah. And then before you know it, you you get that frustration of it pausing halfway through or freezing because there's not enough memory on the phone.

SPEAKER_00 14:09

Yeah. Yeah. Whereas we found people walking the show with some fantastic text.

SPEAKER_01 14:14

Yeah, things that have long kind of looked at, oh, I don't need that. I walked out thinking, no, I do need that, and we're gonna make it happen.

SPEAKER_00 14:20

And guess he was looking at a phone researching stuff, weren't you? Just before we were into our next talk.

SPEAKER_01 14:25

Yeah, so anyway, that whole that whole piece around titles, thumbnails, that was Invaluable, wasn't it? That really got our minds going. And I think in that same session they were talking about the Eat framework, and I believe that's that actually comes from an old Google framework. So the Eat framework, as it was explained at the show, I think you wrote this one down, didn't you? Was expertise, authenticity, trust. Yep. And I think Google's version of that is experience expertise. Authenticity trust. So it's a double E. Yeah, yeah, okay. But it's great, and we were we were playing with those and thinking, well, what could what could some of those be that we could use?

SPEAKER_00 15:04

The favourite with our own version, didn't we?

SPEAKER_01 15:06

We did. And the favourite one we came came up with was real, wasn't it? Because we tell tell people to keep it real an awful lot. So keeping it real, we can bring that right down to I can't remember what it was now. What was it? Oh, relatability, expertise, authenticity, and loyalty. Yeah. So that works brilliantly for what we're doing with awesomely off topic. Yeah. So we we loved that as well. We love playing with all these little acronyms. We love a good acronym. But when they were talking about that EAT framework again, that stayed with us,

EAT REAL And Earning Trust

SPEAKER_01 15:40

didn't it? Because we realised that's exactly what we've been doing instinctively. Yeah, because applying that to it.

SPEAKER_00 15:45

Yeah, because we always talked about that, didn't we? When whenever we've given talks on PR or about, you know, good writing your marketing content, etc., creating marketing content, whether it's video, audio, written, whatever it is, we've always used those as the basis, haven't we? Plus a bit more actually.

SPEAKER_01 16:03

So if we look at those three, the three that that you wrote down that were mentioned, and if there was a fourth, forgive us, we must have is that. Um expert uh expertise, authenticity, and trust. What do each of those three things mean in practice for somebody off topic?

SPEAKER_00 16:20

Well, expertise is definitely looking at the areas that we've worked in over the many years that we've been working for ourselves and also in in corporate as well.

SPEAKER_01 16:28

Yeah, we don't tend to talk about shit we don't understand.

SPEAKER_00 16:30

No, no, no, not at all. And if we don't understand it, we'll go away and research it and hopefully share some of what we've learnt with our listeners. Yeah, okay. So that definitely works. Authenticity, you know, that's a word that you know, don't say it, just show it in what you do or what you don't do. Do you know what I mean? We try and be our authentic real selves. In other words, we're not editing this, we're just sitting on our sofa today with dogs and cat around us, and anything could happen, and we're and also we're just speaking from personal experience from our own viewpoints, but we also like to be open to other viewpoints, etc. etc. And I think that makes for an authentic show. Authentic people running it, leading it, yeah, you know, speaking on the show. Yeah. What do you?

SPEAKER_01 17:11

What about Well authenticity is one of those words we've talked about before, isn't it? It rubs so many people up the wrong way because it's got yeah, it's become almost like a dirty word, hasn't it? Yeah, because again, it it's it's like that old adage, isn't it? Don't tell me you're funny, make me laugh.

SPEAKER_00 17:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:24

Don't tell me you're authentic. You show someone you're authentic in your actions. Yeah. So what about what about trust? How does that come into play with us? With also something off topic.

SPEAKER_00 17:34

I think we're in a we're in a really privileged situation in that people trust us to take us into their homes, their cars, their lives. We talk about supermarkets. Yeah, they're supermarkets, yeah. I was thinking of you, Tracy, who says she often listens to us when she's doing her weekly shopping. And nod to Lisa who listens to us on the train station back. But the fact is we often turn it around and we talk about, as podcasters, we you know, we do feel really privileged that we are, you know, that we're taken into other people's homes. We don't we talk about the other way around that we invite people into our lives, but actually it should be about the other way too. So, in other words, people allow us into their homes, their daily lives, whether you're jogging, walking the dog, going to the supermarket, whatever. And I think that's really important to remember too, because you know, we they want to come back. When people come back and listen to more episodes, that makes my heart really happy.

SPEAKER_01 18:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:30

Because I think you really want to hear more from us, and I feel like sometimes we're so awesomely off topic.

SPEAKER_01 18:35

You really want to hear more from us.

SPEAKER_02 18:37

That's what I mean.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

That's what I mean. Yeah, exactly that. Because we do go all over the place. Like that sentence I've just put together just now. I wasn't sure where I was going and where I was going to end up, but I kind of I hope it made some kind of sense for at least a couple of seconds.

SPEAKER_01 18:48

Do you know what? Just to spin off at a tangent for a minute, now we've talked about Tracy in the supermarket and Lisa on the the train station platform. Tell us what's the craziest and most unusual place you've listened to awesomely off topic. Tell us on our socials or tell us via the the the contact form on the BuzzSpread website. Tell us. Tell us where you've listened to Awesomely Off Topic. And let's see if we can find the most bonkers one. And while we're talking about that, another nudge that we had at the podcast show is we need to remember, usually about a third to two-thirds of the way through the podcast, to pause and ask people to make sure they're subscribing and sharing this all over the place. Please subscribe and share. So, yeah, please, please. It really helps us to grow, it helps us to keep going and to do do more awesome stuff for you. If you make sure you subscribe and please share it, tell all your friends. Let's get a word of mouth growing all over the place. And of course, share the clips on socials.

