Constant Combat

High Value Targets - Andrew Kern (part 2 of 2)

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Part 2 of Andrew Kern from Mobile Assault Platoon One shifts from a summer lull into intense July and August gunfights, including a rooftop engagement that breaks an ambush and relieves pressure on pinned-down troops. An RPG comes straight at him and he has enough time to think, “Well, I’m dead,” before it blasts into the Humvee instead. We also get candid about Iraqi security forces, the randomness of getting wounded, and what service means when the paperwork never matches what happened.

• an Iraqi unit’s reputation 
• rebuilding Iraqi police and army forces 
• the July 13 government center run-in and the July 14th aftermath
• a Route Michigan battle and the rooftop overwatch
• the moral debate around a wounded combatant
• an RPG strike on a Humvee door and a Purple Heart story
• bridge duty, rockets, return fire, and the boredom between chaos
• left seat right seat, the handover to the next unit
• looking back after 22 years on brotherhood, identity, and meaning


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Part Two And The Summer Shift

SPEAKER_00

This is part two with Andrew Kern of Mobile Assault Platoon One.

SPEAKER_03

Um let's see. So summer summer continues after April 10th. Um things kind of like definitely small arms engagements go down quite a bit. And yeah, we we continue. Um we press on uh with the you know the the presence showing a presence of force or whatever in the endless OPs and um patrols and stuff like that. Um I remember there was a time when these um do you guys remember this unit of um elite Iraqi like former Iraqi army guys called the Sheshwanis? The Shishwani, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00

Oh man, I forgot about that. Those are so not just for the Iraqi army, they were uh a special semi-religious Shia unit, which that was a big that was a big

The Sheshwani Unit And False Hype

SPEAKER_00

thing when they brought them in, is that we were in a Sunni province with all Sunni Muslims, and they were bringing in these special Shia special forces or whatever the fuck they were. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03

They were quite a forgettable unit. Um they they were supposed to be these these badass dudes who were gonna like change the tide of the war, and like they were pussies, dude. They like they like we took them out on like like two missions. I remember we we took them out and like um they were like I think they got shot at a few times. I I didn't know that they were a Shia thing, so yeah, that I'm sure the Sunnis of Vermont were weren't weren't happy with them. Um and they they like took fire a couple times and they were like, We we leave, we no more. Like, yeah, they they they bailed, dude. Um so I kind of remember I I remember those guys. Um here's let's see.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, so so if you don't remember their their captain or major whatever rank he said he was, I've he was wearing shiny something. He looked like he was 55 and like an overweight, like like like fat dude from nowhere, like yeah, and he was the guy carrying the machine gun. And so that's I remember this guy specifically. That's the only reason why they really stand out. And they wore the uh they wore the old Desert Storm chocolate chocolate chip camis, and so they should they stood out like a sore thumb.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I yeah, I actually I I actually you saying that now I remember I I have a picture of them sitting in the back of a high back, yeah, and the big fat guy in the middle smiling.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, I remember that picture too. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Oh I'll have to have you send me that that picture. Yeah, for sure. That's it. Chocolate chip. I remember that chocolate chip. You're right, they had those those chocolate chip candies, and yeah, the entire Iraqi army and police force were were super corrupt. I mean, you just you took one look at them, even pre-April 6th. Like, I remember them just being a gaggle of of just window lickers, dude.

SPEAKER_00

Well, you had so I'll I'll give them one uh kudos point as far as that goes. They were either so brazen you didn't understand where their mind was, or they were completely worthless and were just there for uh for a paycheck. Because I remember a couple of times, especially the older guys, they'd walk out there and diffuse an IED with their hands with no nothing. They just walk out there with like a pair of like tin snips and just cut the wires, yank out the explosive, walk away and just you know show their hands in the air like they did some magic trick, and we're like, You're psychotic.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_01

Inshallah, yeah, exactly. Well, you you have to remember too that what partially happened there is the great mistake that we made as a coalition is that even though a lot of the uh military forces surrendered even before we got there because they wanted nothing to do with the war, they were anti-Saddam, more or less.

Rebuilding Iraqi Forces The Hard Way

SPEAKER_01

I mean, oversimplifying. But point being is that in our infinite wisdom, we decided to completely decimate the entire army structure and police force structure in Iraq, and then say, well, we're just gonna start over again. And and so even people that were loyal, or even though even people that would would have been loyal to the Iraqi country, just because they were already associated with the military or the police, they were automatically kicked out, and then there's this really weird vetting process that wasn't really working, and so all the people that were originally a part of this were the idiots that weren't a part of the military in the first place, and so these are the guys that were trying to get spun up real quick, and I mean and for a you know, for a thousand different motivations, too. Um, and then too, on top of that, the weirdos that we had, you have to remember Ramadi was the retirement city of the Bathists and the Republican Guard. And so on on the whole, not anybody could be a part, like most of the people that were in Ramadi were sympathetic to Saddam in the first place, and so they weren't pulling upon the best and the brightest of the city in the first place, on top of not pulling from the best and the brightest of what would have been there before. So, yes, we had a very stupid situation on right now. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, anyways.

SPEAKER_03

Good, good, good.

SPEAKER_01

No, it was just I'm just remembering the idiots. That's that's all. I just this is just just just just the number of times trying to talk to these guys when we were at the police stations holding some of these checkpoints with these, just anyways, it was it was bad. Well, and and and they and they don't have and and and then cut to complicate, and this is non-judgmental, but just to complicate it to some more is is that our like worldview philosophy of like how things should like kind of like this pursuit of immediate excellence, that's not their culture. They they have like this completely different relationship with time, you know, time exists in this paradigm, and and so they'd be like, No, we need to do this now, guys. And they're like, Okay, okay. And it's like, ha ha, I'm gonna kill you.

