Consulting from the Couch
Welcome to Consulting from the Couch, a podcast about leaders, what makes them tick, what drives them, and the challenges they face. During the show, you’ll get to know some of the most genuine people that the host, Steve Goodson, has worked with over the years, and you’ll hear these leaders provide nuggets, tidbits, and takeaways for the emerging leaders of tomorrow.
This podcast is brought to you by Brown Leather Couch Consulting (hence known as BLC Consulting)…we’re a communications and organizational strategy group that works in the electric utility space and with service-related industries, helping them thrive in today’s ever-changing landscape. To learn more, go to BLCconsulting.org.
Consulting from the Couch
Leading with Purpose: Faith, Sports, and the Next Generation
What if a football camp could change the culture of an entire community?
That question drives this conversation in this episode of Consulting from the Couch. We sit down for a fantastic interview with Ken Lovell, Director and Minister with Coastal NC Fellowship of Christian Athletes, whose mission is to bring everything together in Christ through the influence of coaches and athletes.
Ken shares his journey from the Marine Corps to ministry, unpacking how purpose—not position—has guided his leadership across four counties. He walks us through the growth of FCA’s Eastern NC Team Football Camp, the power of student-led huddles, and how discipleship—not just inspiration—creates lasting transformation.
From the “sandpaper” principle of accountability to the ripple effects of the FCA’s reach in Okinawa, this episode demonstrates how faith, leadership, and teamwork can transform communities.
Whether you’re a coach, parent, or leader, you’ll find practical wisdom on how to engage, equip, and empower the next generation through purpose.
Listen now on your favorite podcast platform and join the movement at BLCConsultingLLC.com.
Every better.
SPEAKER_00:Welcome to Consulting from the Couch, where we explore people, ideas, and leadership, shaping our communities and our lives one story at a time. In today's episode, I'm going to talk with Ken Lovell, Director and Minister with Coastal NC Fellowship of Christian Athletes. I'm going to explore how Ken leads with vision, trains up students, coaches, and stewards teams dedicated to spiritual and athletic growth. Ken, welcome and thank you for joining me today.
SPEAKER_01:Thanks for having me, Steve.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. Listen, take a couple minutes to tell the listeners more about yourself, just your background, how you got involved with FCA, and tell us about your family because I know you're proud of them.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I sure am. Thanks for asking. So ten years ago, I received an invitation that was kind of disguised as a calling from the Lord to come on staff with the Fellowship of Christian Athletes as the coastal North Carolina FCA director. I took took that role on, and uh over the last 10 years I've actually for a brief time served our region, the Carolinas, as the regional director of talent advancement, and then uh let go of that role to really focus more intimately here on this calling. But then also over the last six years, I've been the director of Eastern North Carolina's team football camp, which is FCA's largest camp in the world, I found out last year.
SPEAKER_00:So And I don't want to divert from where we are, but that thing has since you since that thing started, man. I mean, I I I see you guys put you know post on you know a lot on social media. So one of my questions that before we get into everything is how many counties does does the coastal NC FCA encompass and does that the the the counties that it encompasses does the football camp actually reach beyond your your thing? So two questions. Four counties.
SPEAKER_01:Four counties Onslow, Jones, Duplin, and Samson. And Samson. And then that lines up with actually the court district from what I understand. Okay, same same district. Yep.
SPEAKER_00:That's exactly right. Now talk a little bit, and this isn't we're going off script in the first in the first two minutes. Yeah, how about that? Talk a little bit about the football camp. Because I because I'm very interested in that, obviously.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah, I know you're a big football guy. And and uh so my first year with FCA in 2015, I was really discovered that part of our job during the summer is to serve and and lead in these camps. So FCA has a variety of camps. Back then, I think we might have had 15 or so. Now we have nearly 40 camps just in the Carolinas.
SPEAKER_00:You just had a just had a women, did you just have like a women's campaign? Yeah, a girls' multi-sport camp.
SPEAKER_01:I just came back from leadership camp. I mean, there's this there's this camps everywhere all summer long and and uh really all year long, but dominantly during the summer. So I went to football camp, and and that was where the Lord really gave me a vision of what could be when you get a hold of 50 or 60 young men's lives for the Lord, and those guys happen to start the school year on fire for their faith. You know as well as anybody that football is such a driver economically and fan base and everything in the school systems. And when those guys' lives are transformed for the Lord and they start to play the game differently, it just ripples throughout communities. Uh, and and as it started to happen, it then came about a couple years later when the director who had the camp uh had grown it from just one session, about five teams to now we were doing three sessions, about 30 teams, 30, 35 teams, and he was done being the director. And uh I went ahead and asked if I could take it forward. And now we have grown it to about 50 teams. We're just about maxed out for what we can do, and then and this camp serves all I say eastern North Carolina, so everything from Outer Banks to Raleigh to to Wilmington, but we sometimes pull teams in from western North Carolina, we have a team from Florida that comes up every summer because they they love it here.
SPEAKER_00:So from five teams in 2015 to 2001. Okay, 2001. So when but when you okay, so when you were exposed to it in 2015, how many how many teams? About 30 to 35, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So it started in eastern North Carolina with one camp, one session, five teams in 2004. I'm sorry. Okay, two thousand four. 21 years now we've been at it, now we're at 50 teams.
SPEAKER_00:You guys didn't do that.
SPEAKER_01:No, no, that's that's the Lord. Yeah, absolutely, man.
SPEAKER_00:He gets credit for the growth about it. That's amazing.
SPEAKER_01:But we we do, though, just to just to give credit where credit's due to here, uh, is the team that the Lord has called together. We got the right people in the right seats, and and that's what enables coaches to come back and see this as value added to their program to get the season started. We just have really funny people where they need to be. We have really organized people where they need to be, and just across the board, it's 55 staff I have to recruit to make each three-day session work. Wow. And and at least half of those are just volunteers. They're not they're not FCA staff that get paid to do this, they're giving up something to come be with us for a few days, if not 10 days. Great team.
SPEAKER_00:That's awesome. So you said you've been involved 10 years, but you you came out of the military and then and then and then got the calling. But tell me, you know, I interrupted you and I and I'll be remiss. Tell me about your family. Thank you for bringing us back to that. I've been in trouble with that. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. I understand.
