Do You Have Value?

What happens when everything you used to define yourself is taken away?

In this deeply personal episode, Dee shares his journey through losing a business, battling illness, and wrestling with feelings of worth and identity. Together, Dee and Jodie explore what the Bible says about value, purpose, and why God’s love for us isn’t based on our performance.

If you’ve ever questioned your worth because of loss, disappointment, failure, or changing circumstances, this conversation is for you.

Featuring: Matthew 3, Isaiah 43:1, Romans 5:8, Philippians 1:6, and the Prodigal Son.

You are not your job. You are not your achievements. You are not your failures.

You are loved. You are known. You are called by name.

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hi and welcome back to the Muddy Cross Podcast. Thanks so much for joining us today. So today, Drew, we're talking about value. We are not value in terms of the value of assets that we have in terms of the value of the work that we have or the achievements that we've achieved, but more about the value of us as a person. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 0:24

I think I know this is really, really an honest one for you and a personal one, but I think it's great because it's the sort of the sort of area in our lives that we all wrestle with, if I'm honest, and probably a lot of us push it to the side and we don't actually face it, we don't admit it, and we don't address it until things go wrong.

SPEAKER_00 0:46

Yeah, and it is something that I've struggled with the past year, and I think for a large chunk of that time probably didn't realise it. So since obviously business closed and then got ill pretty much straight away, um and just dealing with that over the number of months, I think that's where I lost sight of everything, and that's where I didn't I probably didn't realise it. And coming out of that and um illness-wise, I kind of think I've I've questioned what is my value, yeah. Because uh my business closed, I was unable to work, so I'm not able to provide what good am I gonna be, and yeah, my I've I guess my value in myself and self-belief has diminished really. And now that doesn't mean that my um faith has is gone, it doesn't mean that I don't believe in God at all, but just me as a person, I don't probably believe in myself as much as I should or certainly as God probably would look at me.

SPEAKER_03 1:45

And I think I think personally, so many people can relate to what you're going through, what you've been through, and what you're still going through, like the whole journey of it all, because it is an ongoing journey, and we go through, as we've said before, roller coasters of ups and downs, um, and we don't realise how much of our identity is tied up into all of things, you know. Like for me, I'm a mother. Do you know what I mean? Even that in itself, I am, but first and foremost, I'm a child of God, and so it's looking at all the different things that I've said before, I I had an achievement mentality, and so looking at achieving was a massive thing. I had to go, no, that's not who I am. I need to take that off because that just produces ego and pride, yeah, and that's not something he wants for us. So there's all of these things, and sometimes it creeps back in. Yeah, so it's a it's an ongoing journey, you know. Whatever you know you're suffering with, you know, in in mental health or addictions or what have you, it's always gonna come, but it's about knowing who you are in him first.

SPEAKER_00 2:50

Yeah, I think you know, it's funny because whenever you think if somebody asks, Oh, you know, tell me a bit about you, you know, you you tend to say, hi, I am blank and I'm a mum, I'm a dad, I'm a mechanic, I'm a designer, and and and that seems to be what you push forward from assembly. It is, and and really, you know, the the answer should be hi, I'm Dan, I'm Charlie God, and and that's that should be enough, but we don't we don't see that, do we? We because it's that worldly element that tells us that we have to be something or achieving.

SPEAKER_03 3:25

It's the same as children, though, isn't it? How many times do you go to a child and go, Oh, what do you want to be when you're older?

SPEAKER_00 3:29

Yes, it's yes indoctrinated from a young age.

SPEAKER_03 3:32

Massive amounts of pressure and all of that on that child. And I think I don't know, when something changes unexpectedly in our life, like we get a redundancy, like health issues, you know, um, relationships break down, you know. I've you know, I've been through that, you know, all of those things are foul business which you you know experienced. Um, like for us when we left the balloon industry originally, that was a massive life change for us. It was like a as we've said, didn't we suicide, career suicide at that point, but but also massive because our life went from something we loved and we knew, and it and we didn't leave it because we didn't love it, we left it because our priorities were now okay, what's what's right with the children, and so all of those things you know can suddenly change like that, yeah. And and you're grieving a lot, you're looking and questioning who you are, you're seeking new identities, and all of that. And actually, we weren't with God at that point, um, in in any of those points, really, but it it's about just knowing who you are, yeah from the inside out, not seeking it from the outside to in. Yeah, I think that's the most important bit.