SPEAKER_03

So, yeah, I've lived in a lot of underdeveloped countries uh since I left the corps, and I'm telling you, it's yeah, that's the norm out there, and uh yeah, and it's pretty bad when a bunch of infantry Marines are like, man, these guys are dumb, huh? Like no, you're not getting the frame of the crowd. So then so, like, speaking of um, you know, Iraqi security forces and their their um severe incompetence, so july mid-July, we're on uh a routine kind of trip to the government center um for God knows what. I'm I'm an E3

Government Center Taunts Turn Real

SPEAKER_03

by now, I'm a Lance Corporal, but I still don't know anything. And um, yeah, I just know we're at the government center. I know to take security and let uh the officers do their thing. And uh we were parked next to like some kind of guard tower, a guard shack that was a bit elevated, I think, by the entrance of the government center or something like that. Yep. And there was a couple of Iraqi police officers up in that in the tower, and me and Hess and Doc Cornwell and Peterson are like, you know, the the enlisted guys are holding holding down the holding down the Humvee while while Lieutenant Crawford's been doing doing officer stuff. And uh these two Iraqi guys up in the tower start talking shit to us. They're they're like we start gesturing towards us like they're shooting us with their like with like hands, and they're like, tomorrow, I'm in baba, boom, boom. And we were like, yeah, whatever. Like, shut up. You're you know, you're you're uh you're idiots. And uh that was July 13th, and then July 14th. Um, we're out with I I think it's uh like pe people from like the the headquarters and supply, like maybe the colonel, I can't remember who was who was with us, but yeah, we got into a big uh firefight. That was like map one's first like really big engagement. Um somewhere on Route Michigan. Again,

Route Michigan Erupts Into A Gunfight

SPEAKER_03

I'm I'm not good. I'm gonna lay out of the city, but uh boy, did I shoot some rounds that day. Um I I dismounted. There was an army unit that was like under really heavy fire from a building that was right in front of us. Um, whole Route Michigan was, you know, it's a big multiple-lane highway through the cities. There's empty cars, like civilian cars all over the place, the doors hanging open where you could see where like the the shooting started a few minutes before we got there, and like um all the civilians like knew the drill. Like, yeah, uh leave your car and and and head for cover um because you're in the crossfire. And uh yeah, I went out because we're we're you know, Lieutenant's vehicle, we were the release vehicle. Um, so we made contact first with these army guys, and I um got behind a car and just I could see where the the muzzle flashes were coming out of this building. I could see RPGs coming out of it um at us, and then also like they were shooting at our conveys down the street. And um I man, I I I dropped at least three or four magazines, like right just mag dunks. I don't even like I probably didn't hit anything, but man, I I shot a ton. Um, I remember seeing uh an army guy had um he was like behind the car next to me. He had like a little girl, he was like shielding her, like probably got like was just happened to be there like a like any normal civilian, like out on the street that day, and maybe I don't know, got separated from her family or whatever. He had he had her in one hand and he was shooting his uh M16 with the other, with his other hand. Um and uh yeah, I just remember mag dumping a bunch and um being there for I don't even know how long, maybe maybe half an hour or so. And then uh I was kind of by myself, um, like just me and these army guys, and then at some point Lieutenant Crawford came, got me. We both ran across that street down uh like maybe a block or two, and then he put me in me and uh Sean Silver, um Silver Terry, um up on a up on a roof together to be like um Overwatch. By this time we'd been issued the advanced combat optical gun site, uh the ACOG. Um, and so we were up there in the and there was kind of firefights going on a couple blocks here, a couple blocks down here, and we were kind of on an elevated position. So we started uh taking fire um from a couple different directions. Uh uh, remember hearing like bullets coming snapping, snapping past us, and uh um it was it it was it made you reluctant to like kind of uh poke your head up too much, but we were like overwatch and we were trying to like you know um find find targets the best that we could. And I remember that um Sean like you know Sean told me he was like, Hey, he was looking through his ACO, he's like, I think I've got some people over here. And um he he he pointed me to a building, the roof of a building, like maybe uh maybe I'm so bad with distance, especially 22 years later, but like maybe a hundred to to 150 meters away from us, and it had like came netting and sandbags and stuff up there, and it was like clearly like a pre-planned uh ambush site, and uh there was a bunch of dudes, there was like four dudes up there crawling around, and uh um not all of them had weapons, but they all looked like they were up to no good. And uh it turns out they did have weapons, but we didn't uh totally know that at the time. But um we uh yeah, we were just like, all right, I guess uh this is it, it's your time to shine. So we um yeah, we both just uh lit lit all four of those guys up. And uh I remember uh shooting one one guy, like they had no idea we were there, so we just opened fire on these guys, and um I don't think they even had much of a time to react. I remember shooting one guy. He was he I could see him from head to toe. And I remember really zooming in on him for several shots, and I I was I had him dent to rights through my my ACOG, and uh I shot him a bunch of times, and he just wouldn't go down. And I was like, Am I missing? That was the one time in the whole Marine Corps that I switched my rifle to three round bursts and fired a three-round burst. It's like I'm I'm you know, is there something wrong with me? And so and then finally he dropped, and it turns out like um a unit from I think it was Fox, maybe it was golf, I can't remember, but uh uh uh rifle company unit went up to that rooftop and was like they radioed to our platoon and said, Whoever shot that the guys from that roof, those guys had us like pinned down really, really bad. And um, whoever shot them up really did a number on them because these guys are ventilated. And uh and Crawford told us crawl the time crawford was like, you know, Silver and Kern, you guys really shot the hell out of those guys. Um and uh yeah, that was that felt really good. And yeah, so uh we we we cleaned up the rest of that day. Um, we found a ton of ordinance in this. It was a political party or something. This yeah, this building that was that that part of the ambush was like this corrupt political party. And um yeah, there's footage of that um from Ollie North. I think Oli North was with us, and there's footage of them. Manger Harrels there, like he's got a couple grenades, and somebody's like, it's a political party, and then he goes, Well, it's a party, that's for sure. And uh it was right, and uh yeah, so that felt good. Uh that felt really good. And that that took that was probably like I mean, if I've I I what I saw, I remember like looking at my watch and be like, wow, this is like been like a three-hour gunfight. And it yeah, it was uh that's that kicked off I'd say like three or four weeks of kind of some some a little bit more small arms engagements um from our uh with our with our platoon with all of our uh with the whole battalion. I it seems like there was a second wave in like July, August of like um, you know, newcomers or something, some guys with you know with the uh the power of Allah or something.