SPEAKER_01:Yep, I did I did 21 years in the Marine Corps, and for 16 of that, I was married to my wife, Angie. We actually grew up together, and so I yanked her out of Michigan about six years into my career. Uh, we have two uh just incredible young women as daughters, and uh they're both at East Carolina University. So, yeah, the three of them are the absolute best of me. I love them to death, and better for uh them holding on to me.
SPEAKER_00:And Angie works as works apart with the FCA, right?
SPEAKER_01:She is my the the official term in the FCA system is admin assistant. Yeah, I saw that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I saw that on the butt. But yeah, she's probably I mean, like your boss, probably.
SPEAKER_01:She's a leader, and um, and being able to do ministry with her is probably one of the highlights in the season of life. We're empty nesters now, you know how that is. Absolutely, man. Being able to just go everywhere with her and do everything with her. She she's my best friend, so that makes it easier as well. But she is she's she's high capacity, she's super talented, and uh to be able to see ministry, our FCA ministry get better because of the contribution she makes is a lot of fun for me to have a front row seat to that.
SPEAKER_00:That that's awesome. So let's uh so let's pop into now the questions, really. Yeah, so describe your role with FCA and then describe what drew you into the leadership within the organization.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, you know, the the I have discovered this, especially this when I was in the talent advancement seat. Much of my responsibility was to help us as a region discover how to attract the right people. So recruiting and then onboard them well with clear expectations and training and things like that that had them ready to serve. But then also once you get them, it's it's it's training and developing them to retain them. And uh so, you know, coming out of the Marine Corps, I really saw this as a calling to do something really special. So, you know, I think you understand that being a Marine, you are part of something so much bigger than yourself. When somebody says, you know, what do you do? Well, I am a Marine, right? It was just this title, this lifestyle. And I struggled a lot with trying to figure out what I was going to do when I retired. That would I looked at all these different companies that had job expectations or job descriptions, rather, that I felt like, yeah, I can do those things. But it was just all about the do, not about the what and the why. And the why. When I stumbled into FCA and I saw this real clear opportunity, you know, the short version of the story is just that as the Lord revealed to me purpose, then that that's that's what would serve to drive me through all the pressures and challenges of leading in ministry. And so, in short, it's just to be a means in our community to bring everything together in Christ is the purpose behind everything we do in FCA. Uniquely, we have coaches and athletes and athletics in general as this vehicle to accomplish that. Because you know, I mean, let's just drop back to football for a second. On that team are a group of people coming together to achieve a common goal. That's the very definition of team. They're they're all different shapes, sizes, colors, economic backgrounds, church backgrounds. I mean, there's just so much diversity, but they come together for something bigger than themselves. Our community, and I don't mean our community as in Jacksonville, but just our world is really struggling with that. We we we just seem to thrive and being divided for all kinds of things, but the very mystery of God's will in Ephesians 1, 9, and 10 is that everything would be together in Christ. So we get to do that, and that that's how I see this ministry every single day that I get up. That's the purpose that keeps me in it and sustains me from the challenges sometimes. I just want to quit. Like it's too hard, you know, people are too difficult. I mean, just all the things that sometimes just make this thing really hard, the things that allow me to just push that stuff aside, put my hands back in the plow and not be distracted, it's it's the purpose.
SPEAKER_00:So you mentioned during that answer about training. The local leaders at FCA, the folks with the boots on the ground, they you guys have an immense task. I mean, working with our youth, training and leadership development. So talk so talk about that from you know, you you guys have national conferences. I I was looking on your website, don't know if you went, but you guys have international conferences, you know, that provides, you know, obviously great leadership. Not everybody can go. So you guys go to training, whoever goes. Talk to me about some some of the key takeaways that you bring back that you're able to to share with, you know, with staff, with you know, with the youth, with coaches, you know, with whomever.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. I I I'm pretty notoriously known as somebody who thinks outside the box quite a bit and and uh doesn't always just go with what's everybody else is doing. And I get I get criticism for that sometimes, but I I came from a background that most no nobody else had. You know, coming out of the Marine Corps for 21 years, I had a real deep, extensive background with training and styles of training and and how to you know just how to train all that stuff. And that's what really drew me to the talent advancement role, even though talent advancement is part of being a director anyway. I uh FCA does a great job of pouring into our hearts. They really do uh raise up our faith game, if you will. But what I saw as an opportunity was to really do a better job of the X's and O's stuff. How to how to how to train staff based on who they are, how they're wired. I mean, that that first has to start with understanding who your people are and how they're wired, right? You have to do some assessments and some research and and do some things that have you better understand who you got. But then also what I went through in this whole journey is better understanding our best staff and why they're the best. So that what I would do then is try to recruit, attract, if you will, those more of those kind of people. Now, if you look at my team, we all look very, very different. Young, old, men, women of different colors and different ages, different seasons of life. But as I as I assess these, these this teammate, these teammates I have, I'm finding that the things that we're common in are the essentials to being successful in FCA based on you know assessing those who are really good at this. So the training aspect for me then is just finding finding the holes, finding the weak spots, finding the things that maybe they're not so good at that I can level up to bring that alongside the things that they're just naturally really good at. And then that makes us a much better team to do what the Lord has called us to do. You know, I mean, it yeah, it's such a challenge, right? I mean, you hear you there's so much scripture that talks about you you just give the Lord what you got and then he'll multiply it and do more with it. And that can really lend people a lot of times to sometimes just be comfortable, rest in their laurels and not really strive to get better and grow. And, you know, it's that five talent, two talent thing in scripture where like I might be five talent, but my role is to give him back 10. So I do need to grow. I need to need to be able to do better than uh just simply what he gave me. But man, if you can give whatever that is, if you give that back to the Lord, yeah, what he's able to do and what he has done through this ministry through us, in spite of our weaknesses and struggles and and and challenges, like it's it's been it's a fun journey. We have this treasure in jars of clay, scripture says, you know, so we we do see that clearly that we don't deserve this, we're not worthy of it apart from him, we're we're not capable to do the things we've done.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. And I'm gonna come back to to what to what you just talked about about balancing the faith and the I mean, let's I mean it it's a whether you want to it's it's a business, but it's a business with a purpose, obviously, and balancing the faith aspect of that and then the organizational aspect of that. I'm gonna I'll come back to that. Yeah, yeah. Again, off script.