SPEAKER_00 4:43

That's true, and I've got some scripture actually that um kind of speaks into this a little bit. So this is well, I think it does anyway, and I'll explain why. So this is in Matthew, Matthew 3, towards the end of Matthew 3, 16. Um, if you're familiar with it, it's it's the baptism of Jesus. So it's after being baptized, Jesus came immediately from the water, and behold, the heavens uh were open, and he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove and lighting on him. And behold, a voice out of the heavens said, This is my beloved son, in whom I am well pleased. And the reason I picked that verse is because at this point Jesus hadn't started his ministry. He I was gonna say he hadn't done anything. He obviously had achieved a lot, you know, he'd done a lot of different things in carpentry, and uh we don't know the ins and outs until this point, but he hadn't come into his own I guess is what I'm saying. But God is saying, This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased. I mean, that's that's your dad saying I I am just so pleased with who you are and what you are you don't need to be anything or prove anything else right now, and I think that the difficulty is that you know, be it the way the world is, whatever way we want to address that, is that we achieve to become something as a career. Um, some of us stay at that career our whole life, some of us jump careers, but at the point of us working, we believe that's where we bring uh value, yeah, and that we have a purpose. And when you lose that, either you know you're you close your business or you get made redundant or healthy, whatever the reason being, whenever you stop doing that job, you then think, I don't have a purpose, so therefore I'm not of value, and you feel lost because you're trying to find your place in the world as into where you fit, and you know that could be a long period, a long period of time that you're in that, or it could be a short period because you pick up another job and another purpose. But the problem with that is you're falling back into the same trap, finding that you've got the job. Oh, now I have a new purpose, and I'm value there, and I think that this is basically telling us is that we're not defined by what we do, God loves us because of who we are, and and that's where it's real difficult, but it's easy for us to sit here and say that, and I'm sitting here saying I'm sitting here saying the words that I need to hear personally, but it's a very different thing whenever we come off camera and I'm wrestling with this, and I have to repeat this and tell myself that you know there there is value, God has value in me, God has a purpose for me, and and that's enough. Um I will do things, I will find other things to do, and so on and so forth, but it's enough that God feels this about me, yeah and you, and you, and everyone else.

SPEAKER_03 7:33

And his approval comes before performance, and that's and that's what we say that all the way through. Um, you know, other podcasts that we've been doing, it's you know, relationship before performance. Yeah, you know, it's it's making sure that you have that foundation, you know, your value doesn't come from the world, it doesn't come from opinions. It does I was listening to something the other day. This this woman was talking about her journey and how you know, like when she'd started into something, she just had to, you know, shut the world out and and just focus on what what you're doing, and I think that's true of us, isn't it? There's been a so many times, like when we pulled the boys out of school, how many people around us was telling us that we were you know a bit loopy for doing what we were doing? Um, but we just put our heads down and was like, no, we know for us this isn't the right decision, you know. You do have wobbles along the way, don't get me wrong, but it is about knowing that what you're doing is right by him and by the people you're not hurting anyone around you, you're being a good person, and you but your faith is strong, yeah, and your identity is coming from your relationship before any worldly performance or or labels or tags or whatever we want to put on ourselves because we're really good at labelling ourselves in this world, aren't we? No, we are or being labelled.

SPEAKER_00 8:49

It is that you know, knowing that you're loved before you've achieved um anything, and and even you know, again, even when you have achieved in beautiful achievement goes, you're still loved. Yeah, and because God doesn't um God doesn't value us because of what we've achieved, as you say.