SPEAKER_01

Uh kind of I mean they're definitely more trained. There was something very there, there was a it was a new new wave of of what they were calling their hobby. Well and then all the foreign the front the foreigner.

SPEAKER_00

Yep. And then the uh that was when we had again we had Delta and all that rolling through the area and we had the seals, and there was a lot more um AQI. That was when the first uh Al Qaeda in Iraq sort of started with um Zarkawi. And that was we were you know, we did those missions to try to find Zarkawi, and we stole his pants and like you know, found his driver, and like you know, there wasn't there wasn't a whole lot of we never found him. They can somebody killed him a couple years later, but it was uh that was where all the posters were coming from. And and so yeah, it was a whole different element of people, it was a lot more accurate fire, a lot more sniper fire, a lot more stand-up gunshots and uh gunfights, similar to what you saw in April versus uh the you're right, the middle part, right? Like May was more IEDs, June was a little bit of a mixed picture, and then July really started a lot of big gunfights.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah, yeah. I I remember like all through July and August was like, okay, now now this is it. This is this is what I came here for. Like, yeah, um, you know, there it's it kind of got to the point where it was like every time you go out, like there's gonna be some kind of gunfire. Like whether it's

A New Wave Of Skilled Fighters

SPEAKER_03

like a 30-second gunfight or like a few hours, there's there's one like um, I think I didn't think I looked at my watch and it was like six hours where we think we were with a unit from Fox Company, and um they got in, but that's where the um that's where the dead Iraqi uh person on the on the got put on the truck. It was like a guy from our platoon. We were we were doing like a kind of I guess you would call it movement to contact or whatever, like bounding from block to block, like street to street, fighting these guys, and a a kid came running out of his house with ammo in his hand. And I say a kid, I mean like an older teenager's a

Bounding Overwatch And A Moral Line

SPEAKER_03

man, a man came uh running out of his house with a ton of ammo in his in his hands, and he he saw us to his left and then he turned right to run away from us down the street, and one of our guys uh popped him in the back of the head from the hip. Great shot. And uh dude goes somersault and forward, lands on his belly, um maybe maybe 40 meters in front of us, and me and uh Lieutenant Crawford go up to uh he he fell like kind of behind something. We couldn't quite see him from where from where uh he we were standing when he got shot, but um we went up there and uh saw saw his body laying on the ground. And I was like, I remember I was like, yeah, and then Vital Crawford maybe he didn't like that, so he was like, take the corner over there, Kern. Uh and you're having too much fun in this combat. You're you're timeout. I'm living, I I live it, and so I took my usual knee, um, held my usual corner, and uh, and I could I could hear there was a kind of debate going on. Apparently, like I could hear Lieutenant Crawford talking with I think it was Doc Gibbons, he was our other corpsman, and maybe Staff Sergeant Drake was there or something like that. The dude wasn't dead, he had taken a hit in the back of the head, but like like the story I told about shooting these guys on the roof, like the M16 round is so little and I don't know. Um, you get you guys know, of course.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, no, we domed a couple guys that didn't, it didn't kill him right away. It I mean it cracked off a chunk of their skull, but they were still very alive. Yeah, not for long, and you're not gonna survive in a third world country uh with getting your getting a fancy toupee uh made for you.

SPEAKER_03

But yeah, no, especially if map one's got something to say about it, and uh so so he's guy still alive, but he's fallen, he fell down with um he fell down on top of his ordinance that he was carrying, and we didn't know what was under there. And somebody was trying to make Doc Gibbons work on him, and Doc Gibbons was like, Hell no, he's got a grenade down there, like he's got a grenade with a pin pulled, um, and I'm not flipping him over or like and and but we so there's this debate, this like moral debate going on behind us. I remember yelling, I'll pop him if you need me to. And I don't maybe I don't think somebody told me to shut up, and uh and uh probably yeah, probably, yeah. I know I would have told me to shut up because I mean it's like somebody was I think it was like somebody was like shoot him and let's go because like we we we have to move that we're in contact, like um we can't sit around all the like standing around this kid, uh this this young man. Um so there was there's this whole thing going on about like I remember Lieutenant Crawford saying, like, it's it's immoral, I'm not going to do it. And I I I assume he meant like I'm not gonna uh uh finish off this person who's dying, like you know, um gunshot window to the head. Um and uh so eventually the the individual dies on their own, uh but there's still uh there's still ordinance under him, and we don't know what it is, and uh so they tie a chain to his feet, and then uh the other end of the chain to a Humvee. And as map one does, we pull the chain back, like drive drive the Humvee back, um, and uh lo and behold, there's there's nothing, nothing there uh of any danger. But we ended up putting that that person's body up on the roof of that Humvee, or on the um on the on the hood. On the hood, we covered yeah, we covered it with a poncho liner, and then spent the rest of that gunfight, which was a couple more hours, um, like with this thing, like a dead deer, like on the top, and there's blood all over the hood. I have a photo of it somewhere um of this massive pool of like blood all over the thing.