SPEAKER_01:And if I could too, I think what's really important to understand about training, what one of the things we focus on probably more than anything is our discipleship strategy. Like that's what a lot of people might not understand about FCA is we are really in this for no other reason than discipleship. It's making disciples who make disciples, it's it's engaging them with the good news of Christ. This is the training we do for our leaders, our volunteer leaders especially, but yes, our staff as well, that we know how to clearly and simply present the gospel, then equip that decision for Christ with the tools and resources and things to grow in your faith, all so that eventually we get everyone, these volunteers, these people we reach, coaches and athletes, we get them to a place where they're so empowered in their faith that they want to pass it on to someone else. They want to be leaders. And and that's that's really challenging in the way we do ministry in FCA because you know it everyone graduates at some point. Coaches rotate, they leave, they get new jobs, and then it's starting all over.
SPEAKER_00:It's starting all over.
SPEAKER_01:And that's really challenging to get to get this right person in the right seat only to see them graduate.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, because you're because you feel like you're building building momentum and and and like you work with a kid maybe when their freshman year, or maybe even in middle school or whatever, and and and you see, you know, you see this kid growing, or you see, you know, here I don't know how many volunteer military folks you have, but you but again, you see folks growing and you're building momentum, and the next thing you know, Johnny's graduating, and but there's another Johnny coming along.
SPEAKER_01:But that's what's really cool for our ministry to be global uh it's for two reasons. One, just in the most local sense, is that these kids, a lot of them do go to college. And so we have staff that serve colleges or have areas with the college in it that you know we we're trying to hand them off and and let them continue to grow as college leaders. But then because of where we live, the Marine Corps will send some of these leaders we have to other parts of the world. And so we actually one of the initiatives I've started with FCA trying to get that get this thing built, you know, in strategy and concepts and whatever is is how do we lead our volunteer leaders on a DOD base? So let's just say Okinawa, Japan, because they're in a foreign country, but they're on essentially American soil because of the DOD, right? So where FCA is global and we have Japanese citizens who are FCA staff, or they might be there's different terms for it based on just funding and a whole litany of things with foreign countries and how that all works, but you know, they might be our teammates over there doing ministry, but that doesn't mean they have base access to come on base and minister to American kids. So when we had a leadership family, really, I mean their parents, his parents were all in, the kid was all in, they got stationed in Okinawa. We helped get the first FCA huddle started, Okonus, you know, outside the continental United States in Okinawa, Japan, at Kubisaki High School. And that falls under my leadership here because FCA didn't have a model for it yet. So we just kind of said, well, like who better to steward these these leaders in that other country than the ones who trained them and grew them up over the last four, five, six years. Um, so that that's really cool what we get to do here that most areas in the country don't is we send our leaders to other countries too.
SPEAKER_00:That's awesome. So again, off script.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:I didn't realize this. I did, I did, but I didn't. Talk to me about the book. Yeah. Game changer, an autobiography of answering the call, inspiration, and then someone reading it. What's what's one takeaway? I know there's there's a lot in there, I'm sure, but one takeaway you'd like somebody to come away with after reading the book.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I I think one, a very clear understanding of calling. So that's kind of the core of the book is what is calling, and then I walk people through the journey of mine. I I I have discovered out of the talent advancement roles that the number one reason that some of our best veteran staff have stayed in FCA as long as they have is because of calling. And calling is one of those things that's so complex and so difficult to understand. Like if you uh sit down in an interview and you ask somebody, hey, are are you called to FCA and they and they say yes, it's not just okay, and then you move on. It's really difficult to try to ask the right questions and unpack a person's heart so that we discover together, like, yeah, this is indeed a calling on your life for this. So that's the first thing. And then the second thing really is just to walk through these stories of adversity that I had to go through that probably would have made most people quit. But if it weren't for calling, if it weren't for clarity of purpose, then I would probably wouldn't have made it. And so what I know to be true about all my teammates and not just my FCA teammates, but really just people in leadership roles in every every sector, the challenge is there, hard is coming, and how you process through that is is really important to whether or not you can stay where God called you to be. And uh so that's what that book is all about. It's just walking somebody through people through my journey. There's some raw stories in there that most people don't know.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Uh so you know, 10 years in this now, it's it's sort of a look back. That's what our banquet's gonna do this year, too. It's 10 years for the next 10 years. It's kind of casting a it's telling stories of the last 10, but then casting a vision for the next 10 as we have grown and continue to grow. We we want to kind of share with everybody what we see coming. Uh so that's it. You know, I never really saw myself as an author. I certainly use the the the word book loosely. It's but I think people will really enjoy getting a true behind the curtain look at what this last 10 years has been like for me personally, and and and hopefully uh I really do believe they'll walk away encouraged. Can you get it on Amazon? Not nothing yet. No, so I've got a link on my social media for order it. So the re what I'm doing through just a Google Doc is acquiring everybody's requests. So some companies say, I want I want 20 for my whole whole business, then there's a lot of individuals ordering. So once I get all those pre-orders here on August 1st, I'll get with the publisher and we'll do the first ball.
