How An Indie Podcaster Builds A Brand Without Big Budgets

We break down how visibility, structure, and storytelling reshape the independent podcast game — through the lens of a full Thorn City rebrand, a new ecosystem, and a creator-first mindset. From a decade of gig-economy grind to building an agency and a marketplace, this episode lays out the blueprint for indie longevity.

Episode Topics

• audio-first vs video-for-reach
 • Thorn City Syndicate rebrand + ecosystem
 • Thorn City Spotlight Show focus + tagline
 • indie podcast failure rates + what causes them
 • cadence, publishing systems, and benchmarks
 • PodMatch for guesting, sourcing, & agency services
 • five levers of differentiation for indie hosts
 • micro-audiences vs vanity metrics
 • repurposing into clips, reels, blogs, emails
 • collaborations, guest swaps, and strategic partnerships
 • vendor marketplace, studio pipeline, and visibility services
 • the “Be Seen. Be Heard. Be Remembered.” framework

Use my link: joinpodmatch.com/ThornCity — tap in and let’s work.
Make sure you subscribe to Thorn City Spotlight on YouTube.

Welcome 2 Thorn City — Be Seen. Be Heard. Be Remembered.
Powered by Thorn City Syndicate Management, this ad introduces the ecosystem built for creators, entrepreneurs, and solo hustlers ready to turn visibility into value. Tap in and learn how to join the movement.

🎙️ Podcast Host System™

Not a course. Not just production.

A repeatable system for independent podcast hosts who want consistency, visibility, and momentum—without burnout.

Build your podcast with intention, not guesswork.

