32: Are Primitive Reflexes Causing Your Focus, Sensory, or Coordination Issues?

What if some of the symptoms you’ve been labeling as ADHD, anxiety, or just “how you are” are actually being misdiagnosed? In this episode, Dr. Hira Khan unpacks something most people have never even heard of - primitive reflexes. These early movement patterns are meant to develop in childhood, but when they don’t fully integrate, they can show up later as coordination issues, sensory overload, trouble focusing, or feeling disconnected from your body. Dr. Khan explains what primitive reflexes are, how they impact your nervous system and brain-body connection, and why it’s never too late to rewire these patterns.

Connect with Dr. Hira Khan:

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In This Episode:

• (01:30) Why Dr. Khan shifted away from traditional medicine
• (04:00) What primitive reflexes are
• (08:30) How the brain adapts and rewires over time
• (14:20) What cold laser therapy is and how it works
• (17:20) There is nothing “wrong” with you

Connect with Daffney:

The Game-Changer Consult → This 60 min deep dive offers you clarity and insight into what’s possible for your next 60 days. Leave this consult feeling full of possibility and with the energy of purpose!

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Hey friends, thanks for joining us for another episode of Don't F and Shrink. I can't tell you how many times working with clients, I get a lot of misdiagnosed opportunities where people refer to patterns of behavior or issues they're having in their physical health and performance. And a lot of times misdiagnosing them as things as autism and ADHD when they might be something that you haven't really considered. And we call that in physical therapy primitive reflexes. So if you are somebody who startles easy, maybe you like to chew on your nails or your fingers, or maybe you've got a chronic injury that doesn't really have an acute foundation, this is where we're going to dive in today and talk about the possibility that primitive reflexes, which is part of your neuromuscular pathways and your physiology, could be part of the equation. Welcome to Don't F and Shrink, the podcast, where we stop playing small and start showing up big. I'm your host, Daphne Allwine, and I'm here to cut through the noise, ditch the self-doubt, and get honest about what it takes to live and lead with unapologetic confidence. Each week you'll hear unfiltered conversations, powerful stories, and in real life strategies to help you take up space in your life, your work, and your world. So buckle up because shrinking is not an option here. Let's dive in. Today with me is Dr. Hira Khan, and she's actually a doctor of chiropractic, but she's specializing in her care with women and development of young children who have not quite moved past their primitive reflexes. Hera, how are you? I'm good. How are you? Good. This is a fun conversation. I always kind of like geeking out with you in your office because uh I have had the privilege of actually physically being to here's office. And primitive reflexes is really a specialty. It's really something that requires a lot of consideration, thought, and schooling because it's not general physical therapy. It is something that requires you to consider how our brain processes the movements our body makes.

SPEAKER_01 2:13

Here we're what brought you to this specialty? So my mom was diagnosed with a brain tumor when I was 12 and she was stage four glioblastoma. I'm very grateful that she actually fought the odds and she was able to live for 16 years after that. However, after her second brain surgery, they apologized. The doctors did and said, I'm sorry, you actually didn't need it. So as a teenager, I was around 17, 18 at that time. I was like, I can't do this. So what can I do where I can help prevent things? And funny enough, I came across chiropractic because my aunt went through PT at one point. It helped, but not fully. This has surgery is not an option. She had a frozen shoulder issue, and then a chiropractor was able to help her in the early 90s. So she's like, we need somebody to do this in our family. And the more I looked into chiropractic, understood the philosophy that as long as you'll give the body what it needs, let it build on its own and see what comes up. And that's what kids' care is, regardless of which specialty you're looking into. We're just giving them what they need and they just flourish from there. Their brain is a lot more plastic than ours, obviously, but they're just resilient beings. So I think that's what drives me. It's like they're the ones that need the help the most in that regard. But at the same time, when they don't get it, their body will keep adapting. So why not just help them just a smidge and see where they go from there?

SPEAKER_02 3:38

The way that you make it so inviting and integrative and fun, right? Because kids don't want to go to another doctor. Kids don't want to have to do another laborious task or assessment. So one of the things that you and I got to talk about quite a bit, and I learned a lot from you, and it kind of forced me to do more research and even in my field is primitive reflexes. So can you explain what that is?