SPEAKER_00 19:45

And Gladys uh Grudel is sitting here. She's obviously agreeing because she came over and licked my hand just at there, you go, and she's making a funny little noise. Yeah, little grumble to remind us. A little gruodel grumble. It was a grudel grumble, wasn't it, Gladys? Gladys, the Grudel grumbled.

SPEAKER_01 20:00

For anyone hasn't ever seen Gladys, if you're of a certain age and you've seen the the now cult movie Never Ending Story, she looks a lot like Falco the Look Dragon. Very big overgrown golden dude.

SPEAKER_00 20:12

Oh, I've got a mic problem, Caz. I think my mic's detached itself. Oh no.

SPEAKER_01 20:17

Is it not?

SPEAKER_00 20:18

Oh, that's alright then. That's okay. It has turned up the other way, though. Oh, okay. Well, you might get some very strange sound effects, but there you go.

SPEAKER_01 20:25

Excuse me while I just tickle your furry bit.

SPEAKER_00 20:27

Thanks, Taz. Fill with your furry bit. Oh dear, not again. Honestly. Anything's possible on this show. Anyway, where were we? Quickly moving on.

SPEAKER_01 20:34

That brings us back in because I think one of the other areas where we weren't sure, we know we love this format where we come up with the topics. Sometimes you, our dear listeners, and at some point, viewers, give us topics and things you want us to talk about. Yeah, please. We sometimes do as do those Ask Us Anything episodes. We'll probably do another one of those.

SPEAKER_00 20:52

Yeah, we will be soon. Have we done any for no, we haven't done any for season two yet. So there's another point.

SPEAKER_01 20:56

If you've got anything you want us to answer, answer on an episode, find us on social, email us, tell us what you want us to talk about, and we'll we'll do it, we'll do another AMA Ask Me Anything episode soon. But we walked in there thinking, are we getting this wrong? Because it feels right, but so many of the other kind of more seasoned podcasters we talk about do this with guests. And with our PR and marketing head on, well I heads on, we do have a head each, which it kind of makes sense because of course then you've got not only your audience as as the podcaster, as the podcaster, but the audiences of of the guests. So that's gonna share you out further and further and further. It's much quicker.

SPEAKER_00 21:41

Return in a way, isn't it, in terms of followers, potentially.

SPEAKER_01 21:44

Yeah. You can see why. But what we Well, certainly when I did my Taz Talks chat show during lockdown, which was all through YouTube and social media, and all video but not audio, I really should do the opposite with that. Strip out the audio and stick them onto a podcast at some point.

SPEAKER_00 21:56

That's a good idea, Taz. There's another one, see?

SPEAKER_01 21:58

Yeah, but that worked because. It was celebrity guests talking about mental health during lockdown, and of course, their fan base were all piling in. So that worked there. Whereas this one, we didn't even know until we were at the show that this is called pure podcasting. When you've just got the podcast host talking, maybe with occasional guests.

SPEAKER_00 22:18

Like the dog, for instance. Yeah, yeah. We have had that. Oh, my grumbling tummy, which I think has made an appearance several times already today. We'll have to check that on the sound when we come back. Which takes me to revolting.

SPEAKER_01 22:30

Was that revolting rhymes or dirty beasts?

SPEAKER_00 22:32

Are you calling me a dirty beast?

SPEAKER_01 22:34

No, that roll doll anthologist when we were kids. Oh yeah, it was revolting rhymes. Yeah,

Pure Podcasting And Host Identity

SPEAKER_01 22:40

I think my tummy monsters, yeah. Blaining. I've got to please believe me, mummy. There is a monster in my tummy. Yeah, thank you. Okay, right. Anyway, back on topic. Yes, back on topic does. It does happen occasionally. Pure podcasting really got some bloody brilliant validation during the event. So we both spoke to people that we just got chatting to who lit up when we talked to them about the format. So they loved that. No guests, no rigid structure, you know, being A D H D A F. I'm proud of it. The feedback was that it feels real and relatable. And what one of the panellists said, I'm not sure if this was Callum or somebody later on, and we were like, yeah, that's exactly it. And again, it's something we used to talk about in PR and coaching people on their content. Guest heavy shows very often lose the host's identity entirely. It's like, who are they without a guest? If you have an episode where your guest doesn't turn up or you just run out of guests for a time, if you haven't spent the time building up your own personal brand, exactly that, because it is brand building, it's a great opportunity to build your personal brand.

SPEAKER_00 23:45

You know, in the same way that even if you go, you go to you know you go to even the top podcasting, there'll always be if you watch a TV show, for instance, you know, with guests, there'll still be an element of that host having even if it's just two minutes at the beginning doing their thing. So if you look at Graham Norton, for instance, he's great with that because he'll have various news things and have a great spin on something that's happened this week before he goes into the guests.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 24:10

Everybody will do that, or the best hosts do that.

SPEAKER_01 24:14

Same kind of thing as well. The Jimmy Fallons of the world. Yeah, uh Colbert, Stephen Colbert, all of them. And if you look at the guests they get on, those guests are wanting to go onto that show because they feel at a level with that host where they feel their own their own common ground, there's a friendship, there's no hierarchy, and they And they probably feel they know them a bit better because they've given more of themselves. Yeah, they want to be with that host.