DIY • DWY • DFY

🔗 https://www.thorncitysyndicate.com

Transcript

Why Rebrand Now

Audio First Podcasting Philosophy

Independent Podcaster Industry Stats

Consistency Over Hype

PodMatch As Growth Engine

Download Benchmarks That Matter

Building A Booking Agency

Five Ways To Stand Out

SPEAKER_00 0:00

I'm a high school basketball official. About 2002 is when I started refereeing basketball. I had just moved back from Atlanta. I moved back, I was staying with my dad. Shout out to my pops. I didn't have a job at the time. My dad, my little brother, and my uncle. They was all refereeing basketball for CYO, the Catholic youth organization out here. So since I didn't have a job for Christmas, my present was a referee shirt and a whistle. And he said, get on out here. We're doing this. You could do it. And so I started out refereeing for fun and to make some money. A couple years went by and I figured I was good at it. And so I had a couple people tell me, man, you should go do PBOA basketball. PBOA is the Portland Basketball Officials Association. It's part of OSAA, with the high school basketball sanction out here. And so PBOA is who assigns all the high school basketball games in the Portland, Oregon. It's the Portland Basketball Association. So I started doing that in 2008, I believe, was my first season at the PBOA high school level. I love basketball. I know basketball. I'm pretty good at it. So I've done some pretty big games. I'm a veteran official. I've done quite a few state tournaments now. We'll do the big Les Schwab tournaments. I've done a championship game at the Les Schwab. That I would say is my what they say, creme de la creme. That was my one shining moment. Biggest game of my high school career, and it was tight. He had a local team against the number one team in the country, Jackson Shawstead, the point guard down in Oregon right now. He was the star of his Westland team, and he was playing against the number seven pick for the Detroit Pistons a couple years ago. Ron Holland. And I got a tight picture from that game. They took a picture, he was Dunkin', and I'm in the background. And so that picture will live on forever at the Les Schwab tournament. They'll have it out in the foyer. So that was pretty dope. Our head officials all the time talk about when we walk into them. They want to get on one of those. So I got mines. So what we're going to do is we're going to talk about the independent podcaster. I've been doing some classroom work, some studying, some courses on a couple levels. Got a couple rebrands going right now. Rebranding the Thorn City Syndicate. As y'all can see, I got my new logo on. So the C part of my logo. Got the Thorn City Syndicate, the management company. I'm rebranding it into not a management company, but I'm calling it now. It's a management agency. And I'll get to a little bit about what I'm going to be doing. So we got that, and then we got the Thorn City Spotlight Show. Not the Saturday Night Live, but the actual podcast, Thorn City Spotlight Show podcast. Rebraining that. It's the be seen, be heard, be remembered. That's the tagline. It'll always be about networking informant strategic alliances. That'll always be part of it. But the new handle is be seen, be heard, be remembered. Because I'm working on working on a few things and I'll be launching here pretty soon. Give a quick shout out to my guy Jamal Lane and Christina Lane over there at the CBI Strictly Business program. I've been going through. They really put together a good program over there for people like me and the people that I'm looking to reach out to as part of my niche audience. If he's stuck and want to figure things out and get back to the basics and really just go through it and really put a plan in action, it's a good program. So I've been doing that. And then I've been doing a I've been doing a course on PodMatch. On a reached out to me, told me he liked what I was doing with the Thorn City Syndicate Spotlight Show. Told me that I've released more episodes than your average podcaster ever will. And so he gave me a kudos to that and invited me to his platform and say help me grow my show. And so that's what I've been doing. I've been going through the course. It's been great. And so that's we're getting into independent podcaster. But like I said, I'm getting back to podcasting, the real podcasting, where it's about audio. Podcasting is audio. You do video because you can't do video without audio. But you can do audio without video. So you do the video, and now you got the video, and you can use that for promotion. And video's getting more prevalent with the big wigs coming in, but there'll always be room for the independent podcaster like me and those out there. So I'm gonna get into some, I got a few ways you can stand out in a crowded space that I learned from going through the course. Independent podcasters like us can still win big in a space flooded with celebrities, corporations, and big media money. You don't need their budget to make your mark. And that's real spiel. We gotta get back to the roots of podcasting. And so that's what I'm gonna be pushing with my new rebrand is I'm gonna be pushing getting back into podcasting. And like I said, we can still do video. We just ain't gonna do the production of the video. We'll set up a camera, maybe two. We'll capture it, but we ain't gonna be doing production for you unless you got a budget. You got a budget, we got the works, we can make it happen. So, what I want to do is we're talking to independent podcasters. I want to go through some stats right here, man. I got this from a podmatch people. The podcast industry report. If y'all don't know about popmatch, you can sign up for it. I got an affiliate link. So I will be giving that out here in the episode here pretty soon. But I advise you to sign up if you're a podcast host or if you want to get on podcasts, because it's all about matching