SPEAKER_03 9:04

So and it is okay to achieve as well, you know, it's okay, you know it's okay to you know to to just you know like do a job that's not perhaps the grandest job in the world, but if you're doing it with the heart of God in it and you're sharing all of what he wants you to share through that, then you're doing the right thing. Do you know what I mean? So it doesn't matter whether you're a multimillionaire going out there and and you know, got all the titles and all the all or all of it, or doing an everyday job that's a necessity, you know, job. It doesn't matter what we're doing in life, but it's how we our heart is positioned in that. Yeah, and if we put in relationship with him before like I watched um there was uh just a clip come up, and there was this uh it was a football boy um on um I think it was on Facebook I was watching, but it he was basically um it was his parents saying how proud they are of him, not because of his achievements in football. Right, they'd filmed him and he didn't even know before every single match he prayed. He stood on the pitch, he opened his hands, and he was shut his eyes and he was praying. And every clip, like literally it was like multiple clips, you know, and and they went, That is amazing. We're proud of him, not because of his performance, we're proud of him because of his relationship with God. He's bringing God in the world. And he's inviting God so us before we start the podcast, we invite God in, you know, to go ahead of us and speak through us and not be of us, be of him, and that's what it should be in our daily lives. It's it's about inviting him into every situation, and by doing that, we'll get the value of what he wants us to be, yeah, because it comes through that.

SPEAKER_00 10:44

Yeah, you know, it reminds me of another story another telling in the Bible, um, or the prodigal son. You know, you think about it, and you think about achieving and then that going, and then where does that leave you? Because the prodigal son wanted his inheritance, yeah, and he shot off once he got it, and living the right for Riley, like O'Reilly, and partying and so on and so forth. But obviously, that then diminished, that was the the loss, and he ended up feeding the pigs, and he ended up walking home, probably feeling like a failure, not very highly valued, and wondering what his dad's gonna think of him. So that loss, that feeling of loss is there. But obviously, when he got home, he got a different response than he thought because his father valued him as his son.

SPEAKER_03 11:31

He was just so elated to see him come home that everything else just was incomparable. You know, it didn't matter, did it? He and before he could even open his mouth and make his speech, yeah, you know, his father's run up and the embrace he gives us, and that is the story to show us what God is saying to us. That you know, I'm not judging you by you know by any of those things, your highs and lows in life. That's yeah, and obviously, if you do something wrong that you shouldn't do, you know, we repent for that. And if he know and he'll know us by our heart, and he knows that if we've got a good heart, that we will repent from it, and as long as we don't keep repeating it, then you know, um but he doesn't he saved us by grace, he's not saved us by works, and so you know, yes, we have to have a relationship, and that's why we've said before, haven't we, when you come to this and you start reading the Bible and you start taking from all the accounts that have happened in here, all the examples of everyone that's been in here before us, that it doesn't it doesn't make you change because you feel the pressure to have to change, you change because you just desire and want to be a better person, and I think that's the difference, isn't it? If you're putting that pressure on you every day, oh I haven't read my Bible enough, oh I haven't done enough, oh, I haven't helped someone to have problems. That's not what he's asking us to do, he's asking us just to be in relationship with him, and everything else will fall into place.

SPEAKER_00 12:59

Yeah, I'm you know, I'm thinking still more on that protocol, son, and I'm thinking that you know his opinion of his thought of what might happen when he comes back was probably my dad's gonna he's gonna say you're back, explain your explain yourself, prove to me that you're uh you're worthy of me accepting you back, you've got to work your way back up now because you've got you've wasted a lot of money. But there was none of that, it was just I was gonna say it's just a simple embrace, but that embrace was acceptance, and and I think that this is where we need to cut ourselves some slack um self-feeling here, is that you know when things do go wrong, when you have messed up, and you know, I really personally obviously work or job or health is is is bugged you for a long time and you've not been able to do anything, you've got to cut that off and say that doesn't matter because that doesn't define who I am. I am worthy and and valued enough in God's eyes, and because of because of that, I'll just I'll continue to worship God, I'll continue to pray to God, and God will look after me, God will provide a new path for me to take, and no matter what happens, it's that relationship's the most important.