SPEAKER_00 24:38

Jonathan Ross as well, he's another one who does it. Yeah, they all do it. So why would we think that going straight into having loads and loads of guests, which is fabulous for building, but if you've not given enough of yourself, so giving your your listeners a feel for what you're like, some of your quirks and things that make you unique, uniquely you, you know, that's that's a great way to build your personal brand. I think some of us miss out on that.

SPEAKER_01 25:02

Yeah, and I'm I'm hoping this will resonate with anyone who's ever been told that you need to have guests to to grow your podcast. And guests can be a great idea, but not at the expense of your own personal brand. You know, you need to remember that too. And where this really resonated is I remember back in the days where again we were coaching a lot of people over their social media, yeah, having them do it for them. We still do that through our unleashed programmes and some of our coaching schemes, schemes, programs. And that is that so many, and I've got to say, it's usually in the kind of coaching therapy in air quote softer side of personal development that it happens, people spend so much time sharing really pretty quote memes and quote graphics, it might have their their brand, but they're sharing words from Oprah Winfrey or somebody else's quote, yeah. Mel Robbins or Brene Brown.

SPEAKER_00 25:56

It's like why did I want to sing that then? What did you want to sing? Somebody else's quote. Someone else's quote. Who's saying that? Anyway, so if you know what that is, guys, let us know. Where does that come from? Anyway, carry on. Awesomely off topic. But yes, sharing other people's quotes instead of actually thinking about what you can share that is your. I don't know, was it? Yeah. Off topic. Yes, but having that instead of sharing your own quotes and your own words, sharing other people's, which is fabulous. But with your own branding, so really cement it by putting your own quotes in there.

SPEAKER_01 26:34

So often to people, didn't look, I'm sharing this because it's going to increase football. Yeah, but you you're you're marketing somebody else's brand. Not where are your words? Where's your quote? Yeah. And there's nothing wrong with sharing them occasionally. I do that if I think, oh, that will really resonate with my audience. Yeah. But will also also occasionally think, bloody hell, why didn't I say that? What would my version of that be? Have the cockoo sneeze. Cockapoo sneeze in the background. So yeah, we we really love that here in that actually the pure podcasting model is just as valid, and sometimes more so, because again, it's about building your brand, not just providing a kind of bland platform for other people to come and be the big voice on. You've got to have you there as well.

SPEAKER_00 27:20

Yeah, the mix, the mix, you've got to get the mix right, haven't you? I think.

SPEAKER_01 27:23

Yeah. Some of the panelists as well. This was really interesting, I think. And we're talking about the most popular podcasting formats at the minute. Um, if you can hear little tippy toes in the background, that's our cockapoo just wandering across the wooden floors.

SPEAKER_00 27:38

Bailey, come on, come on.

SPEAKER_01 27:39

Come on, Bob.

SPEAKER_00 27:40

He's coming up. Come on, good boy.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

His name is Bailey, but we often refer to him as Bob because Thornton. Bailey, Bob Thornton. We inherited him with He's a rescue. With Bailey, didn't he? He's a beautiful boy. He's also a bit of a git, aren't you? Occasionally. I love you, Bailey. He's lovely. Leave him alone. If you could just see, if you listeners could just see the other side of our recording screen right now. So we've got Bailey the cockapoo on one side. No, don't make me a mic. Currently climbing up Asher's chest and trying to eat. It's a long way to go. I was gonna say, actually, it's not a long way to go because it's so low these days, but. Get out of it. Climbing up Asher's chest and trying to eat furry mic. What are you gonna say then? Yeah. And at this side, if you hear any weird slurping, I've got the the golden doodle licking my hand and sticking her head in front of the screens and stop looking at the nose. And give me attention to the floor. Stop licking my nose.

SPEAKER_00 28:31

Anyway, carry on.

SPEAKER_01 28:32

I never knew my tongue was long enough to do that.

SPEAKER_00 28:34

Hey. Anyway, let's not go there. This is um That's another podcast for another day. Maybe.

SPEAKER_01 28:38

That's for OnlyFans. Right, okay, carry on. Where were we? Different podcast formats that are really popular right now and really good for pulling in audiences. Yeah. And again, with our background, we were like, yep, yeah, yeah, yeah, we've talked about that, we've done some of that. Oh, that might be good. And the ones that were were being touted as the most popular, I remember one of them was the kind of versus format, the this this versus that, or two people with opposing views coming in talking about them. The the polarising content observation. Yeah. Two positions, genuine tension, real opinions. I mean, we do that anyway. We I think we do that quite naturally. But when when a lot of when podcasts are are primed and positioned as that, this versus that, yeah, that can work really, really well.

SPEAKER_00 29:25

Yeah, yeah, definitely. We've got to think about some of the arguably some of the inverted combos news channels do that a lot, don't they?

SPEAKER_01 29:32

Yeah, it's an absolute classic, it's a it's a classic attention grab. Yeah. It really, really is. What were some of the other some of the other podcasting angles that people were saying were really good at that were pulling in inspiration?

SPEAKER_00 29:44

And I was gonna say, because I thought you were in charge of leading that today, because you normally are, so I'm gonna let you do that because my brain, it's look at this.

SPEAKER_01 29:53

What? Okay, so the credentials. So making a big bold making a big bold claim. Yes. Credential led podcast. Okay, so one big bold claim.

SPEAKER_00 30:02

Give me a big bold claim, Asher. Um That wasn't one. I'm thinking I've just got I've got a labbrad doodle and a grudel

Formats Experiments And Asking Clearly

SPEAKER_00 30:10

and a whatever. I don't know, don't put me on the spot like that. I'm supposed to do that.