people, and they have a lot of resources. The owner's heavily involved. He reaches out, you message him, he'll message back. And so they have this podcasting industry report specifically for independent podcasters. This is the August 2025 edition, and I believe, if I'm not mistaken, it came from Buzz Sprout. But this report provides interview-based independent podcasters with relevant industry metrics by excluding data from celebrity and big network shows. So there's AE, actively established. These are non-celebrity independent interview-based podcasters with 100 plus episodes and release cadence of 10 days or less. So these are numbers for actual podcasters who's active and they're consistently releasing episodes. So there's 36,435 of those people out here right now. And so when I went through this report, it's good to let you know the independent podcaster market is still out here and still thriving. So the overall industry buzz is very high. Podcasts are trending at 99% on search engines. The podcaster's health is low. There's an extremely high failure rate with limited clear success paths. So that means, like I was telling my guy, Sam, the average podcast that starts don't get past 10 episodes. So that's what they're saying with the podcaster health right here. People start and they stop. I stopped for a minute, but I didn't give it up and I feel good to get back into it. So leadership health is very high. There is 584.1 million podcast listeners, estimated for 2025. That's up 15.6% from last year. The podcasting opportunity is very high. They say there's never been a better time to start a podcast. So if you got a business, if you got a product, a service you're selling, you probably should start a podcast. That's how I started my podcast. Sitting back in the office back there, just doing some self-assessment like I do from time to time, which got me into rebranding. What can I do? What's next? How can I move forward to help this business, my business, our business? I said, you got a podcast business here, brother. You should probably start a podcast. And so that's what I did. I started the spotlight show. And it's been good for me. I don't regret it. I wish I would have started sooner. But timing is everything. I wasn't ready to start it. So I started it when I was ready. And now I'm ready for the rebrand. Talked about last week. You can't be afraid to reassess, and you're not really starting over, but you're starting over. The rebrand, starting from scratch, but not really. So that's where we're at. Podcasting industry totals. Podcast listenership is rapidly increasing, but the number of active podcasts has not changed, making podcasting a non-saturated industry. So active. Total number of podcasts is 2.8 million, a little over 2.8 million. 2,836,214 total. So that's 13.7 of the total podcasts that are active. That's really a low number. So I gotta get mine back after. That's what we're doing here, man. We're getting back on it. The independent interview-based podcaster totals. Most interview-based podcasters fail to achieve the goal for their show due to quitting prematurely or inconsistent episode releases. That was almost me. It could have been me, but I ain't gonna let that be me. I got a newfound grind for the podcast between going through my business course and my podcast course. So it's been good. So it's giving me a new life. Active. 121,760 podcasts. Only 21% of the total podcasts are actually active podcasts. That's out of 577 and 231,000 total. So chances of success and failure as a podcaster. On average, it takes two years and 100 episodes released before podcasts receive results. Unfortunately, 93% quit before reaching this point. Here it is, the episode milestone. Chances of reaching the milestone. And to get to 300 episodes, only 3% of podcasts get to 300 episodes. That's crazy. So approximately 578 podcasters quit every single day. That's crazy. I didn't quit. I just needed to re-reshuffle some things in my brain around. So I didn't get to 50, but I got past 8. I think I'm at I think I'm at about 25 episodes or something. A little less than 30 episodes. So I'm in the I'm in the 30% or so, whatever that is. So it's a big chance of failure in podcasting. And I think a lot of that is because people see these big brands and celebrities podcasts that are out. They cheated. They already had some stuff going on before they started their podcast. So they can jump the line and go get some sponsorship and people to get behind them because they already they've already built something. Or people like me and people like you who've never done it, you gotta start from scratch. And so that's tough. But I think the thing is you can't do too much. You can't go too overboard. You can't try and do a podcast like someone who has a budget if you don't have the budget. So you gotta do real podcasts. Audio. There's nothing wrong with doing audio podcasts and capturing your video and putting your video out however you see fit. Nothing wrong with that. But the key is to put out a consistent product on a timely schedule. Whether you do it once a week, whether you do it every other week, whether you do it once a month, just do it on the same schedule consistently over time, and it will happen. Jumping the step when you go straight to video podcasting. You gotta get in the booth and do the audio stuff, and that's what real podcasting is. And so, shout out to my guy also fresh, because he's an avid old school podcaster where it's audio. He understands the video thing, but it's really an audio thing. And there's still a market out here, and according to these numbers, a lot of people ain't making the cut. They're giving up too soon before the fruits of the labor payoffs. In the pod match, there's a community of podcasters in there. And so I got through the program and I made a post. I said I'm committed to putting out one episode a week for the next 52 weeks. That is a year. I've