SPEAKER_00

Um I don't remember why, like, because we were on a parallel street, and I don't remember where our streets converged, but I got like right next to that vehicle. Well, your poncho liner had either torn or blown off, and you guys were trying to cut. Cover him with an MRE box, which I also thought was hilarious, and like duct tape. And I was like, I okay, great. Yeah. Cool. Decisions have been made. I do remember I remember walking over to Anthony and being like, what what what why that guy? There's so many dead bodies. Why that guy? And he's like, don't ask. Just just don't ask. I was like, all right cool. All right. Well, we're going this way. See you later. That was it. See you later. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

And I I don't remember what happened in the body. I remember by the time later, like that that day when we came back to Hurricane Point, the body was gone. There was just blood everywhere on the on the hood of the of the Humvee. But I guess they probably dumped it off of the Iraqi police at some point. But the rest of that day, like that gunfight was a long one too.

SPEAKER_00

Like, oh yeah.

SPEAKER_03

That uh that that was that one took a while. And I just remember like as a as a dip as a dismount, you're basically just a rifleman and you're just bounding. And it was it was so hot, like running up to you know, a house to get you're you're trying to get on the roof of the house so you can provide covering fire to the element that's going to bound past you and advance towards the enemy um on the next block up. So you you know, you get up to the the the front terrace of the house, you kick in the front door, um, you go into the house, um you uh tell the family you're not there to kill them as long as they don't give you a reason. And then you go up to the roof, right? You run up a couple flights of stairs, get up on the terrace, acquire targets, fire gun shots, um, and then and then you hear the call like, hey, get up to the next block. And then so you go down the stairs, run out the front door, down the street to the next house, and then you kick that door in and go up, you know, to the roof and like pop off more rounds, and there's gunfire. And I remember that at at some point, like um we were moving with an element for Fox Company. As soon as I like it was me and me and me and Silver were like together for most of this. We were like a pair of you don't obviously don't go alone. Uh the pair of us were like doing this bounding overwatch stuff, and um, right as we come downstairs and we come out the door, like a dude from Fox Company got hit with a sniper, like right as we were coming out. Yep, and uh, I don't remember what part of him it was. I think it was I think he got him on the shoulder, but um Doc Cornwell started working on him um right away, and then Lieutenant Crawford was right there, and he was like, Get back up on that roof, like and uh and we're like, Whoa, there's a sniper out there, and he this guy could shoot, so whatever, like get back up on the roof, and then yeah, I remember hearing another gunshot. Uh, like it just that one individual, because it was like you heard it, like that was like a planned like gun shape. It was like that, like it that was like a a sniper, and so yeah, we ran back up to the roof, heard heard that another sniper shot, and just started everybody started unloading. I think that was like the biggest like cacophony of like because you guys were there, we were there, fox company guys were there, like everybody just that that that next sniper round, everybody just started ammo dumping, dude. And it was um it was beautiful.

SPEAKER_00

Nice. So um I have one question that's like burning in my brain. It during and then I'm I'm reeling you back to uh your July 13th, 14th uh time frame. When you were up on that elevated position and you you guys killed that ambush and took and basically relieved fire on a unit that was pinned down, did you or silver get an award for that?

unknown

No.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, nobody got an award. That's all I this

The Awards That Never Came

SPEAKER_00

is this is just a personal thing that I I this is again something I'm very fascinated by by this deployment. Yeah, that's a very award-worthy action. And so that's it's why I'm I'm very curious.

SPEAKER_03

I also thought the same. Uh in fact, uh Lieutenant Crawford would later go on to say after we were back in Pendleton in California, like you guys probably could have got a medal from that, but and then he gave uh I think he said something like, I didn't want to do the paperwork. That's fine. Well, it is what it is.

SPEAKER_02

That's what it's podcast.

SPEAKER_01

To be fair to some of the to be fair to the lieutenants and our at our let's just have it at the company level. I'll I can uh I feel confident to say it at that level at least, but they were being restricted, they were they were being restricted with how what kind of awards could go out at the time, like from higher, higher, and I don't want to say it was at the battalion even, I don't know where it was, but they were there was a lot of Marines that even the ones that they got put in, um, they were given a hard time about. And there were several that were downgraded.

SPEAKER_03

Okay. Oh wow, I didn't know that. Like, um because you know, I a friend that I would later make from Echo Company um later on after the deployment, um David Quicklass, he he was in Echo and he was at, I think he was at Gypsy Minova and he got a bronze star that day. But like when you hear him talk about what he did, right? But not even him, because like I don't think I ever asked him about it, but other people said what he did, and like I'm like, man, that sounds like a freaking baby cross, dude.

SPEAKER_01

Like Kern, I I I tell you, like, if you just if you with with just even a passing listen to like almost any like I can list off I can list off easily off the top of my head a a handful of like Brownstow Civil Star level actions made by individuals that I witnessed per that I personally witnessed, let alone across across weapons company, and the in the absolute like just over and over and over again.

SPEAKER_03

It's just we were in so much like really uh intense fire firefighting, you know, like so much intense intense gunfire, and um every day, I mean every day we're in combat of some kind. I think in that the book uh No True Glory by Bing West, I think he said something about the Marines in Ramadi took as a battalion on average three attacks per day, either through indirect fire or uh IDs or or direct fire, like um which I I mean that's astonishing that that weren't.

SPEAKER_01

I mean even from the intensity of the firefights, but at the when you start talking about what's typically is given awards in the past is also the junior level, you know, like okay, this Lance Corporal took charge and did this thing, or a corporal did this, you know, independently understanding what needed to happen and then did the thing. And so like it kind of elevates the action. Well, that's and it doesn't even not even even not even from like a serious like firefight standpoint, but like tact being strategically and tactically minded in the moment and being able to advance the mission.