SPEAKER_01 30:13

Big bold claim. Golden Doodles are the best breed of dog, hands down. Prove me wrong. You are, aren't you, Grudel? Don't listen, Bailey. Actually, no, I love all dogs. But that would be an example of a big bold claim. Cool. Prompted by Gladys. Um, so the big bold claim, the big bold claim episodes can work really well. You've got the versus debate, and also with the versus debate, if you can get big names on them, all the better. And one of the points that was made, which again ties back into some of the stuff we used to teach in our PR days, if you can't actually get a big name, if you don't have the contacts to get the guests on, you can use something that a big well-known figure has said and use that in your promotion, but you have the argument about it.

unknown 30:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:58

So I don't know, Jeremy Clarkson says XYZ, here's why he's wrong. Yeah. And you debate it. And then again, if you're going back to the thumbnails, then you can't have a thumbnail of Jeremy Clarkson on your podcast, but you could find an image of Jeremy Clarkson that you were you were allowed to use and do a split screen with him on one side and you on the other.

SPEAKER_00 31:17

That was one of the examples that was given there. That's a great way of doing it.

SPEAKER_01 31:20

So you can still use the big names as topic. Bailey, don't start knocking the house to pieces while we're recording, thank you. You can still use the big the imagery of a big name, a well-known name, even if you haven't gotten them on your show, so long as of course you're doing it with integrity. Outcome driven. That was one of the other things. And again, to use a big bold claim that we kind of diss all the time because too many people use them, and you can't actually sell a promise like this.

SPEAKER_00 31:48

Something like the dog's just raided the bin. Sorry. Stolen now. I had a cookie, a high price cookie. He's stolen a wrapper from a protein cookie.

SPEAKER_01 31:59

So if there's rustling in the background, that's what it is. That's what it is. He's got it. I'm not even going over there because you just growl growl at me. There you go. So the big claim, usually somebody's name, your name, or whoever you're talking about. And then the bigger bold claim, something like how to make how to make five million pounds by next Tuesday. How to make a million in a year. Yeah. So that would be a big bold claim episode where it thinks it's going to give you step by step in in order to go and do that. Entertainment and comedy podcasts, the ones that do product positioning are quite are quite good right now. So one of the examples they gave was let's say somebody says somebody says, we try every discontinued Burger King product this episode. Yeah. And give you our verdicts. So yeah, all of that they talked about. And again, that ties back into that that that coming up with the biggest title that you can and then trying to satisfy it and keep coming down until you find one that you're comfortable with. And the other thing that was said that again I think we're doing naturally is experiment with at least 20% of the code.

SPEAKER_00 33:02

Oh yeah, I loved that. That's when I thought, oh, we're okay, because we do that, as you can probably tell, if you've listened to more than one of our podcasts, I hope you have, that we do that quite regularly and we'll try in different settings, different situations, different mics. Obviously, we've improved the sounds a bit, I think, over the last few months. We've been going for what, 10 months? 10 months now. Yeah. Which is bigger.

SPEAKER_01 33:21

But if you think about the way we started, which was deliberately starting a podcast on a shoestra with no clue what we were doing, and we were just doing it alongside you. We were, you know, recording on the fly with crap equipment to no equipment. We tried recording in cafes, in garden centres, in the car. We went all to all kinds of different places to see how it would sound. Yeah. That was our initial setup.

SPEAKER_00 33:43

Yeah. And we're just roaming from there. I can remember on that one because I think in the garden centre they'd already closed half of the coffee shop, hadn't they? The back of the restaurant bit had been closed, and they let us go in there just to record our podcast so that it wasn't too noisy, which was absolutely fabulous. So if you don't ask, you don't get. Yeah. So we learnt so much doing that, didn't we?

SPEAKER_01 34:02

So yeah, we love a bit of experimentation. And I think another point that was really relevant for us, and again comes back to that principle we know from teaching people social media back in the day and doing it for them. You need to ask for what you want. It doesn't matter whether that's social media, whether it's a podcast, whether it's applying the rules of manifestation and law of attraction. You need to ask for what you want. Hence, please subscribe, please download, please share this. And that comes from please listeners, please subscribe, please download. This is one per episode.

SPEAKER_00 34:32

I know, I've done it. I'm practicing Taz, I'm practicing. I've got a dog slobber on my glasses now because I've had two dogs. I know it's lovely. Hang on a second.

SPEAKER_01 34:40

They are very sexy new glasses.

SPEAKER_00 34:42

Thank you, but they're slightly slobbered over now. Bright red hexagonal framed Levi's dog slobbered glasses. Yeah. Everybody should have a pair.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

Absolutely. So some really fascinating stats were shared that tied into that nicely. And if you're running a podcast, or whatever it you're doing that you need where you need to ask for what you want, please remember this. About 30% of all podcast listeners still say they find out about podcasts from friends and family. So think about that, where you have the potential for getting your listeners to actively promote your podcast and help you to grow by sharing it and by subscribing. It's amazing, isn't it? And then, and this backs up something else we've always said the importance of marketing and staying out there and staying visible. Another 30% of podcast listeners find the podcast via social media. So think about that. That's a whopping 60% of your audience are finding you via word of mouth. Whether that's physical voice or whether it's word digital word of mouth. Yeah. That accounts for 60% of your audience. That's where your growth's coming from.

SPEAKER_00 35:46

Look at it like that. It's huge positions.

SPEAKER_01 35:47

Absolutely huge. Something else that really made us to quote a famous playwright. Just prick up her ears. Go on. Prick up your ears.

SPEAKER_00 35:58

Go on. No, it's. Oh God, we're so no carry on. I can't. Honestly, carry on, Taz. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is it Alan Akeborne? It will come to us in a moment. I'm going to find out. Hang on. Prick up your ears. Hang on, hang on. Just keep talking, Taz. Keep talking about podcasts. Keep going, keep going, keep going.