SPEAKER_03 14:12

Do you think the hardest thing though is not forgiving others but forgiving ourselves?

SPEAKER_00 14:16

I think it's that probably the forgiveness side of things is yeah, the hardest thing is, yeah. I think we're I think we're hardest on ourselves, and I don't think that we ever tell anybody that or explain to anybody what that conversation is in our head. Um I think probably because it's a difficult conversation to explain to ourselves, so even have to explain to somebody else. I I don't even know how I could articulate those conversations that I have in my head of very self-destructive, you know, you you've got no value, no purpose, you're useless, you blah blah blah blah.

SPEAKER_03 14:48

And when you get into that that that dull, that dip, and that lull in there, it's really hard because no matter what I say or anyone else says around you, it's not going to change. It's you and and you being with with God that's the only way to kind of you know lift you out of that. There's there's obviously help, you know, there's support, there's we can do as much as we can. We can tell you every day how loved, and you know, like you're not failure, and all those sorts of things, but ultimately it has to come from inside. You have to want to change, you have to want to do the hard work, you have to want to look in the mirror and and face all those thoughts that are in your head and go, No, they're not of me, they're not of God, they're of something else, and I need to just escape from them.

SPEAKER_00 15:35

It it is hard because you know, from from me from a personal point of view in the past year, because I've not physically my body's not been able, it hasn't been great or reliable to work. You know, I do I have felt that um uselessness and and then therefore lack of value, and then that knocks your confidence. So, you know, though if you if you know me, I'm I'm very I go and I'll speak to anybody, but there's a recluseness that has crept in over the past year where I would rather not do that, and I think that you need to be really careful because over a period of time it can start to change you, and it's not just a case of your opinion, but it's just things you don't really notice creeping in. For example, like I kind of I'm happy to recluse now, I'm happy not to whereas you were always the one that went in front, wasn't you? Yeah, and it's that's something I've recognised in myself that and that's hard work, that's that's not an easy thing. That's yes, you gotta pray and you've got to talk to God, but you have I have to do work to to replicate or to fix that certain replicate, and and that's that's not always easy. Um that's pushing yourself outside of your comfort zone um that you now find yourself in. Um so yeah, if if you're if this resonates with you, have comfort knowing that you're not the only person that feels that. Um again, we're not putting ourselves in this platform to say that we're better than anybody else. Um, we're going through these things just as much as you are, and we'll continue to go through them. And that this is the point, is having that relationship with God because we're gonna continue to go through these things, and you know, there could be tougher challenges ahead, um, but you know, God says, abide in me, be with me. I am I am well pleased with who you are. You know, nothing in the world will define you. I will work with you, I will provide for you, but you know, it it yeah, it's a challenging one.

SPEAKER_03 17:34

It is really a challenging one, and it's an important distinction between, you know, like like we've said, isn't it, what we're putting on ourselves, the pressures we're putting on ourselves, the identity that we're wrapping ourselves up in, versus the identity God is giving us and God wants us to have. And so it's a real, you know, our identity is not changing in him, no, but it's changing in here, yeah. And that's where we have to then keep coming back to scripture, time with him, relationship with him, and working on that as number one in our lives.

SPEAKER_00 18:09

I I think actually that that's a really valid point because we live more in the world than we live our time with God, in terms of the amount of time that we give God in a day and a week, is less than the time that we live in the world, and therefore it puts so much importance that we spend that time with God because otherwise the world will eat us up and the world will tell us where our value is, the girl will uh the world will tell us what our purpose is, uh, and and we need to really be careful, we need to have that balance. Um, now it's and again it's an easy thing to say, well, we should bring God into everything that we do every day. You know, be be honest, do we actually really 100% do that? I would say we probably don't, because you get caught up in a moment, and then the moment leads to another moment, and then all of a sudden you think, Oh my goodness, do you know what? I need to stop, I need to pray. And that's the right thing to do. But my point is that if we don't commit and spend that time with God, then we're spending more time in the world, and if we spend more time in the world, the world will tell us what our purpose is and therefore how we're what our value is.