SPEAKER_01 4:02

Yeah. So primitive reflexes are basically movement patterns that we're all born with. We have them for the first couple of years of our life. They are controlled by the lower parts of our brain and are meant to help babies survive and start developing. So things like sucking, grasping, or reacting to movements, they all come naturally to us, but we only need them for a certain amount of time. So then later on, other parts of our brain brain will kick on and they will become more voluntary and more precise. So as a baby, they're obviously not as much, but they're allowing us to get through that first year or so of our life. So we're not meant to keep them forever.

SPEAKER_02 4:43

And what's very interesting is it is an integration. It's literally learning your body. These babies are getting constant feedback. Or as babies, we're supposed to be getting constant feedback from our environment, which helps us sort of develop past meeting these things. So once we sort of make that brain-body integration, all of a sudden we don't really need that reflex anymore. We now can have that even neuron flow. It just becomes natural. So past the age of three, these are things that sort of naturally should have developed. So after three, that may require some actual modality or some work with you. Is that right?

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Yes. Depending on what the history looks like and where did they miss the mark? What happened? Was it because of a really stressful birth? Was it because they just didn't know how to develop it the pattern or did they skip it? It is best to get this work done under five, ideally, but even after you can do it because we can go back, help the brain start to wire those systems together, connect the movements and sensations, and whatever the normal responses, bring that out. That'll help the brain develop from bottom up.

SPEAKER_02 5:54

It isn't literally, and we know this in physical therapy across the board, it is never too late to do these things. Your brain is still building synapses, it is still functioning. It may not be as with as much ease as it might be in our earlier time, but you know, even just integrating now with some physical movement with adult clients, I can I can see the benefits of crossbody rotation. You know, if you've ever done exercise and you're like, why can't I twist in two opposite directions? Why can't I balance on this? So what is something? Now here's here's sort of a a checklist of sorts. There were, is it six? There are six primitive reflexes. Is that correct? That we're generally seeing? Yes. Yes. Okay. So typically, and and you can use an example that that makes most sense for you or most sense for our audience, but what are some of the actual developmental sort of things based on those six primitive reflexes that you're seeing most or is is most obvious to you?

SPEAKER_01 6:53

It depends on which ones we're looking at. Is it sensory versus movement or behavior? Because obviously we're building from one thing to the next. So let's say we're looking at more like from the movement perspective, you might see um poor coordination, clumsiness, and a lot of times people say, oh, they just fall easily, you know, just a little clumsy. Or if they're walking, they'll touch their body against the wall, seeking that more information from that side, wanting to toe walk, or unequal gait pattern, um, having difficulty sitting and maintaining their posture. Those will all fall under the movement part of it. But then when we look from regulation or sensory, they'll seek sensory intake. So it could be from a noise, it could be touch, it could be texture. So like touch could be like wanting more hugs or uh wanting to be under heavy things, blankets could be one of them. Or with sound, it could be the way they watch TV or music, crunchiness of things, getting as much input as possible or difficulty calming down would fall under that to just get overwhelmed very easily from your regulation standpoint. But if we're looking for looking at an older kid that's already in school, we can see trouble with focusing at school, attention being an issue. And then emotional regularity would also fall under that because they'll eventually get overwhelmed. And then just easily overstimulated, just having a harder time taking the information in and actually understanding it, because that requires several steps for the brain to integrate everything as well. These are generally the ones that I would see are most common symptoms for most people.

SPEAKER_02 8:32

Yeah. Are you willing to break down sides of the brain with us? Because this is where we get the neuropatterns versus the sensory patterns or the movement versus the sensory. So maybe that helps helps listeners understand a little differently. The way the brain is configured is where the developmental condition lies. So if you're having motors, let's say, like you said, your gait or your balance, your coordination feels off, that is completely separate than sensory input, like noise coming into your ear and you not being able to understand, you know, language, things like that. So that's fascinating that a lot of that has so much to do with the integration of the brain. So movement patterns. And the, I guess the other piece or the question I have is you said very specifically, it could be, in fact, trauma-based or environmentally based in that way. So it doesn't necessarily mean that there is something cognitively wrong or lacking with a child. It could literally just be the environment and how that particular neurowiring is affected. Because each each child, and I think that's one of those big things, you probably see this more, is each human, each adult in my case has completely different circumstances. So even if you had a brother or a sister who did not have some of these difficulties with processing auditory or, you know, sensory or coordination, that doesn't mean you're the black sheep of your family.