Word Of Mouth Social Growth Trendjacking

SPEAKER_01 36:20

I know, I know. The trend jacking comments. Yeah, I loved that because it's newsjacking. It's exactly what we've been teaching for years. So again, we go in as newbies thinking we don't know anything. And then everything they're saying, oh yeah, that's that's a transferable skill from when we did this and this and this and this. So we teach news jacking a lot. So find something that's just coming up in the news that's being talked about, and imagine that the conversation is in kind of a bell curve. It starts at ground level, then it gradually increases, gets bigger and bigger and bigger until it gets to the top and then comes down the other side. The idea with newsjacking, what Asher?

SPEAKER_00 36:57

You were right, it was Alan Bennett. Alan Bennett, thank you very much. The screenplay was written by Alan Bennett based on the 1978 biography by John Law. The film stars Gary Oldman as Orton, Alfred Molina as Halliwell, Wallace Sean as Law, and Vanessa Redgrave as Peggy Ramsey. Thank you very much. So prick up your ears. We're all done.

SPEAKER_01 37:16

Anyway, yeah, so the idea is you get that topic just before it hits the top of the mountain. And for the NLPers in the room, this is a when it's a bit like anchoring a state where you want to anchor it just before it hits the peak. And you start talking about it just as it's coming to the pinnacle. Yeah. Because then your content is out there when everybody's talking about that topic. Which means you've got a much higher chance of getting in the news, getting in the media, getting magazines, radio, wherever you want to be. And of course, with podcasts, same applies, but trend jacking. So what's on trend right now with whatever your area of podcasting happens to be, jump on those trends and talk about them as you're rising up that bell curve. I hope I've I've made that clear. Maybe we should do a graphic of it and stick it on the social channels so people know what we're talking about. That could be a good idea.

SPEAKER_00 38:07

Yeah, because we've done that before, didn't we, in our training? So it'd be a nice one.

SPEAKER_01 38:10

So if you don't know, if you can't visualize what we're saying about newsjacking and trend jacking, find us on on Insta and Facebook, and I'll I'll stick we'll create a graphic and stick it out so you can go and see that. What else, Ash? We talked about the trend jacking. What else?

SPEAKER_00 38:24

Well, I loved I loved the fact I want to talk about when we first went in because obviously we'd never been to this show before.

SPEAKER_01 38:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 38:30

We'd read about it online. I think it was the fifth year this year. We met quite a few people. What I love, there's so many opportunities to network. There's actually networking events throughout the two days. There's also get togethers at the end of each day and a pub down the road. It's fabulous. There's lots of opportunity to do that. We didn't do as much of that this year as probably we could have done because we're still finding our feet a bit. But I love the fact that there were so many different types of people there. Some right at the beginning of their podcasting journey. There's the J-word. Um others, I know, I've done it. We hate that journey. I know, but so many people use it too much. I'm going to use it again. And others much further on, you know, been going for years. Um but the common thing was it's a real family feel to it, I think, around it, and the acknowledgement and the recognition of the power of voice. And I've always believed in that. I always talk about that a lot when I'm talking to people about writing books, yeah, with their audiobooks, etc. etc., and voiceover and all of that stuff. So I loved it. When we went in, and I'd been this was at the Business Design Centre in Islington, which I've actually been involved in events there in the past where I was running the press office. Yeah. So I knew the layout, and I've forgotten how much I love the venue. I think it's a fabulous venue, lovely location, and so easy to get to from you know from coming in from um Peterborough area, which is where we came in from. So I just think the overall feeling was really, really positive. Loads of people, really open discussions going on, which I loved. Just sitting in some of the talks, just but you had to get there early to get a seat, yeah, because they were all pretty much sold out, which was lovely. But sitting talking to people before the talk started, there were so many people to learn from actually, and a real enthusiasm for podcasting with others and and recogn, you know, acknowledging the fact that you've kept going with it. Because I think that's one of the things that the main thing is to keep going. You know, I don't think there's ever been a doubt that once we started we wouldn't keep going, although we have struggled sometimes with having you know ideas for podcasts and thinking, you know, what we're going to talk about this week, but actually getting into the habit of having a day when we podcast, which is our ideal day is a Friday, and we go into the studio, which for us is very often your studio over in further into Lincolnshire. And again, our studio, I don't know what it goes.

SPEAKER_01 40:42

I know, I know, but it was yours originally, that's why I say I'm still I've got my but that that brings us on to another point that was being talked about.

Visual Identity Studio And Being Recognised

SPEAKER_01 40:50

I can't remember which of the panellists it was, but it was on the panel with again Callum and Ruth Fitzsimmons from Bow Media Island and somebody else. Oh, Jordan Schwotzenberger. Burger, I believe. Yeah. Yeah. And they were talking about visual identity. And again, if you've ever been to any of my personal branding workshops or had coaching with me one-to-one to help you cement and grow your brand and your audience, I bang on about the importance of using your colours, your graphic, your visual style and everything that you put online. So it's easy to recognise you and stop the scroll because people aren't going to remember remember your name straight away. But when they're scrolling through, if they see something in those same colours and fonts, that same vibe, they're going to recognise it, consistency. And one of the reasons that we created the studio from from the the kind of craft and an occasional work studio we already had, we turned that podcast studio into the the visual smorgasbord that we did because we wanted that visual identity. And one of the points somebody was making very, very strongly was exactly that that if you there's no point trying to have a visual identity or having a studio if you have a different backdrop every week. Yeah. So let's say you do this and use a green screen. If you change your backdrop every way, every week, you're not going to be recognized. And that the studio we've created with that backdrop, with the graffiti on the wall and all the quirky things that represent bits of our personality on the industrial shelving units behind us.