SPEAKER_03 19:17

Yeah, it's really it's a really battling one, isn't it? To work through. I have got some scripture. I'm gonna go into is Isaiah 43, uh one. There's the I think Isaiah is a really good one to read anyway, but obviously 43 really speaks into what we're talking about, not just one, but a lot of 43. So if you can, you know, go and go and kind of sit with this um scripture and just see. But the part that I've picked out is do not fear, for I have redeemed you, I have summoned you by name, you are mine. And I think that's a really important one to notice that God isn't saying you are what you do, you are what you earn, you are what the world says of you, you are what you achieve, which is one I had to battle with. What he's saying is you are mine. A little bit, a little bit going back to your first scripture, which is I am with you, I'm well pleased. It's that same thing. You are mine, and I'm not asking you to be doers, I'm asking you just to be. We're human beings, we're not human doers, and I think that's the really important one. It it's it's stripping it all back, you know, it's really it's really looking at uh what does what does he want for us, and that comes from our time in the Bible.

SPEAKER_00 20:41

The question then goes to those listening is that what happens if you just think about this right now? What happens if everything that you think defined you was stripped away? What if your job or your role? So if you're a mum or if you your mum and work or your dad you go out and work or whatever, if your role disappeared, your income disappeared, your health was failing.

SPEAKER_03 21:05

Job changes, business closes.

SPEAKER_00 21:07

Would you still feel valued?

SPEAKER_03 21:10

Because most of us, our foundation in in the world, and and we had this for years and years and years, didn't we? That our foundation was well, we're secure, we've got money in the bank. We're secure, we've got jobs, we're secure, we've got a house and a car. We're secure, X, Y, and Z, fill in the blanks, whatever you want to, you know, we can afford to go shopping, we can afford whatever, fill in those blanks. But if all of a sudden the rugs pulled from under your feet, like if someone's going through the world and they're relying on a job or they're relying on that income and then it's gone, putting yourself, like you just said, as a question, and it's a really, really difficult place to put yourself. But if all of that was gone and you lost and it's stripped away, a bit like Job, you know. And that's why I love Job. I love the story of Job. You know, read it if you haven't, it's really good. Um Because it really shows us the true meaning and the true value, and I believe that's why it's in here, is to really guide us to the true meaning and the true value, and it's a really difficult one for us all to sit with. I I think because it's been difficult for me to sit with, so it's a really difficult one. All the things that I'm securing in my life, if they were to be stripped away, how would I be? Would I still be secure?

SPEAKER_00 22:26

Do you know the interesting thing about this is that it shows that we we build our value and our purpose around us because we get that job, we get that house, we get that car, we go in the X number holidays, we eat the particular type of food that we like, and we go out on on the days that we go out. So according to I guess our finances from our job, we sat where or we create that value and that purpose for ourselves, but again, if that was stripped away, would we be enough? Because we wouldn't be able to go out on the weekends, we wouldn't have those X number holidays, we wouldn't have that car, we wouldn't have that house, so we wouldn't be able to help other people. So, therefore, do you feel still enough with who you are? Because and the reason I bring that up is because it kind of describes us on our our journey. So if you've not watched um Grace and the Grit in the Cline series, do go back and watch that, and you'll understand what I'm speaking about now. Because we had an L we kind of had that strippy, wasn't it? And everything was very much stripped away.

SPEAKER_03 23:31

And then we're having to find out who we are, but we're still foundationally, we're still here today.

SPEAKER_00 23:36

Do you know? And there are lots of lessons learned, but what I'm saying is that we are still here today, so that that's by the grace of God, and God values us. That's why we're here, so therefore we're an up.