SPEAKER_00:So okay, okay. So it's coming out. Okay, okay, good. And we'll put and I'll get that info from you and we'll put it in in the show notes along with along with some other stuff. Your local board leadership, the your advisory group. Obviously involved in a lot of things, praying, serving, giving, and and and just and helping with fundraising, and then of course, you know, of course, discipleship. Balancing those responsibilities with the board as well as strength as as well as strengthening the staff and expanding the ministry. Talk a little bit about that's tough, and that's kind of getting in into the faith, but also you gotta keep the lights on. You gotta be able to do this and that. Talk about that a little bit, man.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, the board for me is is has been maybe the hardest thing of the last 10 years. I've been on every end of the spectrum. One end I've had a board that actually was trying to fire me and get rid of me. That's in the book, you know, the stories about just what that was like, and then and then on the other end, I've had a board that elevated me and lifted me up and and and and uh grew me and challenged me and just asked all the right questions and really helped grow this ministry. So I've been on both ends of it throughout the last 10 years, and without question, one of the things that makes it the hardest thing to do, I think, and this is shared by all my fellow directors, our fellow leaders, is we talk about this board lane. So it's one of five lanes that we focus on as a director. Board advancement is one of them. It's one of the hardest things uh for us to do to try to find one, the right people who line up well with the expectations we set for them. And then in that sense, it's well, what expectations do I need to set for them? And it really depends on who you are as the director. Who do I need around me to do what based on who I am and based on where we are as a ministry. So there's those things. But then lastly, what makes it so difficult is uh faithfulness. And this is something I'll come back to in another question I think you're gonna ask. And it's just how do I get these people to stay faithful to the thing they said they would do? And when you're dealing with volunteers, whether they're board members or huddle coaches or whoever they are, there's a lot of people that are kind of energetic up front to say, yeah, I want to do this, but then for a variety of reasons, they just kind of fade away. And so my full-time job is trying to keep going, trying, trying to uh keep myself enthusiastic and passionate so that I can pass that on to the people that I lead.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Because they're volunteers. And so what are what are those reasonable expectations? It doesn't demand too much because they're business leaders, they they're probably serving and leading and volunteering in their church, they got their own families, they got their own hobbies, and now I'm asking them to carve out this little bit of time for FCA, trying to find those people that are really sold out for this, they're gonna show up faithfully and and really roll their sleeves up and help us advance this ministry is really challenging.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's I mean, that's tough. I mean, even before COVID, volunteerism over the last 10, 15 years has seen a steady decline. It's simply because everybody is so busy and they look inward first, which they should, and they try to fill, you know, the buckets of you know between work and family and faith and and everything else, and then whatever they have left, then they're gonna give, you know, to the things that matter. You made a great point, man. You know, when someone decides they're gonna be a board member for this or a board member for that, they're on fire, you know, first meeting, next meeting, next meeting, something something comes up, and just gradually, no, like you said, no fault of anybody, man. It's just life, right?
SPEAKER_01:There's there's two things to that. I love what you you said about everybody being busy. I I've had people that are struggling with the walk with the Lord that I'll be sitting down discipling, and and the over and over and over again they say, like, you know, I'm just I'm trying to make time for the Lord. And I was like, well, that's that's the first problem we're all making. We're trying to, we're trying to make time for him, like this carved out block of time that I just put in this box over here. And that's not how it's supposed to work. You know, it's supposed he's supposed to, you know, there's no other gods before him. There's nothing else more important to him. He is part of everything that we do. And if you get that first part right, then the other problem I think we have is 10% of the people doing 90% of the things. So Roger and I talk about this a lot. You know, whether you're a board member, whether you're a donor, it's the same small group of people doing everything. And that gets burdensome for people. And and and I was just talking to a guy this morning who's a trainer at the gym I go to, and he was just talking about just trying to work on himself and wanting to just serve other people. And and and as he was kind of unpacking that, I said, you know, that that's the thing about what we do as a man of faith is narrow is the road that leads to life, and few people find it. And so what I've discovered about myself, I hope this would inspire somebody else, but it, you know, the things that are right, the things that we should be doing are not popular in a lot of ways. Most people aren't doing those things. And so we can't look to gravitate to the crowds. You know, David taking down the giant had to step in front of a whole army that stood in their in place for 40 days doing nothing, just shaking at the in the face of the opposition. It took one person, and and over and over and over throughout scripture, that's the story of God calling one to get out in front of the many and set the standard and inspire many. And that is difficult if you don't take care of yourself, you know, because the task of inspiring other people is is draining.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, absolutely. You mentioned huddle groups and student leadership development. So tell the listeners exactly what huddle groups are, and then tell us what practices help student-led teams flourish and how do you support them?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, so that is the thing that drives everything for us. It's the huddle. So in the church world, it might be a Sunday school small group, life group, whatever that small group of people is. But it's not so small on FCA sometimes. We have some schools that will have 150 to 200 kids every single week faithfully showing up in the gym or library or cafeteria, you know, to be a part of this, and it's all inspiring. So we have huddles. That that's that's the place where coaches and athletes grow in their walk with Christ. Some schools, though, you know, they they struggle, and it's it's it's a teacher in a classroom with five kids. And those are the things that are really challenging to try to figure out what is holding them back from getting to that place. But what we what we try to do in training up the leaders, what we're trying to inspire them to is first, every school has to have an adult, a school employee in most cases, that is sold out for this in a way that they are going to faithfully make this time and space available for the kids. As much as we don't necessarily need that, meaning like legally or anything like that, like kids can form a club and meet wherever they want as long as a school employee supervises it. What kids are telling us over and over and over again, you know, I think of a situation like at Richlands right now, who, you know, this happens every single year where we have the right man or woman in the right seat at the right school, and you know, Coach Bird leaves Richlands. He was our FCA guy there for the multi-sport environment. Again, 150, 200 kids every Friday morning showing up faithfully. And and as we trained up those student leaders this summer, uh, just a couple weeks ago at leadership camp, you could see the emotion in their face wondering who's gonna step up for us now.
SPEAKER_00:When we go back to school, what's the deal? Who's gonna be there for us?
SPEAKER_01:And there are some other people there, but you know, without a doubt, Coach Bird was the leader of that. And and that was his calling. I remember the journey five years ago or so when he shared that with me, and we were walking that out about what that looks like to step up for these kids. So that's number one, we have to have an adult that recognizes how important this is. And then secondly, we want to make sure that everyone, adult and students, don't look at the huddle as just a box to check, like again, it's a Sunday experience. You just go get it done and then you move on with the rest of your life, but that they really see this as the environment where as individuals are transformed, it sends them out into the hallways and onto the fields and courts different, and then those environments start to change. So we always like to ask them to really consider how they can use the word, the living word, to actually affect change in their schools, not sit back and complain about it, not avoid it, but step right into it with the good news of the Lord and set people free, right? That's that's what FC does is you know, you get a lot of these people that complain and say, man, if we just let God back in schools, we'd be okay. And it's like, well, the God I serve is not bound by brick and mortar, and it's it's him and us as we walk wherever we go, that's what starts to shine the light where we are. And so that that's what the huddle is. It's it's Christ in them and working through them where they are at school. And so the multi-sport huddle is one environment, but the more powerful one that we really see is the teams. So it's it's a coach that lets that team, either before practice or after practice, get into the word and how we we uh train our leaders up for this is say, hey coach, like what is one thing about our team this week just driving you nuts? Like, like literally, I mean, tell us tell us this one thing that like above everything else is this one thing that we could get better at. And it's it's nine times out of ten, little to do with the first step running a route or how you block or tackle or throw a ball or whatever. It's it's usually something to do with uh character, resiliency, just losing control of their emotions, whatever. And so then the kids have this ability to say, awesome, hey coach, thank you for that. If you don't mind, we're gonna do a huddle this week on that. And so they get into the word and they'll go to Paul or Peter or Christ or whoever and and say, This is what the Lord teaches, this is what scripture teaches on this thing. And then they get a chance to come together and say, That's the standard, that's what we are all gonna go for. And as the coach starts to see the team change through these character changes, well, then the blocking and tackling gets better because they're a different athlete. That's what we do.