SPEAKER_00 42:34

Again, that in its own right is building your personal brand. Absolutely. Because people are going, there must be, and I know I've done it on things when you've tuned into somebody and about what is that? What have they got? What picture is that? We've got books in the background, we've got Lioness's football now, which I didn't have last week.

SPEAKER_01 42:49

We've got Marvel and DC characters, we've got a little orange tree to represent Olive of Greece, we've got some Greek mythological figures on there. All of that stuff. You've got gifts given to you by some of the clients whose books you've published. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 43:01

So it's so all of that is about looning your brand. I have, yes. Well, National Plant Month, always pick up after your animals, please. There you go. Um I'll get that in there. But it's the visual brand.

SPEAKER_01 43:14

So again, when we start doing more on video with that studio as a backdrop, it creates a visual identity. Yeah. So we make sure that all our visual sound bites have a predetermined visual identity, and we change the the photo element every week at the top and bottom of those to tone with the episode. But every time we drop a quote bracket, a quote quote bracket, a quote graphic, or um again a sound bite, they've got our brand on there.

SPEAKER_00 43:43

And also, oh sorry, go on. I was just gonna say, maybe we're going to the same place. I might have missed it because I was when I was talking, you might have already said something earlier when I wasn't paying attention. Delwood mission, isn't it? Tell me you have in a sensitive ADHD. No, I was gonna say about this whole thing. Around having an image of you within so the logo, it's not just about the pretty colours and stuff, it's always having a visual representation of you. Well, we're not the ones in the logo, but we do have our names in our logo. We do. What's going on over there? Stop it. Come here, Bailey, please. Come on. Bobby in the knob. Sorry, what were you gonna say, Bob? Stop being in the knock.

SPEAKER_01 44:18

Exactly that. The more we do video, we've got the existing brand and the branchors that people will recognise. But if we're doing videos from inside the studio, we're in that physical studio. Yeah. And bits might get added to the shelves or moved about a bit to create interest, but people will recognise when they're doing a quick scroll stream scroll through social media. Oh, that's that's those that's those bonkers, two ADHD women talking about brands and books and businesses and all kinds of things. Who could you possibly be talking to me with it? So, yeah, visual identity. So so important. It really, really is. I mean, yeah, the the the delight of podcasts early on was that you didn't need to be visual, it was all auditory, but more and more now, the visuals coming into it. And I asked this I asked a question in one of the panels later on that was being run by a couple of the guys from Arcade, Joe and Sam. Joe Lam and Sam Ewings? Ewings. I don't know if I pronounced that wrong. Sam, if you're listening to this and I pronounced your name wrong, I apologise. But I asked a question at the end, which was what is the biggest mistake or missed opportunity you find rookie podcasters making? Yeah, and what's the fix you'd encourage them to make? And what did they say? Do you remember? Your consistency.

SPEAKER_00 45:37

Yeah. Exactly that consistency. Which is what we've always talked about, and we all talk about it, but do we've got to look at our own stuff, haven't we? And you say, are we being consistent with that?

SPEAKER_01 45:45

But also in terms of following that TV and radio model, you know, we know you know, well, before the days of just being able to record everything digitally and get it on catch-up, we always knew that on a I don't know, Wednesday night at 6 pm we wanted to watch blah. And that that routine is consistent, and it's the same thing. And they were saying so many people say, Oh, we're gonna release our podcast every blah at 6am or whatever, and then you've only got to miss a few episodes

Consistency Length And Community Lessons

SPEAKER_01 46:10

a few times, and you start to lose trust, yeah, and people start to switch off. And I actually had a real little bit of pride and a bit of smug smugness there because I did, because we've always said we'll see you next Tuesday, yeah, and not everybody gets that for a while, but we always do. We've always put out our weekly episodes on Tuesdays, and we've never ever missed one. And sometimes we batch record some, sometimes we drop out bonus episodes between Tuesdays, but we have been so consistent all the way through, and it surprised me, I think, that so many people were falling down on that score.

SPEAKER_00 46:52

Yeah, and it's and it's so easy to do for you to fall out of somebody's you know, space, if you like. Oh, they'll for it's very easy, you it can be easily forgotten in those spaces. So it's really important that you've got to be front and centre all the time there, so that it's an automatic thing that on a Tuesday, you know, at 5 a.m., it you know, ultimately off topic, for instance, drops, it's there to get so that when you wake up on a Tuesday morning there it's to lose too. Yeah, so whether it's you're listening to it at breakfast, lunchtime, dinner time, supper, middle of the night, because you can't sleep. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:23

And the other the other point that was being pushed quite hard is that time is part of your packaging. So they were advising that for podcasts that's still kind of growing or newbie not to go over an hour. And interestingly, when we first started out, we set out to do between 15 and 30 minutes per episode, and then gradually realised because because ADHD, we struggle to do that. Most of our episodes come in over come in just under an hour, some go just over, and I'd been worried that that was too long. But actually, they were saying that was about the right benchmark, and they were talking about people who do podcasts of like two and four hours, and saying that actually that time element is really important because not everybody's got that time, and you can't really be asking people to give up that amount of time unless they unless you've built a much bigger audience. So I don't know, if you're Joe Rogan, you might be able to say here's a two-hour episode and have people sit down and and absorb it.

SPEAKER_00 48:21

But if you just let the dog out, Taz, I've got to let the dog out. He has to go, he has to go. Sorry, listeners.