SPEAKER_03 23:49

Yeah, and you like again is that prison in the mind thing, isn't it? Like that always comes back to me. The film God's not dead, you know, the one where the guy, the son is talking with his mum, and he and he asks his mom the question. Yeah, and she's got Alzheimer's, and he asks her the question, doesn't he? You know, why is it why is it right that you know I'm sitting here, I've got everything, I've you know, millions of pounds and got a good job, good home, what have you, and yet you've believed in God all your life and you're suffering, and then she comes out with this just incredible.

SPEAKER_00 24:19

She becomes lucid then out of her out of her dimension. Well, God speaks through it, doesn't he?

SPEAKER_03 24:23

That's that's what it's all about. Um, just to sort of say that you're putting all your efforts into worldly things, and you've built this lovely, lovely, wonderful cell around you where you feel comfortable in, but actually that door's gonna shut and you're gonna be trapped in that cell, whereas I'm not, I'm free because I'm with the Father. And I it it it honestly just gives me goosebumps every single time. Um, but there was something else I watched, I wanted to bring it in at this point because um like when you were this this was obviously one that you felt close to your heart, wanted to share. Well, it's very much about you, isn't it? In the sense of what you've been going through, and and and so it's it's personal to you, yeah. Um, but when you were talking to me about it and we were discussing, you know, uh what you wanted to share and how how to share it, um just something I'd watched again with Simon Squibb. He goes around, doesn't he, and he says, What's your dream? And that's a really tough one. Like if someone come up to you right now with a microphone, and again, a good question to sort of say, wash your dream. Yeah, you know, and you're sitting there like oh you know, like I've I've got multitude of things, but it's a really difficult one to kind of sit with. Some people just come straight out with it, but I think if you're on a journey, like we've been on a journey, it can just feel a little bit lost. And so he was chatting to a guy on a train, it just happened to me because I guess in his nature now people know who he is, who he is. Sorry, um, you know, everyone's gonna want to talk to him when they see him. And he said that he was on a train and he met a 47-year-old man, and I thought, oh how couldn't you? Because 47, and he met a 47-year-old man, and he said the man was telling him about his life. He said, and on paper, the man's life was great, you know, he had a really good job, he was really successful, he was quite intelligent. Man, he had a home, he had cars, he had a wife, they went on holiday, he had children. So he looks like on on paper, he had everything, and his life was swimming, you know, lovely. But the guy was drowning. He said that he felt trapped. So he felt trapped because he had to go and do the job he was doing, because that job paid for the house, paid for the holidays, paid for the car, paid for the wife, whatever to do, you know. Obviously, I don't know whether she worked or not, I've got no idea, but but accumulatively he had to to go and do this job because it kept everything else in order. So on paper everything looked lovely, but he's sitting over here feeling like he's drowning, and he's and he said, Um, if I'm not quoting this wrong, that he didn't feel he had a purpose because all he was doing was fulfilling roles and fulfilling things, but his purpose was lost because he didn't know who he was anymore, and so you like Simon said, Well, what do you want to do? And he said, I would love to just go and discover myself. I'd love to get out and just discover, go traveling, you know, like just be free, you know, for a year or so just to go. And so they looked at it all. And Simon said, Looking at everything you've got, you've got a capital of 600,000 pounds. With that capital, you could leave your job, you could sell your house, you could get something smaller, or or just leave it in an investment, whatever, and you could go off and you could take a year out, and then after that year, if you want to come back and get another job, there's always a job you can go and get another job back. Who knows what's going to come in that year? And every time Simon came at him with ways to make that happen and on why he should go and talk to his wife and why he should do that, he came back with, but I can't because I've got to pay the mortgage, I can't because I've got to pay the mortgage, I can't because I wouldn't get a job again. Like it there was, and and so Simon walked away, and he's like, the man's trapped in his own identity, he's trapped in here, he's not trapped out here, he's trapped in here. And I sat there and I thought, that's so true. We all trap ourselves in the beliefs of I can't do that, I haven't got the money right now. I can't do this, I haven't got that, I can't do that, I haven't got this. But actually, with the world the way it is nowadays, technology, you know, everything's online and everything else, we could pretty much do anything we want to do. There are no limitations, the only limitations are what we put on ourselves. It really, realistically, in this day and age, the limitations are that, and so it's like we were having a conversation the other day, weren't we? And it's about you know, when you're in a lull, it's getting yourself out of that lull. What can you do? It's about making changes, facing the difficult things, one small change every day, you know, just getting up and trying, you know, going more walks, doing more things, getting more adrenaline going because that's going to give happier dolphins, you know, all these sorts of things, but it's about taking those little steps, you know, to just go, I can I can make a change, praying more, being more in the Bible, being more in scripture, you know, look at other accounts where people have gone through the same, like Job, sit with Job for a month, you know, just all these different ways that we can go. No, I see where I am, I don't want to be where I am, I want to be out here, and I want to feel purposeful, not in the world's standards, but in his standards. And I think, yeah, I just think that's incredible. Yeah, like I don't know, I'll do it now.