SPEAKER_00

My god, it was every single day. Well, and that's that's the point I was making about his his just I mean, even your your description is probably modest, I would be willing to bet, of what happened on that rooftop. Your your two PFCs, maybe Lance Corporal, one of the two of you, you had no communication with hire. There was no one, you were literally asked to make a command decision, which resulted in relieving the pressure from and probably saving the lives of your fellow infantry marines, and extremely effective based on the battle damage assessment. Yeah, as he's saying, you just performed at a level at least two ranks above your own rank minimum, along with saving the lives of others. That's star worthy, right? Like that's in any other again, in any other conflict, in any other time frame, in any other year, you'd have easily gotten like you'd easily gotten a bronze star. There's no reason why you wouldn't have.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, got some kind of like did did some kind of in in insanely courageous action um at least once during the course of that that deployment. Uh, you know, and so um yeah, it's it is interesting that like more more awards didn't didn't come from that. Um, but it is what it is, and um I think I think you know, and I I hate to sound cliche, but like we don't do it for medals, like right, right. No, it's very true. Yeah, it we you know, your your buddies know what you did, and anyone who wasn't a marine uh kind of doesn't even know what a silver star is, anyway. So, you know, what are you gonna do? Um, I'll tell you about an award I didn't get. Uh I got a purple heart, and it's the easiest purple heart ever. Uh so I'm borderline embarrassed about uh so during I think you it was August 12th, I know because the the citation, um Morning Wild 12th, we were out on a on a foot patrol with uh

The RPG Hit And A Purple Heart

SPEAKER_03

Fox Company somewhere near um Route Nova. Um and we had been taking fire like kind of sporadic, like quick skirmishes a few days for like uh on a few occasions in the days leading up to this, but we were out on a on a mission with Fox. I think they had a vehicle breakdown or something, and we uh it was our platoon and one of their platoons, all down this like narrow alleyway near Route Nova. Uh there was a uh there was a T intersection in front of us, like a so uh another road going in front of us, and then but beyond that road was like a big wide open field, I think maybe an abandoned soccer field, and then brick buildings and structures beyond that. And we were flanked on on both sides of this narrow alleyway by tall, tall kind of one or two-story buildings as well. And we were like in the my so my my truck uh from map one were parked like towards the from the the entrance of the alleyway, almost on the street that was um perpendicular to us and in front of us. And I remember thinking like there were so many dudes, like Marines like jammed into this alleyway. And I remember thinking, like, we're a juicy target right now, and we've been taking fire. And um, I was standing in front of the truck, and I heard like a like a pop sound right in front of me in the in that kind of soccer field open area. Maybe I again I'm just talking terrible with distance, but like maybe like a hundred yards in front of us, probably probably less, maybe, maybe like um, I don't know, maybe like 80. Uh didn't seem like super far away. But I looked up and there's a there was a rocket propelled grenade just coming straight at me. And I I remember like seeing it, and it it this must have happened in a fraction of a of an of an instant, but like I remember thinking, like, well, I'm dead. I probably shouldn't have stood here, and probably Staff Sergeant Drake's gonna be very pissed, and uh I hope it doesn't hurt too much. And I felt the thing go right past my arm and hit the Humvee, it hit our truck. Um, Doc Cornwell on the back right seat, so behind the the vehicle commander, uh he had left his door open and it was those armored doors, like the sand-colored door, but like the whole Humvee was like green. Um, but those thick, like sand-colored doors, it was open. And it the the the round hit that um it impacted and exploded on that. And it kicked up all this dust. I I remember like being shocked. I remember thinking, like, am I dead? I couldn't see anything. And like um, because there was just I was in a dust cloud and I heard gunshots and I remember thinking, like, I don't want to shoot because I can't like I can't see anything in front of me and I don't want to shoot anybody on our side, obviously. Um and then Hass, our driver, um, got in the driver's seat and I had this the knowledge to, I guess, the presence of mind to like get out of his way because he started pulling us up. Peterson and the gun was telling him, like, pull up because we're in this dust cloud. And like he couldn't see anything either. And so we pulled up. Um, and Paul, when he got in the driver's seat, left his door open, uh, another armored door. So I got behind it and like I remember like using it as a shield. And as he was, as he was like driving forward, um, I like had my rifle through through his window and was like, by that time we could like like after we drove forward a few feet, like we could start to see things. Um, and I just started feeling like again, Mac dumped. That's just what I what I started doing um when we made contact. And um yeah, it was it was over in like probably 30 seconds, this this skirmish. A couple guys um with an RPG had like strolled out in the middle of this soccer field. I don't know how nobody saw them, but they got a round off um down this alleyway at us. And uh yeah, um almost hit me. But um yeah, I had a so the gunfire kind of like died down. They killed the two guys, and um, I think some of their buddies um were were out there um shooting at us as well. I think they they they they they ran off, but um, it was over super fast. And Doc Cornwell had been behind his door that the RPG had impacted on. He had gotten knocked out and like thrown back into the Humvee. Um, so thank God when Peterson or uh when Hess pulled up, he didn't fall out or get run over or something. Uh that's a miracle. But um the the the firefight stopped. I went back to my side behind the driver, like um whatever, just to like assess what was going on. And then Doc Cornwell came too and he looked at me and he started freaking out, and he went, he he came around the back of the hump and he started fucking with my arm, like the back of the elbow. And and I was like, what the hell? What are you doing, Doc? And I looked down and there's like this, there's like a little blood stain, like the size of a poker chip, like like right, right on my elbow. And I was like, what the hell? And like a little tiny little piece of shrapnel, like the size of like was like had gone into my arm, like and um it was no big deal. It didn't, it didn't hurt, like um, there was barely any blood. And uh, but but Cornwall is like, you know, he's doing his doc thing, it's like he's he's fucking trauma shears, he cuts my sleeve off.

SPEAKER_02

And uh I was like short sleeve on one side.