SPEAKER_01 9:56

Oftentimes, even as an adult, when you go back and figure out whatever it is that was hard for you. So for example, I will come across people that are very athletic. They do great when it comes to sports, but then they will have a really hard time with speech or expressing themselves or feeling safe in their body. So they just want to go, go, go. If you break that down, it's like, well, your body is seeking movement because that movement is giving it that information that it needs, that needs to go to cerebellum, midbrain, and then cortex. You're physically processing everything rather than being able to sit there to do it because that's how they wired their brain to do it. While there are other kids that can have a harder time, for example, tying their shoelaces. They can't do a simple task because of the sensory issues that they just didn't learn how to strengthen their hands and knees and their fingers, just like the the fine motor skills, because they were focused on the other aspect of their brain. But when it comes to other sides, like other parts of their body and other ways of expressing, they're great there. It's just whatever came easy, they only stuck with that one thing. But going back to what you were saying is that at any age, we're all able to do it because our brain will adapt. So anything that the main thing is like as long as information from your body to the brain is clear, it will feed it forward and it'll figure itself out. The path we will just continue to build until it's clearer. Because our brain wants to be more efficient. It wants to do things with less intake as much as possible. So why work harder when you can work smarter?

SPEAKER_02 11:35

It is very interesting though, because it's one of those things where people start identifying then as whatever that shortcoming is or that sort of thing. And don't think of it in that context that you said that this is something that our brain has, our bodies, our brains are so intelligent. And with the use of, I I know you use exercises, I use exercises, it is literally just rewiring the brain with movement. Is there something in your practice that's ever surprised you?

SPEAKER_01 12:05

Yes. So I recently had a kid with autism, and I work with a lot of kids with that background, and they're very fascinating to me because we are hardwired as a society to think that there is something that is wrong with that. Thank you. There is nothing wrong, yes. Exactly. There's absolutely nothing wrong. Their nervous system just works differently, and it's developing at a different rate and a pathway. But what I have learned with primitive reflex work or especially integrating low-level cold laser, they adapt so much faster than my mind always every single time I get very surprised. I recently had a kiddo start with me within a week of care. He was talking completely in full sentences. And then his mom just kept saying, I don't understand. I was like, I don't fully understand either, but the brain is brilliant. Yes. Exactly. He was already doing the work. We just facilitated a little bit, whatever he needed. He just was able to build from there. And that's the thing. That's all he needed. Now, now that we know he's able to talk and he's able to do X, Y, and Z that we're working on, we just keep pushing him along. For three and a half years, he was not talking at all. He only would point to things or would just kind of interact with his facial expressions. And I'm like, great, we're great. Let's just keep pushing. So, but then this is not the first time I've seen it so many times. These kids are just resilient. Like you said, there's nothing wrong. We just gotta give the brain a little push and it'll do what it needs to do.

SPEAKER_02 13:35

Yeah, that's incredible. Thank you for sharing that story because I think a lot of people need to hear that. That one, there is nothing wrong with a brain that functions differently. I mean, neurodivergence is one of my favorite topics, and as it relates to exercise and movement, because the truth of the matter is there is nothing wrong with your brain. Your brain is a unique specimen in so many ways, but also it is so welcoming to conditioning. It's welcome to new information, to new stimuluses. So I love that you're doing the work that you are because we're learning that we could do almost anything and change that. And as opposed to forcing someone into a box and making them, this is the way we see them, we're saying, what's possible in this case?

SPEAKER_01 14:21

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 14:22

You mentioned cold laser therapy. This is one of my favorite, but I don't use this obviously in my practice. But can you tell me what that does? It's actually one of my fascinators, I'm fascinated by this.

SPEAKER_01 14:30

So, in the most simple terms, all we're trying to do is stimulating mitochondria. We want more energy and we want to decrease inflammation. Every wavelength that a laser provides has a different result behind it. The most studied one out there is red and infrared. So whenever somebody asks me if they should invest in it, especially with a kiddo that has special needs, that's the one I recommend. Because other ones do help. But this is if you have this one, you'll get most out of it because most of us naturally are carrying a lot of inflammation from X, Y, and Z. So we can use it for a thousand different things. For the brain, I can actually use it to stimulate different parts of the brain. So let's say I'm working with a uh kiddo with speech issues, I will naturally target the areas from the mouth to jaw to broker's area to cerebellum, prefrontal cortex, because we need all those areas firing. So we want to do it in the the pattern that we want them to fire. Um figuring out what works for them. But all that to say is we can do those things to speed up the process of their healing. For example, let's say you have somebody comes in with knee pain, they can do it on their knee and surrounding knee muscles to decrease inflammation. So then every exercise that they do, they're able to do it the right way and with ease. So something that could have taken them six to eight months could be done in 50% of the time.