SPEAKER_00 29:47

No, it is it again again, it's that that that valiant purpose, and I think that we we allow the world to create that for us, yeah, and and then yeah, we can feel very trapped, and then if it goes wrong, we fall quite far, and but it always comes back to the cross.

SPEAKER_03 30:02

For me, it always comes back to the cross, doesn't it? It's like he died on that cross for us, and he would have come for any one of us. So, like looking at you when you're sitting there and it's you know, it's not a pity party, but you're going, you know, I'm struggling, I don't feel my I feel like I've lost my value, I feel like there were like you go, but he came and he died just for you, and and he would have died just for you, even if there was no one else here, he would have died just for you, yeah, because every single one of us are beautifully, wonderfully made and are perfect creation in his image.

SPEAKER_00 30:37

And and that you know, if that doesn't give you value, then then then what does it but it's easier said than done. It is, and uh funny, I was gonna bring that up about the cross because I've got uh another piece of scripture in Romans, Romans 5, um, 5.8. I know that we tend to read little snippets um of scripture, but so please do read the whole of the chapters. So um this is Romans 5, but in the little snippets, Romans 5.8, it says, But God demonstrates um his own love towards us in that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Yes, God gave up his son for us, that's how much he valued us. And if you're a parent or you just care deeply about somebody, would you give that person up for everyone else? That that that's a stra that's a hard one, but that's what God done for us, and again, it's a whole process when we go through these things, when we find ourselves in these situations, it's not a case of we read the scripture and go, Oh, okay, that makes sense. Oh, I'm fine. You know, there is uh a tugging and a pulling and a wrestling, um, but again, this is why we should go to scripture because it helps us to work through that, and there will be one scripture piece of scripture or two pieces of scripture that we'll land on, and something will click and we'll realize, do you know what? My attention, my worry isn't what I should be giving my attention to. I I I have I've lost myself somewhere amongst this, and I need to re-center, and that centre is always is God. Uh, and if we res if we re-center ourselves, always centre ourselves from the point of view of God and work out from there, I don't think we can go far wrong. No, but we I guess bringing to a close this episode is we need to be very careful how we value ourselves and what we think our purpose is, and are we creating that within the world? Yeah, because the world, everything in the world will will fade, everything in the world will break, you know, the the best businesses have gone bankrupt and everyone's lost their jobs, you know, and they always say that you're only cog, you'll be replaced. Unfortunately, that is true. Um, so if we give ourselves and our purpose and our value to our job, and then from that job, our purpose and our value, your family relies on that job, we're setting a very flimsy value on ourselves because everything like a plunk, you pull one straw in and everything falls down, that can happen, and then where does that leave us? It'll leave us to be.