SPEAKER_00:That leads into the question. So, what what approach, you know, what what have you found an effective way? I mean, because it's it's awesome to get students to step up, man. I mean, it I mean it is awesome. And or volunteer coaches, but what what techniques, what approaches have you found to be most effective in helping these folks develop their leadership potential?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, we we uh so our our strategy Because that's tough.
SPEAKER_00:I mean, that's tough for a kid. I mean, I'm just gonna tell you, man, a 15, 16-year-old you go to these these huddle groups, and sometimes you may be going to check the box. Your girlfriend may be going to to say you go. But you know, you're 15, 16 years old, you're in school, you're with your peers, and I mean just like going to a youth group, you know, at church, it takes it takes courage, man, to step out and do that. So you you know, talk to me about what you guys do to do that. Because that's powerful. That means I mean that's powerful.
SPEAKER_01:That's a great question. And we just just had kids asking us this at leadership campus. We brought our whole area together in the side breakout session, and and some of them were asking, like, you know, how can I get my classmates inspired to show up? Because so many of them are coming for the wrong reasons. They're coming because their girlfriend's there, or they're coming for free food and this and that. And the short version is like, I have inspirational stories that we share with our student leaders of like, let me tell you about a person who came to FCA for the wrong reasons and then found Christ and then was transformed and what he or she became. So whatever gets them in the room, we're fine with it. Don't you know we're not? You don't care why why they're there. We're not purposely necessarily just trying to bait them with things that are secular, but if we do offer free food or it or it is a study hall hour that gets them out of class, or or there is a girl or boy that they're interested in, whatever gets them there, so be it.
SPEAKER_00:Just put just just get them there.
SPEAKER_01:The Lord can work all things for the good of those he's called, right? So once we get them in the room, again, this goes back to what we I spoke to earlier about my full-time job is inspiring other people to stay faithful to what the Lord has called them to do. And oftentimes what he's called them to do is not always what they said they would do. It's it's it's a calling that they're feeling and there's some resistance there. Other times kids are really confident and they step up and they're just looking for a place like FCA that allows them to do what they know they're being called to do out of the church. So, what we do in our E3, this is engage, equip, and power. E3 is our little short phrase we use to caps on what our discipleship strategy is. So, what we in the strategy, it's not a program that we plug somebody in like week one, we're doing this, week two, we're doing that per se, but it's about equipping the leader with the right mindset to have as you disciple somebody else in a walk with the Lord. So, number one, there's like four things per E that are attached to it that guide how we behave. I'll just give you one each, like one example with engage. You know, when we're talking about engaging somebody with the good news of Christ, what we want our leaders to do is engage God first. We want them to be in the habit of talking to him before anybody else. So it really, the Lord knows the audience, he knows their hearts, he knows, he knows what's going on, he knows why they're really there, he knows all that stuff. And man, over and over and over again, what I have experienced as one doing this, just like I'm coaching kids and coaches to do it, is that I'll show up having seeked God first, talk to him first about what that team needs to hear. And I just got to go in by faith that this message the Lord has given me is what he needs them to hear. And I'll get done with those devotionals over and over and over and over again. It'll be a kid or a coach that'll come up and be like, You don't know how bad I needed to hear that. So that's the first principle. Then when you get into equip and we're talking about adding on to that decision for Christ, what we do is equip them with prayer. Equip them with how to read scripture, equip them with how to surround themselves with like people, right? You can't keep hanging out with the same bad influences when you when the Lord is calling you to walk a narrow road now. So we we equip them with those sort of spiritual disciplines, biblical community, a clear plan of where they're going. And then again, also that the empower piece, the last phase of it is what we want to do is empower their leadership first by modeling. So, you know, if it was you and I, Steve, I I would lead the devotionally, but you'd be there with me. You'd see how I do it. I would model for you a way to do it. And then I'm gonna empower your leadership by assisting. So now you're gonna lead, but I'm gonna help you.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Right. And then eventually you get to empower by watching where you're gonna lead it. I'm just gonna stand over here and just just pray for you and I'm gonna encourage you afterwards. And and then eventually we empower by launching, like, you got it. I'm going over to this school so you can lead this one here.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, and when and when a kid sees another kid do something, and that and that kid doing that encourages the other kid, yeah. It not that it's easier, but he they see, hey, he stepped out and did it.
SPEAKER_01:Well, you talked earlier about courage. If I could interrupt you, yeah, I know who knows. This is this is a strategy I kind of stumbled into that uh Sue and I figured this out to where this is what works. And when you talk courage and getting up in front of your peers, if I stand in front of a team and present the FCA huddle and they're all unanimously in agreement that we want this, and then I say, okay, who wants to lead it? Crickets. You might get a kid raise their hand, but most of the time nobody wants to step out as a 16, 17-year-old raise their hand out of fear of what the others might think. So what we just stumbled into, I don't even remember how, but how we do this now is once the team says, Yeah, yeah, we we we want this, sounds great. I I can see the fruit that can be born from this, then we say, Okay, who do you all want to lead this? They know who the Christian kids are on the team, and without question, you'll get these groups of kids that start four, five, six of them in these different groups are pointing to this one kid. So then we look at that kid and be like, your teammates just affirmed you. They they they think you can do it, and we're gonna make sure you can.