connected with a few people who've reached out and said they want to get on, they want to get on my show. You gotta bring some people on the show, and you gotta go on other shows. So that's something that's I'm gonna start doing too, is I'm gonna get out and do some other shows. Remotely. Podcast guesting health. They said beta. That means in the testing phase. So serious podcast guests and hosts use podmatch.com to connect for higher quality interviews and to streamline the process. And so that's what I'm gonna be doing. So on the platform, there is 99,912 podcast seeking guests. There is, damn, I didn't know they had this many. There's 4.7 million guests seeking podcasts. So every podcast has an average of 47 people reaching out every day requesting to be a guest. So that means they don't have enough podcasts host on their site looking for guests. The number is skewed heavy on people looking to be guests on shows. So that's why I'm getting a bunch of outreach from people. There's a next says average of 47 people reaching out. And I've probably got reached, yeah, I'm just about pretty close to about 50 people that reached out to me already. So now they all ain't gonna get on the show. But the ones who they talk about what I want to talk about, and they can help me and help the audience that I'm after. Yeah, I'm gonna bring them people on. So here's your podcast compared to the industry average. A podcast listener is a hundred times more valuable than an engagement on social media. Podcasting is comparable to public speaking. Hosts are speakers, listeners are attendees. The podcasters group. The top 1% of podcasts get 4,177 downloads in the first seven days. The top 5% get 1,036%, 1,036 podcast episode downloads in the first seven days. Top 10% get a 451 episode downloads in the first seven days. Top 25% get 108 total downloads in the first seven days. And the top 50% get 27 downloads in the first days. So shout out to my guy, Tim James, with the health hero show. No, Tim James Unleashed. He's still the health hero, though. And I'm gonna get him on my show here pretty soon, too. He's gonna be one of my first guests because I need some health tips for him. That's my next ones. I get some shit squared away and straightened out. I gotta get on a health tip myself. So shout out to Tim James. It looked like he's in the top 5% of podcasters. Podmatch is a good resource. I'm gonna be using it. It's another course I'm gonna take here on this pod match site. It's how to build a podcast booking agency. So I'm gonna add that to my agency toolbox. I'm gonna be a podcast booking agency. And PodMatch is gonna show me the ropes. So y'all stay tuned for that. So yeah, that's the podcast industry report for independent podcasters, August 2025. So let's see. Five ways to stand out in the crowded space. Basically, how can independent podcasters like us still win big in the space flooded with corporate celebrities? Big money. It's still possible. We don't need their budget to make the mark. You just gotta have one, your own story. You are the X Factor. Nobody else has your exact journey. So stop trying to sound like everybody else, leaning to your voice and your vibe. So that's where I'm at. It's time to tell my story. I got a story to tell. I've done some stuff. It's all about transformation and visibility. Those are gonna be my two major keywords of the rebrand. It's transformation and visibility. How do you how can I help you transform? How can I transform? And so that's what we're gonna get into with the Doris City Syndicate Management Agency. Niche first, expand later. Don't try to serve everybody, serve one audience so well that they can't stop talking about you. That's always been my biggest issue. I've always worn a lot of hats and done a lot of different things. Because in a perfect world, you have a bunch of different people playing their roles. But when you're starting out as an entrepreneur, you gotta wear all the hats and you gotta play all the roles. And so it's been hard for me to niche all the way down, but I think I got my niche down. I said, don't try to serve everybody, serve one audience so well they can't stop talking about you. That's what you gotta do. Build microcommunities. A loyal hunter listeners will beat a random 10,000 any day. I tell people that all the time. Keep it tight and personal. You rather have a hundred people who's really locked in with you than a random 10,000 people who stop in real quick and pop out. They pop in and pop out. But if you get them hunter to be down with you and they really buy into what you sell them, how you can help provide value to them, then they'll rock with you. And you can really get something going. So that's what I'm working on is building my microcommunity and some loyal listeners who can really take the message I'm giving and the value I can bring to them from what I've learned over the few years that I've been rocking this entrepreneurial journey. Repurpose everything. One interview can be a podcast episode, a YouTube short, an Instagram reel, a blog post, and a newsletter. Milk it. Milk all your content. This live stream is a content creation session for me. So I'm gonna be able to turn this into a bunch of stuff. Like I said, it's gonna be a podcast episode. I'm gonna get quite a few shorts and reels out of it. I'll make a blog post about it and probably create a newsletter. And that's just lightweight. You can do so much with one piece of content like this. So collaborate to elevate. That's another focus of mine. Partnerships, guest swaps, joint episodes, put you in front of fresh ears without paying for ads. And so that's what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna get some more people who's walk the walk and talk, can talk to talk to come on my show. That ain't from around here, who knows? I got a lady in Australia. She wanted to come on the show. She might be one of my first guests, actually, because