SPEAKER_03 33:17

In a care home. And as we were walking through, you know, you're looking into doors, probably shouldn't, but you know, they're open, but you're looking into doors of other, you know, the other um elderly people in their rooms, you know, and although this is a beautiful place, it's still heartbreaking, isn't it? Because you're like you're you're thinking, I say heartbreaking, it's not heartbreaking because obviously we know where they're going, but but from the point of view of you look at it and it brings a stark reality of all the things that we're worrying about at this age now, here you know, you think actually we're gonna be there one day, and it's about making the most of where you are right now. So you may be sitting here, like, oh you know, I've been a failure, my business has gone, my health's been bad, blah blah blah, whatever, you know. Um, life hasn't gone the way I've expected it to go, or I'm carrying disappointment, I'm carrying unforgiveness, whatever, whatever you're going through, you know, it's it's about going. Actually, I can turn that around. I I can, I can do anything as long as I've got Christ who strengthens me. You know, bring it back to Proverbs 3.5, you know, trust in Him, asking, you know, every single day, don't show me the whole picture. I don't want to see the whole picture because I don't want to know what all the ups and downs are going to be, because I want to live through those ups and downs to feel the excitement, to feel the pain. Because that's life, that's what life is. We're meant to feel all these things, we're meant to experience all these things. Otherwise, it's going to be pretty dull and boring if all of that is wiped from us or we've shown all of that. But what I do want to know is the lamp at my feet. I want to know right now what do you want me to do and what do you want me to, you know. So we kind of asked, or I asked in prayer, what do you want me to know, and what do you want me to do with what you want me to know today? And and just getting through those micro steps, it's that ladder, isn't it? Where you see the big chunks people are trying to take on those marathon things and they never get there. But actually, if you just take those little micro steps, yeah, you'll you'll it's a consistency, isn't it? It's being consistent. So if you like wake up tomorrow morning and go, No, actually, I'm gonna make a change, I'm gonna start running, or I'm gonna start exercising, or I'm gonna start whatever, it's about going, I'm gonna commit to that, and I'm gonna do that every morning, and and by the end of three months, you'll be a different person because you've made one micro change. Don't try and change everything in one go, it's impossible. You just overload, and then you'll you'll fall off to be like the yo-yo diet, you just fall off. But if you just make one small change, it's like us with our food, isn't it? We've been trying to go more um more raw, more eating natural, eating more fruits. But if we went all in, it would be massive overwhelm. So it's about okay, well, let's just change breakfast or let's just change lunch or actually let's go raw till four. All of those little micro steps, and then actually in a year later, you're like, Well, that feels easy now because you've done it in micro format. So it's about just seeing what I can do right now to change that that disappointment that I'm feeling. I can train into it. What can I do right now? Probably more so to have some self-forgiveness, you know, on that. I can ask him, I can talk with him, I can go and perhaps talk to the person that I need to talk to if it's about forgiveness with them, you know. I can I can look at myself in the mirror and say he loves me. Yeah, and if he forgives me, I need to forgive myself because if I don't forgive myself on something that I know he's forgiven me on, then I'm questioning his forgiveness, and that's not right. And so it's a really tough process, and as we'll say, we're in the thick of all this, we're going through it, we're battling all these different things, but it's about building that foundation so that when those when those carpets are pulled from under you, you know, money's gone, health's gone, whatever you go no, because ultimately I know who I am in God, I know that I can still be of service to other people because I think that's massive value. I think that's what we're here to do, to be of service to somebody else, and I know where I'm going, yeah. And ultimately that gives me the peace, that gives me that foundation, and so it's about working through all of this, and and you find your value there.

SPEAKER_00 37:42

Yeah, no, absolutely. I'll I'll I'll end this episode on this, and it's that even if you don't see the value in yourself, God's never stopped seeing the value within you. Um, and just take it to Scripture, would be my advice.

SPEAKER_03 37:59

Yeah, just go to God with it every time. Read Joe, Joe's brilliant one. I love Joe.

SPEAKER_00 38:03

So, guys, thank you very much for joining us in this episode. We hope that it's uh spoken to some of you. Um, we really hope that it's encouraged you as well. If it has, please do get in touch. You can uh put it in the comments below, or you can send us a personal message. Remember, we do read them, we do respond, and we love to get them. Um, if you want to support the show, you can do that. Link is down below. But until the next episode, stay rid of the crisis.