SPEAKER_00:And what better affirmation or what better way to confirm to be courageous than by your peers who are very who can be very judgmental, good, good or bad, yeah, saying, hey, you're the dude or you're the girl to lead this. That's all man, that's all that's a and some like you said, sometimes the the best ideas, you say you you know you think out of the box, but sometimes the best ideas, man, just they just happen. I mean, they just happen. That's man, that yeah, that's awesome. So let's talk about accountability. And this goes back to I told you I was gonna mention this. How do you measure success and accountability in ministry leadership? And then balancing that spiritual growth with the organizational health. That's the piece that's key because you you you you have a mission, obviously have a very vital mission, but in the end you've got a 5013 C organization that you've got to run. Yeah, yeah. So talk about that and and and talk about how you measure success.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, it's really good. We we talk a lot about how well first I'll I'll touch on the accountability piece. Like I think that this is something that is sadly avoided too often in the church world. And it happens a lot in FCA too, where we just like, oh, just do what the Lord has called you to do, and you know, and and we lack a little bit of that leadership. Like, I am the director, and there are some things that the Lord is speaking into my heart that he wants us to do as a team, and that doesn't always get shared with the whole team unless I share it. And so there is a a degree of of that. And so what I have found to be effective actually is something Sue on our team did one day. Uh, she said something about that she felt like we were each other's sandpaper, that we together as teammates smooth out those rough edges in each other. And when she said that, it was so great because now one of them, one of my teammates, uh gave me permission for what I would then use as an entry into uh moments of accountability. So what I did is walked into a meeting one time where I felt like my team was sliding in the wrong direction. They were drifting a little bit. And so I walked in and I had actually went to Lowe's and got some 10 grit sandpaper, a little pack of it. And I walked in and I just kind of stood up at the end of the table and I handed each person a little square of sandpaper. And I was just kind of smiling as I did it. And I said, you know, Sue reminded us, you know, that we are each other's sandpaper, so we need to have a sandpaper moment here for a minute. And then I, you know, called them out on something they were doing that that wasn't okay, it wasn't in line with the standard that we operate with and asked them to fix that. And the meeting went great. You know, that that is a technique I learned. Thank thankfully, the Lord used Sue to do that for me. Because as a Marine, you know, if that was a room full of Marines, I'd stand up and it would just be a quick conversation.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that's an easy one.
SPEAKER_01:I wouldn't belittle them, I wouldn't beat them, it would be none of those things, but it would just be a quick, firm, hey, this ain't what we do, fix it today. Good, good, and we'd move on. Like it'd be so quick. Ministry is a little bit different, you're dealing with different people. And so I really love that technique that I have now with my team over all these years that when we got to have an uncomfortable conversation, I just throw a piece of sandpaper on the table and everybody understands where we're going to do that.
SPEAKER_00:Everybody knows, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So then on the success aspect and ministry, especially, a lot of things we do don't always show up on a stat sheet. And so what we really focus on is, and again, the thing that drives everything is the huddle. Are we starting huddles? Are we discipling people in those huddles? Are we growing those things? Is that where our focus of effort is? If anything else comes up, I'm always asking the question, well, what's the cost? And I and I don't always really just mean money, but what's the cost to my team's focus on that one thing that is most important for us? And so we we filter it through that, but then you know, statistically speaking, if if we're focused on the right stuff, as people are transformed, and by focusing on the right thing, I mean loving people. Yeah, genuinely loving coaches and athletes. Like accountability is not judgment, it's it's helping them see what the Lord who the Lord has called them to be. It's it's it's calling those things out and drawing people, inspiring people, modeling that for them. There's a technique to that that matters. And if we do that well, as people start to change, they play the game differently. And as that ripples out into the community, well, then it's a lot easier to get the statistics where more people want to be board members, more people want to give financially, more people want to come on staff. I mean, I had it was two of us when I got started, now we're looking at nine.
SPEAKER_00:People want to be associated with success.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, so so we're not we're not chasing the stats. The stats will take care of themselves if we chase the right things. It's the input versus the output focus.
SPEAKER_00:And I would say a s success standpoint as well for you guys, and I'm sure you thought about this. I mean, because you see it every day. Well, you see it, I don't know if you see it every day, you may see it at camp or whatever. Your success may not be today or be tomorrow. You may have a kid that went through FCA ten years ago, and he may be becoming a youth minister. Or down, you know, down line. I mean, you you could see what was going on with him, but the true fruits of your labor and the FCA's labor may not be seen for a while down down the road.
SPEAKER_01:As a ministry, we are one of our four core values is integrity, right? And so I'll give you a great example of of chasing the right things, reporting the right things, focus on the right things. When I when I took a team from our area, it was actually Swansboro. There's no reason to hide that detail, but Swansboro went to football camp for the first time in like 2017, 18, something like that. And an invitation was given to the Lord one night at camp, and a bunch of guys went forward and made decisions for Christ to receive him as Savior and powerful moment. We reported that back to the community like we always do. Like, hey, you know, praise God, 10 kids from Swansboro, whatever the number was, found salvation tonight. And well, then the next year the team goes back. An invitation was given to receive Christ as Savior, and some of the same guys went forward. Now, this is pre-discipleship focus in our ministry. This was really at the time we were a ministry that was known for, uh, you might remember from having known me this long, is that I was just all over the place doing devotionals for a living. And that's what we used to be as a ministry is just go and present the good news of Christ. So we'd go and do devotionals, go and do devotionals, but then I'd walk away. What happened after that? We just weren't there yet as a ministry. And so it really hit me in that moment that I could keep reporting these stats about how many kids received the Lord and all these things and try to wow my community with investing us because look at all these numbers. But the numbers had some context to it that I wasn't particularly uh proud of. And so we went to work to fix that and start really focusing on discipleship so that coaches and athletes would be firm in their faith, they would understand what it meant when they made that decision. And then the next year when they would be given an invitation, this was so cool. The third year they go back to camp and the invitation was given, and I saw guys that had made the decision the year before staying in their seats, putting their arms around each other, praying for their brothers that just went forward to make a decision. That's when I knew we're starting to focus on the right things. And now, you know, those are the stories you can tell, which I love to tell stories. We weren't we we shifted from really reporting stats to telling stories.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So if you're at one of our banquets, we're not putting slides up to talk about just how many huddles and how much money and all these things are just numbers to try to wow people with data. Because it doesn't wow people, it's pretty boring, quite frankly. But we tell the stories behind some of these numbers, and uh those are the things that inspire behavior. And but again, that's my full-time job. Sometimes it's it's tiring to keep that enthusiasm leading the way.