I think she can help me. And if she can help me, she can help you. So collaborate to elevate partnerships. The creative vendor network and marketplace. That's it's all about collaboration and partnerships. That's how I'm building out the Thorn City Syndicate Management Agency and the Thorn City Spotlight in 2025 and beyond. So if you're indie podcaster looking to level up your visibility, let's connect on Podmatch. Use my link, joinpodmatch.com backslash ThorCity, and let's make something happen. Like I said, use my link, joinpodmatch.com, Thorn City, let's make something happen. Behind the rebrand of Thorn City Syndicate is an ecosystem. I'll share a little bit of the blueprint with you right now. Mentioned earlier, just a second ago. The creative vendor network and marketplaces. It's a place to connect for connecting creatives, freelancers, and small businesses, so nobody's grinding alone. It's tough doing it all by yourself. It's tough doing it by yourself. So you got to get some help. You got to get some people who's on the same page as you, who has the same thoughts and aspirations as you, and you guys come together and make it happen. That's why sports is about team. If you have a team, you can go so far. By yourself, you only can get so much done. So that's what I'm gonna be stressing, trying to build out my community of creative vendors and create a network and, like I said, a marketplace of services from these vendors. Coaching and mentorship. I got a lot to offer. I've learned a lot over my five years at the GMP Podcast Studios and my 11 years in the entrepreneurial journey. So I'm ready to share some of that more intentionally and strategically. Foreign City HQ, this is the hub where all the content gets created. From podcasts to promos to live streams to voiceovers. You got a budget. So shameless plug. I'm an award-winning music video producer. So I did that, and I could do it again. The documentary is coming. Don't worry, it's coming. It's a beast, the documentary works a beast, but I got a good story, and it's about transformation and visibility and how I got started. That's the story it tells. How I got into this. And so that's coming. Advertising. That is the piece of the pie that I haven't been able to figure out yet. Advertising and the sponsorship. I figured out a little bit, but now I gotta master it. My own advertising venture. Because visibility isn't just online putting brands in the streets in front of the peoples. Everything connects. The podcast is the front door, but behind it is the whole ecosystem. So if you're a creative entrepreneur or business owner, or you want to get in this network, then I'm starting up, DM me, hit the link in the description, and let's build. I'm dreaming of a big podcast where I can be good just from podcasting. It's people out there making heavy money in podcasting. So I need one of them heavy bags. So that's the mission I'm chasing right now. If you want to join me on this journey, hit me up, man. Let's do it. So here's the play. Like I said, the podcast booking agency. I like that. It's a good tool to add to my bag of the visibility and network I'm building. That's what that is. Podcasts, whether it's getting you on shows, probably more getting guests on your show because like I said, the numbers are screwed. So that's what we're gonna do with the podcast booking agency. So pick the right guests. Don't just chase big names. Look for guests who could be also collaborators, partners, or clients. And so that's another thing about that. That is gonna be a lead magnet for me. Bringing these people on my shows and seeing how they can help me and see if I can help them. It might not just be a guest. We might become partners, they might become a client, but it'll all start right with the pot match. Ask deeper questions, build real connections, not just interviews. And I think that's what I was naturally good at. Like I said, it was like pulling teeth to get me to start my podcast, but eventually I just said I'm gonna do it and I did it. And so proud of myself. But yeah, I think I was pretty good at my prep, getting questions, getting those deep questions that build the real connections. And it's not just the interview, it's like a conversation. Those are the best ones where you're having a conversation and you get real value. So that's what I'm focused on. Highlight their wins. Make your guests look so good they'll want to work with you or refer you. Preparation. That's what I can say about that. Make sure you prepare for your interviews. If you prepare, it's pretty easy. If you're just going off the cuff, some people are naturally talented like that, but you really should prepare. Even if you're naturally talented like that, people can tell you didn't prepare. And so when you want to get into the thing of real podcasting and taking it serious and getting real real guests, people who have their own brand and own business they're running. And they like to know that you take it serious too. So prepare. If you don't prepare, then why do they want to come on your show? They're gonna prepare to come on your show. If you don't prepare for them coming on your show, that's it's not cool. So make sure you prepare because it shows. And that's one thing I was good at. I put my prep work in and I'm ready when the show comes. Except for tonight. But my assistant had me, so I think we got something decent here for tonight's episode. Create follow-up offers. After the interview, send them something to value. It's a free strategy session, resource, a partnership idea, something. Follow up with something. See if you guys can put something together. This is all the stuff I'm learning in the podcast course right now. Make your call to action clear. Tell your audience exactly how they can work with you. Tell them how they can work with you and how they can get a hold of you. If you're serious, and if you have your stuff, all your ducks