SPEAKER_01 48:26

Carry on, carry on, through the dog, eh? For our lovely little roving furry mics. Yes, come on, kids. You've got if you've got a big enough brand and a big enough audience, you can ask people for more time and you've got that level of trust and commitment there. But if you're not yet at that level, you you need to be able to create the kind of timings where people can listen to you on their commute to and from work. Or again, waiting for a train or on the pod or on the in the supermarket.

SPEAKER_00 48:57

I was gonna say in the pod.

SPEAKER_01 49:01

It's a very difficult word to remember. So yeah, that was that was great too. And certainly some of the things that we're planning will be very, very time-centric, and we don't we're just teasing you for now, but let's just say we've got some add-ons to these episodes that we're gonna be dropping out between Tuesdays, hopefully with more consistency that will not take as much of your time, but will be really, really worthwhile for you. Yeah. So watch this space. Yeah, we're looking forward to doing that. Watch this space. What surprised you, Ash? I think one of the things that surprised me most was how really open and friendly everybody was.

SPEAKER_00 49:38

Yeah, I yeah, I mean, not that that wouldn't happen, but sometimes, you know, you can go to some events, they can be a little bit starchy, a bit, you know, a bit difficult to break through, and it wasn't at all like that. Everybody, every conversation I had, and I had a lot of conversations every time.

SPEAKER_01 49:52

Sometimes somebody came and sat next to us to watch one of the talks, they opened conversation and just chatted. And I thought, is that because this started as a talk platform?

SPEAKER_00 50:02

Yeah. Is it because of that? And also it's a passion, it's something that you do. It's a there's a real kind of I know it's going to sound really weird, but it feels like that, you know, that kind of mini club type thing. Yeah, it's that kind of real community scent, which is what you want to build as a podcaster, don't you? As a host, you want to build your community, but it really feels like that when you go to the event because everybody will ask, you know, what do you do? What's your have you got a podcast? You know, what's it about? And then you reciprocate, and then they talk about theirs, and then you talk about other things that you might include, and and also the willingness to offer advice, not advice in a kind of I've done it and I know it all, but a real.

SPEAKER_01 50:38

So I think one of the first open conversations we had when we got there was when we sat down for our first panel. Um, this woman came over and sat next to us, um, and we got chatting. So big shout out and a wave to Chloe Fergie from Flamingo Heights Podcast Studio in Newcastle.

SPEAKER_00 50:58

Yay, hello Chloe.

SPEAKER_01 50:59

And she was so open and just chatting, and she was saying, Oh, how many episodes? And we said, Well, the next one's our 50th. And but then when we said we've been going for less than a year, she was like, Wow, and you've done 50 already. Well, yeah. And again, that's something else where we had a little pat on the back for ourselves, and we didn't realise that we'd gone over and above what a lot of new podcasters done.

SPEAKER_00 51:21

I think quite a few people don't they, and again, it's got to be right for the individual or the you know the team doing it. So, for instance, I was talking to a lovely lady there who who was watching one of the talks sitting standing next to us because we couldn't get a seat, we got there a bit, didn't we? Uh 10 minutes early, but it was all filled up. We're standing listening to one of the talks, and she was from cancer research, and she got a team of three there to kind of work the room and the event for two days. Uh but she was saying obviously they've got so much in their marketing to do, and this is just a part of it, but they're really keen on on growing that and what they can do, you know, with a relatively small team on that particular area. Yeah, but again, so friendly, so inclusive, and it was just it was just a really lovely conversation talking about you know very different organisations that have seen the benefits in podcasting and what it's brought for them, you know, as individuals as well as for the the organisations that they work for. So I don't know where I was going with that. What did you say before that?

SPEAKER_01 52:16

I was talking about people being really open, I was talking about Chloe Ferdy chatting to us about how well we were doing considering how long we were going.

SPEAKER_00 52:23

And that was it, and we were saying about you know, I think for some people start off with uh say a monthly podcast, and then they might go to you know by uh bi-monthly or and then weekly possibly, or some sometimes stick it, you know, just once a month, whatever it is. You've got to find the right, you know, thing for you, haven't you, and how many you can do in the course of a a month, a year, whatever. Um the fact that we went out for it and went for a weekly right from the beginning, yeah. I did wonder about how we were gonna do it, but I'm really enjoying the and it is hard.

SPEAKER_01 52:51

For anyone saying, you know, they don't have the time. I've because I really wanted to do this, I've completely rescheduled my working weeks. So Fridays are podcast days. Yeah. Tuesdays, admin catch up and working in the business. This week it's been a bit different because we've already taken three days out for the podcast show, so we did have clients on the Tuesday.

SPEAKER_00 53:13

We had a very potty dog one day where we thought we were gonna have to.

SPEAKER_01 53:16

Yeah, let's not go there.

SPEAKER_00 53:17

Yeah, let's not go there because we don't want to end up in tears on this episode.

SPEAKER_01 53:21

But ultimately, committing to this fully and committing to having the time on our businesses rather than being just in our businesses has effectively meant losing two client-focused days per week, which means I've had to really again switch the way that I do things. So I think if you want to do it enough, you can do it, but you've got to really be committed to it. And if you don't think you can do weekly episodes, about to turn the dog on. Don't do it. We know plenty who are doing monthly, bi-monthly, fortnightly. Find a format that works for you. Bailey, get down. Oi, down and go from there. That's it. To anyone listening, called Bob or Bailey, I apologise. I was not talking to you, I promise.

SPEAKER_00 54:09

If we, you know.

SPEAKER_01 54:10

Unless you unless you liked that tone of voice, in which case message me later and we'll work out a reasonable fee.