SPEAKER_03

And uh and he's he's like uh he starts calling it in and like um he's like uh you know uh I don't know whiskey whiskey six, this is whiskey one, like we've we've got a we've got a routine um casualty or whatever, and that and and I was like I he was saying something like um we need we need immediate Cazvac or something like that. And I was like, duck, this is nothing, dude. Like it doesn't even hurt. And uh and he was like, he was like, shut up, don't you want a purple heart? And I was like, okay, all right, I'll shut up. I'll shut up. Uh and so yeah, that's that's that's my purple heart. It was it was weak. They took me to Charlie Med. Like we we like we stuck around for a bit. There was like um some some Iraqi dude had been driving through the crossfire, like wrong, wrong time, wrong place. Um, he had been driving through the crossfire and he got lit up this like thank god it was just him like in his car, but he had like uh he got lit up and then we got me and a couple guys from Fox had to go out. He had like crawled after he got got got smoked, he'd like crawled down, like kind of on the like from our view, like on the left down the left side of this road, um, kind of out of sight from us, and we had to like go go out there and get him and like drag his his wounded ass back to us. So our our docs, Cornwell then worked on him. Uh and then and then after that, like they drove me to Charlie Mid and like you know, they did they like did a they stuck my arm under an x-ray machine and like they showed the doc showed it to me. He's like, There's a little thing right there in your arm. And his I was like, Are you gonna like take it out, sir? Uh and he he was like, No, it'll just it'll either just stay there or it'll work itself out one day. And um, I was like, Oh, cool, good to go. And um, yeah, that was it. That was uh yeah, that's my my lame purple tart story. I would I would never like brag about having the purple. I'll I'll take it, but I'm not gonna like I'm not gonna be like, oh, I got wounded. Like, no, no, amen.

SPEAKER_00

There's people who got them from concussions for mortars that landed 50 yards away. So you uh and nobody from our unit that I know of, but I know other units where that was definitely the case. So you deserve yours, you actually got hit.

SPEAKER_01

So did you ever work it out?

SPEAKER_03

Just it never I've never seen it come out or anything. Like, um, as far as I know, it's still in there. I've I you know I've never felt it like do anything. I certainly never felt it like you know, like hurt her like or anything. So yeah, um, it's it's still in there, but yeah, you I I I I I know it's like legit, but it's like borderline legit. I would never like yeah, yeah, I'd never I'd never brag about it.

SPEAKER_00

It is it's comical to me, and this is definitely a weapons company marine, and probably all Marines, but it's definitely a weapons company marine thing. Like, there's everybody has these levels of like I wasn't in that much combat, tells 50 stories about gunfights. I I was just barely wounded, literally an RPG hit two feet right behind you, right behind you, right? Yeah, yeah. That's as that's as wounded as you get, man. And you're like, nah, nope, nope, it wasn't enough. I didn't take a bayonet to the chest like World War One, you know, like it right.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah. I it's uh it's it's every everybody's uh everybody tries to be humble, but you know, you get I mean you think about like how many how many we we have and you oh severely, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

It's weird to wear the same. There should be different, like it should be a smaller purple heart. Yeah, I totally do that.

SPEAKER_03

I would totally do that. Me too.

SPEAKER_00

McPherson, yeah.

SPEAKER_04

He deserves he deserves one base big purple heart.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, pink star, like yeah, you can you can play with it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Uh it it's it I it's you know, you get get guys like Sergeant Condi or McPherson or um, you know, Hurley or any anyway, yeah, guys missing eyeballs, yeah, yeah. Oh yeah, how am I gonna, you know, but um yeah, yeah, it is it is what it is. That's that's uh that was it. So then um, you know, um a few more like sporadic skirmishes. Remember, I remember meeting meeting um Ollie North. Um I remember uh kind of kind of doing some missions with him. He was out there for a couple of our little skirmishes, not only July 14th, but uh when we were at the soccer stadium, we took we took some some uh some contact out there. Um and then I'm on I'm on I'm a little dot on a rooftop like nearby mag dumping, but you can't you can't see can't see where it is, uh unfortunately. But um yeah, that uh that was it. Um then you know so that was that took us into August. Um August firefights. I don't think we we did anything on August 21st, which is a day that it has continued to pop up on the um on the podcast. I I think we were maybe back on like guard duty or something. Me and Peterson were bridge buddies on guard um on guard duty. And the the one time we we got some on on North Bridge, we got we were out there, like you know, um it was hot as balls, and

North Bridge Rockets And Return Fire

SPEAKER_03

uh we you know bored to death out there, like since 2004, there's no iPhones, right? There's no YouTube. You're just a couple of dudes like on a bridge, and uh, but you got a you had some you got some some firepower too, though. So we heard some we heard some you know launch, you know, sound like some rockets or some ordinance got launched from out in the city and then explosions right on the bridge, like down towards the blue diamond area. So like um uh north just north of us. And we and then like by the river, like because you know, look North Bridge, like look down that river, the the Euphrenes River. And so like down off in the distance. we see like a couple dudes like run towards a car like from the they were like running like from from the river up to their car and we were like that must be them so um yeah we both opened up with our rifles and then I I looked over noticed the the 240 and fucking jumped on it racked it and just shot out a whole can at their car and then I think eighty eighty ones went out there to go go to go check it out and sent a couple guys they the the the maybe maybe like 10 or 15 minutes afterwards 80 81s I think one of them sledgehammer rainmaker went out there and um like assessed what happened I guess they took him to the hospital or stuck like that. The the Iraqis I think there was a bunch of Iraqis out there but a couple guys got sent took to the hospital and uh yeah I don't know if that but that's our gunfire uh wounded those people but um I like to think so so nice um yeah yeah that was good so that's that's our north bridge story that's our our our bridge story um yeah most of the time the bridges sucked as you guys well know but yeah that's I I actually don't know that's my uh my my badge of honor I never had to stand a bridge post okay okay so you sir missed out on quite a lot of uh staring at the air and uh counting down minutes and dude yeah I spent uh all of the time well I again I can't say every platoon seems to have done things just a little bit different.