in order, then you know you can do it right. So this is the Zach strategy. I'm using PotMatch right now to grow the show and the business. Want to turn your podcast into profit machine? That's what I'm working on. Let's talk. Connect with me on PodMatch. Join Popmatch.com backslash Thorn City and I'll help you map it out. But that's what I'm doing on Popmatch. I'm figuring out some stuff and I'm share with the people. Like I said, you can go sign up and join podmatch.com backslash thorn city. Or you can sign up to when I get my booking agency coming. It's full transparency. And I learned this in there. A lot of people with their podcast, there's a lot of people. I don't know if it's a lot of people, there's people out here with podcast booking agencies, and a lot of them use PodMatch because it's a system that's already put together for you. You just got to know how to use it. And it's still a lot of work. So I can see how, like I said, I refer y'all to go use it. But some people might get there and be like, man, it's still a lot of work reaching out or people reaching out, going back and forth, setting up the emails and going through the emails and seeing if they're a good guest or not. See if their values match your values. That's still a lot of work. So that's not what you want to do. That's when you go to a booking agency, and that's when I'll be here for you. So Thorn City Management Agency, that's what we're creating. Our core promise: we transform brands, businesses by making them visible in the place that matters most. So they're seen, heard, and remembered. You want to be seen, you want to be heard, and you want to be remembered. If you can conquer those three, I think your business and your podcast, you be off and running. And so those are my focus areas. To be seen is the awareness and opportunity. Here's the reality. You might be doing incredible work right now, but if the right people don't know you exist, it doesn't matter. It really doesn't. If the people don't see you and they can't find you, then it don't matter what you're doing. But that's where we come in. We take you from hidden gym to a local landmark. I don't know if I, but whatever. It's maybe usable. Your face, your brand, your message. Showing up exactly where your audience lives, works, and spends their time. Outcome, people start noticing you, recognize you, and talking about you. I really created this Thorn City podcast guy persona when I started my show because, like I said, introvert. I'm not a big talker, I don't like talking about myself. So I created Alter Ego name all the Thorn City Podcast guy. Now, when I'm out and about, people see me, you're the podcast guy. Uh, it worked. It worked, it worked, it worked. I am now the podcast guy right here, the Thorn City Podcast guy. Thorn City meeting Portland. That's me. And so it worked. Branding works. And if you do it consistently enough, it shows. And so it's it shows when I'm out and about and people see me and they call me the podcast guy. They don't know me for nothing else but being the podcast guy. And I'm alright with that. But you're gonna get to know me more now. Maybe you got a message worth sharing, but your reach is limited. We can change that. We put your voice on platforms and in front of audiences that align with your mission and goals. Part of the way we do that is guest features on the spotlight show. And then, like I said, the podcast hosts guest interview booking services that I'm gonna be launching here pretty soon. Place you on other shows and book you guests to expand your influence. The outcome? You're no longer just another voice. You're the voice that people remember. Be remembered is growth and legacy. Being seen and heard is just a start. We make sure people remember you long after your first impression. Creative Vendor Network. Professionals. All on my website offering their services, and so I can promote them. I can promote their services. I can now offer those services as something I do, whether that's professional video shooters, editors, graphic designers, photography. I would like to create some podcast producers here at the studio. Just to name a few. There's so much more we can do, but you want to keep, like I said, month before, my problem has always been niching down. So I'm gonna niche it down to video, graphics, photography. Those will be the the three three main staples. That doesn't mean you can't go after the rest, but that just means what you focused on. And so with audio and video production, I'm gonna be launching more and more digital marketing services, SEO, website builds, social ads, just to name a few. Getting into some more digital products, some more digital product campaigns, creating some courses, books. I got my book. I think I'm gonna retitle it. I'm gonna make a play off the podcasting for dummies, and that's what I'm gonna call my book. It's because it was my early stages of learning podcasting where I wrote it, and so it's it's the it's a good way to learn about podcasting, and it covers all the steps from start to finish. And so I need to launch that. Let's see. The outcome. Your visibility turns into influence, influence turns into growth, and growth becomes a legacy. I like that. The loop, how we keep you relevant. Everything we do works in the cycle. We make you visible where your audience is, we amplify your voice through media and storytelling. We create lasting impact with branding, marketing, and products that stick. We repeat that cycle to keep you relevant, recognized, and remembered. That's Thorn City Syndicate Management, where visibility meets transformation, and transformation builds legacy. Thorn City Spotlight Show, where we be seen, be heard, and be remembered. Make sure you drop a comment, tell a friend to tell a friend, tap in on the tap in, like I season say. Make sure you subscribe to Thorn City Spotlight on YouTube. Thorn City Podcast Guy. Holla at you, boy.