SPEAKER_00:Got four questions left, and we got to and we can move. But anyway, real quick, yeah. One leadership challenge you face regularly, and how do you tackle it?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it it's it's a simple.
SPEAKER_00:Is it fundraising?
SPEAKER_01:Well, it it is, you know.
SPEAKER_00:I mean Well, I'll I mean I'm you answered a question. I don't want to bring yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I mean, fundraising is for sure the hardest thing we do. Yeah, you know, I'm right now I I lack about a thousand dollars a month to be fully funded to do what I do, and that that happens to each of us. It ebbs and flows throughout our time at FCA. And and but nobody will really know that stuff because I'm not gonna come out and say, Woe is me, will you support me? Because that's not the inspiration inspired giving I want. I want you to be inspired because of what we do, not the you know, and there's scripture behind that, so I won't preach in the moment, but ultimately though, that that that's a specific example, but overarchingly, what in whatever ministry advancement lane we're talking about, whether it's ministry or boards or donors or talent, it's it's faithfulness in other people. It's me trying to inspire them to do what they said they would do or do what the Lord called them to do. That's the hardest thing I do.
SPEAKER_00:I I phrased it and I didn't want to, and that was one of the others I had examples I had, helping maintain, helping create maintain focus or maintaining that spiritual momentum that exists. Yeah. Reflecting on your journey, FCA journey. One lesson, just one. I know you got a bunch. Yeah. One lesson that you've learned that you want others to hear.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I I think it's reasonable expectations up front that we we have to understand the new car smell will wear off.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. That's yeah, that's whatever you do, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:It's gonna be the it's gonna be the most exciting and fun early on, but that will wear off. And then you what's gonna keep you in it is is a purpose that's greater than the pressures to quit.
SPEAKER_00:Vision in the future. I know you've got a vision looking ahead. What you hope with the Lord's blessing and the Lord's hand on it, Coastal NCFCA is here in five years, ten years, or whatever.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it it's just being involved in every coach and athlete's life in this area. And it takes a bigger team to do that. But wherever there's a coach or an athlete, whether you are an outdoorsman, a martial artist, a basketball player, a little kid in a rec league, wherever you are, my hope is that the Lord would raise up faithful people in every single one of those environments that would reach out to us and say, Will you help us have an environment for Christ here? Because I I don't know every one of those environments, and neither does my team. It's gonna take people that feel this calling on their life that I hope would know FCA to be the organization that loves them to a degree that we're gonna come to you where you are. We're gonna give you everything you need to grow in your walk with Christ and grow others as well. And and that's the vision. Everything in our area together in Christ. And and we're on our way there. I mean, there's I'll get Chris Miller from the Daily News will tend me, send me pictures every once in a while when he's at a random baseball game. And before the game, both teams are praying together around the the mound because they found out you know, the home team found out the away team just had a kid whose you know dad died in a car accident or something. You know, and so they they pray together. Yeah, like that's the sports culture that I'm really trying to drive for our community. That you know, this is a not only a developmental place in sports, as we all know it is, but like this is the platform where we show the world what it looks like to come together in Christ. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:So I wanted to get through those because again, the curveball. You mentioned the banquet. This is a two-parter, and I want to give you as much time to talk about this as possible. I grew up with him and he's a great guy. I want you to talk about the banquet. It it's it it's moved around. Is it this is it gonna be is it this fall or when is the banquet? It'll be in November again. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:So he only moved it once just because of bringing in an NBA player and get him before the season.
SPEAKER_00:So I want you to talk about the banquet, but I want you to talk about in detail as you can, but you can't take 35 minutes to do it, about your relationship with I know who's who's a very important man to you, Roger Carroll.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah, thanks, man. Where do I begin with that? This is actually in my book because I thought it was so important to share with other people just what the Lord can do. Number one is one of our financial goals in FCA is to have is to attract what we call Tom Landry associates. And so that's a name that we put to distinctively recognize donors who will give$10,000 or more in a single calendar year. So these are major donors, we call them, not somebody that's just doing$25 a month, but these are people who have greater capacity who really, you know, if you look at Tom Landry, he was a game changer. He was the kind of guy that would bring in impact players and was one of the most successful coaches of all time. So as a ministry, I'm looking for impact players, people that can enable us to do what we otherwise could not do without them. All that to be said, I met Roger at a Jacksonville football game when Southwest was there. You know, everybody would understand Roger's background growing up at Southwest. So Southwest was at Jacksonville. This might have been 2016. And somebody introduced me to him. I don't know if it's one of my board members or who it was, but he was on the sideline by the fence, and I met him, and he didn't seem really interested in me at all.
SPEAKER_00:You know, so that's a Roger, man.