SPEAKER_00

Uh I never stood a bridge post but I was on radio watch in the COP. And so that was uh a different challenge into and of itself because then I would have Gunny Maraki come by and yell at me for something for existing or breathing too loud or or have random like the BC would show up and I'd be like okay now I have to be on my best behavior. Like you know it's so it's just a different challenge different kind of challenge.

SPEAKER_03

That's that's way worse than like I don't like honestly like just four hours of like just just kind of sitting there with one of your best friends right like one of your platoon mates like shooting the shit like that's nothing compared to like having to be around gunning maraki um you know and and the the the higher ups and having to be on your gay that's real responsibility like that yeah that's I don't know about real responsibility but I felt like a boot that's how I felt so yeah no that's um yeah definitely definitely um nerve wracking well cool man you're getting towards the end there you remember uh kind of what it felt like to get out of there I remember um I remember like coming down to like our last week or so in Ramadi and then then you guys did the left seat right seat stuff which I didn't participate in um at all and um we went over to Junction City for like a week or so I guess that was supposed to be some kind of like decompression stuff. Um and

The Handover Chaos Before Leaving

SPEAKER_03

yeah we just kind of had like time to just chill really but you guys went out there and you know you guys got it on with two four with uh two five like the incoming two five unit and you know you I've I've heard quite a bit about like what what happened with with that um debacle and um yeah you guys were right there right in the thick of it and um again it was like we we were we were a JC and like I kept hearing about all this contact you guys were making out there as you tried to show these new Marines the ropes um and and just and I I remember I remember thinking like damn like I wish I was back out there like um damn we're missing it again but um you know uh luckily most of you guys came back safe and sound I think Diaz got he got broke his leg wounded the two closest to being killed was Musser and Diaz Diaz had a mortar landed right next to him and broke his femur and uh if basically just by dumb luck if kind of like your RPG story if Musser hadn't leaned forward he'd have taken an RPG to the side of the head so it it was it yeah it's just luck. It's crazy how like um how much those like Iraqis like how much of those Hajjis like knew what uh like what our whole plan was I mean I I I guess the higher ups had talked to their yeah probably talked to their police chiefs and tribal chiefs and and all that stuff. But yeah it's it's interesting how they were able to to pick up on the there's a new unit and we're gonna we're gonna get you know get the initiative on them. And uh yeah you guys were you guys were out there for that which was like a whole other whole other experience that not not many guys from weapons company had I don't even remember from our platoon who did left see right see it probably Anthony and Santiago I'd imagine I remember I remember Drake being part of it and uh I remember Lieutenant Crawford being a part of it.

SPEAKER_00

I do not remember anybody else. I don't know if Anthony and Santiago were there or not I don't remember seeing them. But uh those are the two I do remember seeing and yeah anybody who is a part of it will tell you that was probably the worst couple of days of the whole deployment.

SPEAKER_03

A thousand percent that's that's um yeah that I mean that what a what a what a crappy send off too it's like um yeah what what a crappy send off like what a crappy way to end like the deployment like all that we worked and fought for um and and a lot of us were wounded and died for um like yeah to be to watch two five kind of come in and kind of pussyfoot around these assholes uh that's yeah you know from what I'm told they they didn't want to shoot they didn't want to like uh engage because they thought we had been too aggressive in the in the city I guess is that what it was yeah I I mean I feel like we've repeated this a few times and I'll and uh but it it bears repeating again and this is a thinking back it's also kind of the same way we felt about the like we shit talked the National Guard unit right we're like they're a bunch of pussies they're just driving up and down Michigan it's like well no like that was the probably the best tactic actually for given how many people they actually had like that was probably smart to be very honest.

SPEAKER_00

And we thought well we're gonna do it better right well it's the same thing two five got told we were a bunch of cowboys and that we were just shooting wildly we took all these casualties because we were careless and they're gonna do it better. They're gonna do it better. And they learned very quickly they had their big battle I mean not they had one of their biggest battles not long after we left I think November was one of their one of their biggest stand up gunfights yeah they had thrown in November.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah exactly and so they learned the lesson the same way we did right we learned our lessons in April they learned them in November it was almost the exact same time frame about six weeks after they got there yeah yeah they got a little a little time to like um kind of get settled in and then then the Hajjis kicked off and yeah wow and that kept going until um you know um 224 went back to Ramadi Echo and Fox I think went back to Ramadi in 06 and the Ramadi was still uh tinder box so yep yeah crazy crazy but I remember of of leaving I remember that there was a week that we had in in Camp Junction City that enormous army base like you know um on the other side of the canal so south of Hurricane Point and um and that uh uh that was that was a week where I guess yeah we were supposed to decompress and kind of just chill out and get ready to go back uh we took a civilian flight if I remember correctly um back to to California yeah correct yeah we jumped uh military flights from Al Assad to Kuwait and then uh civilian flight from Kuwait back to straight back to California there was no stops actually which was very nice yeah yeah that's way better than the engine failure and uh all that stuff nice I remember that um Solise uh uh Sole SBLIS SWAT is corporal uh at the time um he had um we were leaving robotic we were like going to Al-Sad and he was not like a full US citizen yet he was he's like a you know he's from Mexico and they had like for some reason they decided at that moment was when he needed to like finalize his US citizenship papers and so he could either stay in Iraq for and I don't know why it had to be there at that moment in in that place but he he had to make a choice either stay in al Assad for a few more days or like do his citizenship paperwork or get on the plane and go back to California and deal with that crap later. And he got on the plane he was out of there yeah I don't know if I would have stayed either so yeah I don't know and what a what a stupid system just yeah yeah not not great yeah I remember just being like why why now like why let him go home like what yeah crazy um so yeah crazy uh crazy time for sure and then obviously getting home did and you I assume you took leave because we all got the free you know however many weeks of leave you wanted up to four and how was that coming home? Uh it was good I actually remember that um I decided on that post deployment leave to do uh recruiter's assistance was it no no wait I'm sorry no no no no it wasn't that that I did that at Christmas I'm sorry or was Christmas did we get when was our leave block was it christmas and post deployment in December or yes there was a then yes there was a there was a leave block for our for Christmas that year yes okay um but in and