SPEAKER_00 54:17

You've heard the cat go now. I can hear the cat upstairs.

SPEAKER_01 54:20

Oh, it must be because we're nearly on time. We are, but yeah, and the the number one question that was the icebreaker for so many when they sat with us what's your favourite podcast? Oh, Gladys. And for the first, I think two people we spoke to, we all had the same podcast that came up. Uncanny.

SPEAKER_00 54:38

Yeah, I know. That came up a lot in conversations, didn't it? We were watching the TV version of it last night because there were a couple of episodes that we hadn't seen. And the one that was recommended, the Shadow Man.

SPEAKER_01 54:48

Yeah, and we watched it last night.

SPEAKER_00 54:49

We watched it, thank you, Cl. I think Chloe recommended it. Thank you, Chloe. We watched it last night, we watched it quite late at night. Put it this way a certain person with pink hair, that's not me, by the way, everybody, asked me if I could go upstairs. She needed to go to the loo and didn't want to go on her own.

SPEAKER_01 55:04

No, or couldn't we on my own because the shadow man might go? So there you go. But yeah. The the other lovely thing I think for me was recognising the amount of crossovers. Yeah. So the amount of people we met there that were able to say things like, Are you going to Atomic Con? Yeah, I'm going there. Shall we meet up there? So that

Event Friction AI Slop Wrap Up

SPEAKER_01 55:20

that was really lovely as well. And I think everything there we loved. The only there were two areas where where for us it fell down a little bit. Yeah. Number one, it's a podcasting show where it's all about the tech. There were no plug points unless you'd bought a platinum ticket. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 55:37

It's like, oh come on, guys, really? Really? I mean, if there were and we missed them, do let us know, please, organisers, because we'd love to know. Perhaps we just didn't know.

SPEAKER_01 55:45

Next year we'll be taking some power banks with us. And we didn't take them this year because we went, it's a podcast show. There's bound to be charging points.

SPEAKER_00 55:51

Yeah, I mean No, there are, no, there weren't. So that was one. That was only a little that's a small thing, but it was actually quite irritant.

SPEAKER_01 55:57

We had to go and find a coffee shop to recharge. Yeah. And the other point was one of the talks we went to was really a really fascinating talk about sound engineering and sound design, because we we can geek out. Asher especially can geek out. I love that, the use of that for storytelling. But we sat there thinking this is really fascinating for the the future of sound in media, but there didn't seem to be an awful lot that people running their own podcasts could could apply just yet. Interesting view into the future. Yeah. So they were talking an awful lot, for instance, about doing the sound engineering for the new series on TV that is going to give more money to that transphobic JKK woman. So I'm not even going to drop the name out there, but it has lots of witches and wizards in it. Yeah. So again, fascinating in terms of the technology and the way it's moving on. But I was fine- I found it a bit frustrating because I was like, well, how how can I apply this? I remember though, Taz, we did only go for the one day, and so we just certainly come back and like to come to base days. That's not a criticism at all, but it was just the one of all the talks that we went to where I thought I can't really directly apply anything from this one. But still absolutely fascinating. And what's going to happen with tech and AI over the next few years that's going to allow us to bring some of that audio tech in. And just quickly on AI, and I would agree wholeheartedly with this. More than one of the panellists talked about the amount of AI slop that's being brought into the podcast frame now. So if we're going to use AI, let's use it wisely and not just churn out slop.

SPEAKER_00 57:29

Yeah. So much to take in, does. Still buzzing from that, you can tell, I'm sure. We we we went last Wednesday, it's now this Wednesday just gone. We're on Friday, and we're still talking about it and we'll be for some time. We can't wait to see what comes up for next year's event. Yeah. Looking forward to that, and obviously, you know, learning from all those that attend and meeting loads more people. So do give us a follow and and you know, subscribe and let's chat. If you're a podcaster, get in touch, we'd love to hear from you.

SPEAKER_01 57:54

And we are talking about maybe getting a little group of us to all go up together or down together, depending on where depending on where you are in the world, to next year's podcasting show. So if you're interested in that, let us know. We'll see if we can arrange something and have a an awesomely off-topic delegation going, whether you've got your own podcast or not. Let's let's see if we can make that happen. Very, very quick virtual wave to people that we we know and love that we bumped into there. Shout out to Josephine Hughes, who we we we met at Atomicon a few years back and stayed in touch with. She's been a client in some of my groups since. Had a lovely catch-up with her. Very, very quick catch-up with Matt Hughes. No relation as far as I know. Oh no. Quick catch-up, essentially related to a quick gentle kick up the bum as I walked past and a hello because he was already deep in conversation. And also, shout out to Anton Katz to just back up the power of branding. We were wearing our awesomely off-topic t-shirts. He was at the back of one of the talks where we were in the front row. He stayed back afterwards and came up to talk to us specifically the strength of the brand he saw on our t-shirts. He wanted to find out more on what our show was and what it was all about. So it worked, has what a surprise. Guess what? Two people who have been in journalism and promotion and co and branding and coaching for such a long time, we might know a thing or two about brand. And there's the prefleet works. Anyway, we hope that we've given you loads and loads of food for thought there. Whether or not you run a podcast, hopefully you'll be able to transfer some of this stuff into your social media content, anything else that you're doing to promote yourselves, anything you want us to talk about in the future, please let us know. We will pause it there and we will see you next Tuesday.

SPEAKER_00 59:31

You've been listening to Autumn Me Off Topic. Make sure you're following so you don't miss the next one. And if you'd like more, come and find Autumn Me Off Topic on social media, or find behind the scenes footage, played, and more. See you next time.