SPEAKER_01:And I think if you know him, like maybe he was busy, maybe he was focused on something else. Maybe it's because he got up at two in the morning like usual and he's just tired by that time of day. But that year he gave Southwest Oslo a thousand dollar check, I think, or something like that, to uh fund them to have their warm-up uniforms to come to football camp. So the team comes to football camp, a bunch of guys made a decision for the Lord. We kind of reported that stuff back, and he started to see a difference in that football team as he would observe. Uh the next year he gave some money to help scholarship like uh, I don't know, we'll say five, six, ten guys to come to camp. I think it was like it was ten, if I remember right. Some of those ten found Christ for the first time in their life. And so what I had those guys do is write a thank you card to him, a little postcard, explaining their experience at camp and thanking him for ensuring they could be there. I remember today that he spread those out on his desk, took a picture of it, and threw it on Facebook, you know, to kind of tell everybody what that meant to him. Then the next year, you know, he gave greater for the football team again. And then that fall is when we had the chance to bring Tony Dungey in to our banquet. And he reached out to me and he said, Hey, can I be the title sponsor of your of your Tony Dungey event? I think is what he called it. And I said, Man, I and at this point I kind of knew Roger now a little bit, but I said, Man, we've never had a title sponsor at a bank before. I never even gave it a gave it a thought. And so we did we talked that out and he he made an investment, a commitment to help us uh cover all the overhead that it would take to get him here and put up billboards and just all these different things to draw everyone to that event. And from that point forward, he has been the title sponsor of our event. But the unique part of the story is he asked me, he said, Do you know how many like fundraising banquets I get invited to throughout the year? And of course I didn't, and but he educated me on something is that, and this goes back to what we said earlier about like 10% of the people doing 90% of the work. It's at least one every single week of the year. Somebody's asking him for money. Yeah. Absolutely. Now I will tell you that if you know Roger, he's one of the absolutely most generous men I've ever met in my life. He get his logo, his business logo is on anything and everything around here that is nonprofits, you know, school kids, like that. His focus is to really provide for others. And so he tries to make sure his company understands that and that people that do business with his company understand that it's like when you do business with us, there's a large percentage of what you're paying for actually goes to sew back into our community. So as he talked to me about that, it caused me to start doing some praying and thinking. And I went back to my team and I was like, I don't know as if I really want to call this a quote unquote FCA fundraising banquet anymore, but rather that this event would be this night of the year that you you mentioned earlier about you know vision and you know, mission drift and staying connected to who you are. Like, we are a means in this community to bring everything together in Christ. That's the core purpose of what we do through the influence of coaches and athletes because we're in athletic ministry. But so what I wanted to do was change this banquet from a quote-unquote fundraising banquet, even though it is a fundraising banquet, but what we would call it is a game changer's banquet. So a game changer is someone who affects a significant shift in the current manner of doing things. And what we were able to start doing because of Roger just elevated that idea of game changer, that this event would be that one night a year to bring everybody together from our community, regardless of where you go to church. And I would work overtime throughout the year to try to find a way to inspire you so that when you walk out of that place, one, you are on Team FCA, you understand what you were a part of, not that you just gave to something and walked away, but you are a part of this, and this is what we, all of us together are in this for because it's going to take us all to reach them all. And and that changed everything. That we called it the Game Changers Banquet going forward, and and Roger's been our title sponsor ever since. We brought in a variety of hosts and really special people to bless our community with that otherwise you probably would not be able to have access to. And and I'll tell you, it's worth saying what the Lord has done in a way to attract those people here, because I don't have those connections. None of these people I know. I don't know Tony Dungey personally, I don't know Tim Tebow personally. The way in which the Lord created connections for me to have to pitch and ask, and the way the Lord allowed me to give him what I got. This is how I do an ask. This is the best I got, Lord. You take it. And what he did with that in the hearts of these men and women who have come to speak with us, and what I'm trying to get to here is say that like it didn't cost us anywhere near what people might think it would cost us to bring these people here. Yeah. The Lord has been faithful. And and you know, and I get a lot of that criticism. I can't believe FC had spent that much money. It's like you don't have any idea what I spend on it. So don't make assumptions. Yeah, don't, yeah, don't yeah, don't assume. You know, that's this is part of the challenge I have sitting in the seat as a director, but yeah, the Lord has been good. He's used Roger to help us do what we otherwise couldn't do without him. I I love that man. So thankful for him and and and uh and Shelby as well. Uh that that team over there is uh got a special piece in my heart about it.
SPEAKER_00:So so so tell everybody about this year's banquet, the date, the time, location, details, as many details, and if they you know want to sponsor tickets or do whatever.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, gosh, forgive me about the date. It's gonna be first sometime in November. Pretty sure it's first Monday November. Yeah, you caught it caught me. That was a curveball step. Yeah, that was a curveball. But we will be back in November. First or second Monday of November is is always our date. Uh this year, what's unique because of Roger, it'll be free to the community.
SPEAKER_00:Oh, wow.
SPEAKER_01:And I uh it's worth me sharing just real quick that I felt like what we had done through bringing all these big names in is we had started to create ticket prices and things like that that made the giving that we were getting at the banquet more transactional than I wanted it to be. And I wanted to get us back to being relational in the in the in the way that we receive support from the community. And uh so this year it's free. Doesn't matter who you are, you you're welcome to come join us and and hear about the last 10 years and cast a vision and allow us to cast a vision for you about what the next 10 years look like. Beyond that, we don't have those details exactly what the meeting is gonna look like, but it'll be free. It's gonna be empowering.
SPEAKER_00:And they'll be able to find it on your website, all over social media and website.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, the date's out there. I just didn't sadly don't have a message.
SPEAKER_00:What's your website? What's the URL?
SPEAKER_01:ncfca.org.
SPEAKER_00:And then follow you on follow you on social media. Yes, sir. Well, man, this has been great. I mean, this is this has been amazing, you know, powerful message. Ken, you know, what you're doing in the community with the youth, what your volunteers are doing, what your staff is doing.
unknown:Okay.
SPEAKER_00:You can tell when you talk, man, it comes from the heart. And you know, purpose-driven organization with a clear mission, clear mission, faith, and just everything that you're doing. It's clear that leading, that leading with a purpose means never leading alone too. Always in step with God's calling and in and in the community, you know, with others and and and with great not only your staff and and volunteers and obviously the you know the youth, but then when you have folks like Roger and other organizations, obviously I appreciate you coming on, man.
SPEAKER_01:Thanks for having us.
SPEAKER_00:Thank you so much. And listen, thanks listeners for joining us this episode for consulting on the couch. Be sure to follow us at BLC Consulting LLC.com and leave a quick review or share it with someone and because it's all about stories. And we'll again we'll go back, we'll get the details about the banquet, get get details about FCA on the show notes. You may have her have listened to this and you may feel the calling to you know to pick up the phone, to drop an email to Ken and his folks, or hopefully I'm gonna have folks listening to this saying all over the country. Maybe in in your community, you know, FCA may not be rocking and rolling as as well as it is here in Oslo County. Yeah. And you can do a quick search, you know, for your local FCA. But whatever it is, you know, it if you feel something, if you feel a little tug, then you probably need to pick up the phone or you probably need to send an email. So with that said, until next time, I'm Steve Goodson. Talk soon.