Flying Home Leave Plans And Perspective

SPEAKER_03

it was so there wasn't like like a post deployment leave in like October and then and then another Christmas leave in December there was there was right there was both it was it was basically all of October we got back for November to be able to do the ball and then I think they had blocked out a week plus for Christmas. But that's when Nylan and I were getting out and so I mean that there was no like we were doing tap and tap and no one was around yep so yeah yeah yeah that's right yeah I um I took uh recruiter's assistance in in December because I remember being there for Christmas um but post deployment leave I think I only took two weeks because I I was like really in the mindset that like I wanted to save up my leave days and take terminal um and uh and of course like dude there's like I still have like three more years left I was just gonna say you're already you're a year in it's like okay I'm gonna get as much terminal leave as possible. Oh dude I I I must have just I know I was just like well I did combat like now I'm ready to leave the Marine Corps like I did all done it. All done yeah which is why like it's so interesting to hear like from your guys's perspective or like in your generation like the you know the guys who had done like Oki and stuff and versus like us like me like I lived the boot experience in in Romani and you guys were already like seasoned like NCOs and and we wouldn't have done like you know listen to the to the podcast like um I think it was Hodges talking about like how how young and new we all were but we still stepped up and it's like no like you guys man like as as the senior NCOs like um we couldn't have done like you you guys and in and guys like Hodges Sakaki Condi um you know Anthony um Saniago like the ton tons of them uh tons of the guys from your generation that the senior lances and the and the NCS like I mean we wouldn't uh we wouldn't have been worth anything if it hadn't been for you guys so it's um we're lucky we had you it was kind of a magic potion i i i really i i guess that was part of our point of starting this podcast to be quite honest is to capture this weird weapons company in that we just had a damn good group everybody put out everybody did the right thing the leaders did the right thing we had all good leadership um our officers were great our staff were great uh we were supported by the battalion which isn't always a thing uh we had people who actually repli recognized weapons companies capabilities which is also unique often a weapons company is like an afterthought and uh and it yeah it's just all good it's all all good and in all directions just a weird uh good luck charm because I think honestly you you know you you said it once in one of your stories when you're talking about I think August you you know all the weapons vehicles were juicy targets man we are big oh yeah loud lots of you had multiple people in each vehicle like we we should have taken a lot more casualties and it it was it it really was again I I think it was just a magic potion I don't I don't have any other way to put it we got lucky yeah we did yeah we did um I I think I think I learned I I heard later in my marine corps career that um they sometimes uh a battalion will send um like some of the better or more experienced officers to to weapons company um and I I don't know like um I don't even remember like the our officers past experience on previous deployments but um we we definitely had you know some good some very good leadership um from from Captain Weiler on down for Sergeant Mack like I mean Gunny Mararkey just all stars all stars so yeah it was great it was very good yeah well we're we're kind of wrapping it up man we're going on a couple hours uh we uh we've asked everybody and I it seems like a good way to kind of put a bow on it looking back 22 years uh what does all this mean to you what do you tell what do you tell other people that aren't that aren't us that aren't marines yeah when you know when they when they if if they hear like that you know I I served in the the United States military um you know um you're you're kind of you're just like a novelty a complete novelty even in the United like when I am in the US and there's not many veterans in in the US despite you know a 20 year war on terror um and there's there's much fewer veterans of like real ground combat you know I mean having grown up in the 90s

What Ramadi Means 22 Years Later

SPEAKER_03

as as we did like the Clinton era I mean like aside from like Desert Storm and then like you know Somalia Blackhawk down like there wasn't much shooting going on and I I always wanted to be in the military I was I was always fascinated by like um doing military service and stuff so I always knew I was going to be in it but I I remember growing up thinking like well I'll probably you know join the army but I I probably will never see combat because that just doesn't happen in today's world right and you know man yeah it it definitely still does and to have to have lived an experience like that um especially at our age you know first enlistment kind of you know from 18 to 20 22 23 um your your guys' age um around there you know an experience like being involved in in kinetic ground uh uh in in counterinsurgency operations um that's just a thing that like most people can't even like fathom and um definitely you know have never experienced and it's it's a very unique way to start your adult life um you know like I'm like I I got a I got a I got a bad habit of of uh you know swearing too much that I've I've tried to keep under control during this um this podcast as much as possible but people people will say like uh you know you got you got quite the trucker mouth on you and I'm like well I I spent the first four years of my adult life in a marine infantry unit in in ground combat in Iraq so fuck you uh yeah yeah that's your love language yeah yeah this is my poetry man this is my I'm Hawthorne Shakespeare um yeah it it's uh yeah it it's it's a unique way to start life I wouldn't change one second of it um maybe April 6th if I had a time machine I'd have told myself jump into one of map two's trucks or or anyone's go out fight with them if I fit if I if I'd known um map one wouldn't go not that day I'd a I'd have I'd have gone AWL with one of you guys. But uh you know it is what it is and um I wouldn't trade one second of it and I sh it's to be part of the two four you know magnificent bastards you know got the got the tattoo right there um fucking you know that's a brotherhood that just you're never gonna you know you're never gonna find that anywhere else and I'm so happy that I could you know start my adult life having you know done that like you know I think it was Reagan that said like some people spend a lifetime wondering if they ever made a difference but Marines don't have that problem. And that's yeah yeah I love it. So yeah that's it.

SPEAKER_01

Well I don't know that we can add anything else to this uh this has been great dude appreciate you thank you man if you like what you heard make sure you subscribe for future episodes on your favorite podcast service