SPEAKER_02 15:57

It's amazing. Thank you, technology, right? They're not just fun laser pens anymore. No, it's it is interesting. Technology has taken so many leaps. I want to say, probably in the last 10 years, even beyond in the work I've done where I'm like, what is a laser? I like I'd have to come back and ask, like, here, what is this? What does this do? That's fascinating. Because now we have the option and we understand the brain a lot more dynamically and the way that we can help it. So a really good example is when somebody comes to me with a pain or an issue, it's not just about treating or stretching or or you know, taking down the inflammation is important for that injury, but also building up that muscle structure around that injury. So if someone has a you know hamstring pull, we're really gonna work on those quads and the hips and all the connecting joints because even though that's injured, we need to create a structure. So that it sounds like that's what you're doing with the brain and with that integration.

SPEAKER_01 16:54

Yeah. It's like focusing on pain is an old topic. 10, 20 years old, pain is not important. What the conversation should always be what do we, what can we do to support the problem? As long as we can support it and facilitate it, that's what laser is doing. We're gonna make great progress. And we're trying to find more of a root cause rather than just patching something with a band-aid. Here's what's something that you wish people knew? There's literally nothing wrong with you if you just view the world differently. Plain and simple. I think we all like to put ourselves in a box in the wavy view of the world, whether it's from the regulation standpoint, emotional control, attention, sensory processing, or oh, our kid you kid should sit in the classroom for eight hours, or oh, I should be working from nine to five. Well, it doesn't work for everyone. Our circadian rhythms are different, our brains are different, we are different, we perceive the world differently. So if you do view the world differently, that is okay. That is completely okay. Your brain just developed differently because you're a different person. No one's the same. And we're not supposed to be the same. Because if we were all the same, how would we do the jobs that you may like but I hate?

SPEAKER_02 18:09

That's the thing, is we all have these gifts. And when we it's exactly like you said, it when we see it as a malady as opposed to an opportunity, that's huge. Yeah, I have my own debate on how long we should actually be sitting and how long we should have, you know, natural light available to us. I think science is backing us up on that one that sitting for that long and especially for children is not conducive. But I love that you said that like our brains were made differently for a reason. There, there is absolutely an adaptation, even an evolution of humanity. And there's a reason that we're doing these things, and then it is important. But I love that you have never said in this entire interview that you have fixed anybody. Because that is the truth. You are enabling a brain to come online. You're enabling a brain to meet the body that it's in and help it live to its fullest. And I think if you don't know already, that is your gift.

SPEAKER_01 19:07

So the way I view it is that we're just giving it a second chance. That's it. Or a third chance, a fourth chance. I think a voice. Yeah. Yeah. Like we just gotta facilitate one way or the other, and brain will do what it needs to do. Like you said, letting it to come on, letting it to flourish, because it can do things that we never thought could be done. Prime example would be for like if if we chop someone's leg off, people are able to figure out how to walk. They're able to learn how to just use one arm, even if that wasn't their dominant arm, because brain will adapt. It will do anything it needs to to survive and to thrive from there.

SPEAKER_02 19:44

Amazing. We can talk about phantom limbs too, because that's a whole nother that's a whole nother theory. Maybe we'll get into that next time. Here, thank you for joining the show today. I think it's so compelling and your message is so important that these are things to consider. If you are having chronic injuries, if you do have sensory input considerations and you feel like they're holding you back, right? There's nothing wrong with you, but if you feel like they are holding you back, there are incredible resources like Dr. Khan here who can help you make those connections and maybe just feel more yourself and connect with your mind and body and your nervous system in the way that really benefits and shows you the most.

SPEAKER_00 20:27

Is there a way people can find you or connect with you? I know you're in Northern Virginia. Yeah, absolutely. Um, you can reach me on my Instagram, Safe Haven Chiropractor, and or through the website too, safe havenchiro.com. Thank you so much for being with us today.

SPEAKER_01 20:41

Absolutely.